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Scientology’s ‘International Justice Chief’ surfaces for the Garcia lawsuit

ScientologyEthicsThe last time we checked in on the federal fraud lawsuit against the Church of Scientology filed by Luis and Rocio Garcia of Irvine, California, we told you that Judge James D. Whittemore had given Scientology a pretty good challenge.

Scientology wants Judge Whittemore to dismiss the lawsuit in favor of the Garcias being compelled to take their grievances to the church’s internal system of arbitration. The Garcias object to that notion, and say that not only are their allegations of fraud not an internal matter, but Scientology’s supposed arbitration system is a sham anyway.

The Garcias have produced declarations by former church officials who say Scientology’s rules of arbitration are illusory. Scientology fired back with a 1963 policy written by L. Ron Hubbard outlining the church’s internal justice system, which is built on hearings known as “committees of evidence” or “comm evs.”

Ted Babbitt, the attorney for the Garcias, pointed out that comm evs are for handing out punishment, not evaluating financial disputes. And Judge Whittemore seemed to agree, giving Scientology a few days to come up with an explanation of how its comm ev rules relate to arbitration.

So now, Scientology has submitted an answer to that, and we found it rather interesting. It’s a declaration by Mike Ellis, who is Scientology’s “International Justice Chief.”

If you talk to former Scientologists for any length of time, you hear about the “IJC” a lot. He’s the person who, if you’ve been “declared” a “suppressive person” — Scientology’s version of excommunication — is the only person in all of Scientology that you can talk to in order to get yourself back into the good graces of the organization. In Scientology lingo, the IJC is your only “terminal” once you’ve been “declared.”

But the IJC himself is rarely heard from. We were surprised to see a declaration from Ellis, and his statement only brought up more questions for us. First, here’s his sworn declaration…

 

Garcia v. Scientology: Ellis Affidavit

 
We’ll let the legal experts tell us if they think this was an effective answer to the judge’s question. Our own amateur reading is that this comes off like “comm evs relate to arbitration because I say so,” and it’s not very convincing.

But it’s something else about Mike Ellis that we wanted to point out, and that we wish Judge Whittemore had a chance to hear about.

We said that it’s rare to hear anything from Ellis, but this isn’t the first time he’s been featured here at the Underground Bunker. In fact, back in November of 2012, we published a letter written by Ellis which was one of the more outrageous things that we’ve seen put out by the church.

In that story, we told you about a South African man, Robert Berrington, who had been declared a suppressive person. One of the things he shared with us was a letter he received from Ellis after he asked about getting a refund of the money he still had on account for classes he was no longer going to take as an excommunicated member.

Here’s the letter Ellis sent him:

 
BerringtonLetter

 
You’ll notice that Ellis didn’t suggest arbitration. Instead, he informed Berrington that in order to get his money back he would need to fill out a particular form. But that form is only available inside Scientology “orgs” (their word for churches), and as a “suppressive person” Berrington wasn’t allowed inside Scientology buildings. So therefore, he was out of luck.

“Due to the fact that you decided to leave the Church and your subsequent excommunication as a result of violation of Church policies, you are not eligible to go into the org to do the routing form,” Ellis wrote.

Isn’t that a neat trick? And this is the guy Scientology had write a declaration in federal court this week swearing to the legitimacy of Scientology’s internal justice procedures.

The audacity is pure Scientology. But why should they ever stop with this kind of behavior? They get away with this kind of thing again and again in a system of justice that is forever blind, and not in a good way.

 
——————–

Karen de la Carriere has a theory about PAC base

Recently, we told you about some of the startling changes that have been made at Scientology’s Los Angeles headquarters, PAC base. Karen de la Carriere suggests that part of the reason is about information control, and not just a reaction to failing orgs…

 

 
——————–

Posted by Tony Ortega on October 11, 2014 at 07:00

E-mail your tips and story ideas to tonyo94@gmail.com or follow us on Twitter. We post behind-the-scenes updates at our Facebook author page. Here at the Bunker we try to have a post up every morning at 7 AM Eastern (Noon GMT), and on some days we post an afternoon story at around 2 PM. After every new story we send out an alert to our e-mail list and our FB page.

Learn about Scientology with our numerous series with experts…

BLOGGING DIANETICS (We read Scientology’s founding text) 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25

UP THE BRIDGE (Claire Headley and Bruce Hines train us as Scientologists) 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37, 38, 39, 40, 41, 42, 43, 44, 45, 46, 47, 48

GETTING OUR ETHICS IN (Jefferson Hawkins explains Scientology’s system of justice) 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14

SCIENTOLOGY MYTHBUSTING (Historian Jon Atack discusses key Scientology concepts) 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37, 38, 39, 40, 41, 42, 43, 44, 45, 46, 47, 48, 49

PZ Myers reads L. Ron Hubbard’s “A History of Man” | Scientology’s Master Spies | Scientology’s Private Dancer
The Underground Bunker’s Official Theme Song | The Underground Bunker FAQ

 

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  • [This haiku I didn’t tweet—let’s call it a ‘bunker exclusive’ 😉 ]

    Words cannot express
    My thanks for: kind words, support,
    and encouragement. ♥
    #LoveToTheBunker

    Now on to tweets, I was only going to do the ‘holiday’ ones oday but then a few minutes ago the Sci ebola situation came to me in a flash. So I’ll do both! 🙂

    New Sci holidays!
    Taking the tried and true, then
    claiming as their own.
    #scientology #holidays #AlwaysCopying #haiku

    The new holidays
    basing them on L Ron’s past,
    they’ve now been reworked.
    #LRonHubbard #haiku #holidays #pastlives #scientology

    New Year’s Eve Sci twist
    Because Scienos are so advanced
    Their year starts sooner.
    #scientology #NYE #December27 #haiku #HasToBeTheReason

    Ron St. Valentine
    No longer breaker of hearts
    now it’s bank accounts
    #LRonPastLives #scientology #haiku #SaintValentine

    Sci Valentine’s Day
    Love does not exist for them
    So this day is moot
    #scientology #haiku #NoLove

    L Ron was St. Pat
    Leading the snakes to Clearwater
    To feed on the whales
    #LRonPastLives #haiku #scientology #StPat

    Sci St. Patrick’s Day
    A day for GREEN (of course)
    That must flow to church
    #holidays #haiku #scientology #AllAboutCash

    Uncle Sam Hubbard
    He was the model for him,
    A true war hero
    #LRonPastLives #haiku #scientology #HisWarRecordIsAsFakeAsCOBsTan

    New Sci July Fourth
    Fireworks replaced by cash
    Yours, tossed to the church.
    #scientology #haiku #AllAboutCash #WorshippingMoney

    Salem Witch L Ron
    Collected reward money
    narcing out others
    #LRonPastLives #scientology #haiku #HeSoWouldHave #ApologiesToWitches

    Sci’s Halloween twist
    Instead of trick or treat, it
    is now, tricks and cheats.
    #Halloween #scientology #haiku #TricksAndCheatsAllTheTime

    L Ron the pilgrim
    Discovered America
    Conquered Indians
    #LRonPastLives #scientology #haiku #TheyWouldClaimThis

    Sci’s Thanksgiving twist
    No big turkey dinner, cuz
    it’s ‘Cashgiving’
    #scientology #haiku #MustProfitOffEverything #Thanksgiving

    Ron St. Nicholas
    He went from house to house, took
    cash left out for him.
    #LRonPastLives #scientology #haiku #CashOverCookiesandMilk

    Christmas Sci style
    No worries about gifts again
    it’s now CASHmas, GIVE!
    #scientology #GiveToChurch #YouDisconnectedFromFamilyAnyway #haiku

    [my ebola ‘haiku’ monologue of if Scis went to Africa done in 9 haiku]

    Scis to Africa
    Only they can truly cure
    Those with Ebola
    (1/9) #scientology #ebola #haiku

    Touch assists, purif,
    auditing should ’bout do it.
    Sci church to rescue!
    (2/9) #scientology #ebola #haiku

    They’re not getting worse!
    That’s not blood, they’re vomitting
    out body thetans.
    (3/9) #scientology #ebola #haiku

    We’re total heroes!
    Can you give us a check now
    for services done?
    (4/9) #scientology #ebola #haiku

    They’re not really dead!!
    That’s a meat body, they’ve left
    to get a new one!
    (5/9) #scientology #ebola #haiku

    You can’t call me nuts!
    We’re a religion! Ask the
    I.R.S. ::cough:: ::cough::
    (6/9) #scientology #ebola #haiku

    That cough? I’m not sick!
    Scis are so healthy we don’t
    need those space suits here.
    (7/9) #scientology #ebola #haiku

    Don’t you circle me!
    I’m not sick! That’s a body
    thetan leaving me!
    (8/9) #scientology #ebola #haiku

    Sci church announces:
    Our V.M.s were captured, please
    send us money now.
    (9/9) #scientology #ebola #haiku #SadlyThisIsAllPlausible

    • joan nieman

      Those Haikus are so descriptive. Like balls of fire being shot from the castle walls. Good going Tia! Today you are rocking it!

      • thank you, as always joan! 🙂

    • aquaclara

      Your tweets are fabulous.

      What a terrific gift you have for helping others. Miss Tia, I hope you’re feeling better. It’s no fun losing kitty-cats, I know. They are there, waiting for us in the someday. And now, they are in our hearts always.
      Enough tissues….we have pantries to finish and planets to clear!

      • aw, thank you so much aquaclara!

        unlike planetary clearing, at least my pantry is DONE! 🙂 though it’s as empty as an ideal org! hey, that’s it, i’m redubbing it an ‘ideal pantry’! 😀

        yep, they’re always in our hearts and i firmly believe they are still with us too!

        i’m gonna be a day late—i had no idea today was world mental health day—but i was working on an essay about that for my vintage ads community and about how people with mental illnesses are perceived and i am pointing out i have PTSD so they can view me as an example—i am probably not the best example! too often people only think of the EXTREMELY mentally ill who really need to be hospitalized when they hear someone has a mental illness….that was today’s endeavor…..well i’m not done yet…i’ll finish it tomorrow 🙂

    • Stacy

      O/T: Miss Tia, how did your kitty make out at the vet yesterday?

      • she has a very bad dental infection and is on a mega dose of antibiotics for 10 days and then 1 week a month til i can afford to get her a dental….she had dental surgery a few years ago and they took out half her teeth!! she just didn’t win the dental health lottery! she was eating a bit more today after a couple doses so that is GOOD!!!! she’s a monster when it comes to food so when she doesn’t eat, there’s a problem!!
        thanks for asking! 🙂

        • Stacy

          After my dad died his cat chose me as her next person. She has teeth like that too. It’s some sort of gum disease that affects teeth too, obviously. She ended up having virtually all of her teeth removed, and since then she’s only been on antibiotics once, doesn’t need prednisone or painkillers at all, and manages dry and canned food fine. Dental for cats is so damn costly but in cases like this, it’s so worth it. Watching your kitty yelp when they try to eat and then run away from their food is heart-wrenching. Glad your kitty has you looking out for her teeth.

          • yeah, they can have gum disease too….and/or just dental issues….she has the worst teeth of any kitty i’ve had…you can basically take out all their teeth and they can still eat hard food even, their palettes aren’t fully ‘soft’ and they are hardened (if that makes sense) and they can eat just fine without their teeth….she was eating some hard food today and it’s been about a week since she’s done that, so yeah!!! it is always heart wrenching when they are in any kind of pain or distress, you just feel so helpless!!!

            And please accept my condolences on your dad’s passing.

  • DodoTheLaser
  • Hanging in the atmosphere like a malevolent black cloud in Scientology
    communities is the suspicion of the *EVIL* ::::Cough :::::Cough :::: “EXTERNAL
    INFLUENCE”.. Laughter.

    Current Tony Ortega’s BUNKER (due to very high stats on Alexa, way way
    higher than Scientology.org) ~~ The Bunker is THE most threatening, most high
    risk of creating an external influence.

    Any person, internet site, YouTube video, Amazon book, daily Blog,
    TV programs and especially a relative or friend who is even mildly critical of
    Church conduct, or even REVEALS current affairs the Church wants hushed up is
    an “EXTERNAL INFLUENCE”.

    A person the Church discovers who is being externally influenced is
    segregated from others and sent to the Public *Ethics* officer to identify his
    INFLUENCES for OSA (Office of Special Affairs”) handlings. It can cost $50,000
    to $100,000 in Sec checks (confessionals) These Sea org members, Ethics
    Officers and OSA INT Sea org members members are not on drugs. They are not on
    alcohol. They are stone cold sober. Stone cold obsessive. Stone cold paranoid
    on outside influences that could burst the Bubble.

    In other words, the Church wants to be the ONLY influence and considers
    *ANY* influence other that fundamental Hubbard’s doctrines to be insidious,
    predatory, stretching with octopus tentacles into Church rank and file and
    negatively INFLUENCING the mind set. Scientology is basically a culture of
    isolation. Hence the Public and staff are forbidden to read the Internet. Sea
    Org members are not even permitted to go their local library, leave alone surf
    the web.

    Parents who demand some Christmas/Thanksgiving time with their own children
    (that they have turned over to the Sea org) are considered “external
    Influences”. Sending gifts. money to own kids can be viewed as such.

    This is carried on to such an absurd degree, that almost ANYTHING that is
    not 100% Scientology or Sea Org 24/7/365 can be deemed an “EXTERNAL
    INFLUENCE”.

    In Part 2 of this Video I will explain “Rollback technology” that the
    Church dramatizes with inquisitions and investigations on these “EXTERNAL
    INFLUENCES” that Scientology feels is *corrupting* the purity of total devotion
    to Scientology at the level of sacrifice of every thing else.

    Remember, Bunkerites, this site is not just a club of friends and
    friendships, your words here and now will influence and plant seeds in the
    minds of all those reading and thinking, and feeling guilty pleasure at engaging
    in the “EXTERNAL INFLUENCE”. of this site.

    • DodoTheLaser

      Hi, lurkers! Thanks for visiting The Underground Bunker!
      Feel free to say hi back when ready, we will try our best to be nice and helpful.
      Thank you, Karen.

      • Peter

        And our best is very good, indeed. 🙂

      • chuckbeattyexseaorg75to03

        One tiny suggestion.

        New exiting members use their names so others grasp the atmospheric change, people are less fearful to “come out”.

        I always suggest people “coming out” really think through one major outside world document, the UN Declaration of Human Rights, the point about changing one’s religion.

        People have the right to change their religions, and it might seem insignificant, but because of the legalistic stance of Scientology, they play the legal system of countries we all know, I suggest exiting official Scientologists step back and READ the UN Declaration of Human Rights, and understand the world has a much higher principled answer for people, who feel compelled to LEAVE a religion they’ve been part of.

    • Eivol Ekdal

      Karen, as always very insightful. I can see the end game now, run the Idle Morgues like an international hotel chain. The staff will slowly be replaced by all Sea Ogers and if they do not have enough they will import those from less switched on countries. After all it is much easier to keep someone in the clutches if they have no local external influences. The language barrier will help as well as the fact that a person’s passport can be kept under lock and key.

      • Prim

        > The language barrier will help as well as the fact that a person’s passport can be kept under lock and key.

        That is the FBI’s definition of human trafficking.

        • Stacy

          I wish there was a policy at all airlines to have their people inform everyone getting off of an international flight that having your passport taken away and locked up is a crime. I’m just not sure how much it will help when some people are so desperate to get out of their home country that they’re willing to risk it.

          • Juicer77

            I’ve seen many billboards in int’l airports about this, but it would be helpful to make it more official and hard to miss.

      • Eclipse-girl

        The problem with that is the room and board that are required if one is Sea Org.

        Its is easier to do replace public in Clearwater and LA because that infrastructure is available.
        But it is not available for house 50 or 100 So in Boston, or Portland.

        • ze moo

          Just getting rice and beans to the SO at many Idle mOrgs is going to be a problem. The clampire has shown a lack of proper planning and logistics for the last 5-10 years.

          • DexterSka

            Make it go right!

    • Elar Aitch

      Karen I have noticed in just the last few articles when sorting comments by ‘best’ that the most popular comments are getting over 100 likes. 12 months ago, they maybe got 40,50,60…there are a lot of people reading I think.

      • Juicer77

        (There are a lot of Guests – some could be Disqus errors but I think we have a lot of lurkers. In which case, come in – have a seat. May I get you a snack?)

        • Lynn Fountain Campbell

          Ham sammich anyone? Popcorn? 🙂

      • Anthony Schultz

        having Tony reference that article from 2012 made me realize i’ve been on the site for over 2 years. wow! time really flies when you’re going blind with rage. i just can’t believe that with all the criminal dirt that Tony has compiled here over the years, that this farce of a church still exist and makes money while continuing to ruin lives every day.

      • romanesco

        I got interested in this subject because a lot of obnoxious CCHR Google ads were popping up on sites I visit frequently. I discovered this site after browsing for more information. So in my case at least, Scientology’s advertising had the opposite effect of what was intended. I am not a celebrity watcher nor much of a TV watcher, and had never heard of any of that South Park or Tom Cruise stuff.

        • grundoon

          Welcome!

    • Peter

      Brilliant insight, Karen. And spot on. My take is that this, too, will end up being another foot A-bomb (they’ve dispensed with bullets long ago) which will cost them mercilessly in the future. Ding Dong Davey has done it again, taken precisely the wrong tack.

    • PoisonIvyHerself

      Nicely said, Karen. I admire you tremendously. Thank you for being the powerful “external influence” that you are.

      Although our national justice system and its arcane (and cynical) acquiescence to the “religious freedom” argument are failing all those currently being abused by Scientology, the plethora of “external influences” is doing its job. Numbers don’t lie, Scientology, and yours are dropping like flies.

      The only numbers going straight up and vertical in Scientology are the dollars pouring into David Miscavige’s personal bank accounts. That’s the sick truth of it all.

    • Newiga

      Hi Karen! Thank you for yet another highly illuminating video! I’ve enjoyed your videos ever since you started your Youtube-channel. You are a lioness! Keep up the good work!

    • Pepper

      Karen,

      LA Org has been in a fiscal disaster for many years. My friends (a group of OT 8’s) paid LA Org’s debt around 2003-2004 in the amount of 2 million dollars. They were then sent for special staff training in Hollywood and joined staff at LA Day and Fdn. None of them are there today because when their staff contracts were up, they took the sec-checking and got the hell out of there. This was never a ‘broad public issue’ but it is well known in LA social circles.

      Management quietly sat back and took the money; the two million. No problem.

      • Lurkness

        Thanks Pepper for the additional information. Good to have you here!

        • Pepper

          Good to be here Lurkness.

      • TheRupture

        Yes, the whales are the only thing propping up this corpse today, but 2003-2004 is interesting. I hadn’t heard of this happening that early, just in the last 2 1/2 years. It’s like some twisted version of “Weekend at Bernie’s”. The whales Know it’s dead, so the more interesting question is why they’re still carrying it around on their backs?

        • Pepper

          Yes, TheRupture, that was the first instance that I heard of in terms of rescuing an org. It was often said thereafter that those OT 8’s “created a monster”, because the fundraising went into hyper-drive after that. The whales involved in that cycle were mercilessly hounded for money by the IAS for years after that. They would get IAS regges ringing their doorbells at 1-2 am. I know one guy who refused to get out of bed to answer the door and they rang and knocked for 2 hours straight before he finally gave in an talked to them.

          They are all still in but some of them are no longer ‘whales’, having been bled dry.

          One more note, one of them brought up the relentless fundraising issue with a SO executive and was told by the exec that it was “all you guys’ fault, you paid the debt of the org, 2 million and now Management expects public to pay now.” Those OT8’s demonstrated that the public would step in and take responsibility for the org’s failures to remain solvent.

        • J. Swift

          x

      • aquaclara

        wow. $2 million dollars just to prop things up. And ten years later, there is still a money issue.

        • Pepper

          Yep, there will always be money issues, it was always that way when I was in.

          Truly, money issues will never go away because the target is YOUR MONEY. And as long as you have some, it will be an issue!

      • Yes Pepper, good on whistle blowing this. You can bet that RTC blames “External influences” for LA Org’s long term miserable scene.
        The course rooms have full length glass windowsand one can see through them walking on L Ron Hubbard Way. When you look through the glass, the course rooms are empty.
        I don’t do that of late, but for years while I was in, parking in the adjacent parking lot and walking down, I observed that

        • Pepper

          Karen,

          I wasn’t planning on posting and only did because of what you said in your comment, to be an ‘external influence’. That was true enough for me!

          My best regards to you and Jeffrey.

      • J. Swift

        Pepper, can you offer more details? This is very interesting.

        • Pepper

          I agree J. Swift that it is an interesting event in the history of LA Org.

          This group of OT 8’s had recently finished the ‘New OT8’, in 2002-2003 after Miscavige had made adjustments to how OT 7 was being run in the late 90’s and now people were actually finishing OT 7 after being on it for a decade or more. On the Freewinds, they were indoctrinated into believing that they had to go out and become a worker bee for the church, being a ‘real’ OT now and had a responsibility.

          They had the luck of two companies buying their web-based (dot com boom) companies and made tens of millions of dollars between a handful of people. Being new monied and fundamentalist Scientologists, they were ripe for the picking. They got together and decided to join staff at LA Org so they could continue to work together as a group. Little recruitment was involved with them. They were immediately told that there was a problem: LA Org had a huge debt that had to be paid first before they could join staff. That debt was two million dollars. So they decided to ‘take responsibility’ as OT’s and pay this debt which they did with cash and stock shares they received in the sale of their companies.

          After the debt was paid, they were sent to an Int Management building in Hollywood where they received intense and private staff/management training. Not the usual for public in Scientology. They then had to wait another two years before they were fired onto their posts (Miscavige whim), which everyone thought was very strange indeed. They paid a two million dollar debt and were then trained for months by Int Management but were then not fired onto their posts for TWO years!

          The outcome of this was very interesting to see as someone who was in the orgs during this time period. First, these OT 8’s did a lot of recruiting both for staff for LA Org and the Sea Org. They fed the names of all the people’s children they knew to the SO recruiters and a lot of kids were recruited during this time, now the mid-late 2000’s. This is also when ‘The Briefing’ came out that the SO recruiters were using to recruit kids. Chris Shelton wrote about this in his article ‘The Sea Org; The Ultimate Merchants of Chaos’. Many kids also joined staff at LA Org too. It became quite the fad to join staff all around for short period of time. I also remember the word ‘spectator’ being thrown around a lot to describe people who were unwilling to join staff. Some of us actually have professions that keep us busy, you know. Oh well.

          The OT 8’s also fed the names of all public that they personally knew who were considered ‘upstat’ for regging for Super Power and the IAS. It became a feeding frenzy. Let’s just say that between the recruiting and being thrown to the shark regges, they lost more than a few friends.

          As the regging escalated, even these OT 8’s were exasperated and one complained to one of the SO execs at LA Org. That is when the exec told him that it was his and the group’s fault. Management got the idea that public would step in pay bills and thus “created a monster’.

          As time when on, they proved that even they could not make LA Org boom. After the Basics came out, the orgs really emptied and PAC resembled a ghost town. I saw this with my own eyes. As their staff contracts came up, they did not re-sign (I think only one did) and left quietly. They got their sec-checking at Flag. One of them was sec-checked to the bone and then still not cleared for doing services. He obviously handled it though because he’s now a Super Power completion. Maybe a few donations fixed it for him; I’m not privy to how he managed to get the okay for services again. All of them are still in and are redoing the bottom of The Bridge as New OT8’s.

          • I am told in the last 2-3 years. the only folk on the Purification Rundown in Los Angeles Org are OT8s and 3 to 4 Sea org Members. When they are done, more OT 8s arrive and 3-4 more staff are assigned to go it…and so it goes.

            • Pepper

              There are also the second generation Scns too, who are still at the bottom of the bridge and some OT 5’s who never got on 7. I don’t think there are any new public though.

          • Cece

            Pepper, Thank you for sharing. I’m interested what could be owed by LA Org to the tune of 2M. Not phone and electric. Maybe the BIC rent payments and other %s due management and the book account etc? Sad how management and other execs in general waste away another’s willingness to help. Ron Rakow (not sure of spelling) offered me once that he would cash the payroll check if I ever didn’t make it to the bank in time. It was so nice of him to offer, I would never put him in that position. I wonder how he is – Sandy Willhare used to be his auditor or and Denise Mulkey – I heard they married. (I know my spelling sucks)

            • Pepper

              Cece – I have no idea what the breakdown of expenses was or if the group of OT 8’s even asked to see it. I remember wondering the same thing and cannot recall right now what they told me. It was nothing specific though. Two million dollars sounded pretty extreme to me and I wondered at the time if it was entirely true or exaggerated.

              This group of new OT 8’s had their willingness to help taken advantage of to the extreme. There are so many stories like this in Scientology, countless when you think about it and most are not put out there on the blogs yet.

          • J. Swift

            Thanks for the detail Pepper. This tracks with some things I know about in that period.

            IMO, Miscavige and the Church simply became bolder in their criminality in this period. They got away with taking easy money and so they kept doing it and have not stopped. The religion angle is so good and the money is so easy there is no reason for Miscavige and his Cult goons to stop their financial rape and pillaging of the suckers.

            The essence of any con game is this: The con does not stop until the victim stops it. Until and unless the victim stops it, the Con Man will keep his con going. It doesn’t matter if his victim is hurt or others are hurt. A psychopathic Con Man does not care and has no human feelings. All the Con Man regards is his own staggering narcissism and this is Miscavige in a nutshell: A Con Man who has yet to be stopped.

            Miscavige is being squeezed and, when the hammer drops on him, he will not see it coming. That I know for certain.

    • Ruby

      It gets even more absurd. Those who dare to refer to Hubbard policy and show that the cherch is violating it left, right and center, like Debbie Cook, are also the enemy. What a horrible external influence she is….actually quoting LRH. How dare she!

    • joan nieman

      I enjoyed that so much Karen. Thanks for all the information you put out into cyberspace.

    • Once_Born

      One of the things I have learned since I started commenting here, is that the intention of CofS trolls is to provoke the regulars so that they:

      1) Respond with abuse – which makes us look aggressive and unreasonable
      2) Break up the comments, so that discussions that they disapprove of become difficult to follow. When employing this tactic, they typically contribute smug content-free one-liners, each of which provoke a number of replies.

      However, other consequences of CofS trolling include a tendency to over-react to newcomers and newly independent Scientologists.

      I suspect that a few people who post here (mostly presenting as ‘Independent Scientologists) are demonstrating their curiosity, insecurity and doubt by commenting in such a notoriously ‘entheta’ site. After all, if they are ‘true believers’, why do they come here? It is possible that some (apparently arrogant) visitors are in the process of losing their faith, and have come here to sample a different perspective.

      Their ‘certainty’ may be annoying. however, as long as they are not outrageously abusive (in which case warnings, followed by the ban-hammer will likely ensue) it does no harm to at least try to engage with them. Unlike Scientologists, we do not require everyone to share our views – only to stop harming others.

      Frightening newcomers (even the annoying one) off by resorting to mockery and abuse before they have had a reasonable chance to express themselves is surely unreasonable and counter-productive.

      Of course, it is difficult to tell the agent provocateur apart from the Scientologist whose faith is wavering, but has not yet shed the indoctrinated attitude of ‘certainty’ and the arrogant writing style that goes with it. However, perhaps it worth bearing with the troublesome in such a case.

      • Stacy

        Well said.

      • Lurkness

        ^^^Yes, to this. For instance, watching Bob’s evolution and recovery from the cult comes to mind.

      • Anonymous

        “… it is difficult to tell the agent provocateur apart from the Scientologist whose faith is wavering…”

        This reality has probably led to more trouble than almost all the other issues you mention above., combined.

        The obvious trolls are pretty easy to spot. The fence sitters, not so much. And a few folks don’t get subtle humor or do not spend enough time on the blog to recognize sarcasm from those that specialize in such…which leads to all sorts of stuff. Heh.

        And there are the occasional genuine whackjobs that just like to crap on everybody / anybody, here and pretty much anywhere. They are miserable and want to make others miserable too.

        Those folks make for some amusing opportunities at repartee.

      • daytoncapri

        The short fuses. I subscribe to the theory that we each are personally responsible for our personal
        behaviors, blaming the trolls for my own failure at self-control to posts by trolls,is wrong headed.

      • Pepper

        Once Born,

        The ‘Independents’ actually helped me out of the church because they were supportive. Even though I knew I was an Apostate, I was still frightened and anxious. Communicating with them helped me. I refrain from mocking them and still take a pause to listen to what they have to say because sometimes they make great points. Even though I agree that their ‘certainty’ can be condescending, arrogant or just plain annoying.

        • Once_Born

          Its good that people on different stages of a journey back to participation in the life of the wider world can help each other out. I wish you well with yours.

          As a ‘never-in’ I have a different perspective. Any conversation with an independent who actually replies to your points, at the very least helps me to understand the process by which they came to such bizarre (and easily falsified beliefs).

          Even with the arrogant and annoying tolerance and dialogue are usually the best approach.

          • Pepper

            Thank you Once Born. There certainly is a process coming into Scn and gaining understanding of what it is and quite another getting out. My journey is not complete yet. There is more work to be done.

    • Cece

      Here it is in the churches own words on it’s own website:

      “There are no restrictions for Scientologists to go online and inform themselves or have blogs and so on.”
      http://www.scientologymyths.info/random-rumors/does-the-church-block-access-to-critical-websites.php

      So inform yourselves. If you want help out goggle scientology railroad or help me leave scientology or help me leave the Sea Org. The internet is your friend.

    • Cece

      What Karen says is true. The church is afraid of external influences. It goes to great expense to print up nice glossy booklets to hand out to those who may be effected. Trouble is half the persons the booklets are handed too don’t know anything until the booklet is handed to them. That is how I ended up reading the 1991 Times article in the bathroom. I even hid it from my husband. You should see how berserk they go if you happen to have an articles or tapes of alien abductions LOL

    • Cece

      And Karen ~ if/when these on goings out here do get to the ears of the ‘in there’, well, they have a policy that lets them know it’s only proof how well they are doing. “Signs of Success. Whenever we’re really winning the squirrels start to scream.”
      I think the leaks to the Bunker, Mike Rinder, your videos and Jeff’s posting the tax returns are driving someone nuts. We should get a drone/camera going until we can get some good shots of DM frothing at the mouth. It’s a possibility.

    • Peter

      Awesome responsibility, Karen, which you and thousands of others have now taken on. It really has become an internet tsunami.

    • chuckbeattyexseaorg75to03

      Martin Gardner’s whole book, “Fads and Fallacies” discusses the personal style of people who are crank subject founders.

      Hubbard was a crank subject founder.

      Hubbard displays the crank characteristics.

      Hubbard’s system covered in the “Introduction to Scientology Ethics” book for controlling the membership’s activities person to person, includes unwarranted respect back to Hubbard and to whoever is the leadership of Scientology. The system protects whoever is boss without a way to correct the boss.

      Scientology has no means to correct the boss in power in Scientology.

      Scientology has no means to correct their system.

      These are serious problems that Scientologists cannot address.

      A system built by a crank protecting the crank’s control, will have problems like Scientology has.

      The Hubbard system has left in place problems that Miscavige is both stuck with and which he uses to his personal advantage.

      But mainly, I think the system he’s left with is always going to be a problem, since Hubbard’s crank mentality (I highly recommend “Fads and Fallacies” by Martin Gardner for his criticisms against cranks) is all through the system official Scientology is stuck with today.

    • Remy

      Fantastic post, Karen!

    • Anonymous

      Great video Karen.

      Those that have spent much time studying, operating or being affected by what Scientology laughingly calls “ethics tech” recognize that a very significant proportion of the “tech of ethics” (including the stuff about external influences) is in fact just third party tech, turned upside down and used AGAINST Scientologists.

    • Verve

      Really, you are so awesome.

  • it’s an interesting stat in his declaration—since 2002 he’s done over 5,000 of them….um, and what percentage of those were found in favor of the ‘church’? and/or where he sent such letters?

    • w.martin

      It would be interesting to compare the catholic church excommunications as a percentage of population to co $. Also, of the 5000 commevs how many resulted in sp declares? Considering there are only 25-30000 in the whole mob, it sure looks like they’ve got a problem, hmmm? I’m no mathematitian, but if you throw out more than you recruit….

      • Kim O’Brien

        i have been trying to get excommunicated for years ….LOL..not at easy as you think . I even called down to the Denver Diocese to ask what i had to do to be taken off the rolls ( go by baptism records and all eventually make their way to Vatican City ) if i walked into a church today ..i would most likely burst into flames ..but they would still count me as a Catholic

        • Graham

          Well if they didn’t excommunicate Hitler, you stand no chance!

          • Kim O’Brien

            they excommunicated Goebells though ( think it was him ) cuz he married a protestant …not for having a black soul ..but for the protestant thing

            • Missionary Kid

              That just shows how warped the CC ‘s values are, IMO. It’s all about enforcing conformity.

            • Robert Eckert

              Maybe they’d excommunicate you if you married a Scientologist then?

        • Missionary Kid

          My attitude towards any religious organization that wants to claim me is that anyone can claim anything they want to.

          They have no power over me or my afterlife. In a way, to even ask them to remove me concedes some powe.

          My attitude is, “I don’t believe in their imaginary kingdom, on earth or anywhere else. I didn’t ask to be baptized, and I’m not a party to any agreement with them. Fuchs ’email if they can’t take a joke.”

          • Kim O’Brien

            i don’t like having my name attached to false advertising 😉

            • Missionary Kid

              Go for it, but I’m betting it’ll be like dealing with the International Justice Committee.

            • Missionary Kid

              When I said it’s like dealing with the IJC, I meant you’re dealing with their “holy” rules. You’re probably only going to get excommunicated if you claim to be spouting different dogma, like that Jesus was an implant.

          • Once_Born

            This is why I am always annoyed to be characterised as an atheist. My (rational, scientific) world-view has a lot more to it than its incidental rejection of theism.

            However, this is all that (some) religious people can see. They insist in viewing my beliefs only from the perspective of their own (in which a rejection of God is paramount) without even bothering to try listen, or understand my point of view.

            I know a precious few Christians are open-minded enough to try engage with my point of view. In return, I try to understand (and respect) theirs. Neither of us are likely to convert the other, so we don’t even try – but we do have some excellent discussions.

            • Missionary Kid

              I have no problem labeling myself as an atheist, and I don’t care if Christians call me one, because I truly don’t believe in any god or theism.

              I have had plenty of excellent dialogs. One of the things that at least the reasoning people among the fundamentalist Christians realize is that there are other viewpoints. While they don’t agree with them, when I basically say that I don’t accept something as true just because the bible said so, they realize that without that basis for their arguments, they will have to talk about faith.

              I don’t disagree with their faith. It cannot be reasoned about because it is a belief, and beliefs aren’t subject to facts.

              On the other hand, over 95% of the time, I know more about the history of the bible and/or the historical roots of their belief than they do. I always urge them not to take me at my word, but to take a look at some of the things I reference. I know that I’ve been able to at least make a few people stop and think.

              I spent probably 40 years as an agnostic, and I can go to that position as well in discussing what my beliefs are. When I tell them that it’s not important to me that they claim that Jesus was the son of god, etc., because that’s not a part of my reference. I’m not worried about going to hell, because to me, it’s just a construct, an imaginary place that really didn’t develop until after Jesus was gone, and that the images that it bring forth are really mostly taken from Dante and his ilk.

        • Stacy

          I’ve always had the impression that the Catholic Church is much more concerned about keeping women in their proper place (at home, not working and competing with men) and with insuring sexual reproduction of members continues unabated in order to keep new Catholics coming. Maybe you could confess to wanting the next Pope to be female and to passing out condoms to Catholic teenagers and educating them about safe sex. Maybe that would work.

          Other than marrying outside the faith, what does the Catholic clergy consider an excommunicable offense? Abortion?

          • Hyder Simpson

            Marrying outside the faith is not a excommunicatory offense. Heresy is subject to automatic excommunication though so I expect Kim along with a healthy percentage of American Catholics are in fact technically if not officially excommunicated. But Catholics don’t do disconnection. So these excommunicated Catholics are supposed to go to Mass regularly but refrain from taking the Eucharist until they have renounced the heresy and repented.

      • Once_Born

        The CofS has always had an enormous turnover of adherents. In their glory days, their aggressive recruitment always at least made up for losses.

        In Hubbard’s time, people were ‘declared’ at the drop of a hat, but today’s ‘discipline’ is even more abusive. After all,if members had less to fear, too many of them would simply walk away with a sigh of relief.

        Scientology’s problem today is that they can no longer recruit nearly enough people to make up for their losses. The old style (relatively effective) recruitment procedure, which ‘found your ruin’ via the personality test, then ‘love bombed’ you into commitment, has given way seems to have given way to plonking prospects in front of a video monitor to watch a boring film (and then sneak off).

        Also, after years and years of discarding members when they are no longer productive (or just out of spite) there are probably now more ex-Scientologists than members – and these people have discovered a powerful force multiplier – this new-fangled ‘Internet’ thing.

        Due to their bizarre behaviour (yes, I’m looking at you Mr Cruise – if that’s your real name) and the activities of critics, Scientology has become a popular joke – so much so that the remaining human recruiters have to hide behind front groups.

        Finally, of course, there is the fact that the most comitted, hard-core Scientologists (the Sea Org) are not permitted to reproduce. You can’t make it up.

      • excellent perspective there—and excellent math!

    • Lurkness

      Orson Wells returns. Maybe there is something to this Scientology thing.

      • DodoTheLaser

        Rocking nice judgy beard too.

        • w.martin

          He’s not living on rice and beans.

          • Lurkness

            Awesome line. Cleaning screen now.

          • Sejanus

            Only if by rice and beans you mean steak and eggs..lol

          • I heared he eats young Sea Org members for breakfast.

            -Ron

          • Ha ha. That was the exact words I thought as soon as I saw this pic.

        • VickiStubing

          Nah, Judge Waldrip’s is eleventy million times more awesome.

      • April

        Nooooooo. Orson Wells was a cool guy.

        • beauty for ashes

          and prettier!

    • 1subgenius

      He may not be up on justice, but he has solved the eternal question of where a fat guy should wear his belt.
      It is precarious though.

    • Asbestos Inspector

      If he looks like that then, I wonder what he looks like now.

    • Barbara Angel

      Are you sure that, that’s not Krusty when she let her beard grow?

    • PoisonIvyHerself

      Ouch. How’d you like to have this guy determining your financial future?

      At least the numbers on his scale are going straight up and vertical.

    • Kim O’Brien

      when a man has huge amounts of fat from above his belly button …that makes a big gut over his cock …so he can’t see it …that is called “gock ” …( gut combined with cock )

      Guys with “gocks” are totally gross …just fyi . Only thing worse is a “gunt” …i will let you guess what two words make that combo 😉

    • Shame on you, Ronnie, ratting out your stooges like that. They must be giving you heavier drugs in Hell.

      • Colombian Devil’s Breath, what else.

        -Ron

        • joan nieman

          Ha ha! Now that is funny.

    • Stacy

      He looks so healthy. Those OT powers at work. Obviously he’s not being starved to death. Church of hypocrisy.

    • Jgg2012

      He looks like he has super powers.

      • Kim O’Brien

        😉

    • chuckbeattyexseaorg75to03

      Thank Doug Owen for taking this photo amongst others.

      Thank me, for suggesting Doug where to go to take the several dozen photos he took which in turn were posted for people to see ongoing history of Sea Org members walking to their daily bus ride in the morning from the Anthony Building there on Fountain Ave, over to the HGB for their daily duties.

      Doug, and even Angry Gay Pope, took some very excellent street photos of even some OSA Int staff, including the OSA Int lady who is the in house policer of the internet sites, going back a decade now, forget her name.

      Doug Owen, thankyou!

      • Cece

        Yes, and thank you Chuck. So how many are left do you think? I go near the complex now and then. Took some videos Nov 2013. They were pretty boring. Just a security guard on a bike and pretty much nothing else on the complex block. AOLA & ASHO crew were in the MB (for building re-renos) at the time but still no activity on Catalina or in and out of Leb Hall. Send me your photo wish lists cecegangle@gmail.com 🙂

        • chuckbeattyexseaorg75to03

          Hi Cece,

          Will email you.

          Remember CSP time, remember the times before events when they get lots of buses at the front of ASHO for the public to transport people over to the event at the Shrine.

          There are yearly, and for events, staging areas of people, and the timing of those staging area times.

          The RPF clean the big communal kitchen nightly, and there’s always the pair of RPFers who nightly take out the food slop trash and the boxing trash out to big dumpster in the Cat Lot and to the seperate cardboard roll off in the Cat Lot nightly, so in the summer, right timing, and you can always get a photo of the RPFers taking the cardboard to the trash roll off in the Cat Lot. (The cleaning of the RPF men’s dorm, I think they do it evenings, like Sat night, they’ll be small pairs of RPFers running around extra peppy doing oddball errands, even during the RPF members’ CSP times, they will be doing things like making their trip to the Cat Lot to go into the Cat Lot containers that contain the RPF members’ personnel gear, Cat Lot visits to the containers of their personal gear are pregnant with meaning.)

          When people are “routing out” of the Sea Org, they get sometimes let roam around a bit, they did with me, I got the longer leash treatment, and looking for these people who are quitting but being allowed that longer leash treatment, their routines can be discovered by careful observation. These types of flakey quitters (I was one) would be very interesting to contact and get talking quickly about their immediate experiences, I would have, had some weekly newspaper reported contacted me back during my first week or two out of the RPF!

          The RPF’s RPF will be doing “outside” work in the Cat Lot from time to time. When I was on the RPF’s RPF I did loads of outside work, I even remember seeing Marty Rathbun one of the times back in 2001ish when Marty brought Tom Cruise to AOLA for some Qual cycle, I didn’t see Cruise, just Marty, who was walking in front of Fountain Ave the sidewalk past INCOMM reception.

          So, the timing of when you go, you just need to recall the “staging” times, the times when we Sea Orgers did go outside.

          Mealtimes is always great.

          And the different orgs have different meal times, people will take their 100 yards stroll down one side of the complex sometimes.

          The persons who insist on taking their walks (think Problem of Work, think even OT 1 I think it is, even the Sunshine Rundown walk) is required outside time!

          Remember during Key to Life, the take a walk happened in volume back then, all the twinships all out walking daily, when on Key to Life.

          Here’s my suggest. It takes multiple visits to the complex, around the time slot one wishes to first off get a feel for their schedules.

          It’s all scheduling. It means dozens and dozens of daily trips around the year, same time of the day, like choose mornings. The Anthony bus picks up the Anthony berthing people and drives them to the HGB mornings. There are two or three bus times, since not everyone goes at the same time.

          I forget, but it takes having totally free time to just fumble around enough days to see their schedules for busing from the Anthony to the HGB mornings.

          People will walk to the HGB for their course time, certain days of the week, like people usually the bolder longer term Sea Org members insist on walking, they’ll walk from the Anthony Building on CSP Sunday morning over to the 99cent store on Sunset!

          When I got out of the Sea Org, I went and lived over near Normandy Ave for a year. During that year on CSP Sunday morning, I’d notice mostly OSA Int staff would walk over to the 99cent store Sunday morning to buy their treats! Some, even Lynn Farney the Legal Sec, would do his laundry at one of the outside laundromats.

          There are moments to catch the Sea Orgers with their tiny windows of free time, out in the real world, you have to recognize them, they behave uniquely, kind of out of place slightly dumpy stiff. The older timer ones are the most interesting to me, seeing how they’ve aged, reading their faces for their buried views of it all.

          Anyways, multiple visiting just getting up to speed on their schedules, choosing a time slot, like 7am to 9:30 am, for a week or two, watching their routines, noticing the times the bus shows up, day by day, as that sometimes changes, it does change on Sat and Sunday.

          Last time I was there, my thoughts were that getting a message to Sea Orgers daily, is doable, if your Sea Org person you wish to communicate to rides a bus. Just first notice their bus route, then choose a stop light corner the next day, wait, and aim your sign at the bus saying your message to the person you wish to address, and people on the bus will have to report you and your sign and your message, and possibly the person you wish to communicate to will notice. You could do the prep step for a week first, to see which side of the bus your Sea Orger normally sits on, and just wait for the exact right day and time they are sitting on the right side before springing your message sign at them when they are looking at you!

          It all just takes a lot of time and patience, but there moments to communicate to them.
          I was thinking of doing the sign thing to send a message to one of my ex wives, you just have a one time chance, you have to pick that moment carefully by good prepping to see them.

          Some staff, the OSA Int staff drive cars, photos of them getting out of their cars I’ve seen, so even the ones who write the nasty intel programs, the “Handling Programs”, I’ve seen Fritz and his wife photographed getting out or into a car looking at the camera!

          The OSA Int staff do double duty during the Shrine events and stand even street barricade duty with the police, with their OSA Int watch duty.

          And NOT scaring them off, as they report you photographing them immediately, their counter measure is often just change their patterns and drive the bus right up to the doorway of the Anthony so that boarding and unloading the bus is a minimum of outside world noticeable.

          When the busloads of RPFers go to and from the Shrine yearly, for the New Year’s event preps, that busload can be filmed and it’s route is easily filmed.

          Doug Owen checked out everything he did legally first, and I’ll introduce you to him. Just follow the law as they will play their games with you.

          As you remember, there is always that small minority of Sea Org quitters, route outs, who are making their trips out of the complex at times, they are noticeable while they are accompanied and are out taking their walks with their watches, or going to the doctors (the RPF used to have a posse of people going to the free Univ Hospitals several times a week, wearing their tshirt civies dress and not the RPF uniform, but the RPF member civies dress is noticeable if you know how they dress.)

          chuckbeatty77@aol.com

          • Cece

            That’s some impressive photo wish list you have Chuck! I’m thinking access to the roof of Kaiser may be more my style 🙂

        • chuckbeattyexseaorg75to03

          Maybe Vickie Shantz and Peter will blow and go public quickly, unlikely.

          I’d love to hear from someone like Karen Hvass, a long term programs chief manager at the HGB level,but I fear she’s still in.

          We need someone with access to the “upper middle management” full range of statistics who knows what those stats really mean.

      • Doug Owen

        Chuck, I’m pretty sure the person you meant to thank was Doug Owens, not Doug Owen. Easy mistake, but important to those of us of Welsh rather than English descent.

        • chuckbeattyexseaorg75to03

          Thanks, corrected to Owens!

  • Lurkness

    The Barrington letter from IJC Ellis is why the work you do Tony along with that of former members is so important. Bringing Scientology’s lies to the light of day by former members recounting their experiences and providing documentation is perhaps the only way to combat Scientology’s sharp, dare we say fraudulent, litigation tactics. What are the odds that letters like this would ever be disclosed by Scientology in discovery? Or how about the daily dictations of the diminutive one in directing the nefarious activities of the “cherch.”

    • Sejanus

      I guess it is safe to say Mr Ellis not only perjured himself but has been caught red handed doing so thanks to the Berrington letter.
      By Xenu’s Taint may it be entered into evidence!

  • DodoTheLaser

    (Scientology) International Justice Chief. LOL

  • Sejanus

    Dear Judge Whittemore we enter into evidence the Berrington letter as rebuttal to Mr Ellis lies…er testimony.

    The court finds in favour of the plaintiff.
    $cientology will pay the sum of 9 Trillion Quatloos (that would be 4 Billion dollars in non Space opera currency) to the plaintiffs and all bullet proof glass from Cap’n Three Foot Nuthin’ without delay.

    • Lurkness

      That’s a ton of “Rons”

    • Peter

      I wonder if the Garcia’s attorneys read the bunker? Would be nice if they could get a certified copy of that letter for such presentation. In effect, it is evidence of perjury on the part of Ellis with his new letter.

      • joan nieman

        Perhaps the Garcia’s will see it.

        • Peter

          As has been said, “from your mouth to God’s ear”. Or words to that effect. It would be lovely to catch them in perjury, something they do with alacrity whenever it serves their purpose.

  • Sejanus

    Reviewing all justice acts done to ensure no injustice is done….ROFLMAO!!!!!!!!!!!

    Unless you are the poor bastard brought in before the IJC in which case it stands for InJustice Chief.
    The very nerve of these effers is beyond the pale.

    I could not help but travel backwards in time to the Inquisitions after seeing the term International Justice Chief as an “ecclesiastical” title. Sounds more like a kangaroo court lynch leader….ohh right..CUZ IT IS!

    • DodoTheLaser

      Scientology is the biggest RPG (role-playing game).

      • Sejanus

        Having played alot…ALOT of RPG’s in my lifetime (yes a GEEK and proud…lol) I am always struck by one element most missed. They are at their core co-operative. Not much cooperation in Co$ unless it comes to stealing money, at which time it is all hands on deck.

        • DodoTheLaser

          Skyrim, or World Of Warcraft, or Mass Effect, just to name a few most popular RPGs,
          has literally millions more players than scientology. Of course, it’s just analogy, but still.
          Hubbard’s “game” is obsolete.

      • kemist

        They even have a cosplay, they call that the Sea Org.

        • DodoTheLaser

          My thoughts exactly. Bunch of Anons showing up at the next Comic Con,
          dressed up as the scientology Sea Org members could be a major hit.

      • joan nieman

        I like that description Dodo and if MK is around, perhaps it could go on our long list of ” Things said about scientology”.

        • Missionary Kid

          I’m on a tablet, so I’ll get it later.

          • joan nieman

            ok MK!

      • Missionary Kid
    • April

      I read that line as “Reviewing all justice acts to ensure no JUSTICE is done.” Pretty accurate imho.

  • Sid

    Karen makes a good point. Next to money and income the next biggest concern right now is all the leaks going on. Sea Org have pretty much had all of their external communications shut down. All cell phones and devices removed. A lot of the leaks did seem to come from LA Org so if they couldn’t find the leak then our little Deranged Manic would just throw the whole lot out and send in some bodies he can control.

    • I said the other day when this happened that the Demon Mutt was trying to block the leaks, like he had had a massive tantrum and said eff this lot. I will fix them once and for all.
      maybe I was channeling the little bastard.LOL.

      • Peter

        I wonder how many new enemies he’s made by just walking in and sending people home, negating their staff contracts and, I’m sure, ignoring any severance pay? Almost instant candidates for leaving.

        • Juicer77

          In his twisted little mind: he is glad they are gone, they were security risks and never took the cause seriously enough, better to send them out to the wogs where no one will believe their wild stories anyway. Replace them with good little Sea Argh bots who are too undernourished and exhausted to question him. There, problem fixed! Where’s my scotch?

          • Peter

            Good reply. 🙂

        • Barbara Angel

          ‘Severance Pay’ ?????? Wow, now that’s a very hopeful thought.

        • Hopefully there might be some new bunker visitors in the coming weeks with some tales to tell.

      • Stacy

        “Maybe I was channeling the little bastards thoughts.”

        You should probably get that looked at

        • Nah that was just my OT Eleventy Powers.
          I can also change the traffic lights and find a parking space too.
          Perhaps I should write a testimonial for the next newsletter?

  • That Berrington letter is priceless — just dripping with the smug superiority of lunatic idiocy. I hope the Garcias (or others) use it to mop the floor with Sci claims of a functional arbitration system.

    • DodoTheLaser

      International Justice Chief sounds similar to President Of Earth.

      • Are_sics

        It very much does. Or borrowing from Nat-lificent again, it also sounds like Smugly Superior Lunatic Idiot.

        “Refund? Your only terminal is the Smugly Superior Lunatic Idiot”.
        I suppose there can’t be only one of those, however, so it’s not a perfect title.

        • DodoTheLaser

          There are great many fabulous titles in “Miscavige & Hubbard Hospital for Criminally Insane”, also known as scientology.

          • Mark Foster

            ¨I think I´ll call him…mini-me…¨

        • kemist

          He could be the International Director of Insane OTs.

          • Juicer77

            I see what you did there * snicker *

      • It sounds like something out of a comic book.

        • 1subgenius

          Or a pulp novel. Hubbard didn’t do comics.

          • Captain Howdy

            He just ripped them off like everything else he ever did.

        • DodoTheLaser

          Perfect choice of pic.

      • ze moo

        Zaphod Beeblebrox,President of the Gal-lax-z.

    • Lurkness

      You just know he and others laughed at how they were screwing with Mr. Berrington. Smug, indeed.

    • joan nieman

      Oh yes Nat! It appears that the letter could be used as a very good weapon.

  • Rocket J. Squirrel

    I love Karen de la Carriere’s videos and I do believe that the “Church” of Scientology will be sorry it ever made her an enemy.

    • DodoTheLaser

      Me too. They already are sorry.

      • PoisonIvyHerself

        The Church of Scientology means never having to say you’re sorry.

        The don’t know from sorry. They only know “Bring it on.” Sigh.

    • April

      Me too. I love her speaking style.

    • Sergeant Pepper

      The cherch specializes in “picking fights” and making enemies. Karen is one of the more formidable ones indeed.

      • Barbara Angel

        mustravage has the ability to pick a fight in an empty room. He is his own worst enemy.
        Thank Xenu he’s doing his best to bring his, ‘racket’ down with his own home made ‘sink hole’.

  • Sid

    That letter to Berrington should be sent to the IRS. Might not do anything but you never know what might tip the scale.

  • Elar Aitch

    International justice chief….or…Injustice chief for short

  • Mike Ellis, enforcing that mother-son disconnection thing:

    Scientology clergy force a mother to choose: son or daughter (w/video) March 14, 2014, Joe Childs, Tampa Bay Times

    • DodoTheLaser

      Some justice.

      • Obviously justice is another of those words that’s redefined inside Scientology to something completely different from Earth English.

        • Mark Foster

          Refer to ¨The Marcabian Dictionary of Earth English for The Great Unwashed, 307th edition¨ Oh, no…wait, that´s upper-level, confidential data. Never mind.

        • DodoTheLaser

          Yup. Hubbard also liked to brag how he defined (invented? lol) Ethics,
          since “wogs” are confused puppies or something, and how ethics is a personal thing,
          yet his ethics is really turned out to be justice, and fake one at that.

        • Lurkness

          HCO PL 5 October 1971:

          “Propaganda by Redefinition of Words”:

          “A long term propaganda technique used by socialists (Communists
          and Nazis alike} is of interest to PR practitioners. I know of
          no place it is mentioned in PR literature. But the data had
          verbal circulation in intelligence circles and is in constant
          current use. The trick is — WORDS ARE REDEFINED TO MEAN
          SOMETHING ELSE TO THE ADVANTAGE OF THE PROPAGANDIST. Many
          instances of planned and campaigned in order to obtain a public
          opinion advantage for the group doing the propaganda. Given
          enough repetition of the redefinition public opinion can be
          altered by altering the meaning of a word. The technique is
          good or bad depending on the ultimate objective of the
          propagandist. “Psychiatry” and “psychiatrist” are easily
          redefined to mean “an anti-social enemy of the people”. This
          takes the kill crazy psychiatrist off the preferred list of
          professions… The redefinition of words is done be associating
          different emotions and symbols with the word than were
          intended… Scientologist are redefining “doctor”, “Psychiatry”
          and “psychology” to mean “undesirable antisocial elements”…
          The way to redefine a word is to get the new definition repeated
          as often as possible. Thus it is necessary to redefine
          medicine, psychiatry and psychology downward and define
          Dianetics and Scientology upwards. This, so far as words are
          concerned, is the public opinion battle for belief in your
          definitions, and not those of the opposition. A consistent,
          repeated effort is the key to any success with this technique of
          propaganda. One must know how to do it.”

          — L. Ron Hubbard.

    • Lurkness

      Hope Nick Lister is still doing well and Ashley and her family finally wakes up.

    • Lurkness

      For convenience, here is Ellis’s letter ENFORCING the cult’s “voluntary” disconnection policy. (refresh)….

  • DeElizabethan

    I certainly hope that Judge Whittemore will read this letter from the In…Justice Chief.
    Seems to me that this cult can sue anyone, but oh no, you can’t sue them.

    • April

      That’s what I’m thinking. Someone please tell me that the Garcia’s lawyer is going to submit Robert Barrington’s letter from Ellis into evidence.

  • Truthiwant

    5000 commitees of evidence in twelve years works out at just over one a day on average. Considering the amount of trouble Scientology has had in all these years, including Sea Org and public, this number, in my opinion is much lower than the actual real number of comm evs. carried out.

    However, Ellis is trying to show, with this 5000 number, that Scientology have a vast experience in internal commitees of evidence, to approve or not approve some justice action. I am sure he thought long before coming up with a number that would look impressive to the judge, but at the same time was not too high, else it would undermine the credibility of Scientology itself. If he had written a more truthful number like 25,000 or 35,000 or even more, it would certainly awake suspicion to what the heck is really going on inside Scientology.

    • DodoTheLaser

      5000 Committees of Evidence. Zero justice served.

      • Mark Foster

        Committees of Moral Buggery

        • DodoTheLaser
        • Barbara Angel

          The co$a nostra has *No Morals*….. just shut the fuck up and give us Allllllllllll your moneeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee they’re just using every low life tactic not to give it back.
          They’ve spent decades plotting on ways not to give refunds.
          They are Such Arseholes. As previously mentioned, there is no low level that co$ will not sink to, to preserve the insatiable lust for moneeeeeeee.
          $$$$$ are the most treasured item in the co$a nostra operation.

          • Mark Foster

            “MAKE MONEY. MAKE MORE MONEY. MAKE OTHER PEOPLE PRODUCE SO AS TO MAKE MORE MONEY.”

            – L. Ron Hubbard, Hubbard Communications Office Policy Letter, 9 March 1972, MS OEC 384

      • ze moo

        Would you like fries with your comm-ev?

    • Lurkness

      5,000 is also their favorite go to number for event attendance…..

      https://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&aq=&oq=scientology+5000+at+events&ie=UTF-8&rlz=1T4GUEA_enUS595US596&q=scientology+5000+at+events&gs_l=hp…0i22i30.0.0.0.10159………..0.2sMiyeTrOOo

    • flexible

      And most SP declares are now being done/have been done for years, without any Com Ev. They simply arrive in the mail in a brown manilla envelope I have heard…no com ev done whatsoever. Just “Poof”.. your an SP.

      • DodoTheLaser

        And the reaction of a newborn SP is normally – “Thank you, baby Jesus!”

      • Lurkness

        But, but, but that would be contrary to written scripture. Surely you are not saying Scientology’s “justice” system is a sham.

      • Mark Foster

        No, now you don´t even get written notification…it´s verbal, and often via hearsay…

    • 1subgenius

      5000 ethics issues to be resolved. Hilarious. Cited to show the system of “justice” but instead demonstrates conclusively that there are massive problems.

      • “Over 5,000”. I smell weasel words. It’s somewhere from 5001 to infinity.

  • 1subgenius

    Re: Mr. Ellis’ letter of 10/11/12

    Since it was not written by Hubbard, neither Ellis nor anyone else in the command structure of the world’s most sinister scam has read “Catch-22”, so it is understandable that they are unclear on the central concept..

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catch-22_(logic)

    • Sergeant Pepper

      Second try. You can only get your money back if you ask. If you ask for your money back, you’re an SP. You can’t get your money back if you’re an SP.

    • Peter

      Yossarian has my vote to become the new IJC in skeesiology.

      • Only so long as Milo Minderbinder doesn’t end up as COB.

        • Peter

          LOL Good note.

        • Robert Eckert

          I thought he already was?

  • 1subgenius

    This certainly makes Mr. Ellis a necessary and essential witness.
    I can’t see Miscavige letting that happen.

    • Eclipse-girl

      Another footbullet in the making

      Have the IJC write an affidavit that should get them out of this mess, but then have other evidence such as the letter the IJC wrote to this South African man, also introduced.

      I have the idea that Judge might want to have some more clarification / discovery / depositions done on the IJC

      • 1subgenius

        “…Judge might want to have some more clarification…”

        Its called “giving them enough rope.”

  • Lurkness

    Injustice Chief Ellis’s affidavit is also revealing in that only just now, ONE refund matter was recently referred for a committee of evidence/arbitration. You know that if the “arbitration process” (however the Cherch is lately interpreting it) ever resulted in a refund they would have been touting it. Sham process is a sham.

    • I doubt it was Larry Anderson’s repayment. He’s only been waiting four years. (Watch out for shifting words. There’s refund and there’s repayment, completely different things inside Scientology.)

      Larry Anderson, star of Scientology’s ‘Orientation’ film, wants his money back January 24, 2010, Joe Childs, Thomas C. Tobin, St. Petersburg Times

      Oh look, Shelly:
      http://www.tampabay.com/resources/images/dti/rendered/2010/01/sci_larrydavidshell_104272a_8col.jpg

      • 1subgenius

        One of the few pix of DM that makes me laugh every time.

        • August 1996. He hasn’t aged well.

          • 1subgenius

            Child actors rarely do.

            • Lurkness

              Snickersnort and more.

        • Eclipse-girl

          Dinky looks like a little moppet in that one

        • Todd Tomorrow

          He truly is a shrimp.

          • 1subgenius

            Like something out of a 1950’s Buster Brown shoe ad.
            Or Alfred E. Neuman.

      • Lurkness

        Yes, an important distinction as to how the loons define the terms. I will repost this from last night as it explains difference between refunds and repayments per $cientology and it is relative to today’s topic too.

        I hope future lawsuits (post-Vance Woodward lawsuit) press the issue of “repayments” (funds provided to Sciendollary for future services) relative to their agreement with the IRS. Their purported arbitration process and other new procedures are in DIRECT CONFLICT with their representations and agreement with the IRS. If nothing else, perhaps a court or two might direct the IRS’ attention to this violation of the tax exemption agreement.

        The IRS agreement provides as to “refunds” and “repayments”:

        “It has been a long-standing policy of the Church that if someone is dissatisfied with their Scientology services and asks to have their contributions returned within a three month period, these amounts will be returned. Likewise, if the person asks for return of contributions for which no services were received (i.e. an advance payment), there is no three month limitation period. Anyone newly enrolling in services at a Church of Scientology is informed of the policies and signs an agreement to abide by them. As a further condition of receiving a refund or repayment, the person understands that they may not again receive services from the Church.

        Within the Church, there are two separate terms: A “refund” refers to a return of contributions to a parishioner within 90 days of participating in religious services while a “repayment” refers to a return of a parishioner’s advance payment before he or she has participated in religious services. For simplicity, the following discussion will use the term “refund” to describe both types of transactions, because both involve a return of parishioner contributions.

        The Church’s refund policy is exceedingly fair. If someone isn’t happy with Scientology — which is a very small minority of people — he simply has to make a proper request for his donations back, agree to forego further services and his donations will be returned. For the Church, in addition to the fact that this policy aligns with Scientology principles of exchange, it also serves the purpose of allowing our churches and the parishioners who are very happy with Scientology, to carry on without the unhappy few in their midst.”

        • “For simplicity, the following discussion” is the same as “Look, nothing up my sleeve!” in stage magic, while palming the egg with the other hand when the audience is distracted.
          They’re encouraging people to mix up the terms so that they can use it to their advantage later.

      • Captain Howdy

        At first I was like “why is someone posting this picture of these kids that looks like it’s from the 60’s?”.

      • Lurkness

        I also think Larry Anderson’s case was specially handled by Tommy Davis, his wife and OSA. I never heard of any arbitration. Same holds true for yoga boy’s (Brian Culkin’s) case as well where the cult tried to buy him off as a witness by returning funds to him.

      • Kim O’Brien

        wow Davey …talk about gay face

      • Little Dave looks so cute.

        -Ron

  • DeElizabethan

    I think you’re absolutely right Karen. Getting rid of the public staff
    and replacing them with Sea Org members will help security and their
    control of the people. However, they will lose more money by losing
    public due to the complete robots now encountered there, imo. Yippee!

    • Kittery

      This was my thought also. Replacing staff with SO will tighten up security, but the public can and will still be exposed to ‘external influences’. And where does dear leaders’s money come from? Not sea ogres, they’re poor. It comes from whales and other publics. So if the SO scares off the public, then the money will dry up very quickly. I love the smell of footnukes in the morning.

    • April

      Were the LA staff being paid less than minimum wage and worked more than 40 hours per week without being paid ovetime? If so, the CO$ may have sensed the feds coming after them over labor law violations. The SO are volunteers so labor laws might not apply to them.

      • DeElizabethan

        I believe public staff are volunteer positions too. Really crappy heh? The main difference is in the length of contract and other amenities (punishments) of course. Public staff get a only a tiny percent of money their org brings in.

  • George Layton

    I’d like to see the judge ask for docs on these 5000 proceedings conducted.

    • 1subgenius

      That is inevitable, but will be one hell of a rabbit hole.

      • Guest

        You can only get your money back if you ask. If you ask for your money back, you’re an SP. You can’t get your money back if you’re an SP.

      • Warning! Getting too involved in the “religious” parts of Scientology is dangerous to the case. Anything pulled in has to be precise and with a safety line of relevance attached.

    • Robert Eckert

      No, all he should ask is how many of these CommEvs have awarded refunds, and for documentation of each such instance.

      • Repayments, not refunds. Refunds are within 90 days for a course taken. Repayment is “a return of money without the service being taken.” Keep Scientology’s words pinned down or they’ll slither all over the place.

  • PickAnotherID

    I find it fascinating $cientology keeps refering to “refunds for services” while the Garcia’s lawsuit is about getting money back due to fraud. A bit of a difference there.

  • Captain Howdy

    We don’t recognize sharia law in this country, why this?

    • April

      Church doctrine cannot protect you from fraud forever, Davey. Tick tock.

  • Barbara Angel

    Just found a new church we could all join and wear a nice hat………… Sounds good to me.
    http://minisites.ninemsn.com.au/9stories/8917280/tradie-refused-religious-right-to-wear-pasta-strainer-on-head-in-licence-photo

    • Lurkness

      The Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster! Pastafarians unite. Love it.

      • April

        All hail his noodeliness. Ramen.

      • Barbara Angel

        Yeah and we get to wear a really nice ‘religious’ hat too. Am sure the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster is free too.

    • Golden Age of Blech

      Many people in Russia got arrested and charged with “mocking the church”. Just for having a parade in their garb. Thats why we Sub-Geniuses stay underground.

    • TheQueenofBulgravia

      I am Mother Superior of the Frizbeetarians Revirginated. Our Religious Icon is the Smiley Face. In my Official Drivers License photo I am wearing my Religious Headgear, a genuine silver plastic tiara with Smiley Faces. Although the Motor Vehicle Dept said, “No, no,no.”, after I stood on The Law vs “policy” and The Bill of Rights and Freedoms, I was issued my current DL.

      A Democratic Government CANNOT define a person’s Religion! It is important to speak bureaucratic legalese when defending your Civil Rights!!! Shakespeare, Hamlet, act III, scene 4, lines 206 and 207: “For ’tis sport to have the engineer/ Hoist with his own petar …”

      …”petard,” from the Middle French peter, from the Latin peditum – “to break wind.”

  • Alex De Valera

    Long live Queen Karen! Stand tall. You are brave and have a great sense of humour.

  • rom661

    Quite a catch, that Catch-22.

    • w.martin

      “It’s the best there is”

  • Phil McKraken

    That letter to the SA SP is awesome. It’s really something that they would put an real-life, actual Catch-22 into writing for prosperity.

  • w.martin

    Has anybody but lou’s boytoy been on one post (1998) as long as this ellis stooge?

    • DodoTheLaser

      Figureheads galore.

    • Robert Eckert

      Heber Jentzch has been “President” since 1982.

    • TheRupture

      Cara Golashesky, FLB (Flag Land Base) Justice Chief, posted 1997. She is what is referred to in today’s declaration document as a Continental Justice Chief.

      • Lurkness

        yep..enforced disconnection by Ellis.

  • RadioPaul1

    I have seen the DC Org looking more and more dead all the time. More people from foreign countries. Also a lot of tired and worn down looking faces. So the Sea Org thing is probably going to happen soon there too.

  • TheRupture

    Regarding the PAC change up, one minor point regarding ASHO Fdn financials, this org historically has been more profitable than ASHO Day. This is because the Day org relies on out of town public, a declining number. The Fdn org serviced public that lived in the region. Since the Briefing Course is all but obliterated and there have only been a few reports of bail outs by upper management orgs, since GATII rules all but obliterates all members’ training and processing over the decades, it would not be surprising if ASHO, AOLA, and LA Org will next be rolled into one. The many mini management orgs that take up space in L.A. would then be combined and take residence in AOLA building. This is called downsizing in the real world. It broadcasts a message their Chairman is downsizing.

    As to leaks and information control, this has been true for many years so it doesn’t quite explain it all for me. The suddenness, the extremity of the actions such as 24 hour turnover, not one of the usual penalties enacted such as freeloader debt, year long arduous obstacle course to route out, no severe ethics mania rained down on staff, no scumbag, degraded being labels permantly branded on the foreheads of those leaving through the looking glass, all point to another possible explanation. Considering there is another major factor that potentially might jar sea org staff’s ironclad dissonance, the bald violation of policies that clearly indicate these actions can only be undetaken by a drooling, raving Suppressive Person, my conclusion is based on history.

    The only times such major shocking ploys have occurred is when an immiment and dangerous legal menace was twisting in the wind. Sea Org staff are strictly now on the books as volunteers (see the Headley legal case). This is a preemptive move, like digging foxholes, donning protective helmets, CYA maneuvers. It would explain the emergency 24 hour turnover, the implausible conditions of no penalties that has everyone shaking their head in mystery, and then there’s the matter of publicly stating this is being done to ensure staff get their enhancement time (auditing or training, or qual actions, corrective). For these reasons, my explanation is a plausible threat of legal suits or a raid from some government agency was either perceived or anticipated and resulted in these acute and for some unfathomable transmutation of PAC.

    • DodoTheLaser

      If there will be a raid from some government agency,
      I hope scientology International Justice Chief will surface again,
      tell the agents his title and like totally handle it on the spot, by using the proper LRH references.
      It should work, I think.

      • TheRupture

        He should. According to scientology policy, scientology laws are superior to all laws so by their own tenets, Mr Ellis is superior to the U.S. States Attorney and all members of the Supreme Court Justice combined. I would like to have this judge demand to see evidence of # of actual active members vs 5,000 Comm Evs. And then # of actual active members vs # of SP Declares in the last 12 years. Then how many of those #____ newly minted SP’s have been awarded a refund ever.

      • Captain Howdy

        All he’d have to do is walk out and greet the Feds and say “Hello, I am the International Justice Chief” and show them his badge and they’d be as good as gold.

    • aquaclara

      He’s circling the wagons, eh? Makes sense. I wonder if there is another potential lawsuit blowing in the California air at this very moment.
      And the Narconon suits are getting closer to the top of the house, so these could be a sufficient financial threat in themselves.

      • TheRupture

        I was thinking more along the lines of human trafficking as well as illegal employee infractions, social security fraud, OSHA and similar matters. Perhaps someone studied the Headley case and is taking that judge’s advice on how to do it right. It’s not like conditions have improved since Marc and Claire “volunteered to be abused while resting their laurels at their vacation resort”, a/k/a doing time in the Sea Org.

        • aquaclara

          Boy, this is long overdue. Since the Headley case, I have had little faith that this will make it through the system, but as we learn here and on WWP and the other blogs, we should never, ever give up.

          • TheRupture

            If, for instance, the FBI raided the LA Org and subpoenaed employees, not volunteers, there would soon be federal evidence for hundreds if not thousands of lawsuits. Quite a different scenario when Marc and Claire bravely stepped up to the law plates all on their lonesome.

            • aquaclara

              Oh, pleeeeeeeeeeeze make this be so.
              Yes, I am resorting to begging. Begging and prayers.
              “Hundreds, if not thousands of lawsuits.”

            • TheRupture

              Now LA org is composed only of volunteers (Sea Org) though since this latest evolution. One could still hope that some of these volunteers are missing their passports or fibbed to get their visa or perhaps cause a second look by officials if admitted as indigents without proper identification in county hospital emergency rooms. The incidence of accidents and emergenices in PAC must be another straight up and vertical statistic, so this is a real possibility.

    • grundoon

      The new Sea Org garrison came from Flag. Flag has emptied out since most of the OOTs were allowed to go home with the rollout of GAT II, it’s been reported, and the only people doing Super Power etc are those who prepaid years ago. Flag’s local public has been flensed to the bone.

      Flag thinks there is still some meat on the bones of the LA public. I’m guessing that this is their attempt to restart the pipeline to Flag from the planet’s largest concentration of Scientologists.

      I bet David Miscavige has given a deadline for Flag’s storm troopers to prove their skill at stripping a carcass. If they succeed, they’ll next be sent onward to the 2nd largest area, leaving a cleanup crew to pick the bones in LA. If they fail, they’ll be offloaded and all of the money losing orgs in WUS will be shut down. Miscavige considers the mission holders massacre was a flawed but successful action… now we’ll see what he does differently the second time around, and what he’s learned from past mistakes.

    • grundoon

      Many legal risks are heightened by replacing civilians with Sea Org. It undermines the defense that the Sea Org is an innocuous fraternal order like the Melchizedek Priesthood or the Elks Club. It highlights the web of control and money leading uplines to Miscavige. And the Sea Org is a cesspit of liability with Cadet Org child abuse, underage billion year contracts, kidnapping, immigration fraud, passport theft, illicit recording, RPF, etc.

      An emergency replacement of contract staff with Sea Org could perhaps make sense to dodge one kind of threat, however. Complaints to state labor and tax authorities could lead to a declaration that the contract staff actually functions as employees, not independent contractors. Then the employer becomes liable for social security and other taxes, unemployment insurance, minimum wages, meal breaks, sick leave, and many other requirements. As religious corporations the orgs might be exempt from some but probably not all of these. The religious cloaking gives much better protection to the Sea Org because their “volunteers” suffer for religious penance and not for the money.

    • J. Swift

      Both Sea Org and Staff are classed by the Church as religious orders, i.e. unincorporated membership associations. However, Sea Org signs a one billion year contract and does not, as Karen pointed, go home at night as does Staff.

      To be sure, Miscavige wants to handle external influences at PAC.

      However, Miscavige can now have 230 SO in Uniform K (civilian clothes) looking busy in course rooms and on LRH Way to create the impression that PAC is bustling. In other words, using surplus Sea Org members to play the role of Scientology publics is much cheaper than hiring extras.

      If nothing else, Miscavige now has 230 extra seat-fillers and human applause machines at PAC for his IAS event next week at LRH Way.

      As an added bonus, Miscavige doesn’t have to fly all the way to Flag to beat these 230 new SO at PAC.

  • Gerard Plourde

    This appears to be another document that DM directed the attorneys to file. He can’t seem to understand that an arbitrator (like a judge) has to be a person who is independent of the parties.

  • PoisonIvyHerself

    “The audacity is pure Scientology. But why should they ever stop with this kind of behavior? They get away with this kind of thing again and again in a system of justice that is forever blind, and not in a good way.”

    You said it, Tony. I could not agree more.

    • joan nieman

      A system of justice that is forever blind.
      That certainly is true.

  • Just Dee

    I am not a lawyer but this statement pretty much says that scientologists can never sue the church. I am curious if they are speaking of criminal as well as civil complaints. #4 & 4 a. reads like it, to me. This is really broad and vague.

    • Eileen

      Can never sue the church, can not sue another scientologist. Rape, pedophiles, abuse, all handled “internally”. The goal is to replace external justice systems.

    • Gerard Plourde

      You’ve pointed out the essential dilemma. While it is possible for contracting parties in a private (read non-governmental) agreement to contract away constitutionally protected rights, there are limits. The sheer breadth of the rights given up may lead the judge to reject it as against public policy since it strives to put the cult thoroughly beyond the reach of the law.

  • Todd Tomorrow

    Have the, Garcia’s been declared SP’s? I’m sue they have,just thought i’d check if anybody know for sure.

    • April

      I’d be astonished if they haven’t already.

  • madame duran

    “The position protects the Church, its tenants and membership”

    Ummm…doesn’t the above quote indicate the IJC’s prevailing bias during “arbitration”? If Ellis’s goal is to protect the Scientology church, then ANYTHING that threatens it (like a refund request that would effectively deprive the church of a large sum of money) would automatically earn a negative judgment. How is that fair? In regular courts, people sue the state government all the time with varying results (some wins, some losses). The judge’s sole role is to make a judgment based on evidence and his/her interpretation of case law, not to “protect” one side’s interests. Even in the instance when an unfair/unfavourable ruling is given, an appeal process is made available. No such arrangement exists within the Scientology organization (as seen in sections 4 a & 4 b in Ellis’s declaration where all alternative avenues outside Scientology are forbidden). By the time a Comm Ev is convened, the deck is stacked against the complainant and then punishments are doled out. The “church” management is NEVER found in the wrong. It’s absurd!

    • Robert Eckert

      He probably means “tenets” (beliefs, creeds) rather than “tenants” (renters, lessees). Even in legal filings the tendency to make small stupid errors is pervasive.

      • madame duran

        Oy vey. The misspelling is mine, not the original text’s where the quote came from. Sorry.

        • Robert Eckert

          Ah, sorry. I just took it for granted that the big Chief did that.

          • Anonymous

            Always a reasonable assumption when Scientology is concerned. Just try to find someone with a high school degree in senior management – I dare you. (Joke.)

  • I will wager dollars to donuts that Mike Ellis not only did not write either that declaration or the letter but that he is utterly incapable of doing so. This was a kid raised in the S.O. and “educated” as far as I know at the Happy Valley ranch. His father is McHenry Ellis, one of the Gold musicians and a superb sax player and I think his mother Julia worked in Costumes in the Gold Cine org. Somehow Mike was dumb enough to get saddled with the IJC post but in my few dealings with him he is a lightweight and, like Karen Pouw, merely a figurehead for the lawyers or worse (thinking of you, Dave) who write these things.

    • PoisonIvyHerself

      Maybe Miscavige is settling him up to through him under the bus?

      • Captain Howdy

        Nice seeing you. I was beginning to worry.

      • Anonymous

        ABSOLUTELY.

        There is ALWAYS a cutout, who ultimately becomes the fall – person.

        That is the nature of hierarchically arranged, fraud-based conspiracies, over the centuries.

        Scientology is among the more recent.

        And it is all a lot of Bolivar Based BS.

        Heh.

      • That was my first thought too

  • valshifter

    “One of the purposes of the enrollment agreement is to ensure that all scientologist are aware of the applicable justice system” , so that applies only when you were a scientologist, so what if you left the bubble and you are no longer a scientologist? that means the law does not apply to them because you left, and you wasn’t supposed to leave ever? am confuse how does the law protects scientology if you quit? it sounds more like a business contract but they do not state it that way. and because you broke the contract you loose. there is nothing religious about scientology.

  • chukicita

    If they quit and scn law doesn’t apply to them then why is scn holding them to their law?

    • TheRupture

      Because they are superior to one and all? Just a wild guess.

  • AutOmatic

    I really wanted the scariest Halloween costume ever this year…so I’m dressing up as a Sea Org member, complete with WTH pamphlets.

    (it was either that or a David Miscavage mask…but I think that would be too scary, even for me)

    • Todd Tomorrow

      It might get tiring walking on your knees being. Davey. I’d go w/ a scarey SO member.

  • MyFavoriteSP
  • Sid

    Ellis in court would be something to see.

    Attny. “In your 5,000 Committees of Evidence how many refunds were given?”

    Ellis. “We gave out 6 refunds during that time.”

    Attny. “Were these refunds a result of the Committees of Evidence?”

    Ellis. “Well, no, we just felt in these cases it was expedient to do so.”

    Attny. “So how many refunds were given out as a result of these Committees of Evidence?”

    Ellis. “I don’t remember. I’d have to check my records.”

    Attny. “So we should supeona your records? Or can you give us a ball park figure on how many refunds were given as a result of these Committees of Evidence?”

    Ellis. “I don’t recall any that were actually given out as a result of a CommEv, but we’ve given out plenty of refunds.”

    etc,,,

    • Eclipse-girl

      That is way to straight forward.

      If Ellis were prepared the way Davey would want him to be prepared, he would need to word clear every question before he could answer it

      • Sid

        Good point.

    • chuckbeattyexseaorg75to03

      This point needs to somehow be made simply in court.

      Scientology’s justice application is by whim, from on high.

      How to present this to a judge and/or jury, simply, is the bottom line.

      I lived the sytem, I was in Senior HCO Int for a couple years, 1984-1986, and in my years in the Sea Org, I saw 4 IJCs, Hamish Hamilton, Jurgen Brock, Paul Leclair, Sue Porter come and go. I sat in the office in the complex when Senior HCO Int was there in the complex before we moved over to the HGB, 1985-1986, the move was later in 1988, I sat like 20 feet next to Paul and did some Boards of Review and Review Comm Evs for some of the tricker cycles under Paul. I saw Paul grapple with Int Base seniors (mainly Marc Yager and sometimes a WDC member or AVC Int would overrule Paul’s submission, since IJC is NOT the final arbiter, the justice submissions went up to Int in the years I firsthand witnessed office submission routings and Paul’s wife Andrea and I were twins on some courses and also at daily “product conferences” and just sitting in the office listening to Paul discuss cycles with our office superiors I picked up the trickier daily “SP” cycles going on that Paul dealt with. He wished to allow justice bodies be called which were NOT allowed to be held due to Int level counter orders to NOT allow justice resolution bodies be called. The justice system was ordered NOT to be allowed, Paul heard countless overruling orders NOT to allow justice bodies be formed to resolve people’s requests. That is why thousands of requests languished unresponded to for years!

      At the IJC level, there is activity, it’s all governed by a system that has NEVER been analyzed to show how Catch 22 the system is. The new religion academics don’t have any of them the time nor interest nor courage to take on comparatively the Scientology “justice” system, even with dozens of ex Senior HCO Int and cont staff members in the public who will talk to such researchers.

      This letter is proof of how simple bad Catch 22 the Scientology justice system is.

      To get a refund per this latest letter, which your dialogue shows the actual history, Scientology inconsistently has implemented their system.

      This letter is the latest quick Catch 22 strict application of their rules.

      It shows reason enough for the Garcia’s suits, this letter!

    • grundoon

      Is the IJC even on refund lines? I bet he doesn’t have authority to order a refund, the decision is made in another department. His only involvement might be for the SP declare for persons who request refunds.

  • Douglas D. Douglas

    Stop the presses!

    Mike Ellis is OUT-EXCHANGE!

    Did you see the footnote in his declaration? “A courtesy copy of this book [Introduction to Scientology Ethics] has been provided to the court in chambers with a copy to opposing counsel.”

    He gave them a copy and did not require quid pro quo?

    TO THE HOLE!

    • Lurkness

      I’m sure they think it is effective dissemination too. The stat will be claimed despite the scriptural violation by the ecclesiastical justice poobah.

    • Sid

      Based on the 2 written statements above it seems that Mike Ellis is digging his own hole.

    • Ruby

      He probably got them out of someone’s garage who was storing several extra boxes of the basic books packages…you know, the ones that were illegally debited off their account and sent to them.

      • NOLAGirl

        Probably counted it as a dissemination stat too.

        • Ruby

          haha! No doubt!

  • Ruby

    It’s all very good and fine that Mike Ellis says this is how we do it, but the Judge basically asked the question “where’s the beef?”. They have to SHOW this is what they do…like with evidence of it having been done. Comm Evs require detailed notes to be taken throughout the proceedings. So where are they on the ones they did for financial arbitration?

    • TheRupture

      All it would take is for Mr. Babbitt to submit a half dozen actual Comm Ev’s to show the judge how Scientology’s Orwellian justice system “works”, even though this particular control machine is out of order and has been for years. That should end this particular argument feeder line.

  • Newiga

    “But the IJC himself is rarely heard from.” Hahahaa! So rarely in fact that one can’t help but to say: So, the elusive “only terminal”, the IJC is a person and not just ink behind a golden rod…

  • ze moo

    Five THOUSAND Justice ‘actions’ in 12 years?? At least one them consists of ‘nah-nah, you can’t get a form because you asked for a form’, some ‘justice’. Some very good jokes and observations from the bunkeroos today. The Garcia’s suit is about fraud, and the ‘donations’ used to pay into that fraud. Letting the clams determine what is and isn’t fraud is just too stupid to consider. I don’t see how any judge could allow that.

    Karen DLC makes a good point about external influences {third party stuff in $cieno lingo}. So the dwarfenführer doesn’t trust any non-Sea Arghhh staff anymore? A new level of paranoia has been reached, but one that will be exceeded in the future. Once you start down the road of total control, there is never enough control.

    The current management structure of Staff is now going to be laid off too. Only the SO command structure is needed. This move, and the changes to the management structure of ABLE and NarCONon point to large layoffs of clam management. Is it a ‘loyalty purge’ or a poorly disguised ‘realignment’ to fix dwindling income?

    Ever notice that you can’t talk about $cieno stuff without a lot of ‘air quotes’? Reality is just so twisted in the clampire.

    • pluvo

      Yep, sometimes I have so many ‘air quotes’, that I have to rethink my sentences. I’m relieved that I’m not the only one with this ‘air quote syndrome’.

      • Once_Born

        I have it bad – but just can’t bring myself to write things like ‘Church of Scientology’ without them.

        • pluvo

          I just wrote a comment were I had to force myself to leave it off.

          (The ‘justice’ system of the Church of Scientology with their ‘Committee of Evidence’ is a farce.)
          I actually want it to write like this: ‘ ‘Church’ of Scientology’ ; but it would be more air quotes than words.

  • California

    I am wondering whether one of the “external influences” that dm is trying to stop the workers, including SO at this point, from knowing is the probable imminent demise of narconon substance abuse rehab programs and narconon drug education programs. (Boy, it feels good to type that!) Thus, the re-organization of the “social betterment structure” and the even greater isolation of the low-paid workers, no matter how dedicated they are.

    Once the SAMSHA laws, rules, & regs began kicking in a few years ago, the feds and the states now had tools to control and shut down dangerous substance abuse programs, although everything takes time and documentation. Coupled with the insurance companies catching on about the fraud, the law-suits (tip of the hat to Ryan Hamilton and others), the media attention (this blog and others plus traditional print media coverage) and outraged family members and former narconon people speaking out, the word is out. narconon rehab is almost finished.

    And the educational establishment took care of narconon drug education with the Feb. 2005 finding by the California Department of Education, recommending against its use in California public and charter schools. That finding continues to serve us well in stopping narconon substance abuse in schools whenever it pops up.

    narconon is the most vulnerable program in scn’s arsenal and one that lrh/dm counted on for recruitment and infiltration purposes. And it has flunked miserably, beginning with the threats to teachers and others who began to question narconon drug education in the SFUSD, and other school districts in California back in the Fall of 2002, just about 12 years ago to this day. The dumb threats set off more questions and it all began.

    • MaxSpaceman

      read SAMHSA – Substance Abuse Mental Health Services Administration http://www.samhsa.gov

    • Sid

      It would be nice to see a lot more action from the insurance companies. If anyone can find the fraud in Narconon they can.

      • California

        It is happening. Items will be posted in a timely manner as they enter the public arena.

        • Sid

          Excellent.

    • ze moo

      Just because CO$ says they are going to ‘reorganize’ the delivery and non-delivery ‘social betterment’ programs doesn’t mean that they really will do so. NarCONon used to bring in 8-10 million per year and provide 100-200k incomes to the franchisees and top staff. The ‘referral’ websites and ‘counselors’ made good money too. I can’t see DM walking away from that income stream while there is any money coming in.

      While the Califorinia and Arizona and Michigan Narcs are being sued, what other Narc locations have not been sued? If they actually convert to a ‘half-way house’ business, how will they get paid? Half way houses usually get money from state and federal programs. I don’t think NarCONon can actually qualify for such monies, but then the Salvation Army (a real religious entity) operates such places with populations well over 16 beds and seems to survive fairly well.

      Don’t bury the vampire yet, the stake isn’t totally through the heart, yet. But then Hambo keeps pounding the stake a little bit with every new suit.

      • April

        The problem will be for the CO$ that states pay very little for half-way houses’ services. CO$ would have to do it on economy of large scale in order to make any money, and I personally don’t think that they have enough slave labor sea ogres with which to do it. They won’t make anywhere near the amount of money they make with NarCONon.

        • California

          True.

      • TheRupture

        Perhaps not a profit matter but a legal cover one. This is another preemptive strike, removing future lawsuit bombshells targets. My best guess is his social “programs” will now consist of gravy train profits from the existing Distribution Center and ASI. This would consist of merely chopping down a few more forests to dump books, booklets, DVD’s, CD’s, videos and other media to unsuspecting social betterment “allies”. Miscavige has no buffer, no waiting for the golden profits to arrive at his personal disposal with Author Services as far as I recall.

        I predict the program will include bundling these environmentally caustic materials with air time on his new toy, KCET studios, giving legitimate non profits access to media promotion. This will possibly be “donated” gratis, giving him charity/non profit tax writeoff benefits to keep the IRS inurement dogs at bay and more important of all, give his IAS and real estate Mad Dogs of Fundraising a legit sales pitch to his whale pool. That’s the only liquid asset feeder line he has left to tend.

  • Having been an ethics officer with probably more “training” than Ellis, I can tell you his letter is typical of the arrogant bulshit artist attitude that has ALWAYS been the case with anyone who rises to a high rank within the cult on “ethics” (I use the word reluctantly) lines. They basically assume they are the hooded-eyed, droopy-bearded “R6 god” pictured on $cientology books. Having also worked with some pretty high level lawyers, however, I can also tell you that letters like that one, if introduced into evidence, would blow the cult’s “defense” out of the water with any sane judge. One of these days the world will wake up to this fact: (a) the cult insanely CHARGES MONEY FOR “SPIRITUAL FREEDOM” UPFRONT; and (b) it very rarely gives the money back if it does not deliver. That’s called a business – actually it’s called a fraud – and $cientology is NOT and never has been a religion. I know of no other so-called religion on Earth that has a similar financial/spiritual arrangement.

    • Sid

      Nicely said. Maybe someone will sue and win because they still wear glasses.

    • April

      Scientology is both a business and a fraud cleverly cloaked as a religion.

    • romanesco

      That letter is so insane! It’s like if I paid my rent a year in advance and the place burned down after a month and I had to move, having the landlord tell me I can’t get my money back because I don’t live there any more!

  • Cymboli

    Here’s hoping the Garcias and Babbit read the bunker and as a result of that picture above, make a long distance call to South Africa. Getting their hands on that letter would be priceless for that lawsuit and all others.

    • Eclipse-girl

      I am sure that Tony O has Ted’s phone number or email addy.

  • Finally Free

    Priceless, “The internet is here, you can’t un-ring the bell”. I am sure it has been said many times but not with such spot on delivery. Love you Karen. I think you also go by Karen #1? I think it should be Karen #1 External Influence. I suppose you may have some competition, Tony Ortega for one, but you are certainly up there in the top echelon of truth speakers.

  • Panopea Abrupta

    $cientology “justice”: maculate deception and conceptual emasculation.

    $cientology: absolute certaintity in superstitious ignorance, armed with the violence of a dubiously acquired fortune.

    Modern physics: Schrödinger’s cat may be dead or alive, in the famous thought experiment
    $cientology physics: The judge’s dog may be dead or alive. This is a thoughtless experiment.

    And I found this set of unusually accurately titled volumes in a second hand bookstore.
    $cientology justice is discussed at length by Lord Hubris of Tilden.
    Annotated by Xenu, signed in “parishioners” blood by the author

    First Edition, extremely rare though not rare enough.
    Condition: Fair
    Contents: appalling
    Best offers, free lighter fluid included. Zippo extra.

    • Ardent

      Whoa! Is that a shoop? If so (and I guess it is?) that is a REALLY good job!

      • MaxSpaceman

        Foto forgery down to pixel perfection is not a problem, Ardie. Jes’ sayin.

  • TheRupture

    In reading the Ellis declaration, this one sentence could easily be problematic, “The International Justice Chief is responsible for the application of Scientology Justice Policies to Church staff and parishioners.”

    If Scientology’s lawyers are claiming that the Garcia’s must abide by theirr exact rules and procedures and only through Mr. Ellis as acting arbitrator, then are they opening a door to expose a major flaw here?

    Mr. Ellis has not applied Scientology Justice Policies for at least 10 years and most evidently in the last two years. What he has applied are orders from his seniors, but not justice policies.

    I would guestimate that at a minimum 50 former staff trained and posted as MAA’s could testify with evidence and Scientology’s own documents that Mr. Ellis is not applying these policies. I would also guestimate that over 1,000 former members of all stripes, public, Class V staff, Sea Org staff, could testify using their own personal experiences of being illegally and improperly declared, especially in the last two years, that Mr. Ellis never corrected these illegal and improper applications of Scientology Justice Policies. Not once.

    This particular day at Mike Rinder’s blog gives testimonials and pictures of this fact, the very evidence of such things as declare letters, or the majority not receiving any declare, correct or not, and refusal to send one when officially requested. There are so many policy violations that prove Mr. Ellis is not qualified to adjudicate or preside over any matters involving scientology of any nature that it would not be difficult to argue, IMHO.

    If the highest justice position in all of Scientology internationally has proven to not be able to enforce their own justice policies, then no one can.

    http://www.mikerindersblog.org/scientology-disconnection-where-are-the-declare-orders/

    • Captain Howdy

      Bottom line is that you cannot have an arbitration unless the the arbitrator is an independent third party entity and there is no such thing as religious law in the United States of America.

      • TheRupture

        Of course, but then, we are speaking of Scientology and their law is always attack with unlimited billable hours running on the meter and a billion years for a time limit.

  • Eclipse-girl
  • chuckbeattyexseaorg75to03

    Scientology does NOT deserve this attention, but they are such a problem to this world, and Hubbard’s mentally ill mind caused this Scientology caused problem, I will quote Hubbard’s own basic rules that overrule the Mike Ellis letter. Mike should go to cramming, but leaders wished Mike present that letter’s argument, so the leaders over Mike all need correcting too, but that won’t happen, this discussion goes into what Mike Rinder discussed on his blog some months or a year or so ago on this exact point.

    Anyways, two references, even in the Ethics Book, the “leave the door open a crack” is the overriding Hubbard policy. And there’s “Seniority of Orders” policy making Hubbard’s policy superior to Hubbard’s later despatch orders where Hubbard said NOT to leave the door open, Hubbard privately reversed this “leave the door open a crack” policy, but that was a private order, sort of like a secret Executive Order level order that superceded the policy issued to the movement, and unbeknownst to the movement. No need to even issue that private in house top ranks order to the movement, but it justifies Miscavige’s and the lawyer’s Catch 22 answer that Mike Ellis wrote in his letter.

    That’s the fact. Were judges, were academics to have a total grip on all that Hubbard wrote.

    In fact, behind the scenes Hubbard comment or phase in one of Hubbard’s final years’ despatches (advices) which taken literally, overruling the higher principles of Hubbard’s earlier policy setup and writings, that are the movement’s illogical and against their rules behavior.

    I wrote (revised) the 1984 “Refund and Repayment Routing Form”, to included steps for the Chaplain, per 1984 orders (2 advices) from Hubbard. I was then the “Senior Routing Forms In Charge” in Senior HCO Int, same sub unit as Int Justice Chief.

    The Hubbard “Routing Forms” policy say allow correspondence, and directly state MAIL the claimant their routing form!

    So the routing form could be obtained by mail, and Hubbard specifically even allows for this, I know, I read the allowed options for doing the Refund Repayment Routing Form. It could all be done by correspondence, and it would be done today, legally, using the UN Declaration of Human Rights right about changing one’s religion, were the applicant to do so respectfully.

    But again, as has been brought up by Sid in this blog thread, Scientology has already behaved in the past inconsistenly, which truly the Garcias in good faith were simply following past behavior that Scientology priorly allowed!

    Now, if going forward someone wants to thread the needle some more with Scientology, not that they deserve it, they don’t deserve anyone playing ball with Scientology, since Scientology has consistently NOT played by their rules over the decades, even with them NOT playing ball by their rules, one could put in the detailed mental work and research to PLAY by their rules, deeply, and lay out finally in summary that Scientology MUST allow a refund of unreceived services.

    It can be done, and can become a public issue, and might involve getting someone wishing like a scholarship from some academic body to study the Scientology “refund and repayment” justice system history, and lay it all out, summarize it, for future court cases, for everyone’s in the public’s benefit, really.

    • Anonymous

      Helluvahoax! over at ESMB has determined his own “HUBBARD LAW OF COMMOTION: For each and every policy or piece of tech, there is an equal and opposite policy and piece of tech.”

      And Arnie Lerma brilliantly pointed out how much Hubbard’s “work” relies on “Confusion Technique” : http://www.lermanet.com/scientology/confusion-technique2.htm.

      Thus, confusion of issues (and of course people) in Scientology is CENTRAL to keeping the fraud going.

      Confusion is a Scientology ecclesiastical imperative, without which the whole enterprise collapses into a Bernie Madoff / Enron like catastrophe.

      • TheRupture

        Close. It’s Miscavige’s Law of Loco Motion. For each and every policy or piece of tech, there are two equal and opposite policies and pieces of tech. The reason? It’s the Scientology Triangle: You are either Customer, Slave, or SP and each has their own policy.

        Confusion is currently peaking. Miscavige has performed the greatest magic trick of all. Now a scientologist can be all 3 at the same time and it appears to be driving them loco. I actually have to admire that for it’s pure evil genius. Hubbard would be so jelly.

      • chuckbeattyexseaorg75to03

        Scientology succeeds in confounding judges and juries by keeping academics and experts out of the court room.

        To overcome that status quo of letting this crank operation “win” in court, takes credible writing that is taken as usable and definitive expert testimony in courts.

        I’m thinking of how to achieve that by having academics come up to speed sometime in Scientology’s history.

        That hasn’t happened yet.

        • Stacy

          Another option is to educate people on jury nullification so if they ever get called for jury duty, they understand they have the right to actually question the law itself, in order to accurately reflect the mood/nature of the community. Or try to get all CoS cases tried in Indiana and Maryland where jurors still get instructed on jury nullification.

        • Anonymous

          You might make a pretty good living as an independent expert witness…if you wanted to take the Fair Game heat that went along with that role.

          • Espiando

            Chuck’s been Fair Gamed for a long time. I think he even has a “whois” smear site about him. I don’t think they can do much more to him than they’ve already tried.

            • Anonymous

              Then he might as well get paid for the trouble.

          • chuckbeattyexseaorg75to03

            Yea, I wouldn’t want that define my life, rather I’d like to see the people like academics who are paid to research and write on topics, do their jobs instead!

            Society’s experts I always presumed were pro writers/authors/academics who have publishers and institutions behind them and their research! I’ve resigned myself as just an informed, somewhat, ex member, and due to my jobs as course sup, routing forms project, computer room access to Hubbard’s writings, knowledge of people in Sea Org history due to my above jobs, I have lots of interest popularizing the actual firsthand people who lived firsthand Scientology’s history to tell it like they lived it!

  • I hope counsel in the Garcia case will counter with the earlier Ellis letter. As for his declaration, it didn’t even begin to answer the judge’s question. Do they shoot themselves in the foot on purpose? Happy Saturday, everyone!

    • Anonymous

      “Do they shoot themselves in the foot on purpose?”

      This is perhaps the single most curious question asked by virtually all Scientology watchers.

      Just exactly what is the point in all of all this seemingly intentional nonsense?

      My estimation is there that there is no point. Like many long term frauds, keeping the fraud going becomes senior to anything else, including appearances, reason or a definable end-game.

      The fraud will continue until it is deliberately stopped by others.

      • Michael Leonard Tilse

        Civil Court procedures only work when the opponents are civil. That is, they play by the rules of the civilization. If one loses, they pay because they play by the rules.

        There are people who do not play by the rules of the civilization. Civil Court does not work with them. If they lose in civil court, they don’t pay. They skip out. They bribe the judges or don’t appear when asked. And they keep doing the same stuff again and again.

        Thus Criminal Court. Criminal Court is for those who don’t play by the rules. If you lose in Criminal court, you pay or you go to jail. You lose your rights. You get to live with other people who also don’t play by the rules.

        The judgements of Criminal Court are enforced by Law Enforcement Officers, people with guns. They are the ones who deliberately stop people from breaking the rules. When you have people who break the rules and hurt people and won’t stop breaking the rules and hurting people, the only thing that stops them is ultimately LEO with guns.

        Once I became aware of the lengths to which Scientology leaders and agents go to prevent Civil Court judgements and Criminal Trials, I realized that the only way the evil of Scientology would ultimately be stopped and put out of business is by Law Enforcement.

        The world-view of Hubbard and thus Scientology and Scientologists is fundamentally that they are engaged in the important activity of saving the universe and so are above and free to violate the rules of the civilization. They don’t play by any rules the society sees as valid or sane.

        The real danger is that Scientology has come very close to controlling the exercise of the powers of Law Enforcement. When it can shut down FBI investigations and functionally control the Law Enforcement in a city or state, it becomes above the law. Then the criminal controls the only organization that could stop it.

        What comes after that?

        • Anonymous

          Unfortunately, when civil and criminal justice systems break down, barbarity often times enters into the scene. That has been what has played out “on this planet” since the dawn of time…as demonstrated via calamitous wars, crusades, etc.

          Scientology is nowhere near as bad as the worst extremist organizations and it will succumb (IMHO) eventually to the existing civil and criminal justice systems in the US and elsewhere.

          The tide is definitely turning against the atrocities that Scientology leadership have been perpetrating for more than 60 years. The emptiness of the Orgs is the evidence of the shift in the awareness of the general public about the church.

          Eventually that awareness shift will be demonstrated via a change in the political climate, which will empower the appropriate authorities to take offensive action against Scientology leadership. That day is coming.

          • Once_Born

            When people express contempt for the law, because it does not seem to be able to deal with the likes of the CofS, I always think of this scene from “A Man For All Seasons”

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d9rjGTOA2NA

            • Anonymous

              Many folks know and recognize the Magna Carta as one of the foundational documents of what ultimately became western liberal culture, evolving into self-governing democracies and similar forms of government.

              What is often forgotten is that King John was forced to sign that document at the point of several rather sharp knives / swords.

              Such has been the way of mankind for quite some time.

            • TheRupture

              And today we have the Squirrel Busters.

            • Anonymous

              No kidding…sort of a low rent outfit, no?

            • Peter

              Instant deja vu. As soon as I saw the link, I rememered that passionate speech. One of my all time great film choices. Thanks, OB! Spot on!

    • I have observed this personally. It’s more like “I’ll follow my plan/orders, and if it doesn’t work it’s not my fault!”

      At a meeting where OSA tried to have the National Council for Civil Liberties (UK group protecting, well, liberty) the OSA rep was given two minutes to speak. He then started to read out a long letter. Very long. After two minutes he was stopped and told to wrap it up. He kept reading where he had gotten to, and then he was stopped. While the motion failing was perhaps inevitable (*cough*), the complete absence of thinking on his feet and adjusting his plan to suit reality was the real eye opener.

      So, not so much a case of shooting themselves in the feet on purpose and more a case of complete disregard for engaging. (Certainly for engaging with the outside world, I have no idea what it’s like inside – but I doubt that they do reasoned arguments 😉 )

  • Anonymous

    Great post Tony.

    With a little effort, any plaintiff attorney could dig up dozens of contradictory historical written responses from various church officials on how ex-Scientologist’s requests for a repayment were handled. There would be no
    commonality for that “handling” except a thread of expediency in the reasoning for the denial of the requests. There certainly is virtually no basis for the utterly false church assertion that repayment requests have
    historically been arbitrated via Comm Ev. That is absurd on it’s face.

    As mentioned in a post a while ago, RTC is the owner of the trademarks and copyrights for all Scientology “policy” and “tech.” That means that RTC can apply those trademarks and copyrights to ANYTHING it chooses, including retroactive revisions of the written and spoken basis for Scientology “tech” and “policy,” which are “sourced” from the now deceased L. Ron Hubbard.

    David Miscavige is the COB of RTC and thus the final arbiter of all Scientology policy and tech.

    David Miscavige is also the senior Captain of the Sea Org. Per definition #7 in the Scientology Admin Dictionary the Sea Org is defined as: “a corporate activity headed by a Board of Directors which owns and controls the ships, orgs and activities of the corporation.” One could deduce from this definition that Miscavige is the final arbiter of all management issues in Scientology (and Miscavige has consistently made clear that he is in fact the final arbiter of such issues.)

    Thus David Miscavige is the defacto managing agent of Scientology and ultimately can order anyone to do anything and call that ordered thing “Scientology” policy. Therefore David Miscavige is the person where
    both policy and management combine into a single decision making authority which is senior to any policy or any person in Scientology. (U. S. v. American Bell Tel. Co. (C. C.) 29 Fed. 33 (et al.)

    Therefore the IJC is junior to both Scientology policy and Sea Org management and therefore incapable of independently administering a fair outcome as he / she can be overridden at any time by Sea Org Captain David Miscavige.

    Therefore IJC is a sub rosa agent for David Miscavige. And therefore David Miscavige needs to be compelled to testify to clarify matters as no other person has the authority in all of Scientology to do so.

    Quod erat demonstrandum.

    Aside from all of the above, regardless of how an individual court might rule on these types of issues, Scientology’s fallback positon is going to be that the court cannot interfere with “internal ecclesiastical matters.” Thus one must be cautious about wasting time / energy on such and instead concentrate on the fraud aspects, as Babbitt apparently is doing.

    EDIT to add: Don’t make me come down there and argue this case.

    • aquaclara

      From your keyboard to Ted Babbitt’s ears, pronto.
      Excellent, excellent commentary on Tony’s blockbuster post this morning.

      • Anonymous

        Babbitt hardly needs my advice, but thanks. Some of this stuff seems so obvious, but in the deliberate confusion created in a courtroom by opposition attorneys, nothing is obvious.

        One thing remains certain however, Scientology will make multiple intentionally specious arguments independent of principle or any desire to be a good will participant in a larger community. The church (specifically Miscavige) simply wants to get it’s own way.

        • TheRupture

          Hit many a bullseye on this one. Excellent framework. Perhaps the most glaring evidence of both a) who is the only one in charge of everything as well as b) the rules are whatever the only one in charge says it is, might be the whole issue of issues itself.

          When the “Scientology Policy Directives – Background” issue came out 26 Jan 1997, it clearly laid out the purpose as well as scientology management hierarchy. It just as clearly laid out the food chain of command. Yet Miscavige’s SPD’s since 1982 have covered everything from soup to nuts, not just corporate legal matters and every member as well as staff have since obeyed him, his Directives, as priority and chief bottle washer.

          “LRH personally advised and directed Church management to create ‘Scientology Policy Directives’ as an issue type. Scientology organizations are corporations and have certain legal obligations.” “LRH insisted that the Church establish a distinct issue type for policy for such matters.”

          “Scientology Policy Directives are used to set forth internal administrative or Church policy. They are not senior to HCO PLs or HCOBs, or any other LRH issue type, and may not cancel any LRH issue. Indeed, SPDs do not even cover the same subjects as the LRH issues.”

          http://www.wiseoldgoat.com/papers-scientology/popup-windows/scn_spd_background.html

          • Anonymous

            Interesting.

            Fundamentally, as the holder of the copyrights and trademarks of Scientology, RTC is the senior entity in all policy or tech matters…and RTC (read Miscavige) can “authorize” any changes it so orders. Thus everything else is a charade, whether it be “new” issues that came out after Hubbard’s death or modern revisions to old issues “to make them more closely align to Hubbard’s original intentions.” Heh.

            Scientology is currently operating on the fraudulent basis the “The Basics” as revised and reissued by Miscavige nearly 30 years after the death of Hubbard, are somehow “closer to the original intentions” of the author, versus the books that were published as Hubbard actually wrote and issued when he was still alive.

            At what point does the whole thing just become too bizarre to be real?

            There just has to be a punchline in there somewhere.

            • TheRupture

              Hard to pin down one point, but somewhere between 1952 and 2014 or if this is multiple choice, all of the above. All I know is that the hard fast rule is if you query it, you’re IT, the new SP on the Block.

            • Anonymous

              Agreed.

              One of the apparently unintended ironies of the above clip is that after the guy is slapped by Miscavige, he does a little FU dance, then WALKS OUT THE DOOR FOR GOOD.

    • MaxSpaceman

      Your aim is true: can’t waste time on things ‘ecclesiastical’ in the US of A it is a waste of resources.

  • Juicer77

    The Co$ continues to dance around its pile of cash and snarl at anyone who comes near. In the meantime, here is an interesting article about all the groups fighting Ebola: http://www.cnn.com/2014/09/19/world/iyw-ebola-outbreak-how-to-help/index.html?iid=article_sidebar

  • BosonStark

    So what’s an SP clam to do when their only terminal is a bad apple?

    • Mark Foster

      Fortunately, the movies are good at the implant station and I hear it´s rather warm in the Van Allen belt…and then there are coffee grinders and hoi polloi and chariots and cherubs and other exciting phenomena…

  • nottrue

    OT…….http://youtu.be/T7rF8zWjPpY ….The Dublin Dump…..Trying to get a Homo Novis to talk to a Wog…not easy

  • Jgg2012

    Tony, the IJC is like the original Catch-22. If you fly, you’re insane. If your sane, you can’t get out of flying. Here, once you bring a complaint, you are ineligible to make a complaint, so you can’t bring a complaint.

  • Espiando

    Karen has made a terrific point, and I wish that she’d gone a little further, because there’s one more conclusion that can be made that blows another of Scientology’s greatest illusions out of the water. Let’s see if I can express my logic on my first cup of coffee:

    We know that pretty much every OTC meeting in the LA area has its minutes forwarded to Mike seconds after they’re published. We’ve seen Mike print the idiocy at least once per week, so much so that even he’s sick of the mindless repetition. So, therefore, at least one, probably many, OTs have succumbed to “external influences”. If it can happen to the mighty OTs with their super abilities, it surely can happen to mere staff. Hence the mass replacement at LA Org and ASHO by Sea Org.

    But here’s the rub: those OTs aren’t going to LA Org or ASHO for services. They’re going to AOLA, which is Sea Org staffed already. This means that if the contamination is present, one of its vectors is AOLA, which means Sea Org there are infected and are passing it “downstream” to the mere staff at ASHO and LA Org. This might be why the new “staff” at the lower orgs had to be imported from Flag: there’s no one in the Sea Org at the LA orgs that Davey can trust. Now you have the perfect conditions for an internal fight: the imported Sea Org from Flag versus the LA-based Sea Org already at AOLA. If it isn’t already happening (and I’m sure it is), there are going to be AOLA Sea Org blowing like crazy when they start getting sec-checked to death and sent to the RPF.

    But wait, there’s more. Aren’t they already getting sec-checked like crazy? If so, why hasn’t the all-seeing, all-powerful e-meter found the Sea Org who are CI to COB? Even the new Easy-Bake Mark VIII hasn’t found out who they are. Could it be that there’s a flaw with PTS/SP handling? Well, we already know there is, since Mike, Marty, Karen, Debbie Cook, etc., weren’t found out. But the clubbed seals don’t.

    So, Davey is demonstrating that two pillars of the Scientology “faith”, the Sea Org as incorruptible and the efficacy of PTS/SP handling, aren’t true. This kind of “third layer” of rationalizing what’s going on in LA is well-hidden, and the Church needs it to stay well-hidden in order to survive this. Questioning this questions the whole of Scientology as a philosophy.

    • Dr_Orpheus

      If being sec-checked like crazy isn’t working then obviously the sec-checkers themselves are SPs!!!!!!!! Or maybe there are still some mistakes that the Platinum Age of Tech will correct whenever it is released.

    • Robert Eckert

      They’re going to rename AOLA. From now on it will be called the Enemy Bastards Org of Los Angeles, or EBOLA.

    • J. Swift

      Espiando, great comments.

      However, your remarks lead me to ask where it all ends.

      Perhaps COB himself has been externally influenced by his wog lawyers who read the internet. If so, then COB needs Scientologist lawyers who do not read the internet and are not Sea Org. However, this would require COB to create a New Guardians Office and put some good ol’ fashioned GO lawyers in the New GO.

      But then these Scientology New GO lawyers would create a New Operation Snow White and COB would be indicted. Of course, he would not not indicted if he had Shelly as the Guardian running the New GO.

      Unfortunately, COB had Shelly locked up so she can’t be the New Guardian.

      Maybe this all ends with David Miscavige being the only member of CSI. Then, and only then, will there be no external influences anywhere except for the voices in his head.

      • Espiando

        It doesn’t end. What’s happened in LA is merely the Night Of The Long Knives, only with less gay pedophilia. The real purges are yet to come. And the real end comes with Dave, Lou, and a loaded pistol at Int Base.

        • J. Swift

          So you see a lesser Hemet version of the Fuehrer Bunker?

          • Espiando

            I’ve come to the conclusion that he’s not going unless it’s feet first. His paranoia is now completely out of control. Once he reaches the tipping point, he’s going to drop the body, and he’s going to take Lou with him.

            Yeah, it’s a low-rent Fuehrerbunker, but everything with Scientology is low-rent.

            • OTVIIIisGrrr8!

              HOW DARE YOU CALL SCIENTOLOGY LOW RENT!

    • OTVIIIisGrrr8!

      Flag SO who were offloaded and demoted to PAC are now nobodies and are now just like the rest of the SO nobodies at PAC.

      • Espiando

        “Unwashed SO” is a redundancy. You need to cut down on those sort of things.

        If you sell off Pac Base, give me a chance to buy it first before you put it on the market. I’ll fumigate the buildings to get rid of the Sea Org funk, then change the street name back to Berendo and put up a life-and-a-half size statue of Tory Christman.

  • BeeTee

    Great, informative video Karen. It makes me wonder whether this is the next move for scientology: it becomes 100% Sea Org, full-blown full-time cultists only, and the “public” category falls away. Any thoughts?

  • RBE

    RE: Declaration of Mike Ellis:

    Since 2002, over 5,00 of these proceedings have been conducted.

    Is this the number of SP declarations that have been announced in abstentia of the Scientologist? If this is the case then surely it would be an understatement…

  • Jgg2012

    The problem with the whole arbitration argument is that the Garcia claim is for fraud. A contract fraudulently induced is voidable; that means any arbitration, limited damages or waivers that are bargained for are not enforceable. If the Garcias had been told the “truth about Scientology” like a few bloggers have, they would not have given the Church any money.

    • Kim O’Brien

      oh for fuck sake ..grown adults need to be told that super powers are not possible ? Really ? they are mad cuz the $$ they gave was supposed to go to ” The Super Powers Building ” . Turns out …the $$ went to some other project or whatever ..so THAT is why they are upset . The Garcia’s are not the sharpest tools in the shed …let’s just be honest .

      • Anonymous

        “…super powers are not possible…”

        Wait…what?

        Sez who?

        EDIT to add: The Garcia’s are successful people, independent of Scientology. But that does not mean they cannot have been scammed by Scientology. It happens to people from all backgrounds.

        • Kim O’Brien

          EDIT : bullshit …keep telling yourself that . They are mad that money did not go to the ” super powers building” and they do not have super powers. Sit with that for a moment cuz that makes me laugh my ass off . They even won a ” maximus stupidis” award ..and were proud of it .We are not talking about ppl who bought something on the home shopping network that did not give them six pack abs in 2 weeks …these idiots believe in super powers a la LRH and i do not , in any way shape or form …feel bad for them . I keep my compassion tucked away where greedy scientologists can’t get their grubby fucking hands on it . I am rooting for the narconon plaintiffs ..not these two

          • Gerard Plourde

            I agree that as long-term whales they aren’t the most alluring plaintiffs but the fact is that their case may go a long way to show that all cult contracts are unenforceable and to potentially open the door to getting compensation for overregged ex-members and a measure of justice for ex-Sea Org members as well (if the cult can be shown to have exerted undue influence on the Garcias, then that fact can be used to build a case that such influence could have been used to entrap people into joining the Sea Org without disclosing the true nature of its working and living conditions).

            • Kim O’Brien

              they do not care about the living conditions of sea org ppl …they never did .They are doing this to get their $$ back , not to start a shelter for runaway cult members . Oh , and if memory serves me ..it’s scientology parents who GIVE their kids to the sea org … and those children are the only ppl i ever feel sorry for . All these ppl care about is
              ” compensation for overregged ex members” ..YUP …that pretty much sums it up . I say compensation for kids like Derek and the families of the victims of the quackary of Narconon .. two are no beacons of hope …it’s fuckwits like this who fund scientology and keep it going . They would still be giving $$ if they got awesome parking spaces all the time …and everyone here knows it

            • Gerard Plourde

              You misunderstood my comment. I mean that the precedent set by their case can be used by other attorneys to make a case for Sea Org members, much the way that Ray Jeffries is creating a template for attorneys to follow in suing Narconon.

          • Anonymous

            There are people in (or now out of) Scientology that pay more income taxes in one year than you will make in your entire life in total income. I might be one of them. Those folks can afford a loss or two, even from Scientology. The *cringe* aspect of it is not zero, but I do not worry about that too much as I enjoy the lifestyle I earned and made for myself and my family, entirely separate from (and in spite of) Scientology.

            The class of people mentioned above are not stupid anymore than many of the several hundred wealthy folks swindled by Bernie Madoff were stupid. They were conned, then they figured it out, and justice was served on Madoff, as it will be on the leadership of Scientology.

            As for super powers…that was and remains a con. However very few people got involved originally in Scientology to obtain super powers. Those who did (and those who remain in pursuit of such) have stayed well passed the “sell by” date on that particular aspect of the con. It happens.

            If it makes you feel better to “laugh your ass off” at them…so what. There are all sorts of pathologies that might explain such behavior.

            The bigger issue as I see it is rescuing the people who do not have the resources to recover from the intentional fraud and harm caused by Scientology leadership. Those folks deserve assistance, not derision.

            • Kim O’Brien

              you are a fucking douche bag who joined a cult …all the money in the world and all the ” i pay more in taxes than you will make in your entire life so gee i am better than you cuz you are just a wog who can’t find a good parking space bullshit ” …is never going to change that . You fell for it ..hook , line , and sinker . Idiot rich ppl …sold a scam that they already half believe anyway ( i am rich and you are not so i must be better than you )

              I could be living in a van down by the river and still be richer than you because i never sold my soul , abdicated my child , or ripped anyone off …so fuck you asshole

            • Anonymous

              You sound disturbed. I suggest you seek counseling.

              I hear Scientology has some folks that might be able to help you. In fact I recommend you check it out.

              Ask for Dave.

            • Kim O’Brien

              i was able to communicate my disgust for you , scientology and it’s whales pretty clearly ..don’t cha think ? All without some scio selling me the perks of good old LRH “fuck you tech”

              I do not feel sorry for the Garcia’s …get the fuck over it . As for disturbed …you joined a space cult . I am pretty much gonna drop the mic now

            • Anonymous

              He he he 😉

            • daytoncapri

              Geesh, can yo umake a post without foul language or an attack? How about something thoughtful and respectful towards someone with whom you don’t agree? Gentle honest exchanges? Smh.

            • Kim O’Brien

              oh my ( clutching pearls ) with all the stories of abuse in scientology ( cuz ..you were in ..you dabbled ..i can tell ) you chose to take issue with how i ( gasp agin ) use ” foul language” while describing it and the ppl who keep /kept the money flowing to it ?? Once again ..the only thing that ever kept , and still keeps , scientology and the abuses alive …are scientologists . Damn right i use foul language …i see no reason to be polite to scam artists and ppl who want to teach math to children by using fucking clay ..hand their children over to whack jobs , keep people away from their families , empty the bank accounts of the elderly and force abortions on girls who are not even old enough to vote . So yeah …fuck anyone who gets pissed that their $$ did not go to the ” Super Powers ” building like they thought it would and probably still clutch the cans and blame a guy who only comes up to my tits , for all of their troubles .

            • daytoncapri

              Ok, I read your post. Thank you for reading mine, but you really don’t know my story or how I think.

            • Kim O’Brien

              you dabbled …it’s not an attack …it’s just true .I can do this nifty thing and click on your avatar and read your comments . I do not feel sorry for whales like the Garcia’s and bendy twats like Brian Culkin who fork over ten of thousands of dollars on a cab ride. Pretty simple . Does not mean i do not have compassion , i just do not have it for them . I was raised with an expert in catholic guilt so trying to make me feel bad about my language is just not going to work . Trust me on this one

            • daytoncapri

              Thanks for taking the time to read my posts. That’s not much to go on. I did not attempt to conceal them. Kim, you simply do not know about me beyond that. Dabbled? Yeah, right.

            • Kim O’Brien

              my comments were about the Garcia’s ..you took offense to bad language . I could give a shit less if you dabbled or saluted the dog on the boat …i still don’t feel bad for them

            • daytoncapri

              You might not love Scientology, but Scientology loves you Kim. If a member makes a tentative defense of their weakened beliefs and past decisions, the cos can look to you to trash them and chase them back in. The wog world can be a foul mouthed and unwelcoming place, you are proof positive. Kim, I don’t care about your feelings of guilt, or your experiences with the Catholic church, or nonfeelings or nonexperirences. I am cocerned about clams breaking from their “prison of belief.” I fail to see how you are helping. Maybe you are, but I just don’t see it right now.

            • Kim O’Brien

              You might not love Scientology, but Scientology loves you Kim.

              wow ..just …wow. You would still try to peddle scientology to ppl …after all of the deaths, lawsuits, separated children, human rights violations and forced abortions. Shame, shame, shame on you . If you think you can clear the planet ..you better be able to handle a chick on a blog LOL . Why would the world be a scary place for a scientologist ? I mean jeez ..you have cause over mest or whatever ….you guys are Fearless and Resolute remember ?? LRH was a crazy person ..the tech does not work …if it did , we would not be having these conversations. The tech does not work …you have been scammed

      • Jgg2012

        Kim, you’re being a PTS. That’s out-ethics. What are your crimes? I’m gonna tell Jenna Elfman–wait til she writes up a KR on you.

      • Jgg2012
        • Kim O’Brien

          amen to that

  • Ardent

    Tony, did you send a copy of that letter to the Garcia’s lawyer?

  • nottrue

    It’s not even worth that……

    • Observer

      That cover seems to be a deliberate attempt to restimulate the R6 implant. Since no modern judge looks remotely like that, it just looks ridiculous.

      • Anonymous

        No kidding.

        That book cover makes me want to go down and immediately pre-pay all my taxes before I get audited.

        Or something.

        Isn’t the regional IRS office near an active volcano somewhere?

        • Observer

          Ron, you old scamp.

        • TheRupture

          The new version has golden columns, like the Roman Colosseum?

          No matter the cover, look how thick it has grown over the years. A sure sign, per Scientology Justice Policies, that an SP is running things.

          • April

            What is it with the CO$ and its fascination with columns!? Dickish Midgit won’t stand before a podium without copious numbers of columns behind him.

            • Missionary Kid

              I’ve collected Dickish Midget for the DM list. I’ll post it later.

            • Mark Foster

              ¨Oh, I wish I were an Oscar Meyer wiener, that is what I´d truly like to be…¨

    • ze moo

      Welcome to Santa Claus court. Your defense elf will now check you for candy canes. Bend over and say ‘ahhhh’.

    • chuckbeattyexseaorg75to03

      I hope ex Senior HCO Int staff will do their “reviews” of this book in particular.

      Introduction to Scientology Ethics reviews by existing members, put on Amazon likely will last for decades and longer after we die!

      I urge ex participant firsthand staff to WRITE, and put their views in the Scientology book reviews!

      So much history could be added, firsthand history, of people who lived these Scientology organizations and even the incidents that drove L. Ron Hubbard to write Scientology’s rules!

      People who lived the incidents for which Hubbard wrote the rules, PLEASE write your firsthand history, at least in the Amazon book reviews!

  • Observer

    I’ve gotta hand it to Ron, he certainly is inspiring. He inspired me to do another entry in The Truth About Ron series when I was in the middle of a bad case of Truth About Ron block!

    *refresh*

    • aegerprimo
    • Stephanie Loving

      I like this so much … Rons a PP. Such a kindergarten taunt. ;o) But Principled Pedagogue my ass. Great placement of lrh eyes above the ILC’s letter. I’m working on pdf-ing your Shoops and Marks and Dodo’s and all the talent at Tony’s bunker and then print on stickers and paper the SF Org one evening. No body guards that place. There’s a door open on Columbus that says ‘shipping’ and it’s always ajar and I peek inside and there is an old guy (looking bored to tears) sitting in a little booth. I’m guessing he’s awaiting a delivery? But I’ve peeked at him maybe 5 times … it’s never different. Just sitting there.
      SF Org is sad and nobody in the City wants it there. Seriously … ask any of the surrounding businesses or folks on the street. San Franciscans are embarrassed about it. Thanks Observer … such good stuff percolating out of your frontal lobe ;o)

  • Anonymous

    Slightly off topic, but not really: Bernie Madoff is apparently offering to be a sentencing hearing “reference” for the now convicted criminals that use to work for him at his fraudulent “investment firm.”

    I am not making this up.

    http://dealbreaker.com/2014/10/bernie-madoff-offers-letter-of-reference-to-former-employees/

    This would be like an ex-Scientologist putting into their CV all the years they spent studying and applying Scientology…as if somehow that would “help” them land a new / better job. WOW.

    • Observer

      Madoff would have been an ideal Scientologist.

  • Will Smith is playing a con man in a movie called Focus with the catchphrase
    “There’s two kinds of people in this world. There’s hammers. And there’s nails. You decide which one you want to be.”

    Hmmm.

    • Science Doc

      Goethe: Du mußt Amboß oder Hammer sein (“You must be Anvil or Hammer”)

      • Mark

        I bet Smith or the scriptwriters got it from the ‘Hammer Into Anvil’ episode of The Prisoner rather than Goethe.

        • Science Doc

          My favorite episode in fact.

          • Espiando

            My favorite episode is another perfect description of Scientology and their upcoming little fete at Saint Hell: Dance Of The Dead.

            • Science Doc

              That’s funny. Could also riff on Arrival, Many Happy Returns, A, B or C, Fall Out, Schizo Man, etc.

        • Robert Eckert

          Goethe got it from a previous incarnation of L. Ron Hubbard.

          • Mark

            Who was that—Cagliostro or the Comte de Saint-Germain?

            • Robert Eckert

              Goethe was actually very interested in Cagliostro, and tracked down his real family in Sicily, blowing the cover off his concocted origin story.

    • Anonymous

      IIRC correctly, Otto Roos came early on to the conclusion that in Scientology (paraphrasing) “you are either someone sent to the chain lockers, or someone sending others to the chain lockers.”

      Unfortunately many others figured this out too hence the dog-eat-dog mentality of the organization.

    • kemist

      He forgot one type : broken hammers.

      Like in : Dumb as a bag of broken hammers.

    • aegerprimo

      Hammers are tools. Just sayin’

    • DrGreatCham

      In the immortal words of a famous ex-Scientologist:

      “Hustlers of the world, there is one mark you cannot beat: the mark inside.”


      William S. Burroughs

  • Qbird

    Well, as a non- scientologist, I have never really thought about signing contracts, in order to go to church. No one I know has ever done such a thing… not in my world, my ‘wog’ bubble. So I google Scn. Inc. enrollment agreement. BIG EYE OPENER! Talk about ‘holy’ CRAP!

    http://exposescientology.com/scientologycontracts.html

    I think I will never be able to get, why scientologists put themselves through such shit, especially all this legal shit.

    Here’s a madman, Lurch… he will help you… we promise,
    now sign this…
    and this…
    and this…
    oh & this too! Fun, huh?! Don’t it make you pause?
    Of course not, KSW all the way people!
    Welcome to Ron’s bubble, he’s on your case!
    Now you’re trapped, but good. This is true.
    What is true is REALLY, LEGALLY, fucking true.

    Buy your bridge NOW! Up your status NOW!
    Get to Operating Thetan NOW! Learn what you aren’t!

    Have a nice day… see you in court.
    ML, Ron

    (LRH speak for “I got your ass now, thank you for listening.”)

    • aegerprimo

      In response to your statement…

      I think I will never be able to get, why scientologists put themselves through such shit, especially all this legal shit.

      Scientology is a CULT not a religion. No need to argue the fine line between cult and religion… we know members of a cult are fanatical and their beliefs are considered cray cray by others.

      ANYWAY, $cientology is dangerous because it DOES brainwash its members. As an ex-$cientologist, I did not fully understand this until I read Dr. Lalick’s info about abusive relationships and how the abused makes such abuse “right” in their own mind.

      http://www.csj.org/pub_csj/csjbookreview/csjbkrev101captive.htm

      Qbird, I know you know this. I am just putting this here for the lurkers.

      • Qbird

        Hey you know Aegerprimo, I remember you posting this long ago & I saved it…
        because… unlike so much of Scn. —> this information makes sense.
        I believe I understand and, Robert Vaughn Young’s writings corroborate this perfectly as well.
        Tks Doll.

      • Satansthetan

        thanks for this link, the book looks fascinating.
        Available on eBay in case anyone else interested, I just ordered a copy for $4

      • Qbird

        Aeger, real quick, just wanted to tell you, my own father was an abusive person (verbally especially and also physically – to my Mom more than to us kids, truth be told). My parents divorced when I was 13; he left forever and I knew relief real & true.
        And so, I am sensitive to this because of my experience. I believe it was you that posted a section of this book regards conditions that exist in an abusive relationship… a check list.
        it was at that point I, a never-LRH processed-person, did / could relate to
        (was able to empathize with)
        what a scientiologist goes through.
        It’s all this life changing legal mumbo-jumbo, signing away your life, that I have NO EXPERIENCE with… and can’t relate… only because this is something so completely alien to me.

        • aegerprimo

          I’m glad you are a Bunkerite Qbird. Your insight and comments are so valuable here.
          I guess signing away your life (Sea Org billion year contract) would be similar to someone thinking they found the love of their life only to find they are abusive and then thinking there is no other option. I think you can relate to that from what you have experienced in your life.
          Human beings are complicated (yet resilient) creatures…
          Aren’t we?

  • pluvo

    There is NO justice in Scientology!
    The ‘justice’ system of the Church of Scientology with their ‘Committee of Evidence’ is a farce. It is a mockery of any real justice system.

    Hubbard said: “I have found that Man cannot be trusted with justice. The truth is, Man cannot really be trusted with “punishment.” With it he does not really seek discipline, he wreaks injustice. He dramatizes his inability to
    get his own ethics in by trying to get others to get their ethics in: I invite you to examine what laughingly passes for “justice”.

    Yeah, right! I invite you to examine what laughingly passes for ‘justice’ in the Church of Scientology . Among many other things, there is not even a defense when somebody gets targeted and accused. In every civilized country there is a defense – except in dictatorial, suppressive regimes… .
    For everybody who is interested, here is a report from somebody who experienced “the perversion of justice” first-hand: http://www.scientology-cult.com/bill-straass/487-perversion-of-justice-on-the-freewinds.html

    THIS is how ‘justice’ is done in the Church of Scientology and only ONE example.

  • Mark

    Neither Tubbo Tublard nor Shortarse Miscavige would recognise ethics, even if some rogue ethics crept up and bit them on their respectively flabby/sweaty and scrawny/spotty backsides. Sorry this is a bit late, but my Internet had the collywobbles this afternoon (refresh):

  • nottrue

    Wog’s aren’t afraid to read both sides……..

  • Joke of the day:

    • aegerprimo

      I don’t get it.
      (ha ha just kidding)

  • Qbird

    Yeah, “wish I could go down to a department store,
    buy myself some freedom.”

    I’ll sign anything to get free… http://youtu.be/ZkGHFtaaKOE

  • Eclipse-girl
    • aegerprimo

      I made a few of these…
      (refresh)

      • Eclipse-girl

        AWESOME

  • Xique

    After reading the letter written by Mike Ellis, IJC sent to Mr.Berrington, I feel like answering the letter, albeit 2 years late. It’s going to say, Dear Mike Ellis , Could you please give Mr. Berrington his money back, you big jerk! Signed, J.D.F.

  • NOLAGirl

    O/T: Apparently someone reported Facebook Hag/SP Policewoman Jojo Zawawi to Facebook and got her account suspended (bahahahaha Black Rob, is that you?), so she went on a Twitter rant about it:

    https://twitter.com/jojozawawi

    I know it’s not funny to laugh at someones meltdown, but for those who don’t know, this is the rude bitch that is always on every social media site yelling at Scientologists to unfollow people or telling them what they can and can’t post, so….fuck her.

    • DrGreatCham

      So Facebook is giving her “International Justice Chief” style treatment?

      “I can’t even Appeal because they insist my email is not related to a disabled acct. YES IT IS. dorks”

      I think the phrase “poetic justice” is appropriate.

      • Observer

        So she’s complaining that the “tech” was applied 100% standardly to her? Tsk.

        “If attacked on some vulnerable point by anyone or anything or any organization, always find or manufacture enough threat against them to cause them to sue for peace.”
        – L. Ron Hubbard, Hubbard Communications Office Policy Letter, 15 August 1960, Dept. of Govt. Affairs

      • BosonStark

        They’ve assigned her a condition of Gestapo non grata, and her only terminal is Twitter — so sad.

      • Phil McKraken

        You muat be the International Poetic Justice Chief.

    • Lurkness

      {Such a sweet thing she is.}
      JoJo Zawawi @jojozawawi · Oct 9

      God damned retarded @Facebook #Facebook I can’t even Appeal because they insist my email is not related to a disabled acct. YES IT IS. dorks

      JoJo Zawawi @jojozawawi · Oct 8

      8 hours & counting #Facebook @facebook disabled my acct for “using a fake name” (I use the name that’s ON MY DRIVER’S LICENSE, hello). Dorks

      JoJo Zawawi @jojozawawi · Oct 8

      #FedUp with #Facebook @Facebook listens to spurious reports & disables accounts for bogus reasons. #ScrewFacebook Why don’t they fix it ?

      JoJo Zawawi @jojozawawi · Oct 8

      I uploaded by Driver’s License to #Facebook 4 hrs ago 2 prove I’m NOT using fake name (some asshole made a bogus report). Still locked out.

      JoJo Zawawi @jojozawawi · Oct 8

      GOD DAMNED FUCKING FACEBOOK has locked me out of my account for using a “fake name”. I AM USING MY FULL LEGAL NAME and always have. Fuck FB

      • TheRupture

        Dear JoJo. I hear you. It is quite disheartening and frustrating to be labeled, to be accused, to not have any recourse of defense, to be locked out, to be ignored, to be

        disconnected.

        There are a number of forums on the net that can help you recover from this trauma with excellent tips and advice on how to heal from your experience. They are there for you any time, anywhere, and will not discriminate because of your past or attempt to manipulate you at this low point in your life. Let me know if you’re interested.

      • NOLAGirl

        Her replies after her account was reinstated calling Facebook a Nazi regime are hysterical.

        https://twitter.com/jojozawawi/with_replies

        • Lurkness

          priceless. Guarantee you I wouldn’t want to run across her in even a well lit alley. How any one “friends” her on fb is beyond me, let alone doing it knowing her gestapo purpose and track record. OSA’s finest.

        • kemist

          Facebook “murdered” her ?

          That woman is insane.

          This is just Facebook, FFS.

          • Espiando

            In a way, they did “murder” her for a few days. Her entire existence now depends on being OSA’s whore as the Facebook Police. Virtually every person that was with her on the Apollo has now blown or been declared, and since she still has blood of 100% Kool-Aid, if this happens to her, she’s going to drop the body within minutes. She has no other life. Without Facebook, she has no purpose to OSA and therefore no purpose to anyone that matters to her.

            She is hopeless. She deserves every bit of misery that happens to her.

        • Lynn Fountain Campbell

          The proper sec-checking answer to this is the question, “Do you have similar overts of your own?”

          She says her friends helped her by threatening an “internet campaign.” I was tempted to answer her tweet with “internet campaigns work and they help people.”

          (I’m tempted to “out” her assertions about being a “natural redhead,” but that would just be off-topic and petty. But man, do scientologists have to lie about *everything*?)

          • NOLAGirl

            I know right?

            I was tempted multiple times yesterday to respond to some of her tweets then thought better of it because I know she’ll block me immediately. I’d rather enjoy the madness from afar. 🙂

      • Observer

        Why, she’s just as ecclesiastical as a Captain Miscavige!

      • Peter

        Ah, what taste! What joie de vivre!! What panache!!!

        • Eclipse-girl

          What shadenfreude

          • Peter

            Ah, sChadenfreude, for the future. 🙂

      • Robert Eckert

        Did you notice her sidebar about her musical “career”? “Emotional, moody underscores, from exhilaration to despair” indeed.

    • Eclipse-girl

      I think that just made my day.

    • Observer

      Facebook Nazi Jojo: She can dish it out but she can’t take it.

      • NOLAGirl

        In perusing her Twitter account I found the account of the floral/party designer for Co$. Pics from CC, the Freewinds, they even have pics of the giant red bows. 😀 (not sure I’d claim those ugly things lol)

        https://twitter.com/PatFreyDesigns

        • Eclipse-girl

          I fear for you digging this deep

          • NOLAGirl

            No worries EG, I was just bored watching a football game. 🙂 I’ve done the Co$ Twitter rabbit hole, for the most part, already so I know better. It was just a picture that she retweeted that caught my eye then lo and behold…the maker of the hideous red bows. I got a good giggle out of it. 🙂

            • Eclipse-girl

              I / We do not want to lose you.

              Hey, UW won pretty easily over Illinois

    • Douglas D. Douglas

      So. SCHWEET!

    • Stacy

      I’m sure Facebook was more than happy to take their time addressing her account problems after she equated them to the Nazi Regime. Sheesh, is this an adult or a spoiled 6 year old throwing an obnoxious tantrum? Grow up Jojo!

      • TheRupture

        She is not a well person and had a traumatic, sicko early life, probably why she can’t grow up emotionally. Second generation scientologist.

        • Stacy

          True. I imagine CoS is no better at emotional development than they are at anything else.

          • TheRupture

            Scientology causes emotional regression. In JoJo’s case, she really needed psychiatric care as a child. Some are already damaged when they enter, but overall, scientology procedures are reminiscent of children’s schoolroom games from the 50’s. Running around poles, touching and talking to walls, Alice in Wonderland, repetition, playing with play dough. Scientologists play childish games and act, as you say, like children.

      • NOLAGirl

        That she would refer to anyone or anything as a “Nazi regime” is a joke. Especially after some of the things I’ve seen her say to people on FB and the way she bosses people around and tells them who they can & can’t associate with. If you go back into Black Rob’s thread on WWP you’ll see some of her “work”.

    • Lurkness

      OMG–displaying her composing “talents”!!! Guess Depends doesn’t make an absorbent enough product for all her shit, hence the towel on the chair.

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EaF_35vFqAY

      • NOLAGirl

        What the hell did I just watch?

        • TheRupture

          I wasn’t joking when I said she is not a well person. It makes me wonder about those who obey her on Facebook though.

          • NOLAGirl

            I think anyone who obeys her on any social media site does it because they know she’ll rat them out.

        • Eclipse-girl

          Stringed instruments are not supposed to screetch or scratch.
          She can not play the instruments in her sound room

          (I can not play an instrument)

        • Mark Foster

          industrial strength, unmitigated boooooool-sheet!!!

        • J. Swift

          How did she manage to keep her 200 cats out of the frame?

          • Lurkness

            Well one shows up under the table in the still frame. If I were a cat, I would stay as far away from that screeching too. Sounds like a cat being tortured.

      • Mark

        As Sir Thomas Beecham once said to another less than talented lady cellist: “Madam, you have between your legs an instrument capable of giving pleasure to thousands, yet all you do is sit there and scratch it!”

      • Observer

        Has Big Pharma come up with a pill for Vicarious Shame Syndrome yet? Because I’m going to be cringing for hours.

        • April

          I checked out her facebook page (yes I’m a glutton for punishment) and see several bragging posts about writing music scores for different films. Never mentions them by name though. O.o

          • Observer

            I wonder if they’re cheesy fanfares for the official Scientology vids.

        • Mark Foster

          Venutian Cannabis for Vicarious Shame Syndrome, Helatrobus Implants and Gorilla Goals optional…

      • Gus_Cox

        Oh my fucking God – she’s even worse than I remember!

    • Utterly brilliant

  • TheRupture

    Wouldn’t it be awful if all SP’s around the world who didn’t get a Comm Ev would email Mr. Ellis this weekend to demand one?

    Wouldn’t it be awesome if it happened to number 2,000, reminiscent of 2,000 lawsuits to the IRS? Hey, it worked for Scientology. SP’s United, Inc. That would really be something.

    • NOLAGirl

      How do we “never-ins” get declared? 🙂

      • TheRupture

        You are automatically enrolled in the Ideal Hall of SP’s if you are here. This picture posted at Mike Rinder’s mentions divergent or suppressive groups. The Underground Bunker would be at the top of that list. This was from a 2012 declare and the highlighted lines are what the person is supposed to be charged with as high crimes. Hanging out around these parts is a crime. These are the exact same ones used for all but the biggest and baddest, so cookie cutter describes most declare letters now.

        Sorry, but only former scientologists can request a Comm Ev. However, there used to be some kind of run around procedure for a never in SP to request one. Suppressive Groups, though, never.

        Maybe you should request a Review of this rule and see if Never In’s can get a crack at these Comm Ev’s. Sounds fair to me, especially since many Never In’s here know far more scientology policy than the scientologists still hanging on today.

        http://i.imgur.com/6dfEYLp.jpg?1

        • NOLAGirl

          “Engaging in malicious rumormongering truth-telling to destroy the authority or repute of higher officers or the leading names of Scientology or to “safeguard” a position.”

          Guilty as charged. 🙂

      • Jenstnick

        Right? Sign me up for that!

  • Mat Pesch

    The angle of information control was my first thought when I heard the Sea Org was taking over L.A. Org.

  • Truthiwant

    There’s a few more Ron And Mary Sue comics up at my site http://wp.me/p3a0JR-kS This morning (cet) I updated it and again just now.

    • aegerprimo

      Heh heh funny! ♥

    • NOLAGirl

      “Pity the driver wasn’t going faster.”

      That cracked me up. 🙂

  • romanesco

    If you look at the order, the judge is asking for evidence that the IJC ruled that Committee of Evidence rules and procedures apply in arbitration cases as previously claimed in one of Scientology’s previous filings. This affidavit doesn’t satisfy that. It only shows that the IJC now interprets the Church’s policy on dispute resolution as including arbitration matters. It appears the judge has caught them in a lie.

    • TheRupture

      It’ just a deflecting maneuver. There is no arbitration allowed in Scientology.

      • Eclipse-girl

        Of course there is arbitration in scientology. The cherch ALWAYS wins.

        • TheRupture

          What was I thinking? Off with my head!

      • romanesco

        I’m sure you’re right, but I doubt a judge would last long if he succumbed to such tactics. I suspect he asked for that particular piece of evidence because he had a good idea they couldn’t produce it.

        • TheRupture

          Yes. Scientology legal tactics have usually included wasting resources, both financial and time consumption, so they throw up a smorgasbord of statutes and maneuvers and see which one sticks in any given case. There is no arbitration process when anyone requests a repayment in Scientology and never has been. So it’s all a matter now of whether this is a judge that can be blackmailed, bought, or corrupt. If not, then this tack will be dropped because of course they can’t submit evidence, but expect any number of new ones to pop up in its place just as fast. It’s just what they do and they do it because they can. Other incorrigible corporations do this all the time and they do it because they can and also becausee it works. The little guy runs out of time and money long before the major players do.

          • romanesco

            Is there a GoFundMe page for Scientology prosecutors? Possibly disaffected “whales” would contribute.

            • TheRupture

              Is it Sunday Funnies already?

      • They hit arbitrary in the dictionary and quit looking.

        • Lurkness

          Nice!

  • Dorothy Gale

    Suing Scientology = high crimes = you’re an SP = you are excommunicated = you may not enter a church or speak to anyone other than IJC. So exactly how are the Garcia’s to get their arbitration? Can Scientology show any precedent of ever having given a refund via their “arbitration process” to an excommunicated SP?

  • Jimmy3

    A courtesy copy of this book has been provided to the court in chambers with a copy to opposing counsel.

    Hey, at the rate they’re getting sued, they may have just stumbled on the most effective way to disseminate LRH’s books.

    • Observer

      More of a discourtesy copy, if you ask me.

      • April

        yuk yuk yuk

    • Douglas D. Douglas

      Out-exchange, says I!

    • Since all of Tony’s readers also saw this that counts as like 2 billion disseminations.

    • Michael Leonard Tilse

      That should read: “A special freshly printed new edition courtesy copy of this book has been provided to the court in chambers with a copy to opposing counsel so that they don’t have to dig around in our past and discover we change the rules of the game more often than we change our underpants.”

      • Next week, there’ll be a new version with all the semicolons corrected.

    • Jenstnick

      I’m sure the judge, if given the choice, would rather smack himself in the face with his gavel than read that.

  • J. Swift

    A couple of comments on the IJC’s statement in the Garcia refund matter:

    1. What IJC has stated in this Garcia filing is at odds with what the Church told the IRS in order to obtain its 1993 tax exemption.

    This leads me to ask if IJC Mike Ellis lying to a Florida court or did CSI lie to the IRS? IMO, both Ellis and CSI are lying and that the Cult always uses the most convenient lie given the particular matter it is addressing.

    Here is what the Church told the IRS:

    “It has been a long-standing policy of the Church that if someone is dissatisfied with their Scientology services and asks to have their contributions returned within a three month period, these amounts will be returned. Likewise, if the person asks for return of contributions for which no services were received (i.e. an advance payment), there is no three month limitation period. Anyone newly enrolling in services at a Church of Scientology is informed of the policies and signs an agreement to abide by them. As a further condition of receiving a refund or repayment, the person understands that they may not again receive services from the Church.”

    “Within the Church, there are two separate terms: A “refund” refers to a return of contributions to a parishioner within 90 days of participating in religious services while a “repayment” refers to a return of a parishioner’s advance payment before he or she has participated in religious services. For simplicity, the following discussion will use the term “refund” to describe both types of transactions, because both involve a return of parishioner contributions.”

    “The Church’s refund policy is exceedingly fair. If someone isn’t happy with Scientology — which is a very small minority of people — he simply has to make a proper request for his donations back, agree to forego further services and his donations will be returned. For the Church, in addition to the fact that this policy aligns with Scientology principles of exchange, it also serves the purpose of allowing our churches and the parishioners who are very happy with Scientology, to carry on without the unhappy few in their midst.”

    *****
    2. CSRT and the IAS were not created when when Hubbard created the 1963 policy. AFAIK. there is no amendment in Church policy to incorporate these non-CSC/CSI entities created after Hubbard’s death.

    3. As a general statement, CSRT and IAS donation contracts state that the monies are nonrefundable. Now that IJC has stated that CSRT and IAS monies are linked to CSI’s rules, IJC has made CSRT and IAS monies part of CSI. This is a good data point for all future civil and criminal matters, i.e. CSRT and IAS are alter egos of CSI and therefore alter egos of David Miscavige, this per IJC’s ;legal filing.

    • Jgg2012

      Right, with nonrefundable $ the fraud is more of a problem. Part of the reason Amway was deemed legit by the FTC was that Amway offered refunds–if anyone decided that the overpriced junk was, well, overpriced, they could get it refunded, so there was no harm (except that Amway doesn’t really refund money, but that’s another story). Refunds are for products you purchase. Donations to a social betterment organization do not involve a sale of products. Your only compensation is knowing that you helped people. So, when the Garcia’s found out the money wasn’t being spent the way they intended it to, they had a fraud claim, not a product refund claim.

      • J. Swift

        Correct, it is a fraud claim. However, CSI called it, and still calls the return of monies “repayments” or “refunds” per its documentation to the IRS in support of gaining 501(c)3 status.

        However, IJC argues that per the post-Hubbard, non-Hubbard authored “Religious Services Enrollment, Application, and General Release” contract, internal CSI arbitration is required.

        One could quite possibly argue that post-Hubbard, non-Hubbard authored contracts are not Church scripture and are therefore subject to review by a court of law.

        The entire edifice of fraud that is Corporate Scientology will come crashing down. It is purely a matter of time.

        And some day soon an aged Mike Ellis may indeed find himself pushing a shopping cart around Hollywood as a homeless person. Perhaps he and Linda Hamel and the others will find themselves in the same line at the Social Security Office asking for a free government handout.

        • Lurkness

          Part of the fraud issue with the Garcias is their straight donations (for idle morgues/SP Building, etc.) that are not related to services or even contemplated by the IRS application and agreement. Of course, at the time of the IRS resolution (1993), it would have been considered heresy to seek straight donations without exchange, per Hubbard’s sacred Scripture.

          So seeking “repayments” of funds advanced to $cientology for future services, and the funds are not returned, is one kind of fraud and an apparent violation of the representations made to the IRS. Bilking people by false pretenses for donations to build the SP Building is another kind of fraud, unrelated to the IRS agreement.

        • TheRupture

          Has there ever been a case like the Garcias’ based on this type of fraud? I don’t remember one, not for what their case is based upon and especially not involving the IAS. It’s a fine point I’ve always wondered about in reading Scientology’s objections or arguments. There really isn’t any precedence for this in Scientology processes and forms, is there?

          I always thought the clause thrown in the IAS form about no refunds threw a mental barricade for anyone thinking about a lawsuit, especially sheltered members who certainly learn a great deal of injustice and unfairness but labelled as justice and fair. Ignorance is Strength. Injustice is Fair. How could there be a policy or procedure for an action that has never occurred before? Scientology policies covering legal have always been reactive, not proactive.

        • Jgg2012

          There is a concept called judicial estoppel which prevents a party from making contrary factual representations. Campbell’s once told a Pennsylvania court that they were located on the New Jersey side of the border between PA and NJ, and told a New Jersey court the exact opposite, in order to avoid state taxes. Well, they ended up paying twice–you can’t do that. You can argue alternative legal theories, but not be different things to different people.
          Scientology has taken contrary positions on disconnection, refunds, whether Narconon is part of Scientology, arbitration, whether its services are religious and who knows what else.

  • Stacy

    Duped, interview #214, over at Scientology-Through the Door, made this comment in discussing problems seen in CoS:

    ” I do know of some murders committed by Scientologists, such as an ‘accidental overboard’ in the Mediterranean Sea on a Scientology ship of a person who wanted to leave and expose Scientology for what it is.”

    I’ve done a google search to see if I could find out more about a murder by overboarding on the Apollo, but didn’t come up with much, probably because overboarding pulls up so many results, (even when death is added in). Does anyone know how credible this accusation is? Given everything I’ve learned about CoS it seems credible to me. I’d like to learn more about this particular incident if someone could point me in the right direction. Thanks.

    • Tony Ortega

      Come on. Use your critical thinking skills.

      • Stacy

        Justly chastised.

        • Baby

          Stacy..shake it off…

          It will never show up on google. An interesting site to look for crimes or alleged crimes with actual people named is

          They should Not have died just google that. You will be shocked.

          I know that you are learning..It is an amazing journey down that rabbit hole. We are glad that you are joining this fight! Thank you. Baby

          • Bury_The_Nuts

            yes. What baby bear says!!!

          • Captain Howdy

            Yea, you’re nothing around here unless you’ve been corrected or admonished by The Proprietor at least once.

            • Baby

              Speaking of.. Where has Espi been? I miss him. I hope his knee is healing ok..

            • Captain Howdy

              He was here. How are you feeling?

            • Eclipse-girl

              CH is right, how is the ear, the equilbrium?

              Espi is here. No worries about him.

            • Baby

              Hi E .. thanks.. Please look above..I just answered Howdy.

            • Espiando

              Yeah, I’m here. Don’t worry. Just get yourself better.

            • Baby

              Oh good Espi.. I haven’t been around much lately..Just in and out.. So glad you are feeling better. Thank you sigh ; /

            • Baby

              Thank you for asking .. It’s getting worse. Was going to go to Emergency room.. but upon advice from a professional took 4 advils ( 800mgs) and it went from an 8 ( 1-10) to a 4.

              So will take more at 3:30 am and see.. I didn’t want to grosse anyone out, but at this point who cares.. I was diagnosed with an ear infection/ FUNGUS ..

              I was going to go on Vacation…Oct 17 and if I still have these symptoms forget it..

              I have had a tumor in my pineal gland since 2009.. and I was scared that it had something to do with it..but it doesn’t.. ( too close to the brain stem to determine status)

              Aren’t you glad that you asked..hahahha

              And that is probably the last time I complain about my health.. I promise..

            • Captain Howdy

              You should go to the ER or your Primary Care. And you wanna talk gross? I couldn’t take a BLANK most of last week and blah, blah, blah, yada, yada, yada…aaaaaaaaaah what a relief it was.

            • Baby

              I called my Primary Care and it said.. ” Our hours blah, blah Yakity smackity..and if this is an emergency call 911. ( I live on an island..shhhhhh)

              EWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW poor Howdy your Blah, Blah Yada Yada sound terrible.

              Relief? Yay

            • Eclipse-girl

              Baby, I am worried.
              You have been in for longer than a week.
              You need to see one or more specialists.

            • Baby

              It’s been like 3 weeks E..

              I figured out where I got the damn thing..

              My old boss texted me and said that she had an ear infection..
              During the summer I had been swimming at her pool. ( Hotter than hell here)

              so I don’t do laps or anything just go over and go under the water for hours..

              I have never smelled any chemicals. It looked clean, but the last time I went ( before my infection) all of her dogs ( 3) were swimming in the pool.. I had never noticed them before..

              She said that they are always in the backyard and just ” Live in the Pool..”

              Uh Hello.. Red Flag, Red Flag.. and stupid me just swimming and staying under the water the whole time.. Just stupid.. Very, Very stupid..

              I promise you.. 7:30am on Monday I will be waiting for the Dr to open and ask him if I need a specialist..

              My vertigo has really diminished.. that’s a good thing. I only spin now when I lay down.

            • Vaquera

              “Spray some Windex on it.”

            • Baby

              Ha

            • Kim O’Brien

              vanilla ice cream in a bowl and a big tall glass of ginger ale with crushed ice …all tucked in nice and snug in bed ..and then watch the Wizard of Oz . Works every time . Feel better

            • Baby

              I am tucked on my couch watching one of my favorite movies ( Rise of Planet of the Apes)

              My hubby surprised me and got me my favorite Pralines and Cream..and I am drinking a diet coke with ice to the top ( Crushed)

              So I was just checking back.. Oh plus I have 2 of my 4 baby doggies snuggled with me..
              ( Oops refresh)

            • Kim O’Brien

              close enough LOL 🙂

            • Baby

              I don’t know what happened to Lulu.. she’s my 14 yr old in her little dress.. NO I don’t dress my dog up in clothes.. Wanted to take her picture in glasses..ha

              Check thumbnail

              Oh refresh again..Lulu just showed up!

            • Captain Howdy

              That sounds wonderful, Throw some vodka in the GA and switch OZ for Wild At Heart and I’m in heaven.

            • Kim O’Brien

              double feature with True Romance ..??

            • Eclipse-girl

              Please, promise.

              I remember when i needed stitches in April — The first time for me.
              I kept thinking that if I put butterflies and kept pressure on it that would have been fine.
              The MD did say my approach would work, but it would take a LOT longer to heal.
              Glad my daughter could drive me to the clinic.
              I had the accident washing HER dishes.

              Enough humor – you needed a smile.

              I, and others will want the report on Monday

            • Baby

              Ouch ..( for you..) Oh I’ll take a smile any day.. I promise you I will.

            • Feel better sweetie. Nothing worse than a baby with an ear infection

            • Baby

              Thanks Nat.. I have been in such a bitchy mood.. My hubby enters my office with a stick with a white flag attached..

            • noseinabk

              Howdy did you go back to take care of that lump on your arm?

            • Captain Howdy

              Not yet.

            • noseinabk

              Dang it. Suck it up and get it fixed! Life is to short to live with a fixable condition. I kinda understand why. Not one doc has ever listened to me when I say that meds don’t last as long for me as others.

          • Stacy

            Thank you Baby. I appreciate your support.

            • Baby

              Anytime..We are all Bunker Strong.. And here for each other.. I am hyper sensitive ..
              That’s why I smoke. Come on darlin we got work to do.

    • Captain Howdy

      Scientology doesn’t have to murder people. It just drives them crazy and they end up murdering others or they kill themselves. They may have murdered someone in the past, but there’s no conclusive proof and critics talking like it’s a fact just makes them look kinda obsessed and a little bit nuts to outsiders.

      Anywho..conspire away http://www.crimelibrary.com/blog/2014/03/17/lets-look-into-these-suspicious-scientology-deaths/3/index.html

    • noseinabk

      As you would tell any student, never be afraid to ask a question. The behavior and crimes of Scientology are so bizarre that we learn to question everything.

      • Stacy

        I have a lifetime of asking direct questions to overcome

  • Bury_The_Nuts

    Oooh…I have always hoped this Berrington letter was going to come back to haunt them.

  • mook

    More proof that Lisa Marie is out of the cult, the response she gives in this interview re: medicating kids
    http://lisamariepresley.com/news/354-lmp-interview-in-healthy-living-magazine

    No LRH-speak… Hmmm…

  • Eclipse-girl

    OK it is time for the late night crew to work their fingers

    You want to hurt this criminal enterprise

    By flagging the ads, you mess with their heads

    thank you for all that you do

    https://whyweprotest.net/threads/taking-down-co-on-craigslist-co-ads-on-craigslist.113779/page-115#post-2489344

    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1-Kvg78kCcvo5gL7UfPcmhmbsagTNtdj0y2LAiHVFrCU/pubhtml

    • Eclipse-girl

      I also want to thank Tony O for supporting this effort.

      • Lurkness

        You can’t go that far. He has a light touch in moderating and tolerates our individual pursuits and interests.

        • Eclipse-girl

          This has been going for about one year, when CS LIst Slayer reinvigorated the project. particularly at WWP
          Pierrot, Pan, AP, Dodo, Cranberry and too many others have worked hard to make this work

          Tony O could have removed these posts.
          Tony O did not have to publicize the news articles that appeared.

          I tptally agree Tony O is very light handed.
          I also think in my mad mind that he supports this effort
          please allow me my madness

          • Lurkness

            Your mind is not mad–it’s scientology free to think and opine, but TO has to watch his already fair gamed back, just sayin.

            • Eclipse-girl

              I deserved that.

            • Lurkness

              Hope that didn’t read as a slap to you–just explaining the lines and concerns. 😉

            • Eclipse-girl

              No it did not hurt. I appreciate your concern.
              I am over enthusiastic at times

            • Lurkness

              Thank you too for helping pick up the ball on this important effort to help limit the cult’s fraudulent recruiting efforts!

            • noseinabk

              No you did not.

          • Baby

            E just shake it off darlin.. Tony is being Switzerland. That is why he doesn’t ever use the word cult..but he doesn’t care if we do. xo

            Just keep doing what you are doing..Much appreciated!

            • Eclipse-girl

              Yeah, I understand that.

              I did shake it off. I understand that Tony has to be Switzerland.
              I appreciate that we are all able to be here.

          • Douglas D. Douglas

            The Underground Bunker accommodates many legitimate points of view and activities. Tony Ortega may report on these if and when they cross into the realm of news.

      • Tony Ortega

        The Underground Bunker has never condoned nor prohibited the flagging ads activity.

        • Lurkness

          Guess you were home and got this covered. LOL.

        • Eclipse-girl

          You are very darn quick.
          I still thank you.

        • Baby

          Can I do the Macarena with Howdy?

          Please don’t anyone link the Macarena song.. Pleassssssssse

        • Robert Eckert

          OK, then we thank you for not prohibiting. We perfectly understand not condoning.

    • Jo

      If you flag ads from outside America, does it make a difference? I usually just flag Gumtree Ads that Mark posts.

      • Eclipse-girl

        Yes, it does.

        • Jo

          Ok, thanks.

  • Jo

    Sorry O/T, I was checking out IAS event on FB, 223 invited, 7 going, 2 maybe. Suggested event, zombie run, 2.7k invited, 318 going, 84 maybe, lol. pic

    • Bury_The_Nuts

      47 x eleventy billion!
      Come on, Jo.
      I know you can calculate Sciloon math!

      • Baby

        I darlin..Just checked in! and found you..Yay.. and Jo of course ..and will look for my other buddies..

        • Bury_The_Nuts

          In Kentucky.
          Fried chicken is disappoint!!!

          • Baby

            Aww shit the bed… I had the worst pizza in my life last night.. The crust was wet..grosse..

            but it was OK..cause I pigged out on the fresh bread and took a spoon to the topping and put it on the bread.. Yummy ..

            I asked for Ground beef and pineapple.. ( for a change) and I think he just dumped a can of pineapple ( juice and all) on the top when it was done.. ugh..

            ( After a few beers it did taste better..) I ordered Meatballs on the side ..fabulous..

            Can you tell that we are foodies? hahaha

            • Bavarian Rage

              Gross! Major pizza letdown. 🙁

            • Baby

              The Worst! and I love pizza.. I love the crust the best! and when I leave the crust behind you know it’s bad Bavarian!

            • Lurkness

              Feeling better tonight? Improving?

            • Baby

              I just wrote to Howdy about it Lurk.. ugh Thanks

            • Lurkness

              Found it. Damn, not good to hear, pun not intended. Get your butt to the Doc!

            • Baby

              I promise..

    • Baby

      Oh Jo.. Info like this is never O/T .. It is one of the reasons I am here.. To see the Downfall of Sciloooooooietunes.. Zombie Run..bawwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwhahahah

    • Baby

      I like those who run from Zombies..( refresh)

      • Jo

        Funny but true, run Katie run

        • Baby

          It was just too predictable to post a zombie running..So hearsayed Scientologists running..and this picture showed up..hahahahaa Perfect.

      • Eclipse-girl

        There are times I wonder how hard it was for Katie to re establish some boundaries once she left the family compound.
        I realize that Suri was still fairly young.
        But it is hard to say NO, particularly when a child is used to yes.

        Suri seems more “normal” now. —
        at least as far as the paparazzi go.

        • Baby

          She was raised with good old Northwestern values. She changed Tom’s couture clothes for Suri into off the wrack.. ( when she left) Road on subways in New York.. It seems like she has her priorities straight.

          And then she moved to California..ugh

          • Douglas D. Douglas

            Ahem.

      • richelieu jr

        Better than the ones the Zombies catch, Baby!

        BRRRRAAAAAIIIIIINS! BAAAAABY BRRRRRAAAAAAIIIIIINNNNS!

        • Baby

          Freakin A Rich

    • Lurkness

      your numbers must be wrong! 10,000 will be there (even though tent max capacity is about 7,000), Scientology is saying so. Just like there were 10,273 in Clearwater last year. Phft.

      • Jenstnick

        Yes but how many trees for the Golden Age of Tree Tech that takes place at every major event these days?

  • Ronn_S

    I have no idea who is Mike Ellis… never heard of him and he’s the IJC since 1998? Wow. But back to point, this Claims Verification Board “CVB Routing Form” referred to is an interesting bit of typical CO$ entrapment in itself. It is a form one must follow to several different divisions “posts” within the organization. It has nothing to do with a Comm Ev that I can find, interestingly enough.

    Here is one example of just the 4th Section of this long and ridiculously drawn out 7 Sections plus a full page of Claimant Information and 2 full pages staff actions – “routing form”.
    ———————————————————————————-
    4. CLAIMS VERIFICATION BOARD
    a. Process the claim per Claims Verification Board Policies. (WTF is that?)
    b. If approved, work out the administration charge.
    AMOUNT: ________________
    c. Inform both the claimant and the FBO (Flag Banking Officer) by mail that the claim has been approved and what the administrative charges are.
    d. If the claim is disapproved, inform in writing both the FBO and the claimant. Include instructions on what needs to be done to get approval, if this is the case. (Huh?)
    e. Send the routing form back to the claimant.
    ————————————————————————————
    One of the first steps on this “Routing Form”, Section 2. is to route in to see the Chaplain or “Ruds Auditor”. You may (or may not) see a Chaplain initially and he will try to PR you and help sort through your upset, but failing there you will be required to get “I’m NOT AUDITING YOU” auditing confessionals from the “Ruds Auditor” at YOUR OWN EXPENSE. Meaning any money you may be requesting returned to you will first be used up (as much as possible…) by NOT AUDITING YOU at $300 to $800 per hour (depending on the Org) for a hundred or more hours as necessary to handle your upset.
    ————————————————————————————

    YOU CAN’T MAKE THIS SHIT UP.

    And of course, if you are declared an SP for disagreeing with the routing form requirements, well then you’re just piss out of luck I guess. This happened to a good friend in Seattle only recently. The Chaplain in Seattle, a friend of mine for over 30 years, lived together, whole nine yards, will not return her calls !!!! Another friend with over $70,000 at FLAG requested a refund and they just blew him off, no further communication except via the Chaplain and the Chaplain will not return calls.

    ————————————————————————————–

    They just flat don’t care, you are not getting your money back even if we have to spend 18 times that amount on 18 attorneys.

    • Baby

      Yep Ronn! It is a freakin joke.

  • George Hamar

    As I read this, I am beginning to really see the desperation.
    Miscavige’s “why” is once again wrong. Stats down at ASHO & LA orgs? Well it has to be those mysterious ‘external forces”
    I am getting the distinct impression that little Davey is so desperate to show an appearance of normality, that he is very willing to push the shit & shinola and say it’s something he “discovered” while going through all those LRH writings, & as a result can now “rescue” the PAC area by replacing the off purpose staff and replace them with these incredible fantastic Sea Org members, cause hey, we all know how unbelievably effective that will be. Considering how much he’s smoking & drinking, I would laugh my ass off when he collapses. David Miscavige – you have earned my undying contempt. I’d love to see an event where he justs looses it, and flips out. Better yet, I would love to standing in the room when the IRS realizes they were gamed by him, & they pull every exemption, & arrest him, live on stage. After all the bullshit crap he’s done to so many others, well, karma can be a real bitch. Even better – Tom Cruise tells him to piss off and to never speak to him ever again. Oh well – nice thoughts – sure hope they come true!

  • Lady Squash

    I hope the Judge see thru the Church’s veil of deception.

  • Verve

    Dear OSA, please forward this to Mr. Mike Ellis.

    “Dear Mr. Mike Ellis, you are a fucknut.”
    Slghned,
    Every Monkey That Will Cross Your Path
    (Look out for flung poo, jackass.)