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Scientology’s snitching culture: Jefferson Hawkins explains the ‘Knowledge Report’

Jefferson_Hawkins_ObeyJefferson Hawkins was once the top marketing executive for the Church of Scientology and helped it reach its greatest extent with the famous “volcano” TV ads in the 1980s. He’s told his tale of getting into and out of the church with his excellent books Counterfeit Dreams and Leaving Scientology, and he’s helping us understand the upside-down world of Scientology “ethics.”

One of the things we’ve tried to do, in our radio and television interviews, is make people understand what a paranoid culture of snitching that Scientology promotes among its members. It’s really something that the rest of the media rarely ever explains, but we think it’s one of the most characteristic results of L. Ron Hubbard’s “ethics” rules. This week, in our ongoing series, Jeff helps us see where that idea of turning in your friends, family, and neighbors comes from.

JEFFERSON: this week we’re having a look at Chapter 9 of Introduction to Scientology Ethics, “Ethics Reports.” This is a short chapter, but a vital one in the overall system of Scientology ethics. This is where Scientologists are taught to report on each other.

THE BUNKER: You mean, the infamous “Knowledge Reports”?

JEFFERSON: We know historically that one of the characteristics of any totalitarian, dystopian society is the degree to which citizens spy on each other and report each other to the authorities. This was the case in Nazi Germany, where the Hitler Youth were trained to spy on their own parents and neighbors. In the Soviet Union, citizens reported on those who they considered to be suspicious, disloyal, counter-revolutionary elements, and they were then arrested and sent to the gulags. The East German Stasi, which has been described as one of the most effective and repressive intelligence and secret police agencies to ever have existed, had as one of its main tasks spying on the population through a vast network of citizen-informants.

THE BUNKER: Big Brother is watching you!

JEFFERSON: Yes, and little brother too. Orwell describes this vividly in 1984:

It was almost normal for people over thirty to be frightened of their own children. And with good reason, for hardly a week passed in which the Times did not carry a paragraph describing how some eavesdropping little sneak — “child hero” was the phrase generally used — had overheard some compromising remark and denounced his parents to the Thought Police.

This is a mechanism that is also common to cults. In his Combatting Cult Mind Control, Steven Hassan notes that this is an important part of information control:

Information control also extends across all relationships. People are not allowed to talk to each other about anything critical of the leader, doctrine, or organization. Members must spy on each other and report improper activities or comments to leaders.

THE BUNKER: So how does L. Ron Hubbard sell this to the faithful?

JEFFERSON: Very cleverly. He presents it in terms of responsibility and control, two things that are highly valued by Scientologists. To control one’s environment, he argues, one must take responsibility for what goes on around one. Sounds pretty good so far. Then, as usual, he states it as a technical breakthrough based on his research:

In analyzing countless numbers of groups with whom it has been my good fortune — or misfortune — to be associated, I finally isolated ONE factor which made an upstat group upstat and a downstat group downstat and a horror to be around. The single most notable difference between an upstat, easy-to-live-and-work-with group and a downstat, hard-to-live-and-work-with group is that the individual group members themselves enforce the action and mores of the group.

So if you deputize everyone as a part of your internal policing network, anyone who steps out of line can be instantly spotted and handled. Hubbard adds:

Those who would have a tendency to wreak havoc or loaf don’t dare. And the group becomes easy to live with and work with.

THE BUNKER: I feel safer already!

JEFFERSON: Next, Hubbard lays out how these “Knowledge Reports” will be enforced. He says:

Anyone who knew of a loafing or destructive or off-policy or out-ethics action and WHO DID NOT FILE A KNOWLEDGE REPORT becomes an ACCESSORY in any justice action taken thereafter.

Note the ALL CAPS! And:

Any person who knew of an outness or crime and failed to report it and thus became an accessory receives the same penalty as the person disciplined as the actual offender.

THE BUNKER: That’s pretty harsh. So what sorts of things are people supposed to report?

JEFFERSON: Hubbard gives a list of the types of reports that a Scientologist is supposed to file. These include Damage Report, Misuse Report, Waste Report, Idle Report, Noncompliance Report (where someone didn’t comply with a senior order), Error Report, Misdemeanor Report, Crime Report, Annoyance Report, and many more.

THE BUNKER: I’m surprised they get any work done.

JEFFERSON: Seriously, you’d be amazed how much staff time gets absorbed in all of these reports. If someone takes an unauthorized smoke break, the staff around him are supposed to write up an Idle Report and file it. If someone doesn’t meet their production quota, they get a Noncompliance Report — and so on. I remember at the Int Base, vast amounts of time were wasted writing, reading and dealing with these reports.
But more important than the reports themselves was the atmosphere it created. You literally knew you were being watched every minute. So the only way to survive was to toe the line, keep busy on your job, not be observed idle at any time, and be always cheerful and productive. And of course you could never utter a negative word or hold a negative thought about one’s seniors or about Scientology tech.

THE BUNKER: Can a staff member file a Knowledge Report on his or her senior?

JEFFERSON: Technically, yes, and it is done, although it’s generally frowned upon. You can get away with it if your senior is not very far up the food chain, and you can even rein in an abusive senior. But when it comes to filing reports on the senior executives of Scientology, no, that doesn’t happen. I remember one time on the Apollo, a staff member filed a Knowledge Report on Hubbard. It was said that his luggage hit the dock before the ink was dry — he was offloaded instantly. If a Knowledge Report is filed on a senior person, then it is usually the person who filed the report who gets investigated and disciplined. A lot of Scientologists have learned this the hard way when they tried to write Knowledge Reports about the Ideal Org Program, the Basics Evolution or the GAT technical alterations. They were the ones who got investigated and ultimately declared.

THE BUNKER: The most recent and salient example being Leah Remini, of course. In 2006, after she noticed that Scientology leader David Miscavige was at the wedding of Tom Cruise and Katie Holmes without his wife, Shelly, she asked about it and got a rude response from then-spokesman Tommy Davis (“You don’t have the fucking rank to ask about Shelly.”) Not only was Shelly missing (she had vanished nearly a year earlier, late in 2005, but Leah didn’t know that yet), but Leah was apparently unhappy with David’s behavior around his female assistant. So after the wedding, she wrote up a Knowledge Report, turning in the leader of Scientology himself! For her trouble, she was hauled into Flag and made to undergo three months of interrogations until she agreed to rescind the report.

JEFFERSON: The bottom line is that the Knowledge Report system is there to ensure that Scientologists and staff continually spy on each other and provide a continual flow of intelligence to the Ethics apparatus within the Church. And it’s there to make sure Scientologists know that they are being watched and monitored by those who are closest to them — their Scientologist family and friends. It’s not there to correct Church management operations or abuses. And that’s why it ultimately fails to create the “upstat group” Hubbard claimed it would, and instead creates an atmosphere of fear and paranoia.

 
——————–

Posted by Tony Ortega on January 2, 2014 at 07:00

E-mail your tips and story ideas to tonyo94@gmail.com or follow us on Twitter. We post behind-the-scenes updates at our Facebook author page. Here at the Bunker we try to have a post up every morning at 7 AM Eastern (Noon GMT), and on some days we post an afternoon story at around 2 PM. After every new story we send out an alert to our e-mail list and our FB page.

 

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  • DodoTheLaser

    Upvote my post or I will KR your ass!

    • Sidney18511

      Yes sir!

    • DodoTheLaser

      Hi up voting guests! Pass this blog http://tonyortega.org/ to your friends, please.

      • Missionary Kid

        What are you going to do if I don’t? KR me? Hahahahahahahaha!
        I upvoted you anyway.

    • Just Dee

      Sorry Dodo, I couldn’t resist down voting you! I am kind of a rebel and dare ya to KR me! lol I really don’t down vote much, I think Observer was the last person I down voted, so you are in good company! 🙂

      • Andrew Robertson

        I wanted to down vote Dodo too but my right index finger thetan refused to obey me. So instead I wrote a KR on it!

        Andrew

      • Observer

        But it was such a nice downvote!

        • Just Dee

          It really was! I don’t waste down voting on trolls, they aren’t worth it. I save them for special occasions!

    • InTheNameOfXenu

      Knowledge Reports are exactly like the ‘Chivato’ system in communist Cuba, but is far, far much worse. Every neighborhood had a chivato to spy and report on anything said that was against the collective good. But, in $cientology, everyone is encouraged to be a chivato and punished if he/she does not come through. Much worse than communism.

      • joan nieman

        Of course, Scientology has to take it to the extreme.

      • Anonymous

        The 20 million or so folks that were murdered by Stalin in Soviet Russia (and their families) would probably argue that Communism was worse. Same for the tens of millions murdered by Mao in Communist China.

        We should keep things in perspective.

        • InTheNameOfXenu

          If $cientology had taken a foot-hold of society and become the dominant ‘religion’ the result would have been the same if not worse than the Soviet purges. Fair-Game policy does say that the SP can be ‘destroyed’. Many people would have been disposed of quietly and without remorse as per Hubbard.

          • califa007

            KR’s were among my first turn offs. I questioned whether I would really want to live in a world run by the Sea Org.

        • joan nieman

          I know we should keep things in perspective, Anon, but I thing we are just showing the likeness of mind control in general.

        • FromPolandWithLove

          Thank You, Anonymous for this opinion! I wish I couls upvote Your post hundred times:) As a person who lives in country which suffered under communist regime I agree that perspective makes difference in this case.

          • Anonymous

            Like you, I know people that fled those countries when the shooting started. It was horrific and those people still grieve over the loss of family members and loved ones. They are also ultra sensitive to behavior that reminds them of those events.

            Scientology is a totalist organization that needs to be stopped, but it has never approached the savagery of several political totalism in recent memory.

    • DamOTclese2

      Yes sir! And here’s a check $1,200 as well.

    • joan nieman

      Ok! Done!

    • danlocke

      I downvoted you simply because it’s been years since I have received a KR. It’s been many more years since I have cared. But I thought it would be fun to see how well you did at chewing me out and see how “upstat, and easy-to-live-and-work-with” I got in consequence. If I can make the lives of those in the bunker a little more pleasant simply by getting snitched on by the Dodo, I am up for it!

    • Sir_Real

      Done! Hope that puts your stats into the galaxy you were striving for, sir!

    • Edward Whalley

      A KR for my trophy room, please?

  • Michael Leonard Tilse

    Things That Shouldn’t Be Report

    David Miscavige

    End of report.

    • Pepsicat

      And LRH

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      hahahahahahah. Good one!

  • DodoTheLaser

    “Scientology’s snitching culture” – even though the wording conveys the concept well and brief, it would be more correct to say – “Scientology’s talking and writing stupid and lame shit culture, for to cover one’s fearful ass”, imo.
    A bit long though. Yet so true.

    • Douglas D. Douglas

      Oh really?

      KR for you!

  • Couple KRs with thought crimes (even thinking about being unhappy) and you have a cult by any definition.
    I find the description of children censoring themselves to be particularly chilling – Laura DeCrescenzo and Jenna Miscavige-Hill springs to mind.

  • Anonymous

    Anyone that wants to tell RTC about something can submit their own KR right here:

    http://www.rtc.org/matters/intro.html

    • Silence of the Clams

      Why do I get the feeling I’m going to need to give them my address, social security and bank information to file my KR?

      • Anonymous

        Fake it. Then tell them that GAT II is a massive squirrel campaign.

      • joan nieman

        Because you will, Silence, and be sharp about it!

    • Elen

      Could you imagine if every bunker member filed a report on DM? Although I have the same concern as Silence of the Clams… would I have to turn over my first born?

      • Anonymous

        They don’t ask for anything you can’t fake.

        • Elen

          Hmmmm… worth considering…

          • Anonymous

            It would definitely be inappropriate for someone to send a KR in the name of Tommy Davis. We definitely don’t want to see him end up on the RPF so nobody do it.

            • Scream Nevermore

              I have never done such a thing. Not once. Certainly not twice.

            • Douglas D. Douglas

              Now that, that is bad, m’kay?

            • Scream Nevermore

              Well, we can’t have that, can we, being bad??

            • Douglas D. Douglas

              Uh huh. That would be bad, m’kay?

      • Douglas D. Douglas

        That would be bad, m’kay?

      • joan nieman

        Elen, if we had to hand write it we would have to send pages and pages in.There is no end to his “unethical” deeds.

    • Douglas D. Douglas

      That’d be bad, m’kay?

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      Better proxy up.

      • richelieu jr

        Oh, yeah!

    • I suppose I could file a KR on myself.

      • Dylan

        that would be a great start. while your at it assign yourself to MEST work as well. lol

        • DamOTclese2

          He would just have Daddy buy a maid for him to do the MEST work for him, he’s such a little girl.

  • Once I was asked to help disseminating on the streets. I declined. I said that I had only been in the church for a month and would not know enough to promote Scientology.
    I got a KR and ended up in Ethics.

    I had a highly respected job at that time. There are certain levels where you cannot do such without destroying your business life. Later on I had to take days off to f…..g work for CCHR. I knew that I was not allowed to decline. I made sure it was far away from my home town, so I would not meet anyone there.
    When I then resigned saying that I did not get any refund for my costs they said that I was in a liability condition. And that after working hundreds of hours for free – I finally was a liability.

    Only a mind slave is a good cult member. Someone who gives all, receives nothing and is called liability.

    • Silence of the Clams

      BFM, you were only in for a month and you got reported and sent to ethics? Does the trap on the ‘thinking mind’ close this quickly? I mean, wasn’t the bullshit meter pinging like crazy?

      • Indeed, the bullshit meter was pinging. But at the beginning you are DIV6 – which is quite soft. Overall it was ok. I thought it was that person (not the organisation) going wild. It did upset me a lot.

        • Haha, and I now remember a KR from a man to my wife. He wrote that my wife had walked across the street while the traffic lights were red.
          But this story ended well. That man had written many similar KRs. He was sent to Ethics. Anyway, he is still in and he is one of the fanatics. His daughter started behaving the same way later on.
          Btw. no KR in your Ethics folder can be removed. There is a process to remove BS, but I did not witness any removal in practice.

        • FromPolandWithLove

          Scientology has e-meter, Bunkerology has b-meter 😉

      • joan nieman

        I guess they start on new recruits early, Silence.

    • My name is Larry Lester

      I remember each time I had to walk into the org I would feel so embarrassed. I would shrink as I entered the front door and be relived no one saw me. Not that I would know as I was in such a panic just to get in the door with out anyone knowing I was one of the fruit loops. Those were the days..

    • chukicita

      ” I said that I had only been in the church for a month and would not know enough to promote Scientology. I got a KR and ended up in Ethics.”

      Wow! What if someone had asked you about your belief system’s origin story? Would you have had to tell them you didn’t know yet?

      • richelieu jr

        Come inside and find out!

      • richelieu jr

        Seriously, fi that were a question, 95% of Scilons couldn’t answer.

        Lost of them aren’t lying hen they say they know nothing about Xenu and it sounds ridiculous to them. Juliette Lewis wasn’t lying to the BBC, for example…

        • chukicita

          I guess then I’d ask them why they don’t know their faith’s origin story. It’s usually the first thing you learn, and without having to pay through the nose to learn it.

      • Scientologists call this: Putting someone into an effect position.
        So someone is talking about something you don’t know. Therefore you cannot evaluate data properly and you are effect of the data that you receive.
        At that time, yes – any critical question would have made me think tremendously. In fact it did once on a CCHR exhibition.

        At all times I was open minded. It caused me a lot of trouble. But in the end it was my open minded behaviour that kicked me out:
        http://barefacedmessiah.wordpress.com/2013/05/29/the-mecca-of-thought-control/

    • richelieu jr

      Scientology Morality:
      “Thanks for the 2 million for the Super Power w-Building, her’s your Silver Meritorious Blowhole Certificate with matching leather jacket….
      You are truly ulimately wonderful, KSW is your middle name and LRH is personally looking down from his sauna in the Van Allen Belt, thinking of ways he can get even more initials just so he can give you some!

      now, WHAT HAVE YOU DONE FOR US LATELY?!!!!!!!!!”

      • Guest

        You say that in jest, but in a cult driven by weekly stats, its more true than you may realize.

    • Missionary Kid
    • DamOTclese2

      Damn, they fucked you over solid. Yeesh!

  • Peter

    I recall well, even back in the late sixties, some form or green on white, which stated that Ron could no longer be chitted, a form of KR. In other words, he was immune from hearing about, or responding to, any errors or out tech/ethics things he’d done or said. I remember thinking, “the beginning of the end”. Shortly thereafter, Mary Sue could not be chitted. Then Jane Kember (GdnWW), her staff, etc.

    • richelieu jr

      Mary Sue got chitted, all right… So did Ron, in the end…

      • Missionary Kid

        No chit. Sorry, I couldn’t resist.

      • HeatherGraceful

        Davey is scared chitless.

        • Missionary Kid

          Hiding out like he is, I’d say he is.

      • joan nieman

        Yes, “chitted” taking off the c and replacing it with an s.

  • Simi Valley

    I remember one time when I had been in the cult around 5 or 6 years and I suddenly twigged that I had committed some infraction or other (can’t remember the details but it had something to do with a course I had taken). I was mortified at the realization that I would have to write a KR on myself, which I did. And I actually mailed it in to the org.

    • Simi Valley

      I think I remember now … I was taking a CONFIDENTIAL pilot course on dissemination and I said something about it to someone.

      • PlainOld Thetan

        Simi: Don’t forget that if you find that you’re PTS, you have to write a KR on yourself about it. Failure to do so makes you an accessory to the act and buys you the same penalty as…wait…I’m feeling spinny right about now…

  • Simi Valley

    Additionally, when you are on the OT levels and you do fail to observe the security regulations 100%, you have to turn yourself in. “Out-security” is a HUGE deal. (E.g., taking your locked briefcase somewhere and then discovering that it wasn’t really locked or only partially locked, etc.)

    • HeatherGraceful

      Yes, recall Rex Fowler, who was “out-security” when he committed murder and allowed his OTVII materials to fall into the hands of the police!

      • Andrew Robertson

        I recall his wife trying to ‘Tone 40’ the police who didn’t comprehend that she was a big being and far superior to them:
        …………………………………………………………………………………………….
        When detectives asked Janet Fowler to speak with them, she had an urgent concern as her husband lay fighting for his life in the intensive care unit.

        “Janet Fowler quickly demanded the briefcase” containing information about Scientology that detectives had removed from his office, the arrest affidavit stated.

        “One thing I need is his briefcase,” Janet Fowler told detectives, according to the court record. “It was taken out of his office. It is important to me, my church, and it is religious material and I want it now!”

        Rex Fowler had left a note dated the day of the shooting instructing whoever found it to “please give the briefcase to Jan.” Another note, found on Fowler’s work desk along with several keys, explained to “Jan” what each key unlocked.

        Detective Gene Claps explained to Janet Fowler that investigators needed to review the briefcase contents.

        “Even if you looked at it and read it, you would not understand anything in it,” the wife replied, the arrest affidavit stated. “Because it is way above a normal person and you would not know what it meant.”

        “Janet Fowler then demanded the briefcase be returned again, by saying, ‘I want it back now, right now!’
        …………………………………………………………………………………………….

        http://www.thedenverchannel.com/news/man-s-scientology-faith-ripples-through-adco-murder-probe

        Andrew

        • OrangySky

          That’s just so OT of her.

        • Drat

          She was right about the “normal person” bit… although not quite the way she meant it.

        • Observer

          This part of the Rex Fowler saga made me happy at the time, and I still immensely enjoy the fact that Janet Fowler found out wog law did indeed trump her “church’s” demands and there was nothing she could do about it.

      • OrangySky

        Apparently the murder part was minor compared to the security breach.

    • DamOTclese2

      How ironic, also, since now almost everything the crooks sold looks at is public domain. Well, available on the Internet, any way. 🙂

  • EnthralledObserver

    I have this cultish urge to file a KR on Davey Makemerich… because, well, he’s the only bastards name I know in current cult management.

    • EnthralledObserver

      It totally sucks when poor Davey has to do EVERYTHING himself – literally. And everyone knows it, as he’s the only one left doing anything.

      • richelieu jr

        Well, you know the truism: If something is worth fucking up right, it’s worth fucking up yourself.

      • Missionary Kid

        He is the only one doing everything, and, thank goodness, he’s fucking himself and the organization so people are leaving. My slogan is, Keep Davy at the “Helm.” He’s taking Co$ on to the rocks.

        • joan nieman

          Like a certain Italian captain of a certain cruise ship.

          • Missionary Kid

            Who, I believe, is ending up in jail. Good one.

  • Simi Valley

    Another type of knowledge report is the “session KR” … when you are getting a sec check and anything you say is actionable by the Ethics Department … your auditor must write up anything you have told in your session and send it to Ethics. Then you have to see the Ethics Officer and face the music.

    • NOLAGirl

      Simi, you seem like a kick ass chick…I’ve watched your vids and I wonder…Did you get in trouble a lot or did you keep quiet and avoid it??

      • Simi Valley

        Hey, thanks … I didn’t intentionally go around trying to cause trouble, but once you join staff or join the Sea Org or get onto the OT levels, you can’t avoid getting in deep shit, because that’s how the cult works. The further down the rabbit hole you go, the more shit you pull in, like it or not.

        • NOLAGirl

          The words unreal, wow, and holy shit come to mind. LOL But I’ll just repeat what I said below…I’m so very, very glad you’re out. 🙂

          • Simi Valley

            Once you’re brainwashed into believing that your eternity is at stake, all bets are off as far as living a “normal” life goes.

            • Patient Nurse

              Hi Simi. I remember you well from ASHO in the 80’s. Heard your name at roll call by Dick-O ! Such a nice guy, hope he is out but doubt it. I am so glad you are out – and glad for all of us out. You were a really nice lady back then as I know you are now. Love your comments! So happy we are done with that nut-house.

            • Simi Valley

              Ditto, thanks! Yes, DickO was a sweetheart back in the day. I was in his courseroom at AOLA about 5 years ago and there was a layer of hardness to him that I had never seen before. Staff were being trained to have vicious, mad-dog demeanor and it was surprising how kindhearted DickO still was around 2009.

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              Simi, have you posted your IRL name elsewhere? ASHO as public or staff?

            • Simi Valley

              Not sure I understand the question.

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              Oh, wondering if you were staff or public when at ASHO. and also if you had come out with your real name, since this commentor said she knew you.
              Dick O would have to be Dick Orchirch, Foundation Sup. Dick C was Coanda and Day staff. Not sure what happened to Orchirch.

            • Simi Valley

              Simi Valley IS my “real name” even though it is also the name of a suburb of LA.

              DickO’s last name is “Orciuch” and only now from your comment do I understand the “O” business – to distinguish him from Dick Coanda.

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              I very much remember those that stayed after getting run through the full ethics breakdown machine. Scared the hell out of me. It was so Stepford Wives, only they came out snarling, not smiling. It also served as another insidious control mechanism. You didn’t want to write up a KR on any executive that was somewhat sane and compassionate. You Knew what would happen. And the higher their level, like the CO’s, the more a target they were.

              I try to explain now and then that any one in the upper strata of management in scientology that stays in that strata for any length of time, even 6 months, is either mentally and spiritually broken into slave mode or is a natural born sadist. Anyone who is in that strata for over a year is 100% guaranteed to be in one of the two categories. One year in the Sea Org equals about 5 not in the Sea Org so 6 months is a long duration.

            • Simi Valley

              I’m so glad I was thrown out on my ass after only 1.5 years in the SO.

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              Yes indeedy. You must have been there shortly after I left staff. Glad they did too!

            • I miss my children

              DickO was my BC sup when I was there in late ’90s. Mark Hamilton was also part of the ASHO Day Staff (pro metering lead sup) who might know more about DickO now. Mark, along with his top exec wife, Linda, left the building when selling basics got to be too much. DickO and Mark were two of the best individuals I have known in life.

            • Simi Valley

              Mark’s wife is Lisa Hamilton. They’re out now and doing well.

        • Pepsicat

          That is so true Simi. I heard Amy Scobee say it best when she said when you first get involved and walk into this building, everyone is smiling, everyone is having fun and everything is beautiful. But the deeper you go into this building, the more insidious it becomes, occupying your entire life, pulling you in even faster. The more get involved in Scion, the more they expect of you.

          • Simi Valley

            Yes, there’s plenty of “love bombing” when you’re a noob. And it gets darker and more complicated the longer you stay in. When I signed up for a course or two, I didn’t think I was bargaining for something that would take over my whole life, but that is exactly what I got. The cult wraps its tentacles tighter and tighter around you the longer you are in.

        • TheHoleDoesNotExist

          Definitely one of my top 10 wake up flags. I was Sea Org and top of the bridge at that time. I was privy to what was being said about the OT’s in the field (public) and plans to get them to do more as they Should be doing. The fact was that it was getting hard and harder to retain staff and recruitment was near impossible. OT’s were included in whatever the blanket heavy ethics campaigns were going on at the time as well.

          This was 100% opposite of everything I had read. It was also one of the perks I was looking forward to very much. In fact I felt I was more responsible than ever before and more aware and more productive than ever. In sci terms it was a major invalidation of the OT levels. Since I traveled I knew many if not most of the OT’s as well as the org main execs. That’s when I began to at least realize management was off their rockers and not very smart. I knew the OT’s would walk and they did.

          • TheHoleDoesNotExist

            The OT’s that stayed (in the 80’s) and their children and grandchildren make up the majority of scientologists left today. I read an article about religious fanaticism being approached by psychiatric diagnosis to now include all aspects and problems in a patients life for better treatment outcomes.

            If you’ve read any of the Facebook comments on Black Rob’s WWP thread, you might notice those that seem to relish this Knowledge Report activity. They get off on it. It is a huge tell on both personality as well as the disorder. The original OT’s in their family have had their wins and powers invalidated over and over, the same benefits they claim to value so dearly. Obviously it is Not what they value at all!

            So what IS it that keeps them coming back for more? Activities like Knowledge Reports. No, really. They Know the person addressed is going to suffer whether emotionally, socially or financially and likely all three. When you hear them spout their wins and success stories, know that they do this only for protection.

            They are drawing a card from the Get Out of Ethics Free pile in the sadistic little Scientopoly game they are playing. Now you know what board it is that David Miscavige is Chairman of. Pardon my dangling participle.

            http://i.imgur.com/g3c8pVos.jpg

            • OrangySky

              I got chills from reading this, Hole.

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              Me too!

          • Ruby

            Agree with this completely. The further up you go and do, the worse it got. When I finally left staff, I thought it would be better, being just a public person. NO. I was always reminded that since I used to be staff, I “knew the game”, so had the same expectations put on me as the ones while I was on staff. A tours registrar came into town one time, and upon failing to reg me for anything, submitted a knowledge report about how I hung out with many non scientology friends, therefore someone needed to investigate me for out ethics. True experience. That was a moment I knew without a doubt that I was heading out the door. I didn’t even want to respond or care about trying to get that removed from my “oh so scary” ethics file.
            (Hole, it sounds like we probably have met at some point in time, or at least know a lot of the same people. So glad you are here.)

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              Thank goodness I rarely wrote up those reports. I think when I did it was because it was due to someone making it hard for me to do my job and talking wasn’t helping and the senior at the time was a dufus. I felt bad about it and the person never let me forget it. I realize now that person was a narcissistic twit. She is not staff anymore, and yet after all these decades, spends her time on OT committees and writing up Knowledge Reports. Feel bad for her but glad for me. I probably did meet you no doubt.

            • Good Fella

              Hey Ruby, that’s how I feel about THDNE. When I read what he/she wrote, there’s a resonance in my memory of similar things I’ve experienced. Wish we could get together.

              Is there a safe way to make contact? I have a hushmail account.

      • Simi Valley

        Also, once you stick around and continue in the cult, the pressure mounts to join staff or the Sea Org or do this or do that (especially to “donate” more and more). So it’s unavoidable that you will get in deeper and deeper shit. When I was still pretty newly in, the reg at the NY org was pressuring me to buy more auditing. I was living in Manhattan which was pretty expensive although not impossibly expensive like it is today. The reg would tell people to cut her a check instead of using the money to pay the rent and then just “avoid the landlord.”

        • chukicita

          Sweet baby Xenu. I wonder how many ex-Scns struggle to overcome poor credit from their time in?

          • Simi Valley

            If you mean credit reports, probably a lot. I just passed the 10-year mark on my Chapter 7 filing last month. I remember one time in the mid-90s when I was on the OT Committee in LA, one of the OT 8 members (whose husband was also on OT 7) told me that together they had about 85 G’s in debt. I had way more than that when I filed Chapter 7.

            • richelieu jr

              Just another way the Scientology doesn’t just steal from members. See also: Free healthcare; abortions…

            • chukicita

              Seriously?!
              First, congratulations on getting your credit act together, despite it all. I wouldn’t be surprised if the kind of high-sales pressures that are written policy in Scn, Inc. lead to financial ruin for a high percentage of adherents. That’s not merely unfortunate and sad, it’s illustrative of the negative impact that Scn, Inc spirals upon individuals and communities. Certainly not ‘improving lives’ like they claim.

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              This is why DM is desperately wholesaling declares right now. He is frantic about any whales leaving and trying to blot out the sun. The whales act like personal loan officers once the others, the majority, are bankrupt or can’t get a 3rd mortgage and cards are all maxed out. It wasn’t always like this.

              The reason it is like this now is another piece of evidence of how the paying customer numbers have plummeted in the last ten years alongside only drips of new bait. DM even deputized every single member, staff and public, as mini me sales vultures. He also made staff salesmen first, then whatever their other position was, second.

              And as I mentioned in another post, these are veteran members and their families who are doing this to pay for the same services and products over and over. Each evolution equates to complete denigration of their gains. They don’t care about their gains. They are Not there for the bridge but for something else entirely. It is a sado masochistic role playing game now. Those left get off on writing each other up to get them in trouble which means more debt no matter what else ethics requires.

              It’s a festival of pain and they keep coming back again because they know that they can count on Miscavige to dish. Why do you think they sound like they’re having orgasms when they sing his praises? Because they are.

            • Missionary Kid

              “It’s a festival of pain” just went on the list of Things Said about $cientology.

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              Ripped that off another long ago folk songstress but I don’t remember the name. It just fits.

              “I can always count on you, to come up with something new
              Long about the time I think you’ve done all you can do to me
              You start it up again and I keep comin’ back again
              ‘Cause I know that I can always count on you.
              For some….

              Brand new humiliation
              Some well thought and novel degradation
              You’re a festival of pain and I keep comin’ back again
              ‘Cause I know that I can always count on you.”

            • Missionary Kid

              Wow! Talk about a toxic relationship filled with pain. I tried Hearsaying it, and that turned out to be a rabbit hole.

            • Observer

              ..

            • joan nieman

              Oh OBS! That is awesome….great shoop, as always!

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              Oooh, missed that one. Says it all.

            • Simi Valley

              There was a framed plaque hanging on the wall in the reg area at AOLA with some Hubbard quote declaring how the OT levels are incomparably more valuable than physical universe assets and transcend time itself, all put there, of course, to make sure the culties loosened up their wallets.

            • chukicita

              Daaaang! Why, then, if the OT levels are so valuable, does Scn, inc. put so much of its resources into and boast incessantly about MEST-y stuff like square footage, Ideal Orgs and number of properties owned? Oh, I know, there is no real answer to that. Just glad you’re out, Simi.

            • Simi Valley

              Thanks … the whole MEST thing was Miscavige’s baby; Hubbard only talked about having clean and neat quarters that wouldn’t repel people – nothing posh.

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              This is correct. The reason Miscavige gets by with his scam even though he has virtually stripped all the scam filters off is that he knows his target customer base. He knows them very well. They are Not staying in the game for spiritual enlightenment. They are there for the abuse. Okay, and the oiliness table. But remember what’s on that same floor? That’s right, the PAIN machine.

        • Observer

          Scientology “ethics” at its finest!

    • OrangySky

      Gee, in Catholic confession, you only get more Hail Marys for added sins.

      • joan nieman

        Lol!

  • NOLAGirl

    That’s scary. To never know who may turn you in for what, that must be an incredibly tense way to live. As a “never-in” this is one part of Co$ that has always fascinated me but has always been very hard for me to grasp. I appreciate the stories of the ex-members that help me understand how this becomes normal behavior. And to each of you, I’m SO GLAD you’re out.

    • joan nieman

      Well, I can tell you truthfully, that I would be hauled into Ethics all the time if I had been there.

  • Douglas D. Douglas

    I find the name “Knowledge Report” chilling for another reason, as well. Is it possible to truly “know” what another person’s motive is, or what they are thinking? Do members high up on the OT levels use their “superior” abilities to write up people who have no visibly discernible crimes?

    • Simi Valley

      I have not personally experienced that, but I wouldn’t be surprised at anything that goes on.

    • Bella Legosi

      The whole thing is recommencement of the paranoia/ratting culture that pervaded Nazi Germany IMO. I find it sicking that this tactic is used in a so called “religion”. It is also a form of punishment too. This has to break down trust with-in the group. What religion’s policys inspire a culture where you fear your fellow adherents and have to choose words carefully; for those words may land you in further punishments? I can’t think of any!
      $cientology; The religion where you trust no one!

      • Eclipse-girl

        I consider it a hallmark of fascism.

      • ze moo

        All part of the thought stopping con that Lron crafted.

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      No. But if you read what is considered fodder for a report in the Ethics book, labeled from Misdemeanors to High Crimes, you will find that sneezing at the wrong time and wrong place is enough to garner one. When I looked back at this list years later, I realized the only real crime was being human. Scientology is all about becoming non human. Because that “higher” state comes with such a high price in terms of money, time and sacrific, it must be desirable, right?

      Being human is The crime in Scientology. If you keep that in mind when trying to analyze the thinking process and life activities of a scientologist, keep that fact in mind and you will understand the incomprehensible.

  • My name is Larry Lester

    I got KR’D for doing a clay demo slightly off policy (hate to use their lingo). Though the woman who wrote it was hot so I really didnt mind. We spoke at coffee the same day as if nothing had happened.

    • Simi Valley

      One time in the late 70’s a staff member KR’ed me for incorrectly passing someone on a star-rate checkout when I should have flunked the person. That same staff member also asked me out.

      • Observer

        And then there’s Tommy Davis, who married his sec checker.

        It’s just so bizarre. Maybe knowing someone’s secrets gives some people the illusion of intimacy rather than a sense of violation.

        • richelieu jr

          Or he thinks his wife can’t testify against him…

          More likely:
          Listen, if you don’t tell Davey on my we can get married and I’m make you very rich!
          But you just told me you have a very tiny penis and can only get hard if a short man pokes you in the chest,and screams letters at you, what was it? YSCO–!
          OH, baby! You know me so well! We can rent one! Be mine!

        • Simi Valley

          The “sense of violation” only happens once you leave the cult. While inside, it’s “normal” to have your every thought and deed policed and boundaries of privacy erased. Culties do not realize the spiritual rape they are subjected to in the cult — it “feels” normal. The policy called “Student’s Guide to Acceptable Behavior” mandates getting off all your known withholds. Then you are prohibited from engaging in any kind of health “practice” while on course without letting the Case Supervisor know. On and on.

        • joan nieman

          OMG! A marriage made from heaven….not!

        • TheHoleDoesNotExist

          Look at his mother’s personality and character. No surprise to me that he would marry his sec checker. Even in scientology, this was an abhorrent thought.

      • OrangySky

        It’s like in kindergarten, when the boys pulled the hair of the girls they secretly liked. 😉

      • joan nieman

        I hope you told him where to go Simi!

        • Simi Valley

          Creepily enough, I met up with this guy a couple of decades later and he still had the hots for me. I actually did go out with him once and he was so nervous that I had to try hard to keep from laughing my ass off. It might have been cute for a 14-year old boy to be shaking like a leaf while eating his salad, but this was a middle aged man. I had a horrible time with him and then had a hard time getting him to stop trying to ask me out again.

          • Missionary Kid

            I maintain that Co$ basically retards the emotional growth of many people. This sounds like a good illustration. He never matured, emotionally.

            • Simi Valley

              Totally true. Neither have I.

            • Missionary Kid

              Perhaps that’s why it can be painful for people who are “out.” They have a lot of catching up to do emotionally, as well as learning to reorient themselves to a different life.

              Freedom from a rigid environment brings with it many choices. Once out of the Marines and back in college, late one day, I caught myself thinking that I had to go home and fix myself something to eat, but it would be much easier if I were still in. I could just go to the chow hall.

              At that point I realized what I was thinking, and that I’d also be subject to inspections, reveille, and all sorts of bullshit. My thoughts quickly changed. I went home and enjoyed fixing my dinner.

            • Dylan

              hey I resemble that remark! watch your ass or I’ll write a KR on you.

            • Missionary Kid

              Go ahead. Make my day! 😉

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              It even causes a regression in emotional growth. The ones born into it or entered in at a young age one for one have retarded growth but adults regress. I have stated before that it was somewhere between the ages of 12 to 14 that Hubbard began to manifest a full menu of both emotional and mental symptoms and also physical problems disorders.

              It is no coincidence that the average emotional level of scientologists can be pegged at around 14.

            • Missionary Kid

              That is definitely food for thought. It also applies to Tommy Davis and to David Mi$cavige, and goes far to explain his actions. He’s acting like a 14 year old with a lot of power. I called him a Baby Huey, but your description fits him pervectly.

              Co$ really is jr. high on steroids.

  • Douglas D. Douglas

    I have a very full day ahead– and none of it involves writing up KRs, thank goodness! Have a great day here in the Bunker. See you in a thousand comments or so.

    • EnthralledObserver

      Ditto, ‘cept mine is a busy night of sleep…
      G’night peeps!

  • HeatherGraceful

    I would pay good money for a poster of that David Miscavige “Obey” graphic! Jefferson? 🙂

    • chukicita

      He kindly posted it for me in a previous comments section, I think last month. I’d like to see him put it on CafePress or something. I’d buy a T-shirt or poster, for sure!

      • Pepsicat

        I’d buy a stencil of it!

      • HeatherGraceful

        I really like the concrete background too.

  • Andrew Robertson

    Writing a KR on David Miscavige would be a ‘High Crime’. A ‘Straight Up and Vertical Crime’ would be to write a Suppressive Person Declare on him as Jon Randall McDonald did in 1996:

    http://www.scientology-cult.com/1996-sp-declare-on-david-miscavige.html

    TO: INTERNATIONAL JUSTICE CHIEF 7 March 1996
    FROM: JON RANDALL MCDONALD

    cc: C.O.B. RTC President, CSI CO BPI
    President, RTC CO OSA Int CO GOLD
    Inspectors General RTC CO CMO Int EDs
    ED International IAS Directors LRH Comms
    LRH Comm Int Senior C/S Int KOTs
    AVC TCO OSA Int Reports Officer, RTC

    NOTE: Although this report is specifically on David Miscavige,
    it also addresses the involvement of accomplices. If you are on
    the above routing, you might or might not be considered, in the
    eyes of the law, as an accomplice or accessory to the felony
    crimes described herein, and it is therefore advised that you
    read this report carefully and take whatever steps you deem
    necessary to put your own house in order for whatever may ensue.

    David Miscavige
    Chairman of the Board, Religious Technology Center

    HIGH CRIME REPORT
    SUPPRESSIVE PERSON DECLARE
    …………………………………………………………………………….

    On and on it goes in immaculate Scientologize concluding with:

    This report is submitted in gratitude to L. Ron Hubbard on the
    occasion of his birthday.

    What a thoughtful birthday present to a dead person!

    Andrew

    • Scream Nevermore

      It would be awful if people cut and pasted that into the online ‘e-form’…

    • Suzy

      It’s a good read!
      “he in fact has arranged things so that Operating Thetans now must report in
      annually to a suppressive group and provide this group with
      information about their identity, their whereabouts, their means of
      livelihood, their income, their relatives, etc. If they don’t report
      in, they are debarred from further progress on the Bridge”

  • Mark

    If there was ever a sudden outbreak of real ethics at Bridge/New Era Publications, it might look something like this (refresh):

  • Yep, good ol’ KRs. I think they served another function: to let staff members vent on each other and blow off some steam about how shitty their own lives were. Not very healthy but you could tell by the vituperation in some KRs that the writer was not a happy camper.

    • Anonymous

      Agreed…it was Hubbard’s version of ….”look over there….a criminal!”

  • Observer

    Those who would have a tendency to wreak havoc or loaf don’t dare. And the group becomes easy to live with and work with.

    But hell to live in.

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      and don’t forget The Loafers. I was an SP all day yesterday loafing in my loafers, ordering take out, staking out my position as couch potato queen, where I ruled by TV remote and cellphone to order my movies and my slaves to deliver lazy wings and nachos to my very door. A real horror of a day.

      • Observer

        The horror! THE HORROR!

      • Robert Eckert

        You wore loafers? I haven’t bothered on putting shoes of any kind.

      • Good Fella

        I always thought you to be an autocratic bastard. I bet you sneeze without covering your mouth too.

        Well, that should get me a hefty a KR.

  • richelieu jr

    The Bronzed Pair of Ultimate Brass Balls go to John Atack for saying he was PTS to LRH!

  • InterestedObserver12

    I once stopped into a bar on the way home from a gig. The bartender and I were both on day staff. I had a beer and headed home. Next morning the EO pulled me into her office. It seems some girl at the bar left around the same time I did and the bartender KR’d me for picking her up (I was married at the time). In fact, I had no idea who the bartender, Dave Petersen, was talking about, but I’ve always assumed he was putting the moves on whomever it was he accused me of scoring with. When I told my side of the story to the EO and passed a meter check, she had me write up a False Report Report on Dave and happily started a new investigation. Around and around, hamsters run inside their wheels.

    • joan nieman

      That is pretty bad, Interested! Being accused for something you didn’t do! Who has the f——–g right to point his finger at someone anyway? No body does! It’s like ” those of you who did not sin, throw the first rock”.

      • joan nieman

        Oos! I mean stone.

        • joan nieman

          I mean Oops!

          • Good Fella

            Joan you’re a mess. 😉

            • joan nieman

              Am I ever!

  • Racnad

    “The single most notable difference between an upstat, easy-to-live-and-work-with group and a downstat, hard-to-live-and-work-with group is that the individual group members themselves enforce the action and mores of the group.” Sounds reasonable but think about it – groups that enforce their mores are more often arbitrary and capricious. Easy-to-live-and-work-with groups usually deal with this by not accepting people who don’t fit or by expelling offenders – such as by firing. Easy-to-live-and-work-with groups also tolerate a reasonable amount of disagreement & dissent. Is it not common knowledge that turning in coworkers and neighbors for minor infractions is common in fascist & communist countries? I’m shocked that Americans take to this so easily….

    • Missionary Kid

      Someone from any culture will take take to this easily because the conditioning is so thorough. People want to belong, and to be seen as exemplary, so they go along.

      • chukicita

        The conditioning does seem thorough, but I don’t think Scientology can align with any culture. It can only align with Hubbard.
        Just as a small example, Hubbard’s white-guy-from-the-50s attitudes toward women and animals that permeates even Dianetics are distasteful and alien to many. The individuation mantra “if it’s true for you, then it’s true” isn’t really compatible with non-Western cultures.

        • Missionary Kid

          The relativistic aspect is, but you’re right about the individuation. That’s one of the reasons I maintain that Co$ won’t do well in other cultures.

    • MaxSpaceman

      ‘mericans wouldn’t if ’twere political.
      But since ’tis for their “spiritual eternity” they will completely forget themselves and do whatever is asked of them.

    • richelieu jr

      It is indeed shocking that a totalitarian, Stalilinian system is allowed to freely exist in the States…

      Then again, if you attach ‘religion’ or ‘guns’ to any issue, you’ve pretty much got have the population marching in lock-step with you… Hubbard knew this and was always trying to kiss up to fascist elements with his late-to-the-game anti-communism and ‘anti-drug’ campaigns…

      • Missionary Kid

        Amen.

    • kemist

      Or is it?

      In the same time this scam was getting built, americans were cheerfully ratting one another out as communists.

      Now they are encouraged to do the same thing with terrorists, and a surprisingly high fraction of them accept to be spied on 24/7 in the name of safety. Because of something that has killed less than half the amount who die each year because of their obsession with guns.

      The authoritarian mindset is part of the human mind and no constitution or nice words about freedom will keep it away. Fortunately there are always people who will speak out against it, and as long as we don’t stand there doing nothing when they are carried away, there is hope.

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        Hubbard had a brief job as a cable sensor in his military background. There are bits and pieces of military rules and traditions from the 40’s he transferred to scientology management guides and ethics protocol.

        It was his sociopathic way of getting for each time he was canned from his position by his seniors, job after job and then finally booted out. Those “Boots in the Sky” he preached about and rambling on about how he was the only one responsible? Just another one of his Freudian slips.
        http://www.gerryarmstrong.org/50k/legal/a1/2517.php

    • chukicita

      A group is only “easy” to live and work with as much as everyone thinks the same.

    • Anonymous

      Hubbard’s nonsense about “the group” enforcing mores being the ideal flies directly into the face of the well documented history of what happens when there is “group” justice, versus an actual rule of law.

      What Hubbard wanted was a tyranny, with him at the top. And that is what he developed with his absurd policies and church.

      Miscavige is now the tyrant. He has consolidated the worst aspects of all of Hubbard’s tripe into something so awful that it has been able to hide in plain sight because everyday people find it impossible to believe that an organization so horrible could exist.

      • Racnad

        Think “Lord of the Flies”

  • Imelda Marcos

    I’m thinking of the movie Lives of Others, about East Germany’s Stasi and the widespread snitching network (as portrayed in the film)? http://www.moviemaze.de/media/trailer/2622,das-leben-der-anderen.html Does anyone know if Scientology ordered anyone’s home to be wired, as is portrayed in the film, with terrible results?

    • richelieu jr

      Just imagine if they ever ‘cleared the planet’…

      • Imelda Marcos

        We’d all be fcked.

      • Drat

        Quite a few of us here would be disposed of quietly and without sorrow. The rest and family would be sent to a gulag.

      • ze moo

        Very few people would join or permit any system like this to take hold of their political life. Any attempt to impose it would result in laughter. The clams simply don’t have the numbers and influence to attempt anything more then tutoring fraud from applied scholastics. You just have to keep aware of the little ways they try to make money and weasel into public life.

        Then again, I see that 1 in 3 americans don’t believe in evolution and I despair just a little.

        • WG

          Search for ‘if you see something, say something’ and look at the images. KR’s are making a comeback!

          • ze moo

            The ‘terrorists are everywhere’ has become an overused meme, but one that still has traction. Many people do want to make a better community, but get sucked into ‘anonymous info to the tip line’ on any neighbor. Authorities like and encourage this as an electorate busy watching each other is too busy to watch them.

            • WG

              Nobody ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the American public. 😉

      • sugarplumfairy

        They can’t even clear an org..

    • OrangySky

      Just saw “The Book Thief” the other day – which didn’t depict it as viscerally as some films but showed the cruelty instilled in the Hitler Youth to spy on and report their peers. And the vile punishment inflicted on anyone who dared question authority or even show a little humanity toward the persecuted.

    • chukicita

      I remember discussion from some years back about rooms at the Ft. Harrison being bugged. It would surprise me if they were not.
      Perhaps someone who was in could comment on the practice of ‘listening in’ on auditing sessions?

      • Observer

        Aside from the bedbugs, you mean?

      • pluvo

        Marc Headley is describing it in his book ”Blown for Good”, chapter 17 “Monument”.

      • Davka

        Without looking at the FL law, recording is generally illegal without consent (unless you are law enforcement, with some restrictions), either they are getting public to consent to it when they check in, or well, they are violating the law.

    • grundoon

      Scientology PIs installed video cameras to spy on the Rathbun and Rinder families from next door and across the street. Even some infrared night vision cameras so they could keep spying all night.

  • Sherbet

    This may be a dumb question, but are these rules for all staff or just SO? Or are staff generally SO?

    • Observer

      They’re for all Scientologists, public, staff, SO or otherwise. Davey doesn’t have to write them, of course, because he’s judge, jury and excecutioner.

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        Staff have additional rules and blinders. The Sea Org has Flag Orders so there are more lines to cross. It doesn’t really matter. On staff, it’s how much money you directly bring in or how much you you helped those that do. On public lines, its how much money you directly contribute or get others to do so.

        It’s almost like it’s all about the money.

        • Observer

          That’s a terrible thing to say about The Most Ethical People on the Planet!

        • Interested

          No….. Really?…. About the money. Nah!!!!! Face palm. (Do you know how hard it is to do exclamation marks on an iPad!)

  • Ms. B. Haven

    Jeff Hawkins nails it once again. For those who were once ‘in’, this will make perfect sense because you lived this way. Always walking on eggshells, always alert for ‘outness’ and ready to write something up so you wouldn’t be perceived as an accessory to whatever special ‘crime’ was occurring.

    I would like to address this to lurkers or ‘never-ins’. You can read the words psoted here and think, “oh boy, that sounds bad” but just take a few moments and put yourself in that situation and try to get an idea of what it FEELS like. I don’t know how to convey how brutally corrosive this stuff is to someone who has never experienced it. All I can say is that it is just a fucked up way to have to live.

    “Why didn’t you just leave, you didn’t HAVE to live that way”. True enough. For someone who was never-in, this is the logical way to think about it, but I would posit that you don’t understand the mechanisms of mind-control. The closest thing I can come up with for a ‘never-in’ to help them understand is to compare this situation to being stuck in a job you hate but have to have because of desperate economic times. Your job sucks in all aspects, your co-workers are some evil backstabbing bastards that will do anything to make you look bad and make themselves look good. Your boss is a criminal and the company has a bad reputation that you don’t want to be associated with. Try to imagine being in these dire straits and having your every move monitored by everyone else around you. You can’t even go home at night and tell your spouse what is going on at work because they would be obligated to report you. You don’t dare have a negative thought because of the company policy to have a lie detector test periodically. Those of us who were ‘in’, were in these same dire straits mentally. We had convinced ourselves that scientology was a way to solve whatever problem we felt we had that got us in in the first place. I believe that someone will stay in to the degree that they perceive these problems are causing their lives to be ruined. Once someone realizes that scientology is not solving that problem they will be able to start looking and head for the exits. KRs and all ‘ethics tech’ is there to keep people from looking at scientology’s failure to solve their problems. If scientology worked there would be no need for ‘ethics’. In fact if it worked, the only need for policing would be to keep order at the entry doors because of the stampede trying to get in. If scientology did a fraction of what they claimed to be able do, the public would bust down the doors demanding services. There would be no regs, no ethics officers. Any suppressive bastards talking trash about scientology would be lynched. For lunkers, go to your nearest Ideal Org and see what you see.

    • Missionary Kid

      Perfectly stated. Thank you.

    • chukicita

      If it really worked, no one would care about ‘suppressive bastards talking trash.’ They’d just be ignored, because they wouldn’t be a threat. It would be possible to redirect all of the resources Scn, Inc. pours into litigation, Fair Game, quashing free speech, etc., into projects that truly help people.

    • MaxSpaceman

      “You can’t even go home at night and tell your spouse what is going on at work because they would be obligated to report you.”

      what a chirch of fear it is.

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        Church of Fear? Hey, someone should write a book!

  • BosonStark

    An interesting thing to know from Leah Remini, would be when she wrote that Knowledge Report on Miscavige, did she expect the system to function, and for it to be dealt with by other executives whom she perceived as having some kind of collective power enough to help Shelly or discipline Miscavige? Or, was it her act or rebellion and disgust, for feeling humiliated at the wedding.

    • OrangySky

      I wonder if she still thought there was an actual “Watchdog Committee” or “Board of Directors” who could discipline him by majority rule!

      I never use this acronym but it feels appropriate here: ROFLMAO!

      • BosonStark

        Although Leah was in the Sea Org for a year, she was just a kid then, and I think many of the public clams don’t have much of a conception of the elaborate structure and various functions performed by Sea Org members or their 100 hour workweeks, with David Miscavige having such singular control over everything of importance.

        Instead, they prefer to see them as happy land sailors dedicated to planetary clearing, with David Miscavige more as a master of ceremonies to remind them of their civilization-building, planetary-clearing importance in everything Sciloontology does in bringing “the tech” (and the way to happiness too, and probably II) to this clueless world of ours.

        • TheHoleDoesNotExist

          Here’s the real treachery in the system: You don’t find out about what and who to trust other than the hard way. No one can tell you or warn you. If someone does, that person will be labelled PTS or SP and then you have to disregard. The real experience inside is 99% are only speaking of how wonderful everything is and only 1 or 2 are squawking.

          There is a hierarchy embedded in the ethics system of Knowledge Reports. By the time you get to send your reports to those on high, you have been knocked around and penalized by each person on each rung of the ladder. Few dare get to the top. When they do and find out that either the person isn’t really there on that post and you get no answer or someone answers you with an unjust hauling your ass into sec check hell.

          Scientologists believe in the justice system they read about in the books. Once they get to the very top and find out what happens or that no one is really on post, that is another major wake up factor. It hits the person as a traumatic shock though.

    • Once_Born

      She seems to have carefully prepared for her exit from Scientology, in order to minimise the effect of the disconnection and fair gaming that the {church} would likely use against her.

      I would interpret the KR as a “come and get me, if you think you’re big enough” gesture of defiance – and a warning that she would not submit to harassment, intended to deter them from doing so.

      Filing a missing person report suggest she had no faith in the system.

      Still… it would be good to see her account published.

      • BosonStark

        I believe there were several years between the time she filed the KR, and the missing person’s report though.

  • Suzy

    What a horrible, frightening, cruel way to spend one’s life, and believing there is no way out. This is why we are here, to expose the sick and twisted machine to the light of day so people can be free from this trap. Thank you, Mr. Hawkins, for painting such a clear picture of the Knowledge Report process and mindset.

  • DamOTclese2

    Fascinating, and this is why David Miscavige has been permitted to “squirrel the tech” so profoundly to the point where little remains of what Hubbard actually wrote without David’s changes to it all. Every time someone files a KR about David’s alterations, it’s “report to ethics” and “sec checks” and then finally expulsion, all because David is the worse SP according to what Hubbard wrote — thus the irony.

  • Dylan

    KR’s now we are getting into the meat of being in the Sea org. I hated KR’s getting and writing them. When a mission ( situation handling) would show up at an org. One of the first actions was to have the whole org take their study time. Instead of studying we were told to write reports on all the others in our org. this would go on for days and even weeks. 12.5 hrs a week writting up KR’s on the people that you work with day in and day out.

    you can’t just say hay I got nothing. you have to come up with things. this justifies the “WHY.” looking back now it was crazy. With all the policy, advices, and orders of the day. there is always something that is being violated. When that does not work people would make up stuff to stay out of trouble. One person would be isolated as the one who was destroying everything. then things would go back to “normal.”

    the big thing that I remember growing up and getting scientology ethics forced down my throat starting at 11yo. was the explanation of MOrals vs Ethics. It made it sound like people could not keep a set of morals and manage it based on their beliefs. they we lucky to have (scientology) ethics to keep them on the str8 and narrow.

    • PlainOld Thetan

      When I was auditing at ASHO on the SHSBC, I was horrified when my pc told me that “Wednesday is my day to write KRs”. Apparently she wrote so many KRs that she had to set aside Wednesday afternoon EVERY WEEK to write KRs on people. Shudder!

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        There used to be a semblance of justice where Comm Ev’s (Committees of Evidence) were issued. However, the only reason was the people who were staff were sane and reasonable. There are fewer and fewer of this type inside today. There is no such thing as justice seen inside the walls for some time and I think I nailed it when I said the day that died out was the day members were allowed to buy their way out of ethics. Some have spoken up since then that this is exactly what helped them catapult out the door.

        • Good Fella

          I did that and out the door and onto the internet I went, in one smooth motion. In hindsight I’m glad I was given the opportunity.

  • I really should file a KR on myself so that David knows just how so very much the little girl bitch I am.

  • roxhum

    Hey all, I don’t post here often but the bunker is my early morning reading material. Thank you Tony and all the contributors, and this community. Today I pondered, as I often do as to how much I actually knew about Scientology. The last 6 years of my 19 year marriage my ex husband was a scientologist he must have shared a lot with me. This was in the 80’s. I also read from his books. I never drank the koolaid, which in part is why I am divorced, can’t have a scientologist married to a PTS. I ponder why what was so obvious to me was not to the folks joining the cult. It must be I was getting my information from the outside looking in without the brainwashing. But still… Those constant phone calls, many per day to remind you to come to class. That alone was enough to have me running in the opposite direction.

    My ex left the cult shortly after leaving me. He was out ethics, went to some ethics court thing, long complicated story that happened long long ago.

    Happy New Year!

  • Anonymous

    As usual, Hubbard used Knowledge Reports to keep everyone on staff busy, busy, busy “salvaging this sector” while they were also kept impoverished and poorly fed. Meanwhile Hubbard and his family had special meals, special quarters and special rules. The special rules included the secret delivery by CMO couriers of suitcases of cash generated from church operations and book sales to Hubbard for his personal use. (See page 118 of Janet Reitman’s “Inside Scientology” among other sources.)

    It should be noted that Knowledge Reports are also used by public Scientologists to rat out other public. The insane culture that policies like these create is almost impossible to explain to someone who has not lived through the it.

    And it is an excellent reminder that whenever any entity, be it a church, a government, a politician or a business suggests that you will be “safer” by allowing your freedom / privacy to be “protected” by them….one should become extremely concerned. It is never that simple.

    • Dylan

      sorta like affordable health?

      • HeatherGraceful

        No. Not like that. 🙂

      • Anonymous

        I’m gonna stay away from that one as it almost certainly would be an explosive conversation on this board. 😉

        • Artoo45

          That, my friend, is OSA. That’s a standard trolling argument they use over at Hollywood Reporter to derail stories about the cult. Right vs. Left flame wars. Ignore it.

          • Dylan

            now with the troll shite again. get a fucking life.

            • Artoo45

              You see how the troll responds. This is, of course, from the Distraction & Derailment 101 textbook. It will feign indignation with stories of us being no better than the cult itself with our thought stopping political correctness.

            • Dylan

              and you would know all this because? funny how the people that hide in the shadows attack the people that are out and speaking about their abuse in the COS. I lived it and am here using my real name and doing stories about it with Tony O. all you can do is call names and try and forward this silly little lie that makes OSA look bigger than it is. I’m not trying to disrupt anything. I’m simply trying to be apart of the conversation and expose scientology for the fraud it is.

            • Sunny Sands

              What story did you do about your life in CoS with Tony?

            • Dylan

              I did a thing with him when he was working for the village voice. there is a link around here somewhere. it was about CST and the vaults.

            • Sunny Sands

              If it’s not too much trouble, could you provide a link? I’d like to read it.

            • Davka
            • Sunny Sands

              Thanks for the link. You’re Davka, not Dylan?

            • Dylan

              well there you go and thanks Davka for providing it.

            • RMycroft

              Exclusive pictures of secret Californian Scientology base ‘where Shelly Miscavage lives’ November 7, 2013, Chris White, Daily Mail
              Here Are Photos of Scientology’s Super Secret Armageddon Compound in Lake Arrowhead November 7, 2013, Adrian Glick Kudler, Curbed LA
              Scientology compound Twin Peaks, Shelly Miscavige’s reputed hideout, exposed November 8, 2013, Lee Moran, New York Daily News
              Scientology’s Secret Ranch: Where LRH Will Reincarnate? February 16, 2012, Tony Ortega, Runnin’ Scared, Village Voice
              Scientology’s Secret Vaults: A Rare Interview With a Former Member of Hush-Hush “CST” February 6, 2012, Tony Ortega, Runnin’ Scared, Village Voice

            • Sunny Sands

              I just e-mailed Tony, and he says Dylan is the same Dylan Gill that was in the VV article.

              Dylan, you may or may not be aware that this board was recently “catfished” (scammed) by an imposter, and folks are a little jumpy. Please stick around.

            • Dylan

              I know all about this catfish. this is not the first time I have been attacked as a OSA troll or LOVER of the COS. funny how people listen and don’t look. I thought that was just in the COS that happened?
              my story is here and up for reading. At great risk to myself I might add. I lost the other half of my family after it was published.

              I came here because I like what Tony O is doing and feel he has more Ethics and morals in his little toe than most in Scientology. I want to back that up even if it means loosing my family.

              I have been dealing with disconnected from the time that I decided to walk out the door and take my life back. I have been homeless and yes I was educated in the COS. As I’m sure will not come as a surprise to most of you. not a pitty party i’m trying to start. It is just the facts. I do not want anything other than to be treated as you would want to be treated.

            • Davka

              Yes, Davka. I don’t post that much, but have been around/commenting since VIllage Voice days…..

            • ze moo

              Sunny, have you been by the Tent lately? It is supposed to be down by the end of the month. I do have to wonder if it will go back to England or stay in Fla? I have a semi-inquiring mind…..

            • Sunny Sands

              No, I haven’t been by lately. At the end of the day today, Jan. 2, they are supposed to re-open the 2 streets they have closed for Co$ for New Year’s weekend, Franklin St. and Garden Ave. If they start building the auditorium on that lot that they have planned, that will preclude any tent there again. I’m not sure there are any vacant lots that could accommodate the tent close to Flag. Maybe Winter Wonderland lot, Of course, with DM occupied with the court cases, who knows what will happen.

            • Guest
            • grundoon

              You’re that Dylan? Thanks so much for that article and your other contributions. So glad you’re out!

            • Dylan

              Your the first person the say that to me. thank you.

            • Eivol Ekdal

              http://blogs.villagevoice.com/runninscared/2012/02/scientologys_se.php
              Welcome Dylan – Thanks for being here to share your story. I am fascinated by Trementina. I would like to have it as base of operations for Ekdal Enterprises when CST is done.
              I have been trying to find out what the purpose of this building at Trementina is….
              https://maps.google.com/?ll=35.527144,-104.55497&spn=0.000923,0.001206&t=h&z=20
              Can you illuminate?

            • Dylan

              sure. that building is a maint building/garage. the house just to the north is the “staff home” that is where I stayed when I was there.. there is a battery of generators just off the house to power all this. there is also another set of generators near the LRH home at this sight. it is closer to the vault.

            • Eivol Ekdal

              Thanks for your reply – that is one helluva maint building! One heck of a complex as well,
              Did Miscavige ever visit? Aside from the Ron house are there any amenities for Davey?

            • Robert Eckert

              You have not said a single thing about abuse in the CoS all day.

            • Dylan

              are you fucking kidding me.

              lets see when I was in the CMO and a cmoint mission came to our org. We had already been working 120hrs a week. Sleeping under our desks from tue night on. just so we could get our stats up and keep our meal card. This was around the time that the big push from INT was getting the GI in the FSO up to a million a week. Debbie cook was teh Tech sec still and Ron Norton was the Capt FSO.

              The entire org was sent up to the top of the FH so that we could write KR’s and OW’s. We did this for 10 days until a why could be found. At one point our MAA,( my junior) wrote a KR on me. it said that on our CSP day I had offered him the beer that had been sitting in our refridge ( at the hacienda) for over a year. It did not matter to the mission that Gehard ( the MAA) was over 21 and that it was a joke because we threw it away. I was 16 at the time and had never smelled let alone tasted a beer.

              I was hauled in and told that I was now on the Decks and this close to being sent to the RPF. I had just finished a number of missions which had been evaluated as normal or above. none of this mattered. I was made to clean the toilets of the CMO CW bathrooms with a toothbrush. I was started on sec checking and sectioned off from the group.

              this went against everything that I had known prior. I made it through the decks program. just missing the RPF this time. and was allowed to go back to my 120 + hrs a week at the pay rate of 18.00 per week.

              the church of scientology abuses people and takes advantage of children.

            • Davka

              Artoo, my recollection is that Dylan was established already as bona fide, so I think he’s just derailing like so many others do (who are not trolls) in the comments (not agreeing with the derail, just saying that I think it’s a regular derail, not an OSA derail).

          • Captain Howdy

            We know who Dylan is, and Tony has vouched for him, so accusing him of being OSA isn’t helpful.

            • sugarplumfairy

              Thx.. I’ll stop calling him an idiot..

            • Tory Christman

              Dylan is ********not********** OSA: Period. I know him personally. He is my friend.
              Just FTR. Happy New Year to ALL 🙂

            • Robert Eckert

              He is reminiscent of Skip Press back in the days when his strongest interest was spouting hatred of Democrats (or “libtards” rather) in Tea Party style, to the near-exclusion of revealing what he knew about the insides of Scientology.

            • Dylan

              I apologise for ruffling any feathers. I swear it was not my intention. can we agree to disagree? I have no beef with you bob. I’m not trying to be allusive I’m just being me. If you do not like me I’m okay with that. my intention here is to contribute and help see the demise of the COS.

            • Robert Eckert

              I’m not trying to fight with you either.

            • Artoo45

              Okay. I was wrong. I don’t appreciate incendiary political comments on this blog. I’ll try not to bite next time.

          • kemist

            Not everyone who feels strongly enough about something to comment on it is an OSA troll.

            I think a discussion about the abuses of governments is quite relevant considering the subject of ethics and KRs.

            • Dylan

              now this is more like it. thanks. I was trying to be relevant.

      • kemist

        I don’t understand how these things are related in the minds of americans.

        Most people who live in rich countries have access to free or affordable health care, and those countries are not fascist.

        • Dylan

          we are not Kenya no matter how much the powers that be want to make it so. I’ll leave it at that.

          • Sidney18511

            Screw you Dylan. Keep your Kenyan shit to yourself.

            • Dylan

              why don’t you just write a KR on me. LMAO you should have talked to me when I had to cow down to others and seek what my opinion should be. I left all that when I left the COS. I would like to think that out here in the real world there can be a free exchange of ideas. Without the name calling etc. dear to dream right.

            • Sunny Sands

              Have you written your story at any of the boards? It sounds pretty interesting.

            • Artoo45

              If it can write a story that isn’t centered around creating a left vs. right flame war, I’ll be very surprised.

            • Dylan

              fuck you calling me an it! I’m a human being. here is a scientology term for you. WRONG TARGET!

            • Artoo45

              Then, calm down and stop writing things that you know will inflame the boards. Get it? This isn’t about Obama or Boehner or Duck Dynasty or the Illuminati. It’s about COS and its abuses. Stay on topic and we might believe you.

            • Dylan

              I just drew a comparison to anon’s comment. “And it is an excellent reminder that whenever any entity, be it a church, a government, a politician or a business suggests that you will be “safer” by allowing your freedom / privacy to be “protected” by them….one should become extremely concerned. It is never that simple.”

              simple as that. no intention of derailing anything. I guess I should have just agreed with the entity known as anon and left it at that.

              One thing I will not have is being censored based on the fact that you do not want to hear it. you did not have to accuse or write anything. others left it alone and that was fine. but you start in calling names. I would say that it is you who started this.

            • Artoo45

              I apologize for calling you a troll. I should know better than to bite at political comments I disagree with. I’ve never seen you before and that’s a major derailing tactic of OSA over at Hollywood Reporter, to get everyone fighting over politics instead of commenting on the cult. I’m done with this topic now.

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              Dylan, the political wars are something that most here agree should be left to other blogs and forums, such as political blogs. It’s hard enough to keep peace when dealing with scientology issues especially now that this community has grown.

              There are of course more polite ways of explaining and asking. While I understand because it has been a rough few weeks lately, I’m not going to offer that as an excuse anymore. I hope others will at least consider my suggestion of toning it down on the ad hom method of first approach and instead try and help each other focus on what really matters. Also, I have terrible indigestion from the garbage I ate the last two days, and can’t handle another ounce. and I hope you understand the reactions now, Dylan.

            • Dylan

              thanks for you words. I only came here to add some insight of a person that was in scientology and the sea org for most of their life. it is clear this is not the place for that. I do not like being treated this way and have never treated anyone else like this. So it is strange that it is so easy to blame other events on me being attacked with name calling etc.

              has anyone ever thought about how it might make a person who escaped out of sceintology feel to be called a OSA troll etc. it makes me feel like shit.

              you guys talk about disconnection and how sad it is that teh COS does this to people. well I’m one of teh people. I hate it and I hate that my family ever got caught up in it. It is a reality that I live with while most of you sit in your chair’s deciding what is okay and not okay to say and feel about. There is not a day that goes by that I wish I could talk to my family or that my kids would be able to know their grandparents. this sucks and i’m now going to cry for a while and try to get on with my day.

            • Robert Eckert

              ” I only came here to add some insight of a person that was in scientology and the sea org for most of their life. it is clear this is not the place for that.” This IS the place for that. It is not the place for Republican-vs-Democrat mudslinging.

            • Mooser

              “I left all that when I left the COS. I would like to think that out here
              in the real world there can be a free exchange of ideas.”

              There is. You started saying something really dumb, and people immediately reacted to it. That’s free speech, dude!
              And in order to exchange ideas, you need to have some.

          • D.Y.G.

            It’s tough to bring references to Kenya into a political discussion without instigating some ill feelings and strong responses.. Birtherism, Dylan. It wasn’t America’s finest hour.

          • kemist

            Kenya ? Who cares where someone was born if they’ve got good ideas ?

            Please get out moar.

            Srsly.

            Their are other democratic, free countries besides yours which have chosen to do things differently. It works.

            • D.Y.G.

              The humorous part is that Kenya is, in fact, very progressively moving towards universal health care while Dylan seems to be suggesting universal health care will turn the US into a third world country.

            • Dylan

              I’m not a fan of government run anything. I could give to fucks where anyone was born. I think the problem is not enough healthy people are going to sign up and thus make it hard for the implementation. we have wasted far to much money with no real oops moment. reminds me to much of being in the Sea Org and being told what you are to think and feel and how to act. a slippery slope at the very least. IMHO

            • D.Y.G.

              I’m sure there are John Birch Society forums on the net that might interest you. My deepest sympathies.

            • Dylan

              down voting really. but it’s okay when it is for me. LOOK if you don’t want me here expressing my opinions freely just ask me to leave. so much for a free exchange of ideas.

            • Robert Eckert

              This board is not for political arguments or for arguments about other religions than Scientology. Those kinds of arguments, particularly when started out with as much anger as you throw into it, are just distractions. OSA trolls frequently come here to start that kind of shit; exes really ought to know better.

            • Dylan

              but this comment is not how it started out. I replied to anon and it was sorta left at that. not that it matters; but I was speaking and agreeing with Anon’s statement of

              “And it is an excellent reminder that whenever any entity, be it a church, a government, a politician or a business suggests that you will be “safer” by allowing your freedom / privacy to be “protected” by them….one should become extremely concerned. It is never that simple.”

              my comment was like affordable health? a simple no would have been fine. or even your comment above “This board is not for political arguments or for arguments about other religions than Scientology”

              I would have been fine with that and accepted it no problem. yet this turns into a your a OSA troll and name calling. would you like to be refered to as an IT? come on robert you know this game. think back. or is it okay because you have been hurt before and that gives you and others the right to be large piles of steaming shite?

            • Robert Eckert

              Bringing in “Kenya” was amping up the hostility level way beyond anything that was called for. It looked like an effort to distract from the topic, in the exact way that OSA trolls do, as you really ought to know by now. Come on Dylan, you know this game too.

            • Dee Fogger

              Hey Dylan, thanks for talking with Tony at VV and speaking up about your experiences here on the Bunker board. Ex’s stories are important.

              I’ve read many of your recent comments and realize you’re not OSA and are attempting to make a joke and fit in with the J&D’ing atmosphere. That works when you’re not using incendiary political material (unless it’s about Scn) as the basis for your humor. When you do you’re going to get jumped on from either side if you try it. There are a few regular posters here who’s views are pretty well known and post with political based humor at times and you’ll notice that they don’t get jumped on, but those comments are mostly ignored, because they’ve been here so long and it’s glossed over as “that’s just x acting as expected.” Even then some things that are commonly used to bait
              flame wars all over the internet should probably be avoided, like Kenya and universal health.
              Given what you’ve survived don’t let a terse exchange drive you out of a good community. Give it time while people get to know you.

            • Cat Daddy
            • Cat Daddy

              good argument

            • Mooser

              Gosh, right out of SeaOrg, and into the wing-nut sewer. Take some time to decompress, dude.

            • Robert Eckert

              Let it go, Moose. Nobody likes hearing your politics, either.

            • Cat Daddy
          • sugarplumfairy

            Idiot.. Quit derailing..

            • Dylan

              is name calling really needed here? you can’t even draw on similarity between government and how the COS operates?

            • sugarplumfairy

              How ’bout similarity between YOU and how co$ operates? You both sound prejudiced..

              Ok, I’m finished here.. You may have some good points but your lack of social skills may prevent us from appreciating them.. I’ll try to be more patient with you..

            • Dylan

              that is wrong on so many levels. a simple apology would have been fine. It is clear that I’m not liked nor wanted here. I guess I will go back to lurking more. does this fit into your agenda?

            • sugarplumfairy

              Too hot in the kitchen for you?

              Give and take, baby.. Nobody here will ever chase me away that easy.. If you give it, be ready to take it.. But you already know that..

              Ba-bye..

            • Dylan

              fuck you you ignorant piece of shit. if you read down the comments you might see that I tried to explain this.

            • grundoon

              Hey SPF, Dylan is one of only maybe two people who have lived and worked at the top-secret CST bases and have come out to speak publicly. He’s an ex-Sea Org kid and I think he has a lot more to tell us about life in the Sea Org and in the top echelon CST org that not even most Int Base insiders know anything about. I for one would like to hear what he has to say. Please don’t drive him off just because you don’t like his politics.

            • sugarplumfairy

              I’d like to hear what he has to say too.. I have never and will never try to drive anyone off..

            • grundoon

              Got it. My mistake. Happy 2014 to you!

            • grundoon

              Scientology is often compared to government bureaucracies, noting that LRH borrowed lots of ideas from the US Navy and from intelligence, secret police, and tax agencies, among others.

              Also, Scientology ideas sometimes filter into the government… for example, Narconon, CCHR, Applied Scholastics, and Criminon sometimes succeed in getting schools, courts, legislators, etc to take up parts of their agenda. Scientology has tried to influence elections, Scientology candidates have been elected to office (like Congressman Sonny Bono), and Scientologists have held influential positions in the executive branch of the US government. President Clinton is said to have intervened to help Scientology in the IRS tax exemption settlement because his college roommate was a Scientologist.

              Scientology is often compared to the government of North Korea.

              If there is some factual connection between Scientology and affordable care, that would be on topic for this site. For example, if affordable care regulations required insurance companies to start (or stop) covering Narconon, the Bunker would be a great place to discuss that.

              Any time you slam Politician X, there’s gonna be somebody who loves X and has to tell you how wrong you are, and punch back with a counter-slam to your favorite Politician Y. It goes on all over the Internet. Once it gets started, it will crowd out all other discussion.

              I like this place because we don’t have to take sides on affordable care or gun control or 100 other contentious issues of the day. We can put aside those differences for awhile to talk about Scientology.

            • Dylan

              I see now that it was inappropriate to say that. It was the first thing that popped into my head after reading Anon’s post. I did not think about how it would be received and that was selfish.

              Thanks for your well worded response I really got it and will do my best in the future to mind my actions.

      • grundoon

        Here at Tony’s site, people come together from all across the political spectrum – lefties, righties, you name it.

        Regardless of politics, we have common ground on on thing: Scientology has got to stop hurting people.

        So our community tries to keep the Bunker as neutral ground politically under a flag of truce. Otherwise we would divert our efforts into criticizing each other’s political errors, and forget what we came for.

  • roxhum

    I find this all such a fascinating read, until I remember this is real. Then I find it sad and scary.

  • Natural Philospoher

    The best KR I ever got was from an ‘OT’ in a CLO, who reported me for starting a 2D with someone who was a public in the org. I was on mission at the time, but ended up getting recalled and ended up hosing down all the roads with fire hoses at the Int base to make ‘amends’. All the time I spent doing that hosing I was thinking, ‘God, that was worth it!’ The KR system makes a mockery of ethics and operates to third party to people involved, unless it is actively non-survival activity being reported. Most times, you had to actively engage in refuting false and BS KR’s submitted against you. The other factor you had to have was having your ‘stats up’, in which case you were provided some ethics protection. But if the KR was from some senior, there was no protection at all.
    And if the report was from Dave on one of his advices, that was it – no protection at all – just got straight to the Hole and don’t collect $200!

    • Observer

      Leave it to Miscavige to come up with a “punishment” involving wasting vast amounts of water in a drought prone area.

      • RMycroft

        And possibly not just any water, but from the fire system. That area is unincorporated land, so maybe they own their own fire hydrants and water. In municipal areas, doing that would be a hefty fine.

    • Zana

      Wow. “That was worth it.” Kind of puts the power and importance of love into the equation.

      Seems to me that the best decision is to go to love first. And don’t spend time where there is no love. How daring.

    • Dylan

      no matter how hard they tried. they could not take away the human factor. Most of us were just kids and had good intentions toward one another.

      Bummer you got recalled from the mission that is always messy. but the light at the end of the tunnel was making a connection with another human. makes me smile.

  • BosonStark

    Whatever the stated purpose of the Knowledge Report, as written by Hubbard or executed by Miscavige or his underlings, the assessment on most of the more important KRs written must have been in terms of their potential to damage the stability of the money machine. People were security checked on the basis of their possibility of having “bad thoughts about Hubbard,” so, obviously, that was the #1 person’s behavior or motives you could never question or even think about questioning. In a way, that made sense, because anything that damaged Hubbard’s credibility or reputation, would hurt the amount of money they could draw in and slow the “clearing of the planet.”

    I’m wondering if at the time Leah wrote her report on Miscavige, was she thinking in terms of that Scientology would suffer, ultimately, because of Miscavige’s behavior and the things he could get away with. Did she trust that with her influence as a celebrity and in Hubbard’s system of ethics, that her Knowledge Report against Miscavige would be dealt with fairly? Was she thinking Miscavige was hurting Hubbard’s reputation and ideals?

    I think at some point, when she was being grilled in Clearwater, she must have realized there were some major cracks in the whole system.

    The comically ironic ploy of the indies, against Miscavige, was to say that he was hurting Hubbard’s reputation and not clearing the planet fast enough. Too many loyal people were leaving Scientology because of Miscavige’s behavior, and that was hurting Scientology’s reputation, so they claimed. Marty, for example, suggested that was Miscavige’s greatest sin, not drawing enough people into Scientology, and his vision was that with his new Internet-connected living room auditing, Scientology would rise to new heights in power, where it could be seen what it could accomplish OUTSIDE of all of Miscavige’s control, by restoring “the tech” to its purity. Of course, what Marty found out was that by practicing a more open version, one had a snowball’s chance in Hell of recruiting raw meat to this type of therapy, philosophy, religion or whatever you want to call it. The more Marty read, the more he could understand this, that it was the control and lies by Hubbard that made Scientology what it was.

    So, back to Miscavige…imagine if Leah’s KR had worked against Miscavige and the executives who saw the report formed some kind of tribunal to have him put into security checking. Well, if the whales got wind of this, how would their spending habits change if they revered Miscavige as the Keeper of the Source.

    Really, he’s the keeper of the Source, can you imagine what that means to most of these members? They think he should have the ability to behead his wives if he wants to — the future of this planet is at stake!

    I think the person who wrote one of the biggest KRs on Hubbard and Scientology itself, although it wasn’t in the form of a KR, was Gerry Armstrong. And look what they did to him. Gerry pointed out what could potentially make the cult fall apart over the years — that Hubbard lied a lot. This was expanded by people like Paulette Cooper and Russell Miller. So, the only type of KR Scientology is interested in is the type that helps them keep control, and avoid the loss of income or image. Leah’s report, obviously, was not going to help with that.

    • Anonymous

      Excellent commentary!

      Many people forget (or never knew) that Gerry Armstrong was the original Hubbard biographer, appointed by Hubbard himself. Gerry’s discovery and documentation of the many falsehoods that Hubbard had forwarded about himself for decades, falsehoods directly contradicted by the very materials Hubbard allowed Gerry to research in preparation for the writing of Hubbard’s biography, were the beginning of a massive upheaval in the church. That Hubbard lied to every Scientologist about his own background in his books and tapes is unarguable.

      Removing the worst and most easily disprovable of Hubbard’s biographical lies was one of the primary drivers in the serial re-issuance of Hubbard’s books and tapes over the past decades. There was a money-making aspect to it also, but getting the shore story about Hubbard more attuned to what is now common knowledge about Hubbard’s actual biographical history was of key importance.

      • Sidney18511

        And Marty still sees Gerry Armstrong as an enemy. Why?

        • BosonStark

          Rinder too — probably just their egos, and it’s embarrassing to face the implications of their fair gaming of him. Neither Rathbun or Rinder have dealt with any of the truth that is in Russell Miller’s bio of Hubbard. I think Marty’s probably coming around about Gerry — he just doesn’t feel any further emphasis on it will help his current situation.

          • Dylan

            or their mutual hatred of David Mayo. I never understood this.

            • RMycroft

              For all that they’re out, they have seemed frozen in their attitudes towards people who left before they did.

        • Anonymous

          I am personally hoping one day to see in-person or in a photograph Mike Rinder, David Mayo, Gerry Armstrong, Arnie Lerma and Marty Rathbun sitting around smiling and having a beer together.

          It is a logical fallacy to do do but when the above happens, I am willing to declare victory over the most malevolent aspect of Scientology.

          • Dylan

            be it a tall order, that would be something. I would love to see that. I bet they would find that they are more alike then they could have imagined. but who knows

            • Anonymous

              It would be a fascinating conversation, that’s for sure.

            • Dylan

              agreed. I worked with Mike and Marty when I was in and have spoken to them after we all got out. I have also spoken with Arnie ( I think I like him the most). if they ever do get together I would love to hear all about it.

      • BosonStark

        Yeah, it’s like they had to produce an entire encyclopedia of Hubbard fluff, with the Nutterpedia, analogous to Hubbard’s voluminous output, with classic crazy like The History of Man. To cult members, volume is veritas. Individual facts or inconsistencies don’t matter at all because there are so many pages, translated into so many languages, distributed in more countries than there are actual countires. Never mind that you can’t pull a paragraph out of his writing that isn’t a drooling mess, he has all the answers!

    • Bob

      KRs were originally written so that anyone could help correct an area that was not producing well. It eventually morphed into what it is now. A way of protecting yourself and destroying others. In the hands of the general Disabled clams it’s a form of ratting on people you don’t like or spreading lies. When someone writes a legitimate KR it usually backfires on them or is ignored. I have numerous stories. This helps to further the “atmosphere of FEAR” that Clamatology fosters. COB must enjoy reading KRs from his minions. Probably likes the gossip. I can only imagine what it’s like working right under him.

      • Anonymous

        Perhaps,

        Although Class XII auditor Otto Roos discovering and reporting rock slams all through Hubbard’s PC folder’s while doing an FES, then being physically assaulted by Hubbard before being dumped ashore, would indicate the practice of denying the truth and punishing those who discover it is old hat in Scientology.

        • Bob

          Yes. Otto Roos was considered the devil. I am sure Hubbard went ballistic when he realized that he himself was a rock slammer. Hubbard played lip service to the fact that he was not perfect but in reality he could not take the cold lite of truth on his major flaws.

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        Actually it was originally designed to manipulate as well as hide the persons who were committing real crimes. It was used as a form of control and punishment right from the beginning, Bob. The only times it was used for its written purpose was by those who believed it. They could get by with a few reports in the beginning, but eventually they would be hauled in for “reality adjustments”. It was a ruthless system from the very start.

  • ze moo

    The Hubbtard writings on ‘ethics’ and group dynamics were designed to make the Hub lord of all creation. No dissent, no compromise, no real thought, just bow to the masters will. As most ‘policies’ contradicted other ‘policies’, your supervisor could pick and choose any that fit his intentions. This is the same management scheme that resulted in the Nazi SS. How did things work out for them?

  • dagobarbz

    I (heh) filed a KR a couple of years ago against the President of the San Diego org, David Meyer. You see, he initiated an act that backfired and gave Scientology a huge black eye when he joined with a national group of churches who were opposed to marriage equality. For months, the cult kept having to remind the world that ONLY THAT ONE WEENIE ORG IN SAN DIEGO was the hater, the rest of the cult was sensibly silent about gay rights.

    I wrote it and then had it filtered through an ex-Scn friend for verisimilitude. Then I sent it, but you know what?

    They NEVER answered!

    • Suzy

      I just had to word clear “verisimilitude”. 🙂

      • Robert Eckert

        “Merely corroborative detail, intended to give artistic verisimilitude to an otherwise bald and unconvincing narrative.” (One of my favorite lines from The Mikado)

    • Anonymous

      Interesting.

      Once again, poor handling of factual truth backfired big time for Scientology.

      The Paul Haggis saga was among the fallout from that particular instance.

      • MaxSpaceman

        And Paul’s departure was like the 1st atom bomb. Of major whale 3+ decades a member, and part of $cientology Inc.’s Hollywood entertainment industry celebrity center ideal members. (The other ideal members being the wealthy, followed by a slew of dentists and chiropractors).

    • Anonymous

      That doesn’t mean we can’t have fun mentioning various out-points to the good folks at RTC. :-p Poor bastards, they probably spend alot of time around Davey.

  • JustDok

    Hello Bunker! Long time lurker, first time poster. Ive been following Tony Ortego since the Vintage Voice days and have been continuousally fascinated by his exceptional journalist and his non-stop one-stop-shop drop on this pop-top cult flop.

    I think I take such an intrest in this because I grew up in a cult too. My earliest memories are of cult opression. I was told what to eat, when to eat, what to wear, where to sleep, when to sleep, when to wake, regular cheerios not a damn honey nut to be found. I had no say at all. The cult leaders controlled my education and mold my mind so that there worldview became my worldview. Its embarassing to say, but they even forced upon me there beliefs on where I should potty, how I should potty and what I should do after potty. These are difficult habbits to break and I still practise much of it today.

    I AM slowly moving forward and getting over it. Today is a new day in a new year. Today is the day I have decided to comment here after so much lurking. It shouldnt be weird, because I feel like I know all of you so well!! The shoopster! That crazy ship captain! The one who sarcasticly believes holes does not exists! That one whos a squirrel enthusiast I think? I dunno but I like that one. Theres that guy whos just crazy about lists. Theres even a baby who smokes! Huh!! Wats going on here lol!

    I am trying to says is that many of you are dreamboats of happiness and laughter. The rest of you are rivers that dreamboats of happiness and laughter can float upon. Tony has only provided the oars, you see. Only the oars. You all do the rowing. You row this bunker ship through the roughest of seas and thats what I like most.

    So having read your comments for a couple years and finding nothing to respond to, Ive patient waited and lurked until today. Today is the day, I have decided. I feel it now and now I feel it. I have logged in and I may chats for a bit and then probley disapear without much notice. I know that many who reply to this are some of my favorite people that I have always liked up while as a guest.

    Happy 2014!

    • Robert Eckert

      Welcome! What cult was it that had you in grip, if you don’t mind saying? If you’d rather not say, that’s fine too.

      • JustDok

        Hello thanks! Id rather not say because there my parents and i still use there costco card

        • Robert Eckert

          Understood. We have veterans of the Moonies, the LaRouchies, and various little fundamentalist churches that have shared stories too.

          • Observer

            I believe he or she is literally referring to his or her parents.

            • Robert Eckert

              I assumed as much.

        • Observer

          lol! (apologies to Espiando)

          • JustDok

            I dont no what that is but goodbye for now have a nice day u

            • Observer

              It means you made me laugh. 🙂

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              Oh wow….all this time, years reading since VV and doesn’t know what lol means? That is quite amazing. I am impressed.

            • Observer

              Even if this owl isn’t what it seems, that was still funny.

          • Valerie Ross

            Thanks Obs, BTW, I went to the doctor today. “He said we’re going to have to amputate your last arm.” I said doc, what will happen after that. He said “I hope you will quit while you’re a head.”

    • MaxSpaceman

      Thank you for the best wishes for a Happy 2014- the same to you! And thank you for one of the, if not the, nicest descriptions of the community –

      “I am trying to says is that many of you are dreamboats of happiness and laughter. The rest of you are rivers that dreamboats of happiness and laughter can float upon. Tony has only provided the oars, you see. Only the oars. You all do the rowing. You row this bunker ship through the roughest of seas and thats what I like most.”

      That’s beautiful, to refer to The Underground Bunker commenting community, The Bunkeroos. like that. Thank you! (Edit: only, Tony O provides, on top of the oars, the Ship on which we ride!)

    • grundoon

      Hi JustDok! Happy 2014 to you!

  • Robert Eckert

    Eclipse was trying to post some Craigslist ad links for spam-flagging but Disqus broke the links. The trick is: if the search part of the URL contains any blank spaces, it is necessary to hand-replace ” ” with “%20”. I fixed the first couple but then the rest of the list disappeared:

    http://losangeles.craigslist.org/search/ccc?query=323%20953%203206&zoomToPosting

    http://losangeles.craigslist.org/search/eee?query=323%20953%203206&zoomToPosting

    • Eclipse-girl

      I was seeing if I could copy the post from WWP, but I could not.

      I recreated two lists from Pierrot the hard way. It works.

      • Mark

        I wondered where it went 🙂

  • MaxSpaceman

    Rathbun, as has been noted somewhat recently, is changing, developing, has moved away from The Prison of Belief, and has stopped 1 x 1 auditing indies. At the same time, he wants to move forward and in his doing so is extending a hand to “ex’es”, as he says below. A hand called, “Graduating From Scientology,” incidentally! Because of how time-constrained he must be what with Mosey’s lawsuit, he has an Internet-savvy idea:

    “As noted recently, in essence my coaching or counselling has focused more on connecting dots to get people out of the ‘why trap’ Scientology has so effectively ensnared them into.

    I am offering a Graduating from Scientology correspondence course. It is designed for:

    -Those who are Clear or higher on the Scientology grade chart and are not planning on doing any more Scientology OT levels.

    -Those who find Scientology still occupies their attention and somehow holds them back from moving on with doing and experiencing new things.

    -Those having difficulty correlating the gains they did get from Scientology with the outside world and other philosophies and religions.

    -Those wishing to continue with spiritual growth, but who do not want to start from square zero.

    The course is organized by reading assignments followed by one to one discussions…”
    —-.
    Imagine what Rathbun has said with this one idea/plan. One can now graduate from LRH U. Even those who’ve done their L10/L11/l12, called the Ls. Even those who’ve done their ‘super powers.’ Even the vaunted OT8s (those at the pinnacle of The Bridge To Total Freedom!).

    Rathbun is offering a correspondence course to now graduate from that, and move on in one’s spiritual growth/pursuit/endeavor.

    Gotta love it !

    • Anonymous

      And this is why I don’t talk trash about the Indies…

      • Espiando

        Except that Marty’s no longer an Indie. He’s abrogated the entire philosophy, and good for him.

        The only Indies I go after are the ones who insist that Ron was All That And A Bag Of Chips, and that everything wrong is Davey’s fault. The ones who insist on Hubbard Infallibility (especially on the definition of 1.1) and who still go after the Evil Psychs are at the top of my shit list. I have no problem criticizing people like Carcha and Ronnie Bell, not to mention the Milestoners.

        • Anonymous

          Yeah, but I cut him alot of slack when he still decompressing, and tend to do the same for the others. Their trust in LRH always goes last. You just have to give it time, and the cult indoctrination will largely fall apart without interference from us.

    • Once_Born

      Up to now, I have been somewhat sceptical about Mr Rathburn. However, on the face of it, this seems to be very good idea.

      His knowledge of, and experience with Scientology will give him credibility and enable him to empathise with his ‘students’ – so the process may do them both good. Closure and amends, all in one project.

      The only thing I find potentially concerning is the ‘spiritual growth’ part – I would not want to see vulnerable people exchange one rabbit hole for another.

      • MaxSpaceman

        that’s cool, OB – “potentially” troubling. I don’t think he’s gonna offer an entire rabbit hole. I think he’s talking about into the “infinity of spirituality”. And I’d project that he will only offer his counseling in that regard. Not invent a whole ‘nother rabbit hole !
        .
        Hubbard’s ruin is that he left a “religion” that was ultra finite. OT8 ends one’s trip over the Bridge to Total Freedom. That will bring down the Cult eventually, if nothing else. That’s why the MidgetMiscavige keeps invalidating past “source” and releasing “now it’s as LRH intended” ‘source.’
        .
        Someday, there will be no one left to market a rewritten Bridge to, left in the world.

        • Once_Born

          On the one hand, I think that the therapeutic aim should be to restore the clients freedom of thought, not debate imponderables like ‘spirituality’. On the other hand, the clients will be people who are likely to be concerned about such matters, and will expect them to be addressed.

          This will be a fine line to walk, so I wish him well – especially because, if the CofS should suffer an exodus of members (or even collapses completely) this kind of service will be desperately needed, and therapists may be able to learn a lot from a poacher turned gamekeeper.

          • MaxSpaceman

            you are very sharp OB and I hear you. I have a problem with the poacher part, still. Yes. But I drop it because of Mosey’s cause. That ends it for me. His expiation is up to him somehow someday someway.

            • Once_Born

              It does seem that he is now getting closer to some kind of resolution. This has to be very hard work at the best of times. An having to fight back against outrageous persecution cannot make it any easier to reassess the better part of your adult life.

              On balance, he seems, despite everything, to be moving in the right direction. In future, think I may cut him a little more slack.

            • Mooser

              I was hoping, against hope, of course, that Rathbun (and I would hope, with his capable wife’s assistance!) might wrest control of the COS from Miscavige, become the COB, and lead Scientology in a better direction. Recent events indicate I should put this up with my hopes of Bourbon restoration.

        • ze moo

          The moving target part of the scam requires a target that can be moved further away from the person who has reached the previous goal. As no OT 9 to 15 have been announced, davey is keeps moving the target laterally, I think GAT2 is the last time that misdirection can work. Even fools eventually see that the game is rigged.

          • Once_Born

            A good con artist would have made up new OT levels long before now. They could magically appear in an LRH office, and crumble to dust after being transcribed (people have got away with less credible claims, and this is Scientology, whose members are used to weird stories).

            The new OT material could be better written and the required ‘exercises’ more entertaining. This new writing style could be explained by Hubbard’s new ‘higher state of being’. It would also fulfil the ‘prophesy’ that Ron would return.

            Of course, the ‘New, Intangible Ron’ (from his exterior viewpoint) would also be aware of the Internet, and other innovations. Eventually, he could update his books, and release new works from on high.

            Miscavige does not have the creative nous to do this, and is not capable of delegating the job to a competent person. I think you are right and, as long as Miscavige is in charge, we will see the ‘same old same old’ from the CofS, until the money finally runs out.

    • Mooser

      I think that’s just the kind of guy he is. When he’s got a good thing going, he gets enthusiastic about it, and he wants to offer it to other people. And being an effective, enterprising, let’s-do-it kind of guy, he writes it up, organizes it in easy steps, and offers a correspondence course! He is following in a grand tradition .

  • Mark

    Having got a downvote yesterday for putting Shortarse in drag once too often for somebody’s tolerance, today’s effort at entheta restimulation is irreproachably masculine and virile in tone, and may even be how Davy sees himself – not only now, but on his reincarnatory time-track – along with Alexander the Great, Genghiz Khan, Attilla the Hun, &c. I’m still tempted to put him into a poster for Devil Girl From Mars, downvotes notwithstanding, unless anyone has any better suggestions… (refresh):

    • Observer

      You know what’s really tragic? I have seen a couple of pickup trucks (known as utes in some parts of the world) with those fake testicles dangling from the trailer hitch.

      • BosonStark

        Tom Cruise should get some burl-wood testicles for his SUV.

        • Observer

          *snickersnort*

      • Mark

        By George, you’re living up to your observant name, Obs! I was wondering whether anyone would recognize them (yet to reach the UK, thank heavens). I was gobstruck to see you can even get them with an eight or sixteen-inch “dangle”; is there truly no end to some people’s folly?

        • Observer

          There truly is not.

        • TheHoleDoesNotExist

          And here I felt guilty for dangling a participle today.

      • Sherbet

        “Nadbag” indeed!

      • Sherbet

        Are you sure they’re fake? OMIGOD! I make me laugh.

    • Sherbet

      I’m dyin’ laughing here, even though I had a major crush on Fess Parker back in the day.

      • MaxSpaceman

        Really, Sherbie? Davey Crockett himself !

        • Sherbet

          I’m old!

          • MaxSpaceman

            You’re ultra fine ~

            • Sherbet

              Like a fine, aged wine (not cheese).

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              Aged to perfection, I like to say.

      • Mark

        He was rather tasty. But what on earth was “Fess” short for?

        • Sherbet

          Just looked him up on Wikipedia, and “Fess” was his real name. (If he had been a scientologist, it would have been short for “Confess.”)

          • Mark

            “Fesse” means “thigh” in French. Maybe a nickname from his days as a Canadian fur-trapper? 😉

            • Sherbet

              You’re just getting excited thinking of Fess’s “fesses.” Calm down, Mark, calm down.

            • Mark

              I nearly had another tobacco-incident with my keyboard 😀

            • Sherbet

              LOL. Run this by your “Who would you rather do in the 1950s? meter: Fess Parker or Dale Robertson.

            • Mark

              Impossible to decide!

      • Espiando

        Trufax: According to gossip (so take with as many grains of salt as possible), Fess Parker had a set on him that was bigger than his horse’s. Supposedly, he was the best-hung guy in Hollywood at that time. But he was very circumspect about showing off the goods. If there’s any comparison to Scientology With Ethics In in the movie industry, it was the Walt Disney Company in the 50s and 60s. If Uncle Walt even heard a whisper of something that might make it to the gossip columnists, you were called on the carpet for a session that made a gang-bang sec check look like a tea party. Walt treated his live-action stars horribly. Read about what he did to Tommy Kirk when Kirk realized that he was gay and just wanted to live his life peacefully.

        • Sherbet

          What I’ve heard about Uncle Walt is similar to what you’re saying, Espi. Squeaky Clean was the image, and it was going to stay that way, come hell or high water, dammit! I’ll have to read about Tommy Kirk. Do you know it wasn’t too long ago that I heard Kirk was gay? As an adolescent, I had no gaydar, and we all thought he was adorable. I’m happy here in the Bunker that you and Mark and others are very open about sexuality so we can all talk like adults instead of giggling and wondering. Phooey on that.

          As for giggling and NOT talking like adults — Fess’s “equipment”: Is it safe to say Mark used an actual photo for his shoop?

          • Mark

            A plastic pickup-truck ornament, as Observer spotted (see below).

            • Sherbet

              I was joking, because Espi said above that Parker was known to be well endowed.

        • Robert Eckert

          That’s why Fess didn’t get on the wrong side of Ed Ames

          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0L5QC9ZJkM8

          • Sherbet

            That’s a classic, RobE, as is Carson’s follow-up line.

        • Mooser

          ‘Just take out enough to win, Miltie!’

    • Mooser

      “Having got a downvote yesterday for putting Shortarse in drag once too often for somebody’s tolerance,”

      Well, downvoting is extreme, but he really doesn’t have the gams for it.

    • Dee Fogger

      I’m sure you could do something good with the Wild Women of Wongo. Although it probably involves putting wee Davey in drag again.

      • Mark

        Yesss!

        • grundoon

          Noooooo!

  • Good Fella

    Of all of Jefferson’s posts, this is probably one of the most horrific within the CofS. The systematic spying network Hubbard set up truly created a social group gripped by fear of one’s family members and closest friends. I know, I’ve just experienced it at it’s fundamental level.

    All you ‘never ins’ can only imagine what it’s like to constantly monitor what comes into your thoughts, what comes out of your mouth or what you write. We’ve all had moments of consternation, upset or confusion where we may have thought Hubbard lost his marbles, a senior is mean, some order is crazy. But when these things appear in a knowledge report (KR), written by a family member or good buddy you’ve known for decades, you just can’t imagine the torrent of negative emotions pouring through one’s body, accompanied by increased heart rate, dizziness, dislocation, fear or terror, guilt, hatred, betrayal, sleeplessness, a complete withdrawal from that part of your life, propitiation, degradation, the willingness to throw yourself under the bus to avoid punishment and interrogation, and…on and on. It takes awhile to get over it – sometimes you never do. These experiences are like a cancer eating at your very soul. You don’t even dare to bring them up in an auditing session for fear you will be further thrashed with unwanted questions and punishments. You ‘never in’s’ want to know how one becomes a scientology clone? Live through this shit for a few decades. Your space has shrunk to a density of a neutron star. You’ve become incapable of fighting back because most of your friends and family and business associates are all in “agreement” with this Stasi-like society. One of Hubbard’s great gifts to humanity. One of the products of the Road to Total Freedom. The irony fairly drips with the consistency of old motor oil.

    And all of us Under the Radar denizens live with this every day. How do we reconcile it? Not easily. We do not want to lose our children, our parents, our dear friends or our source of income. Not to beat a dead horse but you Never Ins must really come to grips with this reality if you really want to understand – just a little bit -why we Under the Radar folks tolerate it and find some way to live our lives in spite of it.

    I’ll tell you what, I’m reaching a point where it is becoming less and less tolerable to fly under the radar. So I may break loose some day soon. In the meantime my heartfelt admiration goes out to all of you Above the Radar folks. It’s real to me what you gave up but…hopefully, it will become more real to me what you got back in return for getting the fuck outa Dodge.

    • MaxSpaceman

      I imagine Mike R, Marty R, Jefferson H, Debbie C, Amy S., Paul H, Jason B among others who resonate with ‘under the radars’, are inspiration and a model of leaving (and it’s consequences.)
      .
      Best good fortune in your trip out of Dodge!
      Edit: “These experiences are like a cancer eating at your very soul.” There is the reason not to remain under the radar too long, dear Good Fella.

      • Good Fella

        Yes, you’re right about the inspiration we derive from these front-running hard chargers. But the source of most of my inspiration comes from “the guy down the street”, the guy who gets out of the WISEcentric business he’s been hobbled to and now has no clue where the next job is going to come from. Yet, from his voice you can hear a simple finality as he closes the door on (to paraphrase Hubbard) out tech.

        Well, as I give comment some thought, that was the same boat Rinder and the rest were in at some early point.

        Thank you Max, for your best wishes on my trip outa Dodge. I just have to talk this project over with my family to weigh the consequences to them and other friends. I can begin to smell the clear, fresh ocean breezes awaiting me.

        • MaxSpaceman

          It will be fantastic, for you, Good Fella – to gain control of your life, your thoughts, your heart. To not have to hide the truth inside of you at any given time because of your membership in a chirch. To be the cause of your own life not the effect of Hubbard’s world, which is dead.

          Take your time. Do it right as you see it. Hoping you get out as cleanly as possible, in the sense that Leah got out with her entire family intact. That may be too much to wish for, but here’s hoping for the best! La Chiem!

    • Simi Valley

      I stayed under the radar for six months while getting everything done that I needed so I could bail. Having no family in the cult and no job or business connections with culties made it that much easier for me. You will decide when you’ve had enough and will take the plunge, and I’m sure you’ll find it well worth the trouble.

      • Good Fella

        Yes, Simi. I recall very clearly your name when I was part of the scene back in the day. I was so pleasantly surprised to see your name suddenly appear here. Nicely done. Planning is the key to minimize the fallout.

    • Interested

      Your courage is to be admired. What you said touched me deeply. I am a never in having to live a “good roads policy” I find it so hard to bite my tongue. I cannot imagine having to do that day in day out. Come visit often.

      • Good Fella

        Thanks, Interested. If I’ve helped you and others to comprehend what it takes to just ‘live’ in this cult, I’m pleased. I’ve been visiting here for the last 7 years but as a lurker. Not much longer tho.

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      It usually takes one person in the group/family to muster up the courage to leave before others will follow. As difficult and impossible it is, remember it is Only going to get worse. You probably have NO idea of the long term effects this is having on you not just mentally but physically as well. Remember those who you care about are going through this as well. I don’t want to sound like a dramarama, but the current environment in every way has become so toxic and stressful that it is causing severe damage and time is of the essence. Trying to think clearly and soundly right now is nearly impossible. My suggestion is to leave this environment Completely and yes that includes jobs and social networks and give yourself a break and a rest. Experience life with non scientologists and a healthy lifestyle for a while. Recuperate first then sort out all the bits and pieces. Then you will be in a better position to help those who remained in.

      There are many on the outside who will help with all the practical matters of immediate survival. You can contact Chuck Beatty 1-866-XSEAORG or Tory Magoo ToryMagoo44@gmail.com for starters.

      I’m not going to sugar coat this. There’s a lot of work in recovering, but if you want to help your family, it is worth it. Also, remember that you are not a trained mental health counselor so don’t try and do that job or beat yourself up if you can’t immediately help your loved ones out. There is a new wave of members exiting now so you will have a lot of company. What you will get back is You. Best wishes for a speedy return.

      • Good Fella

        Solid advice, THDNE and I take it to heart. You’re one of the voices I pay close attention to when you speak. I’ve noted the phone # and email address and will use them.

        Once my real name is revealed it will cause a few tremors here and there and hopefully cause a few more to remove the scales from their eyes. I know which family members will shed me like dead skin, but that’s expected and will cause no real loss.

        What I really hope to do is make contact with all those others who are fleeing the sinking boat. God, I really look forward to that. Having been around for the last 50 years in Scn, I suspect there are a few good buddies out there that will be more than happy to have a beer or two and some story sharing. That includes you THDNE. And finally, just having a happy moment with myself and a cold one after I put it all in motion.

        Thanks so much for your regard for me. You are a good person and a good friend.

  • El Con Blubbard

    What is so crazy is that no one can do anything about the criminal activities one experiences in Scientology. This is where the mind control really messes one up! Staff members look at you with the blank stare and say things like…”I don’t know…I wasn’t there…but you need to buy the Basics and get on course” – so nothing of any value gets accomplished with KR’s – they are used to store in the PC folder’s in case someone KNOWS TOO MUCH and get’s declared because they KNOW Scientology is a scam and a cult!

  • Tony Ortega

    NEW POST UP!!!

  • BosonStark

    You know something I forgot about, does anyone know the order of KRs around Leah Remini? I believe that Katie Holmes was induced to write a KR on Leah, after the wedding, probably over the seating issue with Jennifer Lopez. Leah wanted JLo to sit at her table, against the seating arrangements, which were probably approved by Mr. David Miscavige himself, LOL.

    This was disruptive to the theta of the historic occasion — Tom Cruise marrying a woman who was truly dedicated to becoming a clam, and that they would be the power couple who would spread Sciloontology around Teegeeack faster than John Travolta could lube….I mean, COB was there with his gal, who was ready to bend back anyone’s fingers that needed a little persuasion. Tom Cruise’s 3rd wedding had to be the most sacred event on Scientology’s calendar for the decade.

    So, did Leah file her KR on Miscavige after Katie filed one on Leah? How many KRs did Tommy Davis file on Leah? If the cult wants to make a bundle on an encyclopedia of something, I think they should do one with Scilebrity KRs. It could be the SCILEBRITY NUTTERPEDIA!

    • Seannie5

      Tom’s next trip down the aisle will be his fourth – that is a lot of marriages for anyone – for a guy who supposed to be a higher being and who is the only person who can help with a car accident, it’s a pretty lousy record!

    • OrangySky

      “I believe that Katie Holmes was induced to write a KR on Leah, after the
      wedding, probably over the seating issue with Jennifer Lopez. Leah
      wanted JLo to sit at her table, against the seating arrangements…”

      Jesus, this is something out of “Bridezillas.” Come on, people! Scientology is as petty as high school.

  • ProudSP

    I would so like to write a KR on my principal. I am a teacher at an elementary school and she is an evil, evil person. She preaches respect and seeing the best in everyone and then turns around and snarls, growls, bites and humiliates teachers and parents in front of others. She is always right and everyone else is wrong. She has a few favorites who can “bend rules” but if someone falls out of her favor by speaking up to her (even privately) she will do everything she can to make that person’s life miserable. She has already driven away 4 to 5 of my friends in the school who couldn’t put up with her constant attempts to make them feel they were inferior teachers. She would target them by coming into their classroom every single day and writing up an “observation” that was filled with her personal opinions about that teacher’s capability that would go into their files. They would begin to feel persecuted. If someone comes to her with a complaint about another person, she immediately accepts that person’s version of the story and hauls into her office (or goes to the classroom and pulls them out into the hallway) to scream at them. One of my friends who was on her blacklist asked permission to take a couple of days off to visit her dying friend of 30 years. She denied the request. My friend went anyway and her friend died in her arms (true story). When she came back she found she had been written up for her “insubordination” etc. etc. There are so many stories like this. You would think the teachers’ union would be able to do something, but all they can do is file another report in her file which grows and grows. They have no real power. So far I know of 2 lawsuits from staff and 2 from parents towards this woman and yet to date she is still there. I really hate her hypocrisy and cruelty. So far I’ve been able to fly under her radar, but it oesn’t make for a good working environment overall in the school. I don’t know what it will take to get rid of her. As long as the test scores are good (and it has nothing to do with her believe me. The teachers at my school are exceptionally good at teaching and most have been there 15, 20, 25 years, long before she came on the scene. They know how to teach)..as long as those test scores are high, no one in “authority” really cares what she does. Maybe I’ll write it anyway and just get it off my chest even if f have nowhere to send it.

    • Seannie5

      Hopefully she is near retirement age? I have a few teacher friends and have heard interesting stories about principals and other teachers ;P

    • grundoon

      If you think a KR would help, you haven’t been paying attention.

      There is no situation so bad that L. Ron Hubbard Ethics can’t make it worse.

  • J. Swift

    Tommy Davis Refresher Course:

    http://bcove.me/b40mgcir

  • The following comment might be controversial for some people, because I know there are quite a few people out there who think, “Honesty is the best policy.” And that confessions can heal a wounded soul. I used to believe in all of that. It took me a while to find out that it is okay to have your own secrets, hold other people’s secrets and not rat out everyone around you. In fact you can never make real friends if you live your life believing that everyone should be honest to everyone all the time and that if they aren’t it is your prerogative to force it upon them.

    Boundaries exist for a reason. Back when I was living with my Scientology family there were no boundaries. I had to install a lock on my bedroom door and, password my phone and computer to keep my parents from snooping on me. They used to open and read my mail all the time, just like in the Sea Org, and it took several shouting matches to get them to leave my mail alone. I had considered opening a PO box, but this was around the time that everything started to go “paperless” so I started doing that one-by-one with all my bills. As well as locking my room when I left the house–lest there be any stray phone bills or something laying around.

    In Scientology you are expected to have no secrets and keep nothing private. It goes far beyond writing knowledge reports and into relentless invasion of privacy. If you hide your cell phone screen from snooping while reading or writing a text message or if you have a phone call and set it down without immediately recapping the conversation to everyone within earshot you are considered out-ethics. If you don’t immediately divulge information upon questioning you are told to submit to a confessional.

    If I picked up my keys to go to my car for any reason I was questioned. If someone called me and I ignored it, I was questioned. If I answered I was expected to divulge the details of the call. If I walked out of the room I was expected to announce where I was going. If I came out of the bathroom I was expected to reveal my activities in there. If I was on the internet I was expected to be in plain view of everyone. When I came home I was expected to give a rundown of where I had been and what I had done for the night. I had to answer for everything and towards the end, before I left in a gale of drama it was driving me insane.

    It is because of this that I learned to lie and come up with answers on the spot instead of saying that I didn’t want to talk about it or that it was private. I learned how to give complete lies which left no openings for further questioning and satisfied any Scientologist who might be asking me about things. It is not always better to tell the truth. That is perhaps one of the most difficult things I have had to learn against my Scientology programming. Second to that was that some things are better left unsaid. Also, that morality is relative to each individual.

    I am a prolific sharer nowadays, because I find it liberating to be able to divulge what I thought were unscrupulous details of my life which most people consider normal, or if not normal at least they don’t consider them heinous as my parents and fellow Scientologists did. In any event, I live by the singular rule that even the lawless members of society follow: Don’t snitch. I have taken the blame for countless people because that rule in particular is part of my personal morals along with sincerity of words and actions.

    Now this of course is not inclusive of serious things like murder or rape. Fortunately I don’t keep company with people who are guilty of those things. Again this is one man’s life and opinion so don’t take it too seriously. There are a number of people who comment or read here who apparently think internet commenting is a dire matter deserving of extreme emotional investment, it is to those people that I am speaking. It ain’t that serious and neither am I, but don’t get booty-tickled if you express your disagreement and I express my disagreement with your disagreement.

    • Mooser

      I think a person is entitled to hold their mud, if they want to.

      • Great White Clam

        deleted

      • Same!

    • OrangySky

      There’s a saying, “You’re only as sick as your secrets.” But the kind of secret to which the saying refers – the things we’re ashamed of, the dark things we’ve done, the things that we fear to look at or think others will hate us for – that kind of ‘secret’ is not the same thing as PRIVACY. Privacy = the right to set one’s own boundaries, to keep certain areas of one’s life one’s own. And Privacy means not EVERYONE is “owed” your self-disclosures – they have to EARN that privilege. As far as sharing others’ secrets, if that secret is hurting no one, then it should remain a secret. If it’s not a prosecutable crime and the person isn’t an amoral criminal, it should remain a secret. If it’s criminal, dangerous or a cry for help (as in a drug OD, etc.), then it becomes a gray area. But no person should ever have the right to “play God” with someone else’s secrets.

      Happy New Year, Derek!

    • grundoon
    • aquaclara

      Thanks, Derek. This is a valuable addition to today’s article. As a never-in, Jefferson’s post today about Knowledge Reports gave me the creeps. It is unimaginable in this day and age that ANYONE would intervene like this. Yet I know that what you and Jefferson and the others have reported is rock solid truth.

      It is just one more reason why I detest the evils of this cult.

      Your comments are refreshingly honest, and in line with Jefferson’s, paint the picture of the busybody cult that insists on controlling your every thought and deed. I hope that freedom to protect your own dreams and thoughts and ideas is one of the most precious parts of being on the outside of the cult.

      Just when I think I have heard it all, more crap is revealed…… Thank heavens you and Jefferson and Tory and so many others see things as they are, not as you were told they were.

      Happy new year, Derek! This is going to be your year. Less crap, more fun.

    • Jenstnick

      Thank you for sharing. Your perspective helps those of us “never in” understand the culture and the psychological warfare you were all fighting against.

  • Never forget that the top “ethics condition” Hubbard ever issued was CONTROL (Flag Order).