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Jonny Jacobsen reviews the new Scientology memoir by Hungarian writer Peter Bonyai

Peter_BonyaiOur man in Paris, British journalist Jonny Jacobsen, is back with another great piece — this time, a lengthy review of the newest book recounting the journey into and out of the Church of Scientology.

Underground Bunker regulars will recall that Hungarian ex-Scientology member Peter Bonyai (pictured, right) helped us out with a story in April on the supposedly transparent and independent Central-European Religious Freedom Institute (CERFI). (Jura Nanuk, who heads up the lobbying organisation, had somehow forgotten to mention his allegiance to Scientology at the group’s website. Nor, so far as I can see, has the situation changed.)

Now Bonyai’s memoir of his 10 years as a Scientologist in Hungary is available in English, Money, Power, Servitude: Adventures in the Wonderland of Scientology. He translated the original edition himself and former Scientology spokesman Mike Rinder stepped in to edit the English version.

Bonyai spent most of his 10 years inside Scientology in its “Sea Organization,” having been recruited to it at the age of 17 in 1995. “I was technically a minor, but it did not seem to be an issue,” he notes.

Bonyai’s description of himself at that age matches that of many adolescents: Intelligent, a little full of himself perhaps, but with a sense of unease, of dissatisfaction at the prospect of a conventional life pursuing material wealth. It was more than enough for a Scientology recruiter to work on.

Despite the fact that he had already read and dismissed Dianetics (recommended by one of his teachers) Bonyai was pulled in after taking the personality test in his home town of Pécs, Hungary.

The devastating test results, delivered with absolute conviction by a staffer who introduced herself as a Scientology “priestess,” shattered his adolescent bravado.

I was told that I was an irresponsible, nervous, unstable, and pathetic individual in urgent need of attention. She made sure that each statement hit home, and repeated them over and over when I expressed my doubts. She was adamant about the evaluation and gave me an unquestioning gaze each time I wanted to contradict her and explain myself. And she mentioned several times that Dianetics can help me to improve that condition. I was completely overwhelmed at the end of it and I felt totally devastated… Thinking it cannot get any worse and I could definitely use some help to address my deep-lying unhappiness, I decided to give Dianetics a chance.

Like many other new recruits, his initial experience of auditing – Scientology’s version of therapy – was also positive. The sense of relief he experiences after going over a minor point of emotional conflict, helped pull him deeper down into the rabbit hole.

But the very next past incident he tries to audit shows the dangers inherent in the Scientology’s system of therapy: “…[T]hat one went awry. I got a bit lost in the maze of my mind and started to see strange things. The mission auditor had to intervene so I could be freed from its effect.”

And there were other red flags, he writes, recalling the discomfort he felt at the take-no-prisoners tone of L. Ron Hubbard’s notorious text, Keep Scientology Working (“We’d rather have you dead than incapable”).

Nevertheless, he recalls: “I was still interested in becoming a real-life Jedi knight, so I chose to ignore that part of Scientology, which sounded like the teachings of a fanatical fundamentalist sect.”

For Bonyai then, the Scientology recruitment machine worked to perfection:

— a recruiter “found his ruin” — his weak points — via the personality test, and convinced him that Scientology had the solution;

— he was sold on the prospect of tapping into previously undreamt-of powers via Scientology;

— and the initial auditing high did not just whet his appetite for more but persuaded him to put aside any doubts he already had.

Softened up

It is in this state that he takes the “Success though Communications” course, a simplified version of the training routines. The course seems reasonable enough at first.

According to Hubbard, the first phase was being there in a spiritual sense. The basic idea was to establish the elements of communication: being there, speaking to someone, ability to receive an answer, then answer that, repeat the unanswered question if needed, or steer the conversation back to its original topic (if needed), and to conclude the conversation.

Before long though, participants have moved on to more invasive exercises. In bullbaiting, he has to sit, unflinching, while his training partner subjected him to all kinds of verbal abuse. The object of the exercise is to not react, whatever the provocation.


Peter in the Sea Org

Peter in the Sea Org

Critics of Scientology – including many former members – have long argued that these exercises soften up new recruits, undermining their capacity for critical thinking to make them more receptive to the new belief Scientology is installing in them. Reflecting on the results of the bullbaiting exercise, Bonyai reaches much the same conclusion.

In retrospect, this ability was a blessing and a curse. It was undoubtedly useful to have greater tolerance to provocation, but it also blocked proper emotional reactions. It also had a hidden side effect (at least on me): I had a better tolerance of the crazy things going on in the Church. I was not disturbed too much by them, and I was able to put up with much more than I should have. This contributed to my prolonged stay in the Church by making me more susceptible to its indoctrination.

Later, when he takes the more hard-core version of the training routines, he experiences an even stronger sense of dissociation.

The experience I had … regarding these communication drills became even more intense: On [the] one hand, I became more forthcoming and brave during communication, but life also became a bit surreal. External stimuli had even less effect on me, which dulled my emotions and made me experience a strange feeling: I often felt like an outsider, detached from reality, having “stepped out” of real life.

(For more on these training routines, see Tony’s interview with Sea Org veteran Claire Headley.)

Bonyai is particularly good at explaining the appeal and the power of these early steps in his Scientology induction. He has taken the time to reflect on the nature of the machine that consumed him and his insights into this process make up some of the best parts of the book.

Very quickly, he writes, he was attributing anything good that happened to him to Scientology — anything bad of course, was down to his own lack of dedication to the movement.

The net result of this (you can observe this with the majority of the Scientologists) is a partial loss of the sense of reality, or a specific kind of financial irresponsibility where you can spend any amount of money on your own spiritual progress, as by doing so you believe you will achieve a better spiritual state, and money will thereafter find you mysteriously as a result.

This mindset of course makes it much easier for staff members to get money out of public members of Scientology, he points out. The upper echelons of the movement meanwhile adopt a more hard-headed approach to the world, including a barely concealed contempt for “public” Scientologists.


During training in Munich, Germany, Bonyai gets an early taste of the tremendous pressure on staffers to get results, no matter what — and to meet the Thursday 2:00 pm deadline.

Statistics were calculated and monitored on a daily basis. Staff members were mercilessly hounded if their statistics were not in the proper range to achieve a higher value by Thursday. Two major methods were used to increase productivity: There was some minor internal PR (pep talks, emphasizing the greatness of the purpose of Scientology, small rewards etc), but threats, yelling and enforced overtime were the favored methods.

When he runs into difficulty on a course and gets sent to ethics, the officer there decides the hostility of some family members to Scientology means he has to return to either handle their objections or disconnect — cut off all contact — from them.

Back in Pécs, he keeps up the training, learning how to evaluate the personality test — the same one that had pulled him into the movement.

This course had a special significance in my life. This is where my transformation started. I was originally a shy, idealistic and good-natured teenager, and I started to change into a charming, silver-tongued and unscrupulous clone of L. Ron Hubbard, who embodies the phrase “the end justifies the means… [The recruiter has] to find the vulnerabilities of the person and throw a lot of salt on these wounds and make it clear that this/these is/are a serious personality defect, which MUST be addressed, and of course, Scientology can do that. From time to time, the evaluation had to state that these are all scientific facts, not just personal opinions, as they are based on a scientific test.

(This bogus claim for the scientific basis of the personality test was a key factor in the 2009 French convictions of Scientology for organised fraud.)

Back in Munich, having reached an uneasy compromise with his family, Peter continues his training but is soon back in trouble with the org’s ethics officers — essentially for asking too many questions. So he decides to apply to join the Sea Org, to bypass what he suspects are the “suppressive” elements in Munich.

Having filled in the highly intrusive Life History Form (“46. Have you ever been involved in homosexual activities or sexual perversions?”) he signs his billion-year contract and joins Scientology’s most elite — and most exploited — cadre.

Sea Org life of course, is a completely different experience to being a paying, public Scientologist, or even a staffer on a five-year contract.

Peter gets used to seeing Sea Org executives bawling out their underlings.

László [Peter’s boss] assured me that this is pretty common in the Sea Org, and there is even a policy letter from Hubbard stating that you would need to shout at the dumb ones if that was required to get your job done.

But never in front of the public, paying Scientologists, …so his boss usually brought him to a basement office for the 10-minute yelling sessions.

Later, he describes another Sea Org executive in Copenhagen, an Austrian by the name of Walter Kotric.

He had zero tolerance for slackness, poor job performance and to put it mildly, he was not particularly fond of excuses… He also had a special ability: he was able to yell with incredible volume, intensity and intention, a skill he used frequently if he was not satisfied with someone or wanted to get instant compliance to an order. He had no reservations about getting physical if he thought the situation warranted it. He usually grabbed his victim, smashed or pushed him against the nearest wall and screamed at him.

Compare that passage with this account from former Scientology executive Don Larson, one of David Miscavige’s enforcers during his rise to power: “David Miscavige comes up, grabs him by the tie and starts bashing him into the filing cabinet,” Larson told Britain’s Panorama team for a 1987 documentary. “And he’s thrown out in the street; his tie is ripped off.”


A ‘heartless bastard’

By the time Bonyai is a fully fledged member of the Sea Org, he is well on the way to becoming, as he himself puts it, another heartless bastard — and this is another strength of the book. Bonyai does not shrink from describing just how objectionable he himself became during his time inside the Sea Org.

I was slowly turning into a cold, calculating, merciless and rather manipulative person, with the occasional streak of cruelty. Hubbard actually recommended or hinted at ignoring traditional values in his voluminous policy letters and bulletins about the Sea Org, citing the paramount importance of the mission of the Scientology movement, which overrode any other aspect of the situations in question.

Appointed to a post in middle management, Bonyai comes under instant pressure to get results — and he learns the rules fast.

One of my fellow “monks” summarized the most basic survival trick: If bricks start to fall, you better jump aside so they hit the guy directly under you. The classic “lick upwards, kick downwards” policy applied.

In order to survive as a member of middle management, I had to name a person responsible if the stats did not go up or downright crashed or there was a problem…and I had to present a handling (an ethics order, a punishment, ordering overtime etc.) which satisfied my seniors.

The favored method of getting compliance was “you do not go to sleep until it is done” and I learned to use it fast. Otherwise I would have to take the fall and suffer the consequences (overtime, reduced rations, no day-offs etc.).

A little later, he reflects, “ I … realized that finding a target to blame was a way to survive in the Sea Org, where impossible deadlines were an everyday occurrence.”

This is as good a summary of the Sea Org’s dog-eat-dog atmosphere as you could hope to find.

Very quickly then, Bonyai is turning into just the kind of rottweiler Scientology requires him to be. Two months into his Sea Org career and back home for Christmas, he is bragging to his horrified parents about how he handles his subordinates.

On Christmas Day, he phones one minion to pile the pressure on and ensure he has completed his work in time for the Thursday deadline. “My parents were a bit freaked out about my creepy new personality…,” he confesses.

But then this was the kind of executive Hubbard wanted, as Bonyai points out: “The fire-breathing product officer will be followed and supported when the wishywashy old pal guy will be stepped all over in the rush to follow a real leader.” (Hubbard Policy Letter, January 17, 1982 “What is an Executive?”)

“Now I knew the basics,” writes Bonyai. “I was ready to assist the expansion of Scientology with brutal efficiency and blast all barriers away.”

Promoted to a key recruitment post, he applies the same take-no-prisoners tactics, targeting the 16-to-21 age group “because it was rather easy to convince and manipulate them,” playing on their utopian idealism to overcome any doubts they might have.

With hindsight he can see the irony: not so long before, he too had been just that kind of idealist.


Other details might shock anyone new to the way the Sea Org works, but will sound strangely familiar to Bunker regulars: A 15-year-old boy appointed director of personnel; translators falling asleep over their typewriters as the latest impossible deadline draws nearer. Orders from on high to get the product delivered NOW NOW NOW!

And there are the late-night visits to the whales, the rich public Scientologists, to get the cheque — however long it takes. Bonyai quotes Hubbard’s justification for this kind of foot-in-the-door regging.

“Hard sell means insistence that people buy. It means caring about the person and not being reasonable about stops or barriers but caring enough to get him reasonable about stops or barriers but caring enough to get him through the stops or barriers to get the service that’s going to rehabilitate him.” (“Copyrighting”, Hubbard Policy Letter, September 26, 1979.)

Bonyai’s own summary is better: “The ideal registrar was like an attack dog which locked his jaws onto the victim’s leg and could only be removed by hacking off that limb.”

Particularly disturbing is his account of how his cold-blooded Sea Org values lead him to sabotage his first marriage. Having persuaded his partner that they should marry, he quickly decides that she is holding him back.

The extremely Social Darwinist attitude fostered in the organization brought out the worst in me –- the woman did not meet my expectations, the woman had to be dropped… I decided to deal with the situation with the speed and resolve expected of a Sea Org member. I told my wife that I was going to divorce her and I would submit the papers to the court in week. She was devastated, tried to convince me to give her another chance, but I was adamant about my decision…The whole procedure was over in 15 minutes the following day and we were officially divorced. I was proud of myself. In my view I had effectively handled the situation and remained at cause, not letting my emotions and feelings influence my judgment.

Credit to Bonyai for having the courage to tell this tale.

Bonyai also sets out in some detail how he suffered from the perverse and arbitrary nature of Scientology’s justice system.

Part of the problem, he acknowledges, is that he had made a fair number of enemies during his scramble up the greasy management pole; and just as he had learned to find underlings to blame when things went wrong, so his bosses made him the scapegoat when it suited them.

More than once he is sent up to the European headquarters in Copenhagen for various disciplinary measures — committees of evidence and security checks.

On one occasion he is suspected of being a spy for Hungary’s National Security Office.

A specialist was flown in from Germany — a man trained by Miscavige’s direct underlings to conduct such special interrogations. The questions were not limited to suspected espionage activities — I had to confess every harmful act or transgression that sprang to mind during the sessions, even if these had nothing to do with the main line of questioning. Priest-penitent privilege did not [apply], so they could use anything I said against me. Finally, the sessions were videotaped.

A security guard sleeps in his room on a mattress in front of the locked door, the key tucked under the mattress. One of his fellow inmates on the punishment programme, a Norwegian woman, is being disciplined for having considered suicide.

‘Tom Fucking Cruise’

Peter survives several brushes with Scientology’s thought police, its heavy ethics. And each time, he returns to Hungary disgruntled but still persuaded that the problem is not Scientology but the way it is being applied.

Eventually, however, the back-stabbing, cut-throat atmosphere of Sea Org life becomes too much. “I started to slowly collapse spiritually,” he writes. But he still blames himself for failing to meet the impossible targets set by his superiors.

Then in 2004, Tom Cruise gets his Freedom Medal of Valor for services to Scientology.

Even as a dedicated Sea Org member, I felt his whole story was a gigantic insult to all hard-working Sea Org members. I had been working day and night for the Church for the last seven years, enduring all the extreme production demands, yelling, humiliation in the name of greater good etc. And then Tom Fucking Cruise gets a medal, despite the fact that he was only disseminating over the previous 1 or 2 years. By the way, I never really liked Tom Cruise — he was a kind of a symbol of what was wrong with mainstream US culture. He was not even a Sea Org member, just a public Scientologist, whom we considered loser dilettantes for not taking real responsibility for clearing the planet.

And yet, despite everything, he stays.

He even fights to stay in the Sea Org when, during yet another heavy ethics assault, he is told he could risk being declared a Suppressive Person and cast out of the movement.

I really wanted to believe that the new civilization envisioned by Hubbard was attainable. I did not want to desert my hard-working comrades and I did not want to be singled out as someone who had not helped if Scientology indeed succeeded in clearing the planet. I did not want to lose my wife either (I thought that she would leave me if I left the Sea Org for any reason), and finally, I was so deeply involved with the movement that I could not even imagine any realistic alternative to that life…

The other side of the coin of course was that he had no money, no qualifications and virtually no relationships outside the movement. “I was not on the best terms with my family either, so I felt I didn’t have any other viable options.”

During that final disciplinary cycle he is kicked out of the Sea Org and told to consider himself lucky that he has not been declared Suppressive (“by then I had started to believe I was a Suppressive Person”).

His second wife, Andrea, is isolated from him and comes under relentless pressure to to divorce him.

The worst month of my life ensued. I felt utterly destroyed. My big dream of spearheading the creation of a new civilization was crushed. I spent 10 years working for the Church, giving up on all my ambitions and career options. I spent all the money I ever had on Scientology. And the end result was practically nothing….All I could show in the real world was a high school education, a good command of the English language and a mysterious 10-year gap in my life where I was apparently off to save the world. I knew almost nobody who was not a Scientologist. I had been virtually living a bubble and knew little about the so-called wog world.

Despite the pressure on Andrea, she refuses to divorce him. They even meet in secret every night during the crackdown, and finally she defies orders and rejoins him (the book is dedicated to her).

But now Bonyai is a virtual outcast from the movement, with $9,000 in bills to pay for the all that free training he received while inside the Sea Org — and 1,500 hours of unpaid work to do as amends.


The journey out

Peter tries to rebuild his life as a public Scientologist, setting up his own business. But now he is on the receiving end of the hard sell he and his colleagues meted out to public members back in the day. His disillusionment is growing.

It was very hard to face the fact that I had been such a sucker and had fallen for a sleazy con game like the Church of Scientology. I was under such extreme control in the Sea Org, but now I had ample opportunity to look at Scientology from the outside. It was embarrassingly apparent that nothing of real importance or magnitude happened or got done in the Church…

His doubts grow as he takes advantage of the unrestricted access to the Internet he has outside the Sea Org. But the breaking point for Bonyai turns out to be one hard-sell assault too many:

This was the last straw. I had enough of the insatiable greed of Scientology. My only regret at this point was that it took so long — 10 years of hard work as a virtual slave and throwing $50,000 out the window. All the bitterness that had accumulated over these long years came out in a big burst of anger — screamed at the guy for using Mafia tactics and I told him I would not pay a fucking cent. My conscience was clear, I added, I did everything they asked and if they did not like the type of amends I did, they should get back to me in writing. I then hung up on him. When I put down receiver, I knew it was over and there was no way back. I was no longer a member of the Church. I could not care less about their weird rules, their lust for money and planetary clearing for that matter.

Learning more about the devastating effects of Scientology’s disconnection policy helps him shed any final illusions he had about Hubbard’s contribution to humanity and his journey out is complete.

As hard as Bonyai tries to explain Scientology terms along the way, this is probably a book best read by those already familiar with this particular brand of sci-fi totalitarianism.

Bonyai’s experience in the Sea Org may not have been as brutal as some other survivors.

But his analysis of how he was drawn and transformed by the Scientology machine, his honesty in owning up to what he did while under its spell, makes this book a welcome addition to the growing list of ex-member memoirs.

— Jonny Jacobsen


Camilla Andersson: Remembering Ann Tidman

Another great interview by Karen de la Carriere…



Your proprietor talks Mary Sue Hubbard

KABC Channel 7 does a fun job with the Mary Sue Hubbard house, with appearances by Karen de la Carriere and your proprietor…



Posted by Tony Ortega on September 2, 2014 at 07:20

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Learn about Scientology with our numerous series with experts…

BLOGGING DIANETICS (We read Scientology’s founding text) 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25

UP THE BRIDGE (Claire Headley and Bruce Hines train us as Scientologists) 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37, 38, 39, 40, 41, 42, 43, 44, 45, 46, 47, 48

GETTING OUR ETHICS IN (Jefferson Hawkins explains Scientology’s system of justice) 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14

SCIENTOLOGY MYTHBUSTING (Historian Jon Atack discusses key Scientology concepts) 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37, 38, 39, 40, 41, 42, 43, 44, 45, 46, 47, 48, 49

PZ Myers reads L. Ron Hubbard’s “A History of Man” | Scientology’s Master Spies | Scientology’s Private Dancer
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  • DodoTheLaser
    • Juicer77

      Okay enough with the busty babes, where are the fabulous fellas?

      • DodoTheLaser


        • Barbara Angel

          Much better, sick of all the busty babe pictures. But the G-string is missing, or crotch shot, I’m rather partial to the male body.

        • Eileen

          How about a little something without a soul patch, and without a chicken head where a belt buckle would be?

        • MaxSpaceman

          odd, but my thorax looks remarkably like that

  • DodoTheLaser

    I really love today’s post.

  • i-Betty

    Before I read Jonny’s report (I got as far as Peter’s personality test which has made me livid) I just wanted to say thanks to Karen and Tony for their latest interviews – such a fun piece, and Tony is wearing his lucky shirt which made me happy.

    It’s been a peculiar start to my day, beginning with dropping my son (who, I thought was still five years old – turns out he grew up without me noticing) off for his first day of college which made me a bit teary. However, that’s not what I wanted to say.

    The strangest coincidence, and the answer to a puzzle. I don’t know if you remember at Christmas we had a late night visit to my home from two people during a house party we were holding? Several neighbours had also mentioned receiving visits during the day from these people asking if they were aware that they were sharing their street with a bigot. We had great fun trying to persuade them to come in and get drunk with us.

    Well there was a knock on my door this morning and it was the Jehovah’s Witnesses trying to redeem me…and one of them was the man from that night! I honestly don’t think he remembered or recognised me, and the oddest thing is that I’ve never really spoken out directly against the JWs because I have a lovely old school friend who is a lifelong member of the local chapter. I have spoken out about them in general elsewhere, but nothing like the fuss I’ve made about scientology, so it was a natural assumption to make. Just in the 2 months prior I’d been to the Coral Gables org, made various attempts to track down the volunteer organisation that assists Brits escaping scientology (among other cults) and visited the Houses of Parliament with our local MP to discuss scientology, then out of the blue these guys turned up – then never reappeared, which seemed odd for scientologists out for retribution.

    Oh well, I’m happy to host any and all religious minorities with suspect practices. Come one, come all – just please give me notice so I can get the kettle on.

    • joan nieman

      Good story Betty and thanks for telling it. I wonder if that guy you saw works for both religions or if he is just JW. They used to come to my door years ago and my husband would answer and say ” just a minute, I will get my wife”. I would be so enraged I would yell at the Jw’s and later at my husband for passing the buck. Being a widow now enables me to pick and choose who I have coming to my door!

  • We all die. There is nothing shameful, embarrassing or distasteful about

    It happens.

    But in the Sea Org, advanced level areas, Freewinds, one cannot talk
    about a death and in many cases there are penalties for *spreading entheta* or
    promoting “Black PR”. It is supposed to be a secret, in lockdown by Office of
    Special Affairs.

    Public Scientolgists have funerals because they could hardly be ordered to
    not have them.

    But hardly ever for Sea Org members and never at INT Base.

    How unnatural.

    How comforting to all come together in a memorial and remembrance and say
    great things about the person who has passed..

    In the video above one learns how embarrassed Scientology Inc is of

    Promising elite, superior, advance spiritual beings that are practically
    bullet proof from illness (A Clear no longer gets a common cold !) (Dianetics),
    it is disconcerting to say the least when Scientologists die off.

    1) at a very young age.

    2) at OT VIII (The highest level) after paying $1 million in fees to get

    Remember the 2 people closest to Hubbard, Mary Sue Hubbard, and Annie
    Tidman both died of cancer.

    Mary Sue had 55+ years of Scientology counseling, and died of breast
    cancer Annie was in the Church since 12 years old and died at 55 of lung Cancer
    after God knows what “auditing.”

    As with Mary Sue, so it was with Annie, the Church did not issue a
    statement, a thank you, a respectful note to someone who had contributed to them
    for decades.

    Annie Tidman’s mom Jean Tidman, a 91 year old working for the Church in
    Clearwater was not informed of Annie’s death. Neither were her sisters told.

    Camilla informed me, that to this day, people imprisoned at Gold Base do
    not know Annie has died even though they worked together for the last 30

    She became a non person.

    The Church of Scientology feverishly tries to COVER Up deaths.

    WHY ?

    I recall being at the Flag Land Base in Clearwater when a 2 year old died
    in the Sandcastle swimming pool due to baby sitter negligence.

    This was clearly not the Church’s fault.

    But their reaction was swift and with a sledgehammer.

    It was to be buried, silenced and not spoken about and anyone who repeated
    the story would be assigned TREASON with full penalties and amends. It was
    spreading *entheta* and it was Bad PR.

    WHY ?

    Because the “Flag experience” does not contain death. It supposedly
    contains the *Majesty* of advancing spirituality and while you may gossip about
    spinning in a gyroscopic wheel and sniffing fragrances so that you can
    subsequently sniff people’s endocrine’s systems, you may NOT speak of a death at
    the Flag Land Base.

    Scientologists die like anyone else and their hyped up claims of “Cause
    over Life” “Spiritual immortality” “Exterior to the body with full perception
    stably” are beating the drum for $$$$.

    This site lists a lot of the forgotten ~~ buried and covered up deaths,
    including the death of young children.

    • DodoTheLaser

      Thank you Karen and Camilla. Thank you very much.

      • joan nieman

        Yes, indeed. Thank you Karen and Camilla for honoring Annie as she so deserves. What a waste of a life. The very idea that scientology grabs the young, holds them hostage and turns them into slaves for a corrupt and greedy cult is unforgivable.

        • Camilla Andersson

          Thank you Joan, She deserves it. When you’r in and you’r loyal, you don’t see these things, that’s the sad thing.

      • Camilla Andersson

        Thank you Dodo for the support!

    • i-Betty

      Another fantastic interview, and lovely to give Camilla the opportunity to publicly remember her friend.

      • Camilla Andersson

        Thank you so much. It meant a lot to say this out. When I left in 2012, from big blue, I had no idea she was ill or had died, I cam across that data on the internet randomly. I could not get over it, that I had been in the Sea Org and for over a year there had been NO WORD, none, on this subject. It just proves again, now on video as court evidence, that this is no longer a Church.

    • philosofa

      I always love your video’s and this one, in particular, with Camilla Andersson on the shameful way the co$ behaves towards it’s ill and dying members exposes the cult for the heartless opportunists that they are.

      The way Camilla spoke about her friend Annie Tidman was deeply moving. Just shocking to think that the cherch discarded her so callously after a lifetime of service.

      • Espiando

        Not as callous as the way they treated her when she still had some aura of authority. Stole her Loyal Officer rank, stole the jewelry that LRH gave her as thank-yous, ripped her and Pat apart, stole her back from Jim Logan just at the moment she thought she got away (that one’s pretty high on Marty’s Karma Payback list), buried her in Gold just like they did Diana Hubbard, and then and only then treated her like shit when she was dying.

        When all is said and done, she took care of an old man, and that is what she got for it. Yes, the old man in question was Satan Incarnate, but she didn’t remotely deserve what she got.

        • Missionary Kid

          I’ve added Satan Incarnate to the list of LRH nicknames, to be posted later.

          • DodoTheLaser

            He wished.

            • Missionary Kid

              Good point.

        • philosofa

          Thank you, Espi. I shall googlehearsay all you have mentioned to learn more about this story.
          “Scientology … always worse than you think” doesn’t even begin to describe the depths of human evil the cult sinks to on a daily basis. Thank Xenu for you ex’s, who take the time to keep on exposing this evil in all of it’s gory detail, so others outside the cult are made aware of it.

        • Barbara Angel

          Have asked this question before and no answer yet, what did happen to Diana Hubbard please? Not much comes up when Googled, only her being the daughter of blubbard etc

          • Espiando

            She’s working in an obscure section at Int Base, with no real authority, micromanaged by Five Foot One, still paranoid as ever. She’s the only Hubbard left in Scientology.

            • Barbara Angel

              Thanks for answering me. Has she been disappeared like Shelly? Surely she would have previously had a lot of clout, so mustravage must have done something to wrest power from her. Do you know more please?

            • Espiando

              Diana hasn’t been “disappeared” like Shelly. She’s just stuck on Int Base, unable to leave, but she’s been completely neutered in terms of power. She has no remaining people loyal mostly to her to do something like head up a coup. She’s just there, doing her job, whatever it might be these days.

              She hasn’t been erased. She’s had something worse done: pushed into the background until she’s nothing but shades of grey.

            • villagedianne

              But Diana’s daughter escaped. I guess someday we will hear the back story on that.

          • MaxSpaceman

            Rinder has reported in the past that Diana is deeply drinking the Kool-Aid as a staff member in video unit at Gold, Hemet Calif.

          • Camilla Andersson

            Diana Hubbard is at Int/Gold. She is still in the Sea Org.

      • Camilla Andersson

        Thank you so much for your support! It is completely heartless!!

    • Missionary Kid

      It’s interesting that a cult that claims to remember past lives can’t even remember someone from the present.

      • rom661

        It’s interesting that I can remember the lyrics to sitcoms from the 60’s but have no idea where I parked my car….

        • Missionary Kid

          As we get older, short term memory goes. Co$, on the other hand only memorializes two people: LRH and little Davy.

          • villagedianne

            If that time comes, will they memorialize Davy? Or will it be like Stalin after Kruschev took over, when Stalin’s crimes were “exposed” finally.

            • Missionary Kid

              Good question. I believe that there will be a small cadre of true blelvers after the collapse. They will treat Davy like Stalin was by Kruschev, only with more venom.

            • villagedianne

              It will be even worse if Dave takes the money and runs.

            • Missionary Kid

              Mostly because he’s doing such a good job of destroying the cult. I consider any money he’s grabbed as lost. Maybe that’s too pessimistic.

            • Once_Born

              Depends on who “they” are. History, it is said, is written by the winners – and in the struggle for power that will come after Miscavige is deposed or dies, there is unlikely to be any clear winner.

              From it’s earliest days Scientology has always seen itself as under threat from breakaway groups – so-called ‘squirrels’- and with some justification. One of the reasons that Scientology appeals to people is that it promises believers special knowledge – and an enhanced status to go with it. Some of the more enterprising members have always wanted more – to become a guru in their own right.

              This is part of the reason that Scientology is so controlling – if the discipline had ever been slackened off the CofS would have disintegrated into multiple warring sects, each believing themselves to be possession of the ‘true faith’.

              Miscavige has resisted naming a successor, and the ‘executives’ have been reduced to traumatised yes-men. If he loses power (&/or when he dies) the ‘discipline’ that has preserved and reproduced Hubbard’s seriously dated ideas will collapse… and there will be a free-for-all.

              Multiple flags will be raised. Some would -be leaders will promise a return to ‘the true faith’. Some will offer reforms. Some will strike out on their own, offering new revelations.

              Even if one group prevails (and achieves control of the money and property) the membership will probably be reduced to a less than viable level. It would take a charismatic leader and a great administrator to drag it back from the brink – and even then it would be a shadow of its former self.

              More likely the CofS will disintegrate into multiple factions who will fight each other – until they start fighting among themselves. Remember, that Scientology always works – so if have failed to seize power this must mean that you have suppressive persons in your midst.

              Multiple memorials to Miscavige will be raised by obscure true believers and conspiracy theorists. However, his lasting legacy will likely be assessed by journalists, and then real historians – and it won’t be good.

        • Artoo45

          Daisies! Diamonds! Snowflakes! That Girl . . .

        • Peter

          It’s in my garage and I had no idea of where it came from. (Don’t worry, the parking fee isn’t that much. )

        • Once_Born

          I was once standing in a supermarket car park, trying to look casual, when a nice old lady wandered up to me and said, “you’ve lost your car, haven’t you love?” All I could say was “yes, I have”.

          She suggested that I, “look around that corner” because it was, “very deceptive”. I said thank you, looked… and there is was.

          A good Scientologist would probably have ignored her, and still be standing there.

        • Aslansown

          In dire memory situations, I’ve been known to push the alarm button on my key and then follow the noise – it’s very effective!

      • joan nieman

        MK you must put that on your list of things said bout scientology.

    • Panopea Abrupta

      The denial of death is the refusal of life.
      It is wholly apposite that Hubbard’s spawn, members of a cult that denies the body and argues for a schizophrenic and dualistic world-view, would refuse to celebrate the lives of those lost.
      It is a perfect reflection of Hubbard who, in his last years, was still trying to scrape imagined and delusory clusters of spirits off himself in a vain bid to be well.
      It is a testimony to his insanity that thousands have been inveigled upon to join him in his lunacy
      despite clear evidence in his life that he was a criminal obese power-mongering bully who cared for no one and nothing but himself and lusted for and demanded gold and obeisance.
      He was dead while in life.
      His legacy, fortunately, will be a footnote in the annals of idiocy.

      • joan nieman

        Ah! Such eloquent writing Pan. It is always a treat to read your prose.

    • Gerard Plourde

      Sadly, it’s not surprising that Scientology tries to hide death. The fact of death puts the lie to its claim that its adepts can control matter, energy, space, and time and also to the unmitigated hubris contained in Tom Cruise’s absurd statement from the award video that “when a scientologist passes an accident he knows that he’s the only one who can help.”

      • philosofa

        I can’t help but smile whenever I see that insanely deluded statement from Tom Snooze … and perhaps there is a minuscule shred of accidental truth in his egotistical ramblings.

        As it turned out he was able to “help” … by inadvertantly showing the interwebz and the rest of the world what he and his “religion” are about. And, by being famous, generating a huge audience for his faux pas that a less famous clam would not have acheived.Horrible exposure for the clams … an awesome lulzy win for the anti’s, ex’s and critics. Ha!

        Keep it up, Tom Ruze … carry right on with those foot-bullets. As your career falters and your reputation continues to get flushed down the pan you might just begin to wonder why, open your eyes and wake up! One day you might even become self-aware enough to recognize that you were never Homo Novis – just Homo Hubris.

        • Barbara Angel

          It’s too late for him, his head has been up his own bum for so long and he’s been enjoying the view. He’s the only one with *soupa* powers and we are just dumb wogs who deserve every bad thing.
          Edit: Whoops and his BFF mustravage, he has *soupa* powers too, together they are clearing the planet for us, as unlike them, we’re all to stupid. In their next embodiment they’re both going to be really, really, really tall. No more shoe lifts needed.

          • philosofa

            I suspect you are right, B Angel. He doesn’t appear to be the most insightful individual on the block … in fact I would suggest he is depriving a village somewhere of a perfectly good village idiot.

            However, one lives in hope that all those caught in the cult web might eventually wake up and escape, even the remorselessly vain and stupid ones like Mr Snooze. Although I care about him and his ilk least of all the victims of the cult … he seems to be enjoying all the benefits of colluding with the criminal cult and having sea-org slaves pander to his whims, just like his best bud Dildo Dave Mi$cravage.

          • Sejanus

            Dinky Mutt could be 6’1″ and still be the smallest man in the room as it were. Lifts can’t give an asshole height. An asshole is always placed firmly at the base of the spine between two cheeks.
            As for the “greatness” that is TC and his ego…there is no road back for him.
            He has too long stood in defence of the criminal entity and its leader when there has been clear evidence he knew what was going on. He has accepted the labours of modern day slavery and had no issue with it.

            At any time whatsoever he could have held a media conference and done a Letterman…thrown everything out there before the Co$ could and cut them off at the kneecaps. He however chose not to…and for that he shoulders the blame and always will have to. It will be his legacy.
            In 2014 a person of note can come “out” and there just are not the ramifications there once were. Nothing could have been more damaging to Cruise than words from his own mouth with the video and also the Matt Lauer interview. He shames and harms himself better than any one else possibly could.
            I think what it comes down to is…he is an empty vessel. It is why he can act, cause there isn’t anything of substance there in the first place. He doesn’t need to over write himself for a performance..he just …IS. Which is the really terrifying part. Thomas Cruise Mapother IV is just a lab experiment gone wrong.

        • CobGatYour$$

          Spitting out my tea!! THE BEST SPOOF!!

        • villagedianne

          There are hints on the tabloid websites that Cruise has distanced himself from COS.

          • HillieOnTheBeach

            Not surprising. I’d bet money that he is doing so not because he no longer believes in the blubbard and his tech but because his association with the cos has already greatly damaged his career and his best friend status with Miscavige’s increasing, inevitable troubles would (will) do him in.

            • Once_Born

              I know that a really good PR company can achieve miracles but (assuming those rumours are true) I don’t see how Mr Cruise can extricate himself from this situation.

              1)The CofS of has all of his deepest, darkest secrets in those ‘absolutely confidential’ folders – the ones that Miscavige is supposed to have read out loud, for laughs – and will not hesitate to use them against him.
              2) His career and credibility has taken a big hit already – if that video pops into your head when he is playing a serious role, the illusion is broken. Ridicule is fatal to an actor.
              3) He is an action hero with a limited acting range who is getting older. His career is probably coming to a natural end, and the CofS deprived him a few good years.

              If he does distance himself he will never speak out against Scientology, or try to garner public sympathy by presenting himself as a recovering victim – he will withdraw, and never talk about the subject again.

            • CobGatYour$$

              Well maybe because of his celebrity status, using his ” confidential ” information might backfire on DM. Kind of like the IRA killing the Queen of England when they were in their soup. I mean if TC come out, I think he will do it in a big way. I do not see any other way, he can revise his image. He has to peel off his scion coating.

        • arcinva

          Oh no no no. The best spoof video was the one Jerry O’Connell did. He totally nailed it! And I just loved the balls on him for doing it. 🙂


    • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

      Hi Karen, Another horrendous and powerful example of how the practice and enforcement of LRH tech robs people of their humanity. More specifically, it robs people of their most important human emotion: accurate empathy. In my way of thinking, it is the tie that binds. It is the basic ingredient of compassion and allows for human connection and attachment.
      You do a service to all by continually illuminating the evil destructiveness that lies at the heart of scientology.

    • Too bad the Sea Org can’t confront eternity, huh Karen?

    • aquaclara

      Karen, sending you big thanks on covering this sad and difficult topic so openly. Just when I think it can’t get any worse, it does. How Scientology takes real human beings and utterly destroys them, first in life, and then in death, is unforgiveable. It’s why it’s not a religion, just an evil l cult bent on robbing its members of that is meaningful in their lives.

      Your videos and interviews, Tony’s daily work here, all the books, including Peter’s today, Jonny and everyone else log the memories and moments for all time. They don’t need to be on titanium plates – our memories and the internet will suffice. We won’t forget those who have lost their lives, including your son Alexander.
      Hugs and thanks, Karen.

      • Thank you kindly Aquaclara.
        I found one more image of young Anne (in my private collection)

  • Elar Aitch

    Great to see you have fun with these interviews Tony, walking on the wackier side of Scientology.

  • DodoTheLaser

    Péter Bonyai, you rock, my European brother.

  • DodoTheLaser

    I am sorry, Dear scientology lurkers, but this is what OT XV looks like. End of Bridge.

    • Sunny Sands

      I didn’t see your pic before I also put it up.

      • DodoTheLaser

        It’s ok. Imagine what 2015 is gonna be like.

    • yum

      • joan nieman

        I hope you choke on it Ronnie!

  • i-Betty

    Anyone else wondering whether Shelly got her hands on Ann’s ‘classy and beautiful’ wardrobe?

    • Captain Howdy

      I just assumed it.

      • Mareka Backus James Brousseau

        I assumed the same.

        • joan nieman

          Well, if Shelly did get her things, it could only have been a curse as she has been banished to the dungeon, perhaps forever.

    • philosofa

      Yes, iBetty. If so she isn’t getting much opportunity now to enjoy her ill-gotten gains, wherever she is.

      Scientoology’s “ethics” are rotten to the core – if it’s okay to utterly destroy anyone who disagrees with the cult, commit financial fraud and child-abuse what does a little theft matter to the “most ethical beings on the planet”?

      • Barbara Angel

        That Total Total Shit about $cientology being the *most ethical* beings on the planet is such an OUTRAGEOUS statement LIE….. Grrrrrrrrrrrr if anything makes me see red, it’s that one gross lie of the many hundreds of Lies.
        I’ll Red X those fuckers until I drop dead, even plan to take my laptop into the casket.

        • philosofa

          Yay, Barbara A! RedX flaggotry rocks!

          It is indeed an OUTRAGOUS lie .. .exactly to be expected from the tenets of a lying cult that lies and trains believers/marks to lie. LRH was a compulsive liar and the rotten apple has not fallen far from the tree…

          The cult will be over and done with loooong before you need to concern yourself about a laptop in your casket, we will all be here with popcorn and margarita’s for the final cof$ take-down party yet to come … .

    • MaxSpaceman

      and the jewelry, too- no doubt. Shelly prolly got the goods ‘n enjoyed them for 20 years (the jewelry) til she, too, was discarded by Micsavage up to Twin Peaks CST property. 365 days per year there year after year is a very lonely sojourn.

      • i-Betty

        Lou is probably wearing them now!

        • EnthralledObserver

          Gosh, it’s incredible how you are reading my mind tonight!

          • i-Betty


    • EnthralledObserver

      My first thought…

    • HappypantsDance

      I posted this upthread this a.m., but will restate it here: After several hours’ thought since the first post, I’m pretty sure read this on ESMB but could be wrong. Anyway, I read that DM rifled through Annie’s stuff and that Shelly did end up with some of Annie’s jewelry. I’m not sure if the person was speculating or was in a position to know.

  • Three good stories in Scotland’s Sunday Herald on the weekend, but their comment moderator seems to be a complete basket case. One comment accepted per story so far: A mild concern. An e-cig loon. An obvious Scientologist.

    I’d contact Peter Swindon directly, but they don’t have a contact link.

  • i-Betty

    What a fantastic and thorough review, thanks Jonny. And a nod of thanks to Mike Rinder for helping out with the English translation. I’m stuck on Peter’s personality test. The power it had to turn him from a confident young guy into a doubtful, insecure one in such a short space of time is horrifying.

    ‘Scientology priestess’? *snort*

    • Barbara Angel

      Big problem with that scamming personality test, people have believed it and committed suicide. Check out the list of “They should not have died, victims of $cientology”.
      Please God in Heaven, (you know that big being that sits in a chair in the sky, possibly rolling dice to see which way someone’s life will fall ) bring forth all your Old Testament Roth and Rage and Smite mustravage and blubbard from memory and their entire toxic trail of destruction from the face of this earth. Come on old boy or girl, you can do it. You rolled dice with Satan to see which way life was going to fall for Job and won, so now help us out and rid the world of $cientology and all it’s decomposing seeds/weeds.

      • LHS

        “Big problem with that scamming personality test, people have believed it and committed suicide.”

        Yes, I also worry about how this test can affect vulnerable people like Kaja Ballo, who apparently had some history of mental health issues. And I shudder to think of how TR0 Bullbait affects people with pre-existing anxiety or depression. I’m a never-in, but I know what prolonged emotional abuse can do to a person. It’s also worthwhile to look up the incident in England with Karen Henslow if you’re not familiar with it. Okay, that was a long time ago, but clearly Scientology’s disregard for vulnerable people has not changed.

    • Peter Bonyai

      It is really powerful, as most people are completely unprepared for such a vicious attack on their self-confidence and self-esteem, especially if they are young and had relatively normal childhood in a peaceful environment. It can really hit hard,

      • i-Betty

        Thank you, Peter. It’s great to meet you. Best of luck with your book 🙂

  • Andrew Robertson

    A great review by Jonny about what sounds like an excellent book by Peter Bonyai. It made me wonder whether I would have been sucked in by Scientology’s seductive promises and blandishments at the same age.

    I’d like to think I wouldn’t, and fortunately Ali Hubbard and his forty Scientology thieving recruiters had no presence in New Zealand then, so my ruin went unnoticed and I sorted out my teenage angst by myself.

    Scientology may be small and withering but they are still a menace to those vulnerable, particularly young people, and the best vaccine to its pernicious disease is information on its malevolence and subtle distorting of human emotions to satisfy Hubbard’s greed and sociopathy. Peter’s book seems a valuable resource.


    • Barbara Angel

      “Ali Hubbard and his forty Scientology thieving recruiters” hahahahaha love it, perfect description. And yes you are right, co$ may be small and withering but like an article read recently: a Chinese chef cut off the head of a snake and as he was preparing the body for cooking, the allegedly dead snake bit him and he died. Sorry haven’t got a link for it, but I guess this is a pertinent warning for us all about the poisonous powers of a dead headed serpent.
      Hoping mustravage doesn’t slither out of all the upcoming lawsuits as that little shit is one poisonous serpent, would really like to see him on the chefs chopping block. Off With His Head I say…

  • Sunny

    It is amazing how the stories of Sea Org members are all so similar and how much we try to work hard and fight to stay in and do the right thing. Then we end up out of the Sea Org as a “degraded being” or suppressive person and we quickly find out that it is the best thing to ever happen to us.

    • DodoTheLaser

      As in most valuable beings. Why, yes we are, and we gonna kick scientology’s fraudulent ass accordingly.

      • philosofa

        “As in most valuable beings. Why, yes we are, and we gonna kick scientology’s fraudulent ass accordingly.”

        Yes, indeed you are! All those with the strength and insight to escape the cult mind-trap are hugely valuable and we never-ins applaud you

        • DodoTheLaser

          Thank you so much for all the awesome support.

          • philosofa

            De nada, Dodo. 😀

            You are all helping to show the world exactly what the money-hungry, life-stealing, family-destroying cult of cof$ is really about and you will have the gratitude of so many in the years to come.

            Tony Ortega, Marty Rathbun, Mike Rinder,Karen deLac,Marc Bunker, Anonymous and everyone else who fights this evil are doing an amazing and important thing.

    • i-Betty

      What a fascinating dichotomy: when you’re in you’ll fight tooth and nail to stay in – until they discard you and you realise they’ve set you free.

      I’m so happy you’re out of there, Sunny 🙂

    • I hate the stories where the person finally decides that they’ve had enough and are determined to leave–but gets talked into coming back for another round of abuse. It’s like watching a slasher flick: “Noo! Don’t check out that noise in the basement!”

  • Sunny Sands

    There is a picture of Annie feeding a piece of her wedding cake to LRH at 3:15 in Karen’s video. In the US, the bride and groom traditionally feed each other a piece of their wedding cake at the reception. It’s a lot of fun for everyone watching. The symbolism of Annie feeding the cake to another man is pretty off the charts.(image)

    • Espiando

      Be happy that the Marquis de Lafayette de Tilden didn’t reach back to the middle ages and demand droit de seigneur. He definitely would have been the type to do it, but Mary Sue would have had Tzu chew his balls off if he tried.

    • EnthralledObserver

      Made me shudder, actually. Creepy.

      • Sunny Sands

        Yeah, I thought twice about putting the pic up, so yucky.

        • DodoTheLaser

          I think it’s a brilliant pic on so many levels.

    • Mighty Korgo of Teegeeack

      Most people would look rather geekish having a piece of cake shoved into their mouths. Hubbard, on the other hand, doesn’t need the cake.

    • BosonStark

      Bride of Frankenbard.

    • aquaclara

      I saw this, too. Between this, and the other pic of her as a young messenger looking up at Hubbard, I don’t know which is creepier. I shudder to think of what else we don’t know. Creepy, disgusting cult.

      It was good to go back and reread Tony’s column on Annie today. I appreciate Camilla’s openness in talking about her friend. She’s still grieving that loss, and maybe Hubbard’s, too. This cult does not make it easy on its members when it comes to empathy, sympathy, grief, respect, love or respect.

      It’s all so damn sad. But we have Peter and Camilla OUT and sharing their stories, which is a huge WIN.

  • EnthralledObserver

    Camilla seems to ask a lot of ‘why’s’… when it’s pretty obvious why, looking from an objective pov. Annie’s jewelry and nice things gone – thief who took it – not because of any reason about security or blah blah… just simple thieves – who knows, maybe even Makemerich himself has those items to this day! Why was Annie swept under the carpet – again obvious – she had truths Makemerich didn’t want getting out. He wanted her forgotten.
    Is Camilla a complete ex or at a half way state with reverence for LRonny? She seemed to have trouble grappling with LRonny’s mortality and death. Maybe it was just emotional because it was connected to her good friend Annie… but maybe not.

    • HappypantsDance

      I swear I read somewhere that DM is the one who rifled through Annie’s stuff and that Shelly has (or had) Annie’s jewelry. Maybe that was just speculation on the part of whoever wrote it.

      • beauty for ashes

        i thought something similar, but i could swear it was in a video.

        • HappypantsDance

          Hm, I’m pretty sure I read it, but that doesn’t mean it wasn’t also in a video. Maybe a few people know this and have spoken of it.

    • Cosmo Pidgeon

      There is no instant recovery…..and I don’t know questioning one’s view helps that process as I’m sure she read these comments. It’s difficult and slow process that I don’t think too many people know how to help with. Most cases your just kinda on your own

      • EnthralledObserver

        My comments aren’t intended to help anyone’s recovery… my comments are for my purpose of adding to the discussion and understanding the topic further and one of the individuals giving the information. A person’s pov can slant the information somewhat… I am curious as to which pov Camilla starts from as her tiptoeing around LRonny’s death made me wonder if it was a reverence of the man or simply the emotional connection to her dear friend who evidently revered him.
        The other point I was making was that for me those ‘why’ questions are obvious, and it seems she’s dwelling on them only from an emotional point of view, because in the bigger picture they don’t matter. Of course, with this I’m not saying that Annie’s treatment by the CO$ was not appalling, nor that she didn’t matter or deserved any of it: Annie, as devoted as she was, certainly deserved her recognition, to be treated better and her family deserved to be informed! But her being swept under the rug is completely understandable and not a surprise at all considering Makemerich’s goals and brutality.

  • 0tessa

    Scientology: the best way to become a human rottweiler.

  • pluvo

    Jonny Jacobsen, this is an excellent review. Peter Bonyai congratulations, your descriptions of how you got sucked into Scientology and your ‘career’ and exit is very, very good. All these stories have a similar pattern. That is the pattern of ‘normal’ life in the Church of Scientology and in the Sea Org.

    One of the mayor control methods in the cult are the statistics:
    “Statistics were calculated and monitored on a daily basis. Staff members were mercilessly hounded if their statistics were not in the proper range to achieve a higher value by Thursday. Two major methods were used to increase productivity: There was some minor internal PR (pep talks, emphasizing the greatness of the purpose of Scientology, small rewards etc), but threats, yelling and enforced overtime were the favored methods.”

    This is also a factor regarding David Miscavige, the position he grabbed and his status of an untouchable in the cult (like most cult leaders – and also Hubbard had never to be questioned). He is considered the most up-stat and hard working person in Scientology. This ‘COB is sooo hard working’ and ‘COB is sooo up-stat’
    is very much stressed and repeated like a mantra in the cult and is used as a thought-stop. To question Miscavige in any form or even having ‘BI’s’ (Bad Indicators – every non optimum reaction) is handled like a committed high crime followed by immediate interrogations and punishment.

    One of the reasons of the continuing lies of the ‘unprecedented expansion’ is certainly to secure Miscavige’s power position. If it would spread inside the cult that there is no expansion at all but a decline and that the Chairman Miscavige is not the up-stat great leader, many more people in the cult would allow themselves to doubt and overcome the thought-stopping.

    • Barbara Angel

      My dream is that one day all the Enablers will just stand up to mustravage and say, “Fuck It” we’re all really, really sick of you, you vicious little life sucking greedy Turd, now get the Fuck Out.
      You and only You are the SP around here and we won’t take your outrageous behaviour for one minute more. Followed by a pack of people *screaming* at HIM for a change.
      He could have the most Massive Tantrum, but if all just stopped and stared and no one lifted a finger, what could he do? = NOTHING! He would have to do a blubbard = poop in his pants and run and hide.
      So Enablers WAKE UP….Without your help mustravage is just another badly behaved little turd who needs to learn some manners and be given some boundaries. Like the snotty nosed little shit that he is

      • pluvo

        “…one day all the Enablers will just stand up.”

        Barbara, that’s never going to happen (otherwise it would already have happened). The whole system is rigged, that when you are doubting you get isolated and ‘handled’. Then you have to go through more thought reform or you have to leave. In the book “1984” from Georg Orwell this mind set is very well described (if you didn’t read it yet, I suggest it to you – here some comparison:
        But the cult is shrinking continuously and making more and more enemies by the day, also due to the insane and inhumane disconnections. One cannot mistreat people again and again without getting any repercussions.The pressure is coming from the outside! The whistle-blowers and blogs like Tony’s are doing an excellent job. The more people are in the know the less will join and there are always people leaving and speaking up (like Chris Shelton). The main things which are holding the cult together are money, threats and lies. The more they are exposed the more they loose power. 🙂

  • SciWatcher

    “I often felt like an outsider, detached from reality, having “stepped out” of real life.”

    I’ve spent a good part of my life trying to escape that feeling. It wasn’t caused by Scientology, but by my bipolar disorder.

    Just another example of Scientology causing mental illness. Turning everyone into LRH.

  • Mighty Korgo of Teegeeack

    Well, Scientology is like McDonalds. It doesn’t matter which one you go into, you get the same stuff. Welcome back to reality Peter. Thanks for your courageous memoir.

    • Barbara Angel

      But the slaves only get beans and rice no fries or coke.

    • Once_Born

      “Scientology is like McDonalds. It doesn’t matter which one you go into, you get the same stuff”

      This is a really remarkable feature of Scientology – all of the material I have collected shows that the core practices of Scientology are practically identical to those of its earliest days, despite the passage of time and its transplantation into disparate cultures.

      I suspect that it survives today only because Hubbard was so focussed on accumulating money that the organisation evolved a really good ‘hard sell’ – and a financial reserve that has enabled the zombie to keep shuffling along long after it should have shuffled off.

      • Mighty Korgo of Teegeeack

        “It’s the same old story,
        Everywhere I go,
        I get slandered, libelled,
        I hear words I never heard in the Bible”

        Paul Simon?

        • Once_Born
          • Mighty Korgo of Teegeeack

            Thanks, OB. I haven’t heard that one in a while. It could easily be the anthem of the Sea Org. “I’m so tired, I’m oh, oh, uhoh, so tired…”

            • Techie

              Mighty Korgo, many are the nights I sang that to myself as I slaved away. The other one that was always on the CD player for all-nighters was “It’s a kind of magic -magic – magic – oh oh one dream, one prize, one goal……” from Queen.

            • Mighty Korgo of Teegeeack

              Thanks goodness for the poets (but thank badness for one of the SF writers). With your comment I am now thinking of John Lennon and Whatever Gets You Through the Night.

              I like this one by Phil Ochs. A friend told me that it was his, can I say, anthem. Here are some key lyrics…

              My life was once a flag to me
              And I waved it and behaved like I was told
              My life was once a drag to me
              And I loudly and I proudly lost control

              I was drawn by a dream, I was loved by a lie
              Every serf on the scene begged me to buy
              But I slipped through the scheme, so lucky to fail
              My life was not for sale

              Here is the youtube link.


    • Techie

      You stole my thunder, Mighty K, I was going to say the same thing. Isn’t it strange that someone who doesn’t natively speak English, who lives almost a world away from the Big Blue Complex in LA, and who has probably never met Dave Miscavige personally, has such a similar experience to what we went through. It shows you that something is really wrong with the subject itself. It is not the local organization, some particular leader, some event that happened in the local area that made a mess of things. We always ascribe our failures to such causes or blame ourselves, but in fact it is the same everywhere. Possibly it is really just the utopian ideal, the idea that people can be perfected and live an ideal life just by reading a book or believing in some screed. All such utopian visions eventually seem to degrade to their dystopian counterparts simply because they fail to take human nature into account. With Hubbard on the one hand lying about the effectiveness of his “research” and on the other hand demanding that you live up to impossible standards, you are left with no option but to pretend or leave. The pretense gets harder and harder, but the niggling thought continues that maybe he was right after all, maybe we are screwed up here but somewhere the dream of a civilization without criminals, insanity or war is coming true, we just have to stick it out and things will get better. Once you are out and open your eyes it is obvious that it never can really happen, it is not so obvious when you are in and have relationships and resources dedicated to the cause.

      • Mighty Korgo of Teegeeack

        Thanks for your long and insightful comment, Techie. The phenomenon spans generations, too. And it survives Hubbard. Ron is Gone but the Con live On is not only a great looking picket but it is as accurate as can be. It is just nice to know that they are on the way down, a 20th Century cult, if you will.

      • Cosmo Pidgeon

        Techie, that vision is OK. The best and brightest of our youth have similar hopes for our world. The unfortunate thing for people like us is that we were sucked up into a hopeless quest instead of dedicating our time to real world endeavors to make the world a better place. But it’s OK to start now in whatever way we can. I mentioned before I really regret dropping out of college to go and save the planet….it’s still here, has the same problems, a lot of people do good things to make life better for all of us. Some people are just assholes. It’s always been that way. I and maybe you were very idealistic. So many young people are.

        • Techie

          I guess the difference is some think they can change the world by changing how others think, and others try to change the world by changing the world. There are all kinds of things you can do to improve life, to help others, to feed the hungry and so on. The danger is when some charlatan promises to do it all at once by some magic bullet. We all want to help, except those few who cannot feel compassion, so it sounds like a great idea at first. I say skip the magic bullet and just dig in and change the world, in whatever way you find you can do it. for today.

    • Peter Bonyai

      Thank you, too and you are 100% right about that.

      PS: And my sister works as an assistant to the HR Director of McDonald’s Hungary. Oh, the irony. :)I

      • aquaclara

        Peter, this is an excellent interview today, and I very much look forward to reading your book. Your own descriptions of how you got sucked in are so important for people to see. I was in college about the same time you were, so I could see this kind of thing happening. I grew up in Clearwater, though, so was QUITE innoculated from that mess. But there were other things out there that friends and others heard about. We were all so naïve at that age.

        I appreciate your candor in owning up to how things were going with your family and wife as a result of all that happened. Your family had to be so worried.

        I hope your life is filled with much that is good from here on in. After all that, you deserve all the happiness there is…. 🙂

        • Peter Bonyai

          Thank you. Yes, I was truly naive at that time and paid the price for it. My life is certainly better now, I more or less got over the entire misadventure. Nevertheles, I still consider it important to educate other about the dangers of Scientology (that’s one of the main reasons the book was written),

  • John P.

    Sorry to go off topic here, but thought this was worth a mention. A blog I read, Scholars and Rogues, talked about the importance of ensuring that only medically valid treatment is provided to disaster victims. The lead paragraph is one of the best put-downs of Scientology’s “Volunteer Ministers” and the incredibly lame quackery of “touch assists” that I have read:

    By all accounts, post-earthquake Port-au-Prince was hell on earth. Already suffering from crumbling infrastructure and poor housing conditions, the Haitian capital was perhaps the least equipped city on Earth to withstand a 7.0 magnitude earthquake. Within hours, thousands of international rescue workers and doctors were pulling people from the rubble and setting up makeshift hospitals under plastic tents. Their efforts saved lives. But there was one group that almost certainly did nothing besides get in the way. At the cost of $400,000 dollars, a wealthy donor in Los Angeles airlifted 80 Scientologists trained in using “the power of touch” to “reestablish communication” within the bodies of trauma victims. As if the Haitian people were not suffering enough.

    This particular atrocity that the cult attempts to commit makes my blood boil almost as much as the “drugs and toxins accumulate in the body” quackery at the heart of the Purification Rundown and of the whole Narconon fraud.

    The full article is here:

    • Rima Laibow, if not a closet Scientologist like Mike Health Ranger Adams, certainly seems to shop at the same woo mongers. (For quacks, nano is the new quantum.)

      • giggler

        I had my scientology comment on Health Ranger website moderated, it was pretty innocuous, something about a connection with Wholefoods ( there was some flyer showing it on Sunday funnies) he was on about heavy metals and Wholefoods

      • Artoo45

        Adams is a reprehensible fearmonger and charlatan . . . of course there’d be Scientology in his woodpile.

      • i-Betty

        Rima Laibow. Blergh.

        • Married to the Stares at Goats and walks through walls guy. *bonk*bonk*bonk* /goats laugh

    • Gerard Plourde

      You’re right. While we are rightly outraged by the abuses that occur in Narconon and to members of the Sea Org and those suffering from the effects of the Disconnection policy it takes a special level of self-centered cluelessness to travel to the site of a catastrophe and assume that a “touch assist” is an essential service. Scientology – It never ceases to be worse than you can imagine.

      • Once_Born

        Despite everything, I can’t quite get my head around the fact that most of the people who ‘administer’ those ‘touch assists’ likely believe that that they are doing good – despite the inherent lack of credibility and the observable lack of real results.

        It’s one thing to maintain belief inside the ‘Scientology bubble’, another to wander around a disaster area applying a totally ineffective ‘healing touch’.

        Also, why don’t they use the “Bring back to life assist” described in the “Assists Handbook”

        • John P.

          I can only imagine how Hubbard must have felt when he presented his new “research” on the “bring back to life assist” to a bunch of clams in some tape-recorded lecture back in the day. That they swallowed his claims to have saved all those lives and brought people back from the dead, implying that he was some sort of god, must have been quite a rush.

          Too bad none of the brain-numbed audience members stood up and asked for more details on the people he brought back from the dead.

          Also, if Hubbard had discovered a “bring back to life assist” that actually worked, he would have revolutionized modern medicine and won the Nobel Prize in every single year from 1952 (when he first described this in one of the PDC lectures) to the present day.

          • Once_Born

            The Nobel committee is probably still waiting for a positive result after many failures – which are, of course, all due to the ‘tech’ being applied incorrectly or the presence of a ‘suppressive person’.

            One sure sign of pseudo-science is the way in which it is impossible (even in principle) to falsify any of the claims it makes by experiment – there is always a ‘reason’ why you can’t duplicate their results.

          • richelieu jr

            Is such a touch existed, they’d be using it on their moribund religious scam about now…

    • ze moo

      There was quote from a French doctor from Doctors with out boarders who seeing the John Travolta lied group of ‘ministers’ said, ‘ I didn’t know that a massage was effective with gangrene. ‘ The clampire is a group of self deluded clowns who just can’t understand why the rest of us don’t worship them.

    • richelieu jr

      My cousin, who is pilot, said that they also took up valuable airspace and that the Scilons arrived in Haiti lacking basic provisions such as food and water, toilet paper, cothes, thinking they could ‘buy them once they arrived’. They certainly ahd enough of their garish T-SHirts for thephoto opportunites.
      Apparently, when they finally got the criticism of not bringing relief supplies, they bought some from another plane that was already arriving, just so they could take credit for it (this news I heard third hand, so give it the weight you feel it deserves, considering)

      Honestly, I thought they couldn’t be any ore self-serving and amoral than their stupid stunt-tents at the Ground Zero after 9/11, but the old adage is true: Scientology: It’s always worse than you think.

  • Eivol Ekdal

    The Sea Org – A Shower of Bastards

  • MaxSpaceman

    In Lafayette Ron Sr.’s own words, “The Aim and Goal of Scientology is to take an individual and put them in a position where they can–

    – confront their own problems
    – and solve their own problems
    – and so bring themselves up by their own bootstraps.”

    How did that work out for the Founder, hisself? El Wron El Rey Hubbard Sr.
    _ ran like a scared rabbit in the 1960s from U.S.A. govt. authorities — where was the confront…
    _ bolted out of England, late 60s, when the sh1t began hitting the fan — confront not…
    _ took to international waters to escape the situation he found hisself in — confront not…
    _ avoided France like the plague, as he became a convicted Felon wanted by Interpol — solving his own problems, not…
    _ thrown out of every port, from every country hisself wanted to linger in — solve his own problems, not…
    _ by the mid-70s, the better part of a decade running, using the ships of hisself, Ron started hiding around Clearwater — confront not…
    _ throughout the rest of the 70s, going ‘over the rainbow’ and hiding like a scared rat — solving his own problems, not…
    _ hiding around Calif. from authorities into the early 80s, like a rat on a rope — confront not…
    _ living in an RV, while outside that door was a beautiful house and ranch — confront life, not…
    _ dying with an untreated sickening cyst middle forehead, shot full of psych drug Vistaril, a scarred and degraded rat.

    Ron Hubbard, Sr. – OT 8. Founder of the Church of Scientology. His bootstraps remained- untouched.

    • Barbara Angel

      Of course he didn’t follow his own ***Mad Brain Fart***, the whole thing was a major scam, he knew it and secretly laughed at anyone who fell for it. Quite simply he was a scared, little bully and ran away and hid to avoid being caught.

      • MaxSpaceman

        The bootstrap quote is from this interview, available various Websites.

    • Peter

      A very layout of critical facts, Max. Well done!

    • grundoon

      L. Ron Hubbard couldn’t even confront his own believers and supporters, the Scientologists who worshipped and slaved for him. First he created HCO to insulate him from direct communication with his franchisees, staff, and Scientologists who had worked directly with him in the early days. He inserted Case Supervisors, the SO#1 Unit, Ethics Officers, chaplains, and the post of ED WW / ED INT so he would never have to encounter public Scientologists except on his own terms. Then he fled his World Wide HQ at Saint Hill and went to sea, creating the Sea Org to insulate him from having to communicate directly with his WWHQ staff or anyone who hadn’t vowed to serve him for a billion years. But he was still unable to tolerate that much communication and human contact, so he created the Commodore’s Messengers so he could hide behind a cadre of pre-teen and teenage young girls who had to do all his speaking and listening to everyone on the ship. But that was still too much. Eventually he fled into hiding from his wife and children and even from his Messengers, except for Pat and Annie who he had raised from childhood, and Sarge — because without them he would have to confront making his own dinner, doing his own laundry, putting on his own socks and pajamas, and carrying his own suitcases stuffed full of cash. Unthinkable. He fled from his own body at the end, pursued by BTs which still may follow him where not even his Messengers can go. ARC (communication) and KRC (confront) were only for underlings; for himself LRH abandoned first one and then the other. Causatively, of course. At the end his reality was the void of his own creation.

      • And I don’t rent cars!

        And at the end, the reality was simply this… a day old corpse, a stiff in limp sheets, resting on a disturbed bed, an empty syringe his only companion, hiding in the back of a hidden RV, accumulating flies and lies, while chaos and police and coroners and lawyers and distraught disciples and bloodied dogs collected outside his door… and yet, not a tear was shed, out there by the horse shed… where policy, bulletins, and secret advises reigned over the dead messiah.

  • Sid

    “We’d rather have you dead than incapable”.

    I remember once when on course late on a Wednesday night, being pushed to finish before Thursday at 2pm. I was staff but had paid for the course so it would count as a comp. It was about 2:30am and the supervisor had fallen asleep. I was so tired myself I couldn’t concentrate on the materials so I slipped out and went home to bed. About an hour later I was woken up by someone screaming at the top of his voice hovering over me next to the bed. It was the supervisor, who had somehow gotten in the house. His face was red, and he was in a mad rage. In his hand which was held high over his head was the lamp from my bedside stand. As he demanded I get back on study he screamed out “We’d rather have you dead than incapable”. Some of them do take it literally. And that image of him standing over me like that still haunts me to this day.

    • Barbara Angel

      If you can, would you please share…. How did you cope with that Brain Washed Lunatic?
      What was the last ‘straw’ for you please?

      • Sid

        Barbara, amazingly I stayed in for many years after that. I did go back in on course that night as I literally feared for my life at that point, but in true Scientology mental compartmentalization I thought it was just ‘him’ and not Scientology as a whole. I did report it to his senior but nothing was done. What finally got me out years later is a bit of a longer story. I’ll get it written up at some point when I can sort it all out in my head.

        • Barbara Angel

          Wow, you are one brave man to put up with that lunacy. And wow again they had you to the point that you only saw him, not the whole rotten picture. Would love to read about your journey when you feel ready. Please know that by having the courage to escape is such an ****Admirable*** thing and I really wish you well. Now you can have a chance at having a real honest to goodness life. Congratulations, you deserve Every ***Happiness***, good things come to those who wait, so all good is coming your way.

          • Sid

            Barbara, thanks for your kind words. Though I do feel a tremendous relief being out, I won’t feel the true ‘happiness’ until the kids, brother, sister, nieces, nephews, and friends are out. Though I could deal with the rest of it if we had the kids.

            • Cosmo Pidgeon

              Wow Sid..I feel for you. Most people In my day had the opposite situation. Nobody else in the family was “in” and we were always trying to avoid a PTS Situation with the family. The net result is not as bad as yours but similar in that you don’t see them anymore. But having lost your kids …you probably brought them in with the best of intentions I’m sure.

            • Sid

              Cosmo, That’s my biggest regret in the whole thing. For myself I can live with my mistakes but that we got the kids into it really weighs on me. Of course there were many lies told to us that we were making these decisions on but there were also many, many red flags we should have seen.

            • Cosmo Pidgeon

              I’m sure Sid…I’m a father.You thought you were doing what was best. Don’t beat yourself up. Things are changing.

        • Vaquera

          I’m proud of you in that you thought it was just “him” as opposed to thinking, “This is my fault. I pulled it in and deserve the results for failing Scientology.” Proof that the wog in you hadn’t been totally destroyed. Thank you for sharing the story.

          • Sid

            V, it’s an interesting thought process where some Scientologists feel that Scientology is ‘ok’ but there are just some people in it who aren’t. The problem with that reasoning is that if Scientology ‘tech’ worked there wouldn’t be so many wackos in the church. Auditing would have handled them.

            • Vaquera


            • Cosmo Pidgeon

              That’s true of the Scientology community in general. When I moved to a city with a large Scientology public I noticed that these people had the same problems, jealousies, relationship problems, flaws, etc. that exist in the wog world. They just have different names for it… I just had an ARC break [ argument ], she’s putting a strong 2D flow on me [ She’s flirting ] he’s out 2D [ cheating on his wife], …I goes on. I’ve gotten screwed by people I worked for and they justified it with Scientology “tech references”….And don’t get me started with “Conditions”…most often applied to suit someone else’ s selfish agenda with the guise of “helping you”….write up your overts ….so I can use them against you…make amends….free work for some perceived or made up transgression. These are by and large a selfish group.A self important group…..Myself included….. You learn the way if you come in young…there are few industries that reward this type of personality in the real world. Probably, investment banker, car salesman and actor.

            • HappypantsDance

              “investment banker, car salesman and actor” – professions for sociopaths and/or narcissists.

        • aquaclara

          when you’re ready, we’re listening….

          That story was so telling – and awful. It bears mentioning to any person who is still in and reading here that this kind of treatment is NOT acceptable. It is a reason to LEAVE. It is ABUSE.

          Looking forward is much healthier than looking back. But the lessons are invaluable. Thanks, Sid. I hope your kids come home soon.

    • kemist

      My own answer would have been that he would be dead or incapable very soon if he did not get the fuck out of my room. That is if I can still be coherent despite murderous rage.

      I’m normally a shy, polite and non-violent kind of person. But take away my sleep and I’ll be screaming profanities at and possibly hit you. I have very little control over that reaction.

      • Sid

        That thought did cross my mind at that moment, but he was crazy enough to whack me before I could get any punches in. I was also pretty groggy from very little sleep in the last few days. I really thought the church would throw him out on his ear the next day. He got nothing.

        • HappypantsDance

          He probably got a commendation. That’s the sort of behavior the cherch encourages. Whatever works is good, regardless of how morally reprehensible or outright illegal.

        • Vaquera

          He actually followed through and hit you with the lamp? Inexcusable!

          • Sid

            V, no he didn’t hit me, but I was pretty sure he would have if I had refused to go in.

    • Dibythesea

      That is so fckd up Sid!

      • Sid

        So true Dib.

    • joan nieman

      That is really traumatic Sid. It is actually quite insane. Thank Goodness you are free of this now.

      • Sid

        Joan, I don’t know that I’d say I’m entirely free of this yet. Aside from the loss of family there is still a lot of mental baggage I seem to carry. It’s a process. Every day I weed through it a bit more.

    • Free Minds, Free Hearts

      OMG Sid, I am so glad you are out and I hope the gets of your family sees their way free soon.

  • Panopea Abrupta

    Planetary leering – that’s what it is, and so on and so forth.
    Despoiler of innocence, thief of dreams, vulture to the vulnerable.

  • Mark

    Are you quite sure the quotations you make from those Hubbard Communications Office Policy Letters are accurate, Jonny? (Refresh by gargling obsessively with industrial-strength Listerine):

    • Sid


    • i-Betty

      L.Right Bastard 😛


      “you may not even have to contact us…”!

    • Missionary Kid

      Thanks to i-Betty, I’m putting L. Right Bastard on the list of L. RON HUBBARD NICKNAMES

    • Jonny Jacobsen

      Easy with that Listerine, Mark…

      • Mark

        Well, was either that or permanent chlorophyll addiction 😉

        • Missionary Kid

          Chlorophyll addiction? Isn’t that what cows, sheep, and goats have? 😉

          • Mark


            • Missionary Kid

              There’s a poem that goes something like,
              If you think that breath is sweetened,
              With chlorophyll,
              You should smell the goat,
              On yonder hill.

  • Just Dee

    What a great analogy.

    “The ideal registrar was like an attack dog which locked his jaws onto the victim’s leg and could only be removed by hacking off that limb.”

    • Sid

      That is so right. Many times I’d throw $50 or $100 in just to get out of the reg cycle.

  • Anonymous

    Scientology is an assembly line grifting machine. The purpose of the machine is the accumulation of financial assets for a small cabal at the top. The cabal at the top changes as time goes by. Right now the cabal is headed by Sea Org Captain David Miscavige. Previously the cabal was headed by L. Ron Hubbard and his family.

    The individual players that operate the assembly line grifting machine called Scientology are irrelevant to its long term functioning. The culture inside Scientology uses up, then discards the operators of the grifting machine as expediency dictates.

    Annie Tidman, Mary Sue Hubbard, Quinten Hubbard, even L. Ron Hubbard all became irrelevant over time to Scientology. Eventually Sea Org Captain David Miscavige will become irrelevant and most likely a new cabal will take over what is left of the Scientology assembly line grifting machine and alter the confidence game (the grift) to snare new suckers, so that the new cabal at the top can prosper (survive.)

  • BosonStark

    The reason Scientology doesn’t memorialize a person after or upon their death is simple: That person stops bringing the money in, or working to squeeze it out of others. That’s what Scientology boils down to — the money. If Tom Cruise were to be hit by a bus — remembering that OT powerz are only good at helping at car accidents — he might be memorialized. But only if Miscavige thought it could be used to squeeze money out of members. Therefore, within the cult, Annie would pass unnoticed as she sails on for implantation on Mars, and hopefully can keep her stats up in her next life.

    Congratulations to Peter for writing his book. It sounds like he carefully chronicled his personality transformation and what he was thinking about, or blocked from thinking about, at the time he was going through experiences. That interior transformation is something that is missing in some Scientology memoirs. Members sometimes describe what others were doing, or what happened to them, but not what they did to others, or thought about during the time they were doing it.

    I don’t expect Sea Org members who were raised in the cult to have much perspective on how Scientology changed them, because it was just part of their growing up, and seemed natural at the time. I understand that.

    Also, I like the title of Peter’s book.

    As I was watching HBO’s “Nixon on Nixon” recently, I couldn’t help but think it would have been nice if Hubbard left similar recordings, just to show how he thought at the time. Of course, Hubbard’s voluminous crazy ramblings make up for that, in part. Nixon was an anti-Semitic, racist, sexist, homophobic, paranoid nutter and it is embarrassing and unsettling that a person of his character and integrity ever became President of the U.S.

  • “Power is when people listen to you. The posse of thugs helps too.”

  • Dr_Orpheus

    It’s interesting that I have never seen a single still-in Scientologist give any details about his or her experiences with COS. All they can give are vague claims about how wonderful everything is and how it has made them better able to deal with the problems of life, increased their income, ect. Any questions about the courses they have taken (even the basic communications course) are met with the answer that you will have to take it for yourself to understand it.

    By contrast, ex-members are often very willing to discuss their experiences in detail. Leaving Scientology seems to have improved their communication skills.

    • Sid

      This is true. And if they do mention anything specific they will attribute anything good that happens to them to Scientology. I know a girl who married into money, then bragged profusely how Scientology had made her the envy of others because of her great success in life.

      • Dr_Orpheus

        I’m betting if you asked for an explanation as to how exactly Scientology helped her marry the rich guy she wouldn’t be able to nail anything down.

        • Sid

          Dr_Orpheus, you’re invalidating her win. I’m writing a KR on you.

    • CobGatYour$$

      My sister- in- law, broke, disfigured by cancer, living on a stipend from my in-laws, unsuccessful as an artist, divorced without ever having another meaningful relationship to this day, says she is spiritually perfect, content, and successful in life. She still has not word cleared DELUSIONAL,

      • MaxSpaceman


      • Peter

        Perhaps that is her coping mechanism. Hard to really tell what is in the mind/heart of another.

    • MaxSpaceman

      ‘Tis a Crime, sometimes a High Crime to talk the tech. What do they call it, ‘verbal tech’ ? Can’t talk about it with anyone alive unless you are Blown for Good.

      • Dr_Orpheus

        That’s certainly true. I remember an internet debate involving a Scientologist who couldn’t even explain the basic beliefs of his religion without quoting the Scientology web page. Discussions about how yelling at an ash tray improved his communications skills were equally frustrating. (From our point of view his skills in that area were horrible.) He was confident that the course was extremely helpful, but if we wanted to understand it we would have to take it ourselves ( and give money to his church for the experience.)

    • Just Dee

      I’ve seen many explain. It’s like WOW!!!!! Over the top!!!!! Mind blowing!!!!!!!! FINALLY HAVE THE TRUE MEANING OF LRH!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Still floating out of my body!!!!!!!!!!!!! Everything is now clear!!!!!!!!! Lightning fast!!!!!!!!!!

  • CobGatYour$$

    Symptoms: The long good bye to family and life as the person knows it. Memory issues, million mile stare, dissociative responds, aggressive out of control moods, suspicious, disinterest in mainstream life, reverting to strange behaviors, speaking in another language, forgetfulness, depression, complicated health issues, disconnecting with family members once very close too.

  • Nice to see this European expose, but I suspect $cientology will be wiped out there soon by the jihadinazi Muslims, along with everything and everyone else.

    • Techie

      Hey, we stopped them at Vienna last time, why not again?

  • NOLAGirl

    Shame on you McSavage. You either break people or you bury them. Sadly, to some, you do both.

    Karma is going to have a field day with your tiny ass.

  • BiigBangBaby

    There is no production in death and therefore you’re a down-stat. Sad, but that’s how it looks to the outside world.

  • pronoia

    Such an illuminating interview Karen and Camilla.

    What a tragedy — a young 12 year old girl, is taken away from her family and out of school and is given over to an old con man, who becomes her only source (no pun intended) of security and connection to anything. That is the definition of human trafficking — and if Lron where alive today, that would be the law that could be brought to bear against him, Then, when big pooh bah guru dies, she is thrown into the gulag and even though she tries to escape, she never gets away. Really really awful.

    The most telling thing about the interview is the fact that Camilla never asked Annie anything. Only in scientology is that being a good friend. It is understandable, to not ask is to protect yourself and your friend from the ever-present stasi-like interrogations. However, I hope that Camilla is beginning to remember that in the real world, when a friend shares horrific and traumatic events, the usual reaction is to say, who and why and how? And oh how awful and wrong. Not to stay silent. But I understand why she did — both too afraid to really talk in case one or both began to express their real experiences and feelings.

    And Camilla if you are reading this. Hubbard is dead. Please don’t be afraid to say it because it is the truth. Just like all of us will one day be. Dead and gone. Forever. Dust to dust, ashes to ashes and dumped in the Pacific Ocean.

    And those dogs. Wow. I think that they were somehow expressing the truth of what was about to unfold — their mistress was in grave danger (dogs are that way — they feel things and simply act on what they feel) and that is the way dogs tend to behave when they are feeling anxious and fearful.

  • ze moo

    Good job Jonny Jacobsen, the Peter Bonyai interview is perfect. It covers the ‘how I got in, what happened in the clampire and how I got out’. I do hope that his book gets a lot of read in Eastern Europe, they are prime recruiting territory for the clams these days.

    Peters experience with the ‘personality test’ just shows how the self help scam is supposed to work. I am not surprised that Peter took the bait, it can be a very powerful manipulation. Setting that hook and getting the new meat in the door and paying is what $cientology is all about. Or at least it used to be, Davy does seem to have left the new meat off the current menu.

    The ‘personality test’ has been used for a long time, it is the psychological equivalent of the shell game. Though sometimes with horrible results.

    F5 No obligation, until they want you for the sea borg.

    • ze moo

      I paraphrase Dr. William Cosby, but what happens if you take the personality test, and find out you’re an asshole?

      • Dr_Orpheus

        They try to recruit you to OSA!

        • ze moo

          Son, you have management potential!

      • Jimmy3

        Do you think you can pass a personality test even if you have a history of drugging and raping women? I’d like to ask “Dr. William Cosby” about that.

        • Cosmo Pidgeon

          There is no “passing” you are always fucked up.

          • Jimmy3

            I make passes all the time when I’m fucked up. The slap across my face usually sobers me up a little.

            • Cosmo Pidgeon

              I like you Jimmy 3.

            • Jimmy3

              Hey, Stuart Smalley was right after all!

            • Cosmo Pidgeon

              Ha! I had to look him up….yes he was.

            • Jimmy3

              The guy who thought that bit up is now a United States Senator. Only in America.

    • Missionary Kid

      “The ‘personality test’ has been used for a long time, it is the psychological equivalent of the shell game.” is now on the list, THINGS SAID ABOUT $CIENTOLOGY & DIANETICS

  • Panopea Abrupta

    A lost early draft version of one of Leonard Cohen’s songs in which he deals with El Wretch’s death and cremation:

    Ron of Arc

    Now the flames they followed Ron of Arc
    as he came riding through the dark;
    no moon to keep his cyst-face bright,
    no Kools to get him through this smokeless night.
    He said, “I’m tired of this lark,
    I want the kind of work I had before,
    to type out reams of rubbish trite
    to feed my swollen appetite.”
    Well, I’m glad to hear you talk this way,
    you know I’ve watched you hiding every day
    and something in me yearns to skin
    such a cold and lonesome lying king.
    “And who are you?” he sternly spoke
    to the one he tried to choke.
    “Why, I’m fire,” she replied,
    “And I hate your solitary misplaced pride.”

    • giggler

      Spot on

    • joan nieman

      Excellent! I am thinking Fire is perhaps the ‘ Wall of Fire’.

  • Jimmy3

    I’m a member of several book clubs (I have many stickers on charts to prove it), but I don’t much care for book reviewin’. I’m of a simple folk — don’t explain it in detail, just give a thumbs up or a thumbs down, and I’ll know if you’re sayin it’s good or it’s bad. Said that, my review of Jonny’s review is one thumb up. I’d give it two, but making meth is harder than it seems on the tv.

    • Qbird

      oh ha Jimmy…

      • Jimmy3


    • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

      Yo! Jimmy to the 3, wutup?!? Sound like you and kemist need to hook up and go into the money bidness. Y’all could be slingin’ mad volume and makin fat stakin’ benjis! You know what I’m sayin’ Yo!

      • Jimmy3

        I always been wantin to go into the money bidness, but it just seem so dam espensive.

  • HappypantsDance

    OT. This won’t stop bugging me, and since you’re an intelligent group, particularly on matters $cilon related, I’m hoping you can answer this for me..

    In various Co$ publications/correspondences/etc, including Debbie Cook’s delightfully enturbulating email, I see the phrase: “the Scientology religion.” For me, seeing that phrase is akin to hearing nails on a chalkboard because it’s redundant and rhythmically awkward.

    If Scilons actually believe Scientology is a religion, then why say “the Scientology religion” in *internal* correspondence? Is it to emphasize that it is a religion since most on the outside think it isn’t, even though readers in the “wog” world aren’t the intended audience? And/or do Scilons do it to convince *themselves* it’s a religion? Both or for other reasons entirely? I simply don’t understand why they cannot just say “Scientology” instead of the clunky and redundant “the Scientology religion.”

    Please to help with my understandings. I’m hoping your help will cure the facial tic the phrase gives me.

    • Missionary Kid

      I wouldn’t worry about it. They’re trying to convince themselves and others that they’re doing something legitimate.

      • endoftheQ

        Legitimate + Religion = Oxymoron. 😉

        • Missionary Kid


          I’m an atheist, but I think that religion serves a useful function. It just isn’t useful to me.

          Scientology is flat out not a religion, but a scam.

    • Once_Born

      Scientology’s religious status is disputed (to say the least). They seem to think that they can ‘handle’ this by explicitly referring to Scientology as a religion at every opportunity – if you keep saying it, you will make it so.

      Unfortunately for them, this seems to have the opposite effect – drawing attention to the weakness that they are very sensitive about (both internally and externally). Sometimes, whistling in the dark only helps the bad guys find you.

      Don’t develop a facial tic – smile every time you hear “Scientology religion”. It is a sign of their insecurity.

      • HappypantsDance

        Ha, yes, it is a sign of their insecurity! 😀

        But I realize now I didn’t make my point clear – that’s all on me. My facial tic isn’t the result of their claim to be a religion. In fact, if I play loose with the definition of “religion,” I can say Scientology is one, with the qualifier that it is also definitely a cult. (For me, anyway, “cult” and “religion” are not mutually exclusive.)

        The facial tic is about the awfulness of the phrase itself. Say it aloud: “the Scientology religion.” It’s strange! And it’s redundant. Saying “the Catholic religion” or “the Muslim religion” is just as long-winded; saying “Catholicism” or “Islam” is more concise. Yet, those two don’t sound off-putting in the way “the Scientology religion” does – again, beyond the obvious “why” :).

        Perhaps the problem is the two soft “g” sounds so close together. Perhaps I’ve done one too many close-readings of poetry, a task in which attention to internal rhyme, euphony, and any manifestation of disharmony is part of the exercise. Perhaps I’m simply insane! Whatever the reason, the phrase bugs the hell out of me, beyond its quite literal ridiculousness 🙂

        • Once_Born

          I take your point… but also strongly advise you never to read any of Hubbard’s books – dissonance and redundancy are the least of his literary sins.

          • HappypantsDance

            I’ve not put a dent in the mountain of verbal diarrhea he wiped onto paper with a pen, but enough to know that you’re spot on. It’s really awful and so forth.

            • MaxSpaceman

              I think you should read “A History of Man.” Just that one’ll do ya’ for a lifetime. To know a few of the choicest specifics of the Sciloonacy is really helpful in a few different ways. Anyway…

        • Captain Howdy

          Yep, you’re screwed.

          • HappypantsDance

            I may have to be institutionalized like Shoo-MANN 🙂 One of my favorite musicals making a showing in one of my favorite TV shows – life is good! Thank you 🙂

      • Freethinker

        This reminds of using the word “science” in a name (e.g., Christian Science, Creation Science). If that word is used, it isn’t a science.

  • Panopea Abrupta

    Red-X Red-X Red-X

    Ever felt people were being led around like donkeys by the Hubbard family?
    Red-Xing can help you do something about it:

    Today’s list:
    And the preceding ads for the last 3 days:

  • Lovely review, Jonny. I still want to put in a favourable review in the Kindle store.

    There’s one quote which caused me to have a Highly Desired Object:

    “We did not have too many freeloaders at that
    time, but due to this pricing policy, we could collect hefty sums from
    these traitors. We were relentless and ruthless and pursued even penny.
    Even minors were charged for every service they received (though they
    got a 50% discount – Hubbard even had a policy for this).”

    So, pretty please with sugar on top, does anyone have a copy of this PL to get freeloader debt back from minor ex Damnation Navy victims?

    • You might find it somewhere here Jens:
      I meant to add more policy letter quotes to back up some of the points Peter made in the book, but ran out of time.

    • Peter Bonyai

      In Organization Executive Course, Volume 3 (1991 edition), there is a policy about giving 50% discount to minors on Scientology services. I don’t remember which exactly. This was applied to the calculation of the “freeloader debts” of minors, so Scientologist parents could be persuaded easier to pay for the “debts incurred” by their children.

      • Thanks Peter (and all). So, it’s a general policy about the price of courses to minors which is applied to minors in the Damnation Navy. I had been hoping for one PL which stated something about pricing specifically for minors in the Sea Org, thus one more time revealing the lie of there being no minors in the SO.

    • Drat

      I don’t know the P/L, but I do know somebody who joined as a minor and left shortly after (never completed the EPF), coming home with about $3500 in freeloader debt.

  • BosonStark

    I’m not so sure about the Mary Sue Hubbard doghouse offering the kind of caché buyers with 2.5M are looking to buy into. I suppose it beats trying to sell a house where someone was brutally murdered, but not by much.

    • Nice location for shooting a movie or two.


      • Robert Eckert

        Remake of The Shining?

        • richelieu jr

          RegRum, ReggedRum!

  • Vaquera

    Church of Scientology inks lease in Quincy amid HQ delays in South End

    Co$ can’t reg the funds to rehab the building they already own, so now the’re going to lease another property. Leasing?? Another sign of the church’s diminishing influence.

    • Tony Ortega

      It’s not an ideal situation. Hur hur.

      • Vaquera

        Tee hee.

      • Missionary Kid

        Good pun.

    • Captain Howdy

      Wicked Pissah
      We know how to deal with evil leprechauns

  • Guest

    Someone, or a group of someones need to write a book to help people return to sanity after the horrors of Scientology. Right now, the message boards are doing a great job of this, but I wonder with the horrible sanctions drummed into them about the internet if they’d even see it. I have been watching this board for over a year, and the names and faces that have come through the stories that Tony posts, and who have posted as themselves here show that they are sad, broken people. Everything that made them human was ripped from them by the mind control techniques that the cult uses. Up is down and bad is good. Emotion is poor taste and lying and stealing are sanctioned. They come out believing they can move stuff with their minds. They have no religious faith on which to anchor themselves because it was drummed out of them and replaced with worship of a cheap smooth-talking charlatan and his diminuitive successor/ co-conspirator (who I am convinced stole the leadership role). Most have no families, no friends, no contacts. They are the saddest people I’ve ever seen. It takes months, years for them to try to put themselves back together. If there was only some way to help them.

    • Tony Ortega

      Jeff Hawkins already wrote that book. It’s called “Leaving Scientology,” and it’s easy to find online.

    • Captain Howdy

      Freedom of Mind: Helping Loved Ones Leave Controlling People, Cults, and Beliefs by Steven Hassan

    • DeElizabethan

      The saddest people I’ve ever seen are the ones still caught in the trap who are n the organization. Once one gets out the road is mostly on the high side with new found freedom, friends and the ability to find out the truth, which eventually becomes freedom from all the shit. Mostly they are mad at themselves, get over that, then help to prevent others from experiencing the same pitfalls, through freedom of speech and press.

      • richelieu jr

        Yeah, I am very, very impressed by how well survivors in these parts seem to be able to reconstruct themselves and go on without letting it eat them up or becoming bitter. It is pretty amazing, actually.

    • Sid

      “They are the saddest people I’ve ever seen.”

      Harsh. I didn’t realize. Don’t forget though we’re also ugly, and smell bad.

      • Robert Eckert

        and your commander dress you funny!

    • richelieu jr

      Jefferson Hawkins has written a book, ‘Leaving Scientology’ about this very thing, and has a website of the same name. What is more, he can guide people to experts who can help them. Jon Atack does the same thing…

      • Robert Eckert

        “Surviving” Scientology is Karen de la C and Jeff Augustin’s YouTube channel. “Leaving” Scientology is Jeff Hawkins’ book and site.

        • richelieu jr

          Yeah, I thought I’d corrected the mistake before anyone could catch it… OH, well!

  • joeapple212

    Wow, Tony, this is so experiencial. The guy really makes you feel what it’s like to become scientologist. And his sea org transformation was like doing time in a sci-if reverse-prison based on the illusion of freedom and aliveness.

    But, it also helped me see the shape of an idea that’s been forming in my mind – that scientology affects different people in different ways. Like TR0. I associated it with a heightened state, a kind of fascination. Bullbaiting was about retaining that. I don’t think it made me more tolerant of the weirdness in scientology. If anything, it heightened it. I wanted scientology to be weird . . . I guess I have a taste for the bizarre.

    After doing TR’s, I had to study. I felt like I was ‘on.’ So, I couldn’t figure out the exact difference between “thetan” and “theta”. I asked the course supervisor (the ‘sup’). It soon became apparent that he would not be answering my questions with his own words. He would only show me LRH quotes. (That’s weird!) I just couldn’t get the concept of “theta”. What was it’s essence? I understood that a thetan was a nothingness. It seemed to me that LRH was saying thetans were made of theta, but if a thetan is a nothingness, how could a nothingness be made of something? I thought the theory seemed incomplete. The course supervisor tried to convince me otherwise. He showed me Hubbard quotes from different sources. This went on for quite a while. Eventually, I felt a little guilty about taking up so much of his time, so I let it go.

    For me, scientology induced hypomania – a low level mania associated with euphoria. That euphoria, combined with the counter-intuitive other-worldly weirdness, was nothing to be sniffed at. It was a trip.

    Many times I’ve argued about scientology being hypnotic. I think for some people it was. The thing about hypnosis is that you don’t even have to be relaxed. You could be hypnotized while riding an exercise bike – you just have to be susceptible. There’s a scientific test that reveals if you are a person who could be hypnotized, called the Stanford Hypnotic Susceptibility Scale*. People who are hypnotized are awake, but they feel as if their actions are involuntary . . . I’m sure scientology had an hypnotic effect on different people to different degrees . . . and I’m not sure I could be hypnotized, though I’d like to find out . . .

    “I often felt like an outsider, detached from reality, having ‘stepped out’ of real life.”

    I had the exact same experience. I told the mission holder that, if the universe was a house, I felt like I was outside, looking in the windows . . .

    She held out her hand to me. I took her hand. She said, “[joeapple], I think I really got that!” She was OT III, and I felt as though she was welcoming me to the world of ‘OT.’

    “you do not go to sleep until it is done”

    It’s hard for me to imagine how hard it was to be in the sea org.

    “The fire-breathing product officer will be followed and supported when the wishywashy old pal guy will be stepped all over in the rush to follow a real leader.” Hubbard

    Everybody loves a tyrant! Who knew?

    ‘sci-fi totalitarianism’


    Thanks Tony for this special treat! It really help me realize that, like so many psychiatric disorders, scientology is a spectrum. People’s experiences in scientology go from one extreme to the other.


    • Techie
    • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

      Another phrase that describes the hypnotic state is the dissociative state, which has a similar conceptual and experimental background.

    • richelieu jr

      “The fire-breathing product officer will be followed and supported when
      the wishywashy old pal guy will be stepped all over in the rush to
      follow a real leader.” Hubbard”

      This reminds me of bin Laden’s logic in his discourse about people preferring the strong horse over the weak horse, no matter the hardship, etc…..

  • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

    Sorry all for this OT re-re-post, but I wanted to get a bit more feedback on a recent response that I had to our latest troll, Ethics Officer, particularly any reaction to the “Bunker House Rules” (although I am also self-indulgently including an edited version of the exchange because it was fun for me and I wanted to share):

    Hello Ethics Officer, I see you dropped back in again, and did your best to complete a brief com cycle and establish some affinity with your LRH tech. Good luck with that. The following might be helpful to you. Of course, this is not official, since, unlike a cult, there is no centralized authority here at the bunker (unless you want to think of Tony as “authority figure”…well, he is certainly an expert authority, but it is funny to think of Tony as authoritarian!).

    Bunker House Rules:
    1). Thou shall demonstrate an accurate awareness of the true horror that is LRH, DM, and the COS.
    2.) Thou shall demonstrate a capacity for genuine compassion and accurate empathy towards those that have been harmed by the church.
    3). Thou shall not discuss or lecture people about the supposed benefits of LRH tech, or claim that that those here misunderstand Scientology and/or LRH, ESPECIALLY without having demonstrated 1 and 2.

    Anyone who violates all 3 rules is still mind-fucked by the cult or a troll. Violation of one or more of the rules will result in an initial attempt at engagement and understanding. Continued violation of the rules will ultimately result in being ignored (mostly). The above rules are not binding on anyone, and no one has to follow them, since I made them up. This is an open blog, and anyone is free to make whatever comment they wish or take on anyone here. One should not act surprised or claim that this place is “just like Scientology” (the latter of which is highly laughable to an uninfected, reasonable mind) when there is blow-back, ridicule, or rejection
    for violating the house rules.
    Ethic Officer Responds:
    May I point out to you Sir, that your proposed rules are quite uhm…, lets say… cult rules? It’s like: you have to think how we think and behave like we behave, right? We don’t want to have a cult here Sir, do we? That would be very bad. However, I appreciate your concern for my wellbeing Sir. I feel so much genuine compassion and accurate empathy in your words when you speak to me, that it really touches my heart. God bless you, Sir.

    Sir Hemet responds:
    But thank you for supplying further evidence that, because of your deeply embedded LRH-ARC tech, you do not recognize or understand the basic psychological principles of human social interaction: social rules that are in
    operation in all free and open social groups (i.e., groups that are free to join, and truly free to leave). One of those principles is that, to receive empathy or compassion, you have to demonstrate a least a little yourself (or be perceived as innocent). At this point, the only emotion that you deserve here is pity, which, like many others here, I do feel for you. But until you prove otherwise (i.e., follow rule 1 & 2), feeling empathy for you would be as
    wasted as feeling it for David Miscavige.

    • lucille austero

      “highly laughable to an uninfected, reasonable mind.” Yes yes yes!!!

    • Phil McKraken

      What’s with all the “Sir” business? That like taping a “Kick me” sign to your own back.

    • Ethcs Occifer

      So tired of this Tony Ortego cult… PPL here is wearing top hats, making up rules, culting it up, chatting, laughing. Laughter is stuped. One guy here is even named Phil McCracken… That can’t be real. And what’s the deal with skim milk? People actually buy this?

      • Phil McKraken

        It’s real … stoopid

        • Jo

          I think Phil McKraken is a great name.

          • Phil McKraken

            Thank you, Jo. It’s layered with meaning, but mostly it’s J&D.

            • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

              Not only layered, but tumid with meaning. BTW, are you related our friend, Putin? Putin McKraken.

          • richelieu jr

            “RELEASE… THE MCKRAKEN!!!!!”

            • Jo

              I just hearsay it on youtube, 🙂

    • Science Doc

      He has mostly been less obnoxious than the ones we have been infested with in the past. When I engage these guys, and I usually don’t, I try to get them to talk about the harm to families from disconnection and other things they don’t like to address. Because they are usually playing characters they can act nice one day and go downhill when they feel they aren’t having their way.

      Sometimes I think we might actually be dealing with a public or staff member who is looking for a reality check before going under the radar, but then the aggressive trolling kicks in. I don’t know why OSA even bothers sending in the trolls (reminds me of a song). With the 33 active lawsuits agains Narconon, possible criminal charges in the near future and a brand identity second only to ISIS in toxicity, I would think they would all be busy with more adult activities.

      I know that the goal of dead agenting some individuals draws them out, but they show up at other times as well. I’m curious whether really bad news that can’t be handled by dead agenting an individual keeps them away. I bet that stories about criminal charges or massive litigation will tend to keep them away in that the risk of contamination must be much greater than stats points for 6th grade snark on the Internet.

      I think your 3 rules reasonably triage good faith people with divergent views from bad faith trolling.

      • Captain Howdy

        “and a brand identity second only to ISIS in toxicity”

        Well in all fairness to ISIS, except for another beheading faux pas, they’ve really been trying to clean up their brand name through social media.

        • Science Doc

          Process R2-47?

          • Jenny Daniels

            Actually, I believe, Sir that perhaps you’re thinking of Process AK47?

        • jeff
        • Bury_The_Nuts


        • richelieu jr

          I was very impressed in the VICE reports how thye crucified that guy on the street corner and life went on, selling fruit for witnesses, trafffic snarls, kids playing…

        • Jenny Daniels

          ISIS is everything Hubbie wanted $cientology to be…

    • Bury_The_Nuts

      Hey, I love these rules. But I been drinking green smoothies for two days and I could use a tasty troll snack.
      I hope he tastes like chicken!

      • Qbird

        Green smoothies?! Is that what you’re calling Mojitoes these days girl?!

        Bury, this newbie guy, Bob the Ethics Officer, is just another
        ‘smarty-pants’ guy akin to Theo & Vinay… he believes in his heart, soul
        & mind that LRH did something good for him – he likes Teh Tech (from the beginning of his scientology experience of course).

        Bob EO says he was in Scn. Inc., he talks the talk. He says he even signed that damn worthless billion year contract but only made it 3 days in the SO before “smelling a trap” — when I asked him who set the trap, he did not answer me. So he didn’t walk the walk for very long, that is, if he’s not one of those lying liars that lie kind of guy. He said last night he left the organization and became a squirrel, claims to have helped others, but then, oh noes!!! he got officially declared an SP. BUT! He likes auditing, it works for him in his life’s course.

        The problem he is having in the bunker is that he cannot seem to express himself without belittling other folks who comment here. He quite deftly denigrates any & all posters here even though English is not his first language. He enjoys stirring up some shit, often saying that that adds to the Underground Bunker community. He also is fond of saying that this blog is a
        cult and people here are whining idiots who have no life because they are here all day long – most unlike him, who has a job, two sons who are his best
        friends, a blonde flight attendant girlfriend and a new motor boat. He claims to only attack in self defense which is to me anyway, a very compelling form of attack… ‘justifiable’ even. Whatever.

        So there’s my synopsis of this latest ‘troll’ person so far. Just a guy who knows Ron lied but still thinks Hubbard, The King of Bullshit Mountain,

        was an all right guy.

        That he feels the need to constantly say this

        on a clearly anti-scientology website: IS. THE. TROLL.
        It’s a good one… a beautiful man-made artificial hard-bait trolling lure ~

        • lucille austero

          EO appears to me to be an asshat, but that is just me.

          • Qbird

            He surly was an asshat to you, lucille, dear heart… I saw.

            • lucille austero

              You know what they say, I’m rubber, you’re glue, what rolls off me sticks to you! A big Neener Neener to EO!

            • richelieu jr

              I’m with you, Lucille..

              (and I seem to remember actually being in the trenches with you the other day. What a prick!)

              Anyone who can’t see the difference between the CoS and The Underground Bunker is doomed to fall right into the next cult (if they’ll have him, see above ‘Prick’
              It is certainly not hard t see how someone with those analytical capacities and proven reasoning skills fell for Hubbard’s flim flam… He’s clearly kept the winning personality)

        • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

          Splendid analysis, Qbird.

      • Vaquera


    • Free Minds, Free Hearts

      As Science Doc says, sometimes it is hard to know if these are disaffected public or under the radar folks. I always remember Tory saying how much it meant to her that Arnie Lerma was kind, unlike what she was told about the outside world and unlike what she had experienced in the criminal organization known as the “church of scientology.” That is partly why she had the courage to leave, to test out the unknown world. So anyway, I try not to be mean to the possible trolls. I figure that any OSA or troll is a potential “ex.” Anything I can do to move them towards their “ex” status (now THERE is a real status!) is worth trying.

      • jeff

        I think Tory said that about Andreas and not Arnie Lerma

        • Free Minds, Free Hearts

          Thanks Jeff I am sure you are right and I just edited my comment in response to your correction.

    • richelieu jr

      Well, Sir Hemet,
      your learned responses certainly put my simply calling him an asshat to shame.
      Good job, sir!

    • richelieu jr

      Hey, the guy chose VLadimir Putin as his avatar! That tells you a lot, right there!

      I wrote (then erased, sadly),

      “If you go carrying pictures of Chairman Mao/ You ain’t gonna make it with anyone any how”

      …but then I was afraid he’d go off on how Putin wasn’t Mao an dhow we need to be educated blah, blah, blah…

  • nottrue

    2013 was a great year inside the bubble…..what a bunch of crap …

  • Panopea Abrupta
    • aegerprimo

      Heh heh, did not think this graphic made it to my Flickr LOL

    • aegerprimo

      Left these trails on the trolls today…
      (ty THDNE)

  • CherryPitz

    OT: The New Yorker has a piece on Anonymous, with some mention of the battle with CO$. I have only skimmed the piece so far. I hope this link works.

    • aegerprimo

      Excellent! Thank you for the link. This is a good read.

      Here is an excerpt….

      In January, 2008, Gawker Media posted a video in which Tom Cruise enthusiastically touted the benefits of Scientology. The video was copyright-protected, and the Church of Scientology sent a cease-and-desist letter to Gawker, asking that the video be removed. Anonymous viewed the church’s demands as attempts at censorship. “I think it’s time for /b/ to do something big,” someone posted on 4chan. “I’m talking about ‘hacking’ or ‘taking down’ the official Scientology Web site.” An Anon used YouTube to issue a “press release,” which included stock footage of storm clouds and a computerized voice-over. “We shall proceed to expel you from the Internet and systematically dismantle the Church of Scientology in its present form,” the voice said. “You have nowhere to hide.” Within a few weeks, the YouTube video had been viewed more than two million times.

      Anonymous had outgrown 4chan. The hackers met in dedicated Internet Relay Chat channels, or I.R.C.s, to coördinate tactics. Using DDoS attacks, they caused the main Scientology Web site to crash intermittently for several days. Anons created a “Google bomb,” so that a search for “dangerous cult” would yield the main Scientology site at the top of the results page. Others sent hundreds of pizzas to Scientology centers in Europe, and overwhelmed the church’s Los Angeles headquarters with all-black faxes, draining the machines of ink. The Church of Scientology, an organization that reportedly has more than a billion dollars in assets, could withstand the depletion of its ink cartridges. But its leaders, who had also received death threats, contacted the F.B.I. to request an investigation into Anonymous.

      On March 15, 2008, several thousand Anons marched past Scientology churches in more than a hundred cities, from London to Sydney. In keeping with the theme of anonymity, the organizers decided that all the protesters should wear versions of the same mask. After considering Batman, they settled on the Guy Fawkes mask worn in “V for Vendetta,” a dystopian movie from 2005. “It was available in every major city, in large quantities, for cheap,” Gregg Housh, one of the organizers of the protests and a well-known Anon, told me. The mask was a caricature of a man with rosy cheeks, a handlebar mustache, and a wide grin.

      • Barbara Angel

        WOW, I love the Anon people, thank you for the excerpt.
        They’re definitely doing a “”Community Service”” in shining the light on co$ and all it’s dirty dealings. Same as this site and many others, Yay…x..1,000 The internet is the Most *Powerful* weapon against that vicious cult. Oh yeah the cult of the *most ethical* people in the universe. WTF????
        Now all we need is for the authorities to WAKE THE FUCK UP and do something about it!!!
        One good thing in Aus, co$ has such a small presence, we don’t often hear about it unless it’s a scandal and as previously mentioned: mustravage flew in to Sydney under cover and then out again. Too frightened for media opportunities to promote his maggoty shrinking cult.
        The only thing heard by the general public was that he had Goons blocking the footpath. So the whole Sydney grand morgue opening was over and done with, so fast, not many ordinary people even noticed. So much for the Appearance of greatest most ethical church leader in the entire world. True to form, He Slunk in and Slunk out.
        Or should that be slithered in and slithered out?

  • Chee Chalker

    Looking forward to reading Peter’s book. Maybe others will follow Peter’s example and publish an honest accounting of their actions. I know there are a few good ones out there, but I can think of one of two really major ones that could blow the lid off once and for all.p

  • Felony indictments in Oklahoma by the end of this month, with any luck!

  • outraged

    As soon as I saw the The Masked Avengers, : How Anonymous incited online vigilantism from Tunisia to Ferguson….I wondered if ScientoLIEolgy was mentioned. It is, it is.

    here is the link, interesting article

    I never quite understood whether or not there was a relationship between SciLie and Anon, except for the occasional event picketing and the public exposure of Tommy Gurl.

  • aegerprimo

    A year and a half ago, I started my REAL journey out of the mind-fuck of the Cult of $cientology. Over 15 years ago, I quietly left the Co$ and all being an active member in good standing entailed (the steps on the “Bridge to Total Freedom”, etc.) Time passed but I did not shake the cult-think and ideas of L. Ron Hubbard until I started reading Google Hearsay on the Internet, the Underground Bunker, the chat forums,, etc.

    To make a long story short, one of the first books I read on my way out of the $cientology Brainwash was Margery Wakefield’s book, “The Road to Xenu”
    The appropriate chapter – Flunk for Laughing! Start!

    Here is an excerpt about the TRs (Training Routines) of $cientology as experienced by Margery. This EXACT thing happened to me. For me (like many others) the TRs where like a hit of a drug and makes you want more. (This happened after lots of love bombing about helping people and being part of a group that is making the world a better place for all people.)

    The excerpt from Margery Wakefield’s book….

    I looked at my checksheet. The next section was called “Training Drills.”

    According to the instructions I needed a “twin” to do the drills. I went up the Supervisor. She looked around the classroom. “OK,” she said. “I think George needs to do TR’s. Go have a seat and I’ll get him,” she pointed to the pairs of chairs in the back of the room.

    A minute later, an older man approached and stretched out his hand. “Hi,” he said warmly. “I’m George. I hear you need to do TR’s.”

    “Yeah, I guess,” I hesitated. “I’ve never done them before.”

    “That’s OK. Let’s read the bulletin,” and he opened his pack to the same page I was on.

    “TR 0 Confronting,” I read.

    Purpose: To train student to confront a preclear with auditing only or with nothing. Training Stress: Have student and coach sit facing each other, neither making any conversation or effort to be interesting. Have them sit and look at each other and say and do nothing for some hours. Student must not speak, fidget, giggle or be embarrassed….

    “All right,” George looked at me pleasantly. “I’ll be the coach. We do this for two hours. Get comfortable.”

    I adjusted myself in the chair and put my hands on my lap.

    “Ready?” George sat in a similar position directly across from me. Our knees were almost touching.

    I nodded.

    “OK, start!” George commanded.

    I looked into George’s eyes, wondering what was going to happen. He looked back at me with a flawless, unblinking stare. I blinked my eyes.

    “Flunk for blinking! Start!” George said sternly.

    “You mean I can’t even blink?” I asked incredulously.

    “Flunk for talking! Start!” George said, still maintaining his perfect stare into my eyes.

    I tried to return the same perfect stare he was giving me. My mouth started to quiver.

    “Flunk for moving your mouth. Start!” George was merciless. All right, I thought to myself. This is serious. Then I thought of something.

    “George,” I interrupted. “Wait a minute. If I flunk, does that mean we have to start the two hours over again?”

    “That’s it,” he said, temporarily ending the drill. He smiled at me and said, “Right. The two hours will start over again every time I say `Start.’ When you can do TR 0 flawlessly for two hours, then we are finished with the drill.”

    Before I could ask him anything else, he had resumed his staring and commanded, “Flunk for talking! Start!” and we were off again. I tried as hard as I could not to blink. Soon I could feel the tears welling up in my eyes. My eyes were burning from the salty liquid. But I forced myself not to blink. George continued his seemingly effortless blinkless stare.

    As I stared into George’s eyes, I began to see an aura of colors around his head. The colors were flowing in streams around his head. Then the colors expanded into the whole room. I watched with awe as the whole room became filled with flowing colors.

    Meanwhile my pain was increasing. The tears started to run down my cheeks. Inside I was crying with pain. But stubbornness competed with the pain. “If he can do it,” I thought to myself determinedly, “then I can do it too.” I was feeling pain in my whole body. I was suddenly conscious of the chair, and it felt painful against my body. I wanted desperately to move and to ease the pain of the chair against the pressure points of my body. This was torture. The time went on. I began to have sensations of my body being contorted out of shape. The flowing colors in the room became even more vivid. I was feeling strangely dizzy. I wondered if I was going to pass out. I was feeling light-headed, almost like I had felt once at the dentist when I had been given gas before having a tooth extracted.

    How much time had gone by? I continued my stare. I wanted to look down at my watch. I wondered how were we going to know when two hours had gone by. The thought of having to sit here until the Supervisor called the dinner break was not a good thought.

    The time continued to pass by. The excruciating pain at the point where my hipbones met the chair seemed to be going away, and I was beginning to feel a sense of expansiveness, as if I were expanding like a balloon into the space in the classroom.

    Suddenly I had a rushing feeling of euphoria. I felt as if I was floating, looking down at everyone from a thousand points all over the room. This was better than anything I had ever experienced on marijuana.

    “Far out,” I thought to myself. The pain was gone. “I feel like I could sit here like this for a thousand years.” I was enjoying the expansive high. The colors were gone. Instead, I saw the room with crystal clarity. I felt an unaccustomed serenity. I could just stay like this forever, I was thinking, when suddenly George reached forward and tapped my shoulder.

    “That’s it,” he said quietly. “You have just passed TR 0.”

    • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

      Here is a video to accompany the text:

    • Panopea Abrupta
    • Cosmo Pidgeon

      That’s an excellent account..As I mentioned the other day the TR’s are quite amazing when done per instructions. Especially for guy like me who has already had a similar experience on LSD of being exterior to my body and had already formed a cosmology of my own similar to the early explanations of Scientology. If there was nothing to it people would not be so rabid in defending the cult.It’s what happens later. The incessant demands on the totality of your existence and the insanity of the organization that Hubbard created. It makes me think maybe he didn’t really create these TR’s…..but if he did it was for us to use to control others. This may not make sense to those who never experienced this..Another reason it’s hard to leave.Unfortunately it’s all not about a spiritual journey like you thought. It.s about control….It’s about power..that’s why you hear all the abuse stories… rape…it’s not about sex, it’s about control and abuse..This part never made sense to me. When I found out yesterday that so many people here were never in. I think this is important to understanding. Hope I made sense …If’s still my experience and maybe if I were better equipped as a writer…I don’t know.

    • Cosmo Pidgeon

      I just got a book on Alister Crowley….There might be an answer there apparently according to Nib’s grandson….I am not a believer in Black Magic or afraid of ideas or what people think or believe and I am not looking for an alternative to follow. I am done, found peace with the universe. If I seem loony by my next entry maybe that will open a door for the rest of us as to what happens in Scientology.

    • And I don’t rent cars!

      There was a discussion earlier today in the Bunker about hypnosis. So I ended up reading some essays written by professional hypnotists and clinical studies (using PET scans) which looked at hypnotherapy used in psychotherapy or used for pain management and these kinds of visual and/or auditory hallucinations, e.g. brought on by fixed staring or other techniques, during self-hypnosis processes are common.

      There were other studies, which I haven’t read, which looked at how false memories can be created using similar hypnotic techniques or using a combination of hypnotic-psychotherapy and how, using PET scans, true vs. false memories can be differentiated.

      It all made me think of Jon Atack’s essays in which he states hypnosis is at the core of some of the training routines and OT auditing.

      Sorry no links, computer crashed 10 mins ago before I saved all the open tabs. If I can pull them up, I’ll send you some sources.

      • Anonymous

        Arnie Lerma has researched and written a great deal about what he sees as the application of hynotic techniques by Hubbard in Scientology.

        Confusion Technique is one of the most prevalent:

        • And I don’t rent cars!

          Yes, that is a good source to post a link to. Thanks for reminding me. Now that I’ve read about hypnosis and self-hypnosis from a neuroscience perspective, it’ll be good to re-read Arnie’s pages.

  • Deeana

    Certain aspects of Camilla’s recitation of Annie Broeker’s story about the LRH death event don’t line up with other published accounts. I suppose this is to be expected since it is a second-hand telling of an event that happened a long time ago.
    I do not think Annie “called 911′. Ron was supposedly discovered dead during the evening hours. There were $cientologists called. If I recall correctly, the next morning a call was placed to a local mortician to come and remove the body. It was someone associated with the mortician who called the local sheriff’s office in regard to the death.
    There have been several first hand accounts of these events published.

    • Anonymous

      The account by Camilla of the stories she was told by Annie provides some useful information, but the timeline is a little soft. Most (not all) of what Camilla relays lines up with the written recollection of Robert Vaughn Young (who arrived several hours after Hubbard died) and does not conflict much from what has been reported as the viewpoint of Sarge, who was also on the grounds at the time of Hubbard’s death.

      The issue with who called the sheriff is interesting, but might just be an anomaly among details recounted from a story told by another. Per the official Coroner’s report on Hubbard’s death, Mrs. Irene Reis from Reis Chapel made the first call to the Don Hines, the then Chief Deputy Coroner for the area (Creston CA) where Hubbard died. It was the Deputy Coroner, Don Hines, who first called the Sheriff, per Mr. Hines’ written report.

      An image of the first paragraph of the Coroner’s report is below. A link to the entire Coroner’s Report and other documents is provided here as a convenience:

      A very comprehensive written recounting of events by Robert Vaughn Young is here:

      • Camilla Andersson

        What is documented is written by those people. My story is from the person otherwise in-charge and the trauma that she went through. When the stress is that intense, honestly, it can be anything.

        • Anonymous

          Absolutely agree. Your story is valuable and it is new information (at least to me) about Annie’s recollections.

          I tend to go with official eye-witness accounts on details, especially when the eye-witnesses do not seem to have a hidden agenda. However I am always cautious when still-in Scientologists are sharing information as my personal experience is that the culture of Scientology promotes inventive shore stories.

          IMHO, the best histories are written by ALL the participants in an event or in broader dramas. Each participant provides a tile in the larger mosaic that approaches the truth.

          • Camilla Andersson

            We both agree. At the time of her telling me this – mid 90s, that was her version. IT is just all more information into the large machine of investigation going on on the outside – to find out what is really up, on the inside.

            • Anonymous

              It is useful information – thanks for sharing it along with your other insights and experiences.

        • Dancing Cranberry

          Thank you, Camilla, for sharing your recollections of Annie. You are honouring her memory – as good friends do.

          • Camilla Andersson

            Thank you! And a true friend always has ones back! And I have hers! 🙂

        • Jo

          Thanks Camilla.

    • Camilla Andersson

      Per Annie’s side of the story there was for sure police. But who knows as the story has been covered up, so it’s not exactly known. In Scn to cover up these actual events, such as why LRH died, information is changed around.

      • Anonymous

        It does sound like a few of the details that Annie provided might have been shore stories, especially the timing of Hubbard’s death being a surprise, with him dictating notes etc. until the day of the night before he died.

        According to the sworn testimony of Hubbard’s personal physician, Dr Eugene Denk, Hubbard was suffering from dysphrasia for about 8 days before death. Dysphrasia is an impairment in the ability to speak and / or to vocalize thoughts in an organized way. Dysphrasia is common in people that have suffered strokes, as had Hubbard.

        It is impossible to know what the unvarnished truth was as your dear friend Annie is no longer able to tell her story. This happens all too often in Scientology, especially to people who have salient, eye-witness information.

      • Baby

        Camilla ..thank you so much for speaking out.. I’m loving your videos..I am sorry that you lost a great friend. I really value my GF and I know you do too. What a nice tribute.

        • Camilla Andersson

          GF = Great Freedom? Thank you and I appreciate your support. This has not been easy and I simply want the in-humane activities and brutality to stop. We will both enjoy our freedom, being out and doing what we choose & love! I am sure I do know you – by the way!

          • Robert Eckert

            GF = girl friends

            • Baby

              Hahaha Thanks Robert.. I miss you..Where ya been?

            • Robert Eckert

              I was on a long weekend camping trip to the catskills, then disqus wouldn’t let me back in for a while.

            • Baby

              Well, glad to see you back!

      • J. Swift

        The police were called as Annie related to Camilla.

        Here is how it happened according to the San Luis Obispo Sheriff-Coroner’s investigation:

        L. Ron Hubbard was discovered dead in his Bluebird motorhome at about 8:00 PM on January 24, 1986.

        The ranch called Int Base rather than the police. Led by David Miscavige, a large party departed Int Base at 10:00 PM and arrived at the ranch at about 1:00 AM on January 25.

        Scientology officials wanted to bypass the authorities and called the Reis Funeral Chapel the next morning at 7:30 to inquire about arrangements for an immediate cremation.

        The Reis Funeral Chapel thought the time delay was out of the ordinary and immediately called the San Luis Obispo Sheriff-Coroner.

        The Sheriff-Coroner called the ranch and spoke with Hubbard’s personal physician Dr. Denk who explained that Hubbard had died of a stroke. The Sheriff-Coroner also spoke with Hubbard’s attorney Earle Cooley.

        The Sheriff-Coroner dispatched Deputy Gassett and Deputy Bang to the ranch to investigate. The deputies responded, investigated, and called the Sheriff-Coroner to report on their findings.

        Given the decedent’s notriety and the fact that Hubbard had signed his Last Will and Testament the day before he died, the Sheriff-Coroner refused Cooley’s request for an immediate cremation and insisted upon a post-mortem examination of the body and blood samples.

        Cooley consented. A post-mortem examination of the body was conducted, the body was photographed, and blood samples were taken.

        Satisfied that there was no foul play or a suicide, the Sheriff-Coroner released Hubbard’s body to attorney Cooley who immediately had the body cremated. Additionally, the Sheriff-Coroner released custody of Hubbard’s ranch to Hubbard’s executor Norman Starkey.

        Details here:

        And here:

  • aegerprimo

    Did you know that the WABC Eyewitness News, Tony and Karen make appearances as mentioned above…

    Here is the link to the page that runs with Disqus comments!

    • lucille austero

      Couldn’t link back to the bunker…left a generic “google it” comment.

      • Baby

        Lucille.. I read your post.. Do you think you should change it to the Abuses of Scn ..because the way you have it people will go to Scientology site.. right?

        • lucille austero

          You’re right – done! Thanks!

          • Baby

            Perfecto.. didn’t want to be bossy.. I thought well we know you as a critic, but others may think you are a Scientologist..eeeeeeep.. xo baby

    • Baby

      Thanks sweetie.. Just posted!

  • Anonymookme

    Um, I hate to break it to you guys, but regardless of how LRLoon died, all he is right now is a dead con man. Oh, and spoiler alert! He ain’t coming back. Thank God! He’s done enough damage.

    • Anonymous

      “He ain’t coming back.”

      Well…at least not yet.

      But if he does, he’s going to be one pissed off OT!


      • Anonymookme

        I’ll bet you $1,000.00 that LRLoon ain’t coming back. Trust me. I’m not a gullible sap. The chief loon is dead, he ain’t returning

  • Diana Hubbard is locked in her tunnel and is a loyal Scientologist.. She
    praises David Miscavige and is convinced he has “saved Scientology”. She said so to a mutual connection who briefed me.
    Diana is trusted to go on and off Int base. She has her own car and can get through Security at the gates with no problem. She could take off (flee) any day of the year. She does not,. She returns to the hell that is INT Base willingly.
    She believes she is being loyal to her father.

    • Narapoid

      Thanks for sharing Karen. That is another terribly sad reality. But isn’t Diana the sole LRH offspring still in? Great interview with Camille and the KABC news interview, simply delicious.

      Power to ya dear.

      • Yes Narapoid, the sole offspring still in. Her siblings Arthur and Suzette do not participate in any Scientology.

        • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

          Stunningly beautiful, but more powerfully haunting.

        • richelieu jr

          Yes, she could have served as a shining example but chose to serve as a hideous warning.

      • Eclipse-girl

        Diana is the only Hubbard progeny that is still in.

    • Barbara Angel

      Loyal to her father or waiting for her time to wrest back the family power? Can’t believe she would tolerate being shoved into oblivion like that and has complete freedom to come and go.
      Perhaps she has the same sadistic streak as her father and mustravage? Maybe mustravage has made her Director of the RPF’S, RPF so she can indulge with sadistic delight in the misery of others?
      Just saying…because it sounds a bit fishy? What’s in it for her to stay???

      • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

        You can’t reason someone out of a position they didn’t reason themselves into.

      • grundoon

        Diana Hubbard apparently surrendered completely to David Miscavige. Mary Sue couldn’t stand up to him, how could Diana? She did make one attempt; the story is told by Mike Goldstein at Annie Tidman Broeker also makes a cameo appearance. (Mike didn’t know then what was really going on at the top of Scientology.)

        • Barbara Angel

          Thank you for the link. As they/we say just when you think $camology can’t get worse it does.
          Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr So poor Diana she grew up on the Kool-Aid and I do think co$ is the only place she has every known… she stays….. Sad huh

    • Captain Howdy

      What a waste of a beautiful woman. She could have done music, acting, anything but waste her life on this rubbish.

    • 0tessa

      She praises Miscavige? OMG Then she is or stupid or she is the evil queen of Scientology.

  • CobGatYour$$

    Just read the Scientology Handbook for assists! Laughed my ass off!!

  • Cosmo Pidgeon

    I have to admit after yesterday I felt a little bit like this…….But I like a lot of you and I’d like to stay.

    • Baby

      Cosmo… Will you sit beside me during group therapy? OH you better stay Mr. You my buddy!

      • Cosmo Pidgeon

        Thanks Baby…..Yes, if I don’t get harassed out. I felt both ways yesterday and had to say it. I think you and this bunker are wonderful and I love being a small part of it.

        • Baby

          did I miss something.. I haven’t been on as much..

          • Cosmo Pidgeon

            No No….just that the video I posted might have been taken the wrong way..But you didn’t. I’m still here for group therapy. Thanks.

            • Baby

              Oh good.. the more the merrier!

  • Tampa Bay Times Editorial: We’re not saying that Hernando County is incompetent, but residents sure deserve a government that isn’t. (More or less.)

  • Pierrot

    *** RED X +–+ RED X +–+RED X +–+ RED X *** Wednesday the 3rd of September

    Good morning Early Birds and Night Owls.
    The tempo has increased, the SOs are stirring in co$land, the dreaded statsdays is nearly upon us AGAIN!
    Although we have had 122 ads yesterday we still maintain a comfortable moving average of 80 / day thanks to this W/E slag down!
    We expect this average to shoot up (straight and vertical) in the days leading to Statsthursday.

    Please read the IMPORTANT NOTICE about the flagging options CAREFULLY.

    DON’T route out, BLOW, Get HELP, get OUT. CALL 1-866-XSEAORG

    Hi Baby

    • Graham

      Just done my flagging via the spread-sheet. Quite a few new ones there since yesterday:
      I like using the spread-sheet- very satisfying seeing the blues turn purple.

      • Pierrot

        Thanks Graham, we think that it is safe to RE-Flag after 24 hours especially if you get a new IP from your Internet System Provider daily or after a reboot of your router.
        I am publishing a 3 to 4 days list, hoping that RedXers will take the habit of flagging the same ads 3 to 4 times, increasing the chances to get them down.
        I wish that I knew Tampa’s secret, they are getting them down as fast as the scillons post them!
        Nice to have you back after the holidays, it looks like you had a good time.

  • Missionary Kid

    Totally Off Topic: This is for Marty and his quantum bullshit.

    Marty, if you want to try to understand REAL physics, and not the bullshit Tao of Physics, The Feynman Lectures on Physics are now available for free online from Cal Tech at

    You might go over Volume III on Quantum Mechanics.

    Here’s what the Huffington post wrote about understanding the lectures: But unless you’re a whiz, don’t expect to understand all of Feynman’s physics. As Feynman himself once said, “Hell, if I could explain it to the average person, it wouldn’t have been worth the Nobel Prize.”

    By the way, here’s an interesting video on an astronomer teaching Buddhist monks about Cosmology in the foothills of the Himalayas.

    Dr. Chris Impey Video, On Demand Humble Before The Void: Western Science Meets Tibetan Buddhism

    You can rent the video for $3.95 at

  • valshifter

    ‘I often felt like an outsider, detached from reality, having “stepped out” of real life.’
    I know the feeling, scientology manages to bring you to that position, where you feel like you are the “only one” unable to establish real affinity with no one inside or outside the church; that only serve to further distance yourself from the real world outside and to further depend on the group as a safe zone, rendering you as a powerless individual to be used as they please. meanwhile they make you believe that you are becoming more powerful, but you don’t see the fruits of that anywhere. the only powerful player is the church itself.

    • Baby

      Ohh doggy.. you have us.. We have plenty of seats set up for group therapy..xoxo

      • valshifter

        oh thank you Baby, you are so sweet, I love the bunker great people here.

        • Baby

          Aww I love you too Val.. We are a great bunch.. When I get a little down I come here and I feel a part of something wonderful..

  • richelieu jr

    Every time I think of Annie TIdman, I cannot forget that while Marty Rathbun fights to live a nice life away from Scientology with his new love,t hat he was single-handedly responsible for denying that sort of life to Annie. He chased her down at an airport, just before she was to board a plane to be with the love of her life and brow-beat her into ‘not betraying Hubbard’ to return to Int Base where she was sequestered, force din to sec-checking that broke her as a human being, leaving her unable to recognize close friends from before the incident, and looking ‘every day as if her dog had just died’.

    He claims she did it of her own free will, whilst publicly speaking on his blag as to how free-will is conditioned away. He says he’d done his best to ‘make up for it’ (whatever that means). She died of a disease Scientology was supposed to keep you from getting, from smokes Hubbard encouraged her to puff away on, sperated from friends and family and the man she loved so much she never got over.

    Marty and his wife have been heartlessly harassed, but they are free and still have each other.

    It breaks my heart and just makes me sick.

    • Qbird

      ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ This is true.

  • Baby

    I”ve been thinkin bout it.. Ain’t nobody put me in a clay demo.. NOBODY.. So I gotta rethink dis crowd on da bunker.

    • i-Betty

      You’re so funny!

  • The sales professionals among us will likely see the parallels of overworking and underpaying idealist young sales professionals based on the intense adulation of team motivation as well as the use of illusory titles handed out from above. Youth often crave power more than money, having had so little of the former in relation to the latter. This is, for better or worse, a common technique among the most successful commercial corporations in America.