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Never-before-seen photo of Diana Hubbard, daughter of Scientology’s founder

Diana_Hubbard1982a

 
This has been a great week for tipsters here at the Underground Bunker. We’re very fortunate that so many people think of us when they find interesting news and documents about Scientology. In today’s case, however, it was something a photographer had been holding on to for more than 30 years.

He goes by the handle Ronnos, and he lives in the Netherlands. And it was at a Scientology event in Amsterdam on June 6, 1982, when he captured an image of Diana while she was sitting at a piano, preparing to perform. Ronnos tells us that he left Scientology in 1986, and it was only a few weeks ago when he was digging through some of his things that he found the photograph again. He wanted the readers of the Underground Bunker to see it, and we’re grateful.

Diana Hubbard, 64, is the last member of founder L. Ron Hubbard’s family who is still involved with the Church of Scientology. She’s a member of the Sea Organization, and spends most of her time at Scientology’s International Base, near Hemet, California. But our sources who know her tell us that she does have more freedom than a typical Sea Org member, and can come and go on occasion. When she would come into Los Angeles, she would sometimes stay at her mother’s former house on Chislehurst Drive in Los Feliz, until it was sold in 2014.

Her younger sister and brother, Suzette and Arthur, we’re told both live in the Los Angeles area, but neither of them are involved in Scientology anymore. Meanwhile, any evidence that L. Ron Hubbard ever had any family at all — including the detail that he had seven children by three different wives — has been completely erased from Scientology’s website today.

In 2012, Diana’s only child, her daughter Roanne Horwich, 38, escaped from Scientology when she bolted from Int Base within a few months of Ron Miscavige’s escape. Roanne still isn’t talking publicly, but since she got away from Int Base, we’ve learned a few things about her.

Our sources tell us that she was never close to her mother because Diana left the Sea Org when Roanne was an infant. Roanne was primarily raised by her father, Jonathan Horwich, with help from other Sea Org members at Int Base. When Diana returned to the Sea Org, Roanne had already been forced to join it herself, and they never really connected as mother and child — the Sea Org teaches that family connections are a weakness that only get in the way of “clearing the planet.”

Today, four years after escaping Int Base, Roanne is working in Los Angeles as a scenic painter in the film union, and she’s reportedly very happy to be out of the Sea Org and out of Scientology.

 
——————–

Chris Shelton on ‘Scientology,’ Chapter 2

Chris continues to take apart an academic book about Scientology…

 

 
——————–

Bonus items from our tipsters

Hey, what’s inside that thing?

 
SciBelleair2

 
Yesterday we had another fun appearance at KABC 790 radio in Los Angeles with John Phillips and Jillian Barberie…

 

 
——————–

3D-UnbreakablePosted by Tony Ortega on August 11, 2016 at 07:00

E-mail tips and story ideas to tonyo94 AT gmail DOT com or follow us on Twitter. We post behind-the-scenes updates at our Facebook author page. After every new story we send out an alert to our e-mail list and our FB page.

Our book, The Unbreakable Miss Lovely: How the Church of Scientology tried to destroy Paulette Cooper, is on sale at Amazon in paperback and Kindle editions. We’ve posted photographs of Paulette and scenes from her life at a separate location. Reader Sookie put together a complete index. More information about the book, and our 2015 book tour, can also be found at the book’s dedicated page.

Learn about Scientology with our numerous series with experts…

BLOGGING DIANETICS: We read Scientology’s founding text cover to cover with the help of L.A. attorney and former church member Vance Woodward
UP THE BRIDGE: Claire Headley and Bruce Hines train us as Scientologists
GETTING OUR ETHICS IN: Jefferson Hawkins explains Scientology’s system of justice
SCIENTOLOGY MYTHBUSTING: Historian Jon Atack discusses key Scientology concepts

Other links: Shelly Miscavige, ten years gone | The Lisa McPherson story told in real time | The Cathriona White stories | The Leah Remini ‘Knowledge Reports’ | Hear audio of a Scientology excommunication | Scientology’s little day care of horrors | Whatever happened to Steve Fishman? | Felony charges for Scientology’s drug rehab scam | Why Scientology digs bomb-proof vaults in the desert | PZ Myers reads L. Ron Hubbard’s “A History of Man” | Scientology’s Master Spies | Scientology’s Private Dancer | The mystery of the richest Scientologist and his wayward sons | Scientology’s shocking mistreatment of the mentally ill | Scientology boasts about assistance from Google | The Underground Bunker’s Official Theme Song | The Underground Bunker FAQ

Our Guide to Alex Gibney’s film ‘Going Clear,’ and our pages about its principal figures…
Jason Beghe | Tom DeVocht | Sara Goldberg | Paul Haggis | Mark “Marty” Rathbun | Mike Rinder | Spanky Taylor | Hana Whitfield

 

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  • OOkpik

    Psst, Tony. 3rd paragraph.
    “…that she does have more freedom…”

    • $cnmonkeyrob$

      Oops. 3rd word.โ€œdoseโ€ should be โ€œdoesโ€ ;)ETA: I know, I know… damn autocorrect! ๐Ÿ™‚

      • OOkpik

        Hahaha. Thanks, Monkey.
        Fixed.
        eta: Not only did I turn that inside out but apparently I couldn’t even count to 3. No writing career for me!

        • It should be hahahaha ha…. look here for instructions F5

        • $cnmonkeyrob$

          (no worriesโ€“monkey also couldnโ€™t [count… COUNT] to three, and had to do a crafty edit to correct that, too ๐Ÿ™‚ )[ETA Aaaaaaaarrrrrgggghh!]

          • OOkpik

            Oops.
            ” monkey also couldn’t count to three,..”
            There must be something in the water. ๐Ÿ˜€

            • $cnmonkeyrob$

              Touchรฉ ๐Ÿ™‚

      • My (LInux) autocorrect tried to turn ‘Miscavige’ into ‘Miscreant’.
        I still don’t know which one of us was right.

        • $cnmonkeyrob$

          Got to salute that autocorrect for swiftly getting to the truth of the matter! (it has a point ๐Ÿ™‚ )

        • NOLAGirl (Stephanie)

          You both were. ; )

        • Juicer77

          XD

      • Robert Eckert

        A post correcting someone’s spelling or grammar is likely to contain a similar error– Muphry’s Law

        • Draco

          Yup – that Murfry – he lurks everywhere.

        • EnthralledObserver

          Come on… that’s just here say!

          • Draco

            I was about to correct you…

            • EnthralledObserver

              ๐Ÿ™‚

  • Good that Roanne is out – it’s OK with me if she doesn’t want to talk about it. Ex-victims of the mind-fuck perpetrated by the criminal organisation known as the “church” of $cientology are Not My Private Army (alas ๐Ÿ˜‰ ).

    • NOLAGirl (Stephanie)

      I’m with you Jens. As much as I’d like them all to converse with us about it everyday or have weekly features with Tony, what some of them have been through is a nightmare and if their mental health and well being is better suited to not talking about it then I can respect that. I’d rather someone heal properly than end up in a worse mental state.

    • Ella Raitch

      Note that she’s not talking publicly – so maybe talking privately :-)))))

  • PickAnotherID

    Interesting today’s post is about sons & daughters, because today is: (f5)

    http://ak.imgag.com/imgag/product/postcards/3405165/graphic1.jpg

    So all you sons & daughters in $cientology who’ve ‘disconnected’ (what a disgusting practice) from your parents, give them a call – they still love you.

  • What’sup

    If the cake is like the book then there’s a load of crap inside.

    • thetastic

      Excellent answer.

  • The lie is a cake!

    • Peter

      Definitely NOT caek!!!! ๐Ÿ™‚

      • OOkpik

        Urban dictionary:

        Caek

        The way which many people write “Cรฆk”, simply because it’s hard to get
        the AE character whilst typing. Caek was a popular inside joke from the
        Encyclopaedia Britannica guys who published the first four volumes. The
        joke was so popular that the EB guys decided to write Encyclopaedia with
        the รฆ, vindicating their actions in that it was the correct Latin
        spelling. The work cรฆk was used often by the editors of EB, to describe
        an article that was submitted by less intellectual students and were
        obviously bullshit. It’s a portmanetau of “crap” and “fake”, with the ae
        for intellectual measure.

        That’s such a caek it’s almost worthy of being included.

    • kemist

      I’d take GLaDOS cake over Scientology cake any day.

      At least GLaDOS’ psychopatic tendancies are pretty much obvious.

  • EnthralledObserver

    Heh… for a change they actually did a good job on the cake – the art looks quite good – not Cake Boss, but pretty good. Probably still tastes a little stale on the inside, though.

    Ah, $cientology’s awesome ability to break up families… especially when one member wants out. Why must these pseudo ‘religions’ do this? Oh, that’s right… because they wouldn’t exist without the threats of beheading… er… disconnection.

    • Most of them are mental beheaded. it’s a no brainer!

  • Jenyfurrrrr

    Wow Dianna Hubbard looks like a beautiful lady in that pic. SO sad to hear of the lack of relationship between she and her daughter. But it’s great to hear that Roanne is doing so well and very happy nowadays. Had to be a very strange way to grow up!

    My little man is 10mos old now! Here’s something to make everyone smile: (Sorry – Disqus always rotates my pics & im not sure how to fix it!)

    • EnthralledObserver

      cute… ๐Ÿ™‚

    • Flip Tech F5

      • Kim O’Brien

        SO CUTE …!! what a happy baby ๐Ÿ™‚

      • Jenyfurrrrr

        Thank you!!! ๐Ÿ™Œ๐Ÿผ

        • Ella Raitch

          I’d totally snuggle that

          • Jenyfurrrrr

            He’d love it! He loves the ladies – I’m in trouble already!

        • sashiebgood

          did you try out the teething necklace? he is so adorbs!

          • Jenyfurrrrr

            Yep and he loves it! It definitely seems to help. Then I have a teething bling one also. Thanks again for that – works better than the homeopathic teething tablets!

            • sashiebgood

              I’m so glad! it definitely worked for my son. when the big teeth come in he needed a touch of ibuprofen, but otherwise he wore it until he was over 2. your guy seems like such a happy boy!

            • Jenyfurrrrr

              Yep the necklace plus teething tablets help most days though at night we do rotate Tylenol/ibuprofen (got to love those 1y molars!) but this also keeps him from putting EVERYthing in his mouth, since he’s got his necklace! Huge help!

      • FredEX2

        Awwww. He’s adorable!

      • BronxLaurie10

        OMG! cute!

    • He loves his mommy.

    • Kim O’Brien

      Jenny …you are doing a great job …what a face ๐Ÿ˜‰

      • Jenyfurrrrr

        Aw thank you! He’s a blast and a total ham!

    • TheMirrorThetan

      Look at those little chubby cheeks.

    • Vaquera

      FWIW: If you take the photo horizontally (landscape mode) instead of vertically (portrait mode) it won’t flip when you post it. It will remain upright even if you then crop it to look like you initially snapped it in portrait.

      • Jenyfurrrrr

        Thank you! I will try that next time – much obliged!

    • Draco

      The Pixie hat suits the face; are you sure there aren’t pointy ears underneath there?

      • Jenyfurrrrr

        I’m convinced he’s got elf ears when he wears that hat! My 3yo daughter put it on him & just cracked up. He loved the reaction so now he loves to wear the hat.

        • Draco

          That is just cute! He has a lovely face and those eyes are gorgeous!

          • Jenyfurrrrr

            Aw thanks so much! Thought of you at the Harry Potter & The Cursed Child release party last week.

    • Newiga

      Heyyy!!! Look at that face! And the hat!!!

    • SarahDB

      The way to fix it is to save it as a smaller picture file.

    • Andrea ‘i-Betty’ Garner

      He’s absolutely edible and scrumptious. Aww ๐Ÿ™‚

    • Juicer77

      Such a sweetie!

    • Bo

      Ah. What a cute little happy baby. Love the chubby cheeks.

    • thetastic

      Adorable!

    • Baby

      Awwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww so adorable just the cutest.. He is getting big Jen..You are a good mommy..he looks like such a happy baby.. love baby

      • Jenyfurrrrr

        Aw thanks Baby! He’s such a love & a cuddler. Definitely gives me great reason to smile everyday! Hugs to you!

  • NOLAGirl (Stephanie)

    The only good thing she got from Ole Loony Ron, her gorgeous hair color.

    • Peter

      Perhaps also her internal viewpoint. My lady, who worked with her, says she was known as the Ice Queen. I only met Diana once and she certainly was Miss Imperious!

      • NOLAGirl (Stephanie)

        Oh yeah? Fascinating.

        I wonder if she believed she was going to inherit it all and then just cowed when Miscavige took over. Was it weird to anyone in the cult that she wasn’t part of the structure that took the reins when he died? (I clearly need to go and do some more reading on her lol)

        • Draco

          If you find some interesting stuff, post links here. Finding stuff on the Hubbard kids is generally not easy! Thanks. XXX

        • It’s a weird situation, isn’t it?

          You wouldn’t expect the President’s son to take over from his father, when the President died… but Scientology has never had any real constitution nor succession process.

          ‘Leadership’ has only changed hands once, going from one absolute ruler to another – and that was a ruthless power grab by someone who had positioned himself as the founder’s gatekeeper – an ideal position from which to prepare.

          Diana seems to have been content with a unique position as ‘celebrity Sea Org officer’, given special treatment as long as she stays with the programme and doesn’t rock the boat.

          Also, the question of why she accepts the Miscavige regime is complicated by the fact that the only information she has about it comes from… the Miscavige regime. COB is acting as her gatekeeper, and controlling her perspective, in the same way that he did her father’s.

          She sounds to me like a ‘true believer’ who has never known anything else, and it seems that she will remain so until the ends of her isolated and (relatively) privileged life.

          The fact that , despite this, her daughter still left is significant. The collapse in recruitment is and immanent existential threat to the CofS because nobody is getting any younger.

          • chukicita

            Scientology *still* doesn’t have a succession plan.

        • gtsix

          She didn’t go meekly into the night, but Captain David Miscavige, COB RTC outmanuvered her mother and then her.

          He outlawed sea org having kids when Suzette was pregnant, ole seeohhbee played the game hard.

  • Panopea Abrupta

    Chris’ sociologist du jour, William Sims Bainbridge, wrote a book on The Process,
    a splinter group from $cientology.
    Lord Hubris declared the 2 founders SPs.
    They ultimately morphed into The Best Animal Society.
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Best_Friends_Animal_Society

    Would that $cientology would turn into something benevolent.
    Can you imagine DM running an animal shelter, rescuing greyhounds,
    coming to the aid of alley-cats and strays.
    I know his sympathies lie with tarantulas, barracudas, black mambas and hyenas.
    Perhaps The Worst Animal Society?

    —————————————————

    “Rapunzel, Rapunzel, let down your hair.”

    If The Donald had been at home in Trump Tower yesterday, he could
    have let down his hair to the young man who suction-cupped on 5th Avenue…
    Nobody would ever be so foolish at Gold.
    DM can never con-template letting his hair down.
    Straight up and vertical, baby!
    As for that pompous periphrastic pissmire of a pinhead with the “monastic tonsure”, Dan Sherman …

    As The Donald might say, “We Shall Overcomb”

    Gone all day – airport duty.
    Ciao, ragazzi

    • What’sup

      Beagles need saluting.

    • Draco

      And the M-in-law drill begins…

    • Graham

      Is the word periphrastic not in itself periphrastic? Just asking ๐Ÿ˜‰

      • Draco

        Well, if you take into consideration the nature of its definition, then yes, you could very well be correct in your assumption.

      • Robert Eckert

        Some adjectives are self-descriptive (“short” is short, for example; or “polysyllabic”) although most are non-self-descriptive (quite aside from “long” and “monosyllabic” there are all the adjectives like “blue” or “wet” that are not attributes of words). Is “self-descriptive” self-descriptive? It is, if it is, and it is not, if it is not; your are free to have faith in either possibility. But what about “non-self-descriptive”?

    • chukicita

      Pan’s thinking about barracudas because he’s picking up the high-maintenance-in-law. ๐Ÿ˜€

      Dopo il cattivo, viene il bel tempo.

    • That book (called “Satan’s Power”, partly because the publishers thought it would boost sales) was an examination of one of the first ‘squirrel’ groups. It’s long out of print, and rare.

      Bainbridge approached ‘The Process’ as a participant observer after trying to study Scientology in the same way, and apparently failing. ‘The Process’ was still, at that time very close to Scientology and more open. It was the next best thing.

      The only extracts I can find from his books include an account of the ‘strange face’ hallucinations he experienced during his TRs – and the way that similar experiences had by his partner made that person think that ‘there must be something in it.’ https://scicrit.wordpress.com/2015/08/27/the-compelling-effects-of-simply-staring-understanding-the-scientology-mindset-part-13/

      This aspect of Scientology has fascinated me every since. I wish I could obtain a copy (or a scan) of this book.

  • BosonStark

    Always a little freaky that she looks like Hubs, but other than that it’s a beautiful photo, with a Rembrandt quality to it.

  • YellowSubmarine

    They probably couldn’t afford a filling so they used leftover rice and beans

  • Tony Ortega

    KABC 790 radio interview added to the post…

    • cool

      • Graham

        neat!

    • Andrea ‘i-Betty’ Garner

      Fresh! (Vick Tipnes, dapper CEO ยฎโ„ข)

  • BosonStark

    They should have done Battlefield Earth in a cake edition. Then it would be worth 99 cents, except it would have to look more appetizing.

  • madge filpot

    I remember when Diana married for the 2nd time. He was public, not S.O. I knew him well.. music producer.. totally must have felt to Diana as if she had been set free and gone to heaven, in that she could play her music and be surrounded, for a bit anyway, by creativity instead of “stats’. ( The fact she married an “outsider” was so shocking to me,( LRH’S
    daughter marrying a wog.). that I took courage from that and it helped me
    to escape months later. ) They both went to England for a while crusading for the cause. Guess WOG life wasn’t a comfortable experience fr her.. to have gone back to the S.O.
    She has a wicked good sense of humor, though never shared it much. Striking woman.. and in that shot above, looks like she finally chopped off her knee length hair..her signature. I’m happy to hear she is not a prisoner as much as we thought. That she can come and go somewhat is good to know.

    When I worked as her assistant in NY, when the ships were being sold and the base established, I overheard her comment how “put out” she was by the fact that I had to tend to my new born off and on during the day, thus detracting from “post” duties. My daughter was 2 weeks old and I would have her beside me in a baby carrier in a filing cabinet in a smoke filled room, peopled by all the S. O. Aides. Diana had little tolerance for babies it seemed and it is no surprise that John took over the raising of Roanne. C’mon Diana.. wake up!

    • lynn

      She may still have knee length hair, the pic is from 1982.

      • madge filpot

        Well yes, she may have re-grown it. Just saying that all the time I knew her.. her hair was her identity really, and she would never think to have it more than just slightly trimmed to get rid of the dead ends. I remember having to book a hair appt for her in Queens.. couldn’t find a place that had the facilities to handle all her hair.. ended up going to a place that was NOT, shall we say, top of the mark by her standards! Well.. to be fair, it was sort of a dive! lolol.. but at least they could deal with her hair! lol

        • lynn

          It is strikingly beautiful. I always wonder what life experience or trauma, if any, would cause one to cut their long locks off.

          • Draco

            I did that. No trauma, just got tired of it and it gets heavy!

            • Missionary Kid

              I maintain that women who have long hair often cut it when they have kids. For one thing, they don’t have the time to spend on hair maintenance, and another that babies and little kids grab anything that comes close to them, and hair often droops into their orbit.

              I shaved my beard after having my babies often grab it while I was holding them.

            • Draco

              True this! The first time I cut my long hair was just before my first child was born. The second time it was even longer and I just got tired of it.

            • thetastic

              I’m an exception, I cut mine off right after high school graduation, Many years before kid 1 hit the scene.

            • thetastic

              Word. I couldn’t believe how light my neck felt after chopping off my hair. It was incredibly freeing!

            • OhioWaterBear

              Haha, it sure does, especially in mid-August… coincidentally, I literally JUST gave in and lopped off all my long heavy hair before I showered and sat down to read the Bunker. ๐Ÿ˜€

      • Techie

        When I knew her (’88 or so to 2004) she had her hair very long but not waist length. It is true she had a bit more freedom in the 80s but after that she was pretty much on the same schedule and so on as the rest of us. She had some money and drove a pickup around when we were living in apartments off the Int Base, but now that they have moved everybody on base it looks like the personal cars are gone. There are only six in the satellite photos parked around the berthing area. But one of them is a blue pickup, maybe that is Diana’s! https://www.google.com/maps/place/Gilman+Hot+Springs,+CA+92583/@33.8324327,-116.9858818,35m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m5!3m4!1s0x80db67ff6394ee35:0x3b0a3475d2e73105!8m2!3d33.8353659!4d-116.9897135 Or maybe not. She is thoroughly under Dave’s thumb and he has mercilessly pushed her out of the public view. There are shots of Maiden Voyage Anniversary events showing her in her dress whites sitting in the front row, but those are from the 90s. Now they don’t even have Executive Director International Guillaume giving out Birthday awards, the “Int Execs” are hidden away at the Int Base and Diana, Hubbard’s daughter and only family member still involved in Scientology, is a non-person. Dave wins, but it is a Pyrrhic victory.

    • Draco

      Babies in the orgs were common back then. Woman would have their babies and be back on the job within a couple of days, with the babies under the desks in a carry cot.
      (Grrr…Disqus just kicked me out while trying to post this…)

    • chukicita

      I’m not sure I understand – her 2nd husband was “public, not S.O.” I take that to mean a public Scientologist, and a wog to mean non-Scientologist. Was he not involved with Scientology at all, then?

      • He was a Scientologist. His name is John Ryan perhaps Ryann? I don’t think its a secert.

      • aegerprimo

        In scientology-speak… a “public” is a Scientologist who is NOT a Sea Org member or working for (on staff) in any Scientology organization. A “wog” is what Scientologists call non-scientologists.

    • Andrea ‘i-Betty’ Garner

      Amazing comment. Thanks for the inside information.

    • chuckbeattyexseaorg75to03

      The period after her bust as CS-6 (Commodore’s Staff Aide Division 6) she was put onto the OEC Course, I was OEC Course Sup at Flag Clearwater then and was her supervisor.

      My boss then was Bill Franks who was then Commanding Officer Int Training Org when the ITO was at Clearwater back then. (LRH wrote a slew of traffic to Bill when Bill was CO ITO, and LRH gave quite a pat on Bill’s head during that tiny stretch, Bill after CO ITO then took on the first ED Int post.)

      Bill nicknamed Diana “princess” during that time that we in ITO had to deal with her schedule, her just having given birth to Roann, and Diana was not on perfect course schedule.

      Gabi Lim I recall was helping with nanny duty, I wonder what happened to her, hi Gabi if you ever read this.

      Nancy Many took over in that tiny period of time as CS-6.

      I had a lot of the Apollo vintage old Sea Org execs come through the admin course room, even Kerry Gleason came and studied for two days. (Kerry himself had so much Hubbard traffic, Kerry I hope writes someday too.)

      What an era, what an era of Sea Org history that was, the Apollo vets who all had Hubbard facetime coming ashore, fading out of the picture, leaving the Sea Org, a whole bunch had defected even by the time Diana divorced with Jon and Diana went off to marry the non-Sea Org guy who I think was at least a beginner Scientologist, professional in the music business. But I wish more of the old Apollo vintage CS (Commodore’s Staff) era old Sea Org salts would write more.

      Diana was pretty light-up-the-room-celebrity-gleaming when she was in the OEC course room, and her sometimes “wins” talks of her OEC volume completions (back when the OEC checksheet was broken down into 14 volumes—old vols and the new vols) course left all the OEC/FEBC students all glowing, etc.

      But, truly, being in the Sea Org, being a mother, I don’t think that the weird Sea Org communal lifestyle is today at all healthy for kids growing up.

      I hope Roann goes to college, and someday writes of her life.

    • Before I closed my mostly $ client business I’d started after being kicked out, one client/more friend was Diana’s X you are speaking about. The week I moved out of my Hollywood apartment/office I brought him my 3×3′ healthy sword fern he loved. That day he asked me what I thought he should do with Diana’s piano he’d been storing ๐Ÿ™ Nice guy.

  • Hamtaro

    I never realized before how pretty she was and how much she looks like a young Tori Amos:

    http://assets.rollingstone.com/assets/images/story/new-faces-tori-amos-19920430/rectangle.jpg

    • She does not look like her! Thats not fair!

    • Missionary Kid

      The only resemblance I see is that both have red hair.

      • chukicita

        Two eyes, a nose and a mouth.

        • Missionary Kid

          I bow to your superior observation. ๐Ÿ˜€

          • chukicita

            Ha! It’s what my dad used to tell my mom when she thought someone looked like someone else (if you squint and look sideways) ๐Ÿ˜€

  • OOkpik

    FINALLY! A Scientology cake that’s nicely done.
    It has caek inside, of course.

  • Racnad

    When I talk to Scientologists, one of the questions I ask is “why is there NO mention of Mary Sue or LRH’s kids on lronhubbard.org the Ron magazines or anywhere else?” It’s a perfectly reasonable question, and older members can remember when Ron’s family was in official biographies, and part of what Scientologists discussed among themselves. So the answer is “I don’t know.” I do this hoping to plant a seen of doubt. If the Church withholds non-scandalous information like “he had a wife and kids” what else could they be hiding.

    • Back in the days of absolute monarchs, one of the things that those in power feared the most was a disaffected family member being taking by in a faction who wanted to be the power behind the throne and used as a figurehead.

      Diana seems to have been safely isolated and controlled in the Sea Org. I don’t doubt that some members of ‘her’ staff are actually there to insure it stays that way, and to report upstairs if she should ever become restive.

      The other kids are out in the wider world. where they are not a threat. This can’t be mentioned without a risk of raising the question, ‘if Scientology is so wonderful, why are Ron’s own kids not Scientologists?’

      Also, when ‘Ron’s family’ appeared in early Scientology publications they were not presented as people in their own right, but as accessories who further glorified the leader.

      The only exception to this was ‘Nibs’ who, at one point, was apparently being groomed to become Ron’s deputy, and run the lucrative high-level auditing for his father. That didn’t work out, and then poor Quentin took his life…

      This seems to be a rare case of Scientology knowing when not to draw to attention to it’s own weaknesses and contradictions.

      • villagedianne

        It’s like that in the world of Hasidic Jewish dynasties. In the case of the Satmars, two brothers are vying for succession. From http://www.nytimes.com/2002/01/24/nyregion/the-heir-unapparent-brothers-feud-fractures-a-hasidic-community.html?pagewanted=all

        ”It’s really an argument over who is going to be leading the next generation,” said Samuel C. Heilman, a professor of Jewish studies and sociology at the CUNY graduate center. ”It’s always brothers. You’re talking about princes in a royal family. The problem has always been who is going to be next in line.”

        • There is also the aspect that many people don’t want power – but are either co-opted by those who want to use them as figureheads, or controlled by paranoid relatives who are are afraid that, one day, they might.

          It’s a situation that is difficult to just walk away from, and a comment those who in Hubbard’s family who have managed to step out of his shadow and build their own lives.

          • villagedianne

            True. From the same article linked above:

            The Kiryas Joel side says the grand rabbi was swayed by his advisers, who thought they could maintain their power if the younger son was installed. Aaron Teitelbaum, recognized as the more charismatic, forceful brother, would be beyond their control, in this view.

    • chukicita

      Like, how much money comes out of the War Chest to keep a private eye on those family members?

  • TheMirrorThetan

    Thankyou to our Bunker tipsters, for the interesting things you all send to Tony.

    • Jenyfurrrrr

      Seconded! Yes thanks for all the great material!

      • Draco

        Thirded!

        • OOkpik

          etc.!

          • ditto

            • thetastic

              Tritto! Oh, yay, I love when I get to trot that one out!

          • Draco

            Yeah – fourthed just doesn’t sound right, does it? ;P

  • Draco

    Considering how unattractive both her parents were, it all always amazes me that she and her siblings turned out quite attractive. That’s a beautiful photo, I would love to see current pics of the Hubbard kids. I met Suzette briefly after an event I attended. She was doing a meet and great and signing copies of Dianetics, (only if you bought one there) my copy later disappeared. I suspect the person who bought it for me nicked it when we parted ways. There was a great mystery as to what had happened to Quentin Hubbard, and someone in the audience asked what had happened to him during a Q&A session. She did a sort of double take and told him to speak to her after the event. I was very new at the time and knew nothing about the Hubbard kids. I asked my friend afterwards who Quentin was and he told me that he was Hubbard’s son and had most likely been murdered by the CIA/FBI to get at Hubbard. I did wonder how such a great OT could have that happen in his family, but buried the thought, as I would many other thoughts that popped into my head over the decades to follow.

    • chukicita

      Wow. Interesting to hear what the ‘shore story’ was internally about Quentin!

      CIA/FBI? While the FBI deals with domestic issues, the CIA (at the time, anyway) had no authority to do any domestic operations. And I don’t think the FBI’s playbook includes murdering the son of a crackpot.

      • Draco

        This is a scientologist we are talking about. In his head, either agency would be capable of carrying out the deed. You must remember that all these agencies are under the control of the Evil Psychs, so their stated purpose is never what we are told it is. And Hubbard wasn’t a crackpot – he was the only hope humanity had in the whole wide universe! Of course the Evil Psychs could murder his child as a warning for him to back off!
        Blech – now I have a nasty taste in my mouth – scuttles off to brush teeth with super minty toothpaste.

        • chukicita
          • Robert Eckert

            link failed

            • chukicita

              Oh, it was just a joke – link to an academic paper entitled “Lying and the Subsequent Desire for Toothpaste: Activity in the Somatosensory Cortex Predicts Embodiment of the Moral-Purity Metaphor.”

            • ExCult.Jan

              I learn something new here every day!
              Chuckicita, how/why/etc did you find that article (and how/why/etc did the study get (funded?)?

            • chukicita

              I have no idea. ๐Ÿ˜€

      • villagedianne

        I give no credence to the Scientology shore story. At that time, as you say, the CIA may not have involved itself in domestic operations. However, former governor Jesse Ventura describes here how he was presented with first-hand evidence that the CIA is operational inside the US, contrary to it’s mission statement.
        https://youtu.be/u7uLA2p2IZE

        • chukicita

          If the CIA [or insert whatever conspiratorial alphabet soup here] wanted to “get at” Hubbard, they would have simply taken him out. End of story.

          • villagedianne

            Certainly as I said I give no credence to the Scientology version of Quentin’s fate. IMO if there was any US intelligence involvement with Scientology, and that’s an if, it would be in order to see how much abuse people are willing to accept.

      • thetastic

        You need to open your mind to conspiracy theories. Men in black cars, cruising slowly into town, Area 51, stuff like that.

        • chukicita

          I grew up related to a perhaps unhealthy number of people in the industry.

          They rarely agreed on everything, but they all would agree that the logistics around containing and maintaining an extended conspiracy – the person hours alone are staggering just to obscure something – would be such a negative ROI that about the only person who’d think it would make sense to try would be an ecclesiastic dictator with a personal fundraising army.

          • thetastic

            Ooh, we know a guy like that!

    • villagedianne

      Mary Sue was not unattractive, but it’s hard to see it with the outdated hairstyle she always wore.

      • gtsix

        Agreed.

      • Draco

        Not to my taste at all. I find particularly unattractive and very hard looking. Even as a young woman, she looked way older than she was.

      • thetastic

        I always thought she looked kinda pretty.

  • Mighty Korgo of Teegeeack

    I have heard only one first hand story about her. A friend was declared suppressive. Diana thought the declaration, just or not, was foolish because the individual was irreplaceable. I quote here, “She picked him up like the hand of God” and reinstated him.

    The photo is beautiful. But really, I have no idea how much she resembled Pops in mind or form.

    Ron Nos has a far different sense of aesthetics than L. Ron. L..Ron thought that looking like a buffoon was looking good. He liked deep shadow, his hand over his face to show thought, sailor suits and the dumbest looking cowboy clothes money could buy. He thought he looked robust. I thought he looked like he couldn’t control his weight. There are ways that a person in late middle age with few handsome features can be photographed to look good. Look at what Karsh did. Think of his photos of Einstein, Hemingway and Churchill. A portrait artist has to be able to connect the man or woman to his inner self and have the audience believe it. Hubbard’s photographers couldn’t say no to him, obviously.

    Dianne looks pretty and more than that she looks like you would want to spend time with her. Her large eyes and shy smile do that. Her nose is a bit like a potato but that could be shown as a humanizing imperfection or as a bit of ugly. It depends how the portrait artist wants to display it. Here, the highlight on the nose largely blends with the highlight on the cheek. Presto. Nose is deemphasized.

    I don’t know if this is photoshop shifted to red or what, but the reds dominate. It is a bit grainy, too, which can cover details in complexion. The photo is beautiful but I have no way of knowing if she is truly beautiful or if she is just beautiful in the way Ronnos wants her to be. Certainly, at age 64 she has at least one photo that makes her look good before aging did its thing.

    • madge filpot

      She is pretty uniquely beautiful Korgo. And tiny. Amazing skin.. white white white. She had some trouble with it off and on..obviously couldn’t handle the sun. Lots of Presence. Hardly ever smiled in public.

      • Mighty Korgo of Teegeeack

        Thanks, Madge. Good to know about the smile. I have to wonder if she had the father’s aversion to dentistry.

      • Draco

        Her mom was not exactly the smiley type either. I don’t think I have ever seen a photo of Mary Sue smiling.

    • I think the graininess and colour cast are characteristic of the photographic film of the period (which was very fussy stuff) when it has been underexposed. This confirms the picture’s presentation as an indoors grab shot

      • Missionary Kid

        The change in color is a result of the film and paper that was used. Unless kept in complete darkness, and kept cool, the colors fade unevenly.

    • Simi Valley

      I also have a few old color prints of photos that turned red as they aged.

  • David Arum

    It is interesting how much the COS revises history.

    • Bleuler

      Yes they are very good at producing “unpersons”. Constant revisions and those still in need to make sure any previous information goes down the Memory Hole.

    • They even revise their own versions of history.

      • David Arum

        That is a very good point .Scientology is special in revising there own lies.

    • Missionary Kid

      It’s “historical revisionism”, which is what the communists did after someone fell from grace. History texts were rewritten to reflect that either the person didn’t exist, or they were excoriated as if they were responsible for some evil events. Their pictures were edited out of photographs. Bleuler uses one of the terms applied to them: unpersons.

      • Robert Eckert
        • Missionary Kid

          Thanks. That’s one of the photos of communists I was thinking about.

          • Robert Eckert

            That’s Zinoviev, Stalin, Kamenev, and Trotsky completing the Soviet Constitution; which is to say, Stalin, Kamenev, and Trotsky; or rather I mean, Stalin and Kamenev. Of course you know that Stalin wrote the Soviet Constitution all by himself.

            • Missionary Kid

              Of course, that’s what the history books eventually said.

            • flyonthewall

              here’s another one. f5

              That’s Yezhov, head of the NKVD. From wikipedia – ” After presiding over mass arrests and executions during the Great Purge, Yezhov became a victim of it himself. He was arrested, confessed under torture to a range of anti-Soviet activity, and was executed in 1940. ”

              Couldn’t of happened to a more deserving apparatchik.

              https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikolai_Yezhov

            • flyonthewall

              have you ever read Emma Goldman’s My Disillusionment in Russia? Excellent first hand observations on the early years of Soviet Russia. It’s available online for free in its entirety

            • Robert Eckert

              No I haven’t. I’ll put it on my stack of Books I Really Need To Read If I Could Ever Stop Fucking Around On The Net All Day

            • flyonthewall

              lol, glad I’m not the only one w/that prob

        • chukicita

          This made me think of this photo – I seem to remember once reading that there were others in the photo who were removed at some point. Still, it would be fun to play “Who Blew” since it was taken.

          http://www.xenu.net/archive/photoalbum/7a-1200.jpg

          • Rasha

            I’m sure they have an image of an empty deck somewhere, with Lil’ Cap’n standing alone, and each other person individually rendered, so they can re-issue the pic in its correct form, as Source Intendedยฎ, at will.

            …Mr. Smith.. Mr. Winston Smith… please report to your Editor’s desk at Minitrue… Mr. Winston Smith…..

          • Harpoona Frittata

            Wow, what a great idea! Start with the original, then move forward in time, deleting blown and busted-in-rank individuals in succeeding years to reveal how the ‘Stalin Effect’ has played out over time.

            I’d call that, Oaty Super Shoop Power put to its highest creative use across all 8 dynamics!

          • aquaclara

            Those uniform hats fit so badly. Do they still come with the uniform?

      • Missionary Kid

        To add: my ex would revise her version of events fairly rapidly. One son said that he told his friends about it, and they treated him as if he was making things up. Finally, a friend hanging out with him witnessed her change her opinion, and with it, her version of an event within half an hour.

        He said it felt good to finally have someone believe him.

        I never used the term in front of him, but I used to refer to her as “the queen of historical revisionism.”

      • David Arum

        That is very true.

      • grundoon
      • grundoon
  • Observer

    Diana’s mouth is smiling in that pic, but her eyes are not. She reminds me of the Lady of Shalott.

    F5

    • peaceful…

      • Observer

        The painting is based on a Tennyson poem.

        https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems-and-poets/poems/detail/45359

        This stanza is apt:

        A longdrawn carol, mournful, holy,
        She chanted loudly, chanted lowly,
        Till her eyes were darken’d wholly,
        And her smooth face sharpen’d slowly,
        Turn’d to tower’d Camelot:
        For ere she reach’d upon the tide
        The first house by the water-side,
        Singing in her song she died,
        The Lady of Shalott.

        • thetastic

          Spookily apt.

    • Techie

      Diana has a wicked sardonic sense of humor, it was not uncommon to see her smiling sideways before the 90s. Since then sleep deprivation and harsh “Severe Reality Adjustments” from Dave have made her akin to the rest of the zombies that inhabit the Int Base.

      • Observer

        So sad to think of all the unique personalities with all their individual gifts and talents beaten down into a helpless, ineffectual Hubbard slurry.

        • Yes it is so sad. And many of us would be out and in the same shape if not for those taking this trap apart and spreading the word and those that are putting humor to it all and also comparing against other such comparable cons. We so just need the information to help us adjust to the real world. I love you commentors to bits (((hugs)))

    • flyonthewall

      i also like to take all my blankets with me when I go out on the lake. I take them all with me so I can have them

      • beauty for ashes

        mmm hmm! i always take my candelabra too , just like liberace.

        • flyonthewall

          Don’t leave home without it!

      • thetastic

        And let them trail over the side, into the water…

        • flyonthewall

          she’s so fancy, no time to worry about that!

    • chukicita

      She knows not what the curse may be,
      And so she weaveth steadily,
      And little other care hath she,
      The Lady of Shalott.

  • Newiga

    What a find! Thanks for sharing this interesting photograph with us, Mr. Ronnos! It makes me sad to hear that Diana was never close with her own daughter and that she’s lived in the “core of the bubble word” most of her life. ๐Ÿ™ The stories she would have, eh? However, I’m glad to hear that Roanne is doing well!

  • Diana looks rather more natural when adjusted a little for her portrait fading towards red since 1982. I’m guessing she was photographed with old-fashioned Kodak Ektacolor, which was highly prone to losing its cyan component in dye-prints? (F5):

    • Missionary Kid

      Good point. IIRC, Kodak rejected using a more stable but also more costly and complicated dye transfer process when they introduced color film. My high school pictures were in stable black and white, while those of people younger than I were in color, which have faded.

      • And then there was the dire DeLuxe Color…

    • same motive but nice job

    • KingofSweden

      I tried my own hand at correction, pushing a little further. My version is less gentle and makes her look like she’s got stage lighting on her.

      • thetastic

        Now her outfit looks like a dated women’s Olympic basketball uniform, though.

    • flyonthewall

      I’m sorry Mark but I’m not getting this shoop

      • Too subtle for you, eh?

        • Graham

          ThetaMark is confusing his EnthetaMark fans.

    • Rasha

      No, Mark. I clearly remember all of my family being bright orange in the ’70s and early ’80s. It was a different time.

      • Graham

        My family were all shades of grey. The 50s were a dour time.

        • flyonthewall

          combine these two sentences and you have a pop culture reference

        • Rasha

          The sound was less crisp, as well, though people tended to talk really fast. Especially on the phone.

          • Juicer77

            Yeah, see? ๐Ÿ˜‰

            • Rasha

              Whaddya talkin’ about? Sure I got the dame, right here, nah she ain’t goin’ nowhere, of course I’ll call Da Boss – wait, where’d she go, you palookas! Go find her, yeah I’ll call ya right back, You! get me a car, pronto!

              (elapsed time: 0:09)

            • thetastic

              I got the horse right here, his name is Paul Revere….

            • Juicer77

              *snortle*

        • Robert Eckert
          • $cnmonkeyrob$

            *wakes up from nap in tree*(so glad you posted this… classic Calvin and Hobbes ๐Ÿ™‚ )… whenโ€™s dinner?…

          • Rasha

            LUV his dad’s explanations!! (and his mom’s one-frame appearance!)

            • Douglas D. Douglas

              A total tangent:

              Mom’s one-frame appearance was in the “throw-away” gag that is required by the syndicates that sell comics to newspapers. In the old, old days of comics, some artists were given an entire page on Sunday to create vivid color strips. By the time Bill Watterson was doing Calvin and Hobbes, this had been reduced to half a page.

              But some papers insisted on cutting back the number of pages for the comics, and wanted to put three strips on each page. So the syndicates demanded that the to of the strip be removable. Start reading the C&H page above on the second line and you will see that it is complete without the top line.

              Watterson rebelled against the rigid formatting that was required o achieve this (later even the size of he panels was regulated, so that, incredibly, a strip could be rearranged to fit four strips per page on Sunday!). Watterson felt that the comics were an art form, not a commodity that could be diced and trim to suit the newspaper owner. As his strip became more popular, he began flouting the “rules,” turning in ambitious strips that could only be run on half a page (example below). This put him in conflict with the syndicate, who could not sell his Sunday strip to many newspapers who refused to give up a half page on Sundays.

              As we all know, eventually Watterson threw in the towel and stopped producing Calvin and Hobbes entirely, And there are no half page strips out there any more, The last time I saw a Sunday funny page, it looked like a daily page with color. And that, I guess, is what passes for progress today…

              End of tangent.

            • Rasha

              I always liked the first couple of panels that were only somewhat related to the whole. It was a good setup, and expanded the story. You always had that “I totally get it” feeling, while the rest of it was going on.

            • Andrea ‘i-Betty’ Garner

              That’s fascinating!

            • aquaclara

              Excellent tangent, my friend. I never knew this.

          • Bavarian Rage

            Awesome! Now I have a hankering to go to my local library to check out some Calvin & Hobbes.

          • Bavarian Rage

            CORRECTION: You just made me buy Calvin and Hobbes The Complete Collection from Amazon! ;P (Better that some money go back in this awesome artist’s pocket anyhow!)

    • thetastic

      I’m having trouble understanding how she is both looking like Hubbard and looking pretty. The two thoughts keep jostling against each other in my brain. I need to go lay down.

      • I think she looks a lot more like Mary-Sue than Tublard. Does that help? ๐Ÿ˜‰

        • thetastic

          Actually, yes.

    • aquaclara

      I wondered why so many old family pics have that same color. Is it hard to fix?

  • Sunny

    I remember in about 85 or 86 Roanne showed up at the PAC Cadet Org (AKA: ATA, on Fountain Ave across from Bridge building). She was under a loose watch (she was not free to roam, and definitely not able to speak freely to any other kids). I think she was around 10 or 11 or so. She spoke candidly, but you could tell she was unhappy and trapped. It was sad to see her like that.
    She was only there a few days or weeks and vanished again. (Maybe it was right after LRH passed?)
    It’s good to see she is out. I hope she is happy.

    • Techie

      About that time back at the Int Base they built her a “schoolhouse”. Well, just a renovated public restroom near the Music Studio. And it was also where she had her “berthing” in this case a bed. This was a much better setup than some of the kids who ended up at “Happy Valley” but it must have been a bit lonely. Everybody too busy to even talk to her. The concept of a child playing is pretty foreign to the Int Base.

    • Juicer77

      I’m trying to figure out how old she must have been. If she was 10 or 11 in 1985 that means Hubbard was fathering children into his 60’s. I thought she was older than that when he died. Darn, I need a timeline or something….

      • Observer

        Roanne is LRH’s granddaughter. Diana was born in 1953 or thereabouts

      • jazzlover

        Impossible! Viagra hadn’t yet been invented.

        Timeline? You mean you haven’t yet downloaded the Scientology History app? ๐Ÿ˜‰

      • gtsix

        Roanne, if 38 now, was born in 1978. She would have then been 7 or 8 in 85/86.

        • Sunny

          You are correct. I was about 13 or 14 at the time, and she was younger than I was, I only guessed at 10 or 11. She could have been 7 or 8.
          Her hair was blonde, not red.

          • gtsix

            I don’t doubt that guessing ages of born in sea org kids is difficult… when you were never allowed to be a kid, what do you have to guess by?

            Hell, every time I walk into a pub, I wonder how teenagers are allowed to be bartenders now. ๐Ÿ˜‰

          • Sunny

            Here she is pictured with Amy Scobee. Refresh.

            • Observer

              Such a pretty little girl. She transcended the limits of her parents’ unfortunate looks. Genetics is fascinating.

            • thetastic

              Beautiful pic of both Roanne and Amy.

          • Kim O’Brien

            would it be ok if i wished that i had a time machine so i could go back and take you out of there and bring you back and adopt you ? my daughter is 14 ….hugs

            • Sunny

              That’s sweet. I am all grown up now and have 2 of my own…. a girl who is 6 and a boy who is 3 1/2. They are getting a very different life!

        • Juicer77

          Ah. thanks. Got my names mixed up!

      • Sunny

        It’s LRH’s granddaughter. At the time, it was hush-hush that she was related to him. They (correction: Roanne told me) said back then (in 86 or so) she was LRHs only grandchild. Not sure if that is correct or not.

        • Observer

          Jamie DeWolf’s mother is Nibs’ daughter and LRH’s granddaughter, so it’s not true. It may be that whoever was saying that had no idea Nibs even existed.

          • gtsix

            And Suzette had a son in 86 or 87. (And I think a daughter after she left the so)

            • Observer

              I did not know that. Thanks!

          • Sunny

            That means Roanne did not know of Nibs? (written as a question, but it is actually a statement)

            • Observer

              I wouldn’t be surprised. What a screwed-up mess Scientology is.

    • pluvo

      Roanne was used as PR as “L. Ron Hubbard’s granddaughter” when she was christening the Freewinds on the original Maiden Voyage of the Freewinds in 1988. The video where she was saying a poem and the champagne bottle cracked on the hull was shown for a while. Now I can’t find even a photo of that scene anymore which was a big deal then.
      Sunny, you were on the Ship too, right? What time was that and why did you leave?

      • Sunny

        I remember that video too!
        No, I was never on the Freewinds. Except one visit for a few hours when it was docked in Ensenada. Anyone who had an ok visa got sent for a visit for a day. Big busload of Sea Org members drove there, visited for a while, and left.
        I did not qualify for the Freewinds. I tried to blow (leave) Scn at least two or three times a year. Always came back because I had nowhere to go. I did that from age 5 until I was declared in 2004. (It’s an out-Qual for the Freewinds)

        • pluvo

          When we were in Ensenada most of the Ship crew were going to LA and to Int Base. I’m glad that I’ve seen it.

          “I tried to blow (leave) Scn at least two or three times a year.” OMG …!!

        • thetastic

          That’s interesting. Kind of goes against the situations where they put people on the boat to trap them from blowing. Although maybe that was the Apollo? The problem with having this many horrifying stories is that I start to mix them up.

  • Interesting pic. While some family resemblance is apparent, I think the cover photo for Diana’s record album LifeTimes provides a more stark indication . . .

    ๐Ÿ˜‰

    • Minion Gayle

      That’s not the least bit creepy.

    • Bavarian Rage

      Oh dear! Don’t do that to us!

  • Interested2

    I can’t help but gasp at her beauty. She really was lovely.

  • Bavarian Rage

    Photo? It’s so serene and ethereal with the 70s style lighting and colouring that it’s reminiscent of a vintage painting. Quite lovely.

    Thank you, photographer Ronnos, for thinking of us, and Tony for this very interesting update on Diana and the current status of her immediate family members.

  • Bavarian Rage

    Kind of off topic but reflecting on Hubbard’s descendants, I’m curious as to how extended non-Scientology family members feel about Jamie Dewolf’s very public criticism of Scientology, given that some temperaments prefer privacy, moving on, and leaving skeletons in closets when it comes to unsavoury family history. This would make a very intriguing article IMHO. Anyway, God bless him for the important and creative contribution he offers.

  • chukicita

    It must have been the strangest of childhoods to grow up in the Hubbard Reality Show thinking your dad is a reincarnation of Buddha. And maybe *you* could see the bad teeth and temper, but no one else was allowed to.

    • Harpoona Frittata

      But, on the other hand, being Elron’s favorite child no doubt meant that daddy hypnotized you early and often, resulting in those bad teeth and foul breath magically disappearing, while two miniature baby kangaroos – small enough to play on the palm of your hand – became your besty childhood playmates.

      Magical childhood indeed! But as most of us now know with certainty, the inability to sort reality from imagination can take you to places in the Hubbardian Universe that no one else can travel too. Sure, both $cn and the LDS faith promise to make you Masters of your own planet, but the real reason no one reports actually having done so is obvious: It’s really, really lonely waaay, waaaaay out there – 79 X 10 to the 81st power parsecs beyond Rigel – and even OaTy 27 thetans get bored pretty quick without the company of family and friends!

      Of all the sad, sad stories of deluded sacrifice for the greater good at the cost of everything that it’s ultimately based on, the stories of Sea Orgy kids – raised in the cult since birth and fed a steady diet of pseudo science and magical thinking from the moment they began to understand language – is certainly one of the most poignant and heartrending. The fact that all of Elron’s progeny, except Diana, escaped the cult in one way or another is a real testament to human resilience and the fierce determination to actually be free, even if that costs you your own life as it did for Elron’s gay son, Quentin.

      Let’s hope that Roanne and the other surviving progeny of Elron find the courage to one day tell their own stories too! If they can make it out and go on to have lives of their own, then anyone can!

  • J. Jimmy James

    I’m not fooled. I looked at her and heard this
    http://youtu.be/OAFCiEFX6ag

    • Kim O’Brien

      you brighten up my day , every day

      • J. Jimmy James

        <3

    • Qbird

      Saw this as a child. In absolute fear, held hands with my little brother…
      I have stayed away from this gendre ever since.
      On a lighter note: I have gotten to know several of the ‘devil dogs’ since…
      they’re all good. This lastest boobie-head likes rocks.

  • Sid (Phil Jones)

    I remember Diana around ’72/73 when she was in Toronto on a short tour. She stood on stage and said that we just needed to open our thetan eyes and we could see the planets and the people on them. Sadly, Farsec remained out of reach to my myopic thetan vision.

    • jazzlover

      Couldn’t you have plumped for some better bi-focals?

      • Sid (Phil Jones)

        I was too shy to make a spectacle of things.

        • jazzlover

          Ha! LOL

        • Nancy Law

          OMG … LOL … good one!!!

    • J. Jimmy James

      That gives me an idea: a thetan optometry practice called WISE Eyes.

    • Fly Lady

      She’s got Greta garbo’s standoff sighs, she’s got thetan viewing eyes…

      • Sid (Phil Jones)

        Clever. She was a bit stand-offish. Pretty good on the piano though even if not really my style of music.

    • why was she on tour?

      • Sid (Phil Jones)

        I can’t remember exactly but it was sort of an ‘entertaining the troops’ kind of thing for staff and public.

  • Suzette’s house isn’t in a very great neighborhood. I suspect Arthur’s about the same. Diana probably just doesn’t have anywhere to go other than to Suzette. I don’t know how badly they got screwed financially by Lil Davey, but I assume it was substantially. Diana’s pretty screwed up – that’s what I thought in 1983, last time I spent time with her, and I was still in the cult back then. Too bad, she was a talented pianist.

    • Sunny

      What happened to Arthur after LRH died was just horrific. I would have much preferred being parent-less and dumped in the Sea Org to fend for myself than to end up one of his family, especially after LRH’s death. They would be a threat to Scientology.
      I hope they all are ok.

      • Archie was always weird, met him a couple of times. Last time I saw Suzette was a few years ago in a local grocery store – I happened to be in line right behind her. She had a little red-haired boy with her who was beautiful, and she was more gorgeous than the last time I saw her 20 years before. I get the feeling she’s doing OK. Maybe I should go find out, always had a crush on her.

      • Observer

        What happened?

        • Sunny

          I am sure whenever he is ready to talk, he will. It is not my place to say.

          • Observer

            Understood

  • gtsix

    So, Arthur is still an artist: http://www.aconwayhubbard.com/

    and as a smart bloke, he got ahead of the curve:

    http://www.aconwayhubbard.com/scientology/

    • Observer

      It’s interesting how Lafayette’s kids actually got the talent he pretended to have.

    • Sid (Phil Jones)

      “he began to develop work using mixed-media centered on the female figure and executed in color pencil and using his own blood.”

      • He’s a fine anatomist and his compositions are beautiful, but his obvious obsession with his subject matter (objectification) plus the quote about blood is just spooky as hell. I can only imagine the psychological forces at work there.

    • Intergalactic Walrus

      I found this interesting and wonder if there might be an autobiography in his future…
      (refresh)

      • Draco

        ” I know John and I consider him a good friend.”
        Another reason for DM to dislike JT. I am pretty sure he would not care for this association…

      • gtsix

        If it is true that he signed an NDA when he left (and I can not imagine him being allowed to leave without signing one) it would have to be posthumous.

        But one can hope. That would be a fascinating autobiography.

  • villagedianne

    Jesse Prince has said he was one of the Sea Org members given the job of getting Diana H. to relinquish custody of her daughter. From p.92 of http://www.xenu-directory.net/news/images/1998-interviews-prince.pdf

    J: This is another incident that I was directly involved in. This was like a couple of
    weeks after I was brought up to the Hemet location, which I didnโ€™t want to go to in the
    first place. There had been a situation where Diana Hubbard wanted nothing else to do
    with the church. She had married some record producer guy, his name was John Ryan.
    He was interested in her as an artist, and she just wanted to dissociate herself from
    Scientology. Well, she effectively did so, and she was extremely non-cooperative. Now
    this was a nightmare for David Miscavige and I guess L. Ron Hubbard. Because L. Ron
    Hubbard was concerned with Roe Ann, Dianaโ€™s daughter, not being within the confines
    of the church. For a long time after Dianaโ€™s decision to leave the church, and which she
    did, you know where used to have that penthouse at Flag, on the second floor, she just
    abandoned that, ran away, married this other guy. L. Ron Hubbard had sent down orders
    to get her to turn over custody of Roe Ann to John Hallwitch, her former husband and
    father of the child, who was still in Scientology in the Sea Org. He came from quite a
    wealthy family himself. It was my job to go there and make her sign over legal custody of
    the child. I was given mission orders by Miscavige and Starkey, who talked to me
    extensively about things that had been done, and what was she was doing. David
    Miscavige mentioned that she was in the Mile High Club, giving people blow jobs on the
    airplanes, and this and that and the other thing. Screwing this one and screwing that one,
    and just kind of out in life trying to be a normal person is how I see it at this point. I was
    to go there, she could do that, but I was to do that and get her to sign over custody of her
    child to her former husband, which I did do.
    L: She actually signed over custody of her child?
    J: Yes.
    L: What did you say or do to make a mother give up her child to an organization she
    wants nothing to do with?
    J: I told her just basically spoke to her about the goodness of Scientology and the Sea
    Org and all of the things it was trying to do. That she had chosen another path, and it was
    obvious that she was going to do that, but to please let Roe Ann grow up in an
    environment where people would look after her and she would be perfectly taken care of.
    Of which she was. She was like a child prodigy; she lived like a princess in the making.
    For some reason on another, there was literally no resistance. She just said OK and
    signed it. I was there all of 45 minutes. By the time I finished my spiel, she had her damn
    pen in her hand.
    L: You never had to say anything negative, no threats, no nothing?
    93
    J: No sect checks, no Iโ€™m going to do this, Iโ€™m going to do that. She just did it. She was
    tired of fighting, she was pale. I was the last person in the line of many. Vicky Aznaran
    went there and screamed at her, had a fit, totally screwed the whole thing up. David
    Miscavige went there, screaming at her, telling her how horrible she was.
    L: So, people had already taken her through the baiting, they had already wore her down.
    J: Months earlier.
    L: How many missions went there to try to get her kid from her.
    J: Two.
    L: David Miscavige and Vicky Aznaran, and you know for a fact they screamed at her?
    J: And failed miserably, and she just got worse.
    L: Did they threaten her?
    J: Iโ€™m sure they did, but I wasnโ€™t privy to that. I just know how they act, the kind of people they are.
    L: When you came there she was pale?
    J: Kind of listless, kind of. She had been in a giving up position, like I just give the hell
    up. I just spoke to her, I said, these are my views on it, you know why Iโ€™m here. This is
    why weโ€™re doing it. By the time I got out my spiel she said, OK, where do I sign. No
    representation, no attorney, nothing.
    L: Signed over her…
    J: Her only child.
    L: …without an attorney. Did you take the child with you?
    J: The child was already in the custody of the church, this was just a legal matter.
    L: How could the child be in the custody of the church if the mother…
    J: The child was in Hemet California, and the mother was in Florida at the Flag. How
    that happened I donโ€™t know, but that was the existing situation when I came into it. It
    was just a legal wrap-up that they were trying to do.

    Prince also discusses Diana here: http://armstrong-op.gerryarmstrong.ca/archives/tag/diana-hubbard

    Then, you know, Iโ€™m getting the advices and the notices from L. Ron and Iโ€™m doing this, that and the other thing and I wonโ€™t belabor that, what had happened, because I really have to move forward. But one special thing that did happen: his granddaughter, Roanne โ€” I guess that was his only granddaughter at the time, or may have ever been his only granddaughter โ€” this little girl, he really loved this child; she was a princess to him. And whatever she wanted, he would do anything.
    Well, her mother โ€” his daughter, Diana Hubbard โ€” left Scientology, left the Sea Org, bragging about having sex on airplanes. I mean, sheโ€™s experiencing [8:00] life for the first time and she is loving it. And L. Ron wanted custody of the child, Roanne, turned over to another person that was within Scientology that she was married to โ€” his nameโ€™s John Horwich โ€” anyway, he wanted custody turned over to her. He sent David Miscavige to do it and he failed. He sent another big person in Scientology at the time, a woman named Vicki Aznaran, and she failed. Marc Yeager, COC MO INT, he failed. All of them doing Lower Conditions now, when I get there.
    So, after I took care of my first little duty withโ€ฆ I got Shelly going good, now you have to now go back to Flag where you came from and get Diana Hubbard to sign over custody of her only child to this man thatโ€™s still in the Sea Org. And I was informed about the prior failures, and I was informed that if one more [9:00] failure happened on this project, back to the Rehabilitation Project Force Iโ€™d go, you know. So Iโ€™m like, โ€œThis is a hell of an invitation and welcome to this new job.โ€ My new job was Inspector General Cramming Officer. God knows what the hell that was supposed to mean.

    So I went out there, followed their orders, got my little briefcase and, you know, and went there and she was expecting me; I arrived back in Clearwater and as soon as I walked in the door Iโ€™m like, โ€œHello, Diana, you know why Iโ€™m here.โ€ โ€” โ€œYes, I do. Where are the papers? Iโ€™ll sign โ€™em nowโ€ โ€” Iโ€™m like โ€œOh, my God. This canโ€™t be happening.โ€ Because she told those people where to get off and where to go, and they got in so much trouble, and as soon as I walked in the door sheโ€™s like, โ€œOkay, Iโ€™ll sign. Iโ€™m not fooling with this stuff. I donโ€™t care.โ€ Sheโ€™s having so much fun in her life.

    It looks to me like over time Prince may have changed his interpretation of Diana’s motives. I don’t know the chronology of these reports by Prince, but it seems appears that he later came to feel that Diana caved in to pressure more than anything else.

    • Observer

      I can’t judge any of Hubs’ kids for anything they did. With their childhoods it’s a miracle none of them turned out to be serial killers.

    • jazzlover

      Aside from the fact that the interviewer or transcriber didn’t bother to make sure that the ex-husband’s last name remained consistent. It went from Hallwitch to Horwich.

    • Noesis

      Another historical note is that one of the most effective early critics of Scientology – Arnie Lerma – almost married Suzette Hubbard, until Ronnie’s goons intervened and Lerma eventually fled the organization.

      http://www.lermanet.com/exit/FINAL2.htm

      • villagedianne

        Yes. That was sad.

      • yeah! that’s an interesting story.

    • Noesis

      IIRC Hubbard awarded Jessie a semi-automatic rifle for performing this act…which Jessie later used to hold much of senior management at bay during one of several confrontations before he finally was sent to the RFP.

      Now everyone…back to clearing the planet…nothing to see here.

    • Draco

      Just another horrible story in a long line of horrible stories. It makes me sick to my stomach to see how they played with people’s lives. I really wish that the Hubbard children would tell their stories about growing up in the Hubbard “household”. Did they ever feel they had a real family? Or was it all just weird from beginning to end? If Nibs’ stories are anything to go by, life must have been terribly confusing for them as little kids. ๐Ÿ™

  • Lousy Ratatouille

    Diana Hubbard:
    A lovely portrait, is it sepia, is it vintage?
    Maybe it’s Maybelline.

  • I thought Diana reminded me of another unlikely daughter of privilegeโ€”except that this other person actually did something with her life… (restore duster with dodo, aepyornis and phoenix feathers):

    • flyonthewall

      now this I get!

      • Good! ๐Ÿ™‚

  • chuckbeattyexseaorg75to03

    It’s a treat listening to Chris Shelton dissect the “Scientology” anthology.

    Scientology and Hubbard have been so taken not seriously, that when mediocre academics take on Scientology, it’s like Team D academia came to play, and since no one else came to really study Hubbard’s crank opus corpus, the academics who did show up to take on Hubbard are bamboozled and horribly superficial, etc.

    Martin Gardner’s points in “Fads and Fallacies” book about crank/crackpots overall strategies to forward their crank subjects apply to Hubbard and Scientology.

    I wish and hope Chris someday takes on Roy Wallis’ “The Road to Total Freedom” and Harriet Whitehead’s “Renunciation and Reformulation”.

  • Jefferson Hawkins

    Amazing picture of Diana, she is a beautiful lady. I got to know her at the Int Base and we became friends. We worked together on a lot of projects when she was CS6 (Commodore’s Staff for Div 6). She also had a stint as Executive Director Int for about a year when Guillaume was on the RPF, a fact very few people know as it was kept very hush-hush. I always liked Diana, and yes, she has a wicked, irreverent sense of humor. Dave Miscavige hated her, of course. Well, he hates everyone, but he had a special hatred for her because she was a power threat. She was eventually busted off of CS6 (a post she’d held, off and on, since the ship days) and was demoted down to being a scriptwriter in the Int Management PR Office, writing speeches and video scripts for events. Everything she did was rejected and criticized endlessly by Miscavige. I was sorry to see her lose her spark and spirit and just become another cog. I hope that someday she gets up the nerve to escape. I never observed that she could “come and go as she pleased” – she was watched pretty closely.

    • Qbird

      I hope that someday she gets up the nerve to escape.

      Escape to where? To what?! I wonder.
      Her entire life she has been in.
      She is at the end of her life now… @ 64.
      No where to run to, nowhere to hide.

      • Jefferson Hawkins

        Sorry, 64 is not the “end of life”!!! And Diana has many friends and supporters on the outside.

        • Qbird

          ok then, Jefferson, point taken.
          However, how does a person “escape” all that they have ever known?
          I just don’t see it.
          I’m 58: I try to imagine where i would go, right now, if i needed to “escape”…
          & I’ve never been a part of a ‘group’ like Scn., Inc.
          I’m here, that’s it for me.

          • gtsix

            To your friends, to your family, to any place that would take you in and allow you the ability to breathe and figure out your future.

            • Qbird

              A daunting task in my mind’s eye.

            • gtsix

              Indeed. Daunting to rebuild your world if you left as a young person (who was raised in Scientology from birth). I can not imagine what it would be like for a 65 year old who was raised from birth in it (even though she did not have the same upbringing as other born-ins as she was not sent away from her parents to a cadet org).

              But people are strong and some are stronger than I could imagine being.

            • aquaclara

              I put a note at the top of the thread to Jeff, thanking you both about these comments. You said what I was thinking. I hope others see all this, too.
              Thanks. And a gorgeous photo….

          • Jefferson Hawkins

            I left Scientology when I was 58 – I did not know anyone on the “outside” (I thought), had no job and no place to live. But I made it. If people get desperate enough, they leave, regardless of age. I realized that if you can survive Scientology’s hell-hole, you can survive anywhere.

            • Qbird

              You give me hope then, Jefferson.
              You had family & friends (supporters) to help you, yes?

            • Jefferson Hawkins

              I started networking on the internet and found literally hundreds of friends all over the world – many former Int Base staff. My brother left Scientology a year after I did and has been amazingly supportive. And I reconnected with my daughter who has always been wonderful. The full story is in my book “Counterfeit Dreams.”

            • Qbird

              Your daughter. Ah. Good, good.
              You “found literally hundreds of friends all over the world”
              using & applying the real technology of the internet.
              Your brother was right behind you – you & he, together – reconnected & moving forward.
              And so this shall be the very next book I read then.
              Thank you for this. Counterfeit Dreams it is. A true life’s story.
              May I say, your strengths & survial skills are inspiring.

              As a side note, Jefferson, at 58 years of age, I, for the first time in my life, feel old.
              So it is. Just a feeling.

            • Draco

              Counterfeit Dreams is a good book. Well written and very interesting. Get it and enjoy it ๐Ÿ™‚

            • Ella Raitch

              One of the first I read

            • Draco

              A book that I really enjoyed reading.

            • Nancy Law

              I loved Counterfeit Dreams … excellent book! ๐Ÿ™‚

        • Qbird

          Good to hear she has many friends & supporters on the outside, Mr. Hawkins.
          May they BE THERE for her, if it’s true that she can come & go as she pleases.

        • Draco

          But does Diana know she has friends and supporters on the outside? That is always the thing I worry about. These people have been in for so long, they have no idea that people on the outside would help them if they left. If she is not close to her daughter, she might not feel that contacting her would be an option. Did she keep in touch with her sibs, Arthur and Suzette? If not, she would not think she could go there.
          Horrible trap is horrible. Especially in such a closed and disconnected environment as Int.

    • Observer

      I wonder if the Indies would try to get her, as the last of the Hubbard Scientologists, to join them or at least give them her blessing.

    • aquaclara

      I’m catching up on today’s news, and just wanted to say that this whole thread is remarkable. Qbird’s questions and comments reflected much of my thoughts, too, and your responses (and your own fresh start) are inspiring. I hope there are others out here who see themselves in your experience, and decide to take that all-important step out the door, too.

      I enjoyed your book, Jeff. Thanks for putting it in print, for the permanent record of exactly how Scientology treats its own, and what it takes to come to the realization that it’s all a trap.

  • gtsix

    OK, as I love genealogy and Scientology, here’s what I have googled:

    Pretty detailed Family Tree at Clambake:
    http://ocmb.xenu.net/ocmb/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=29488

    and a briefer one at:
    https://barefacedmessiah.wordpress.com/2013/07/02/1-madman-2-5-wives-7-children-2-5-out-of-control-not-a-single-cure/

    To sum up:
    3 wives:
    Polly (deceased); Sara (Deceased); and Mary Sue (deceased)

    7 kids:
    LRH Jr aka Nibs (deceased); Katherine (deceased); Alexis; Diana; Quentin (deceased); Suzette; Arthur

    13 Grandkids:
    6 by Nibs and Henrietta; 1 by Diana and Jon Horwich; 3 by Suzette and Guy White; 3 by Alexis and Edward Connolly

    Not in any way verifying this data is accurate, but that is the best I could google-fu at this point. (Especially as I always go down the rabbit hole when I get onto Clambake!)

    • Vaquera

      And at least one kick-ass great-grandson. f5

      • A few day ago, i saw him at the “Flag Down” event on youtube, speaking for one hour strait. He is amazing as a vocal artist and a storyteller.
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRUYESI3v3c

        • Vaquera

          I saw when you posted it last week and had coincidentally watched it the day before. He was typically fabulous when I saw him in Toronto, though he did not read from his grandfather’s manuscript. Wicked talented man.

          • you were in Toronto… I have seen Gerry Armstrong’s vid’s but not Jamies. Is it any different from this Flag Down or is it the same story?

            • Vaquera

              Yes, I was there. He performed The God and the Man, Graduation Day and, I think, Rebels Without Applause. If you haven’t seen the last two go to jamiedewolf.com and click on performances. Lots of other works and films, too. Beware, several are NSFW.

            • Ohh! i was thinking of the – Getting Clear Conference in Toronto ๐Ÿ™‚ but this is good… haven’t seen this

            • Vaquera

              Yes, Getting Clear is what I was referencing, but you can see the same pieces at his website.

            • Got you ๐Ÿ™‚

        • aquaclara

          It’s fantastic, isn’t it? He has more on his youtube, including one remarkable and heart-breaking story about a child who slipped through so many cracks, it is simply tragic.

  • nottrue

    Super private sacred religious files…Yeah right…https://youtu.be/QMoVRSNUh00

    • 13 sec and you can see that this guy is a total ass

  • Reminder: Tomorrow is Sea Org Day.

    Many are called, but more are running!

  • chuckbeattyexseaorg75to03

    “Today, four years after escaping Int Base, Roanne is working in Los Angeles as a scenic painter in the film union, and sheโ€™s reportedly very happy to be out of the Sea Org and out of Scientology.”

    Excellent news, thanks.

    Jon Horwich, her dad, produces a classic jazz two hour radio show, which will educate anyone:

    School of Jazz
    Robinhood Radio, Chicago
    http://podcasts.am1020whdd.com/~am1020wh/shows/index.php (then search for “School of Jazz” and follow into Jon’s bi-weekly two hour shows of the all time great recordings)

    • jazzlover

      If this is the same Jonathan Horwich I think it is, he also rescues obscure jazz albums and releases them in pristine, great sounding mini-LP replica CD editions. They are among the best jazz reissues on the market today. I had no idea that he was a scientologist. See here:

      http://internationalphonographinc.com/cd_reissues.html

      • chuckbeattyexseaorg75to03

        Jon’s expert taste is on display at his radio show on Robinhood Radio, “School of Jazz”, truly amazing radio show.

        Every show Jon gives out just exceptional quality jazz. He DJs his expert taste.

        • jazzlover

          He does have good taste. Is he still in, and would he be willing to talk to Tony, I wonder? I know if it were me, I’d probably wanna distance myself from the fact that I fathered L Ron’s granddaughter.

          • gtsix

            He has been out of the SO since about 2004. Doubtful he wants to talk on record, as he has not done so. But he has been reunited with his daughter, so bravo for them.

            • jazzlover

              Yes, bravo for them. It would be nice to hear from him, but he’s probably too close for comfort. He seems like a good guy. He always asks for release suggestions on jazz boards, and responds to everything in a very kind manner.

  • Spackle Motion

    I thought Jillian B knew more about Scientology than the basic questions she’s asking.

    I heard her on this show a few weeks ago and she had great insight to narcissists, which was a surprise to me considering that she’s played the dumb female for decades in the public eye.

    • Juicer77

      She has certainly asked the same questions of Tony before. But then again it’s a drive-time show and they probably are asking the same questions their listeners are. A very short interview is not enough time to get deeply into things their listeners know nothing about. I can’t comment on her public persona. (ETA: can’t comment because I have no previous exposure to her projects).

  • Alex De Valera

    I had the opportunity to meet Diana at a concert in the old days. She looked beautiful and had charisma. Too bad she stopped the Royal College of Music and stayed in the cult instead.

  • Lousy Ratatouille

    So transhumanist and atheistic scholar Bainbridge studied the sociology of cults such as Scientology and forgets his fact-checking and debunking techniques. He only goes as deep as the surface. Chris’s words: “It’s amazing that he didn’t become a Scientologist.” Yes, indeed.
    LRH made up the definitions of words such as “standard tech”, “clear”, “theta clear”, “O.T.”, but never could develop them and make them come true. And all these years he did nothing but lie about everything.
    I had already heard about “Hymn of Asia”. Now is the first time I heard that LRH claimed he was Metteya (Maitreya), the second coming of the Buddha and that he lied about the Sanskrit scripture containing the claim “the Metteya would be a man with red-flaming hair who would first arise in the West”, for this is NOT part of the Sanskrit scripture. I feel bad for Scientologists in Asian countries with a Buddhist tradition, where these outright lies could be used to sucker people in, such as Japan and Taiwan.

    • I saw this “Ratatouille” as a dish in the store today, thinking of you and had an Aha moment ๐Ÿ™‚

  • PRenaud

    After listening to Chris’ video I wish that Bainbridge guy was a coworker, I’d smack him…

    • JJ

      Or the person who decided what the Muppets needed to be was product endorsers. Would Jim be OK with it? I doubt it.

  • Andrea ‘i-Betty’ Garner

    Great interview, Tony! You’re a soundbite pro.

  • Kim O’Brien

    i just went back and looked at some posts from last night . Imma gonna feel bad for about 2 seconds , then i will remember that my cousin is married to a Muslim , that i have several members of my family that are gay , and that child abuse comes under the ” bad ” category .

    #sorrynotsorry

    • flyonthewall

      My fav part was how some unnamed person’s xenophobic Trumpesque rants were characterized as “controversial” while your’s specifically were called “hate-filled and vile”. What a fucking joke. Fuck that guy. I said way worse to EnthralledObserver than you did and will again to her or anyone that brings that filth here. Why should I, you or anyone stay silent when confronted with bigotry and fear mongering?

      • Rasha

        Howard Johnson’s right!

        *ducks*

        • flyonthewall

          merphaaaro gupta rumph!

          • Rasha

            He says the sheriff is near!

            • Juicer77

              BOONNNNNNNNNGGGGGGGGGG

            • Rasha

              LOL!

      • Kim O’Brien

        i was pretty harsh …and i feel pretty OK about it …but one thing that really bothers me is that I know that there are people here who need to fly in under the radar and post under fake names , because of scientology . I can totally respect that ( might confuse me , but i can respect it ) ..but when someone uses that shield , in this place , to spew out racist tripe because they feel like they CAN and that they have a soft spot to land …then i am not going to sit and take it . Ugh .

        • flyonthewall

          Right. I’m not going to just sit back and let the Bunker be turned into some kind of Trump rally.

        • Robert Eckert

          I got harsh with her first, but then got tired of responding to her. Glad there were others ready to pick up the cudgels when I dropped them.

          • Kim O’Brien

            you were a true gentleman …as well as MK . Both of you tried to reason with her , guide her , point out some obvious wrongs . If she was in front of me and speaking about Muslims and America the way that she did , i would have punched her in the face .

      • JJ

        My pen pal in Wales said a person there voted for Brexit because she “didn’t like Chinese food.”

        Hmnn doggies. Brave New World indeed.

    • I thought… “oh, good… moving on…”
      Why do people go off into that kind of intellectual wilderness, making ‘facts’ up as they go along?

    • gtsix

      What you talking about o’Brien?

      • Kim O’Brien

        someone left cuz i was mean

        • gtsix

          Ahh. I was wondering if there was more vitriol but I blocked that user that as I just don’t have time for that.

          Now, STAHP BEING MEAN, you meanie meanie miney mo.

          • Juicer77

            LOL

    • Was trying to find the thread, but I don’t see it.

      • Kim O’Brien

        Enturbulated Masterbator โ€ข 21 hours ago
        I am taking an indefinite leave from the Underground Bunker. I love open and free discussions but some of the recent conversations have been brutal. I’m talking about the crude name calling and hateful dialogue by a few(most notably Kim O’Brien) towards other UB posters. It’s not the subject matter of the posts but the manner in which we treat one another. However controversial someone’s view point may be, it does no one good to be so hateful and vile. I’ve read this blog since its inception and posted for a few years but it’s time for me to move along. Thanks to many other that made me laugh.

        oops

        • I was more looking for your post that he’s talking about so I know whether or not I should judge you. XD

          • Kim O’Brien

            hold on ..lemme grab it ..

            • Kim O’Brien

              might be easier to just look at my account at all the things i said to the Muslim hater …but it’s OK to judge me . I feel pretty OK about it when i remember that she posts racist crap at 6am for no reason …and does not have the guts to do it under her real name .

              Kim O’Brien EnthralledObserver โ€ข 2 days ago
              Boo hoo ….crybaby Aussie racist does not have any friends . What a shock . And it’s the Muslim’s fault ! Too bad your life totally sucks . People like you deserve to live on a rock in the middle of nowhere ….you can’t handle the real world and you have obviously been rejected to the point that you are now flailing about Jihad , on a blog about scientology ….from the other side of the planet , and whining that you don’t have any ” real friends ” in the interweb . Odds are …you don’t have any friends in the real world either …and you did it to yourself . The reason why people are repelled by you ….is you . I have no issue speaking to you this way ….i think you are a piece of shit human being . And deep down …i think you know i’m right . Blocking you will now be a relief …ya stupid twunt

            • I’m still waiting. I want to judge you, hurry. It’s very important to me that I pass judgement on you.

  • Intergalactic Walrus

    Gtsix earlier posted the website of LRH’s son, Arthur. Even though he goes by the name A. Conway Hubbard (dropping the “Ronald”), I couldn’t help but notice that LRH named him A.R.C. Hubbard…
    (refresh)

    • jazzlover

      LOL. This reminded me of one of the Chickster’s albums from 1971. Cleverly (or not), when famous saxophonist and composer, Anthony Braxton, joined the group that year, the band name changed to Circle. Apparently Corea was interested in following Hubbard’s expertise in geometry ๐Ÿ˜‰

      • Rasha

        Careful – that’s one pointy circle…..

        • jazzlover

          LOL. Did you see the 2nd album cover? Go check the stuff out. It’s pretty avant and out there ๐Ÿ™‚ That’s kinda where jazz was going at the time. The civil rights movement was in high gear, and many musicians just abandoned form and structure at the same time (hence, the term ‘free jazz’). Things got pretty wild before all the revivalists of traditional jazz reigned things back in in the later 70s and nearly killed the music. It is all about progress, after all. Jazz just stopped being progressive music for a while. zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz ๐Ÿ™‚

  • ze moo

    That Dianetics volcano cake just makes me think of flaring hemorrhoids.

    “Today, four years after escaping Int Base, Roanne is working in Los
    Angeles as a scenic painter in the film union, and sheโ€™s reportedly very
    happy to be out of the Sea Org and out of Scientology.” That is the End Phenomenon of $cientology, happy to out.

    • Observer

      If you’re lucky.

    • Intergalactic Walrus

      “Scientology, the flaring hemorrhoids of religions”. I like that ๐Ÿ˜‰

      • Dave Reams

        I made a T-shirt once with Hubbard auditing a tomato captioned by: “Preparation H – prompt soothing relief for inflammed assholes”

  • aquaclara

    Roanne, if you or friends are reading here, I wish you much luck in your life. When I hear that people have to escape to leave Scientology, it gives me the chills, even after following this damn cult since that landing in Clearwater way back when.

    You escaped and found your life. I hope it’s a happy one. And an example for others.

  • aquaclara

    Nice find, Ronnos. Thanks for sharing…..I just love how we get all kinds of treasures around here.

  • Intergalactic Walrus

    I saw the Valley Ideal Org donors list posted today on Mike Rinder’s blog. The Buttercelli Bakery is listed under the “Humanitarians”. Hmm… unfortunately, they went out of business last year. They put out a story that they were going to relocate to a bigger location in Studio City and then “boom” – they closed their doors, never to be heard from again. One has to wonder, if they hadn’t throw away at least $100,000, down the Valley Ideal Org rathole, would they still be in business. You would think that seeing their name would make a clam think twice about wasting money on this boondoggle. SMH
    (refresh)

    • flyonthewall

      You got it backwards. If only they gave $200,000 they would still be open bc it would of put that much more theta out in the thetasphere or whatever

      • Kestrel

        Maybe they just couldn’t raise that kind of dough.

        • Observer

          Here we go…

        • flyonthewall

          ISWYDT

        • flyonthewall

          Good bakers will rise to the occasion, it’s the yeast they can do.

          eta – full disclosure, I stole that joke from the internet *shame*

      • DoveAlexa

        Is there a Thetastat to measure how much in/out theta you have? Would really help people figure out the magic break-even point :P.

        • flyonthewall

          I will summon the ghost of Ben Franklin and have him make us one. We’ll be rich! Rich as nazis

          • richelieu jr

            You left out he second ‘s’ in “rich ass”…

            What’ the matter, run out of money bringing back old square-assed granny glasses from his kite-shaped casket?

            You could have shelled out for the capital ‘n’ for the Nazis, after all… A little respect, please!

            I swear, sometimes I wonder if you really are a fly, @i_am_flyonthewall:disqus , or of that is all bullshit too..? It is easy to say that Satan is your Lord, Master and Constant Companion, but few are called and even fewer can stand the reeking stench of his Narconon Big Brother’s Sebaceous Cyst ..

            So which is it, Fly? Do you love Satan, Scientology and the Nazis (capital ‘N’ there, Sonny, you’ll notice!), or does tof he stench LRH’s Cyst and logical inconsistencies and constant narcissicism and blatant theft bother you?

            • flyonthewall

              yes. yes to everything you just said!

            • Missionary Kid

              OT. How are Europeans reacting to Trump’s latest statements?

          • sashiebgood

            I can never resist a sideways Simpsons quote ๐Ÿ˜…

      • Intergalactic Walrus

        I guess that’s the way the cookie crumbles ๐Ÿ™‚
        (refresh)

        • richelieu jr

          Boba Fett!

    • richelieu jr

      “Ideal Civilization Builder With Honours” goes to one “Nancy”–

      That is either one great comeback by that little black buzz-saw cartoon character with the piggy little schnozzle, or else the is the “Civilization” that “You– Go to Hell Man!” built.

      Fitting, either way.

  • J. Swift

    With all the talk today of color and film an amusing story is in order. The last Scientology event I attended was the 2007 New Years Eve event. COB was blathering on about LRH and mentioned that Mr. Hubbard was such an expert with film that Kodak and Polaroid color scientists routinely contacted him for advice and input. I wanted to start laughing but that would have gotten me 86’d for J&D’ing.

    I worked in lighting for 30 years and part of my portfolio was Hollywood. I had clients that included ARRI, Mole Richardson, Cinemills, LTM, K5600 and other manufactures of lighting fixtures. One of the central concerns was optimizing the spectral emission of the light source to the absorption spectra of the film; color chemistry being a photoactivated process. Many of my clients had won technical Oscars for their work in lighting, film, and cameras.

    When I heard Miscavige claim that Hubbard was a photographic expert this was obviously another bloviating Danny Shermanism. Indeed, Sherman has claimed that L. Ron Hubbard created the US Air Force. In any case, below we see the quality of work Hubbard was shooting. So right, Dave. Kodak and Polaroid contacted the guy who was shooting sensational stuff like this:

    http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i68/sadhu77/1LRH66.jpg

    • beauty for ashes

      whoah, look at all those dynamic colors , sharp focus, and interesting composition. it’s underwhelming!

    • J. Jimmy James

      Maybe they wanted to ask him to never use or endorse their products.

    • pluvo

      Wasn’t David Miscavige Hubbard’s camera boy when this shots were done?

      • JJ

        Yepo so he would know….

      • Dave Reams

        Dave was LRH’s fluffer – nobody could goof the floof like Dave!

        • JJ

          Ewwww! It that why his lips look like that?

        • JJ

          Looking up floof, and we got excessive animal hair and men who fluff up their chest hair, at Urban Dictionary. fluffing up something puffy…

    • jazzlover

      Is that supposed to be Moses leading the Israelites out of Egypt? ๐Ÿ˜‰

      • JJ

        Church of What’s Happening Now Bring and Fly.

      • OTVIIIisGrrr8!

        The Founder’s photo shows the progression of wog religions always attempting to find Truth and invariably failing until… Scientology came along as the result of 50,000 years of thinking men. Scientology is the ultimate revealed Truth and offers the exactly taped path to Eternity. With prices beginning at $360,000 you too can experience the universal cosmic Truth that Jesus, Buddha, Mohammed, and Ernest Angley strove for and never found. Jesus and Buddha could never get higher than Clear. Mohammed was a Grade 2. Ernest Angley remains in need of Life Repair.

        http://i112.photobucket.com/albums/n196/scienowriter/scientology1_zpszhnmfbmq.jpg

        • jazzlover

          Interesting that he would go this far to support his theories. Thanks for the explanation, Jeff.

        • richelieu jr

          Oh, I thought it was the President of the Harvard Lampoon judging a Racial Stereotypes Costume Contest to give awards for Fakest Beard, Most Historically Inaccurate, Most Hysterically Inaccurate, Most Racistly Offensive, Most “Smelling of all the Baths They Didn’t Take (Winner? China for the 70th consecutive year for some reason… Funny, the actor smelled fine to the Casting Director, but who am I to question Hubbard’s Judgement?

          • OTVIIIisGrrr8!

            Bigot!

        • Missionary Kid

          You forgot Father Coughlin and Bob Jones Sr.

    • Dave Reams

      … chemistry being a psychoactive process

    • JJ

      Do you think that has become sort of common? People sitting there at big events, counting the money they have spent to be in The Presence, and trying not to let a critical laugh ooop out at some inopportune moment? Perhaps it can be covered by clapping extra hard at the Clap Now! breaks? Or a well timed fart maybe?

    • Michael Leonard Tilse

      I got a call from Gold one day. They were having trouble managing their E-6 color process. They didn’t know how to keep it stable.

      Yea, they were the experts. Not.

      • JJ

        Maybe DM wasn’t there that day and they didn’t have the authority to do anything…stabilizer final rinse tech was down.

        • Michael Leonard Tilse

          They didn’t know how to compensate for the PH change caused by reversal bath carryover into the color developer.

          • JJ

            How do you? I got my info from Slide development web site. Sounds like an empty start over process

            • Michael Leonard Tilse

              Depending on how much there is, you add measured amounts of sodium hydroxide solution to the color developer bath. The reversal bath is acidic and some carries over on the film, or in dip-n-dunk, the racks themselves also. So to bring it back in line you add it to the next bath. But that tends to cause an oscillation in the crossover of magenta/cyan plots. To keep it steadier, I added the average amount we were having to use, directly to the replenisher concentrate cube on the pump rack. That kept it much more stable because the volume of chemical added was in micro amounts, metered out per square inch of film recorded by the IR scanners.

            • JJ

              Good God. If everything spilled at once and co mingled, what would happen?

            • Michael Leonard Tilse

              Not *that* reactive, but I wouldn’t stick around without breathing apparatus. Though I did discover that the lab air had a lot of gaseous bromine in it. Silver Bromide is one of the major components of film and that gets broken down into silver and bromine by the developers. A lot outgasses into the air. If you do a lot of hand development, you can get it absorbed through your skin. I did a lot of litho film development in trays.

              I went for blood tests one day. Dr. Denk asked me why I had a high level of bromine in my blood.

            • OTVIIIisGrrr8!

              Michael, what you’re describing sounds suspiciously like the Helotrobe Implanting Process A, wherein a series of vats is used to overexpose thetans and drain them of cyan. Are you sure you weren’t sent in to destroy Scientology organizations?

            • richelieu jr

              Hey, Either way it’s Win/Win as far as I’m concerned– Better Holiday Snaps for all vs Destruction of a Love Grinding, Family Mashing, Dwarf-Enriching, Psychosis-Enducing, ersatz Mafia (without the family values and Old World’ culture) posing as a friendly religious organization.

            • OTVIIIisGrrr8!

              rj, you make Scientology sound so tawdry when actually it’s quite wholesome.

            • sashiebgood

              I used to represent photographers and one of my stable was an amazing creative photographer named Exum (those of you who read the magazine RayGun in the 90’s would be familiar with her work) she did a lot of work with chemical processing to achieve really cool daguerreotype effects and color washouts etc. She ended up with rheumatoid arthritis from developing her photos without using proper gear (face mask, gloves etc). so, be careful MLT!

            • Rasha

              IKR??? LOL!!!

    • everything was wrong with that man’s ideas of what was art, music, film, science and blowjobs. I had a real hard time with that book and his short movies with all the weird equipment. The man was raving mad!

    • Draco

      Oh God! Those Volunteer Minister’s Handbook photos were terrible. I cringed when I first saw them

    • richelieu jr

      @disqus_MYMqA6D5xj:disqus I totally agree, and as a film professional myself, it was the poor quality (on pretty much every level– especially given as I have heard anecdotal (and the occasional photo) evidence that his equipment was pretty high-quality. If you were reading the comments at the time, you may recall my going off on a several-day tirade asking how other people who had a high degree of mastery of their craft,be it, music (!!!WTF??!!!), film, literature, philosophy, medicine, physics, history, science- basic brushing and (the now-disregarded art of) flossing and oral hygiene, managed to keep a straight face when that fat fabulist went off (or the ‘church’ did in his place) on his pioneering expertise in their field. How could they take such shameless, shameful, ham-handed bragging and loud-mouthed ignorance regarding THINGS THEY KNEW TO BE PROVABLY FALSE, and then fail to wonder if he might not be just a bit stretching the truth about breaking “bronchoes” when he was 3, becoming blood-brothers with a tribe that never partook in that hollywood nonsense at around the same age from a ‘medicine man’ whose name cannot be found on any tribal registry, first wounded soldier, spy, cripple, war-hero, messiah by book-reading, etc, etc…?

      — That said, this Jesus Christ Superstar/ Godspell rip-off is amongst the better clichรฉs I’ve seen from M Prevaricator. I mean, it still sucks, but I have seen far,far worse. At least there the exposure isn’t too far wide of the mark.

  • JJ

    Jesus, who doesn’t want to eat a brown cake? So reminiscent of what’s to come…or is that prescient?

    • I’m gonna swing wide here and say that chocolate cake is pretty much a dessert staple.

  • Dave Reams

    I imagine Arthur and Suzette gazing up whistfully at the “Call me” billboard and sighing at the memory of their long lost sister.

  • Andrea ‘i-Betty’ Garner

    Highly OT but come on! How could you not love our local TV new stations? Jim Hughes, 73, is so proud of his impeccably groomed cock.

    https://youtu.be/y5VAZF7GovI

    • Kim O’Brien

      i have no idea what he is saying ….but any old guy with a big cock …is just fine with me

      • Andrea ‘i-Betty’ Garner

        He’s (very) Scottish, but it’s a Yorkshire TV station. Bless him. And his enormous cock.

    • JJ

      There were selling a big rooster stature here years ago, place went out of business, missed opportunity there. Buy it, haul it, drop it off at Gold. I double dare anyone to do that.

    • Juicer77

      I tell you, I kept the “Hairy Bikers Pullout” edition of the Daily Mail.

      • Andrea ‘i-Betty’ Garner

        Hahaha!

    • At Primary School we were once treated to a ‘educational’ BBC radio programme which told informative little stories about how children lived in other countries, for later discussion.

      I remember one was about an Italian lad and his grandfather. They were farmers, who bred poultry and were going to a regional show. The lad was sure his prize bird was going to win. His Granddad, not wishing him to be disappointed, urged caution, pointing out that somebody else might win.

      He replied, “but Granddad, I’ve got the biggest cock in the village!”

      • Also, he seems to have the right stuff for a career in high-energy physics…

      • Missionary Kid

        I grew up with a friend with the name of glass. In our chemistry class, the teacher was talking about making chemical containers and apparatus. All of his buddies had a hard time not laughing out loud when the teacher said, “If you’re going to be a chemist, you need to learn how to blow glass.”

    • Subtitles would be nice.

    • Rasha

      He chupped et dewn, b’cos it were a dinger in hay wends. Ged fer hem.

      (Just being funny with the accent, I think et’s brellyint)

    • HillieOnTheBeach

      Johnny Tank! you gonna let ths challenge slide?

      I know I wouldn’t.

  • Intergalactic Walrus

    I work at a clam school, my kids attend the clam school and I have to crowd source to try and afford to send my kid’s to the clam school’s summer camp. What did I do to pull this in?

    BTW – here is a Yelp review of that clam school… yikes!
    (refresh)

    • Kim O’Brien

      summer is over

      • JJ

        Way. boots have replaced thongs in foot wear at Walmart.

      • gtsix

        Speak for yourself. It’s going to be above 100 here for the next 5-8 days.

        • Kim O’Brien

          ๐Ÿ˜‰ i just mean for camps …school starst in like 2 weeks LOL

          • Supper Powers

            F5

            • Kim O’Brien

              now i’m depressed . My kid has orientation next week

            • Intergalactic Walrus

              Cheer up, because your kid doesn’t attend a clam school! ๐Ÿ™‚

            • Supper Powers

              Yeah, but your kid goes to a prestigious school on scholarship. These poor kids…they have a sub-par education.

  • grundoon

    long ESMB thread from 2010: “Diana Hubbard-Horwich and me”

    • JJ

      And the other threads: Cruise has become #2 In Scientology…. Sure he has, sure he has… depends on definition and expectations. No one seems to be saying that anymore.

    • grundoon

      Diana Hubbard got up to some ill-fated shenanigans in 1980-81, as told at length in Mike Goldstein’s fascinating “New Regime Takeover Series.” Mike later posted this short summary of Diana’s part in his story…

      Diana contacted me before the “new regime” had made their takeover push, when there was still a chance to stop them. In May of 1980 when Diana contacted me, she was seeing the signs probably before anyone else was.

      After a long and productive career in the SO, I’d routed out in 1978 with a large freeloader debt. A year later when he needed my help, I made a deal with LRH that if I did the job he needed me to do, he’d cancel my freeloader debt and arrange for all my and my wife’s OT levels as well as quite a few intensives put on account at AOLA. Having fulfilled my end of the bargain, in the spring of 1980, I was a public Scientologist in good standing again, already having made one trip to LA for auditing. I was working at my father’s business in Denver when my sister (who was the receptionist and a Scientologist) came into my office one day all excited, saying that Diana Hubbard was on the phone. She’d somehow tracked me down. She sounded a little desperate when she asked for my help, saying that she knew I was someone her father really trusted (I’d never really worked with Diana when I was on the ship; only with her parents. And the last time I’d been in contact with Diana was at a time when she was in great disagreement about something I’d done, so I was surprised that she was reaching out to me.) When I wasn’t willing to fly down to Clearwater, she agreed to send me a written briefing about what was going on, but only if I promised to destroy the document after I’d read it. I remember getting the distinct sense that she hadn’t been in touch with her father for a while.

      In her briefing, Diana discussed many indications that such a takeover was beginning, but that those initiating this takeover were not much interested in Diana’s “domain” of Div 6. She proposed that by creating a strength in the field that wasn’t under “their” control, we’d be a force to be reckoned with. But she wanted to make this happen with me coming back to Flag to run such a program. I told her that there was no hope of accomplishing her loftly purposes from Clearwater, or any place in management or even within the structure of the Church, and that in order for such a program to have any chance for success, it would have be done from the field without any upper management interference. I told her to give me a month to come up with a plan.

      Thirty days later Diana flew to Denver where I met her in the airport and she read my proposal. This is where I provided her with all the data leading up to my program, which called for creating a grassroots movement, an expanding army of competent Book One auditors who would be trained and managed directly from the field; the program being run from a profit making company outside of the CoS. And what I needed from her to make this all happen was “air support.” She had to keep management and the GO (Guardians Office) off my back long enough for me to get things rolling. After that, this new regime would have a hard time stopping us.

      Diana approved the program, got back on the plane and went home. Over the next year she did her best to keep the assholes off of my back, and when the GO started putting a lot of attention on my operation, I quickly launched the program from Flag. The initial “launching program” went as well as I could have expected, and when I left Flag, everything was in place to insure my program’s distribution to the entire worldwide Scn network. Success appeared to be within our grasp. But the pressure from “above” was really getting to Diana. At a crucial moment, she knuckled under to management and all but gave the program to the FSO. After that, I knew I was pretty much on my own, and without Diana handling her end, the war was pretty much lost. It just took me a while before I realized it. During this time I did maintain communication by phone and sometimes in person with Diana, but she was pretty much a burnout by then.

      • Sounds to me like Diana was entertaining the fantasy that she could control events by applying Scientology while Miscavige was using intimidation and realpolitik.

        She didn’t have a snowball’s chance.

  • grundoon

    ILove2Lurk recently posted these (from 1978-79) at ESMB…

    • flyonthewall

      First thing that came to mind when I saw this pic of Hubbard. f5

      • Rasha

        Perfect. But I do like all the light-up middle fingers in the background…. Fitting..

        • flyonthewall

          wow, nice catch!

      • Hmm, perhaps this:

    • Royce Harlow

      That jacket is so theta…

    • in al these pictures, you get the sense of someone who is displaying his possessions rather hand recording a day spent with people he’s close to. He’s always slightly aloof, and everyone else looks as if they are, slightly nervously, doing what they are told.

      • OOkpik

        Who among them was blessed with a happy arch?
        eta: OOps! This was supposed to be for Grundoon.

        • grundoon

          That photo must be from Arthur “Archie” Hubbard’s 21st birthday party.

        • Rasha

          …and it was their 21st arch, as well!

    • Intergalactic Walrus

      LRH looks loaded in both photos and the jacket doesn’t even fit him.

    • Jon S

      Hell’s bells that LOUIS THEROUX guy gets everywhere. (See top picture.)

  • Royce Harlow

    It is extremely weird. She’s such a gorgeous woman but at the same time being a spitting image of her father.

    • flyonthewall

      Royce loves Diana! Royce loves Diana! Why don’t you just marry her Royce! Oh right, nevermind

  • Intergalactic Walrus

    Houston, we’ve got a problem. The school district? The mayor’s office? Ugh…
    (refresh)

    • littlefish

      Oh lort. Someone get the mayor on the phone!

    • Free Minds, Free Hearts

      Oh No, Houston!

  • Lousy Ratatouille
    • flyonthewall

      ….

      • Bloated, grandiose, Francophilic, dreck.

        • flyonthewall

          who me?? ๐Ÿ™

          • Of course not, you’re no Francophile.

            • Rasha

              Who’s scruffy-lookin– oh sorry. nvm.

            • flyonthewall

              you mean scragly, it’s scragly. And don’t forget gaunt

            • Rasha

              There is that, yes. So gaunt. So, so, just so very — OH! How did that cutie larva like Cirque do Soleil?????

            • flyonthewall

              she was enjoying herself but I got bored so we left

            • Rasha

              LOL. I call Nuh-uh.

            • flyonthewall

              it was really good, she was rapt and got a neat souvenir. Best hang out ever

            • Rasha

              ^_^ They are really amazing. Just remember to cheer for the cast that comes out to set up the stage for the performers. <3 Glad it was a good time!!! Best times…..

    • I thought she was a singer. What did she do on this track?

      • Lousy Ratatouille

        It says on YouTube she’s the composer and the performer. I don’t think it’s that bad.

        • Technically, no. I could do without the bloopy synthesizers, but what Hubbard can resist corny electronics?

      • flyonthewall

        i think she plays piano

        eta – like in general, idk this song specifically.

  • Lousy Ratatouille

    Here’s an awesome performance by an awesome relative:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ciupsqkLLkQ

    • flyonthewall

      …..

    • Rasha

      That man can speak songs.

    • I love Jamie!

  • Vaquera

    Jamie DeWolf was voted best filmmaker in the East Bay. Woot, Woot! Storytelling genes are strong. f5
    https://instagram.com/p/BI-pJIEjkVr/

  • Rasha

    Just in the spirit of today’s post, I did find this old pic of Rasha as a little’un … good times……

    • You used to know the Trents in McMinnville? Small world! ๐Ÿ˜‰

      • Rasha

        Rasha is familiar with them. -.o It was a different time.

        • It was indeed… (F5):

          • Rasha

            *hovers*

  • flyonthewall

    Remember this troll? f5 Poor sock only has one fb friend ๐Ÿ™

    • Rasha

      That’s 100% more than none. Wait – we have to join the Bunker??? Glad he/it brought up the financial burden of donating to the “so called open discussion group”. I forgot to donate. Accept Rasha’s apologies.

      • flyonthewall

        you pay now!

        • Rasha

          Agh! Okay, okay, Rasha got this….. okay…. aaarrgghh…. um… I got Pocky. Here’s 12 Pocky sticks! GAHH…. what else…. Umm.. I submit to the Group Think! Yeah, that’s it! Whatever y’all say – that’s what Rasha’s for!! That and Pocky!!!!

          • flyonthewall

            *munches Pocky* *eyes warily*

            • Rasha

              *shifts uneasily* ….ummmm……. membership card?……. Badge? ….

            • flyonthewall
            • Rasha

              Just watched it again yesterday!!!!

            • flyonthewall

              Ooh you’re a very lucky Rasha!

            • Rasha

              I knows what I likes….

            • flyonthewall

              This movie was robbed at the Oscars. Shameful

            • Rasha

              The “Billy Drinking from the Firehose” scene alone rivals anything in Working Girl

            • flyonthewall

              my “you’re a very lucky Rasha” comment was a ref to that scene ๐Ÿ™‚

            • Rasha

              Yup.

            • flyonthewall

              I can’t decide b/w Stanley’s fight or the TV shows

            • Rasha

              SUPPLIES!!!

            • flyonthewall

              i’m thinkin’ of somethin…orange. Somethin’ oooraange! Do ya give up? It’s an orange!

            • Rasha

              “dun dida dun dida dun dida DUN DUNNNN!! What’sa matter? Don’t you like Bonanza???”

    • jazzlover

      Good luck hangin’ with Alanzo is all I have to say.

    • Observer

      “Groupthink” = nobody agrees with me!

      • Rasha

        I agree!!

        • Observer

          Hurray for not groupthink!

          • Rasha

            You’re right!!!! O.O

    • Oi vey all of these losers need some cheese with their whine.

    • HillieOnTheBeach

      “My last post in the Bunker was a generic post…”

      No, it was your usual nuisance post.

    • You were in Scientology 20 years ago for 6 months and you spent $600? You poor pathetic piece of shit. I’m glad your expertise in cults has allowed you to make such an educated assessment of our group you dumb fucking keyboard warrior douchebag.

      • gtsix

        The Kim is strong in this one. Harness the Kim, young paduan.

        • Kim O’Brien

          oh god

    • Eivol Ekdal

      I was completely nice to him, even gave him an e-meter schematic. And this is the thanks I get, I am really pissed off!

    • Also, I could never reconcile the sense and feeling that some in the Bunker showed signs of psychopathic and sociopathic behavior that could not be reconciled otherwise.

      Literally 4% of the entire world population are sociopaths. The ones that aren’t in prison already are either working in high levels of government, the military or senior management in a large corporation. Their lack of empathy specifically precludes them from being able to spend even a small amount of time on a website like this. Once again you are really really dumb.

    • $cnmonkeyrob$

      Wow… Andrew KC is a real fekkin person???monkey thought he was a chatbot (or something) because he didnโ€™t know how to use the โ€˜Post as…โ€™, โ€˜replyโ€™, โ€˜deleteโ€™, or โ€˜editโ€™ buttons properly… (or the English Language with any startling proficiency) so we just didnโ€™t bother… just goes to show really…

      • flyonthewall

        he’s only technically a real person.

      • J. Jimmy James

        He’s as real as they come from Trollsock Island.

    • J. Jimmy James

      I wish the group was meaner to him so I could have been too.

      • flyonthewall

        we plan on pissing on his grave soon as he’s dead. I’ll let you know

    • Harpoona Frittata

      My goodness, if young Andy thought this was a tough group, then I sure hope he learns to stay off the internet because there’s some serious leap-through-the-screen-and-rip-your-face-off discussion groups out there!

      On the Salsa Scale from mild to fire-breathing, I’d give this site a mild-medium hot rating, with almost all the razor-wire sharp snark aimed at the cherch, not those who post here.

      However, if you can’t jump in and J&D like you mean it, then I do see how you could feel left out, which does tend to magnify folks hurt feelings and affect how intentionally aimed they perceive flippant comments.

      In any event, we’re here to put an end to $cn as we know it, so what’s a few more bodies in the ditch on the way to total cult eradication (just kidding ๐Ÿ˜‰

      • flyonthewall

        right?? It’s a jungle out there! People don’t even know, they be spoiled

    • gtsix

      Hey… I didn’t do nuttin but tell him not to cheap out on buying a fake emeter, and when he said he was envious of the works of the sea org that he could join up and end the envy.

      Ungrateful bast. I gave good solid advice. For free!

      I’ll report to ethics for my out exchange. And yes, I’ll bring muffins.

      • TheMirrorThetan

        Me too. I told him to buy the most expensive one COS sells and to go the whole hog and bling it up with gold and diamonds.
        That is what being nice gets me. ๐Ÿ™‚

  • Fly Lady

    Fly, I made you that cake you wanted. F5

    • flyonthewall

      that cake is like 2 yrs old, I’m not eating that!

    • aegerprimo

      Does it have Lego prizes baked inside?

      • Fly Lady

        Around here, I’d be more surprised if it didn’t.

      • Missionary Kid

        They’d be melted, wouldn’t they?

        • thetastic

          Absolutely not. They’re indestructible. And when you bite into a lego, you can simultaneously feel a sharp pain in the arch of your foot. This is true.

          • Missionary Kid

            I’ll steal a kid’s lego and try it out.

        • aegerprimo

          I think the King cake of New Orleans Mardi Gras has a plastic baby Jesus baked inside. It would be sacrilege if Jesus melted.

    • Sid (Phil Jones)

      I see that Fly is going to PAC a lunch.

      • gtsix

        How has Mrs. Sid put up with 44 years of you? Lords a leaping, your humor has me in stitches constantly.

        • Sid (Phil Jones)

          She seems to tolerate my terrible jokes. Amazing how she anticipates it though. I can look over at her and she’s glancing out of the side of her eyes with a wry smile on her face just waiting for the punch line.

          • gtsix

            And yet those side eyes are twinkling with love for you. Bravo (to Willie, of course )

          • thetastic

            They’re quintessential dad jokes. No one can take the dad out of you, Phil!

      • flyonthewall

        clearly

  • I have the Diana Hubbard lifelines record album. Anyone remember that?

    On that Dianetics cake. Man, is that like kool-aid flavored? Kind of a creepy photo. “Eat this cake, then you are one of us.” Ingredients: Irradiated BTs

  • aegerprimo

    Diana Hubbard was strikingly beautiful in that photo. I read somewhere that she was self taught on the piano. That is remarkable really. Too bad she was ruined by her father’s far reaching insanity = Scientology.

  • Missionary Kid

    OT. This just popped into my mind. David Miscavige is the Pee Wee Herman of religious cult leaders, both in stature and maturity.

    • HillieOnTheBeach

      Miscavige could never hold a candle to the best.dance.scene.ever!

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BodXwAYeTfM

      • Missionary Kid

        I should really apologize to Pee Wee (Paul Reubens) for my comment.
        I remember the original release of Tequila in the late 50’s, so I was glad to see it revived when I took my kids to see Pee Wee’s Big Adventure, and see the song revived.

  • nottrue

    One good thing. No Scientology Ads during the Olymipics

    • flyonthewall

      you just jinxed it!

    • J. Jimmy James

      They are working on Clearwater’s host city bid for the 2024 Games

    • Sid (Phil Jones)

      They were going to be participating in the fencing competition until they found out you can’t use razor wire.

      • Rasha

        LOL!!!

      • Rasha

        …and they suck at Disqus….

    • Sid (Phil Jones)

      And they dropped out of the sailing competition early after tossing most of the crew overboard.

      • gtsix

        Let’s hope all of the SO medal in the get out of scientology running events.

        • Sid (Phil Jones)

          I know right? They tried to qualify in the sprint competition but kept running in circles instead of a straight line.

          • gtsix

            They were totally confused at the pole vault. Running around it got them disqualified.

    • HillieOnTheBeach

      Then again, Sea Orgers volunteer to clean the green algae infested pools as they are surely safer than working on the Freewinds.

  • Rasha

    OMAGARSH! Just realized I hadn’t recommended this post! ….there! Done!….

  • This is way off topic, weird and NSFW, but I just went for a smoke break on my roof and these two were having fun next to my ashtray like nothing else matters in the whole damm universe. They didn’t even care when my camera was like an inch away, it was that good. I let them do their deed and now I feel like a porn director. You’ve been warned.

    • Rasha

      *blush* Oh, my….. what kind of domicile is this??? That sort of thing….. oh, my……

    • EnthralledObserver

      Fly porn

      Was that you, flyonthewall?

      • EnthralledObserver

        I mean… I don’t wish to imply anything… but… well… you and Kimmy and Robert are down stream a bit circle jerking each other so thought maybe you were into that kind of thing…

        • flyonthewall

          shouldn’t you be vandalizing a mosque or something?

          • Kim O’Brien

            Block tech is cool

            • flyonthewall

              i tried that for a bit but my curiosity always gets the better of me ๐Ÿ™‚

            • gtsix

              Can I interest you in some cake?

          • EnthralledObserver

            Oh, fantastic idea… maybe tomorrow.

            Today I was actually just working my way through deconstructing the myth of ‘racism’… seems interesting…
            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MARyj9JNrBM

            • flyonthewall

              yep, just let it all hang out there, good for you. Always nice to see someone’s true colors

            • EnthralledObserver

              “see someone’s true colors”

              Ha… oh the irony.

            • Frodis73

              So, you totally ignore what science, specifically DNA, has to say about the origination of human beings? How scietological.

            • EnthralledObserver

              So ‘racism’ exists because of DNA? Is that your argument?

              Hmm… and here I thought the video was an interview with a black man discussing the his black community, absent fathers and brainwashing of their young with preconceived ideas that did them no service.

              You might want to watch at least a little of it before you comment…

            • Supper Powers

              Oh please, shut the heck up already.

            • EnthralledObserver

              Nope

            • Supper Powers

              Ok, keep showing your ass you attention deprived anon81b4u mimic. Idiot.

            • EnthralledObserver

              And the name calling and abuse just keeps on coming… you people just can’t help yourselves, huh?
              I already said, when the abuse stops is when I will.. but you’ll have to prove yourselves for a few days first. Three more days of this… I wonder if you’ll learn this time?

            • Supper Powers

              Boo fucking hoo.

            • EnthralledObserver

              For you – YOU are the one who demanded I shut up! How’s that logic working for ya?

            • Supper Powers

              Bye you ridiculous fool.

            • EnthralledObserver

              ๐Ÿ™‚ Breakthrough!

            • EnthralledObserver

              This really is fantastic parenting advice… it points out the holes in even my children’s circumstances and I wish I could change things so they had their dad home all the time.
              Especially for my son… who is 14, and now taller than me… just. He needs his Dad more now, definitely.

        • Supper Powers

          Pure class.

    • Rasha

      Didn’t George Carlin call this “golf”?

    • HillieOnTheBeach

      Fly 1 to Fly 2: I didn’t want to do it at first, but you’re right.! Doing it in public is kink-ay fun!!

    • Oh my gosh why would you do that to Mr. and Mrs. Fly!

    • gtsix

      Wait… you have video? Hmmmm… nah, not my type of pron.

    • Thanks for upvote, Fly. Makes me think you are not offended. I just thought it’s fascinating.

      • flyonthewall

        No offense. I mean it’s a little embarrassing just cuz those are my peeps and they’re just humping butt naked in public, smh. *shrug* What you gonna do?

    • Rasha

      …that’s a tall ashtray…. just sayin’….

      • It’s just one of these

        • Rasha

          Affordable, does the job, and allows room for flies to ….. well… to…. “like each other very much”, so to speak.

    • Frodis73

      Oh my.

    • thetastic

      What are you talking about? They are well hidden behind a humongous flower pot!

  • Intergalactic Walrus
    • Rasha

      Can’t watch. Maybe later. Haven’t had my VBN. ….yeah….. nope…..

      • Intergalactic Walrus

        Cardone is growing creepier every day. Here, he makes Charles Manson look sane. After his house of cards collapses, he might have a future in S&M porn. GAG.

        • Rasha

          …the money eases the fall, maybe softens the impact at the bottom, but a shit stain on the pavement is a shit stain on the pavement. People like that don’t think about the future or their legacy. It’s Me, Now. “Ha ha, I’ll have fun on the way down, but you’ll have to step around the puddle I leave!”

          …then it becomes a story about what was there before the Wal-Mart parking lot.

    • J. Jimmy James

      Yeah… A jury will see this some day.

    • HillieOnTheBeach

      Edited. Misunderstood something.

    • flyonthewall

      Makes Roberto from Futurama look very sane. Very sane indeed.

  • Supper Powers

    Do I stay in bed or get up for some peach ice cream and Chris Shelton?

    • Rasha

      …you have to ask…. silly head. ^_^

    • Vaquera

      If it’s Blue Bell Peaches and Homemade Vanilla…you get up, no question.

    • Frodis73

      Peach ice cream sounds so good..I have never had it before, but I vote for ice cream and Shelton.

  • J. Jimmy James

    I love when the Bunker gets all professional wrestling-y. Can’t wait to see who turns heel next. Maybe we find out who the masked troll is!

    • flyonthewall

      well we already know who the neo-nazi is

      • Frodis73

        Snort.

  • Frodis73

    Greetings Bunker!!

    Just a quick hello and to pass along a message. First, I am now in the 21st century again! YAY!! Fellow Bunker 5 ft and luminous had an old (ha, it’s 5 yrs-to me that is new!) laptop she was going to recycle so she sent it my way. I am getting things set up. I am beyond excited and grateful. Of course now I am having problems cos the electricity keeps going out. Grrr. We need the rain though, so I will survive.
    I have a message from her to you guys also. She doesn’t have net access at home until Tuesday when they come to install…so, she’s out of touch unless things slow down at work and she can sneak a peak. She says hello and that she misses everyone and will be back soon.
    While I was digging for something in my inbox I came across an old pic of Murphy, so I can finally switch my avi out with a non-holiday themed dog. ๐Ÿ™‚
    Oh yeah, and who would of thought Andrew wasn’t a bot? Lol. Surprise, surprise now he is on the “bunker is a cult bandwagon”. (eye roll)
    xo-E

    • Supper Powers

      Frodis!!!!
      ETA And Murphy!!!!

      • Frodis73

        Supper!! HUG!! I am so glad to be back!

        • Supper Powers

          HUG! We’ve been asking about you! Glad to see you and the pup!

    • Rasha

      *waves at Frodis and 5FeetLongandLuminous* …the radioman says It is a beautiful night out there!

      • Frodis73

        Aw! Sweet, another SC fan.

        • Rasha

          …learnin’…

    • J. Jimmy James

      See. This is like when Sting was gone from the WCW forever and then came back and the crowd was gonna tear the building down they were so excited

      • Frodis73

        Lol, not quite, but thanks J3. I have missed the banter between you and Fly.

        • J. Jimmy James

          Did you see when I hit him with a steel chair and he didn’t remember ?

          • Frodis73

            Missed that one. I see that you have all been picking on people and hurting their feelings tho.

            • J. Jimmy James

              I just do what the groupthink instructs me to do.

            • gtsix

              What is this “I”? There is no “I”.

              (is that right? I haven’t gotten the most recent cult meeting minutes. It was up for a.conformity vote… so con-fused)

              F5 I can’t spell… I mean we can’t. .. us can’t. .. so con-fused

    • flyonthewall

      Glad to see you are back Frodis!

      • Frodis73

        TY I wiill be able to start watching Stranger Things later tonight too.

    • Vaquera

      Hello, sweet girl. So glad to have you back! ML to 5′ for facilitating your return to the bunker and all things cyber. Squee!!

      • Frodis73

        Squee indeed! I owe you an email that I will get to eventually. I meant to ask you at HowdyCon, but it was too crazy and I forgot.

        • Vaquera

          You owe me an email? The only reason you forgot to ask anything at Howdycon can be blamed on my heavy pouring of Fireball and that alone.

          • Frodis73

            Lol, same here…that is the most I have had to drink in years. It was worth it though!

      • Kim O’Brien

        psst …send me an email ..i have sumthin to tell ya kimob2@comcast.net

        • Vaquera

          Done

    • gtsix

      Welcome fellow cult member. Have you had your required doses of popcorn and ckae? Wonderful to have you back… was wondering where the luminous one was. Thanks for the news.

      Have you tried my cupcakes? Special recipe… have 2.

      • Frodis73

        Thank you, I do need to load up on Bunker treats…I have been starved!

        • gtsix

          (Heh heh heh… the agenda is working.)

          I mean enjoy! You’ve been missed. Hell, have 3 more cupcakes. No one will mind.

          (muwaahaahaa)

    • Kim O’Brien

      FINALLY ! ๐Ÿ™‚

      • Frodis73

        I know! I was going nuts…Oracle type nuts! lol

    • Free Minds, Free Hearts

      Nice work Frodis – welcome back! and special thanks to 5-ft-luminous!

    • sashiebgood

      yay! welcome back Frodis! ๐Ÿ˜† we’ve missed you,

  • Frodis73

    Oh, I forgot…anybody else out there watching the Olympics? The women’s gymnastics team is kicking ass…they are so far above everybody else it’s not even funny.

    • flyonthewall

      I’m beginning to think they’re cyborgs. Seriously

      • Frodis73

        IKR??

      • Rasha

        …still re-watching the Chinese women’s diving. ….just……

        • Frodis73

          Them too! I love watching both…they are not showing diving tonight on network…pool blue yet?

          • Rasha

            Tomorrow at 2:30 EDT. They are addressing that green pool, but at least one is azure.

            • Frodis73

              I thought the color on my tv was messed up at first…then I thought I was imagining things…

            • Rasha

              I knew there would be issues, especially in such a tropical climate (used to have a pool), in addition to other factors, but I’m sure they will ensure that all of the competitions are done right. Rasha has faith.

        • flyonthewall

          Oh! I have to mention before I go that I heard the Japanese national anthem last night for the first time when the Japanese swimmer gymnast got gold. It was so soft and subtle, even melancholy. I am use to big loud bombastic chest thumping ones like America’s or England’s etc. Very cool. I know you’re into Japanese stuff so I wanted to share that with you. Nite!

          • Rasha

            It has a lovely introspective feel, no?

  • Panopea Abrupta

    Andrew Kiyotaka Caesar, a sociologist who studies cults,
    in con-sultation with Alanzo and Miss Tia, has recently been
    performing a cursory study of a most pernicious cult –
    the Underground Bunker
    The Bunkerues, as acolytes are occasionally known, view
    Cleveland and Denver as places of pilgrimage.
    They worship a mythical being, Captain Howdy, and believe in
    the SugarPlumFairy.
    They indulge in group-think wherein they condemn child abuse,
    infringement on human rights, human trafficking and coerced
    abortions.
    They further are likely to go into paroxysms of shooping and joking
    and degrading of such upstanding and ethical beings as Tom Cruise,
    Germ Revoltya, Kirstie and Jenna as well as strenuously objecting to
    abuse of junkies and addicts.
    They show a curious proclivity for facts and science and a disdain for woo.
    They occasionally wax ecstatic about squirrels, cats and dogs and can’t
    spell caek cake.
    Popcorn is a sacrament.
    Their numbers are straight up and vertical.

    • Missionary Kid

      Don’t forget the Bunker’s obsessions with food, and music.

      • Supper Powers

        *eating peach ice cream* *nodding silently*

        • Rasha

          (takes a tiny spoonful… swoons)

          • FredEX2

            Takes a great big spoonful… Grins ๐Ÿค“

            • Rasha

              Haha! I need to be more assertive. #^_^#

        • thetastic

          Magnum bar over here.

      • Rasha

        …and nailguns.

        • Ella Raitch

          Damn – missed that meme

          • Rasha

            ^_^ Oh, it ain’t over…. hehe.

    • Rasha

      I can too spell caek…caeK…. CAek……CAEK…. …. dammit.

    • Frodis73

      This is awesome!

    • Gertrudis

      “…squirrels, cats, dogs and babies…”
      FIFY
      Absolutely adore your prose, Pan!

  • Frodis73

    Also, I just have to say something about this to get it off my chest. I have soooo much to catch up on, but I stopped over at Marty’s just to see what was new. It does seem as if Oracle has taken over his blog though. I know she will hate that I am saying this, but she is off her rocker. What is with the 7 paragraph replies that just go on and on. Can we all say paranoid? She also says that she is banned here…I do not remember that. What I do remember is she just didn’t like the replies she got. Anybody know if she is truly banned here or is that also all in her head?

    • gtsix

      YOU SAID THE M-WORD!!!

      • Frodis73

        I know!! I was going to type he who we shall not name, but if he read that I figured he’d get off on that.

        • gtsix

          Are we not doing phrasing anymore? (someone insert the gif please!)

          • Frodis73

            what gif? What did I miss?

            • gtsix

              https://goo.gl/images/ektttF

              TV show, where they often have inappropriate phrasing. That last line activated my eeeew meter.

            • Frodis73

              TY!

      • J. Jimmy James

        She was back for 29 minutes before she was banned. Couldn’t even make it a half hour. Damn.

        • gtsix

          Discus will not allow me to upvotes you. Sads.

          She shall be missed. And I wasted all those cupcakes!

          • Rasha

            (glances at cupcakes…. looks away… glances at cupcakes…. looks away…. disassembles nailgun for maintenance… glances at cupcakes… gets back to nailgun……)

      • Missionary Kid

        I’m not worried about writing Marty. All one has to do is read what’s going on there, and it’s crazy, for a lot of it. I usually don’t bother.

        • gtsix

          YOU SAID THE CRAZY WORD! WE’RE DOOOOOMED!

          • Missionary Kid

            Sorry, I don’t believe in magic or majik, or any of that stuff. ๐Ÿ˜€ Ya can’t scare me!

      • Juicer77

        f5

    • Robert Eckert

      She also claims to have been banned at ESMB where nobody remembers any such banning ever happening either.

      • Frodis73

        Ha, I knew it! Wasn’t sure about ESMB as I don’t read there often, but I was pretty certain she had not been banned here. Lies.

      • Ella Raitch

        She asked to have her account removed. She was not banned.

    • Observer

      She was banned here because she made a nasty, over-the-line comment about Tony’s personal business. I was on here when it happened and saw it and the banning. She richly deserved it, believe me.

      CORRECTION: I saw the aftermath and Tony’s post about it, and was told what she had said. Menopause Brain sucks.

      • Robert Eckert

        How long ago was this?

        • Observer

          A couple of years.

          • Robert Eckert

            ok then, if it had happened during the past few months of nonsense it would disturb me that I didn’t remember it.

            • Observer

              No, it’s been awhile

      • Frodis73

        Oh wow! I did not know that! It must have been very bad as Tony is *very* tolerant here…I know those other people claim differently, but Tony rarely bans people.
        Thank you for letting me know….I can only imagine what she said as she seems to Obsess about him…actually now some of it makes sense now.

        • Observer

          She’s a piece of work

    • Juicer77

      My best advice: stay far away from MartyMark’s Place if you want to keep your sanity. Those who are brave enough to comment there and try to provide some balance are few and far between.

  • gtsix

    BTW: anyone seen baby lately?

    • Gertrudis

      Baby! Come out and play with us!!
      ETA: Baby – Hope you are having fun visiting with your family … miss you!
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jrVbawRPO7I

    • Robert Eckert

      She has family visiting and may be scarce at the Bunker for a while.

      • gtsix

        Ecellent.

  • Vaquera

    Lochte…Phelps….Ack!!!

    • J. Jimmy James

      That was crazy.

      • Ella Raitch

        Huh? Any Australians racing? If no Aussies, probably not broadcast down here

        • J. Jimmy James

          Those sisters from Australia just swam. I think one of them came in 5th

      • Vaquera

        The dude is hungry.

      • Vaquera

        Here we go again!

    • Robert Eckert

      All Phelps

      • Vaquera

        Wanted me some Lochte.
        eta: …when I was younger.

        • Robert Eckert

          It was the green hair, wasn’t it?

          • Vaquera

            Blue steel.

        • Frodis73

          Did you ever see his reality show? I guess the illusion was shattered for many people as it turns out he is very dumb and not interesting. At least that is what I heard about the whole thing. ๐Ÿ™

          • Vaquera

            Never saw it, but heard the same. To be honest…perfectly honest….doesn’t make a damn bit of difference because…Ryan Lochte. ๐Ÿ™‚

            Here he is with my goddaughter shortly after the last Summer Olympics. f5

            • Frodis73

              No way!! Where did she meet him? She a swimmer? That is a *great* pic of him…

            • Vaquera

              Yes, she was a collegiate swimmer.

            • Frodis73

              Respect, that is awesome.

            • Kim O’Brien

              SARONG

            • Vaquera

              ^^^^^ Winner!

            • Vaquera

              Here you go, honey. f5

            • Kim O’Brien

              oh my ..i’m gonna get a callous in my naughty place

            • Vaquera

              Hilarious. So glad I met you.

            • Frodis73

              ^this

            • Frodis73

              rotf!

        • beauty for ashes

          Ya know, I’m looking at at Lochte in a swim cap, and he looks good. His hair does not help him.

          • Vaquera

            Semantics. ๐Ÿ™‚

            • beauty for ashes

              He just took it off, and I just thought nope! not hot anymore. guess I’m fickle.

      • Ben Franklin

        Phelps must have some fish in him. His swimming abilities are beyond human.

  • J. Jimmy James

    I just won gold in Men’s Individual Chocolate Fudge Brownie, but I know I couldn’t have done it without Coach Ben and Coach Jerry.

    • Rasha

      …all that training…. Eye of the Tiger…….

    • Frodis73

      I’m the reigning queen in the Red Velvet Cake with Coaches Ben & Jerry…on a side note, I have not been able to get a hold of this in about a month…I am slacking.

      • Supper Powers

        (It’s just so good to have you back.)

  • Intergalactic Walrus

    Here is a video of the clams claiming that LRH was a Purple Heart recipient at this weekend’s CCHR Purple Heart event. GAH!

    https://www.facebook.com/james.d.chamberlain/videos/vb.1384285111/10210253738604925/?type=2&theater

    • Supper Powers

      No no no! Stolen valor.

    • Rasha

      Managed 1 minute in. No. Nuh-uh. Over. Rasha pissed.

    • Liberated

      Someone needs to display before and after photos of Lisa McPherson at one of these “human rights” events. Let them explain human rights according to the “cult of L Ron.

    • pilgrim

      Thanks for sharing this!!!

      This really needs to be spread far & wide. Maybe post it at http://www.veteranstoday.com/. I can’t imagine that veterans would be too happy about Hubbard’s stolen valor.

      • Len Zinberg

        Pilgrim, you may not know that Veteran’s Today is a website that promotes anti-Semitism and Holocaust denial.

        • Frodis73

          Oh wow. Thanks for the heads up. I have never heard of them, but will remember that!

  • What’sup

    Butterfly, backstroke and breaststroke are completely superfluous. You don’t see Usain Bolt backing up his 100m sprint with the 100m moonwalk and 100m hop.

    • Vaquera

      But how cool would that be? :)))

    • Ella Raitch

      Well, walking is an international athletics event – although that’s probably the track and field version of synchronised swimming

      • What’sup

        When does the Twerking start?

        • Supper Powers

          That was during opening ceremonies.

        • Frodis73

          Don”t give them any ideas, that might just get added in 2020.

    • J. Jimmy James

      When I swam as a kid, I was really really fast at the backstroke… The problem was I couldn’t do it in a straight line. Kept swimming into the lane divider. I’m sure some people thought I was a handicapped kid.

      • What’sup

        They have an Olympics for you too.

    • beauty for ashes

      I would really enjoy olympic skipping.

  • beauty for ashes

    I’m just gonna be stupid. I thought Enthralled Observer was this really nice lady from Australia. What the What?
    Can someone splain this and use small words?

    • Kim O’Brien

      Ella is the nice one …i think EO was nice once , but then something happened

      • beauty for ashes

        Ella is a peach:) It just doesn’t sound like the same person. We might need an exorcism.

        • Supper Powers

          She sounds like she became anoni81b4u. So bizarre.

          • beauty for ashes

            YAAS! I just wonder if its not a counterfeit sock account.

            • Frodis73

              I would be thinking the same thing if I hadn’t had that discussion previously…it seemed so weird.

          • Frodis73

            I forgot about him…I guess he didn’t like being ignored.

        • Ella Raitch

          Online exorcism – that’d be cool. I like the cut of your jib

          • Supper Powers

            How would the throwing up pea soup part work?

            • beauty for ashes

              Digital pea soup puke! No wait~ I swear someone out there has made some sort of exorcist emoji already. It’s a strange time to be getting old.

            • Ella Raitch

              An app! An app!

            • TheMirrorThetan

              You would need to make a DIY Exorcism Kit and sell it online and include a huge bag of pea soup that people can spray about the room or puke up, just to get the full effect.

          • beauty for ashes

            Yeah, the Bunker would need a backup generator.
            I would think RMycroft could do it. I’ll even make a priest collar!

        • Frodis73

          Oh no, it’s definitely her and it’s not new…I think it was over 2 years ago that it came up in discussion one night.

          • beauty for ashes

            I have such bad radar for these things. **sighs heavily**
            BTW~ congrats on your new computer!

            • Frodis73

              Thanks! Trust me, I was shocked when she said whatever it was she said…like Ella said though, we only know a small part of each other. Still though, those ideas are seriously outdated…and just dumb and mean.

          • TheMirrorThetan

            I’m glad your back Frodis. Missed you when you had computer problems.

      • What’sup

        The nice one! I understand you not including me but The Mirror Thetan an Unex-skus are nice too.

        • Kim O’Brien

          oh no ..i did not mean it like that ๐Ÿ™ i promise !

        • TheMirrorThetan

          Iam NOT nice. You take that back right NOW. ๐Ÿ™‚

    • Ella Raitch

      We all know only a very small bit about each other online from what we all care to share. Just because we agree on matters to do with Scientology, doesn’t mean we all share the same political views. FWIW this Australian doesn’t agree with EOs views.

      • What’sup

        Me neither.

      • Supper Powers

        And I never agree with Aussies. ๐Ÿ˜‰

        • What’sup

          Australian racists are easy to spot. They shave their heads and wear these. F5

          • Frodis73

            That’s a good one!

          • Supper Powers

            Ha! I jarred myself out of drifting off to sleep!

          • beauty for ashes

            that is just sacrilegious.

      • J. Jimmy James

        I’m actually a hippopotamus.

        • Rasha

          WHAT??? I never vote hippopotamus!! Marsupial Party Strong!!!!! WOOOO!!!! (totally divides the Bunker Party)

        • TheMirrorThetan

          I’m actually a dropbear. ๐Ÿ™‚

      • TheMirrorThetan

        Neither does this one.
        I don’t believe in blaming a whole group of people for the sins of a small minority.
        I don’t think that hatred, discrimination and cruelty directed towards those that are innocent people just trying to get on with their lives, will help anything.

        I also don’t understand Trumps appeal and why some think he can make a positive difference to the fucked up world we live in and why some people** are ok with his obvious Racism and Misogyny either.

        ** I Mean people in general, not having a go at anyone.

        • Ella Raitch

          Onya! And while I’m more than happy to have respectful in-person discussion about political views, I don’t think an internet chat board is the place for nuanced discussion. Who can be bothered with all of the bloody typing for starters.

    • Frodis73

      I know…I was pretty shocked the first time this kind of thing came up. It was quite awhile ago, late at night too, but she said something shady about immigrants. She was not as harsh as she was lately though…it seems maybe something has emboldened her.

      • beauty for ashes

        This is like a bad horror movie.

        • stillgrace2

          I’m alarmed by the changes to the atmosphere in the bunker.
          I will never stop reading Tony’s articles but I cancelled my flights to Denver in 2017.
          I was looking forward to it, too, since family affairs kept me from Cleveland. (F5)

          • EnthralledObserver

            May I ask you a question, stillgrace2?

            • stillgrace2

              Absolutely.

            • EnthralledObserver

              Thank you! ๐Ÿ™‚
              I noticed something about Miss Tia mentioned in a comment regarding Alonzo and another labelled ‘troll’… I wasn’t aware of anything going down, haven’t had much time to go through the comments section lately… did something happen? I noticed I haven’t seen any comments from Tia… has she left too?

            • stillgrace2

              I’m not an authority on bunker happenings since my business takes up so much of my time these days and it is impossible for me to read all the comments each day. But I know that Miss Tia posted an explanation why she left on Alonzo’s blog. I read it and wished her well.

            • EnthralledObserver

              Okay – thank you. I think the name of Alonzo’s blog was on that post, I’ll scroll down and find it again. ๐Ÿ™‚

            • J. Jimmy James

              Yes… her explanation.

            • Frodis73

              Yes, with a lot left out.

            • Ella Raitch

              For you as well……((((hugs))))) – I will never know (and don’t really want to) the full story but hugs for you who were closer and IRL hurt by what happened

            • Ella Raitch

              ((((hugs))))) – I will never know (and don’t really want to) the full story but hugs for you who were closer and IRL hurt by what happened

          • Robert Eckert

            It sounds as if you missed the days of buildup to that exchange.

            • stillgrace2

              Maybe … I caught some of it. It devolved into ugliness and name-calling and crap that reminded me of the old Flunk days.

          • Juicer77

            I’m sorry you have decided not to attend HowdyCon2017. All I can say is that we are a really mixed bunch who seem to get along quite nicely when meeting in person, at least that has been my experience. I hope you will reconsider. There are many of us who really would like to meet you.

          • beauty for ashes

            I don’t like drama either. I like you a lot though. ๐Ÿ™‚ I’m sure you are smart enough to figure out what’s best for you too.

            • stillgrace2

              Thank you so much. I like you, too. I remember when you first joined (it was right after 26) and your avatar intrigued me … so I always paid attention to your posts. I think our “viewpoint glasses” have similar corrective lenses.

      • J. Jimmy James

        Trump Hair Gel seeping into her brain. Just use a different brand, ffs.

        • Frodis73

          That idiot is poisoning everything.

          • 0tessa

            I find this inappropriate. So I flagged it.

    • EnthralledObserver

      Happy to have you ask me directly, you know. Perfectly willing to explain what’s going on without the falsehoods and prejudiced opinions of those with motivation to do so.

      • beauty for ashes

        You know I was intimidated. Sometimes I don’t seem to catch if somebody is a sock or not.I had concerns that someone was imitating you like they did with other bunkeroos using a slightly different moniker. I just remember everyone’s concern after the hurricane for you, so it couldn’t possibly be the same person. I shouldn’t have stuck my nose in any further about any other fights you are having with other bunkerites. That was none of my business, and I apologize for that.

        • EnthralledObserver

          It’s okay – if you didn’t see it all from the beginning I completely understand how my reaction could have looked to many.
          Mostly what you need to know is that it’s deliberate and calculated… and targeted. Sometimes even more far more ‘controversial’ that what I really believe, I admit.
          Essentially I disagree with the curtailing of the concept of free speech. I made some comments – I admittedly lean to the right politically – I think center-right, others seem to think I’m full blown fascist – and got vilified and abused for it… very little actual discussion… just abuse. My point in my follow-up posts is to teach them all a lesson, that their vulgar, vicious behaviour is NOT the tool that will get me to stop sharing my opinion (which I normally don’t – but I was rather upset and frustrated when I made that first one and it leeched out despite my usual ‘Bunker Filter’). So… stalemate… they keep the abuse up, I keep finding inflammatory topics to post about, tied some way into the day’s $ci-post… so I’m not completely off topic.
          Coincidentally, I just discovered about Tia’s leaving and just read her post at Alonzo’s blog… heh… the of comparing her thoughts and experiences with this one I’ve been having with Bunker lefty gang attack displays not a small amount of irony, right?

          • Frodis73

            First, there is more info to the Tia thing that she is not revealing…but she left and threw the Bunker under the bus as an excuse to hide something else.
            Second, I do not think there is one person here that is against free speech. I’d say most, if not all, of us are rabid free speech. You and anybody else can say whatever the heck you want, but don’t get all uppity, offended, whiney, martyr-ish (pick one or many) when you get push back against those ideas. That is also part of free speech.

            • EnthralledObserver

              You don’t understand the concept of free speech then. You are welcome to your counter arguments, your stating you don’t agree, your right to ignore me… but abuse? Why is that necessary?

            • Ella Raitch

              You do understand that people calling you out in whichever way they choose is also free speech, right. You might not consider it constructive or effective, but someone calling you an arsehole is not inhibiting your right to say exactly what you want. Only the moderator banning you will do that.

            • EnthralledObserver

              It doesn’t matter – I object, and this is my remedy. Their submission will be voluntary.

            • Frodis73

              Can I ask you a serious question? Why exactly are you so concerned about Islam? I get being worried about the radicals and extremists that want to kill everybody and force them to live like them, etc. But I just don’t get this round all of them up mentality. And this is coming from somebody who thinks religion poisons everything and wishes it would all go away on most days.

            • EnthralledObserver

              Sorry – I had to take my daughter to dancing… back now.

              My problem with Islam is the written doctrine and teachings. These are not like Christian writings (that so many people like to compare it to) that detail a history of past events – the Islamic writings very specifically call for the actions in it, or to follow the example of Muhammad, to be done always and forever. So those writings and teachings are VERY dangerous. It’s not for Westernised Muslims to say what Islam is or is not, or who is a Muslim… western culture by its nature curtails the harshness of Islamic culture by way of needing to adhere to our laws… but Islam, when free to do so i.e in Islamic countries, especially those not secular and who apply the Sharia, displays a very different picture of what Islam genuinely is. Now, for the most part westernised Muslims are fairly harmless and would be fine to get on with their business in western countries, but as the West continues to bring in Muslims from non-western cultures then westernised Muslims must face a choice… submit to their brethren to maintain their allegiance to their historical tribes (which is natural to wish to do – all of us like to flock with our own kind), or split from Islam altogether. This culture is not passive, it’s VERY aggressive, and the Muslims from the Islamic countries in general are quite aggressive too… and they will resist assimilation to maintain their culture because Islam is aggressive in its call for adherence. In short, your Western Muslim neighbour isn’t a problem until he must choose between Western culture or Islamic culture as the latter grows in our countries. Western culture is tolerant… Islamic culture is not… which one is he more likely to submit to? And that’s why we need to keep Islam from Islamic countries from importing itself even more in western countries. The way to do that is ban Islam altogether – unpopular, but my preference – or limit or cease the importation of Muslims from aggressive Islamic countries.

            • Tim Brown

              Um, I’m a bit late to the party. But isnt the real solution for people to grow up and realize that ALL religions are made up by people?

              Some are more obviously bogus than others – $cientology and Mormonism for example.
              But with the possible exceptions of Jainism and Buddhism, they have all produced dangerous fanaticism that has gotten countless people killed and made life miserable for even more.

              I agree that, at the moment Islam appears to be particularly unhinged
              But humankind as a whole would be better off without any of this stuff.

            • EnthralledObserver

              Possibly… maybe. I don’t know… I think Christianity, as imperfect as it’s been over the centuries, has been a valuable contributor to western values and morals… without that I fear the direction civilisation will turn in.
              And I don’t even believe in God… I just think there were some very smart people over time who came up with the good stuff. Unfortunately the anchor for the good stuff appears to be lodged with the dogma… I’m not sure I trust society over time to know which bits to keep and which bits to discard.

            • Irit8ted

              Thats sort of the point. Dont trust society. Dont trust religions.
              If you ask Chris Shelton, featured on The Bunker today, I am sure he would advise everyone to think critically for themselves.

              Look, listen, read, discuss and argue and then make up your own mind. And change it if you get better information or a new perspective.

              Where religion goes wrong is encouraging an unquestioning belief in what is often patently absurd. They will deny it, but you can see it happening.

              On the grand scale of things, Scientology is small potatoes.
              Obscene, certainly. But statistically speaking it affects almost nobody.

              However big or small the religion, humanity is better off without any of this dreck.

              Live long and prosper

            • Anne

              Right, humanity is better off without the universities, hospitals, and charities that Christianity has pretty much invented. If it weren’t for the Catholic Church, no one would have university degrees because they invented the concept of a university in the first place……

              Also, you speak as if an atheistic society is any better. If anything, it’s only worse. My mother escaped perhaps the bloodiest regime in history, the USSR, and was hunted down by the KGB for being defiant about her religious expression.

              Better advice would be not to trust yourself and your own ego, because that’s what you’re really worshiping.

            • Irit8ted

              Anne,

              I’m sorry your mother was persecuted by the KGB. But that’s not my point.
              I am saying that worshipping anything without evidence is delusional behaviour.
              And it can and has frequently led to some very bad things.

              Besides, the Catholic Church has done its fair share of persecuting. Take Galileo for one example. He dared to question holy writ and ended up in jail for suggesting what we teach today in kindergarten, not to mention university.

              You might say that that was a long time ago. But today in Africa the Catholic Church is campaigning against condoms, the result of which leads to more aids sufferers. Not to mention US evangelicals supporting the intoduction of the death penalty for homosexuals in Uganda.

              I am not worshipping anything. I support clear and critical thought.

            • Frodis73

              ella, do you have an email addy for what’sup??

            • What’sup

              …..

            • Frodis73

              Got it!

            • Ella Raitch

              No but I communicate with him on Messenger so can flick him your addy if you leave it here

            • Frodis73

              Thanks hon, we are now in touch.

            • Ella Raitch

              So glad you’re back xxx

            • EnthralledObserver

              I wanted to add, but had to go to dancing…

              Free speech is not free speech when you find you have to watch what you say lest you face abuse or will risk being ostracized. That self censorship. That’s not free speech. Free speech is when you’re allowed to speak your mind with no consequences bar the possibility of having to defend your position with further argument or evidence.
              Abuse should not an acceptable consequence of speaking your mind… how many would choose not to bother… how many already don’t bother? Have you considered how many others here might agree with me, in full or in part, or wish to further discussion or investigation to a new perspective that this abuse hurled at me has deterred?
              That’s not free speech.

            • Ella Raitch

              I understand, but that is you applying your own definition of free speech and not using the definition which is generally understood, for example, in terms of human rights, which is that a government or other authority is not interfering with your ability to speak your mind.

            • EnthralledObserver

              I did state in my original answer the ‘concept of free speech’ was what I was motivated by… deliberately separating it from any legal meaning… but I understand that you probably missed that.

            • 0tessa

              Does ‘flagging’ help at all at the Bunker?

            • Ella Raitch

              Flagging will alert the moderators who will determine whether something is inappropriate, but Tony/Scott seldom interfere with comments. Blocking is also an option if you are upset by commenters. Or read a book instead ๐Ÿ˜‰

            • Frodis73

              I don’t remember that I was abusive to you…was I? But that actually would be part of free speech too…nobody is forcing you to stop talking.

            • EnthralledObserver

              By all means share what Tia left out with me – I have no idea what went on.

            • Robert Eckert

              No, we’re not going to gossip about her in her absence. If you disappear we won’t keep talking about you, either.

            • EnthralledObserver

              Love a good fight, don’t you, Robert?

            • Robert Eckert

              I stopped fighting with you days ago.

            • EnthralledObserver

              Well, I wasn’t asking for you to gossip about anyone… so… ???

            • Robert Eckert

              You were asking for all the dirt on Miss Tia. Nope.

            • EnthralledObserver

              *sigh* No, Robert… I said I just read her post about why she left… which was new to me… Frodis said there was more to the story… I said to HER to go ahead and fill me in, because apparently it’s important I have the bigger picture as it’s relevant. Ffs… you know you are almost twice my age and you carry on like you are a quarter of it… get your shit together, mate.
              And don’t whine that I don’t know the full story regarding Tia, if you aren’t willing to fill me in. I don’t even care. I liked her… I wish she never got rid of her fb account, because now I don’t have her contact to get the full story off her.

            • Robert Eckert

              “apparently it’s important I have the bigger picture as it’s relevant” No, it’s not important, although you should be warned off assuming that her self-serving rant was the real story.
              “don’t whine that I don’t know the full story” Nobody is “whining”, we are simply observing the plain fact that you don’t know. Unlike Frodis, me, Jimmy, etc. you never met her and have no reason to know. Just like you don’t know shit about what really happens in America either so we don’t care to hear you lecture us about the subject.

            • EnthralledObserver

              “”apparently it’s important I have the bigger picture as it’s relevant” No, it’s not important, although you should be warned off assuming that her self-serving rant was the real story.” <<< what pointless platitudes… you people are so biased why would I bother to believe there's any validity to your suggestion that the whole truth has not been revealed without proof – I've SEEN what you repeat of what I said that's NOT TRUE or deliberately misinterpreted to make yourselves look superior! If you've done it to me right in front of me, why would I take your word for it about Tia? So, fuck off if you aren't intending to tell me… or just tell me. As I said – I don't give a shit… it was implied by Frodis that she wanted me to know the whole story by telling me there apparently WAS ONE, so I suggested I'd be open to listening – that's IT! Get off your fucking moral high unicorn – you aren't an angel!

            • Robert Eckert

              Talk about deliberate misinterpretation: ” it was implied by Frodis that she wanted me to know the whole story”? No, she implied no such thing. She was just warning you not to take what Miss Tia said as gospel.

            • EnthralledObserver

              You see, Robert… it’s my interpretation that matters, not yours.
              I believed that was what was implied, so therefore I told her I was happy to listen to further explanation. I never nagged, insisted nor demanded any such explanation when one wasn’t provided… so, please… fuck off and go grill me on my current comment – it’s getting lonely over there with everyone else having learnt their lesson. I mean, I really want to bring up Islam or Gay marriage or Political Correctness or Trump again tomorrow… do me a favour.

            • Robert Eckert

              “I really want to bring up Islam or Gay marriage or Political Correctness or Trump again tomorrow” Fuck off with that noise, nobody wants to hear your nastiness. Especially nobody wants to hear you whine about how nasty people get when they tell you you’re nasty.

            • EnthralledObserver

              Naww, Robert… with that attitude I might just do it anyway.

            • Robert Eckert

              Yeah, yeah. You know that posting with the sole purpose of causing annoyance and disruption is the very definition of “trolling”?

            • EnthralledObserver

              Yep, I know. Is that label supposed to deter me?

            • Robert Eckert

              *shrug* just in case you weren’t aware of what you are turning into

          • What’sup

            • Frodis73

            • Frodis73

          • beauty for ashes

            Can I just say that maybe right now is going to be an inflammatory time for Americans for any political discourse? Here in America there is an atmosphere of fear for our choices politically.
            My neighbor has a social group for elderly men to go out to breakfast together. The only rule is no talk of politics. Before this rule was made two old guys almost came to blows in a restaurant. He told me this story both exasperated and laughing.
            I find the interjection of politics here a bummer. For the most part we have more in common to talk about. I say that after getting into arguments too. ๐Ÿ™‚ It’s just not worth the stress.

            • EnthralledObserver

              I agree that’s probably true… though the response from the left to alternative ideas and comments has been to attack vehemently for a long time now… it might be just worse now as everyone is hyper aware of their own political position and have a desire to voice it.

            • beauty for ashes

              It is polarized on both sides. There is literally no middle ground, no listening to each other, no giving other respect. I really hate it.
              You know what makes me sad, is that for the first time in history a woman who is so highly qualified to be president is running, and I feel like I can’t even celebrate that as a woman with all women.

            • EnthralledObserver

              It does seem to feel that way sometimes, I agree.
              As for not being able to celebrate a woman potentially being president… well, we’ve had a female Prime Minister… and it’s not all it’s cracked up to be if she’s not the ‘right’ person for the job. Her gender should be irrelevant… and celebrating her gender seems strange to me with the progressive push for ‘equality’ as they define it – women and men are supposed to be the same. It’s feels a bit hypocritical. When the right woman comes along (which I don’t believe Hillary is) she won’t have to fight as hard as Hillary for validation. Be patient… she’s coming. ๐Ÿ™‚

            • beauty for ashes

              Well we disagree on gender. And Hillary. I really don’t want to discuss politics here. It has saturated every media outlet. I’m going to try to avoid them for my mental health. ๐Ÿ™‚

    • Ella Raitch

      I will add that we’ve recently had a Federal election which saw One Nation party do quite well in Queensland where EO is from. One Nation is a fringe party that supports some minority views on immigration and Islam (I say minority views because they do not get the amount of support that makes them serious political contenders. We also recently had a morning TV ‘celebrity’ espouse some views on Muslim immigration following the latest attacks in France, which sparked a national social media furore over immigration, political correctness, yada yada…speculating that this maybe what has EO interested in posting things here at this time (that and the US election of course).

      • EnthralledObserver

        Whilst I appreciate your input, Ella – it’s not a minority a view as you’d like to think. Most people just don’t yet realise the concept that we aren’t locked in to voting for only two parties. With all the many that voted what you called ‘fringe parties’, Liberal/National coalition still got in… which is a far cry from stating that the rest of the country is against the ‘fringe parties’. They are just the best of the bunch of TWO… the views here at the Bunker tend to lean left, which is Labor influenced by Greens… their results were abysmal… so there reveals the truth.

    • gtsix

      Here’s my take: she said that homosexuals have a society destroying agenda and we want to make all children gay (and that we will go after children to further our agenda).

      That is an attack on gays, and absolutely disgusting. She said it, and I blocked her.

      She calls attacking me and mine “free speech”. Of insinuating that gheys are manipulative pedophiles as free speech. So take that as you will.

      I am not a fan of attacking her back, it does no good. I prefer the j&d response to such horrid bigotry. But this was not a free speech debate.

      Can I interest you in a cupcake?

      • beauty for ashes

        Okay, well I’m a volunteer for the gay agenda. That said, I also used to be very religious and until better human examples taught me better, I was really narrow minded. I will keep my heart open for change. (for now) ๐Ÿ™‚

  • Frodis73

    Oh yeah, I forgot to tell you guys I spotted Jenna “neflix” Elfman…on Netflix. I had no idea, but she did an episode of “Shameless” (US). Of course, she played a lesbian…in a psychiatric hospital!

    • Rasha

      That Bridge ain’t gonna pay for itself!

    • J. Jimmy James

      Which season/episode? I don’t remember that

      • Frodis73

        Pretty sure it’s the first season. Remember how the mom comes back and then tries to commit suicide at Thanksgiving? Then they go and break her out of the hospital and the mom takes off with Jenna instead of going with her kids.

        • J. Jimmy James

          Yeah. IMDB wasn’t loading. That was 2012. Completely forgot about that.

          • Frodis73

            Really small part, but you know Jenna loves that she can say she worked with William H. Macy. He’s amazing, she is in no way comparable to him imo. How’d she even get that part??

            • Kim O’Brien

              she blew a horse

    • Ella Raitch

      I just saw that the other day – I was home sick and binge watched a few seasons. She was featured going down on another woman while in a psych hospital. It was a kind of blink and you’d miss it cameo. Was going to post about it but thought – naaah, surely that must’ve been mentioned at the time

      • Frodis73

        It was a very small part and I had to double check too. I was also shocked that it hadn’t been mentioned here considering the nature of the part, lol. I am so excited to be back online.
        I have to force myself off of here, but have so much to catch up on. For example, Tony is doing voice work for his book!!! That is such great news.

        • Andrea ‘i-Betty’ Garner

          Frodis!!! We missed you.

  • Frodis73

    Aw, tears. Aly kicks ass!

  • Fink Jonas

    I love Jilian, how enternainig she calls it like it is.

  • mikevh2.1

    “Meanwhile, any evidence that L. Ron Hubbard ever had any family at all โ€” and certainly not the detail that he had seven children by three different wives โ€” has been completely erased from Scientologyโ€™s website today.”

    I believe “not” is a typo here, yes?

    • TonyOrtega

      Nope.

      • Mooser42001

        “I believe “not” is a typo here, yes?”

        That’s strange. Is he complaining about the syntax, or the facts?

  • Todd Tomorrow

    Probably mentioned earlier today but wasn’t there several people that claim hubmonster molested Diana?

    • Robert Eckert

      That rumor has come up often but never traced to a good source who saw anything or would know anything, so Tony won’t touch that story.

      • Todd Tomorrow

        I see..

  • Ann B Watson

    Hi Tony and all, Well thank you because that picture is how I remember Diana.She came quite a few times to Asho and did her piano and singing at the Palladium as that was where I saw the Flag Events.She had the most gorgeous red hair and wore very pretty flowing clothes.I guess she could never let go of Dad.Just a hunch I have.Stardust memories.XO

  • Chris Shelton

    Bainbridge then describes how he designed artificial intelligence computer models to model gradations of belief, shades of gray rather than absolute black and white thinking and he then makes the point that this is how non-fundamentalist belief works.

    /rolls eyes.

    I’m tempted to read Bainbridge’s book God From The Machine Artificial Intelligence Models Of Religious Cognition to see if it’s CyberCrud GIGO as bad as his writing on Scientology.
    https://archive.org/details/GodFromTheMachineArtificialIntelligenceModelsOfReligiousCogni.EBOOKOID

    http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/cyberintelligence.png

  • LittleRedSongbird

    Wow, she was really pretty. Sad to hear that she’s still in the Sea Org