SUPPORT THE UNDERGROUND BUNKER
You can either make a one-time donation to the site via Paypal...

...or you can subscribe and get billed monthly:

FOLLOW ME ON
SUBSCRIBE TO OUR
E-MAIL LIST
To join our e-mail list & get daily updates on new stories, e-mail us at newstory@tonyortega.org.
RSS Feed
Click here to add The Underground Bunker to your RSS Reader

Drone footage of Scientology’s secretive Int Base: The reaction from former base employees

phantom4

[DJI Phantom 4 drone, like the one that took images of Int Base]

It’s been 24 hours since we posted stunning drone footage of Scientology’s secretive Int Base near Hemet, California, and those videos, made by an anonymous drone pilot, are still up at YouTube where you can view them for yourself or even download them, with the blessing of the filmmaker. [Int Base flyover 1 and flyover 2]

We’ve been talking to former Int Base residents who were blown away by the quality of the footage, as well as what they noticed were numerous changes at the site since they were last there.

One of the things that many people noticed was that in the first few seconds of the first video, you can see a soccer game going on.

“There were 14 people playing soccer on the soccer field. That almost never happened when I was there,” Paul Burkhart tells us. “The sports fields were only used on Sea Org Day for the most part. A few brief periods of ‘Exercise Time is Mandatory’ and then the next flap would happen and the sports fields were forgotten.”

 
droneint1q

 
Chuck Beatty noted that about ten minutes later in the video, the game is over and the field is empty. Had the drone been spotted, or was exercise time over?

“My guess is that this was shot on a Sunday morning (the shadows indicate it’s morning) during CSP (personal room cleaning and laundry time),” Jefferson Hawkins wrote in the comments section. “Probably Miscavige is not on Base and they are allowing people to exercise ‘if they’ve passed their berthing inspection and if their stats are up,’ something like that. The few staff leaving MCI (the cafeteria) are heading back to berthing, not to post. It would be interesting to do a flyover during crew muster.”

Paul Burkhart agreed with that Hawkins about the time of the week: “This drone flyover appears to be happening in the morning, but not really early in the morning, judging from the shadows. I wonder about the time because the whole base looks really inactive. There are no projects in the driveways and roads around the Castle, one or two joggers are seen, no cars are present at DM’s Berthing or at Building 50 or at the Villa’s guest rooms. No cars are at motor pool gassing up or washing. An External Comm Van goes across the highway to berthing. About 15 people not in uniform are seen leaving the dining building (MCI). It makes me think that this must be a Sunday morning, when staff clean their rooms etc, until noon. I saw one person coming out of the Laundry building with sheets and towels, but I would expect more staff doing that if this was Sunday morning.”

At one point, Int Base housed something like 800 workers, but we’ve been told that that number is way down now. In 2009, the Tampa Bay Times series “The Truth Rundown” revealed that Int Base housed a bizarre prison for executives, “The Hole,” and was otherwise a scary compound where workers were starved and punished. After that series came out, we’ve heard, the prisoners of the Hole are still segregated, but they spend their time in courserooms during the day and confined to spartan rooms in Berthing at night. And the overall population of the compound has come way down as Scientology leader David Miscavige seems to be putting more emphasis on the Clearwater, Florida base, as well as a new studio compound in Los Angeles.

Still, Int Base is largely the way it’s been for many years, with some important differences. Hawkins, for example, pointed out something that numerous other people noticed: Near a roundabout down from Building 50, the RTC headquarters, there was a bare spot that is marked with an “X.”

Sinar Parman tells us this was where Building 119 stood, which housed CMO Gold and the Household Unit. Sinar had a room in the building from 1981 to 1986.

It was the Household Unit that Gerry Armstrong was assigned to when he discovered that there was a huge collection of L. Ron Hubbard’s personal documents and artifacts on the property that he archived and which eventually became the center of intense litigation for years.

Paul Burkhart tells us what was being planned for this spot after Building 119 was torn down: “This is where Building 51 was supposed to be built. Building 51 is where Int Scientology Management staff were to be located. But those staff were all assigned to the Hole. Even when they were in the Hole, this building was still being planned. Probably 200 different space plans were done (no exaggeration) and submitted to Miscavige on how Management was going to be set up. Staff in the Hole even worked on the plans. Eventually my senior and I got plans for Building 51 approved. I did renderings of the new building. An Architect was hired to produce construction drawings for the building, and those were construction drawings done. Contractors provided bids on the cost of the construction. The small building that used to be on that lot was demolished to make room. And a decade later – the lot is still empty.”

 
missing119

 
Burkhart and Hawkins also both noted that the place in general is looking a bit dog-eared.

Burkhart: “In 2010, there were a lot of plans being submitted (and eventually approved) with regard to Base Landscaping and Lighting. After all that planning, I don’t see that much of it ever got done. Overall the drone flyover gave me a feeling of quiet acquiescence and not much happening. Maybe it was just the serene music track. A handful of people on a 500 acre $250 million base going thru the same motions, day after day, week after week, year after year … decade after decade.”

Hawkins: “The grounds are in terrible shape compared to when we were there a decade ago – large areas of what used to be lawn are now brown, desert landscape. Probably due to lack of staff to maintain it and lack of water. Huge brown spots on the lawns which Miscavige never would have tolerated in the ‘old days.’ Still huge areas of lawn wasting water.”

One big change from previous years was the way a whole section in the northwest has been altered. “All of the buildings out at OGH are gone – Old Gilman House, Maintenance Man’s House, etc. There was a whole group of buildings out there at the northwest end of the property – all dirt now. These buildings were mostly used as prisons for wayward staff. They probably use sections of Berthing for that now, as Tom mentioned,” Hawkins noted.

Also, a swamp in that area has been removed, as Sinar Parman noted. He said that besides the removal of the Old Gilman House (OGH) and “Maintenance Man House” that as nearby, something called the “Wiese House” has been taken away, as well as the “Horwich House.”

 
missingogh2

 
Sinar — who at one time was L. Ron Hubbard’s personal chef — also noted some changes to the south fields.

 
southfields

 
And he wanted to clear up some identifications of structures near “The Hole.” It was at the music studio here that Hubbard’s “Space Jazz” album was recorded, as well as the “We Stand Tall” video. It was also used for Tom Cruise’s courseroom when he visited in 1990.

 
thehole

 
But maybe the most important thing we left out of our tour of the base yesterday was to pinpoint where David Miscavige lives when he’s on site. In the middle of the compound, on the north side of Gilman Springs Road, there are three rectangular buildings known as “The Villas.” Miscavige’s personal quarters are in the easternmost one, known as “Upper Villa.” Paul Burkhart helped us out with the identity of the other structures around it.

 
thevillas

 
Burkhart spotted a couple of other things in the high-definition footage. “The Berthing Building landscaping has grown in nicely. When I was last there in 2012, I saw staff that had been assigned to the hole out working on the landscaping around Berthing….It looks like there is a sand sorting operation going on by the generator. The base is probably selling sand. A lot of sand washes off the hills.”

And: “The usual piles of shredding in large bags are seen outside the shred room by the dumpsters.”

Isn’t it fun what we’ve learned, thanks to our anonymous drone pilot friend?

And we’re working on some expert help to identify what we can in our next video, coming soon.

In the meantime, we’ll leave you with this question.

Where’s Shelly?

 
——————–

Chris Shelton on ‘Scientology’

 
——————–

3D-UnbreakablePosted by Tony Ortega on September 8, 2016 at 07:00

E-mail tips and story ideas to tonyo94 AT gmail DOT com or follow us on Twitter. We post behind-the-scenes updates at our Facebook author page. After every new story we send out an alert to our e-mail list and our FB page.

Our book, The Unbreakable Miss Lovely: How the Church of Scientology tried to destroy Paulette Cooper, is on sale at Amazon in paperback and Kindle editions. We’ve posted photographs of Paulette and scenes from her life at a separate location. Reader Sookie put together a complete index. More information about the book, and our 2015 book tour, can also be found at the book’s dedicated page.

Learn about Scientology with our numerous series with experts…

BLOGGING DIANETICS: We read Scientology’s founding text cover to cover with the help of L.A. attorney and former church member Vance Woodward
UP THE BRIDGE: Claire Headley and Bruce Hines train us as Scientologists
GETTING OUR ETHICS IN: Jefferson Hawkins explains Scientology’s system of justice
SCIENTOLOGY MYTHBUSTING: Historian Jon Atack discusses key Scientology concepts

Other links: Shelly Miscavige, ten years gone | The Lisa McPherson story told in real time | The Cathriona White stories | The Leah Remini ‘Knowledge Reports’ | Hear audio of a Scientology excommunication | Scientology’s little day care of horrors | Whatever happened to Steve Fishman? | Felony charges for Scientology’s drug rehab scam | Why Scientology digs bomb-proof vaults in the desert | PZ Myers reads L. Ron Hubbard’s “A History of Man” | Scientology’s Master Spies | Scientology’s Private Dancer | The mystery of the richest Scientologist and his wayward sons | Scientology’s shocking mistreatment of the mentally ill | Scientology boasts about assistance from Google | The Underground Bunker’s Official Theme Song | The Underground Bunker FAQ

Our Guide to Alex Gibney’s film ‘Going Clear,’ and our pages about its principal figures…
Jason Beghe | Tom DeVocht | Sara Goldberg | Paul Haggis | Mark “Marty” Rathbun | Mike Rinder | Spanky Taylor | Hana Whitfield

 

Share Button
Print Friendly, PDF & Email
  • Roan

    In one of the hottest, driest areas of a drought-plagued hot, dry area: the Hemet deserts of Southern California, where are they getting all that water for those vast green acres of non-native lawns?!? >:( In Tustin, where I live we are on water rationing. This would probably be a good area for inquiry (and activism) with the public utilities in Hemet. The Asthmatic Dwarf needs to have his slave corps dig up the lawns and replace them with gravel and desert xeriscapes!

    • LongtimeLurker

      We are reliably informed they have a well.

      Xenuscapes.

      • Susan black

        Sometimes wells run dry.

        • LongtimeLurker

          Like the well of Scientology?

          Thats a good point. They should be investigated.

    • Juicer77

      I see your point, but Mismanage should let his slaves go home to their families and forget about the landscaping. Just let it revert to desert naturally.

  • Liberated

    O/T….Rachel Maddow is showing clips of Alex Jones and all of his conspiracy theories, there’s so many I lost count. He says Sandy Hook was staged by the government, no kid actually lost his-her life.

    This guy is certifiably crazy. He’s nuts, and has quite a following.
    Pretty scary. Now he talking about “lizard people” they’ve infiltrated our society and making plans w/the
    government.

    Don’t tell Dice, he’s always threatening to become lizard man.

      • Liberated

        Oh no, I didn’t know you could hear me so quickly.
        We can’t lose you to the lizard people, you’re too important to the bunker.

        I mean what if you start talking in lizard-ese, Meme wouldn’t like it either?
        Please don’t!

        • Meme is also an Alien Reptile as illustrated here F5
          btw: Marty should fact check David Icke from time to time j/k

          • Liberated

            You’re scaring me man.

            • he he… i am totally down on the ground and a supporter of the Objective world. So now you know when i am joking.

            • Missionary Kid

              What, you’re joking? πŸ˜€

            • And creepy… All at the same time… Ron did that to me. He

            • Missionary Kid

              πŸ™‚

    • LongtimeLurker

      That SOB (and others) are saying that all the sobbing, distraught survivors interviewed after Sandy Hook are paid actors.

      There are sites that claim to show the same actors at other shootings.

      If he really believes it, he’s an insane simpleton.

      If he doesn’t he’s evil.

      • It’s called an reenactment recycling

        • Todd Tomorrow

          Like an Adam Sandler movie I get it.

      • salin

        Not just crazy, but have spurred people to act on that belief, in inexplicably awful ways to cause on going pain to the grieving families and community.

        Bit of a read – but worth it. Former conspiracy theorist is a Sandy Hook parent whose child was murdered in the massacre. http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2016/09/the-sandy-hook-hoax.html

        Regardless of whether or not he believes it – he has wrought zealot action based on his stridency of the conspiracy theory that is unbelievably callous to the families of the victims.

        • LongtimeLurker

          Yeah, as Todd just pointed out, it’s adding insult to injury.

          As if they haven’t suffered enough, then they’re told that their tragedy never happened?

          Gleefully told it by a ratings-hound?

          It’s not okay.

          • salin

            Not only question whether happened, but (the grieving families) are portrayed as actors – who never had children .

            There are a couple of examples where “activists” have publicly demanded that specific parents “proved” that their child had really been born (show the birth certificate), and there were demands for evidence of remains (meaning dig up the remains and subject those remains to dna testing).

            Appalling requests by folks who adhere to extreme conspiracy theories. Why should grieving parents spend thousands of dollars to pay for ‘proof’ of their child’s death?

            Abhorrent harassment of families and a community in grief.

            • Frodis73

              to actually have the nerve to demand that these families comply with their wishes is just so beyond crazy. SMDH

        • Disturbing

        • Frodis73

          Wow, I can’t even imagine what that guy has gone through. I like that he fought back though. Those people make me want to tear my hair out.

      • Todd Tomorrow

        What a horror for the parent’s of those that lost their little sprogs. Insult to injury 10x.

        • LongtimeLurker

          Exactly TT. I couldn’t believe it.

          • Todd Tomorrow

            looney fucks.

      • Kim O’Brien

        oh my god

        • LongtimeLurker

          Yeah. Don’t think about it Kim. Bastards.

      • Robert Eckert

        The two are not mutually exclusive.

      • Juicer77

        The Conspiracy Skeptic podcast (Karl Mamer) did a great episode with Rich Orman, one of the prosecutors in the Colorado theater shooter case. He talks about these creeps who tell people their relatives are still alive because the shooting was a hoax. Great episode, worth a listen.

        • LongtimeLurker

          Thanks, will listen.

          Hopefully my head won’t explode from rage.

    • Todd Tomorrow

      He hangs out with Vivian clam Cubrik.

      • Liberated

        For real?

    • Ben Franklin

      The scary thing with Alex Jones is that he has so many followers who hang on to every word he utters as if it is the absolute truth. Most of his followers are very aggressive by the way. They are some of the most active relentless online trolls you’ll encounter.

      • iampissed

        Kool

        • I like Troll’s too, especially those from the Flat Earth communities

          • Ben Franklin

            A lot of Trump trolls are actually Alex Jones trolls

          • iampissed

            Yea it’s like playing with the concepts of game theory. Some come In soft and
            go crazy later…some just come in guns a blazing.

            • iampissed

              At least I gots chicken

          • Ben Franklin

            The problem with Alex Jones trolls is that there are a lot of them and they just take over or swamp the whole place and they don’t go away for a very very long time.

    • littlefish

      I learned recently that lizard people as a phrase began as a dogwhistle to neo-nazis in reference to perceived Jewish influence in politics and government that has been co-opted to mean actual lizards. I don’t know which idea is more outlandish.

      • Liberated

        I didn’t know that, but now that I’m thinking about it, sort of makes sense.
        Yes, both ideas are absurd.

  • LongtimeLurker

    OT

    Anyone know if there’s a specific link for Tony’s radio appearance yesterday?

    Or do I just have to fast forward through the whole show?

    • Sherbet

      I don’t see a podcast of yesterday’s show, only up to September 6.

      • LongtimeLurker

        Thanks. So when it does go up, it’ll be in one big chunk? The whole show, right?

        • Sherbet

          I’m not sure, but they might break up the show by hour, and Tony was on during the 7 p.m. hour (7:20-ish I think). I didn’t hear it, either, so I’m eager to hear the podcast.

          • LongtimeLurker

            That’s great to know. Thanks!

        • iampissed

          It will be the whole show…Tony is really good….REALLY, but he isn’t that
          well known…maybe someday.

          • LongtimeLurker

            Thx. Great stuff. I also want to hear the Scilons who called in.

  • Cosmo Pidgeon

    I’ve watched these videos a couple of times. It’s so eerie to me.

  • Todd Tomorrow

    Just knowing Vivian clam Cubrik can get you killed.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UoDKg8nHI1U

    • stanrogers

      See, if you forget to put on your tinfoil hat just one time, “they” can put thoughts like those in your head.

    • Missionary Kid

      There’s a lot of overlap between Alex Jones and Trump, even if they do disagree at times.

      • 9001

        That Trump shill Roger Stone is often on Alex Jones. Shamefully, they invaded the stage during The Young Turks show from the republican convention a few weeks ago. Cenk almost lost his cool! Alex Jones is a disgrace for pulling that shit. Not just crazy but rude too.

        • Missionary Kid

          Jones, I believe, was trying to show what a badass he is. He’s a jerk, and it was a publicity stunt.

  • Saint

    Sorry I’m late to the party, but isn’t “removal of a swamp” aka interfering with a wetland? I thought the US Army Corps care about that stuff. Permit? If not, I think the Corps doesn’t have any to give for violators…sorry if this already has been discussed.

    • Jimmy3

      They’re pretty good about complying with laws and ordinances. I’m sure it’s fine.

    • Juicer77

      If it was artificially created in the first place, perhaps not.

    • Missionary Kid

      The term swamp was an appellation, given by $cientologists. It probably was never a natural swamp.

      • Graham

        My guess is that it probably dried up of its own accord, along with all the former green grassy areas which are now brown and dead.

        • Susan black

          The so called swamp may have been a vernal pool. Vernal pools are low spots that temporarily fill with water. In spring they come alive with carpets of ephemerals like California poppies and lupines. There aren’t many left.

          • Graham

            Ah right. As in vernal equinox; spring.

  • Ella Raitch

    A few reflections on watching My Scientology Movie yesterday evening

    ACMI cinema capacity looked about 400-450 and was about 2/3 full. Most in the audience were 20-30. Overwhelming reaction was one of laughter, right from the opening where tweets are featured that warned of Louis of Scientology’s creepy, psycho behaviour. Like Going Clear, lots of internet footage here, from IAS events, the LRH death event, Larry Anderson training video (paraphrased – if after watching this video you decide you don’t want to join Scientology, then best go and kill yourself).

    The crowd really enjoyed Louis interaction with ‘filmers filming filmers’, especially the parts with Cathy Fraser and the dispute over where the private property begins and ends around Int base. Jeff Hawkins has the counterpoint that Cathy is a good person at heart. Andrew Perez is amazing. If there is an award category for best performance by an actor in a dramatic reenactment in a documenntary, he’d be a shoe-in. Amazing 1000 yard stare.

    The reenactments didn’t take up as much time as I expected, but were the parts I was really looking forward to seeing. DM in the Hole was devastating,and it was clear the performance affected the other actors involved for the short amount of time. Biggest laughs (apart from Scientologists making a doco about Louis, and Louis being completely unfazed), was for actors auditioning for Tom Cruise, reading lines from the 2004 medal of honour speech, from the part where he says KSW and ‘pfffft’. The film highlights one actor after another doing Tom Cruise onomatopoeia….hilarious (well, you had to be there) Marty…. It is not fair to make judgements based on a documentary like this because the filmmaker is using characters and their reactions to tell a story.

    It appears that the events are presented in the order they occurred (based on conversation and clothes, for example), but with only one viewing, I can’t be sure that events led to each other the way they were depicted. Marty appeared to be enjoying himself at the start, engaged and a little arrogant, and the audience response to Marty’s comments (around me) suggested they found him full of himself. The times Marty really has issue with Louis are when he is being asked about his behaviour as the cult enforcer (the circumstances are obviously more nuanced than I can record here). At this point in the film we have already seen TR bullbait exercises and examples of ‘tone 40’.

    In the 2nd exchange where MR gets annoyed (swearing etc) with Theroux, I admit I felt that Louis had been unfair, but my daughter (let’s call her Ellette – 21 y.o. Anthropology student; has seen Going Clear but is not familiar with all of the Marty drama) thought Marty’s reaction was over the top (her muttered response – to Marty – ‘ get over yourself’). It made me think about how deeply-immersed Scientologists can wear an emotion instantly – like a mask. And how they use strongly emotional behaviours to manipulate people (demonstrated by Cathy Fraser for example, ridiculing Louis to get him to ‘cave in’). I suspect Louis was seeing beyond the display. It makes me consider that we can’t be sure with Marty whether emotional behaviour is an authentic response or manipulative posturing he chooses for whatever reason; whether his blog represents his real feelings or a caricature; a less ironic OTVIIIisgrr8.

    One thing apparent from Marty’s appearance….he still has strong emotional…something…to Scientology. This in strong contrast to Marc Headley, Jeff Hawkins and Tom de Vocht (Tom in particular was adored by the audience…more fucks than a Jason Beghe interview). These three spoke with the authority of first hand experience, but with a demeanour that reflects past experience….Marty’s demeanour suggests more immediate, raw feelings. Ellette’s characterisation: he didn’t leave because of the appalling things that were happening, but because they were now happening to him. Big snickersnort from me to hear a ‘rue the day’ comment, aimed at Miscavige. Sorry Tony, only second hand threats for you. I will tweet the article about Marty denouncing the film to Julia Zamero (journo interviewing Theroux on his Australian speaking tour)…maybe Louis will respond?

    • Rita G

      Thanks for the review. I love hearing about the audience’s reaction!

      • Ella Raitch

        It was pretty clear most think it is a joke. As Tony mentioned in his review, Theroux didn’t cover disconnection, Narconon, CCHR etc so there was no sense of the wider abuses of Scientology

        • What’sup

          I was going to go tonight but I’ve had a bastard of a week,full of conflict and screaming in RL. I think I’ll just go to the rub a dub and catch it at the Luna next week.

          • LongtimeLurker

            You okay?

            Don’t answer if you’re not comfortable.

            • What’sup

              Hah I’m fine. Work problems, but between different companies on the same site. And I work for myself . Sometimes ya gotta stomp ya feet to get heard

          • Gertrudis

            “… go to the rub a dub …” That sounds fun and relaxing.

            What is it, exactly?

            • LongtimeLurker

              I think What’sup is AFK, so I’ll stick my nose in here.

              It’s rhyming slang for “the pub”.

            • Gertrudis

              Ah, rhyming slang, I get it …
              Not something you hear a lot of in the States.

            • LongtimeLurker

              It’s not as common in Australia as the UK (I think) but some do it.

            • Gertrudis

              Hmm. Seems like it (the rhyming) can get kind of complicated.

            • Rita G

              Thanks for clearing that up, I thought it meant taking a bath.

            • LongtimeLurker

              No worries me old China.

              It was no Barney Rubble.

            • Gertrudis

              The second one I know (from Don Cheadle’s character in Ocean’s Eleven doing an incredibly bad English accent): Barney Rubble = Trouble.

              “… me old China.” Is this another example? If so, translate please, if you don’t mind.

              Edit: nvm, Google was my friend, again. China = Plate = Mate. So, “me old mate.”
              Yeah, kinda complicated.

            • LongtimeLurker

              Of course.

              Well, they do this other thing to make it all even more confusing.

              They shorten the rhyme.

              So “china” is from “china plate”.

              Which rhymes with “mate”.

              And the “me old” part is just a weird English / Australian thing.

              You usually say it about things that aren’t actually old.

              Well done on “trouble” I’d forgotten about Cheadle’s character in that (do you think his accent is better or worse than Dick Van Dyke’s in Mary Poppins?)

            • Gertrudis

              Loved Dick Van Dyke in Mary Poppins! Besides, he was adorable, where Don Cheadle’s character was kind of strange. Cheadle’s was worse.

            • LongtimeLurker

              I agree. MP and Van Dyke are great.

            • Gertrudis

              “… taking a bath.” Or something …!
              Really, my imagination kind of ran wild for a moment!

            • 5 Feet Long and Luminous

              The only rhyming slang I know comes from Squeeze songs.

            • Gertrudis

              Could you give an example or two? The rhyming slang cracks me up — it’s so random.

            • 5 Feet Long and Luminous

              Cool For Cats was the song I was thinking of. But you can grab just about any early Squeeze song and find an example–they’re filled with London street slang (not necessarily rhyming slang, but it’s all jumbled in).

            • LongtimeLurker

              Who dat?

              I’ll look it up.

            • 5 Feet Long and Luminous
            • LongtimeLurker

              God, that’s embarrassing. Of course I know that song.

              Looks like I’ve been alive too long, and stuff is falling out of my brain.

            • 5 Feet Long and Luminous

              I’ll catch what falls out of your old brain, if you’ll catch what falls out of mine.

            • What’sup

              Haha “pub”, to the
              uninitiated that could sound like a brothel. That would be ” knock shop”

            • Scream Nevermore

              Have a good ruby first – that always cheers me up!

        • 5 Feet Long and Luminous

          Hmm, that’s one thing I do worry about with this film–that it’ll elicit a “point and laugh” reaction from most viewers whose general takeaway will be, “damn, that silly Tom Cruise space cult.” Although, I guess Going Clear already properly horrified people. I would just hate for the abuses, which are legion, to get lost in the laughter.

          • Susan black

            No one will forget going clear, it’s too sobering. But occasional comic relief is a good thing when confronting the horrors of dm’s con. Learn a little, get creeped out, then watch Louis’ doc for some good laffs at the little guy’s expense. Then back to the nasty stuff. Back and forth!

            • Gertrudis

              I agree, Susan. Plus, who knows what little thing will catch a person’s attention and make them curious, then lead them to do a little research, which leads them who knows where? I think that’s what lead a lot of us to the Bunker.
              The more questions asked, the better.

          • Ella Raitch

            Yep. I hope there will be more to take the stories up on the big and small screen

    • Dylan

      Thanks for sharing your opinions.

    • Qbird

      he didn’t leave because of the appalling things that were happening, but because they were now happening to him.

      This was my 1st impression as well while listening to his story years ago.

      How long was MR in the hole before he escaped? Not very long, if i recall.

      You enjoyed the film then, yes Ella?

      • Ella Raitch

        Yep. I’d love to see it again. You are right he wasn’t in the hole all that long (according to what was said in the film)

    • Missionary Kid

      You did excellent work in your commentary. I’m jealous, and pissed that I have to wait 4 months to see it. Tell Ellette that she’s got another admirer that’s some 13,000+ Km away. (I’m assuming you’re in Oz.)

      • Ella Raitch

        Was it her photo or her judgement that you’re talking about MK ;p

        • Missionary Kid

          What photo? I was talking about her judgement and the perspecacity of her comments. πŸ˜€

          • Ella Raitch

            I’m glad you realised I was teasing!

            • Missionary Kid

              What? You were teasing? πŸ˜€

              Tell her that you reported her comments, and she came off sounding great.

        • Missionary Kid

          I hadn’t seen the photo of Ellette until early this morning, on Tony’s 9/9/16 post. I’ll add cute to my assessment. πŸ™‚

          I’m no Donald Trump, so that isn’t a dirty old man comment. I’m at the stage where women under 40 are just kids to me.

          • Ella Raitch

            πŸ™‚

    • MaxSpaceman

      Ellette’s so right on the fact that ” he [Mark Rathbun] didn’t leave because of the appalling things that were happening, but because they were now happening to him.

      Marty Mark fled from the 2nd highest position in Scn. Fled the power and resources of Scn he had and had wielded as he wished, over 20 + years.

      A big, powerful executive, who was highly valued by many, many in a large organization.

      Now, he’s valued like any other putz trying to make it and keep a roof over the heads of his family.

      • Missionary Kid

        “Now, he’s valued like any other putz trying to make it and keep a roof over the heads of his family.” Well put. He doesn’t like living in the real world.

      • Juicer77

        But this is true of so many ex’s – willful blindness works until it gets personal. That’s human nature.
        I think you’re spot on – Rathbun is still seeking for some sort of power and influence. It’s sad.

        • Gertrudis

          Agreed. And I think it chaps his buttocks to see and hear Tony called “the world’s leading authority on Scientology,” and so on. He (Marty) wants to be the one people seek out.
          (edited for clarity)

          • Juicer77

            Without a doubt.

          • Cornelius Orowitz Bigot

            When reading Marty’s latest writings, i was thinking of the video Gerry Armstrong did, “An open letter to Chris Shelton”. A reading of “I. Me. Moi. Gerry Armstrong. Am the one and only true expert on Scientology!” Authority can be a drug hard to kick. Especially post the mind fuck supreme that is the church of Scientology. I’m not an ex Scientologist, which probably plays a big part in why i tend to not be too harsh on any ex member of a distructive cult and his strange or asshole-ish behaviour.

        • MaxSpaceman

          Juicer! Hi- hope all’s well.

          I lost your e-mail where you gave me the name of the co. that moved your loved ones to UK. I haven’t gone where I want to go yet and need the name and info. on that animal transport co. Please Mail me at max. spaceman @ yahoo . com or you have my e-mail acct. maybe still, so send it there? Thank you :-))

      • 5 Feet Long and Luminous

        I’m with Juicer–for most people, shot doesn’t get real until it gets personal. But that’s by design; the cult structure sets that up, so I don’t fault most ex scientologists for that. It’s what they do when they find out the truth that matters. Although, I do agree that Marty’s a special case. Given his unique position to cause harm when he was in, I think it’s fair to judge him differently.

        • Juicer77

          IMHO Rathbun is still causing a lot of harm by purposefully withholding information and making the critic community look like buffoons. Like it or not, he’s viewed as firmly in the critic camp by the general public, thanks to his blog and media appearances.
          I suppose the argument could be made that Mike Rinder is withholding information as well (re: allegedly criminal past activities on behalf of the Co$). But Rinder comes across as more repentant and does a good job with his blog sharing information. He’s also a very savyy PR person who knows when to keep silent or comment, vastly different from Rathbun. So perhaps Rinder’s public persona is much more palatable. I don’t know either of them personally.

    • Gertrudis

      Ella, thank you for your great description. It almost felt like being there!
      So kind of you to share this.

    • OOkpik

      Yay, Ella!

    • Juicer77

      Great report! Thanks!! The bit where Theroux asked Rathbun about his time as enforcer is CLASSIC Theroux. All of his shows have that “gotcha” moment where he brings out the Big Question Of The Episode. It’s what he does, and it’s incredibly effective. Obviously! I didn’t think it was unfair at all, and if Rathbun walked into the project having done *any* simple research, like watching some Theroux episodes, he would have known exactly what was coming.
      PS When Cathy gets in her car to leave after the harassment, and Theroux says, “You don’t have to go – you’re not trespassing!” had me HOWLING.

      • Ella Raitch

        It was the outraged reaction that made me think maybe the question – or at least the timing – was unfair (this after the harassment that included questions about ‘fostering’). This is an example of what I mean about being unsure about what is authentic and what is a mask. At this point, Theroux looked like he was waiting out a tantrum.

        • Gertrudis

          “… waiting out a tantrum.” Such an apt description!
          You are on fire tonight, Missy!

        • Juicer77

          Sometimes Rathbun’s tantrums can look made up. What he thinks readers/viewers will see as “righteous indignation,” perhaps? And he is an expert at twisting any situation to make him the martyr.

          • Gertrudis

            Still using his Scientology training, getting his TRs in …

    • 5 Feet Long and Luminous

      Thanks for that great review, Ella! Interesting to hear the crowd’s general reaction to Marty. So, we’re not the only ones who can see his hubris a mile away. I think your observation about his still having some attachment to scientology–or at least, nostalgia for his position of respect and power within scientology–is spot on. I can’t wait to see this film when it comes out in the States.

      Also, “more fucks than a Jason Beghe interview” should be a pull quote on the movie poster.

    • cdub

      Thanks Ella. Makes me want to see it even more.

    • 0tessa

      This I found significant: ‘… (not) because of the appalling things that were happening, but because they were now happening to him.’

      Edit: I just saw Spaceman’s comment. Sorry to double it.

    • Thanks. Very insightful.

    • flyonthewall

      Great review and insights, espec about Marty. Thnx!

  • Sejanus

    a drone surveilling drones…
    poetic

  • Missionary Kid
    • LongtimeLurker

      Aaaaaw, Gracie!

      Good work, pupper!

    • Juicer77

      Doggie dream job. πŸ™‚

    • 5 Feet Long and Luminous

      Wow, she’s gorgeous. My Corgi-terrier barkaholic would love to be Gracie’s backup. All he gets to herd are cats and squirrels.

      • littlefish

        My Corg is totally a barkaholic also – she’s 13 and as she’s getting senile she’s getting louder. She also is a chronic sock stealer and creates nests throughout the house.

        • 5 Feet Long and Luminous

          I am already in love with that sweet old face and her little sock nests. Corgis got some character!

    • littlefish

      Glacier is one of the most amazing places on earth and I highly suggest everyone get up there at some point in your life. I saw the northern lights for the first time last summer just west of glacier.

    • Juicer77

      That is amazing!! Real science! You can bet if DeadLRon had ever heard of such a thing, he would have claimed to invent it and worked it into the e-meter somehow. XD

      • I am glad he didn’t… what a mess it would have been

        • 9001

          What a MEST it would have been! πŸ™‚

  • Gertrudis

    Is it just me, or does Disqus seem especially ornery right about now?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SBClImpnfAg

    • Looks fine here. Must be OSA

    • LongtimeLurker

      Thank god, I thought it was me.

      It’s been hell for the past 2 or 3 hours for me.

  • Cornelius Orowitz Bigot

    I’m looking at this and thinking: those people playing soccer is a gift to any Scientologist claiming Int. is an ecclesiastical workers paradise. Dismissing anything ever filmed or written about the conditions there, in one fell swoop of cognitive dissonance. You can have that one for free, dear OSA worker. I just hope you don’t end up in that hell hole.

  • Mymy88

    As a new day dawns, after spending some time last night reading at another message board about recent events, I’ve realized even the scientology rabbit hole has rabbit holes that have rabbit holes. It’s like watching one of those horror movies where in the closing final 5 second scene, after the bad guy was finally killed, you see a hand raising out of the dirt above his grave. Aaaaaand then the credits role.

  • LongtimeLurker

    Yo, new post up.

  • cinfrance

    As you say Tony, Where’s Shelly?