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Scientology asks for psychiatric examination of Laura DeCrescenzo in forced-abortion lawsuit

Laura DeCrescenzo (center) with Marc and Claire Headley as word emerged that Scientology's motion for summary judgment had been defeated

Laura DeCrescenzo (center) with Marc and Claire Headley as word emerged that Scientology’s motion for summary judgment had been defeated

The Church of Scientology has already demonstrated that it will go to extraordinary lengths to fight and derail the lawsuit filed in 2009 by former Sea Org member Laura DeCrescenzo.

Just to contest an order to turn over evidence in the lawsuit, for example, Scientology filed multiple appeals — even petitioning the U.S. Supreme Court — but was ultimately forced to fork over the 18,000 pages of documentation which bolstered Laura’s case that she was manipulated as a child worker of the church, including being compelled to have an abortion at 17.

With that evidence in hand, Laura won a huge victory in October when Los Angeles Superior Court Judge Ronald Sohigian denied Scientology’s motion for summary judgment. Finally, after four years, Laura’s case was headed for trial. But now, Scientology, perhaps predictably, has attempted to throw up a new set of hurdles to prevent Laura’s evidence from being heard by a jury. And one of those hurdles is truly stunning.

While Judge Sohigian ruled on October 3 that Laura had proved there were facts in contention that justified a trial, he didn’t actually rule on some key statute-of-limitation issues in the case that need to be resolved.

So now both sides have each submitted proposed schedules for how they think things should go as the case moves toward a January 2015 trial date. Laura’s attorneys submitted a brief document in which they suggest all of the issues can be handled in a single, 30-day trial.

But Scientology is asking for multiple hearings, some of which would prevent Laura’s case from going to a jury. The church says it should get a shot at a second motion for summary judgment, for example. But perhaps most surprisingly, the Church of Scientology has asked that Laura DeCrescenzo submit to a psychiatric examination.

Yes, the organization that detests psychiatry with such fervor it has an entire front group, the Citizens Commission on Human Rights, devoted solely to attacking the psychiatric profession, has asked for a psych exam.

Such is the desperation Scientology will resort to in order to keep Laura’s disturbing evidence from getting to a jury.

We asked a member of our legal team to break down the legal briefs submitted by each side…

The church focuses on how many trials, motions, hearings, and depositions it intends to demand — in other words, how much money and distress it intends to force Laura to spend or endure. By contrast, Laura’s statement proposes one trial, but attaches 137 powerful undisputed facts which are taken from the discovery documents.

The church presents a long wish list of multiple, lengthy hearings, bench trials, and jury trials. It claims there must be many months before the first hearing because, for one reason, more discovery is needed since Laura may have “destroyed evidence” (spoliation of evidence) by deleting e-mails. To “prove” that she destroyed evidence, a snapshot of her Facebook page is attached in which Laura jokingly says she “weeded” out one of her e-mail accounts. (This appears to be more of a harassment tactic, and to show Laura her every move is being watched). It also claims the following is needed before the hearings:

— Document discovery concerning records relating to a crashed computer.

— Depositions of Christie Collbran, Shanon Kimoto, Laura’s employers and others.

— A psychiatric exam of Laura by court order, unless she voluntarily agrees to it.

The first hearing the church asks for is a hearing to address the ministerial exception and other First Amendment issues involving the court’s potential entanglement in determining issues of religious controversy, and “the defendants’ constitutionally-mandated immunity from intrusion into matters of religious doctrine or practice by the legal system.” The church argues that this hearing should set the ground rules for the trial on the merits and wants this hearing in February 2014.

The second hearing involves a second summary judgment motion the church intends to file to “address legal deficiencies” with certain of some of Laura’s claims (“such as torts not available under California law or as to which monetary damages are not an available remedy”), and whether the First Amendment ministerial exception mandates dismissal of some or all of Laura’s claims. The church wants a hearing on this motion before the equitable estoppel bench trial and it wants it to be held in May 2014. (I don’t see why the first hearing is necessary if the second hearing is essentially covering the same issues.)

Then the church wants a trial in September 2014, to last approximately ten days, on the equitable estoppel issue, i.e., whether the statute of limitations is extended because the church’s actions convinced Laura she could do nothing against it.

Lastly, the church wants the trial on the merits to be set for January 2015, to last 60 court days. The church also makes the point that there will be many pre-trial motions-in-limine (or other motion) hearings beyond the hearings/trials set out above.

This large number of requests by the church for hearings, motions, trials, new discovery, allegations of spoliation of evidence, etc., seems to be overkill. In fact, it seems like a very Miscavige-like response to Laura’s short brief. In that brief, Laura’s attorney requests one 30-day trial because it is “not practical for plaintiff to have to testify twice about her extensive history in the Church of Scientology, particularly as these subjects are deeply and painfully emotional for Plaintiff.” How like Miscavige to twist the knife, if one hearing is painful for Laura, to give her three or ten more. Then, give her the ultimate insult, (to Miscavige) make her undergo a psychiatric evaluation.

So after fighting for four years to prove that she didn’t file her lawsuit too late, and then proving that she has evidence and facts that deserve to be heard in front of a jury, now Laura learns that Scientology will argue that the lawsuit fails on First Amendment grounds.

We asked attorney Scott Pilutik for his thoughts on the filings.

Basically, Scientology is suggesting that they have First Amendment defenses that would, if successful, knock out the entire case, so it’s better to hear them first. But the thing is, Scientology has already made a lot of First Amendment arguments with respect to the statute of limitation issue, and they could probably be disposed of on the same or similar bases. But they’re going to say that the questions are different now, and Laura’s attorneys are likely going to say that, no, they’re effectively the same thing and a waste of money after having already exhaustively covering this terrain.

The First Amendment issues they’re going to raise in such a motion are the (1) ministerial exception defense, which I don’t think they’ve raised here yet but did successfully raise in the Headleys’ case. Basically, that Scientology could do whatever they wanted to Laura because she was a minister as a Sea Org member. One problem with this argument is that Laura was a minor for much of the time; and (2) & (3) the establishment clause and free exercise arguments; the former forbids judicial inquiry into the underlying claims because the courts are then impermissibly entangled in a religious controversy: and for the latter, Scientology can do whatever the hell it wants because it’s a religion.

Scientology is saying that such a motion is necessary because Laura’s theory of the case implicates Scientology’s beliefs, practices, etc., and it would therefore be prudent to set ground rules for the trial(s) in advance with respect to the First Amendment defenses Scientology will raise there. I can see a court permitting such a motion, but I don’t think they’ll be able to get the case dismissed.

Thanks for that analysis, Scott.

We’ll be fascinated to see how Sohigian — who made such an affirmative ruling on Laura’s evidence just two months ago — decides.

 
——————–

Posted by Tony Ortega on December 9, 2013 at 07:00

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  • Anonymous

    Reposted from an earlier thread:

    It is more than ironic that Scientology vilifies psychiatry for its poor handling of truly desperate mentally ill people, yet Scientology will not handle mentally ill people itself, as an organizational policy.

    It is sort of like a local fire department refusing to put out house fires while at the same time issuing press releases blaming the victims of house fires for poor safety practices.

    The fact is Scientology cannot handle mental illness.

    If it could, it would.

    After all, Scientology is one of the most money motivated organizations in the world, yet Scientology vilifies psychiatry for being money motivated.

    If the market for “crazy” is so big, why hasn’t Scientology entered that market and dominated it?

    • Mooser

      “The fact is Scientology cannot handle mental illness.”

      I know that you have a lot more experience and knowledge on the subject, and I will defer to it, but my impression is that it is mental healthiness that Scientology abhors.

      • Anonymous

        I assume you are being ironic, however my use of the term “handle” was in the sense of “solve”…not…”endure.”

        In that sense, Scientology cannot do anything effective about helping someone with mental illness.

        • Mooser

          “I assume you are being ironic,”

          Yes, I was, and I hope without giving offense. I’m just trying to get my MDR.

          • Anonymous

            I thought your comment was funny, although I did add an edit to the original post to prevent possible later confusion by others.

            As you know, sometimes it is impossible to differentiate between sarcasm and earnest belief on these boards.

            • Mooser

              “As you know, sometimes it is impossible to differentiate between sarcasm and earnest belief on these boards.”

              You said a mouthful, pard!

    • DamOTclese2

      David needs to have his fucking head examined.

      • Mooser

        I don’t know about that, but I sure would like to know, if any of the more legally knowledgeable, how close Davey might be to being ordered not to leave the States?
        He really doesn’t want to be around when serious questions start being asked about the one human being whose fate he cannot legally disclaim responsibility for.

        But let me state, in case I am offending anyone, that I firmly believe that Miscavige will show the same bravery in confronting his difficulties that L Ron Hubbard always did.

        • Robert Eckert

          LAPD is satisfied that Shelly is still alive. There appear to be no criminal cases being prepared against Miscavige personally, and civil lawsuits don’t raise the possibility of being ordered to surrender one’s passport.

          • Mooser

            Thanks, that seems pretty clear. Questions about the fate of his wife is the one thing he can’t continuously defer by throwing money at it. And the only thing which could immediately end his freedom.

            • MaxSpaceman

              No way, Jose. You’re on a long plank off a short pier.

              Michelle Miscavige is doing her job at CST in Crestline Calif. and has so attested to the LAPD. End of story.

            • OrangySky

              And assuming she’s alive and not a babbling idiot by now, if asked, I’m sure she’d say she’s happy with her job. And her husband sends her postcards once a year or so.

            • MaxSpaceman

              Michelle is a Kook-Aid drinker. Has to be. Like everyone in the Hole. Every single one of them knows if they swallow a mouthful of bleach a la Laura – or try any action like that – they are out out out.

              The *only* conclusion w/o more evidence/knowledge/witnesses is – they are all drinking the Kook-Aid and are there willingly. So they don’t lose “their eternity” for yazeus’s sake.

            • Mooser

              “Michelle Miscavige is doing her job at CST in Crestline Calif. and has so attested to the LAPD. End of story.”

              She has so attested? In that case, I shudder to think what your opinion of the plane-towing-banner-saying: “Where is Shelly Miscavige?” is. You must think, at the least, that it was completely gratuitous?

            • Mooser

              He went through all that effort and expense just to point out her absence from a Scientology ceremony?

            • Missionary Kid

              It was a missing persons report. It was not filed by a spouse or relative.

              All it would take is an attorney attesting to the fact that she is safe and doesn’t want to be bothered. As an officer of the court, his word would be good enough. The penalties would be very severe if he lied.

              No policeman would have to actually see her. What the attorney or some other $cion told her was going on could be something entirely different. An alternative might be a skype link interview. with someone attesting to the fact to the police that the person on the other end is Shelly. As long as she wasn’t in shackles, or visibly restrained, or obviously in ill health, that would satisfy any police officer.

              If a person wants to disappear from public view, they have the right, as long as there are no legal obligations that require them to be in public view.

              In spite of all the conspiracies that we all know Co$ is capable, LAPD did its legal duty, and somehow legally ascertained that she is not missing. Since it was not a spouse or close relative that filed the report, they’re not going any further.

              I know that we’d like to know more, but that would violate her right to privacy, and that’s a part of the law that Mosey is using against Co$ in her lawsuit.

              That being said, it would be a good idea to keep asking, “Where’s Shelly Miscavige?” because it upsets Dinky Dick Mi$cavige, and, hopefully Shelly might learn that people are concerned for her.

            • MaxSpaceman

              Not gratuitous, Moose.

              It’s good PR for the opposition! It’s to let the still-ins see it, mostly.

              *Everyone* out knows that the LAPD are satisfied that Michelle Miscavige is “where she says she is” to LAPD. “Doing what she wants to do” according to LAPD.

              So, you’re way off the mark believing ‘something is amiss’ with Michelle’s existence! and that that will be a huge pit for which Davey can fall into. Wayyyyyy offffff Moooossse.

              Just sayin. Way way way off.

          • Baby

            LAPD is satisfied..

            But we sure as hell ain’t!

          • HolyCash

            Any of the LAPD officials indicted and arrested one of the Shelly Says She’s just Super Busy detectives?

            http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-la-sheriffs-jails-indicted-20131209,0,2539880.story#axzz2n0qPb4SQ

            • Missionary Kid

              That’s not LAPD. That’s the LASD, completely different department. The PD is city, SD is county.

    • OrangySky

      LRH started out wanting to be a big mental health poohbah who would blow psychiatry out of the water. As many have said, Dianetics and everything to follow were in some ways “cut and paste” solutions based on other real scientist/research…but there were helpful elements in there. Immediately, LRH thought he’d get the seal of approval of the psych community and was furious when they dissed him big time. As far back as the Elizabeth Institute, people were having psychotic breaks from Dianetics auditing and that’s what drove some of LRH’s early supporters to turn against him…because he had no real interest in helping these people.

      Ultimately, LRH came to the conclusion that Scientology was to make “the able more able”…people in true need of psychiatric help were really “to be disposed of quietly and without sorrow.”

      • Anonymous

        That seems like a fairly good summary.

        The foundational book Dianetics is so full of venom towards both the medical and the mental health professions, that it really is not hard to understand why the very few members of those professions that cared to even consider the work, found it unworthy.

        Generally speaking when you begin a conversation with savage viewpoints towards someone, they do not respond with equanimity.

        Not sure why that simple idea was so foreign to Hubbard, the supposed “discoverer” of ARC.

        • Missionary Kid

          Hubbard was full of venom towards everyone and everything that didn’t point out and worship his {{superior intellect.}} He expected, in his own hubris, that scientists would immediately recognize his {research} as superior, in spite of the fact that he never published any peer reviewed papers.

          His misogyny and your use of the term venom brought to mind the book, Generation of Vipers which was popular in the 1940s. It was not about mothers in general, but about overprotected mothers who crippled their sons by “protecting” them from everything, hence really stunting them. Hubtard probably took that and piled on, expressing his bile towards mothers in general as well as women with his pregnancy stories.

          • Mooser

            One could substantiate that hypothesis by looking at Hubbard’s actions toward and relationship with his own mother.

            • Missionary Kid

              I’d have to guess at that one. My reaction goes all the way from him being a spoiled brat to his mother being a bitch. I tend to think he learned to manipulate the women around him quite early, so he didn’t respect them.

              He was an asshole.

          • Anonymous

            He does seem to have been a rather unpleasant ‘ol chap, yes?

            • Missionary Kid

              I get the feeling that once he had some success with the initial go-round with Dianetics, and he finally was pulling in some money with $cientology, that he figured that he was smarter than everyone else, because he could force his will on them. Whether it was legal or ethical to the rest of the world didn’t make any difference.

              If anyone questioned him, he played bully. IMO, the whole fair game policy grew out of his own insecurities. He’d learned that by attacking, he could bend people to his will. If you were fawning, you were rewarded, but if you questioned him, you were, at best, banned.

  • NeverIn

    Annnnnnnnd AGAIN it’s worse than I thought.

  • MaxSpaceman

    Still, can’t forget that Diariahetics/$cienloontology is a global seller. Fromm Black Rob @ WWP

    • Collin

      Anyone else notice the door looks like a clam?

      • Sherbet

        No, but I noticed the three white thetan clusters hanging on the wall.

        • Collin

          ha i love it , clusters in the flesh! or eh baloon

    • Robert Eckert

      sorry, can’t help myself…

      • joan nieman

        Oh Robert!!Damn that Big Hello!! It always made me cringe!

      • Baby

        Robbbbbbbbbbbert! Contain Thyself !

      • Interested

        Where is he? Has anyone heard from him?

        • OrangySky

          A moment of silence for Koki. I believe Tony sent him to his internet rest.

          • Mooser

            If I remember, Tony Ortega asked him to ease up on the big hello’s from “LRH’s Bulgravia”,
            But he proved incapable of doing so. Or maybe he just dried up and blew away.

            • Missionary Kid

              He did ease up on the Bulgravia sign off, and then turned to the less annoying avatar with that in it, but he just got flat out annoying with his posts. It’s at that point that Tony banned him.

            • stillgrace2

              My take: Koki was a one-trick-pony with her “Big Hellos” and when that was gone, so was she.

            • Missionary Kid

              He or she was from somewhere in the Balkans, so that seemed to stimulate (s)he into action. There were other times that discussions touche on that region that they really got interested. Something was off kilter, or they were quite young, IMO.

            • stillgrace2

              She posted some totally inappropriate crap videos (and remarks), and couldn’t keep track of her bullshit claims, yet insisted she wasn’t a liar, and blamed her keyboard. ffs

            • Missionary Kid

              Yeah, if you’re gonna bullshit as much as I do, you can’t blame the keyboard. There was also possibly a cultural, or mental, if not language problem.

          • Interested

            Tony is my MAN!

        • Jgg2012

          He has left his body.

          • Interested

            Chuckle

        • Eclipse-girl

          Koki has been gone for a while. Don’t know if there was any reason for his leaving.

          • stillgrace2

            One of her dodgy videos was deleted, along with her comment. It looked official, not like something she did herself.

            • Eclipse-girl

              TY, I tried to avoid Koki as much as possible.

            • Eclipse-girl

              TY for all the information

            • D.Y.G.

              She said she was banned. She came back with a sock and that comment was deleted as well.

            • Robert Eckert

              I saw what DYG saw also: a post by koki-something-something asking Tony if what she had done really required banning– that post quickly disappeared, answering that question.

        • tetloj

          He’s posting on ESMB

  • Synthia Fagen

    What? I can’t even sort out my own cognitive dissonance on this one.

    • DamOTclese2

      Scientology can help you with that!

      • Missionary Kid

        That’s cruel!!! πŸ˜‰

    • Ruby

      I know, right?!

  • HolyCash

    After a nap, I woke up thinking David Miscavige ordered his lawyers to demand a psychiatric evaluation in the Laura D. case. Must have been the pizza. Can you imagine anything so crazy?

    • Mooser

      “Must have been the pizza.”

      What was on it? An undigested bit of beef, a blot of mustard, a crumb of
      cheese, a fragment of an underdone potato? These things have been known to cause nocturnal effusions.

      • HolyCash

        clams and bologna

        • Mooser

          Of course, I should have known!

    • Free Minds, Free Hearts

      Of course not. That is ridiculous. They hate the psychs. You must have imagined it.

  • Mooser

    Is Miscavige in the US now?

    My intense study of Scientology Scripture leads me to believe that about now, when people are asking questions about the whereabouts of his wife (not to mention other stuff) is when it is traditional for a Scientology leader to take it on the lam. Why come back if there’s a possibility you can’t leave again? That boy is gone.

    • Anonymous

      He’s very ecclesiastical and oily.

      He may be hiding under a table somewhere.

      He can slip in and out of the country better that way.

      • DamOTclese2

        Or he could go hide with the other 8 million missing clams! Yeah! Under the refrigerator!

    • Eclipse-girl

      he was in Taiwan for the opening of the idle (M)orgue 2 days ago. he could be back by now.

      • Robert Eckert

        He might come back after Wednesday, if Waldrip does not order a deposition or find that he is personally a defendant in the Rathbun case. Until then I think he is keeping open the option of disappearing.

        • DamOTclese2

          Love to see a bench warrant issued for the violent sociopath. πŸ™‚ That would be eleventy million lulz.

          • Mooser

            It just hit me. Everything depends on who blows! Sooner, rather than later, the right person, who has direct knowledge of certain things will blow, and things will tilt even further against Miscavige.

        • joan nieman

          I think he must be in a state of paranoia all the time. If it escalates, he may just do that….vanish.

        • Mooser

          Maybe I don’t have this right, but wouldn’t the question he wants to avoid at any cost be “Sat Davey, how’s the Mrs.?”
          Isn’t it only a matter of time until word of her fate leaks out?

          • Mooser

            Has she been seen respiring lately? Composing?

        • OrangySky

          What? And miss New Year’s Eve? Who will give the speeches? Heber?

      • OrangySky

        Was there evidence he was in Taiwan?

        • shasha40

          Do shoops count as evidence ???

        • Eclipse-girl

          Thought I saw a picture of him on the screen over at WWP from Black Rob
          I know there was a taiwanese person on the screen.

          Nope. not there. darn it.

        • Aslansown

          Yes. Late last night or early this morning on yesterday’s post someone posted pictures of him.

  • Walter Mitty

    The true reason why Scientology asked for a psychiatrist. (picture – refresh)

    • D.Y.G.

      Botox, Juvederm, chemical peel. He’s going to need a facelift soon.

      • Great White Clam

        Juging from the color of that skin, hes going to need a liverlift MUCH sooner.

        • Rita Gregory

          Hard to tell if it’s spray tan or liver disease.

        • SopranoAscends

          Agreed. Another thing which catches me is that although his mouth is smiling, his eyes are not. Cover the face with your thumb, and see how uncomfortable he looks.

          • D.Y.G.

            That’s psychopathy for you. Imitated facial expressions never quite reach the eyes.

      • shasha40

        At this point he should really just get a brain transplant , preferably from a higher being than himself , like maybe an ameoba… Too high ?

    • Sarah James

      Only fair to ask for 5150 hold on David Miscavige.

  • kemist

    Totally OT, but I think I’ve found my hero via the google homepage :

    http://www.history.navy.mil/bios/hopper_grace.htm

    She lived in about the same time as LRoon, was also in the Navy, but was so totally awesome.

    • Robert Eckert

      Happy birthday Grace, even if you did invent COBOL!

      • ze moo

        COBOL is your friend, it has run banks and computer systems for the last 40 years. Why is it still used?? Because it works and you don’t have to spend huge bucks for Oracle certification! I salute you Grace Hopper and you didn’t shell Mexico…….

        • D.Y.G.

          COBOL was my favorite programming language to learn 30 years ago in high school.

        • Robert Eckert

          Yes, and some of those systems have COBOL programs that have been there for 40 years, patched by a dozen different hands as the requirements have changed, and some poor nebbish has to come in and figure out what is going on with it.

          • Mooser

            Were it not for poor nebbishes the world would fall apart. We all owe them a debt of gratitude.

            • Robert Eckert

              Thank you. I was such a nebbish, in an earlier life, when the COBOL programs I had to decipher could not have been more than two decades old, and the layerings of patches were no more complex than the average Mayan pyramid.

      • kemist

        Is the downvote because she invented COBOL ? πŸ™‚

        I think being among the first systems engineers to conceptualize compilers as a way to distance oneself from low-level machine language compensates more than enough for that.

      • John P.

        As an ex COBOL jock (only a year or two in a galaxy far, far away), I don’t look back too fondly on those years. On the other hand, she was able to get people to invest previously unheard of amounts for R&D to write a compiler for a syntactically nasty language that was able to run in 16kb or so of memory. An impressive achievement for 1954. I respect the hell out of her.

        Incidentally, the first computer bug is taped to a page of one of her lab notebooks, which is visible in the computer museum in the Smithsonian in Washington. It was a rather large moth that got into the wiring and caused an intermittent short. So she not only invented COBOL but also invented the term “bug” to describe a malfunction.

        • Robert Eckert

          Edison’s journals also mention bugs in his circuits. In most cases it is clear he is referring to literal insects (the warmth attracts moths etc.) but he may also have used “bug” metaphorically for subtle wiring errors. Grace Hopper was, however, the first to use it for software coding glitches.

    • HolyCash

      Can not find reference notes for Grace Hopper possibly having a meet up with Hubbard. Thought there was something there where he dissed her, but can’t find it. Her father was a Navy Rear Admiral.

      Was curious to find it because her first computer was called Mark I, then Mark II. Always wondered if that’s how Hubbard came to call his emeters Mark. Maybe better search sleuths can find?

      • Missionary Kid

        The terminology of Mark I, Mark II, etc., apparently were used by the military to designate different models of weapons. I believe the British were first to use the designation well before WWII. I strongly believe that neither Grace Hopper nor Hubturd came up with the Mark designation.

        In WWI, British and French aircraft carried model designations with roman numerals. I’m guessing that somebody started to call them Mark I, Mark II instead of saying “model number One, etc., and it stuck, but I don’t have any proof that the term was used that early.

        Could some of you people in the U.K. let us know if, for instance, when it was that the Brits started to use the term “Mark” before the model number?

        • HolyCash

          Thanks MK. Emeter as a weapon. Makes sense.

          • Missionary Kid

            The military used the designation for all sorts of things, I’m sure, from tents to trailers. It wasn’t just weapons. I didn’t even think of the e-meter as a weapon, but the way that Co$ uses it, it is.

            • HolyCash

              Originally for use as an aid for psychotherapists. Hubbard borrowed as in stole from Mathison, although he was a chiropractor. It does seem likely that the term -mark- is from his military experience.

            • Missionary Kid

              Yeah, he liked to play fake military, covering up the fact that he basically fucked up and, IMO, malingered for his entire career in the Navy. He did a lot of good for the war effort – for the Axis.

        • SopranoAscends

          I found a cool thing. There is an etymology dictionary online that is fun to play with…Seems “mark” is a pedestrian way of designating models, as suggested.

        • Graham

          Yes, it was common to label a piece of equipment as Mark 1, and then each update would be Mark II etc, usually designated with Roman numerals. The Spitfire for example went through many upgrades and variants, the last one being Mark XXIV.

          Jaguar Cars went through a phase of naming their large saloons as Jaguar Mark VIII, Mark IX, Mark X. .

    • 3feetback-of-COS

      That reminds me; I am sure I’m not the only one, but every time I see a picture of one of those Sea Org clowns or see one of them strutting around in person, it strikes me as an insult to those who served and risked their lives in the REAL Navy, not LRH’s Make-Believe-Navy.

    • Graham

      As a Rear-Admiral in a real navy she well out-ranks Captain Slappy in his own personal toy navy.

    • Cat Daddy

      The person who downvoted her can eat my shit

  • Rita Gregory

    The ecclesiastical leader of Scientology ordering a Psych evaluation is like the Pope ordering someone to have an abortion. I’m sure DMass will blame the cherch lawyers. Shouldn’t DMass fire them then?

    • Miss Tia

      I think DM should argue the case himself! πŸ™‚

      • HolyCash

        Thought he already was doing so.

        • Rita Gregory

          Bawahahahahahahaha!

          • HolyCash

            hahahaha. No, really!

            • Rita Gregory

              Yes. He might as well appoint himself officially. The court would love that.

        • Baby

          bawwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwhahhah EVERY SINGLE WORD

        • shasha40

          True , but we want to see him without the puppets ! I know they’re the same size , bjt …

      • Eclipse-girl

        That would be so funny. Please let the hearing be taped.

        • Miss Tia

          LIVE VIDEO FEED!!!!

          • Eclipse-girl

            From the RadarOn, I would be so honored if you thought anything I wrote was worthy of a tweet.

            ETA : It would need to be saved for posterity.

  • Mark

    A few helpful indications for judges and/or court-appointed shrinks dealing with $cientology and/or Shortarse Miscavige:

    • OrangySky

      Is that really a cardboard hanky?

      • Snippy_X

        or a supena in your pocket.

    • Nevermore

      His chin implant has moved…

      • Rita Gregory

        I think it moved onto Kirstie’s face.

        • Rita Gregory

          Yep. there it is!

  • DamOTclese2

    I’m infested with invisible murdered space aliens! Help me!

    • Mooser

      “I’m infested with invisible murdered space aliens! Help me!”

      A lung un leber oyf der noz Don’t worry about it until a pupick starts growing in your bellybutton.

    • Rita Gregory

      I hear DM is approving psych evals now, so it should be ok to get some help. πŸ˜‰

    • Don’t worry about the aliens! They come in peace.

      • Douglas D. Douglas

        I LOVED Mars Attacks…

    • Jgg2012

      hmm…if you did a triage, you might say she is beyond curable.

    • Guest

    • ShoopZ

      What the *H* is wrong with disqus?

      (picture – refresh)

      • Robert Eckert

        Puter thetans

      • Lurkness

        Wow. Kristy took center stage and took the theater curtains too.

  • InClearwater

    I want to repost my question from this morning, now buried under an avalanche of comments.

    Question for the lawyers: Is it typical to ask for a mental exam in a case like this?

    Like a few other commenters have said, I am aware of it being asked for in civil family law/domestic relations cases. I can imagine the scenario of a fender-bender plaintiff being asked to undergo a mental exam if they were claiming to have suffered psychological issues as a result of the car accident. But in this type of case, I am totally clueless and hope an attorney can answer my question.

    • Mooser

      Wouldn’t they have to state, or isn’t it implied, that they are trying to determine her mental state at a certain time? So are they trying to determine her mental state at 17, when the coercion occurred, or when she filed the suit? Or do they just hope to prove “the girl was always nuts”? It’s ridiculous.

      • InClearwater

        Excellent questions! I hope an attorney will address the timing issue as well.

        • Jgg2012

          Yes, for the purpose of determining damages, and its a bad idea for Co$–the shrink will not find any engrams or body thetans.

    • Graham

      I think what they are saying is that Laura is claiming psychiatric harm, therefore she needs to have a psychiatric examination. Makes me wonder if that was dreamed up by a wog lawyer, without realising the potential “scriptural” implications??

      • Mooser

        “I think what they are saying is that Laura is claiming psychiatric harm…”

        I think the psychiatric harm (is that term even mentioned?) is a subsidiary issue, a result of the main issue, which is that her rights were violated, that she was the victim of criminal or illegal conduct.

    • Davka

      So my caveats are that I am a non-practicing lawyer and I don’t remember all the particulars of the complaint. A litigator can correct me if I’ve missed something. That said, if Laura is alleging intentional infliction of emotional distress, from a legal perspective one could argue it appropriate for COS to have their own expert review evidence and Laura to potentially rebut the claim. Also, from a statute of limitations perspective, if part of Laura’s argument is PTSD and her cult-like mental state as to why she delayed filing, then evidence from the eval could go to that claim as well.

      I actually think this is legal strategy not originated by DM, but his team – he may approve it for other reasons, but I can see counsel putting together a “reasonable” justification for the request.

      • InClearwater

        Thank you!

        I was thinking this request for mental exam may be par for the course for wog lawyers not versed in the organization of Scientology’s, um, vehemence against psychology/psychiatry. Am now wondering if the request will need to be narrowed down as to the timing, per Mooser’s most excellent questions.

        And I have to wonder if DM approved of that being in the pleading or whether it slipped by him. Either way would be humorous.

      • Tory Christman

        $cientology proved they will use “The Mental Health System” any where, any time when they
        had underneath President_gack_Bush, the DAY of 9/11:
        “For mental health call 1 800 For Truth”…On Live TV!

        I was on the Net at the time and said “That’s the Dianetic Hotline!”
        Many of us called Fox news and it was immediately removed.
        (Note: Gretta VanSustren works for Fox news as a journalist and is an OT 8)

        So I’m not surprised they are *trying* to pitch this quackery (in their books) in
        re Laura. Hopefully the Judge will be able to see through their utter hypocritical
        actions of attempting to destroy psychiatry (CCHR), they feeling it is 100% evil,
        and they trying to use it on Laura.

        • Mooser

          But what on earth are they trying to prove with this. Are they prepared to prove that Laura became mentally ill or unstable after she left Scientology, and this suit was filed as a result of her mental incompetence? (She made the entire thing up, she was induced by lawyers to falsify things?) I mean where are they going with this? What bearing is it supposed to have?

          • Mooser

            ‘The bitch was crazy, and had it coming’ has really gone out of fashion as a legal defense. I’m surprised they didn’t include accusations of promiscuity, too.

          • Davka

            I’d think they’d want to prove she wasn’t harmed, at least for the statute of limitations claim, but honestly, I have no idea what the strategy is other than to have drawn out costly litigation in order to wear her down.

            • Mooser

              “is other than to have drawn out costly litigation”

              While Miscavige looks for a spot where he can hide out until the statute of limitations doesn’t blow over.

  • Bernie Headley

    OT, but several comments below suggest DM is out of the country, but my sooper sekrit spy network tell me he is in LA and was spotted on Hollywood Blvd shopping for Ecclesiastical supplies and later posing with Krusty.
    (refresh for pics)

    • Baby

      Bernie..hahahhaa… OH no you Didn’t Have the happiest of holidays and I will say Merry Christmas to you.. ( cause that is what I celebrate..) xo Baby

      • Robert Eckert

        The Headleys still have a hostage to extract before they can have the very happiest of holidays, but soon, I pray.

        • Baby

          Absolutely Robert.. I will light a candle for those still in right now! …

        • Bernie Headley

          Thanks for the reference! http://www.bernster.net/stephanieheadley.html
          I want my daughter back!

          • HolyCash

            No words. Only actions now. The spotlights are on and they are staying on. The legal heat is on and it is staying on. The stories are up and they are staying up.

          • aquaclara

            I hope it happens soon. Very soon.

      • Bernie Headley

        Absolutely! Merry Christmas to all!

  • DamOTclese2

    Mean while, Scientology’s shit bag collaborator Sheriff Lee Baca and his fascist gang Is Back In The News Again, and yet Baca himself has so far managed to avoid getting indicted right along side the rest of his fascist gang members.

    • Snippy_X

      for “misconduct in the county’s jails” … hmmmm. Do they funnel inmates to Narconon by any chance. What kind of car does Baca drive, btw?

      • Aslansown

        How about Crimanon?

        • Mooser

          There you go. “Criminon” is a Scientology front which seeks to involve law-enforcement personnel in the cult through ‘training’ courses.

          • Aslansown

            Sorry – I misspelled it. Yeah, I was just wondering if that’s in the jails.It looks lt looks like it’s a correspondence course for inmates. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criminon

      • DamOTclese2

        For a while their “Criminon” fake front was attempting to recruit criminals to come work for Scientology, they felt that getting criminals to join them would make it easier for them to use said criminals to commit crimes for them. I don’t know why the insane crooks ended their “Criminon” fake front.

        • Snippy_X

          Prisons track inmates after they leave to determine recidivism. Criminon can’t lie about their success rates the way Narconon can because of this. Criminon takes state money and is held accountable. As soon as they see inmates in the Criminon program do worse that those who don’t go near it, their funding gets cut and they get the boot. That is unless there are shady deals occurring with prison management that escape notice.

    • Sibs

      Just came back on to see if somebody posted it yet. The link I saw in the LA Times said the Sheriff’s Office is making some kind of official statement in a little bit.

  • Walter Mitty

    Do not confuse (picture – refresh) (By the way: Seen a good sitcom lately? Me neither. …)

    • Sarah James

      Sorry, still can’t tell them apart.

      • Jimmy Threetimes

        One is a drunken clown cartoon. The other is Krusty.

        • Bernie Headley

          Isn’t that redundant?

          • Jimmy Threetimes

            Perhaps. Though I vaguely recall an episode where Krusty cleans himself up.

        • Jgg2012

          Can Nancy Cartwright tell the difference?

      • Great White Clam

        The clowns eyes seem more alive…….

        • Great White Clam

          Wait. Their BOTH clowns.

          My bad.

          I should of said the clown with the blue bowties’ eyes look more alive.

    • Jgg2012

      Krusty is thinner

      • Minion Gayle

        And funnier.

    • Graham

      It’s the one on the left, yes? Kirstie’s the one on the left?

  • Great White Clam

    Looking at recent pics o David Miscavige he does NOT look to be in good physical health. I doubt the yellow orange skin could be mistaken for a healthy tan. Hes been spending too much time in the Van Allan Radiation belts?

    What about the off-white pus-colored whites of his eyes?

    WTF hes doing with his liver thetans?

    http://a.disquscdn.com/uploads/mediaembed/images/737/4793/original.jpg

    • Rita Gregory

      He feeds those liver thetans scotch and they love it.

    • Jgg2012

      Maybe he’s been eating too many clams.

  • Minion Gayle

    Wait. What? A “PSYCHIATRIC” examination? The evil psychs? Really?

  • valshifter

    why don’t we ask for a psychiatry test done on THEM. ?

  • Walter Mitty

    If Scientology is a religion – what is the theological role of Miscavige? (picture – refresh) Sorry: double picture…

    • Unex Skcus

      Good shoop, WM πŸ™‚

    • MaxSpaceman

      That’s very ‘artful’.
      Terrific, Walter M.
      You are expressing your artfullness in your expressingness of yourselfness !

    • OrangySky

      Wow, Walter. You are an artist!

  • mook
    • Sibs

      Wooooooo!

      • MaxSpaceman

        uhm… isn’t that supposed to be Wooo-Hooo !!

        • Sibs

          I always think of The Sims when I see “WooHoo”. I see that article’s comment section is infested with trolls (not surprising…)

          • Interested

            Ooo we must go there and tell them DM s asking to use a psych in a court case….. Entheta ….

    • Eclipse-girl

      some of us have been having fun there throughout the day.

  • Tory Christman

    Already posted, but for those who missed it:
    $cientology proved they will use “The Mental Health System” any where, any time when they
    had underneath President_gack_Bush, the DAY of 9/11:
    “For mental health call 1 800 For Truth”…On Live TV!

    I was on the Net at the time and said “That’s the Dianetic Hotline!”
    Many of us called Fox news and it was immediately removed.
    (Note: Gretta VanSustren works for Fox news as a journalist and is an OT 8)

    So I’m not surprised they are *trying* to pitch this quackery (in their books) in
    re Laura. Hopefully the Judge will be able to see through their utter hypocritical
    actions of attempting to destroy psychiatry (CCHR), they feeling it is 100% evil,
    and they trying to use it on Laura.

    • SopranoAscends

      “Fox,” “news,” and “journalist.” Lol. Yep. It seems a strange strategy, for sure.

    • aegerprimo

      Can’t wait to see your next video about the Co$ condoning psychiatry… well I hope you choose to take up that topic.
      Love you Tory and all you do!

  • I can’t wait to see the response from Laura’s attorneys. This is clearly an illegitimate last ditch effort to completely nuke Laura’s case before they are forced to settle.

    Whatever you were seeking in damages Laura, you should double it because they are getting desperate! πŸ™‚

    • Cat Daddy
      • Been busy. Plus I think I’m coming down with something. I’m not sure how because I haven’t been around that many groups of people, but I guess being at work is enough to get exposed. Ugh.

        • Graham

          Coming down with something? Not been reading all that secrit OT III crap have you? Watch out for the pneumonia!

          • Oh crap thanks for the reminder. I’ll report to Qual for a quick review and then to ethics for an immediate declare. Yay!

        • SandiCorrena

          Feel better!

          • Thank you πŸ™‚ Hey I don’t think I’m going to be able to make it to New Braunfels on Wednesday. Unfortunately, I have been placed in the precarious financial situation of either going to visit my family for Christmas or going to sit in on these court hearings. You can imagine what my choice will be. But I’ll make it a point to visit you. I’ve heard good things about H-Town.

            • SandiCorrena

              Oh I won’t be making it to New Braunfels either; of course you made the best choice!

            • Oh I know I did. I can’t wait to get back to Tyler. πŸ™‚ I’ve been having a blast reconnecting with family. Once the weather calms down and I don’t have to worry about being entombed in an icy death fog, I’ll try to make a trip to you. I need to visit the outlets in San Marcos too.

            • Robert Eckert

              I’m sure Mike Bennett (the videographer and “flying squirrel”) will be on hand to record as much as the court allows for our delectation.

            • Apparently according to Texas law you can request to video the hearing as long as it is within the Trial Judge’s parameters and the request is made no later than 5 weeks before the scheduled hearing date.

  • ShoopZ

    Off topic, but, am I the only one who finds the workings of Disqus about as unfathomable as Facebook’s privacy settings?

    • Rita Gregory

      Right there with you! I haven’t been able to link to the comments page on my nook color for days. So here I am on the PC again!

      • ShoopZ

        It’s driving me nuts! One minute a post is there, the next it’s somewhere else entirely…if I can even find it.

  • I think every Scientologist should be informed that their donation money is being used to pay a psychiatrist. I just sent an e-mail to my mom to let her know, not that she’ll care! Whatever the church does is law to these people!

    • MaxSpaceman

      *Both* your parents are still-ins?

      • My mom (52), dad (54), sister (25) and brother (19) are all still in the cult.

        • Eclipse-girl

          How young were your parents when they joined?

          Did all you sibs joins SO at age 13?

          Ignore if too personal

          • Only my brother and he was 17 when he joined. My sister is as vicious a person as my father so she was able to avoid being recruited. For some reason my dad made it a point to back her up when he wouldn’t do the same for me.

            My parents got into Scientology 22 years ago so my mom would have been 30 and my dad 32. I was 6 and my sister was 3. My brother was born two years later. He never had the opportunity to bond with my aunts and cousins like I did.

            • Eclipse-girl

              I am glad your extended family was there for you.

              You are know learning what it means to have a loving caring family.
              Your immediate family doesn’t sound very pleasant.

              If your brother wanted to escape, does he know how to contact you?

            • My extended family was not there for me, They thought I was dead. They are not “there for me” now either so to speak, rather we are reestablishing mutual and amicable bonds. I live alone and completely independent, as I have been for the last 1 1/2 years. I visit my extended family because I want to, not because I feel like I need them or they need me.

              I’ve had help in the last two years of my 22 year journey in and out of the cult. My friends were there as a support structure similar to a family, but at the same time it wasn’t like I cried on their shoulder all the time (in fact I never did that). They were reciprocal friendships, give and take, you know like a normal friendship is. I refused to let anyone burden themselves with my problems. I never took from them without giving in return–whether emotionally, materially or financially. Which I feel the phrase “being there for you” implies. For example, when I was living with a friend of mine for several months I paid them for letting me stay there–it wasn’t for free.

              I have received financial contributions from fellow Bunkerites for which I am infinitely grateful. Those contributions are symbolically and sentimentally large and very important to me but it wouldn’t be fair to myself or anyone else who’s offered assistance along the way to hang my hat on them. The same goes for the bonds of friendships which I forged in the fires of my own adversity and the resurgence of my familial relationships once I was able to cool off from those fires. They are a significant part of a powerful experience which was built on a foundation that I had to lay by myself. Forgive me for the cheesy metaphors but I thought they painted the picture I was looking for. Even when Tony told my story, he did it because I had the fortitude in everything that I was suffering at the time to reach out to him. I’m sure he can recount how nervous I was when I agreed to do it.

              None of that is meant to belittle the gestures of kindness, quiet solace, words of sympathy and encouragement I have received to date and hopefully will not be misconstrued in that way. What I am trying to say is there is a lot of pain, heartache and regret I have had to endure on my own and will forever have to carry with me. By the time I actually started to receive any kind of assistance from anyone, I had already passed through the most painful times and talked myself out of suicide more than once.
              —————————
              As far as my brother the thought hasn’t even crossed my mind. Unfortunately if any of my family wanted to escape I would have to defer them to someone else. I am not in a proper emotional or financial position to support them. I couldn’t trust them either. It was their decision to oust me not mine.

              It may seem unfortunate to some but I feel no obligation to help any one of those four. My mother and father hung me out to try at age 13. My sister repeated the act when I was 18. I did my best to stop my brother from joining but he chose to listen to my misguided parents against my advice.

              Frankly they all treated me like shit and while I don’t harbor a grudge I will not go out of my way to make their lives easier for them. They all have better resources than they ever afforded me. My mom and dad turned away their siblings and parents and my sister and brother turned their backs on me. They’ve made their bed and they’ll have to lie in it.

              My sister and brother may come around one day, but I am not going to drain my soul searching for a way to save them. If I feel capable of helping them when or if they ever do come around, I will do what I can. If I don’t then I won’t.

            • Cat Daddy

              They thought I was dead.

              How did that happen ?

            • Eclipse-girl

              I knew it was difficult; i did not realize how challenging it was for you.
              I am glad that you had friends who were there.
              Friends should be there for you, just as you would be there for them.

              You have spoken of the family gatherings, so I made an assumption . I made an ass of myself.

              You seem to have a incredible sense of integrity.

              Did you feel forced to join Sea Org? Sad. very sad.
              You have written of your father. I have no respect for that person.
              You have every right to define the boundaries you need.

              TY for sharing. I am sorry if I push the boundaries.

            • Oh no you’re fine. It’s just a very delicate subject and requires a lot of tact on my part. I want people to know they’ve helped but I also don’t want to give the credit away for something I’ve worked so hard for. I’d never say I did it all alone but at the same time no one put in more effort than I did and no one did it for me.

            • As far as the sea Org. I was 15. They had been working on me for a year and a half. They made me feel worthless and alone and I thought I had no other option. Was I forced? Yes. But I felt like I was doing what I had to.

        • MaxSpaceman

          Holy sh1t !!
          You are the only one who got out ?!?
          But you have family you recently visited, yes? so that helps, a little, I’d imagine, to have them as a source of, well, “family.!”

          • Yea I am the only one. I have Aunts, Uncles, Cousins and my widower grandfather and his soon-to-be-wife. Fortunately I have a lot of cousins so that does help fill the sibling void. My sister is just like my dad though, so my relationship with her was just as toxic as between my dad and I. Unfortunately my brother was relatively private up until he joined the Sea Org so I never got to know him very well. I think my parents made it a point to keep him and I from being friendly.

        • woodrose

          Many hugs. I’m so happy your aunt and cousins are family to you.

          It must have been so scary for you to leave the cult, knowing you’d lose your entire birth family. Really hard for me to fathom the courage it must have taken.

          I always look forward to your informative posts, one of the best parts of the Bunker. Thank you.

    • Cat Daddy

      You are so special and funny, Hey bro we Anons could have used you back in the day

      https://whyweprotest.net/community/attachments/o7vx6-jpg.210020/

  • Interested

    Yesterday on the tv guide site there was heavy discussion about KA. there was one “hershey” who was damn rude. so i did what some have said to do and threw him some questions.
    imagine my surprise to see he has answered me, but just check out the answer

    Interested Lifter1968 β€’ a day ago βˆ’
    . What about Lisa McPherson. Where is Shelly Miscavige, what are the top executives doing in the prison “the hole” how much money have you got saved for your old age? So many questions you should ask before you show yourself as an ignorant fool.
    9 1 β€’Editβ€’β€’Share β€Ί

    Lifter1968 Interested β€’ an hour ago βˆ’
    β€œDetectives met with Shelly Miscavige in person,” an LAPD source said “The investigation is completed and classified as unfounded.”

    Talk about the party line… Where was it stated that they actually saw Shelley? They said they talked to her. How? Skype? Or phone?

    His avatar is a body builder.. Hum… From his language yesterday he was an inconsequential rude bully. Oh wow.. Cognition! A troll!!!!!! ( more !! Or is that too much tone 40)

    • Eclipse-girl

      Lift1968 was a homophobic scientology apologist

      He tried to get me engaged today. I let him have the last word. I think his posts show his attitude.

      I flagged the ones that I found particularly offensive

      • Interested

        Good for you. I note that he took the reply button off. Don’t know how, but giggle he he he,) do know why.

    • HolyCash

      Send a link to the LADP massive indictment news today.

      • Interested

        Sorry don’t understand. I saw the Sherrif has serious problems.

        • HolyCash

          Try these.

          β€œOur investigation also found that these incidents did not take place in a vacuum β€” in fact, they demonstrated behavior that had become institutionalized,” the U.S. attorney in Los Angeles, Andre Birotte Jr., said in a statement.

          “The pattern of activity alleged in the obstruction of justice case shows how some members of the Sheriff’s Department considered themselves to be above the law. Instead of cooperating with the federal investigation to ensure that corrupt law enforcement officers would be brought to justice, the defendants in this case are accused of taking affirmative steps designed to ensure that light would not shine on illegal conduct that violated basic constitutional rights.”

          http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-sheriff-indicted-jail-misconduct-20131209,0,6914608.story#ixzz2n1H7WJOb

          http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-sheriff-indicted-jail-misconduct-20131209,0,6914608.story#axzz2n1GOY4Mt

          http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/12/09/la-inmate-abuse/3922305/

          • Anonymous

            One wonders if there will be an attempt to get one or more of these early indictees, to flip, plead guilty to a lessor charge, then help convict one or more higher ups.

            That is a fairly typical outcome of situations like this.

            • HolyCash

              Pandora’s Box comes to mind. Tip of the iceberg and all that. Already terms like pattern and systemic are thrown around. It is like Scientology abuses in that when one person buys his way out of consequences, cheating justice for a very long period, it grows like a cancer and devours itself. Hope this will be the beginning of an end to abuse by LAPD in that town.

            • ze moo

              Jail deputies have their own little world in the jail. The street officers have their own little world too, the two only get together at union meetings. Baca is trying to keep out of this mess, but it is one he ignored for years. One can hope the chickens have come home to roost.

            • Anonymous

              It’s the Sheriff’s office, not the LAPD, but I understand your point…

          • OrangySky

            I could have told them this in the ’90’s.

    • aegerprimo

      In case anyone lost the link to the TV Guide article, here it is…

      http://www.tvguide.com/news/kirstie-alley-leah-remini-1074382.aspx

  • SandiCorrena

    OT: my recruiter just phoned and said my offer of employment is coming, probably tomorrow, as soon as the President signs off-he was out with the flu but they expect him back tomorrow. So I’m still praying. In other the other shoe drops news because of miscalculation on my part my home/auto insurance was cancelled so I’m scrambling to get new ones in place-my God I look forward to breathing again.

    • Eclipse-girl

      YIPPEE !!!! GREAT NEWS

      I am very happy for you.

      (((HUGS)))

      • SandiCorrena

        I LOVE you guys; I’m sitting here sobbing because I’m sooooo scared and feel so very close to the end of my rope and you lift me up; thank you!

        • Eclipse-girl

          Do you need a little help before the first paycheck?

          Friends help Friends

        • HolyCash

          Remember, ropes are handy when you need to climb out of holes and quicksand and things. If they weren’t going to hire you, why in the world would they call you to tell you to just hang on another day?

          • SandiCorrena

            you’re right; I’m going to just keep repeating HolyCash is right, HolyCash is right!

            • HolyCash

              Hey, they love you, the really really love you.

        • OrangySky

          I think compassion is what Bunkerites have in common, even the crustier among us like Mooser, the Captain, etc.

    • Rita Gregory

      Yay! Maybe you’ll get a better rate on your home/auto insurance too!

      • SandiCorrena

        That would be nice!

    • OrangySky

      YAY!

    • IBBy

      what a blessing! such fantastic news, I’m so happy for you

      • SandiCorrena

        …and the recruiter said they absolutely loved me; that was SO good to hear. When my former employer eliminated our positions in January after a decade plus of service I never dreamed the job search would be so hard and littered with so many “were sorry but” rejections.

    • MaxSpaceman

      I hadn’t heard that Obama had the flu. Hope he gets back soon to sign off.
      Wow- a govt. job!!

      • SandiCorrena

        lol!

    • aquaclara

      Yay, yay, yay!!!!!! Great news!

    • Observer

      Great news!

    • Lurkness

      Awesome! Hope it works out soon!!!!

  • Steven Bensics

    Just posted a link to Kirstie Alley’s facebook page

  • Interested

    Got to sleep. Bless you all.

    • Eclipse-girl

      sleep well. sweet dreams

  • Cat Daddy

    My Ode to David Miscavige:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S1w8OQEcplY

  • Johnny Tank (Forever Autumn)

    Alexa update for Dec. 9: *refresh for image*

    Tony: US rank #15,538 – up 193 from yesterday.
    Scientology: US rank #34,730 – down 98 from yesterday.

    Difference: 19,192 – 291 more than yesterday.

  • LetsGetCoS

    Hi bunkmates. This is my second post, but I have a better
    user name now. In my first, I talked about the psychopathy of LRH and CoB, so
    I’m no troll. In fact, I am an attorney (retired) watching with some glee right
    now as CoS has opened an incredible can of worms by asking for the psych
    evaluation! They’ve brought into issue a whole treasure trove of damning
    evidence that discovery will now be able to unearth. I agree with others that
    such a dumb move legally had to have been demanded by CoB, because any competent
    lawyer, IMHO, would advise against that demand in this case given the inherent,
    glaring contradiction of CoS v. Psychiatry that will necessarily come to light.
    (Just loved that video clip of Davey on Psychiatry! Priceless!)

    I’m betting the judge will be plenty annoyed with the added barrage of
    frivolous filings lately, at least he darn well should be. But the battalion of
    pricey lawyers happily lapping from what’s so far been a bottomless trough of
    CoS cash are paid to do exactly what they’re doing, to obfuscate the merits of
    the case with ceaseless and tenuous filings. We all know the CoS offense as
    defense drill- suffocate the plaintiff by abusing the legal system. But calling
    for the psych eval here? Whaaa? Definitely not a bright move.

    Even more delightfully, the “leadership”, and Kirstie and Tommy and
    Johnny (and the rest of the dwindling celebrity defenders) are on a super
    scorching hot seat as the widespread bad press mounts and sworn affidavits
    against the syndicate from scores/hundreds of defectors pile up on the record,
    most notably those of former top-tier execs. How can it end up anything but
    badly for this cult when everything eventually plays out? Litigation may take
    an excruciatingly long time, but the bad publicity is mushrooming so swiftly
    that CoB is probably burying the money and planning his end-run disappearance
    as we speak.

    I confess, I am watching the implosion of CoS with voyeur eyes and
    schadenfreude, but I also recognize that at its core, the fight against CoS/CoB
    is literally about saving lives. I get it. Keep up the good work in educating
    others!!

    (And, don’t get angry here, just as a note, I’d like to see less swearing and
    mudslinging in reaction to the obvious trolls. It doesn’t win arguments, nor
    does it reflect well on the board itself. Like me, thousands of folks are
    directed here for info, and I’m afraid the comments section can seem like a
    scary place to visit, and it does the purpose of this site injustice when flame
    wars are so distracting. Just my view,)

    • Eclipse-girl

      Welcome. make yourself comfy.

      Laura has claimed psychological damage. It would be routine to request a psychiatric evaluation.

      • LetsGetCoS

        Thanks! I recognize why an eval is necessary, because her mental state is in issue. But her defense can make hay of the results regardless, because of the stance the CoS has about psychiatry and the fact she is alleging mental anguish as a result of CoS behavior. It’s just going more messy for CoS at this stage, I hope!

        • sugarplumfairy

          Me too.. I hope they’re hoisted on their own petard..

        • Eclipse-girl

          Another legal mind here is going to help. We constantly speculate. Welcome.

        • Zana

          That’s what occurred to me… That it would only incriminate Co$ more. At some point of all these very public law suits one would think that the FBI and the government are going to realize that Co$ is not a religion and only uses that as a camouflage. And that the cost to the taxpayers for all these costly trials and harassment actions are more thuggery than religion. Hope this opens the door to their religious status being revoked.

      • sugarplumfairy

        Routine for anyone except the entity who has publicly and repeatedly and ferociously denounced Psychiatry as an evil, manipulative and ineffective science..

        • Eclipse-girl

          If the lawyers didn’t request the eval, they would not be doing their due diligence.

    • Sandy

      I must send you a welcome sir. I rarely post myself but your opinions are most appreciated.

      • MaxSpaceman

        You shunt be such a rare bird, poster that is, Sandy.

      • SandiCorrena

        Max is right-there should always be a symphony of Sandy/Sandi’s… πŸ˜‰ Just saying! Nice to see you; stick around!

        • OrangySky

          I feel like John Travolta is about to break into song any minute now….

    • sugarplumfairy

      seconded, especially your last paragraph..

    • Carlos Rodriquez

      I very much agree with you about the comments perhaps needing a bit of chilling out. I would actually like to see trolls ignored completely — just say nothing at all. Also, I’m curious about commenters who feel compelled to post personal off-topic tidbits, i.e., need for sleep, job offers, etc. Why would anyone do that? Is this a chat room and not actually the comment section for an interesting article about the amazing Laura DeCrescenzo and her legal battle against the Co$. It’s so odd to me.
      Speaking of Laura: You have my admiration and respect. It must be very hard to keep up the fight against the many-tentacled monster.

      • Sibs

        I dunno, the personal comments are why I feel like I know so many of the commenters better than I actually do and make me feel more comfortable posting here. I mean, I understand not posting too many because it does derail the main focus of the article and discussion. But still.

      • Anonymous

        One of the reasons a troll does their trolling on a particular site like this one, is to make reading the comments so intolerable that the actual valuable information being shared is buried from view.

        The goal of a troll is to either get folks to respond directly to the troll with flames, or to flame among each other, so that the level of discord is so high that the general public avoids the site altogether.

        To put a reverse spin on Hubbard’s drivel, the fact that trolls come to this site is proof that the site is an effective source of true information abut Hubbard, Miscavige and Scientology.

        Ideally, all trolls would be simply ignored…no response whatsoever, good bad or indifferent. Ignoring them makes their footprint even more tiny and insignificant.

        (I will admit that every once in awhile I do not follow my own advice on this and almost always regret it later on.)

        Trolls get a stat for EVERY response they generate, regardless of whether or not they are smacked down via the response.

        They WIN if we respond at all. (See first paragraph above.)

        • OrangySky

          “To put a reverse spin on Hubbard’s drivel, the fact that trolls come to
          this site is proof that the site is an effective source of true
          information abut Hubbard, Miscavige and Scientology.”

          GASP! You’re saying that Trolls Amongst Us are a “Sign of Success”!!!

          • Anonymous

            Oh the double irony.

        • LetsGetCoS

          As you rightly point out, newcomers like me struggle sometimes to get to substantive and insightful comments when trolls are so able to disrupt the boards. I wish folks could just ignore these pesky sailors, and feel really bad for them that their minds have been so manipulated against their own self-interest. And I mean that, these trolls are really just victims of the tallest order!! So sad, really, when you think about it.

          • Zana

            Well said… “That their minds have been so manipulated against their own self interest.”

            Also I agree to ignore them… Resisting something only makes it stronger.

          • KJP in Portland

            Welcome!

            • Missionary Kid

              Hey, how was the first day? I hope it went well.

          • splog

            Disqus has a neat feature that can help filter out the rubbish – threads and sub-threads can be collapsed. Hover the mouse at the right margin on the same line as the posters name and date, click the grey dash. The post and it’s sub-thread collapse.

            I use this a lot myself on comments I’m not interested in, it makes Disqus somewhat manageable.

        • Bury_The_Nuts

          Well I hope the trolls can’t count posts that talk about trolls and not posting to trolls as stats.

          Because it they can, the math is running the trolls favor.

          • Captain Howdy

            Don’t ya know that marco and bill are standing in the way of serious intellectual discourse and information that could topple the evil empire? Get with the program girl!

            • Bury_The_Nuts

              Heh heh
              I guess we failed utterly in all that time they were gone?
              Damn, lost our chance!

            • Captain Howdy

              I gotta go, I’ve had a hard weekend πŸ™‚ and my favorite band, The Bedbugs, are on F-Troop.

            • Bury_The_Nuts

              Lol, you freakin kill me. Nite.

        • Captain Howdy

          All work and no play make for a dull read a la OCMB and ESMB.

      • Eclipse-girl

        We are a community. We share our problems and our successes. As this community has grown so have the number of those type of posts.

      • MaxSpaceman

        Well, it’s a commenting “community” so, over the course of huge time months upon months, all hours, late at night, early in the a.m., people start to care for one another, and the Bunker becomes, then, more that Radar Online or wherever else you may be used to commenting. See? Some becomes personal. And those who don’t like that simply ignore that.

        Which is what you can do from now on ! πŸ™‚

    • Anonymous

      Reposted from 12/06/13 on the http://www.johnpcapitalist.com site:

      “One craft of experts that will always have an open door for Scientology is the legal profession. Its almost hard to imagine a more lucrative client (than Scientology): virtually unlimited funds, a penchant for long term scorched earth legal battles, and a constantly churning engine of net new liability being created on a daily basis every time the client turns on the lights and delivers its “services.”

      • LetsGetCoS

        Amen! Except there do exist lawyers like myself who fought in the public interest at very little pay…. just saying…

        • Anonymous

          Yes, I am well aware…note avatar…

          • MaxSpaceman

            uhm, Anony?
            Is uhm you avatar like a famous lawyer that I should/might recognize? like uhm I’m confoosed.

            • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

              That’s Clarence Gideon, a drifter who tried to represent himself, and did quite poorly, which ultimately resulted in the supreme court decision holding that if you cannot afford an attorney, the court must provide you with one.

            • Anonymous

              Yes indeed…give that man (I assume) a cigar…

            • OrangySky

              Anonymous, you’re educating us with your avatar and we didn’t even know it!
              See, that is what I LOVE about the Bunker. People here are wicked smaaaaht.

            • Anonymous

              One never knows if people will make a connection about certain stuff…I assumed that sooner or later someone would call it out…and they did!

              FWIW…I looked you up some time ago…Maude…

            • DodoTheLaser

              “Each era finds an improvement in law for the benefit of mankind.” ~ Clarence Gideon

            • Anonymous

              IMHO – the Warren era of the Supreme Court was instrumental in setting the stage for much of the REAL civil liberties that Americans enjoy today. Decisions made during his tenure affected and extended the day to day experience of freedom to a huge number of individuals that had previously been considered outside the mainstream, and therefore not worthy of the same Constitutional protections afforded others. The Gideon decision was a landmark. We all owe a debt of gratitude to the people that supported the important principles that were ultimately decided in the Gideon case.

            • MaxSpaceman

              Jolly good show, Sir HTCB8 !!
              Thank you!

            • Captain Howdy

              Thanks. I thought it was Mr Peabody.

            • Robert Eckert

              I thought it was James Joyce.

    • OrangySky

      Welcome LGCOS! (Can I just call you “Get”? Or is that too familiar.) Nice comment. I agree with you about the swearing and mudslinging, though it’s hard to resist letting trolls know that we’re on to them. But in deference to My Girl Sherbet, I’m on a no-troll diet for now!

    • woodrose

      Agreed and seconded.

      I recently read the story of Tory’s escape from the cult. She was astounded that someone on the a.r.s thread was nice to her, while she was trolling on behalf of the OSA.

      We have a similar opportunity with SOS and others here, if we care to take it. We can be polite, respectful, and factual and possibly persuade another person to leave the cult! Or, we could persuade a still-in lurker. But I don’t think that hundreds of name-calling posts are going to have a positive impact.

      Troll posts, no matter how obnoxious, get totally lost and overwhelmed by positive information if they are just ignored and no one responds. Conversely, every time someone responds with a nasty obscene reply, the troll counts a ‘Win!’.

      Thus, it seems there are a couple of good ways to deal with a ‘troll post’.
      1. Ignore it. Don’t feed the trolls!
      or
      2. Smother the troll in kind, polite, factual information posts. Remember Tory!

      • MaxSpaceman

        At the same time, WoodR, when a troll comes on – especially if it’s a handle one doesn’t recognize – it’s *so* difficult not to just start *wailing* on the sumbitch!

        It’s an emotional, visceral action. It’s human. One just wants to smackdown the sumbitches !!

        But I know I know . . . and I and others too I’m certain do try to restrain from the smackdown. … but it’s just difficult sometimes. Alas . . .

        • woodrose

          Even when you know that a smackdown is *exactly* what the troll wants? Why give them the ‘wins’?

          You’re helping them get their stats up!! Why would you want to do that?

          Drive your local troll crazy: Ignore it!

          Help the local troll get out of the cult: Lure it out from under The Bridge with respect and kindness and truth.

          These options are also respectful of Tony’s playground, too.

          Remember the lurkers.

          • MaxSpaceman

            okay, okay.
            I will really try and be mature.
            And not let the sumbtiches win by making me wail on them.
            All right. Okay. Dang- I don’t like logic.

            • woodrose

              Sad I have but one upvote to give you. πŸ™‚

            • MaxSpaceman

              is it okay to ‘at least’ downvote the sumbitch?!?
              That’s okay, right? Yes !?!?

            • Rita Gregory

              I’ll wager down votes count as a stat.

            • OrangySky

              Oh, that makes sense! Just like we LOVE our downvotes!

              IGNORE tech – that’s the ticket. Will try and control my downvote finger!

            • woodrose

              IGNORE tech.

              LOL Love it, in a down the rabbithole kinda way.

              Poor ‘tech’ should sue Hubbard for word abuse.

            • OrangySky

              “Tech” the way that Scilons use it is one of my most nausea-inducing Scientology pet peeves.

              techΒ·nolΒ·oΒ·gy
              noun: technology; plural noun: technologies

              1. the application of scientific knowledge for practical purposes, esp. in industry.
              “advances in computer technology”
              2. machinery and equipment developed from the application of scientific knowledge.
              3. the branch of knowledge dealing with engineering or applied sciences.

              Scientologists would argue that Scientology fits this bill. But there is ABSOLUTELY NO REAL SCIENCE in Scientology (except for that which Ron stole.)

              End of rant. Good night.

            • Rita Gregory

              We should ask Tory.

            • Robert Eckert

              I don’t believe ars or other boards existing when Tory was working for Yaude had a way of expressing “down-arrow”

            • Rita Gregory

              Thank you sir. I wonder if any more recent ex’es would know?

            • Robert Eckert

              Maybe Geir Isene?

            • woodrose

              I have no objections to downvotes, because they don’t impact the readability of the thread.

              Rita may well be right, tho, and they count toward stats. Depriving SOS of the opportunity to get upstat here would send him elsewhere to make his ridiculous stats. Something to consider.

        • SandiCorrena

          It IS hard especially when someone is being ugly to someone; that protection gear just wants to kick in; I remember Turtlez (whatever his name was) on VV almost gave me a stroke and a hemmorage….

          • Robert Eckert

            Tory believes that Turtlez was her old boss Bill Yaude and that our recent “friend” is also.

            • SandiCorrena

              It’s a small world isn’t it!

        • KJP in Portland

          We’ve been through just ‘a few’ eh?

      • OrangySky

        Yeah, but we’re not going to persuade SoS of anything. S/he’s been here a while. I think s/he is more than one bot, in fact.
        I believe ignoring and going on with the conversation is the best remedy, though I’m as guilty as anyone of engaging and trying to point out the Trolls’ ridiculousness (and ineffectiveness) to them. But Sherb is right.

        I would vote, keep the conversation going.

        In fact, I would vote, make note of where the Troll disrupts. And turn up the volume on that topic. The Troll will have to do SOME reading to find out where to post.

        And thus is educated by default if s/he so chooses.

        I do like the way Derek and those who were once inside handle Trolls. To me they have the moral high ground.

    • aegerprimo

      Hello LetsGetCoS – Great to have an attorney here to add educated and experienced insight to the Co$ court cases that are being followed here at the Underground Bunker!

      • OrangySky

        Yes, we love Legal Eagles!

      • LetsGetCoS

        Thanks but my law is rusty and I wasn’t a litigator. Still surprises me about CoS legal tactics, though. But it’s an unprecedented set of facts and questions of law (1st Amend., etc.)

        • Eclipse-girl

          Our speculations is that the lawyers can not control David.

    • Bury_The_Nuts

      Welcome to you and find a comfy place to sit. And I will apologize for all the cringing you will be doing in the future thanks to me and a few of the other regulars (and not so regular).
      I don’t plan on changing one fucking word of what I say here or how I say it.
      That is just the way it is…and no, I am not angry in the least.

      I just don’t take advice unless I damn well feel like it.

      So, with that said…..did you bring Doritos?

      • Rita Gregory

        I hope they bring Cool Ranch ones!

      • LetsGetCoS

        Lol. A bowl of fresh trail mix! The fireworks show should keep getting better—such a shame so many lives are getting blown up in the process.

        • Bury_The_Nuts

          Are there lots of raisins in the trail mix? I like raisins.
          And yes, there is a whole lot of shame to go around in Scientology.
          Too bad David Miscavige is incapable of feeling any.

    • Missionary Kid

      I tend to be profane, but not in my jousting with trolls. I do, sometimes indulge in ad hominem attacks, but I try to shy away from them. It’s ironic, but the members & former members of the {Church} of $cientology seem to indulge in a lot of it, and profanity seems to run from the top down. BTW, I came up with the sarcasm brackets a while ago, and the Bunkaroos used them, { and } for a while, but it’s now not used much.

      The trolls that drop in love to incite people to anger. I just keep insulting $cientology, its leaders, and celebrities with the facts of the cult’s idiotic moves, insincerity, and hypocrisy.

    • PreferToBeAnon2

      Glad you posted! Welcome!

    • splog

      I have a question for the retired attorney.

      I imagine there’s a process where courts can curtail people who waste the court’s time with frivolous and vexatious filings. What are the rules about this, what does it take before a judge can correctly call enough and slap a few wrists?

      I understand this is a complex question with many factors, so no easy one-shot answer. But I can’t believe that people can essentially troll the court with dross forever and the court itself is powerless to stop it.

  • Nevermore
    • Eclipse-girl

      Mike Rinder’s post today was about Ryan

    • OT8squared

      There is a line in Farenheit 451 about a salamander devouring his tail, thus consuming himself. So many top people have been harassed and abused to the point of leaving that scientology has become its own worst enemy.

  • Miss Tia

    Did some tweeting….i don’t usually tweet in the evening…perhaps in the morning i be more ‘routine’ like! πŸ™‚

    So @scientology wants Laura DeCrescenzo to have a PSYCHIATRIC exam in her lawsuit against them! Suddenly psychiatry is okay with them?

    I guess @scientology doesn’t realize that if Laura DeCrescenzo does have a psych exam it’ll only VALIDATE her claims & make them look worse!

    Since @scientology seems to be okay with psychiatry now, will their front group @CCHR which is against psychs, start attacking the CO$?

    Is @scientology going to take down their revisionist history display about how they claim psychiatrists caused the holocausts?

    If @scientology STILL claims psychs are evil, then why order a psych exam? If they admit they want to torture Laura more, major foot nuke!

    Why does @scientology & @cchr ignore the fact the LRH BEGGED the VA for psych help in 1947? Better & easier to believe the fake bio he made?

    Who is @scientology gonna request to do their psych exam if it’s granted? I bet they’ll suggest @TomCruise cuz he knows the history of it.

    Speaking of that glib @tomcruise could @TODAYshow get him back on & ask him about the @scientology slaves he had working 4 him paid by CO$.

    Could maybe Mr. Lauer @TODAYshow ask @tomcruise if he knows the definition of inurement & if not have an IRS official standing by? #TaxCheat

    Did you know @kirstiealley that @scientology is apparently OK with psychiatry now? So you can go get the help you need w/o shame from CO$!

    Hey @JennaElfman @scientology seems 2 B OK with psychiatry now U should go get some help cuz screaming ’bout raping babies is a little off!

    Who buys UR twitter followers @kirstiealley? @scientology? @tvland? YOU? @organicliaison? (which is U & CO$) http://socialnewsdaily.com/17305/get-twitter-followers-buying-fake-followers-will-will/

    If U weren’t defending the indefensible & realized what @scientology was doing, U wouldn’t have to buy ‘friends’ or followers @kirstiealley

    I truly have hope U will get out of @scientology & I believe you’ll do what U did after U got off drugs, apologize. @kirstiealley #Never2L8

    What kind of ‘humanitarian’ acts have @scientology OTs done to get those Humanitarian awards? Donating to COB’s slush fund doesn’t count!

    In @scientology U donate lots of money & they consider U a ‘humanitarian’. That’s it, just give COB lots of money to put in his slush fund.

    In the REAL world a REAL humanitarian helps people and makes their lives better, not contributing to a crooks slush fund @scientology

    • OT8squared

      Since the Citizens Commission on Human Rights believes psychiatry is evil, maybe they can stand up and fight for Ms. DeCrescenzo. If you want to report this egregious human rights violation to them, here is the contact page: http://www.cchr.org/contact.html

      I wonder if they’ll take up the cause?

      • Miss Tia

        OMFG!! That’s a devilish idea!!! πŸ™‚

        • hansje brinker

          In Amsterdam the CoS earns money on the psychs because the new building they have bought (Idle Org, that must be kept a secret) a tenant is a mental instituut to help people with emotional problems……..

          • Miss Tia

            WHOA! REALLY?!?!

            • hansje brinker

              Yes it is real. But it is by “accident”. When they bought the building this year, this company did already rented some office-space.
              But this could be the reason why CoS Amsterdam keeps it secret for the outside world.
              Perhaps this is something for a twitter?

            • Miss Tia

              Yes, I believe it is!!! Is there an address for the Amsterdam CoS building? Or the mental health place? I mean some public factual tidbit I could rely upon for a tweet? That is awesome material for a tweet! πŸ™‚

            • hansje brinker

              The adress is: Wibautstraat 112-128 Amsterdam.

            • Miss Tia

              THANK YOU!!!!

      • Great White Clam

        Dox on any and all of the comm with the CCHR clam front group on this issue would be a pulse+++++++

    • Rita Gregory

      Some of these would be great “troll fighter” quotes!

      • Miss Tia

        Use them as troll fighter quotes all you want! πŸ™‚

    • Carlos Rodriquez

      Awesome job! ^^^^^^^^^

      • Miss Tia

        Thanks! πŸ™‚

    • SandiCorrena

      LOVE THIS ONE: “If U weren’t defending the indefensible & realized what @scientology was doing, U wouldn’t have to buy ‘friends’ or followers @kirstiealley”. Love them all but this one especially!

  • Michael Hobson

    I can say with high certainty that the true purpose of this psychiatric exam his lawyers are asking for is so that David “Darth Midget” Miscavige can discredit anything Laura DeCrescenzo says as “psychiatric implants” to the sheeple membership. If one wishes to understand the more crazy-seeming things the D.M. has his lawyers do, consider them solely in the light of him trying to defend his PR image as that is the only thing meaningful to him at all, besides his income stream.

    Michael A. Hobson
    Independent Scientologist

    • OrangySky

      Interesting, Michael.

    • Walter Mitty

      WELCOME in the bunker Michael. If you want to tell your story or your inside opinions – we are listening.

      • Bury_The_Nuts

        Oy vey…………face in both palms!

        • Walter Mitty

          Why?

          • Cat Daddy
          • Robert Eckert

            We know Michael Hobson from way back. An enemy of the {church} certainly, but still a true believer in Scientology. He is welcome here, but you asked him to give all his opinions– you might regret that if he actually started answering that.

            • Walter Mitty

              Thank you Robert for the information. I did not know that. The reason for my answer is that I respect his openess, because he clearly says he is an Independent. No lying – thatΒ΄s good. And I believe itΒ΄s better, when we talk to each other.

            • OrangySky

              Michael has always been open about his beliefs. Which I appreciate. And personally I have no problem with full out Indies coming here and posting, if they dare. They might learn a thing or two – which is why I think they tend to avoid us (we post bad stuff about Hubbard, etc…we “just don’t understand” the “tech” which is why we are anti-Scientology, etc. etc.) I would hope they would continue to face the honest facts if they are serious about their spiritual evolution. Personally I’m not one to disbelieve someone’s subjective declaration if they say their “tech” helped them, etc. I would only challenge someone who posted here who argued something clearly not factual – “LRH was wounded in the war,” “The tone scale is scientific and tested,” or some such. I also would object to someone of any faith or belief system who tried to proselytize me.

            • Robert Eckert

              Yes it is better when we talk to each other, but maybe better if we stay off subjects that are likely to lead to pointless circular arguments. There are plenty of subjects where Michael and the rest of us can be agreeable.

          • Bury_The_Nuts

            He’s alright. Robert explained it perfectly.

        • Captain Howdy

          Ha-Ha-Ha.. ho-ho-ho.. hee-hee-hee-ha-ho

          • aegerprimo

            and a couple of…. tra-la-las

        • Rita Gregory

          Ooooooooh.

    • Anonymous

      Of course, all the psychiatrist has to do is ask a few simple questions about the auditor’s in Laura’s PC folders, especially any of the stuff from her “past lives” and off-planet whole track recalls while under the Scientology ether, and…well…gee…I think the outcome of that exam is sort of a foregone conclusion.

      Then the professional liars at Scientology can claim that Laura is “nuts” because she actually believed what Hubbard wrote.

  • Sibs

    So apparently we are an organized group of extremists, according to 6dog on Radar.

    1. I’ve never seen so many trolls all at once. Did Radar’s headline strike a nerve or what? (“OH NO! NOT TOM CRUISE!”)

    2. … God, I can’t help myself! I keep checking back and commenting even though I know we shouldn’t feed the trolls! I think the extremist comment just made me laugh so hard.

    Okay, I’m gonna try to ignore my internet browser and get some work done, maybe that’ll help.

    • DamOTclese2

      If critics are “extremists,” then so are the law enforcement, Judges, District Attorneys, human rights organizations and other agencies and citizens that opposes Scientology’s crimes and human rights abuses. Yeah, almost 7 billion of us “extremists” now. Yep.

    • Eclipse-girl

      Some of the people who took offense are not trolls IMO

      Oona is just a tom cruise fanatic, and can not stand any criticism of her man

      TeamMe sounds like a narcissist. Not found of her, but her comments are open. S/he only erased one post. Had a lot of troll behavior. Have not read through hher / his posts.

      6Dog absolutely is a troll.

      SSC only posts on Radar. Only has been active on Kirstie and Tom articles. Got them to admit that the “organization” may be guilty of committing crimes

      • Sibs

        Aaaagh, I fell asleep (it was an accident caused by lack of sleep and will not happen again) and woke up and saw that TeamMe replied to me. After I decided that I was gonna ignore Radar. Aaaaaaaaaaaah, the temptation!

        • Eclipse-girl

          We are NOT the RPF. get the sleep you need.

          • Sibs

            Tis all good, I had to do some things before my dad landed and I just talked to him so… yeah, I’m good now.

      • IASREG

        Somehow I think TeamMe is FLUNK101.

        TeamMe
        stillgrace2
        β€’
        an hour ago

        TeamMe NEVER posts as Guest and
        stillgrace2 is still ungracefully butting into conversations with
        nothing intelligent to say while he eats his cheetos off his fat belly
        and watches porn cause no one wants him.

        FLUNKISH? TeamMe indeed did post and then change to Guest.

        • Eclipse-girl

          NO. I think TeamMe is a self absorbed woman who was pissed that the comments were overwhelming her with anti-sci-lon tech. She is a celeb watcher and perhaps thinks Tom Cruise is “da man.”

          Flunk would be abusive and never apologize. TeamMe apologized to me.

          • IASREG

            I think TeamMe is one of several socks being run at the same time by the same person who also posts over here with several socks. It is conversing with itself.

        • Charlotte

          A post from TeamMe to me changed to guest when he/she deleted it, but TeamMe told me they were going to do it and explained why.
          That said, I’m not up with who’s a troll or not and you may be correct. I try to be polite as much as possible, possibly to the point of nausea. Probably because I’m a sarcastic bitch IRL.

        • stillgrace2

          Jeez Louise, that wasn’t worth repeating!! ; )

        • stillgrace2

          After going back and reading some “TeamMe” lies, you might be right. The lie that “she’s” tangled with me before is totally untrue. I went back through the entire thread and I found no comments where I insulted “her”. I challenged “her” and anyone else to do the same search and find anything amiss. What a loon.

      • Missionary Kid

        With SSC, I just kept repeating facts about Co$ that they couldn’t refute. Every time that they replied, I’d hit them with one more. They quit after a while, because they figured out that I’d expose more entheta, as well as bad stuff about TC and KA.

        • Eclipse-girl

          Right way to handle SSC, IMHO.

          Was shocked to learn of the psych eval.

          • Missionary Kid

            The psyche evaluation request definitely is something to cause a little problem with cognitive dissonance. We’re laughing at the conflict, but the clams will be getting the blowback from the move. I’m sure that Mi$cavige figured that he had everyone in the cocoon of Clamworld, and they wouldn’t find out.

            FOOTBULLET!!! DM is the best SP that there is. TC is second, and Kirstie is #3. The cult is being hoisted on it’s own petard of celebrity at this point.

            Here’s a protest sign: $cientology filed for a psych evaluation of an SP

            I’m sure someone can come up with a better one.

    • Suzy

      I believe he called us a disorganized organized group, whose name shall not be spoken

      • Eclipse-girl

        I like that. we are the disorganized organized group, whose name shall not be spoken

        • Miss Tia

          So wait, we’re a secret disorganized organized group?! Do I need a password?! DAFUQ?!

          • Eclipse-girl

            That is a good password.

            You were present for a while at RadarOnline.

            We have been accused of being a secret group.

            TeamMe was jumped on pretty hard. I think she was overwhelmed by all the anti-scientology comments.

            6Dog came on late. Very much like a troll. Also accused us of being a group, and even implied that I controlled it.

            TeamMe and I had made peace. 6Dog came in and tried to start it up again (Troll / Yaude behavior) We were able to get beyond it

            Someone started the Anon words of “we are legion.” 6Dog then called us “legion.”

            Oona is just a Tom Cruise Fanatic and must protect her man from bad pr. Hence her need to implicate others.

            • Miss Tia

              yeah, i was there just a short bit…..that oona was beyond ‘glib’! protecting tom cruise? i mean, wow….how is she gonna feel if/when what he’s been involved with comes to light??? i sort of feel sad for her…

              great summary!!! πŸ™‚

            • Eclipse-girl

              Not recognizing the name, I have had dealings with her. I read her discus account and recognized some posts. Always on articles about Tom and defending him. She doesn’t like Katie or Nicole

            • Miss Tia

              Wow, I mean if this was like 1987 I’d give her a pass, but 2013?!?! SERIOUSLY?!?! I guess I still gotta say I feel sorry for her in a way, but SERIOUSLY!?! Yeah, empathy mixed with SERIOUSLY?!?!!?

            • Eclipse-girl

              pity is the correct response..

              Its funny because she does know enough to constantly blame Miscavige, Rathbun and Rinder.

              She isn’t sure that Tom Cruise beat the hell out of Tommy Davis, but when presented with that, her retort was that Tommy Davis deserved it because he is a monster.

              I am not a fan of Tommy Davis, but calling him a monster elevates all of his ass hole behavior.

              Tom Cruise can do no wrong in her eyes.

            • Miss Tia

              yeah, i saw that! like a broken record!! SMDH….

    • Observer

      I’m probably the most boring extremist ever.

      • Cat Daddy

        Nah I am more boring

        • Charlotte

          I’m upvoting your humble brag

      • Just Dee

        I down arrowed your statement. You do great photos!

      • Eclipse-girl

        You know, I often just up arrow comments. I have been dealing with RadarOnline and not paying attention. Just Dee is correct.

        My upvote has been removed. I do not down arrow

        • Just Dee

          I don’t down arrow either but this is a special circumstance. πŸ™‚
          Wanted to add that I think trolls like down arrows. I would never give them one. They aren’t special enough! lol

      • Charlotte

        Your shoop work is so far from boring that it stretches right around the world, comes back and bites boring on the arse.

      • DrGreatCham

        Any man who carries his brain in a plate can -never- be boring!

    • Missionary Kid

      Give ’em hell with facts.

    • KJP in Portland

      6dog can go wet himself…

    • kemist

      What ? We r extremists nao ? Whatever happened to ‘bigots’ ? They got bored with it ? Well, except for Krusty the sad clown.

      Sciloons make me think of that kid who’d discover a word he likes, and start using it everywhere, especially where it does not belong. All his friends start using it too to be cool.

      Expect them to keep using it for a few months.

      That’s a consequence of the imposed “standard tech” and uniform predetermined responses that come from higher up. If you’ve been at scilon watching for a while, you start to recognize those pre-approved expressions and it draws a big fat target on the trolls.

    • Free Minds, Free Hearts

      I know the whole Radar group of scilon apologists is pretty active!

  • Cat Daddy
    • Tory Christman

      SO sad…………..so true.

      • Cat Daddy

        Tory Anons deal sad truth out without mercy, well we did once and gave Scientology a black eye

        • Tory Christman

          Cat Daddy—we ex-scios deal sad truth out without mercy too…and we’re happy you all arrived when you did! You *certainly* gave $cientology a black eye that shall not go away…….evvvvvvvvvvvvvvvahhhhhhhh. (And in honor of ALL who came before you…their actions shall never be forgotten, either!) πŸ™‚

    • Eclipse-girl

      This is another name the person game for me. I learn the names and then their stories

      Top Row : Victims (left to right)
      ? think it is the man in CW, LMP, ? , ? , ? , LMP agains

      Bottom row : Cultists
      Tom C., John T, ? Kelley Preston, Jenna Elfman, ? , Juliette Lewis

      • Robert Eckert

        Left and right of Lisa McPherson might be Sean Lonsdale and Kyle Brennan?

        • Eclipse-girl

          Sean Lonsdale. Yes that was the person I was thinking of.

          I know Kyle’s story, but I would not recognize his photo.

          still 2 more Victims to identify.

          TY for your help

  • Observer

    I miss THDNE.

    • Eclipse-girl

      I do too.

      • Ruby

        Me 3

    • Artoo45

      There’s a hole shaped hole in The Bunker . . .

    • Captain Howdy

      “We’ll meet again in a place where there is no darkness” – 1984

    • palmas74

      where is he?

      • Eclipse-girl

        She.

        • palmas74

          where is She?

        • palmas74

          What happened to her?

          • Eclipse-girl

            I am not sure. According to others she needed to take a break.

            • palmas74

              Ok, thanks

    • sugarplumfairy

      I look for her here every single day.. Hope she’s ok and that she comes back to us.. soon..

    • Lurkness

      she posts occasionally. She was also commenting on the radar article. Hope she comes back more frequently,

  • ShoopZ

    More tweeting to twits.

    • Sidney18511

      Excellent ShoopZ!!!!!!!! Keep up the good work!

  • aegerprimo

    Most of the time I do not have time to read the 1000+ comments here, so sorry if this is a repost….

    Tony Orgtega’s reporting work has hit mainstream media. FANTASTIC!

    Article in Radar Online. “Tom Cruise Scientology β€˜Labor’ Scandal: Ex-Church Members Allege That They Were Ordered To Work For The Star In New Court Files”
    http://radaronline.com/exclusives/2013/12/tom-cruise-scientology-labor-scandal-ex-church-members-allege-that-they-were-ordered-to-work-for-the-star-in-new-court-files/

    • Anonymous

      Tony posted the recent affidavits, but IIRC correctly, this story (about Sea Org folks doing unpaid work for TC) was originally broken on Marty’s site, quite some time ago. Photographs and some very compelling narrative was posted way back then. Must give the devil his due.

      • aegerprimo

        The Radar Online article is today.

        • Anonymous

          Marty’s article on the same underlying topic was approximately one year ago.

          • Eclipse-girl

            I do not think Tony O worries too much about credit. He has given lots of credit to both Marty and Mike.

            I am just glad sorta mainstream media has picked this up.

            • Anonymous

              I’m not doing a good job communicating here…I wasn’t assigning or debiting credit to anyone, just clarifying the timeline of events.

              These events have a tendency to take on a patina of nonsense if not kept in factual order.

            • Eclipse-girl

              Correct and TY for keeping us honest.

            • Anonymous

              As many have also done for me. πŸ˜‰

            • Robert Eckert

              Affidavits filed in court are what makes this story printable for media who don’t know and trust the sources the way Marty, Mike, or Tony does.

            • Anonymous

              You mean….the press would not trust…Marty?

            • Qbird

              Off Topic: Robert – did you have any fun at all talking to the neanderthal?
              I swear. He must actually eat with his asshole, he consumes so wrongly.
              Dim sick f*** — Stooopid beyond belief. Ridiculous, mean & a biggo Bully.
              At any rate – he really does “prove” his nastiness, all on his own.
              nice try however, you gave it. Good to see. For myself, I will never talk to him again.

            • Robert Eckert

              Well at first I assumed it was an OSA troll pretending to be a Neanderthal, and I was answering to expose to any outside readers of the thread what Scientologists are really like and what the Kirstie story is really about. Eventually it began to appear that he might be a genuine Neanderthal, so I tried MK’s test of posting entheta (his demand that I “prove it” about Scientologist deaths was a good entry) to see if he could respond. I think he actually is not pretending, but really is just as he appears.

            • Qbird

              well – tee hee – re-visit when you’re bored & lookin’ for a snickersnort.

              think he might be outta there now – ? – the little reply word ain’t on his posts anymore.

            • Robert Eckert

              This morning I find that the moderators have banned him and deleted all his comments.

            • Qbird

              Oh YAY! Man that guy was foul & rude & scary mean – Sir jackus aSScuss!

            • Anonymous

              Normally I try to use nuance to help make a point and rely on the inferences of others to fill out the details.

              In this particular situation it has not worked out well and several folks have felt the need to “correct” what I said with non-sequitur comments.

              I’ll resort to the sledgehammer approach here just to set the record straight for posterity.

              Monique Rathbun’s lawsuit against the various Scientology entities and David Miscavige is alleging, among other torts, unjust harassment.

              It was repeatedly chronicled on Marty’s website that as he made new general (negative) revelations about Scientology, the level of harassment against he and his wife increased. The level of harassment seemed to reach its zenith every time Marty made a negative revelation that was in particular about the actions of David Miscavige (and by association, Tom Cruise.)

              Therefore the timing of Marty’s revelations about the possible inurement of church funds by COB David Miscavige (and his pal Tom Cruise) if shown to be correlated closely with an increased level of harassment against Monique and himself, might help prove the personal involvement, and possibly the personal liability of David Miscavige, in the lawsuit brought for damages by Monique Rathbun.

              My apologies for being obtuse earlier and further apologies for being blunt here.

      • Eclipse-girl

        I think that Aeger is referring to the depositions which is what Radar picked up on.

        • Anonymous

          Correct.

          The declarations (not depositions, as there have been none yet) posted recently by Tony, contain essentially the same information that was written about in narrative fashion on Marty’s site quite awhile ago.

          • Eclipse-girl

            You are correct. There are NOT depos, but sworn statement.s TY for the correction.

            I do not deny Marty or Mike their due. Bringing down scientology has been helped by them

        • aegerprimo

          Yes EG.
          (and now I took the time to scan the Bunkerite comments at the article).

      • Missionary Kid

        The story may have been broken a year ago, but these are affidavits that were filed as a part of Mosey’s lawsuit, which make this official, and a part of the public record. News agencies are reluctant to carry stories like the favors DM has given TC by using sea org low paid workers by themselves, because it approaches, “he said, she said” in veracity, and you know what Co$ does with those. These docs are now a part of the public record, which gives them more weight.

        You’ll notice that the Radar story puts in “alleges” with the statements, and it is a report on what has been filed in court. At this point, they are only allegations, but, when you read the totality, with corroborating statements, the story has much more weight.

        The allegations have not been proven, or ruled on by a judge and jury, but at least they were done under oath. TC is gonna feel the burn from these docs, and DM from the rest.

        • aegerprimo

          Thank you for clarifying the timeline MK! I assumed people already knew Tom Cruise Sea Org slave labor was reported by Tony a long time ago, but the affidavits only became public court record recently and posted online by Tony, hence the Radar Online article – today.

    • Eclipse-girl

      Some of us have been having fun there today.

    • DamOTclese2

      I like how they call everything that’s months old “Exclusive.” πŸ™‚

  • Mary_McConnell

    I like what Terril wrote on ESMB:

    “Its just another big footbullet.

    Donning Hoaxies valence:-

    Laura’s Lawyer:- Havn’t you declared psychaitry was to be eradicated in 2000?

    COB’s Lawyer:- Erhhhh…Yes.

    Laura’s lawyer :- Thus a psyche evaluation is not possible is it?

    COB’s Lawyer :- Er…… We failed.

    Judge:- And you’ve failed here. There will be no psyche evaluation from a profession

    whose judgments you dismiss. We shall instead examine your own counseling records of Laura.

    You clearly stand by them and there will no grounds upon which you can appeal. “

  • Jeb Burton

    Wouldn’t it be great if Mosey gets the court to have DM testify, then they request he undergo a psychiatric evaluation? Can you imagine the results of that evaluation?

    • DamOTclese2

      Gods that would be amusing. The Judge would order him remanded in to protective custody least he harm himself or others.

  • Mary_McConnell

    Why no email notification about this article? I found out about it on ESMB just now.

    • DamOTclese2

      I blame David Miscavige. πŸ™‚

      • Anonymous

        That’s some funny stuff there…and quick too…

      • Suzy

        That’s Captain David Miscavige who is to blame

        • DamOTclese2

          Rear Admiral Miscavige. πŸ™‚

    • Tory Christman

      I got one……not sure why you did not. My guess is it’s a slip. πŸ™‚

    • Missionary Kid

      I got one, too, at 9:42 EST.

  • Cat Daddy

    Some girls could make me believe in Xenu and certainly in VULCANO’s wink wink

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z3mr1nifNnY

  • Cat Daddy
  • aurora50

    O/T, but a cult is a cult and there may be useful info to share. The FLDS cult has former members working to help its folks escape.
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2520919/TLCs-Escaping-Prophet-new-reality-sheds-rare-light-FLDS.html

    • Eclipse-girl

      nice article. I think the woman is a heroine

    • D.Y.G.

      I saw the previews for this series and I definitely plan to watch it. There’s another series called Breaking The Faith that is shown on TLC Sundays at 10pm. This show has a group of young men that helps people escape the FLDS. It’s a must watch.

      • SandiCorrena

        I’ve been watching it; it’s really good!

      • Hubbub

        Sounds interesting, except after TLC’s very dishonest “documentary” program Breaking Amish, I don’t really trust anything that comes out of them anymore. Search for terms like “faking Amish,” and you’ll be amazed at how much that was portrayed as real was completely made up. The producers tried to act like they were duped, but in reality, they were just caught with their pants down.

        • PoisonIvyHerself

          I call TLC “The Lowbrow Channel.” It is the sleaziest of the sleazy. Please, do not trust ANYTHING you see on Reality TV. I’ll check it out because it’s ( uhhh, obviously) a subject matter that interests me, and let y’all know what I think. I know all too well how the sausage is made on these shows so I can pretty well assess how “real” the show will be. (For instance, while “Hoarders” and “Intervention” definitely had their flaws and a LOT of fakeness, I think they were well-done, sensitive for the most part and educated audiences to have compassion about addicts/alcoholics/hoarders. So even though I have been told some not so cool things that happened behind the scenes on both series, I give them an “A” for effort.)
          I did recently read a report that TLC is looking to clean up it’s cheesy reputation a bit, so it’s possible they accidentally did something good. Will report back with my review! πŸ˜‰

          • Aslansown

            I remember when I actually used to learn something on the The Learning Channel. Those were the day…..

            • PoisonIvyHerself

              It’s been a long while since then…but the “what networks are buying” report that I recently saw had TLC complaining about its cheezy reputation and put in a call for producers to pitch them shows with more substance. It’s about time, TLC!
              Having a series be only 6 episodes long is a really good way to possibly make better “reality TV.” The Fatal Flaw of ALL reality TV is, you cannot have escalating conflict in ANY real life situation every week. Not even on the front lines in modern warfare (there’s often weeks where it’s mostly waiting around, even there!). Even ride along shows like COPS shoots an insanely high ratio of boring hours of crap to find the nuggets that go in the show. Today’s budgets can’t afford to just roll tape and wait for something to happen. So when someone buys a weekly series of “reality” – particularly docu soap reality – some things if not most things are gonna get made up.

            • Aslansown

              I used to watch actual operations – I thought that was TLC but could have been Discovery? I refuse to watch any reality TV for the very reasons you cited. I really hope you’re right about TLC.

            • Hubbub

              I remember the operations, too.

            • Aslansown

              They were fascinating!

            • Hubbub
            • Aslansown

              I had no idea it was started by HEW and NASA! Boy, it really went off the rails and I blame Trading Spaces for the glut of home make-over shows, home buying shows, etc. that don’t even resemble reality.

          • Hubbub

            I’d be interested in hearing your review. Re: Hoarders and Intervention… I agree, the formats seemed a little more well-meaning and educational. I’ve studied some documentary filmmaking and as an offshoot enjoy reality tv. So I get that just by the nature of a camera being there and the fact that episodes are going to be edited into storylines, it’s not real reality. But it still bums me out to see such purposeful deception when being portrayed as truth. (I know… welcome to the real world, Hubbub!) I like name The Lowbrow Channel. I’ve been referring to it as “True Lies Channel.” πŸ˜‰

          • SandiCorrena

            I’m dying to see what you think of it!

        • SandiCorrena

          From watching it I think this one is a different cup of tea but that’s just my opinion.

          • stillgrace2

            Here is a link to the Biggi Reichert documentary. this is the veterinarian that committed suicide. There are English subtitles.

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yg6fAsSG3ts

            • SandiCorrena

              This is astonishing; I just finished watching it.

    • Hubbub

      NPR had a good piece on another Warren Jeffs escapee recently. I love the title of her book, “The Witness Wore Red.” and the reason for the red. She was also on one of the tv news magazine shows (can’t remember which one), wearing red and standing tall. Here’s the link to the NPR write-up and/or audio.

      http://www.npr.org/2013/09/14/221790096/the-witness-wore-red-a-polygamists-wife-finds-a-new-life

  • Eclipse-girl

    PLEASE if you can stomach it, call off the attack on TeamMe on RadarOnline.

    Baby treated her very gently early today.

    I asked her a question and got some flak. I think we have made peace.

    • Qbird

      E-girl – link? (just got here, I’ve been gone all day)

    • stillgrace2

      I think TeamMe is the same troll that’s been around here the last week. He’s deleting some of his posts and now RadarOnline has its own “Guest”. The last I saw of him, he tried to insult BTN without success. I suspect TeamMe is talking to himself as SCC, but have no proof. Very low entertainment value as a troll. I did my bit to keep the discussion focused on the criminal activities of sciloontology.

      • Eclipse-girl

        I honestly think TeamMe is not a sock or a troll. She is woman who follows celeb stories, Radar online.

        She was overwhelmed by the anit-sci-lon tech that occurred.

        Her DISCUS account is open for all to see.

        She deleted a total of two comments that I am aware of. The second one she deleted was in response to 6Dog (TROLL) instigating things after we had made peace.

        NO TROLL that I know of does that.

        She admitted she jumped on me, and it was not deserved. She was overwhelmed. No troll would do that.

        • stillgrace2

          I think trolls mix up their behaviors in an attempt to confuse things. The little arguments that are happening between TeamMe and SCC seem so false! I’m signing off now, anyway. Family Time.

          • Eclipse-girl

            Family time is so important. Have fun

            SSC is still in. TeamMe claims to know that scienology is bad.

            You have tempted me to return

          • PreferToBeAnon2

            Agree with you there!

            And, enjoy the family!

      • Jimmy Threetimes

        SSC is S_StClaire. I would bet anything on it.

        • Bury_The_Nuts

          I think you are right! I was just thinking that about five minutes ago.
          Name as well as posts!

          • Jimmy Threetimes

            SSC TeamMe β€’ 37 minutes ago βˆ’
            Yours. If you are going to squabble with Nuts, you have to put in some effort. Just trust me. …

            • tetloj

              Awwwwww….

        • Robert Eckert

          I took that for granted.

          • Jimmy Threetimes

            It is obvious, indeed, but last week when I asked if they were StClaire they played dumb.

        • Bury_The_Nuts

          Lol, it is. I could tell for sure by his post where he defended me.
          How cute.
          Awwww!

      • Rita Gregory

        TeamMe just crossed the line with BTN then tried to take it back. Sounds Flunkish.

        • IASREG

          All the weird circular/flawed logic, victim complex weird nonsense is VERY Flunk. I saved a few snips. Mental.

          • Rita Gregory

            They suggested BTN should “end cycle”.

            • IASREG

              I saw that, then apologized twice in a weird ranting way about deleting regretful posts doesn’t work… writes like FLUNK.

        • stillgrace2

          Upon final review, I agree with the “Flunkish”. I went through the entire comment section to find where I insulted “her” and found nothing. I challenge anyone to find something offensive I said to “her”.

          • Rita Gregory

            I don’t usually try to figure out who the troll is, but the statements made sounded pretty familiar.

            • stillgrace2

              Yeah, I think it might have been Flunk. Poor guy. The way “she” went after me with no provocation was very telling.

            • Rita Gregory

              Poor guy is right. I wish he’d get some help.

          • Sherbet

            How about this from Radar’s comments: “Yes I know a bit about Shelly she” is being gone for about 5 years now”….that I why Leah is in trouble, she ask about her in Toms
            previous wedding….please…if you can go to Tony Ortega .com :the guy knows a lot…he was a former member of that cult..” What?? Can somebody correct “mima”?

            • stillgrace2

              I didn’t see that one. Is it a recent comment?

            • Robert Eckert

              I found it and straightened things out.

            • Sherbet

              Thanks. I don’t post anywhere else but here.

    • Rita Gregory

      TeamMe just went way over the line with BTN. Trying to take it back but it sounds like Flunk.

      • Eclipse-girl

        Ok. I am NOT there. BTN can take care of herself and is familiar with FLUNK.
        Remember FLUNK is a misogynist.

        • Rita Gregory

          I think telling someone to “end cycle” is rather over the line. Just thought you might want to know.

          • Eclipse-girl

            Its cool. I may go back tomorrow. TY for the info.

    • Baby

      Here is my Take on Team Me.. Because I read all of her previous comments also..

      She goes to Radar for the Gossip.. She was surprised to see so many Anti Scns show up.. She didn’t know anything about Scientology..

      She is a Social Services employee who works in trying to get women off Welfare.. She has served in the military.. She didn’t understand why we would be so interested in such an insignificant subject like Scn.

      because there are bigger problems out in the world to worry about..

      Well, everyone was trying to convince her what a big issue it is because it is an evil cult..

      She has her own causes.. ( Women being raped in India..etc.)

      She did not have the first clue. She thought we were complaining about Tom Cruise..

      We have all seen it before..You try to discuss it with someone and if they don’t make the effort to do their homework it is difficult to explain it to them in comments on a site ( especially a gossip site..)

      She wasn’t a troll.. Just someone looking for gossip.. getting information about a Cult that she didn’t care about in the first place..

      She was OK when I left..

      and she got caught up with everything.. and everyone…and didn’t leave the drama.

      That’s how threads go sometimes.. Thanks E..

      It was just too much information for her to process.. and when we give information that people have heard before..

      We do sound like a bunch of nuts because we always say.. ” You can’t make this shit up..”

      and if we know.. and we have documented proof from people who have been there ( The Hole, RPF etc)

      Then why doesn’t the Govt. go in and Arrest them..? Shut them Down? Raid them?

      How many times have we all been asked that? People look at me like I have absolutely lost my mind when I tell them stories..

      and I think that is what she was thinking… ” What a Bunch of Whack Jobs..” hahahah…

      • Eclipse-girl

        Yes, I am in total agreement with your assessment.

  • Deeana

    Has there been a place set up where people can donate to offset Laura’s legal fees? If so, where is it?

    • monkeyknickers

      You’re not a troll, honey. I appreciate your critical view of facts at hand.

  • Richard Lloyd-Roberts

    oh no they didn’t… well good luck getting a psych to testify in favor of the church. They would probably label her as the sanest person on the planet. That is a very low blow though.

  • ShoopZ

    OK…No more Kirstie after this. At least for now. (picture – refresh)

    • DamOTclese2

      Sweet! I Tweeted that. πŸ™‚

  • Bradley Greenwood

    It’s ironic… after myself becoming totally disgusted with psychiatry, the $ciloons decide to utilize it. WAKE ME UP!

    • aegerprimo

      CRAZY isn’t it?

    • Charlotte

      Feck! Arse! Girls! Drink!

    • Nevermore

      That would be an ecumenical matter!

  • Bob Gravlin

    So COS is using Psychiatrists as expert witnesses now. This is huge. Tony should send out press releases informing the media outlets of how This group is changing it’s tune about Psychiatry. I suppose they will soon be giving psych drugs to those they are unable to handle with their auditing. And I suppose they will soon be buying copies of The DSM 5, (The psychiatric diagnostic manual) for all their libraries!!!

  • Tone

    The irony, it burns!

  • aegerprimo

    Kirstie on the Howard Stern show. (I posted a comment).

    http://youtu.be/7c8hF_QaEKA

    • Unex Skcus

      35.40:
      Q: “But you do have a religion that kicks people out?”
      A: “No… well, that depends…”

      • Aslansown

        She deflects from the “religion” to “you would kick out people in your life if..”

  • pronoia

    Just checking in. Laura is brave brave brave, and if she preservers will not only be compensated but will also set a precedent: child abuse is still child abuse, even and more importantly, when perpetrated by a cult hiding behind the 1st amendment.

  • Herod
    • DodoTheLaser

      Oh, no!

      • Herod

        I know, I really hope Baca is ok, it must be hard on his {heart}

      • Aslansown

        There’s that red bow again.

        • Unex Skcus

          Looks kinda purdy, what with the while gloves and lovely red scarf, ‘n all. { }

          • DodoTheLaser

            White gloves, white hat – a good guy, you know.

            • Unex Skcus

              Yippee Ai Ay .

          • Qbird

            Hey Unex! You done cracked me up yesterday. Seriously! I told this to Funnybroad as well bc it’s the truth – just before i fell asleep last night – that image you posted – just made me chuckle long & low… and then I slept well. Thank you for that – those bullies have no sense of humor whatsoever. ha!

            • Baby

              Q Bird..OMG.. Where in God’s name did you find that picture..hahahahhaha

            • Qbird

              no matter what I search bing images I find birds ~ was googling, angry body builders this was in there – LOL. But when Unex Skcus posted the cartoon muscle-man, I tell ya – it lifted me up! Him and that Funnybroad.

            • Baby

              Absolutely hysterical.. OMG

          • Baby

            Oh I just love a man in uniform.. ( Like this man in a Jail Uniform!)

            All right now everyone give it up..That is funny!

    • Unex Skcus

      IIRC, Baca is wealthy (?), so if that’s correct, what’s the bet he throws his staff under a bus, and pleads ‘ignorance’ – via high-priced lawyers of course?

      • Herod

        He just won’t get re-elected. Which sucks if you are Miscavige!

        • Unex Skcus

          Unfortunately, he may well get re-elected, if he out-spends all the other contenders combined on his campaign!

          But, we can hope.

          • Herod

            I suspect he will bow out in disgrace…

    • Missionary Kid

      Baca didn’t get raided, the staff at the jail did. While this reflects poorly on Baca, he was not directly involved.

      Some of the deputies got arrested for violence and abusing people’s rights, and some got arrested for covering up actions, and some both.

      As I recall, there were at least two lieutenants, two sergeants, and a host of others.and most of rest of them were deputies.

      • Herod

        “Sixteen of the defendants were arrested Monday and are expected to be arraigned this afternoon in federal court.

        β€œOur investigation also found that these incidents did not take place in a vacuum β€” in fact, they demonstrated behavior that had become institutionalized”

        • Missionary Kid

          Baca was not named in that statement. His office was not raided, nor was he named as an unindicted co-conspirator. As much as I dislike the man, I want the facts to be straight.

          He is responsible for things that happened on his watch because he’s in charge, but that speaks to poor management, not criminal behavior on his part. He has not been named anywhere in the arrest warrants.

          • Snippy_X

            Yet.

  • DodoTheLaser

    Marty just dropped a bomb at his blog.
    Could be relevant on December 11th.

    Very telling regardless. Click the link for more.
    http://markrathbun.wordpress.com/2013/12/09/scientology-intelligence-manual/

    • DodoTheLaser

      Some “Church”.

    • Nevermore

      Impeccable timing!

  • Missionary Kid

    I know it’s late, but I have a short list for bumper stickers or protest signs that go with $cientology asking for a psych evaluation for Laura.

    BUMPER STICKERS OR SIGNS ABOUT CO$ ASKING FOR A PSYCH
    COS ASKED FOR PSYCHS
    Miscavige demands Court-appointed psychs!
    Why did COB order a “psychiatric examination”?
    Why does Miscavige support psychs?

    Reply to my comment to get yours added.

  • Bella Legosi

    If Laura does submit to the psych exam and it goes well………could that Dr. be called to discuss her perceptive on Laura’s mental state (without breaking confidentiality) and could that psych have already known about $cientology prior to have seeing Laura? I ponder what those cross examinations would be like!
    It surprises me not that Co$ is bringing up the Psych card. The hate psyches, but are willing to use them, the run fraud drug rehab programs, yet when you question the L Ron exposure at NarCONon or Delphi you are called a bigot. The pick and choose everything in this religion. What worked for them one day is thrown out the next, no matter how much it may damage their prestige or tech. Cuz right now the only person who matters is Little Boots.
    Hot damn, Laura’s lawyers are going to get a good wad out of this. Co$ will be paying her lawyers fees and all should they win.
    And the better win damn it!

    • splog

      It might also be a carefully laid trap like the “oh look, we just realized where all our trustees live” variety. Such a trap would be designed by the lawyers (Tiny Fists doesn’t have the restraint to think something like that all the way through). The trap is to entice Laura’s lawyers to question the religion in court and get into First Amendment issues. Or worse, to goad the judge into making a comment from the bench. That’s mistrial material right there, or appeal fodder.

      I think Laura should just calmly agree and go talk to a psychiatrist. Because that’s all they will do – talk. Courts take psych assessments seriously, and Laura will come through looking just fine – a regular person with many reasons to be aggrieved. This will all work in her favour as long as she, her lawyers and the judge make no big deal about it.

      Meanwhile, bunkerites can J&D about this for months, maybe wake some clams up at the same time. I do love the smell of roasted backfire in the morning!

  • Robert Eckert

    O/T: North Korea confirms that Kim Jong Un’s powerful uncle, Jang Song Thaek, has been removed from his posts. This had been suspected for weeks, since Uncle Jang stopped appearing on the podium with the other bigwigs, and a frequently re-run documentary about Kim Jong Un now had Uncle Jang edited out, and some old pictures that were re-used had Uncle Jang airbrushed out. The DPRK media now releases photos showing armed guards removing him from his seat near the front of a party “Central Committee” meeting (when a body has 300-some members, “committee” somehow no longer seems the right name). He is charged with corrupt use of funds and stirring up dissidence in the party. It is thought by some that his real offense is his oft-noted failure to applaud more than a token amount at Kim Jong Un’s long-winded speeches: since he has held official titles since Un was a spermatozoon, it might be understandable that he didn’t think he needed to bother.

    EDIT: linky http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/12/09/jang-song-thaek-ousted-photos_n_4413017.html?utm_hp_ref=world

    • DodoTheLaser

      Hmm. What does it reminds me of?
      I guess zeitgeist of truth it is.

      On a similar note, one of the most well known scientologists
      in South Africa, got SP declared and he is talking.

      Ryan Hogarth, former Church President, Declared Suppressive!
      http://www.mikerindersblog.org/ryan-hogarth-steps-forward/

      • DodoTheLaser

        Interesting video of Ryan when he was a President just a few years ago.

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WAAeDl7VZ2M

        • Baby

          Actually Do….. I just read this at Rinders.. This video aired a week after he left.. he said he felt uncomfortable when they asked him about Scn. Numbers..

          as you can see in the video he kind of hesitates and fumbles around.

          • DodoTheLaser

            I am in the middle of reading his story. Thanks, Baby.

      • Great White Clam

        miscavige SCOHB

        • Great White Clam

          Miscavige suck COHB

      • tetloj

        Scientology appear to have messed up royally here. Mandela’s passing has put Scientology’s shameful actions there in very sharp contrast.

        • DodoTheLaser

          Yep. They should make an Ideal Org in North Korea now.

    • Jimmy Threetimes

      Oh man. I feel bad for the pneumatic tube operators, stuck working overtime to remove this unperson from the hundreds of copies of newspaper they must have.

      • DodoTheLaser

        Yeah, but they would rather do that than rot in Korean “re-education” gulags.

    • Great White Clam

      Yep.

    • tetloj

      Robert, I see you’ve been a busy man, tackling the poorly informed on any number of sites….kudos!

  • Great White Clam

    Tiny little David Miscavige is the brown dwarf of $cientology.

  • Great White Clam

    Just WTF does YSCOHB mean anyway?

    • Qbird

      Y ou S uck C ock O n H ollywood B lvd.

      DM texting Rinder & Davis during filming of BBC doc

      • Great White Clam

        Well then, that makes perfect sense.

        • Qbird

          Sweeny wrote about it in his book that followed the documentary.
          I believe Rinder game him the ‘behind the scenes’ docs.
          When he & Tommy Davis didn’t make it go right, that’s just one of the things he wrote.
          He enjoys all foul words.

          That ol’ ee-sleazy-a$$-tickle David Miscavige, what a guy, what a guy.

        • Graham

          Apparently it’s some kind of sacred religious mantra which Slappy-the Eight-Minute-Wonder intones when things aren’t going too well. It’s kind of like their version of praying, which tells you all you need to know about $camatology.

  • Great White Clam

    COB SCOHB?

  • Great White Clam

    North Korea wouldnt DARE pull a leg up on Tiny David Miscavige would they?

  • DodoTheLaser

    I sure hope OSA people have some medicine for pneumonia,
    because in 2 hours from now OT III will be exposed, as never before.

    • tetloj

      More trolls….ugh!

      • DodoTheLaser

        Trolls are cute.

        • tetloj

          I’m getting a bit fed up with the local ones πŸ™

          • DodoTheLaser

            Even trolls need love. That’s our best weapon.
            Or just tell them to fuck off, if not in the mood.
            Or just ignore.

            • tetloj

              πŸ™‚ I try not to look but just…can’t….keep….away

  • Verve

    Just put some of these punks in front of me. My “ecclesiastical” non-judgemental fists of fury will have zero impact whatsoever in the very non-physical communion of minds.

  • noseinabk
    • DodoTheLaser

      I hope it will happen.

  • Charlotte

    I hope Enthralled Observer is doing well in her step-son/daughter-in-law troubles, wherever ye be…..

  • Jgg2012

    I just hope that they don’t get the psychiatric exam, have it presented into evidence, and then claim that putting it into evidence violated Scientology’s First Amendment rights.

  • Jgg2012

    Remember that, in Marc and Claire’s case, the judge dismissed a psychiatric report suggesting that the plaintiffs were brainwashed (causing the delay in leaving the Sea Org and filing the lawsuit). Judge Sohigian picked up on that. The problem with that analysis? That psychiatrist did not actually examine the Headleys, but merely reviewed statements and conjectured about brainwashing. So, if a psychiatrist does examine Laura and makes such findings about her, that will have a LOT more weight.

  • AintMizBahavin

    wow i wonder how lyingtology would fair if as many ex cob members all over the world got together and begin filing motions against the church all at the same time..? i also wonder how the militant midget would feel if the ex members stop filing against the church and go after him personally? taking observations from all ive read from everyone along with the shoops. the midget reptilian master would literally pull his eyeballs out the back of his head. rofl….

  • AintMizBahavin

    oops i forgot to say this in my earlier posts HELLO EVERYONE i hope and pray everyone and their families are ok… ive been sick with a viral chest infection hence the reason i havent been around. and as always thanks for the laughs and giggles from the many posts…

    • i-Betty

      Oh no, I hope you’re feeling better?

  • AintMizBahavin

    i know im losing it now the main thing i wanted to say is Laura should file that she would be willing to submit to a psychiatrist exam if the midget meister will also submit to 5 psychiatric exams by doctors of her choosing for her case and his….

  • Sydjazz

    I don’t get why they are asking for a psychiatric assesment. I thought they hated psychiatrists

  • Canada05

    I think a great way to hit back at Scientology would be to start multiple lawsuits all at the same time, not a class action but hundreds of lawsuits over human rights issues, fraud, labor standards etc. hundreds of lawsuits throughout the US and other countries and lets see them keep up with that. The few lawsuits that are going on show DM in a bad light but hundreds would crush him and he would not have the resources to keep up with it! Any ex members thathave thought about it should get together and file at the same time.

  • peakofelephants

    Boy is that a mistake on their part. As a mental health worker, I can safely say that the majority of my colleagues have at least a basic understanding of cults. Furthermore, considering how much they’ve publicly alienated the psychiatric community (most of whom don’t even get what the deal is with Scientology’s enmity towards us, we just know they’re nutjobs), and I have a very difficult time of any psych eval working out in their favor no matter what psychiatrist their attorneys get on the payroll.

  • Jon Frost

    So what do you call the crash of a DC-9 with jet engines piloted by John Travolta and carrying DM, Tom Cruise, Kirsty Alley, Ann Archer, and any other Celebrity SOC members… along with some of the Squirrel Busters???

    Wait for it…..

    Hilarious!

  • violetskyye

    I am a lawyer in L.A., and have litigated with and against Laura’s attorneys (one of whom is a blithering idiot, but I won’t say which one), and have appeared before Judge Sohigian, who is normally a bit better for the defense than the plaintiff. It says a lot that this particular judge denied the motion, and made some great comments about the oppressive Sea Org life, because a lot of these suits are tossed for being untimely. I’m glad and relieved the judge didn’t throw out the case on statute of limitation grounds, and am very interested to see how this plays out.

    Interestingly, I had to go to court a few years ago on a day when a bunch of Scientologists were having a demonstration [it may have been the Wollersheim trial], and got into a little verbal scuffle with them.