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HOW SCIENTOLOGY COERCED A CHILD TO HAVE AN ABORTION: THE LAURA DECRESCENZO FILES

HOW SCIENTOLOGY COERCED A CHILD TO HAVE AN ABORTION: THE LAURA DECRESCENZO FILES

—————- In anticipation of her biggest day in court yet, Laura DeCrescenzo and her attorneys hit the Church of Scientology with 928 pages of new filings —————- Details from 18,000 pages of evidence show how Scientology manipulated a child to keep her working under slave-like conditions —————- A key document describing DeCrescenzo’s unwillingness to have her coerced abortion is missing from the evidence Scientology was ordered to produce By Tony Ortega Wednesday afternoon, Laura DeCrescenzo filed explosive new information in her four-year legal odyssey against the Church of Scientology, submitting 928 pages of new declarations and exhibits in anticipation of a crucial October 23 hearing in her lawsuit against the church which alleges abuse, including allegations that she was forced to have an abortion at only 17 years of age. Key to the new filings is information gleaned from thousands of pages of previously secret files that the church fought mightily to keep under wraps. But on Monday, the U.

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SCIENTOLOGY MOVES TO DISQUALIFY MONIQUE RATHBUN’S ATTORNEYS

Marty Rathbun and David Miscavige, back in the day

Marty Rathbun and David Miscavige, back in the day

When Mark “Marty” Rathbun filed an affidavit last week saying that his former employer, David Miscavige, firmly rules every aspect of the Church of Scientology and oversaw its dirty tricks campaigns in Texas, we expected that the church might respond by calling Rathbun a liar.

Instead, Scientology is crying foul because Rathbun told the truth.

In a stunning, if predictable, move, late yesterday the Church of Scientology asked Comal County, Texas Judge Dib Waldrip to disqualify Monique Rathbun’s attorneys and cripple her harassment lawsuit because, the church says, Monique’s attorney Ray Jeffrey and his team improperly used “confidential and attorney client privileged information” when it allowed Marty Rathbun to submit an affidavit in his own wife’s lawsuit.

Scientology is asking Judge Waldrip to consider the motion Thursday morning, along with other matters in what is becoming a crowded two-day hearing in New Braunfels, Texas.

Monique Rathbun filed her lawsuit on August 16, alleging that she has been the target of a four-year campaign of harassment by Miscavige and Scientology simply because she is married to the man who was once Miscavige’s top lieutenant before he left the church in 2004 and then, in 2009, became its vocal critic. Monique is suing on grounds of intentional infliction of emotional distress, tortious interference of her employment contract, and invasion of privacy. She’s asking for more than a million dollars in damages.

Miscavige filed a special appearance on August 29, asking to be let out of the lawsuit because, he claimed, he had only a limited role in Scientology, had never done any business in Texas, and didn’t even know one of his fellow defendants, a Dallas private investigator named Monty Drake.

Monique responded by filing an amended complaint that added two defendants and provided more details about why she believes Miscavige, as Scientology’s leader, was behind her harassment. To bolster that assertion, she attached a lengthy and explosive affidavit by Marty Rathbun detailing the work he did for Miscavige in Scientology. Among its many assertions…

— Scientology’s corporate structure is a sham, and the church is really run by a “shadow organization,” the Sea Organization, which is captained by Miscavige.

— Miscavige’s every utterance was considered so important, Sea Org employees constantly followed him everywhere he went, recording his words and transcribing them 24 hours a day.

— Miscavige, through Rathbun, monitored the dirty tricks and harassment campaigns run by Scientology’s “Office of Special Affairs.”

— Miscavige, in his declaration, made false statements about having no knowledge of Monty Drake and having overseen no activities in Texas. According to Rathbun, Miscavige was well aware that Drake had been used for church operations for years, and Miscavige had micromanaged numerous activities in Texas, which included an effort to influence the family of dead church member Lisa McPherson.

— Crucially, in paragraphs 31 to 36 of the affidavit, Rathbun says that Miscavige relied on him to find a law firm with insider connections to handle matters related to McPherson.

And now, the Church of Scientology International (CSI, one of the numerous defendants in the lawsuit) has fired back in a startling way. While Rathbun essentially said that Miscavige lied about his Texas activities, the church’s attorneys are objecting not to the substance of Rathbun’s statements, but that he had an obligation to keep them secret. From CSI’s motion to disqualify, which was filed late yesterday…

There can be no dispute that Mark Rathbun, by his own sworn admission, was a non-attorney employee engaged in the Defendants’ legal affairs for many years. He has now improperly and impermissibly shared the Defendants’ confidential and privileged information acquired by him while in their employ with Plaintiff’s counsel and that Plaintiff’s counsel is now attempting to use it against these Defendants in this case.

Scientology, in other words, is arguing that Marty Rathbun’s fiduciary duty to keep his mouth shut is stronger than Miscavige’s own duty to tell the truth to a Texas court.

We’re gobsmacked, we really are. We turned to our legal adviser, Manhattan attorney Scott Pilutik, who cautioned us that the real problem with Scientology’s motion is in its legal argument…

This is really quite compelling.

First though, I’d caution against drawing the inference that Scientology is necessarily admitting the truth of Marty’s affidavit by posing the argument in these terms. Their conflict argument doesn’t depend on all of Marty’s allegations actually being true, only that he’s alleging information and communications which are in fact attorney-client privileged. Specifically, CSI references paragraphs 31 through 36 of Marty’s affidavit, which covered Marty’s and Miscavige’s involvement in procuring the Texas law firm Jenkins & Gilchrist in Lisa McPherson-related litigation.

That said, I think their argument has a huge problem. Well, a few actually, but one problem looms larger, I think.

The smaller problem is that Marty’s allegations in paragraphs 31 through 36 were made in the context of directly refuting Miscavige‘s statements that he’d never purposely availed himself of Texas law, arguing that the Texas court did not have personal jurisdiction over him. Marty’s statements contradict that assertion. Moreover, Marty’s statements about the activities Miscavige directed in Texas concern conduct that is, at very best, ethically dubious.

I’m also not so sure it’s a given that the assertions by Marty in paragraphs 31 through 36 are necessarily attorney-client privileged. While it’s definitely the sort of information that often is attorney-client privileged, neither Marty nor Miscavige are attorneys, and there’s no indication (nor does CSI allege) that this information was conveyed to an attorney or that an attorney’s advice was even sought. Discussions about legal strategy aren’t automatically attorney-client (or even the more narrowly construed work-product) privileged. The line gets perhaps fuzziest in paragraphs 35 & 36, but even there Marty is reporting on factual assertions made by the attorneys, not advice given by them.

But the far larger, more structural problem with CSI’s motion to disqualify is that Marty isn’t an employee of Ray Jeffrey, he’s a witness. CSI skates right past this crucial distinction, elaborating extensively as to Marty’s history with Scientology while ignoring Marty’s lack of an employer-employee relationship with Jeffrey. The cases cited by CSI indicate their hope that the judge will liken Marty to a legal assistant, but each of those cases are distinguishable in that the conflict-causing employee was an employee of the firm that the party was seeking to disqualify.

To take CSI’s argument to its logical end, no ex-employee with sensitive, damaging information concerning legal strategy could ever be used against their former employer. But we know that’s not the case — there are even laws protecting whistleblowers. The bottom line is that Scientology already has a remedy at their disposal for all the harms alleged in its motion: quit whining about Marty and sue him.

 
Thanks for that analysis, Scott. Also attached to the church’s motion is a lengthy set of exhibits which harken back to two previous cases Ray Jeffrey handled against Scientology. In the most recent of those, a lawsuit filed by former church private eyes Paul Marrick and Greg Arnold, the church had also filed a motion to disqualify Jeffrey, and on similar grounds — objecting in that case to Marrick and Arnold talking with reporters about their top-secret activities as Scientology’s spies. The church also refers to the way Jeffrey handled the defense of Debbie Cook, a former church executive who was sued by Scientology. But in each case, the church settled those lawsuits and, we suspect, paid out huge sums. So for them to come whining now that Ray Jeffrey didn’t play fair rings pretty hollow.

Although CSI is asking for this matter to be heard on Thursday, we’re not sure enough notice was given. Judge Waldrip will already be dealing with the request by Miscavige and the Religious Technology Center (RTC, Scientology’s nominally controlling entity) to be let out of the lawsuit. And Thursday and Friday are also set for the hearing on Monique’s request to convert a temporary restraining order into a temporary injunction, which would prevent surveillance or harassment of her throughout the duration of the lawsuit.

We expect testimony by Monique and other witnesses on those days, but we also expect a few more surprises before things get started on Thursday morning at the Comal County courthouse.

 
——————–

Narconon’s Insurance Woes Could Also Screw the People Suing Narconon?

This morning, our talented journalistic colleague Pete Combs at WSB-Radio in Atlanta is reporting about Narconon Georgia’s insurance woes, which we told you about last week — Narconon is being sued by the Evanston Insurance Company and Western World Insurance. But Pete and WSB-TV’s Jodie Fleischer smartly advance the story by interviewing Georgia state insurance commissioner Ralph Hudgens, who has some dire words for the people suing Scientology’s drug rehab system in a class-action lawsuit. If the insurance companies are allowed to bail on Narconon, those plaintiffs might be left out in the cold.

Pete sent us two of the stories he’s airing this morning on WSB Radio…

 

 
——————–

Posted by Tony Ortega on September 10, 2013 at 07:00

E-mail your tips and story ideas to tonyo94@gmail.com or follow us on Twitter. We post behind-the-scenes updates at our Facebook author page. Here at the Bunker we try to have a post up every morning at 7 AM Eastern (Noon GMT), and on some days we post an afternoon story at around 2 PM. After every new story we send out an alert to our e-mail list and our FB page.

If you’d like to help support The Underground Bunker, please e-mail our webmaster Scott Pilutik at BunkerFund@tonyortega.org

 

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  • GlibWog

    OK.. MIScabbage.. If you aren’t in charge of nuthin.. then step down. Quit bossin people around.. and eat beans and rice like everyone else..

    You wanna play the big shot ?.. Well PLAY THE FUCKIN BIG SHOT..

    OK good people of the Bunker .. Going to bed ..Yay I’m sleepy.. xo Glibby

    • i-Betty

      Hehe, what a bon voyage that was. Sweet dreams, Glibby :)

  • 1subgenius

    Deja vu all over again.
    They got no game.

  • Krew13

    Hi Sciloons. Still reeling from yesterday’s Ellen interview, ain’t ya? Plenty more where that came from, motherfuckers!

  • media_lush

    It’s got to the stage where the lawyers representing the midget are becoming a laughing stock themselves. I can only imagine that Tiny Fists turned up with a gun to their offices and forced them do this as any lawyer worth his/her salt wouldn’t use this as a defence in a million years.

    • sugarplumfairy

      The attorneys co$ use don’t need to be threatened with guns.. All miscavige has to do is threaten to disrupt their cash flow.. They’ve already proven they’ll do anything for a buck..

      • Poison Ivy

        As one lawyer said to me recently, “Win or lose, I get paid either way.” (This wasn’t the lawyer I hired.)

        But it’s true. As long as they don’t cross the legal line, they’ll be okay. And if they do end up disbarred, at least they’ll have a hefty retirement fund.

      • Robert Eckert

        I don’t really get it. He’s a Harvard Law grad. He can get clients who will pay him and not put him through this kind of shit. All I can figure is that for some reason he didn’t research Miscavige enough before taking him on, to realize what he was getting into, and now he can’t withdraw.

        • Douglas D. Douglas

          Or… there’s a LOT of money in this.

          • WildaBeast

            Seven figures is too little. Seriously, you couldn’t pay me enough to work for that asshat, and I’m supporting two people on under twenty grand a year…but if that lawyer took this case for under $10 million, he’s an IDIOT.
            Sell your body for whatever you think it’s worth and have fun while you do it, say I. But this lawyer has just sold his soul, and quite likely his legal future, so he’d damn well better have gotten a GOOD price.

          • Robert Eckert

            What WildaBeast said. It had better be enough money that he never needs to work again for the rest of his life, because he may not ever be able to practice law.

        • sugarplumfairy

          And maybe miscavige uses PI tech on his own attorneys the way he did with the IRS guys ..

          • WildaBeast

            Urgh…”Work for me and do exactly what I say or else I’ll send those pics of you in leather and a ball gag to the Bar Association”…

  • Krew13

    Once more, because it’s so fucking awesome!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MQ8oatRLBK8

    • Jon Hendry

      I don’t get the “should I sit like this” thing.

      • Marc Headley

        you have to watch the whole interview. She was talking about dancing and posture earlier…

        • Jon Hendry

          Ah, thanks!

    • Poison Ivy

      Yeah!

  • Eivol Ekdal

    some videos are up at wsbtv.com for those who like visuals…
    http://www.wsbtv.com/list/news/local/narconon-stories/aF4s/

    • GlibWog

      Thanks Eivol.. OK last post.. I can’t stay out of the Bunker.. all my friends are coming in..wah, wah..

  • Marc Headley

    Time to pull out the statement from Scientology spokesholes that Marty, “never held any positions of importance while volunteering for Scientology and has no information about David Miscavige or management personnel.”

    Hey Dave Miscavige, remember when your attorneys advised (took your money to tell you stuff they knew you would not listen to) you NOT to send those rodent people down to Texas? This is why, stupid.

    BRB, convincing Mr. Jeffrey to get his Colorado Bar membership active…

    • EnthralledObserver

      Forgive my Aussie ignorance… what/who is in Colorado? The Headley Clan?

      • Marc Headley

        Yes.

        • EnthralledObserver

          Ah, okee… so Mr Jeffrey might be getting a new client if he does get his Bar membership active, then?
          Watch out, Dinky Makemerich, the SP’s are coming for you in droves… heh, heh… love it!

          • Eclipse-girl

            Yes, The Headleys deserve a big WIN against Co$.

          • RMycroft

            Good thing I have a drover coat then.

        • TheHoleDoesNotExist

          Out of the entire parade of horror stories, the image I have of Miscavige’s Flying Monkeys stalking your wife and children from their Stalker Van while you are out of town …

          That is the one that has stayed with me every single time I see David Miscavige’s name. I am still hoping to see a movie of your family’s very American horrifying and human nightmare. Thank you and thank Claire for what you have done for so many.

          http://i41.tinypic.com/pac29.jpg

          • Erica

            Oh yes, a movie!! That would be fantastic! But could you get John travolta to star in it? I hear he’s a little gun shy from the last one.

            • Gus_Cox

              A movie – yes! What nearly all the reviewers of Marc’s book seem to miss is that BFG is a wonderful love story. Sure, it’s hard to ignore all the Scientology crap, but bottom line, it’s two people (Marc and Claire) who overcame tremendous obstacles (that fucking “church” and the people running it) to be together. It’s most inspiring, really.

        • richelieu jr

          I love Tiny Town. I grew up (partly) not far from there!

          • Robert Eckert

            Liar! You’ve never grown up…

            • richelieu jr

              Argh, you’ve got me!

        • LaLa104

          Marc, I’ll happily offer free baby sitting services for you and Claire when you meet with Mr. Jeffrey. I’m just a few towns over and nothing would make me happier to help you two if it ever comes down to that “MEETING”.

      • Robert Eckert
        • Marie Claire Wolf

          Perfectly sized retirement village for D.M.

          • WildaBeast

            He just has to buy it up entire, and move it to whatever country he’s planning to flee to when the shit *really* hits the fan.

            • kickingit101

              Speaking of him fleeing to another country. Can this judge order him and the other defendants to turn over their passports while the proceedings are in the court?

            • Robert Eckert

              This isn’t a criminal case. Surrendering a passport is often required as a condition of bail, but nobody is going to have to post bail. The penalty for not showing up at a civil case, if say he is required to give a deposition, would be limited to losing the case by default, with consequences of a large monetary judgment and an injunction against future conduct– but there is no possibility of jail time at issue here.

            • kickingit101

              That is what I was wondering since they are putting on a pretty strong case for perjury and that does carry a jail sentence if this civil case will have criminal implications in the future.

            • Robert Eckert

              Perjury rarely gets prosecuted. The “intent” element gets very difficult to prove (defendant can also claim to have really meant some weaselly interpretation of the words that was technically true). This might be blatant enough to be an exception, but don’t count on it.

          • LaLa104

            Bwwwwwwaaaaaaaaahahahahaha.. I just snorted my liquid beverage from my nose on that post!

    • Poison Ivy

      “Someone make sure to send Dave some phone books to sit on when he ends up having to take the stand. Three big city editions should do it.”

      Now look what you’ve done – thanks to that spit-take I need to brew another cup of tea!
      I’m in a totally un-Scientology related legal sitch right now and I want Ray Jeffrey too – this guy has the magic combination of brains, cajones, and he’s done his research inside and out. He is on to their tricks…which is what is going to make all this so delightful to watch.

      I would imagine Dave’s attorney’s are still taking his money and telling him stuff they know he won’t listen to. So far the Scientology response to this suit might as well be written on “From the Desk of David Miscavige” stationery.

      Oh, how I wish we could watch it on the tube!

      • richelieu jr

        Screw him. Let the bastard sit on the reissues of all those Hubbard CDs only one person has ever listened to, but everyone had to buy two copies of. (again)

    • Chee Chalker

      Excellent point Marc! Marty, if you are reading this blog, gather up each and every statement you can find where the Co$ refers to you as nothing more than DM’s beagle walker. Hand those over to Ray to he can attach them to his answer to this latest insane filing. How could a unimportant beagle handler possibly be privy to confidential and privileged communications? On another note, DM is actually a fascinating example of what happens when someone lives in a bubble for 30 years, where he is never challenged or even questioned. DM could be a interesting psychiatric case study……oh wait……….. Gotta run, there is an army of marching semi-colons heading my way!

      • Douglas D. Douglas

        Hello there and welcome to the Bunker! Great first post!

        • Chee Chalker

          Why, thank you….thank you very much! I have been an avid reader of Tony’s since the VV days and used to post there as well. I just never got around to posting on the Bunker. But this is just getting too exciting to sit back and not say a word! I am jealous…..Texas gets all the action!

          • N. Graham

            Yes, welcome. Good name, shows knowledge of Hubbard’s classic, asinine Sci-Fi!

          • WildaBeast

            /waves Hi, and welcome back! I used to lurk on VV, but missed you there.

          • richelieu jr

            No offense intended, but is that your real name? Because it is absolutely AWESOME!

            It implies for example, that you are ‘chalking cheese’ which is phoenetically marvelous as well as reflecting chalk & cheese…

            And if you made it up, Kudos!

            • TonyOrtega

            • Poison Ivy

              BRILLIANT!!

            • Chee Chalker

              Exactly!

            • Robert Eckert

              The word (“novice, tenderfoot” in Alaska, from a Native language) is actually pronounced more like cheechako, but L. Ron eventually didn’t quite catch it right when it was directed at him during his infamous trip to Alaska.

            • Observer

              BLASPHEMER! There is nothing that Source didn’t catch!

            • WildaBeast

              Including, but not limited to: gonorrhea, syphilis, and chlamydia!

            • i-Betty

              Hur hur :P

            • Marc Headley

              Most likely a transcriber or typist error…

            • Poison Ivy

              Correction. His “radiographic EXPEDITION to Alaska.” (Did he ever pay back that $625 loan to Bank of Alaska to get home after the boat broke down?)

            • Robert Eckert
            • GlibWog

              When they say.. ” Thar She Blows” they are talkin bout Hubs. What a Bull Shitter..
              4 bells and a jingle.. I would give anything to hear that jingle Robert..

            • Poison Ivy

              That’s a great article, Robert – great find. I hadn’t read anywhere that he was a radio show guest host. He’d be great on talk radio today – better than anyone on the airwaves at pulling bull out of his hindquarters at the drop of a hat.

            • jeff

              It was in Janet Reitman’s book.

            • richelieu jr

              Apparently, no he didn’t…

            • Poison Ivy

              Calling Bank of Alaska! David Miscavige has your $625….which has probably inflated to about $10,000 today!

              Get in line to collect…it’s gonna be a long one soon!

            • richelieu jr

              Hell, that line was long by the early 50s!

            • richelieu jr

              Wow, I didn’t know about this story…
              What an interesting coïncidence… This is why you should always be very, very careful before venturing out into Conspiracy Land.

              Sent from my iPad

      • GlibWog

        Hi Chee.. So glad you have joined us.. The more the merrier! Glibby

      • i-Betty

        Hi, Chee. It’s lovely to meet you :)

    • InTheNameOfXenu

      I certainly hope Jeffrey gets his Colorado Bar membership. I’d like to see round 2 of The Headleys versus The Midget!

      • Mrs Libnish

        Just deserts, DM……just deserts.

    • ziontologist

      “BRB, convincing Mr. Jeffrey to get his Colorado Bar membership active…”

      Do it!

    • DamOTclese2

      I would also love to see Ray J. do some Dwarf Tossing in Colorado.

    • Mrs Libnish

      Oh God, I wish they would. Marty’s got enough evidence to hit them with both barrels. This is not going to end well for CO$. They keep recycling the same, tired, old defense.

    • Cat Daddy
      • Public Buggering

        He really does play the part of the insane psychopath very well, doesn’t he?

    • Public Buggering

      Oh oh! I want to see David up on the witness stand again. Man, that would be sweet!

      • Leslie Stipe

        I would miss work for that! And I never miss work and I’m always on call so that says a lot.

    • OTVIIIisGrrr8!

      Marc, for your information those twelve “rodent people” were upstat dedicated Scientologists who flew to Texas at their own expense to try to wrest low-ranking nobody John Brousseau from the evil clutches of bitter defrocked apostate Marty Rathbun.

      Scientology parishioners care so very much about bringing people back into the fold that their intensely aggressive affection is often mistaken for harassment, stalking, or even kidnapping by people who can’t think clearly because being bound and gagged in the back of a white Sea Org Ford Econoline van puts them into restim on their evil purposes to harm the most ethical group on the planet by blowing. All we in RTC have ever asked is that such people route out of the Sea Org properly so we can at least give them a going away party.

      Because Marty likes to march to the beat of his own drum, COB has ordered his overpriced wog lawyers to put in Marty’s legal ruds. Marty flat out attacked COB by calling him a liar and saying that he, COB, was busy, busy, busy in Texas when the fact is that COB doesn’t even know where Texas is on a map. All Texas is to COB is a place of vicious SP’s. COB seems to get hurt, injured, and defamed whenever “Texas” is mentioned in a legal context. Why the next thing you know, Monique will subpoena Thomas Davis and drag him into her case to prove that COB ordered him to Texas in the Brousseau incident.

      In happier news, we in RTC are pleased to report that COB RTC David Miscavige’s new GAT II airship is aloft over Clearwater spreading the message of GAT II and the 1-800-DONATE program to fully fund the launch of GAT II.

      http://i1284.photobucket.com/albums/a563/OTVIIIisGrrr8/800Donate_zpsea53c75b.png

      • GlibWog

        8 Do you have to call ahead to the HOLE for the Going Away Party.. or are they always ready?

        Musical Chairs? and Kool Aid.. Sounds like a hell of a party.

        • i-Betty

          High five! :D

      • Cat Daddy

        Xenu is not pleased

      • DMSTCC

        I’m having a hard time getting through to this number. Oh well, I guess my checking, savings, mortgage, pension and 401k will have to go to my wog family instead.

      • i-Betty

        It’s a thing of great, great beauty, OT8. Fly free, Golden Age of Tech 2 balloon, you beauty, fly free!

    • ScamProof

      Marc, what an excellent point and you have such a way with words. I’ve known this since I read your book but this was one great post. Thanks for making my day. They can’t have it both ways for sure!

      • GlibWog

        Hi Scam! Oh I am so excited that we are getting new people in here.. Welcome to the bunker…Glibby

        • ScamProof

          Well thank you!

  • Xenuvius

    So who else believes this will play out to be a Debbie Cook payday for the Rathbuns with no collateral damage for Misdamaged?

    • Nevermore

      That might be what the Wee Sleekit Beastie’s lawyers see as their best hope – I don’t think Mosey’s legal team will play along with that.

    • Phil McKraken

      He might offer what Monique will demand in cash, but it’s the other terms… Of course COS will insist on Monique’s AND Marty’s perpetual silence as a condition of any settlement. Would Monique agree to it? I have no idea. Can Monique agree to Marty’s silence? He’s not a co-litigant, so I don’t think so.

      My question, for the legal eagles: Can the court force a settlement that includes the restriction of Monique’s right to free speech?

      • Poison Ivy

        Good question. As you said, I can’t believe Marty and Monique would accede to a gag order. To me, that would be hypocritical, given all that Marty has written on his blog about the importance of freedom since he left, of speaking out, etc.
        Also, I believe it would hurt others. Marty has claimed that he wants to help others who want to leave the church. A gag order would potentially hinder that in many ways.
        If they agree to trade silence for cash, then they are essentially giving permission to COB to continue to do to others what has been done to them.
        In my mind, that is unconscionable, especially given what Marty has done to others and the “living amends” I like to assume he is trying to make.
        Monique could take the money and get a pass – she had nothing to do with these assholes. But Marty – if he agrees to stay silent, I will lose all respect for him permanently.

        • WildaBeast

          I really don’t think that the {church} has a good enough case to be able to even try to go for a gag order. Going for Mosey was just unbelievably stupid. If they’d left her alone and just gone for Marty, it might be a different story, but as it is…nope. This could take a few years, but I think the {church} is heading down a path that will end with them bent over a barrel…with all of us watching, and popcorn stocks sky-high.

          • Poison Ivy

            I hope it doesn’t take too long. The Manuela story made me realize this cult is still destroying new lives, every day.

            • WildaBeast

              Me too, PI, me too. I really hope this case gets heard in record time; it looks to me like the biggest cloud among many on the horizon for Co$. I pray it turns out to be as fast-moving and as damaging as a hurricane for them.

      • Robert Eckert

        “Can the court force a settlement that includes the restriction of Monique’s right to free speech?” Absolutely not. Non-disclosure agreements that are voluntarily agreed to are generally enforced, but imposing them involuntarily would be a core violation of the 1st Amendment.

      • DamOTclese2

        If the victim agrees to a gag order on the grounds that the criminals stop committing harassment and racketeering against her, you could bet $10 million dollars that the syndicate would violate the agreement to stop their harassment within a day of signing the agreement, allowing the victim once again to speak and to return to the Judge with another complaint.

        That’s Scientology. That’s David Miscaviage. The insane little fuck just. Can’t. Stop himself.

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      Ack! Barking guard dogs….I just Knew I was forgetting something in today’s PSA. The Circus really IS coming to town, isn’t it?! DM’s Camouflage Tech…..what a dufus.

      http://i43.tinypic.com/20qc9pd.jpg

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        Speaking of Tents…it will likely be several days before the totally awesome Southern SP Society Intl beachside convention photo album will be put together, but to give you an idea of just How awesome…here’s just One little old pic:

        Looks like the Big Tent already has some pesky suppressive Body Thetans! (don’t bother OSA monkey poo….long gone on big airplanes..) First view of inside the tent!

        http://i43.tinypic.com/2enruh5.jpg

        • Bury_The_Nuts

          What an exciting “tent”.

          Here is a link to the beginning of the photo album:

          https://plus.google.com/u/0/photos/110311047381007287507/albums/5921980624815192737

          And another lulz pic as well of St. Petes Life improvement center. Scientology must have pulled in their neighbors….

          • TheHoleDoesNotExist

            Holy Crap! I wonder if the Clearwater City Permit awesome has seen THIS picture! That can’t possibly be right…or safe, can it?

            http://i43.tinypic.com/2pye4he.jpg

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              And is this the future Freewinds replacement? Finally, doing it right. Free beer, fishing and gambling. They won’t need cray cray fundraisers to buy this one!

              http://i43.tinypic.com/2iscg2g.jpg

            • Bury_The_Nuts

              Are you making fun of the cornerstone of their foundation?

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              No. I am making fun of the cornerstone of their foundation in a tropical storm gust.

            • Bury_The_Nuts

              Hurricanes are bad!

              Just ask Whingey!!!!

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              hah….well, they can all jump on board the Fleewinds II for their escape.

              http://i43.tinypic.com/29l1ekn.jpg

          • DeElizabethan

            Really like this photo with the ‘Lust’ bar or whatever, next to it.

          • Mrs Libnish

            Those photos are outstanding!! You two have some balls. Must bookmark…..

            • L. Wrong Hubturd

              Balls don’t make good bookmarks. I tried once………once.

          • aquaclara

            Love the pics!!! Thanks for taking them and for sharing! Hope you had fun at the Southern SP Society wing-ding!!

          • Casabeca

            The pics are sooo good. TY!

          • L. Wrong Hubturd

            I can’t believe you turkeys had so much fun when I was not around. Dammit!

            I wonder if Howdy saw the picture of the cute, ginger sea ogre you got there? We might not hear from him for a little while.

        • Douglas D. Douglas

          Mmmmm. It’s like a cathedral! It’s like one of those inspiring structures built for the ages, that will inspire and encourage people to seek a higher purpose in life. I cannot imagine that anyone would think otherwise…

        • aquaclara

          The Southern SP Society is totally awesome! Love the pics, which are around here somewhere! (I lost my place when I clicked out). Thanks for sharing them, and glad you all had a blast!

          • Robert Eckert

            When you follow a link, remember to right-click instead of left-click; it will then let you “Open link in new tab” so your place in the current tab is undisturbed.

            • aquaclara

              Thank you, Robert. I click on so many things-there are always great rabbit holes to follow here. It wasn ‘t so bad when there were a couple hundred comments. Now, it’s a bit more challenging. Love the techie solution!

    • DamOTclese2

      David is already “paying up” by handing a great deal of money to the various incompetent, dimwitted lawyers he hires. Still, it’s merely a business expense to him, it’s the cost of running a criminal enterprise but even so, it’s his remaining customers that are footing the bill, it’s no skin off his nose.

    • Mrs Libnish

      I think they want to take it all the way and get DM on the stand. But if it does end up being a payday, I believe it will be a cold day in hell before she/they sign a NDA. Marty has been pretty vocal up until now and has given a lot of details in his latest book. I don’t think he has ever been forced to sign a gag order. I think he has been holding onto these details until he needed them. Like now.

  • Krew13

    I bet Miscmidget has been throwing hissy fit after hissy fit since this lawsuit and then the Ellen interview yesterday. I wonder what it looks like when Tiny Fists throws a tantrum?

    http://www.examiner.com/images/blog/wysiwyg/image/tantrum.gif

    • GlibWog

      OMG ..hahahhaha…

      Mama says ( back in the day..) .. ” Now Davey stand tall honey..”

    • RMycroft

      The man is definitely several Dorothys short of a Kansas.

  • Couch_Incident

    Congratulations to Marty on passing the bar! Oh, wait…. Congratulations to Marty on getting his paralegal certificate! Oh, wait… Congratulations to Marty on working as a legal assistant! Oh wait…

    • i-Betty

      Chucklesome :D

    • richelieu jr

      Don’t confuse ‘Passing the Bar’ with actually walking head high under the Limbo Stick….

  • Observer

    Ladies and gentlemen, I present David “One-Trick Pony” Miscavige’s new go-to legal strategy: disqualify the plaintiff’s attorneys by filing whiny motions containing spurious and ridiculous claims of attorney-client confidentiality breaches! It’s the spectacularly brilliant legal strategizing we’ve come to expect from this 10th-grade dropout.

    • Krew13

      His whole life has been one wrapped in cotton wool, having slaves do his bidding while he lives a life of luxury. The punk fuck wouldn’t last 2 seconds in a real job. He hasn’t got the intelligence, the basic life skills or the talent. He’s a worthless oxygen thief piece of shit.

      • Poison Ivy

        And those brilliant Scientology “communication skills”? Behold exhibit A: http://www.ami.com.au/~bradw/cos/Lisa/dm1.htm

      • Michael Leonard Tilse

        As one of my erstwhile coworkers once said: “….are a waste of CARBON!”

        • Missionary Kid

          O.K. I’m publishing THINGS SAID ABOUT DM You’ll have to refresh to see it.
          THINGS SAID ABOUT DM
          DM’s so short he can’t have fallen arches. They have no place to go.
          He’s so short he’s never seen the bottom ½ of a movie.
          He’s so short he thinks short bread is just bread.
          He Who Should Probably Wear Lifts
          He’s so short, he poses for trophies!
          DM’s dialect is called “COBorrea”
          Miscavage’s Law: If there’s a way of fucking things up, he will.
          If it’s a Co$ footbullet, thank DM.
          DMSCOHB
          McSlappy ~ welcome to co$ – would you like fries with your stupor-powered dementia?
          That little fucker bites ankles!!!
          Management by Miscavige = management by unusual solutions.
          He’s so ignorant he could Fuck Up a Wet Dream
          DM – so short that an ant would have to stand on a dime to piss on his head
          A dictator who’s smaller than you think
          Computer animation about book sales that DM is hyping :Top Ten Dwarves Who Lie With Statistics!
          COBwebs: what fills your brain if you listen to DM.
          David Miscavige … Single Handedly Clearing the Planet — One Family a Day, One Limb at a Time (ref: cutting down oak trees at Flag).
          The word “miscaviage” sounds like a bad facial skin disease.
          Just when you can’t imagine him being any more of a wanker, he up-wankers himself.
          Davey’s speech: dwarf’s drivel.
          Davey’s speech: dwarf’s dribble.
          A waste of carbon.

          • Michael Leonard Tilse

            Nice.

          • richelieu jr

            The Miscavige Diet: A half pint of milk, small fries and a short order of shrimp.

            • Missionary Kid

              Great. refresh.

      • DamOTclese2

        The punk fuck wouldn’t last 2 seconds on the witness stand.

        • WildaBeast

          “What does ‘Texas’ mean?”

      • Mrs Libnish

        He also can’t help slapping people around…frowned upon in the workplace, so I’m told.

      • richelieu jr

        The punk fuck wouldn’t last two seconds with real punks, or actually fucking.

        He’s three feet tall and has spent his whole life being told how tall he is, how big ‘it’ is and how amazing he is.

        All he had to do was outwit a drug addled old man and a bunch of teenage girls to take control of the whole shebang. He’s never had to actually accomplish anything that any moron wouldn’t do with a billion dollars to throw at the problem and tens of thousands of human drones…

        And he’s still had mediocre results…

    • Bury_The_Nuts

      Poor Nevada! Everybody is always trying to dump toxic waste there…

  • Unit G-Xenu’s Other Fist

    What. A. Dipshit.

    That is all :-D

    • GlibWog

      Oh Unit.. That is all that is needed..ha.. Less is More when Asshole is involved..ugh

  • aquaclara

    I wonder if it’s possible to annoy the judge before a trial has even begun….

    • WhereIsSHE

      OH…. there is ample time to annoy a judge before the trial actually begins.
      Trials don’t start for months (sometimes years) after the initial pleading has been filed.

      I so hope that those Texas Supreme Court decisions cited in the Motion were improperly cited as authority. Sooooo hope it., because it will establish a pattern of disingenuousness from the defendants, which no judge, no matter how fair, can put aside in his/her assessment of future representations those parties make to the court.

      *****
      I don’t know that this judge will be “annoyed”, and I mean that as more of a compliment about his judicial temperament. I posted some information about him yesterday. If they are playing games with the case-law cited in this Motion, it will just add to the already shaky credibility they are establishing for themselves.

      • sugarplumfairy

        “…If they are playing games..it will just add to the already shaky credibility they are establishing for themselves..”. I lovvvvve when they do that..

        • TheHoleDoesNotExist

          This is one of those sociopath/narcisstic characters that are so endearing. Even with an army of lawyers with the highest billable hours, he has to do it His Way. Then the lawyers have to spend a Lot more billable hours fixing it and eventually winning. Of course, people like DM will know, they just Know, it was their brilliant idea that won the day. Which means they will forever insist on doing That thing, even when advised against it.
          It’s kind of karmic in a way. I have seen this phenomenon before personally, but there are other stellar examples of someone like him bringing themselves down because of insisting on doing it their way.

          • RMycroft

            You take the lies out of him, and he’ll shrink to the size of your hat;

            You take the malice out of him, and he’ll disappear.

            ‘Mark Twain’

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              Always love me some Mark Twain with my coffee. Thanks. And this is So appropriate.

            • RMycroft

              There is no character, howsoever good and fine, but it can be destroyed by
              ridicule, howsoever poor and witless. Observe the ass, for instance: his
              character is about perfect, he is the choicest spirit among all the humbler
              animals, yet see what ridicule has brought him to. Instead of feeling
              complimented when we are called an ass, we are left in doubt.
              — Mark Twain, “Pudd’nhead Wilson’s Calendar”

              I just installed Fortunes on my Raspberry Pi.

            • WildaBeast

              Totally off-topic but AAHHHHHH stop writing the word coffee! I’m…I’m…/whispers sadly…I’m out
              No, can’t stand it. BRB.
              /runs off to store for coffee

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              We’ll wait!

            • Robert Eckert

              {We’ll wait!} sure sure, we’ll make sure you have to read 500 comments to get caught up.

            • WildaBeast

              LOL Robert, ain’t it the truth! I had to finish the Leah and Ellen thread this morning before I could even start here!
              But I gave it up and just ran to the corner store for two cups of coffee…I love that my corner store sells coffee :-)

            • Poison Ivy

              I had to go back to it. Tony posting twice in a day – there goes my life productivity forever!

            • WildaBeast

              ^^^^^ This. I fell asleep at 2am, woke up at 9:50 (sad, I know), and immediately grabbed the laptop…sigh. Dammit why does the Bunker have to be so awesome!

            • DamOTclese2

              The Bunker has become an obsession. :) Won’t somebody somewhere develop a technology to rid us of our obsessive personality disorders? (And our invisible murdered space alien fragment infestation while they’re at it?)

            • WildaBeast

              Ah well, there are worse obsessions to have. This one only costs me the $24/month it takes to keep my internet going. Seriously, I won the computer I’m typing on, so I don’t even have to factor that in!

            • WildaBeast

              Awww, thanks!

          • Poison Ivy

            I’m watching it right now in another situation. It’s astonishing, the way some people double down on bad decisions time and time again because once, long ago, they got lucky and had a good outcome (or fooled someone) using the same strategy. It’s like a drug addict chasing that first high year after year with more and more drugs and never quite hitting it. It also proves what my dear late mother told me, quoting Mark Twain, “If you never lie, you never have to remember anything.” And of course, “Oh what a tangled web….”

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              Exactly. I’m watching it right now in Two situations! That’s why I noticed it. That’s an interesting analogy of chasing the first high.

            • Poison Ivy

              One of the hallmarks of a narcissistic sociopath is a kind of grandiosity and feeling of invulnerability that results in recklessness. Whereas your garden variety professional crook (probably falling somewhere on the scale of sociopathy but not necessarily a full-blown narcissist) realizes he or she can get caught and proceeds with more caution.

            • DamOTclese2

              :) Continuing the Mark Twain thread, when the Duke and the King of England were committing their “Nonsuch” scams against town people along the Mississippi River, they “felt” the time was right to pack up, rook the citizens of a few more dimes, and then light out just before the rails, tar, and feathers festivities were scheduled to begin. :)

              David Miscviage will eventually run ahead of the Federal arms reaching for him, and a buck says he’s successful at evading imprisonment, spending the rest of his slapping life resting comfortably in Argentina or some other third world country that lacks formal extradition agreements.

            • Robert Eckert

              The Duke and the Dauphin messed up the timing once, and once was all it took. I do not share your belief that Davey is competent enough to run fast enough.

            • DamOTclese2

              Some how I don’t like the image of a naked David Miscaviage covered in tar with feathers handing from a rail being paraded around town. Toss a blanket over the whole mess and THAT would be something I could pay a dollar to see!

            • richelieu jr

              Ahem, “The Duke and the Dolphin!”

            • Robert Eckert

              No, the Duke and the Dauphin. If you were American you would have been made to read the story when you young:

              http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adventures_of_Huckleberry_Finn#In_Arkansas:_the_duke_and_the_king

            • richelieu jr

              No, I’ve read it alright. I love it!.

              I was referring the fact that Huck misunderstands the word (but secretly gets it right: Twain spent a ot of time in France and would have known that ‘Dauphin’, as well as referring to the missing prince, means literally ‘dolphin’…

            • Robert Eckert

              I see.

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              I’ll raise it to $2 (for the popcorn, but I’d bring the tar and feathers any day. I think they still carry it in some backwood florida stores here.. I’m pretty sure Bury can get some in her neck of the woods)

            • WildaBeast

              Tar shouldn’t be too hard…as for feathers, I’m pretty sure there are still some really old feather pillows up at my dad and stepmom’s place that would be willing to sacrifice their lives for such a worthy cause. I can UPS them?

            • Douglas D. Douglas

              Drug highs and Scientology wins… the illusion that keeps on luring the credulous.

            • monkeyknickers

              Credulity is just another way to say “taking something on faith”. (sly funny grin and a big kiss)

            • Douglas D. Douglas

              If one is willing to accept ANYTHING “on faith” then yes, it is credulity.

            • monkeyknickers

              And how do you decide to parse the believables and unbelievables?

            • monkeyknickers

              You’ve just described my love life.

              Well . . . .up to the lying bit. I go so far in the other direction that I’m kinda thinking its just as bad.

              :)

            • Poison Ivy

              I hear ya, Monkey…it took me a little while to stop hitting the “repeat” button in that department myself! ;-)

            • DamOTclese2

              That behavior, that human primate mental construct, is why Las Vegas exists., Occasional positive feedback, selection bias, selective memory, the occasional win is what the primate brain remembers the most, the more frequent losses are dismissed or deprioritized, thus we have dimwits that go to Las Vegas thinking there is a chance of walking away winners. It’s how that Diminutive Dimwit manages to keep stepping his little feet in it every single time.

          • DamOTclese2

            :) Selective memory, selection bias. David loses civil and criminal cases and he wins civil and criminal cases, and he always takes a hands-on approach making sure that his lawyers have to stumble over his idiot, stupid feet every step of the way. And it’s the wins that the insane loon only remembers, quite likely, reinforcing the psychopath’s beliefs that he’s unbeatable, reinforcing the psychopath’s belief that he must get involved in every legal case.

          • Michael Leonard Tilse

            So what about the (supposed) tactic of irritating the judge with nonsense or out of courtroom influence, and then demanding the judge’s recusal because of bias?

      • BananaSplits8

        Ricardo G. Cedillo is a Harvard law grad. He does not do justice to himself if he’s misusing case law and knowingly breaching standards of decorum. Dubiously accusing and personally attacking a fellow officer of the court (Jeffrey) as being “unprofessional, unethical and immoral” shouldn’t sit too well with the court either.

        • WhereIsSHE

          Ad hominem attacks go over so well. *eyeroll*
          Cedillo must know this, and so we can fairly imagine that those statements are “client-driven”.

          I do not envy the judge (but I envy his law clerk, assuming he has one, because the private discussions in chambers are going to be some of the most interesting ones the clerk will ever have in his/her entire professional career.)

          • BananaSplits8

            In this particular situation, his client-driven statements are making him look like a Taft Correspondence School of Law graduate rather than Harvard.

            It’s his signature at the end of those motions.

            • DamOTclese2

              But Banana, consider the money that he’s adding to the law firm’s coffers and the fact that having a major loss recorded in the firm’s win/loss columns being utterly irrelevant when people checking his firm’s record sees that the firm lost a Scientology crime syndicate case.

              I would hope that most people seeking lawyer assistance in civil and criminal matters would recognize the Scientology label is essentially guaranteeing a loss regardless of the competence or incompetence of the law firm representing Scientology.

              At the end of the day, the law firm IRS tax statements enumerating the firms’ revenues will show a big chunk of money handed over by Tom Cruise, and that growing bank account is all that such law firms care about.

          • DamOTclese2

            (Judge mutters under her breath) “Why do I always! get the assholes? Why?!

        • DamOTclese2

          To be fair, Cedillo works for a law firm that only concerns itself with billable hours, they don’t do justice, they don’t do truth or fiction, all that Cedillo and the law firm cares about is taking the money that Tom Cruise hands to David and following David’s thrice-daily commands over the telephone.

          Hopefully Cedillo and his fellow fucktards in that law office have a translator that can explain what a screaming rant of “MAKE IT GO RIGHT!!!11″ means out here in the wog world.

          • WildaBeast

            “MAKE IT GO RIGHT!!!11″
            /feeds into Babelfish, sets to Wog World translation:
            “I NEED A MIRACLE!!!11″

            • Public Buggering

              “‘Cuse me, stewardess, I speak Wog.”

      • Poison Ivy

        He seems to be a very salt of the earth guy from what you posted, more slow and deliberate than impatient. But like so many ranchers/salt of the earth folk I have met in my travels – the folksiness often disguises an uncanny ability to spot a faker right off the bat.

      • stateofcircle

        Good Morning, WIS. I went a-lookin’ for the information you mentioned you posted yesterday about the judge in this case and couldn’t find it. If it isn’t too much trouble, could you possibly oblige us with said information again? And as always, thank you very, very much for all of your insightful comments, they are incredibly helpful.

        • ThetaBara

          You can click the username for a comment history.
          good morning!

          • stateofcircle

            That’s what I did and I couldn’t find it :/

    • Lark Smith

      Obnoxious behavior when dealing with the legal systems of the world is apparently one of their sooper powerz. CO$ has mastered arrogant and obnoxious! I hope they get spanked by this judge. Crap work is interfering with my Bunker addiction. I looking forward to catching up later. :-)

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      Are you kidding? There’s a whole course and checksheet and drill baby drill program on how to annoy and or much worse to figures like judges.

    • DamOTclese2

      David should drown the Judge’s dog. That always works.

    • Public Buggering

      I think it likely that Judges get immune to the abject core criminality of lawyers, nothing that lawyers do in court or in their filed papers probably make seasoned Judges angry to the point of ordering jail time after a while, I would think.

      • aquaclara

        I hope the judge sees through the Scilon bs on this case…It’s already looking like a circus.

  • Marc Headley

    This may or not be the proper time and place to talk about this, but there was one subject that David Miscavige often brought up when we were producing Criminon videos at the Int Base. Prison Rape. The guy seems very fixated on not being ass raped at some point in his life.

    Year after year the same thing would happen. We’d be editing away and he would come in to watch the video and at some point or another prison rape would be brought up by him.

    Pretty sure that all of his legal wranglings are intended to make sure one that one thing does not happen.

    David Miscavige – writing big checks that his ass would rather not cash!

    • EnthralledObserver

      The horse has bolted on that, I reckon… as friendly advise to him, though it is already too late, my suggestion would be to NOT commit any crimes which might have you end in prison…

      • WhereIsSHE

        Too late. He’s probably committing more crimes as we type.

      • Collin

        I heard Charles Manson needs a new cell mate…

        • EnthralledObserver

          Makemerich will be joining him in a couple years at the latest, I should imagine. Can you tell him to be patient, Jeffrey is doing his best.

        • GlibWog

          Welcome Collin… So glad to see you! Keep coming back.. Glibby

    • Observer

      “David Miscavige – writing big checks that his ass would rather not cash!”

      omg, I’m going to be laughing at this all day!

      • VickiStubing

        Any chance we’ll be blessed by an Obs shoop based on that? Pretty pretty please?

        • Jon Hendry

          Maybe Miscavige talking to the pilot from Airplane, the “Turkish prison” scene.

          • tetloj

            Judging frem the stage paraphernalia he commissions I think Dinky is into movies about gladiators

        • Observer

          Mmmmaybe … it’ll have to wait till after work though

          • i-Betty

            Do NOT overdo it, Obs. We love your shoops but we don’t want to take you away from home-life. So you are permitted one cup of coffee when you get in. Don’t thank me! We thank you :D

    • Pepsicat

      I see that oiliness table coming in handy for him.

    • Mark

      Breaking news from RTC:

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        We need all kinds of warnings before these…thank you.

      • i-Betty

        Classic!

      • WildaBeast

        ROFL…you know, a shiv would make short work of those.
        Now, a titanium case…err, male chastity belt…THAT might keep him safe on that {awful} (read: deliriously happy) day…

        • Mark

          They’re only the last line of defence, under the chain-mail jockey-shorts.

          • WildaBeast

            Oooh, those would pinch!

            • Mark

              And rust…

            • WildaBeast

              You know, ordinarily that mental image would make me gag and shudder. Then I realized it was DM we were talking about, and I smiled.

            • Mark

              (Evil chortling).

        • Missionary Kid

          May he lose the key when he has to go to the bathroom.

          • WildaBeast

            May he flush the key down the crapper by mistake…

            • Missionary Kid

              First good laugh of the morning. Thanks.

            • WildaBeast

              For you, Kid, anytime. Always a pleasure :-)

            • GlibWog

              MAY HE FLUSH HIMSELF DOWN the crapper by mistake

            • WildaBeast

              Heeeey! You’re up and about! Good morning!
              And, yes, that might be an ideal solution :-)

            • GlibWog

              Yippee I am up.. Let’s get this party started..
              Actually 2 hrs ago I got up to go to the Potty.. came here ..

              realized I didn’t get my sleep out and went back to bed..ha

      • Public Buggering

        I’d buy that for a dollar!

        • Mark

          $34.95 plus postage & packing.

      • hellboundalleee

        So is that ^ “The Hole” I keep hearing about?

      • Leslie Stipe

        Now see, I didn’t almost lose my lunch today from this pic. Ironic, isn’t it?

        This has made me laugh every time I’ve seen it today.

        • Mark

          Regular Bunkerites have cast-iron stomachs (and waterproof keyboards, just in case).

    • Poison Ivy

      That’s fascinating, Marc. To me that means that somewhere, subliminally, he understands that what he’s doing is very very criminal.
      I love these little day-to-day details you share about life in Golden Age Productions. Little Davey micromanaged those things even worse than a network executive!

      • Snake Plissken

        There is nothing subliminal about it, he know perfectly well he is a criminal, that is why there was a labyrinth of shadow organizations set up to protect him.

        • EnthralledObserver

          Exactly.

        • Vistaril

          Yep . . . thanks to the 1977 Julie Christofferson Titchbourne case, Scientology was proved to be fraud from beginning to end. It was that court case which, in large part, prompted L Ron Hubbard to brew up his alphabet soup concoction of corporate bodies. While this citadel of criminals was constructed, a parallel operation was put in place to bring down the religious cloaking which, alas, remains largely intact in the US and even within some areas of the critic community.

          • WildaBeast

            “Alphabet soup concoction of corporate bodies” – well-described, Vistaril!

          • Poison Ivy

            I don’t know much about that case except all the CO$ celebs flew to Oregon shouting “religious persecution”, and the judge reversed the ruling. Is there any evidence the judge was “gotten to”?

            • Vistaril

              There’s court testimony . . .

              A Portland judge who presided over a fraud trial involving the Church of Scientology in 1979 was the target of a covert operation by the church aimed at learning his attitudes about drug usage and sexual promiscuity, a former Scientologist testified Thursday . . .

              [I]n his first full day on the stand, [Martin L. SamueLs, former head of the church in Portland] said the intelligence branch of Scientology devised a plan in 1979 to seek to learn the attitudes of Circuit Judge Robert P. Jones on several subjects before Jones presided over the first trial.

              Samuels said Scientologists called Jones’ home posing as a telephone survey company and attempted to elicit information from Jones’ wife. He also said he received orders to put Jones under surveillance by two Scientologists.

              “The point of their caper was to get his attitudes, “his buttons”, regarding sex, promiscuity and drugs, so we would know how best to present ourselves and how best to present Julie (Titchbourne) and any of her witnesses in the worst possible light,” he said.

              Earlier witnesses have identified “buttons” in Scientology jargon as subjects about which individuals care deeply or which cause emotional reactions when mentioned or “pushed.”

              Samuels also said the plan involved placing a court watcher in Jones’ courtroom well in advance of the trial :”to see what got his interest, what angered him, what amused him and to see how we could present [our case] . . . “

            • Poison Ivy

              Evil buggers. Was Samuels the judge who ruled against Julie?

            • Michael Leonard Tilse

              Martin Samuels was the scientology mission holder who owned the church of scientology mission of davis chain and who started delphian foundation which morphed into delphian school.

            • Vistaril

              Ahh . . . sorry, didn’t realise that was the judge you were referring to. The judge who voided the decision was Judge Donald H. Londer who was actually responsible for the mistrial by fucking up his summation. Deliberate? I dunno. Wouldn’t suprise me. You could ask Marty Rathburn or Mike Rinder, they would know for sure. Good luck with that. I gotta scram right now but will have a rummage around later to see what I can see.

            • Poison Ivy

              Thanks Vistaril, you’re a great researcher!

            • richelieu jr

              Well, the statute of limitations is probably over for that one, so they might show the slightest sign of a backbone on that subject… ah, who am I kidding?

            • coonellie

              Evil buggers…hahaha…just not the buggees

            • Gus_Cox

              Nay, Martin Samuels was a co-founder of the Delphian School, and owner of COSMOD (Church of Scientology Mission of Davis) in Davis, CA.

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        Yes, it is a rare climpse in the movie “Being David Miscavige”. I love how Marc writes too! The details bring this nightmare of a figure to life.

        He makes it real to outsiders that people like Miscavige get by with so much because it is So unreal and unbelievable.

        • ThetaBara

          I’ve learned that it isn’t a good idea to give too much information at once when talking with folks who are new to the subject or it is very easy to give the impression that you are actually the crazy one.

          • TheHoleDoesNotExist

            This is so true!

          • Mrs Libnish

            Been there, done that. Don’t care :)

      • DamOTclese2

        Poison, here is the transcript of David’s bizarre “Public Buggering” outburst:

        http://personal.linkline.com/frice/bugger.htm

        • WildaBeast

          Just…wow. I can’t even believe I read that. That was said in a COURTROOM? Did the judge manage to keep a straight face?!

          • DamOTclese2

            This was a deposition of The Dwarf which, for some insane reason, The Dwarf permitted himself to actually attend. I don’t know if the Judge ever actually read the depositions or whether the Judge was present during this amazing outburst.

    • Tony DePhillips

      I hope to see cob in prison getting trained how to behave like a human one day.

    • Tony DePhillips
    • InTheNameOfXenu

      Yep, getting corn-hauled is definitely on The Midget’s mind. if he did go to the slammer, wouldn’t it be more of a Federal Country Club type where white-collar criminals go?

      • WildaBeast

        Depends. If he was deemed to be at high risk of escaping, or of being busted out, they might slap him in medium-security just to make sure he stayed where he was supposed to be. And I think a good case could be made that some last few true believers might try to bust him out…

        • Poison Ivy

          Also depends on what he ultimately gets convicted for….if it involves false imprisonment or other potential crimes of that nature, that changes the whole equation.

          • WildaBeast

            Oh, if they could nail him for the shit that went down in the Hole…now THAT would be justice.

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              I Love that dream.

          • Marie Claire Wolf

            No bail – passport relinquished to the court. Who wouldn’t love that!

            • WildaBeast

              One person: Tiny Tyrant.
              :-)

            • richelieu jr

              I’m sure he could NEVER get a new /fake passport. Or ten.

        • Chee Chalker

          Tiny Dancer would flee to a jurisdiction that does not extradite to the US in advance of incarceration, or even the risk of incarceration. They probably have enough moles in various law enforcement depts. to get wind of any impending actions/arrests. And we all know his bosom buddy TC is a pilot. I’m sure he and TC would just happen to be opening an Ideal Morgue in, let’s say, Morocco, when the police would come knocking. If it ever gets to the point where justice prevails and this man is arrested for crimes against humanity, I hope he is not given bail. Because we all know DM will post whatever it cost and then, “bye bye Davey”. But this is going to be very interesting…….is DM going to settle and pay his arch enemy, #1 apostate the hard-swindled donations from his followers? Or, will he risk being deposed? The anticipation I feel is greater than what a 4th grader feels for Halloween and Christmas combined!!

      • Poison Ivy

        Not all white-collar criminals go to those prisons.

        • richelieu jr

          Wherever he might go, he’d be separated from the general population…

      • 1subgenius

        The American Cornhole Association
        http://www.playcornhole.org/

        Yes, I am a member, for real, and proudly wear the most awesome hat evah.

        • Robert Eckert

          When he was Romney’s running mate, Paul Ryan caused a bit of a flap when he casually he had spent his afternoon playing cornhole with an 11-year-old:

          http://www.dispatch.com/content/stories/local/2012/09/01/ryan-attends-osu-miami-game.html

          • 1subgenius

            You sir have made my day.

            Also the article contained this quote:

            “It’s good PR and a good way to potentially expose yourself to 100,000 people in a swing state,” said Derek Ensign, 29, of Marblehead, Ohio,”

            You cannot make this stuff up.

            • WildaBeast

              ROFL @ cornholing and “potentially expose yourself to 100,000 people”.

            • Robert Eckert

              100,000 swingers…

            • richelieu jr

              ..can’t be wrong!

            • Sibs

              But but but it’s a cultural pastime! We played it every day when I was in the hospital! And at church picnics, and- oh hell, this is just sounding worse.

          • 1subgenius

            One of the benefits of membership

            “ACA members are eligible for the Cornholer of the Year award presented annually”

            Anyway,I think they meant annually.

    • Captain Howdy

      Was he a big fan of the David Mamet film “Edmond”?

      http://youtu.be/d8XVFXck0-g

      • Michael Leonard Tilse

        I thought that was an exceptional film. “Every fear hides a wish, don’t you think?”

    • Chocolate Velvet

      LMAO! Reminds me of Tom DuBois from “the Boondocks”. Marc, did it go a little something like this?

      http://m.adultswim.com/video/the-boondocks/toms-anal-rape-thing.html

    • ThetaBara

      Recently there have been a lot of prison rape jokes on these lawsuit threads. Normally I find rape jokes of any sort extremely distasteful. However, I may just have to make an exception for Miss Cabbage.

      • WildaBeast

        Yeah, I know. I’m not normally a huge fan myself, Theta…but…regarding Homunculus Horribilis, all bets are off.

    • Zana

      Sounds like his focus on it is pulling it right into him. Ahhhh…the technology of the mind.

    • DamOTclese2

      Here is the link to the transcript extract:

      David Public Buggering Outburst

      Fascinating to see what runs through that loon’s head constantly, isn’t it?

    • Mrs Libnish

      Don’t drop the soap, DM!!

    • Erica

      Wow. He seems under the impression someone would actually be WILLING to ass rape him.

      • WildaBeast

        Tee-hee! I wouldn’t touch it with a 10-foot dildo!

        • ThetaBara

          I wouldn’t touch it with YOUR 10 foot dildo!

      • GlibWog

        Welcome Erica.. Funny, Funny.. hahahhahahhaah

      • richelieu jr

        Oh, I’d do it. I’m straight, but I would make him suffer, believe me.

    • ziontologist

      Thanks for the good laugh, Marc. Just like when I read your book. It was well written, though I had to put it down a few times because I was laughing so hard!

    • Deeana

      It is because he is little. Like a girl. Fair-haired, non-hairy bodied little guys are the preferred targets for prison rape. (One of my good friends was a prison nurse for several years.)

      • GlibWog

        Hi Deeana.. Welcome aboard.. Yep.. I am sure that it scares him to death..

    • monkeyknickers

      Damn – I wrote a post recently about the very same thing. And obviously I’m on the outside looking in and it’s crystal clear – CRYSTAL – that the guy has a gay issue. Shit – even in that interview with Ted Koppel the one piece of evidence he brought along to prove that “psychs are bad”, was all about anal compulsion.

      For the life of me I cannot imagine the inner strength it took for poor Ted to not BURST into laughter.

      • WildaBeast

        Diaphragm of STEEL…facial muscles, too!

      • Casabeca

        Yes, yes, yes!

        • monkeyknickers

          Haha Casa – that’s the title of one of my tunes. :)

          • Casabeca

            It would be a thrill to hear it someday! “next on the top 10 countdown is yes,yes,yes by the monkeyknickers! “.
            Girl can dream…

      • OTVIIIisGrrr8!
        • Observer

          I see him as more of a metrosexual.

    • Public Buggering

      Somebody call my name?

      • GlibWog

        Welcome to the Bunker PB… OMG Lovin the Name.. Perfect timing..hahahha

        • Public Buggering

          Thank you! Any time my name is mentioned anywhere on the Intertubes, I’ll be there.

          • GlibWog

            You are funny… hahahhahaa intertubes.. ha

  • WhereIsSHE

    If you take the arguments in this Motion to Disqualify to their logical conclusion, they are incredulously suggesting to the court that NO lawyer can represent Monique

    Without getting into a long explanation of what is and what is not protected by the attorney-client privilege, the final analysis is just as Scott explained.

    Also:

    Look at paragraphs 19 and 20 of the Motion to Disqualify.
    They allege that a Texas Supreme Court decision “requires” dismissal in paragraph 19.
    Then, in paragraph 20, they quote from that decision (which is actually quoting a prior Texas Supreme Court decision.)
    Notice how they selectively emphasize, via bold type, only part of the sentence in that decision.
    Notice how they selectively leave the “under some circumstances” part of that sentence unbolded.

    I would have to go and read both of those opinions to even determine whether either one is even apposite, let alone to determine whether they are quoting from the actual “holding” of the case vs. just quoting “dicta”. I’m going to go out on a limb and guess that they are not, since there is zero discussion of those cases on the merits and how they should govern the court’s opinion in this case, which is how you do it when you do it properly.

    • RMycroft

      Standard Scientology Legal Playbook:
      [√] Move to remove the other side’s lawyers.

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        I actually understood this, when reading their argument. No Lawyers for You! Because No One has a right to speak, ever, about anything. Except David Miscavige. He truly has gone over the edge. Little Hitler, Little Napoleon, take your picks.

        • Missionary Kid

          I already had Little Hitler on the list. Little Napoleon I didn’t. A couple of more nicknames, ant the list will hit 190. Yes, there are spelling and word order variations.

          When the list hits 200, I’ll probably publish it again.

          • WildaBeast

            I don’t know if you caught them, but Misdamage, and Damage Mismanage were used this morning…

            • Missionary Kid

              Thanks, that puts me up to 190 total J&D names for DM

          • richelieu jr

            I think Napoleon (Bonaparte) WAS the ‘little Napoleon’, actually.

            • WildaBeast

              He was under five foot three? I guess that was easier to accomplish 200 years ago.

            • ThetaBara

              That’s why it’s funnay.

            • Missionary Kid

              But Davy has the smaller mind.

            • WildaBeast

              Yeah…Napoleon mostly won…and they still study his tactics in REAL schools.

    • WildaBeast

      “If you take the arguments in this Motion to Disqualify to their logical
      conclusion, they are incredulously suggesting to the court that NO
      lawyer can represent Monique.”

      Oh, they’d like that, wouldn’t they? Seriously, just how supple are the spines of Tiny Tyrant’s lawyers? I don’t know if there’s a check big enough to make me do what they’re doing right now (even if I was a lawyer). For one thing, I’d worry about my future reputation in the legal world if I *ever* took a case for Scientology.
      Also: how fucking insane is a case in which, before it even starts, the defendants are suggesting that the plaintiff should go unrepresented?! How does that even make any sense? The exasperation factor alone might give the poor judge an aneurysm or a heart attack. I hope he’s in good health, because seriously? Head ‘sploding time.

      • ze moo

        Many lawyers aspire to elected office, many just chase the ambulances and chase the big bucks. Why are lawyers unafraid to swim in the ocean? Sharks give ‘professional courtesy’…..Disparaging every member of the bar is unfair, the large majority do try to live up to the best qualities of Clarence Darrow and Abraham Lincoln. But I do like a good lawyer joke…..

        • WildaBeast

          Q: What do you call 500 lawyers at the bottom of the ocean?
          A: A good start.

          And no, I really don’t hate all lawyers. Hell, the one I have right now is offering to review all our paperwork at no charge because my wife does harm reduction work; how awesome is that?

          • N. Graham

            The difference between a dead dog and a dead lawyer in the road:
            No skid marks by the lawyer.

            • Missionary Kid

              I’m having trouble typing, I laughed so hard.

              I’ve told this one before:
              A guy stands up in a bar and shouts, “Attorneys are assholes.”
              A second guy in the back says, “I object.”
              First guy, “Are you an attorney?”
              Second guy, “No, an asshole.”

            • ThetaBara

              Bahahaha! That’s the first new to me lawyer joke I’ve heard in ages!

            • Missionary Kid

              You must have missed it when I posted it before. I hadn’t seen the one about the dog and lawyer.

            • ThetaBara

              Hey, I’ve got something for one of your lists!
              “ScientLOLogy” – the study of Joking & Degrading!
              Hope you’ve had a great weekend.

            • N. Graham

              Another good one!

            • Missionary Kid

              Thanks.

        • richelieu jr

          All:
          God save your majesty!

          Cade:
          I thank you, good people—there shall be no money; all shall
          eat and drink on my score, and I will apparel them all in one
          livery, that they may agree like brothers, and worship me their
          lord.

          Dick:
          The first thing we do, let’s kill all the lawyers.

          Cade:
          Nay, that I mean to do.

          Henry The Sixth, Part 2 Act 4, scene 2, 71–78

    • ThetaBara

      And the only way to do it is to Do It Properly!

      (SFW! Unlike SOME people’s videos!)

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7x9iDaGdGWY

    • Public Buggering

      “You don’t have the RANK! to try me in a court of law!!!”

      • Eclipse-girl

        Remember you must use expletives

  • monkeyknickers

    You know . . . . . this whole thing has become pretty absurd. It’s like watching Bobby Fischer play a round against my dog.

    Christ.

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      Thank you for the imagery! Those guard dogs of DM’s in front of Flag have really sunk into our brains. You can’t buy those kind of “I Am a Crook and Cult Leader” visuals.

    • Robert Eckert
      • kemist

        I’ve heard the expression that debating with creationists is like wrestling like a pig. The pig likes it and it’s you who gets dirty.

        There’s one autralian biologist who also famously answered to a creationist who wanted to have a debate with him : “That would look good on your CV. Not so much on mine.”

        • WildaBeast

          Creationists, honestly, I have very little patience for. You want to believe in a Higher Power? Fine. I was an agnostic until I had some experiences that made me unable to deny the existence of *something* – just don’t call it God, ’cause that gets people thinking of a dude in a white robe and long beard who interferes with people’s lives, and that’s not what I saw (okay, “saw” is the wrong word, but “perceived” isn’t quite right either, and the more I talk about this the more woo I sound). But folks who can look at fossils, radiocarbon dating, younger and younger fossils that *show* evolution happening, set in stone…and then still want to argue that God made the world from scratch? Learn some freaking subtlety in your belief systems or STFU. I don’t even try to argue with creationists on the rare occasions I meet one. I either change the topic, or leave.
          Addendum: I am very wary of organized religion because all of them ask you to take things on faith. I would never debate with an atheist or an agnostic. If you’ve experienced something for yourself, well and good. Otherwise, I think healthy skepticism or the admission that there’s no way of knowing is probably the sanest attitude.

          • kemist

            If all religion (or spirituality) was that reasonable, I don’t think anyone would have any problem with it (except maybe people who don’t accept that other people may be different from them. God (ha!) knows there are atheists who are nasty assholes.)

            I just have a major problem with the very idea of revealed Truth. It’s like taking down the firewall to your mind. All kinds of crap can get in there, because you have absolutely no feedback mechanism. You can wake up some day in a world that’s 6000 years old, and where scientists are the tools of Satan. Or in the Sea Org, saving the world from the Evil Xenu and his horde of shock therapy obsessed psychs. Or on a plane with a boxcutter in your hand, thinking you’re just about to fulfil the will of Allah.

            Religion is a fascinating and scary thing.

            • WildaBeast

              I can’t argue that! Nor would I want to.

            • xjohnuk

              Honestly? I’m scared more by masses who have no religion. I don’t think that anyone would argue that, for example, the ten commandments are rubbish. I’m not saying you need religious faith to keep those ‘laws’, but it helps…. Anyways, $cientology is NOT and never has been a ‘religion’, so any comparison is bizarre. Yes, there is one particular faith which at the moment is truly scaring the sh*t out of most of us who are not of that persuasion, but I also acknowledge that those causing us terror are of a minority, and do not represent the majority of their faith believers. It’s not religion that is fascinating and scary… it is PEOPLE! Especially those who USE their faith as an excuse to inflict so much pain and suffering to so many, even of their own ‘religion’… Humans seem to have this innate ability to cause suffering to others. But religion can also control ‘anarchy’ if you will in society. I don’t imagine the guy who burgles my house will be attending his church any day soon.

            • jeff

              Honor thy mother and thy father doesn’t take into account screwed up parents.

            • kemist

              Most of the ten commandment are rubbish, and those that aren’t are so straightforward that all working human societies have them as implicit rules since like forever, no religion needed. Let’s review them, shall we :

              1) I am the Lord thy God. Thou shalt have no other God before me. -> useless rubish

              2) Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any
              thing in heaven above, or things which are in the earth beneath. -> moar useless rubish

              3) Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain; for the Lord will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain. -> even moar useless rubbish

              (We get it. God is a vain being who gets pissed like a two year old when he doesn’t get the respect he thinks he deserves)

              4) Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. -> pointless rubbish

              5) Honor thy father and thy mother, that thy days may be long upon the land which the Lord thy God giveth thee. -> meh. Tell that to a kid who’s been mistreated by his parents.

              6) Thou shalt not kill. -> DUH

              7) Thou shalt not commit adultery. -> Meh

              8) Thou shalt not steal. -> DUH

              9) Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor. -> DUH

              10) Thou shalt not covet. -> Aaaaand thoughtcrime.

              I is not impressed.

            • richelieu jr

              Hell, Jail is where you FIND Jesus!

          • ThetaBara

            Real science admits it doesn’t know everything. Only people who have a religious type belief in science are offended by woo.

          • monkeyknickers

            I think you should engage, Wilda. For the same reasons that we should carefully, kindly engage SO members and Scis when they appear on this blog or elsewhere. I honestly think that organized religion is brainwashing.

            For example, right before we came up here, Ash did . . . . shit I don’t even remember. Tried to kill the cat – something like that. And when she was reprimanded she burst into shaky scared tears. :(

            I said – why are you crying so much baby?

            And SHE said – Because Maria told me that when I do bad stuff I get burned up forEVER.

            I hit the fucking roof. But that’s the kind of indoctrination I’m talking about . . . . .with Christianity it starts very early, and involves threats of ETERNAL TORTURE. Not nice. Really not nice to manipulate a child with this bullshit.

            So maybe if we tell creationists over and over and over – they will hear, you know?

            • WildaBeast

              It’s really angry-making that someone told your kid that. I know it was just another kid repeating what they were told by adults, but…SO wrong to scare a child like that.
              And I do argue with religious folks about matters of faith, and doctrine, and dogma…it’s very specifically creationism that I don’t like to debate about.
              On all other matters of faith, it’s a matter of opinion: “”God makes us all how we are, right?” “Yes..” “Well, does God really want you to believe that gay folks go to hell for something they can’t help, even if they live the rest of their life in a perfectly Christ-like manner? Because the church you belong to teaches that…” That kind of thing. I can debate about matters of opinion all day without getting angry. Creationism, though, is a matter of seeing hard evidence laid out in front of you, and going “LALALALA I can’t hear you, I can’t see you!” And it’s really hard for me to have an argument with someone about evidence-based things when they won’t pay attention to the evidence.
              You’re right that maybe by continuing to make good points, we might get through to them. But I honestly don’t trust my temper around this one particular issue, and getting mad at someone only entrenches their position, mostly…and that’s the last thing I want to do.

            • monkeyknickers

              I feel you for sure, Wilda.

              I WANT to hate creationists and their on-purpose idiocy. But . . . . you catch more flies with honey than vinegar, I suppose. Not only that – as with SO and Sci folks . . . . I try to remember that they’ve been so deeply inculcated with this bullshit that they need the same patience, the same constant gentle pressure to see the truth.

              And Maria isn’t a kid – she’s the woman (who is lovely) that watches Ash when I have a long day of studio work. A grown up. Shocking.

            • Missionary Kid

              I just use their own, fixed beliefs against them by letting them make statements of “facts,” then ask them to explain…. Eventually, they contradict themselves or make statements so ridiculous that they either have to retract them, or they will end up looking ridiculous. Either way, they lose.

            • aquaclara

              Horrible story; I hope you hugged your baby girl and fixed it for good, and with some chocolate chip cookies. You are SUCH a good mom.
              We stuck with big sins and little sins, and that all are fixable. Oh, and that children have only little ones because they are learning all the time about good ways to treat people (and living things). You are going to handle the newbies just fine!!!
              I’m Catholic, don’t believe in brainwashing, either, of course. Oh, and for the record, I do fully believe in evolution. Most Catholics I know do, too. I don’t fully understand the creationists who don’t acknowledge science, but there are all types out there in the world. My garden and my dog are inspired by God, as are my kids, their artwork, ugly and wonderful architecture, sunsets, and great books. Actually, even not-that- great books. Also bugs and weeds. I’m not the only Catholic who thinks that it’s ok for gays to marry, have a family or get benefits. Some people are still learning. And I hate the eternal torture piece, with the exception of those that will fully get their due one day for being so evil that no courtroom could do justice. Davey boy is on that list. So is that guy from Cleveland. And Sandusky.
              But the guilt thing WAS really handy when the kids were in their teens, I will happily admit.
              Hope the twinnies are good today!

            • monkeyknickers

              Jesus why does that Sandusky guy make my skin crawl more than most hideous child molesters. He is grotesque. Yuck. I read they have him isolated from the general population in prison because it’s a total guarantee someone’s gonna take him out.

              I wish there was a hell for him to go to.

              And I’m not Ashleen’s mom. Just her Auntie. :)

              I “handled it” (wtf I have no idea what I’m doing) by A) saying “Fuck that!” really loudly before I could control myself. Then . . . . I was just completely straight with her. Some people in the world believe there is a Santa like man (she was 3 at the time after all. I was winging it :)) in the sky that people believe they have to love or else they go to a bad place when they die. And then I said: that’s crap. There is no bad place, just some people think there is.

              That seems to have solved the issue except she said to the twins via my belly button that if they’re bad some people might send them to a bad place. So we went thru the whole thing again.

              And trust me honey – my mom makes use of the guilt thing in a spectacular secular way – she’s very talented. And she doesn’t have to tithe! It’s a bargain! :)

            • Missionary Kid

              And she’s not Jewish?

              Before anyone jumps on me, I’ve got Jewish friends who make mother jokes.

            • Robert Eckert

              ALL mothers are Jewish. Just like all cops are Irish.

            • richelieu jr

              Do you know what a Jewish sweater is?

              It’s what YOU put on when your Mom’s cold.

            • Missionary Kid

              Some of the classic mistakes that parents make are, I’m cold, so you put on a sweater, or I’m sleepy, so you need to take a nap.

            • aquaclara

              Oh, I think you are Ashleen’s mom in reality! You are there for her every day, and loving her. She may call you aunt, but will always come to you for the cuddles and the big stuff.
              That’s being her mom. And you are doing a great job. So sorry to hear about the crap that was scaring her.

              Love that she talks to the babies! Wait til they recognize her voice after they pop. She will be fascinated by it.

              Hugs to you! Ps Sandusky is in a Supermax prison in the last county in Pennsylvania, in the bottom left county (southwest corner). I believe the count of those coming forward is at least 30 so far. He is going to hell when he is done serving his time. And deserves everything that is coming. This I believe for sure.

            • richelieu jr

              John Paul II endorsed evolution himself. It is the official position of the Catholic Church..

              The Catolics have been closely reading the bible and related writings for 2 millennia?? Creationism and it’s nasty mutnat offspring ‘Intelligent Design’ (an oxymoron if there ever was one!) are entirely a protestant production.

            • Missionary Kid

              The Protestants didn’t learn from the Catholic’s mistakes with Galileo, which they gleefully like to point out, yet duplicate the mistake of declaring that scientific theories are mistaken because they supposedly contradict the bible.

            • aquaclara

              Thank you, Richelieu, as always. You are smarter than the average bear. I know my kids’ books in school covered science in the same manner as I had in a university quite well known for producing some fine scientists….But even my public high school way back in the day, in the south, covered evolution quite well.
              I do get a little put off by some of the general (usually damning) assumptions about “all” Christians, Catholics,” etc. when that “all” is usually far from the truth. You fix it with facts, I stray off into emotion. Your way is better.

            • Missionary Kid

              Realize that Maria was probably putting her own interpretation on what she’d heard. What someone says, and how a kid interprets something, are two different things. After that, there’s the kid communication network, where things REALLY get strange after they’v passed through several layers of interpretation.

              Ya done good.

              Joke: A little kid was asked what the equator was and he answered, “An imaginary lion running loose around the world.”

            • Robert Eckert

              You ever hear of Tera Long? The Dotted Lion?

            • Missionary Kid

              No, but I’ll remember her.

            • richelieu jr

              Gladly, the Cross-Eyed Bear?

            • Missionary Kid

              I just read your comment below. I assumed Maria was another child.

    • 1subgenius

      Sorry, but you made me think of this. It’s all your fault.
      I just got back from bicycling to and from the course (8 miles round trip), and walking 9 holes, and it’s going to be near 100 today in Detroit..
      My point, and I do have one (as Ellen would say) is one of my favorite lines to a lady golfer is, “Would you like to play a round sometime?”

      • WildaBeast

        Oh, urgh, you’ve got that same weather front we’re stuck with. I mean, farewell to summer and all that, but 95+ (or 40 Celsius) in mid-September seems a little much, doesn’t it?

        • 1subgenius

          Everyone is always complaining about the weather, but no one ever does anything about it.” – Mark Twain

          • WildaBeast

            Yes, we do! We all crank the A/C, and keep driving our cars, and…oh wait, that isn’t what you meant is it…

          • TheHoleDoesNotExist

            Mark Twain and Marc Headley, all in the same thread, all on the same day. Gotta love this place!

            • RMycroft

              Balance your day out with some HST:

              (From the interview “Going, going, gonzo”):

              HST: Being a writer in America is very hard. A freelance writer. I’d like a monument to me indicating that you can do it. If you don’t lie.

              Times: If you don’t lie?

              HST: Yeah. That’s a tricky thing to say. Yeah. I’ve been pretty honest, I guess, with what I’ve written. The only thing that would hurt me would be to be accused of some really horrible, the kind of crimes I jump on people for. Lies, treachery. If it came out I was working for Scientology all this time. (Laughs.)

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              Thank you so much. I like that line. It’s So HST.

            • Missionary Kid

              Harry S. Truman said that? ;-)

      • Mark

        Now you’ve reminded me I need to change the tyres on my bike – back one to the front before it gets too worn (’cause of the pannier for heavy loads of shopping) new one on the back, and replace the mystery inner-tube that has no puncture, but which still slowly subsides two days after being pumped up. All this a fortnight after rebuilding the whole damned front wheel…

        • 1subgenius

          BTW I’ve electrified mine. with the easiest conversion available. Truly took 5 minutes. Just swap out the front wheel. They send you a new front wheel, with electric hub, tire (just for you they will substitute a tyre…lol) , battery.
          10 miles at 15 mph with no peddling per charge. With some peddling and downhills, you get more accordingly.
          It’s not designed to be an electric cycle, just nice assist when you need it. Again, if you don’t want to peddle at all, you get the distance indicated above.
          A guy asked me, “Doesn’t that defeat the purpose of a bike?”
          Only if you only ride a bike for exercise. I use mine for transportation. So replacing a car if and when you can is quite the feat.
          I’ve had it about 2 months now and absolutely love it. In the picture you can see the hub, and the Lithium ion battery under the seat.
          http://www.electric-bike-kit.com/hill-topper.aspx

          (An unpaid testimonial)

          • ThetaBara

            Those things are great on hills. Although the one I used to have (lost it in the divorce, o well) was ridiculously heavy. If they’d shave some weight it would have been able to go a lot farther.

            • 1subgenius

              And if my aunt had balls she’d be my uncle.
              If they made a Tesla lighter it would go farther.
              Ummm, OK.
              The battery is 2.3 pounds. The hub is 6 pounds.
              This one is not only not ridiculously heavy, I defy you to be able to tell that it’s even there.
              I certainly can’t, even when I’m peddling with no power.

              What brand did you have, and how heavy was it?

            • ThetaBara

              This was over 10 years ago – it was one of the very first electric bikes. It looked like a ’50s beach cruiser, and just the bike itself was ridiculously heavy, even without the battery. I can ask the ex what kind it was. We’re friends.
              Also, if my ass were lighter it could go farther too! LOL! But seriously. Pedaling was a PITA because of the weight.

            • WildaBeast

              Mine weighed 330lbs with the battery in. I weigh 120, 125. Every time I had to walk the thing down a hill I was leaning back like crazy so it wouldn’t run away with me…

            • 1subgenius

              Don’t bother. It was your “those things” that threw me.
              It’s like comparing apples to oranges.
              This kit is in no way like what you describe, other than electricity is involved.

            • ThetaBara

              Sorry for the lack of clarity. This was not a kit, but a bike that was already rigged up.

              I still want a Tesla lighter, though! ;-)

            • ThetaBara

              If they made a Tesla lighter, you could fire up your bong with less guilt.

            • WildaBeast

              Oooh, thanks for reminding me Theta! Haven’t had my medicine yet today…
              Also: lol.

          • Mark

            I wondered what that hub was – assumed it was a hub-brake, but then thought it must be a dynamo, because of the wires. If you’re cycling that far in such heat, & towing a golf-bag, it would be a huge boon, I can see. I’d love to have one (especially in winter when the wind & cold stops cycling being a pleasure), but dread it being vandalised or stolen in a big city like London – even tho’ it’s so discreet.

            • 1subgenius

              The battery removes easily,
              But that’s probably more than enough bandwidth for this derail.

            • L. Wrong Hubturd

              When you mention electrified hubs, I was thinking something entirely different.

        • WildaBeast

          I used to drive an electric scooter – no insurance, no license, max speed of 33km/h (err, almost 20mph). I loved that thing. Grocery shopping was a breeze, as I had a very large model and could easily fit $80 worth of food and cat litter on my back, under the seat, in the little carrier on the back and at my feet. But, like a bus pass, it made me lazy as all get-out.

      • Missionary Kid

        In Jr. high, long ago, Dan Custer was walking down the hall between classes, and saw a screw on the floor. He picked it up, and had stopped to look at it closely (scrutinizing it?), along with some friends, including me. He said, “I wonder where this came from.”

        Since we were kind of clogging up the flow down the hall, a young, attractive female teacher started towards us, and asked, “What’s going on?”

        Before anyone else could say anything, Dan, who was flustered, held it up to her, and innocently said, “Wanna screw?”

        How we all kept a straight face, I don’t know, but we knew we’d better not laugh, or Dan would have been in BIG trouble.

        Needless to say, the story spread like wildfire.

      • GlibWog

        Cool Set up sub.. Were you there during Kilpatrick’s reign? I protested his Outster.. I still have the
        Recall the Mayor T shirt..
        What a Trip he is .. and was.. and his whole damn family..

        • Robert Eckert

          I’m in the district that was represented by Carolyn Cheeks Kilpatrick, aka “Kwame’s Mommy”. Tried to oust her every primary, but of course, in the general she was always a shoo-in (even if Republicans did not nominate a clown, there are too many who will absolutely never pull the R lever). Finally we are rid of her.

          • GlibWog

            Oh you lucky bastard.. I know you got rid of her.. You will laugh.. When she was running against …Who was it.. Mary Walters.. ( Sam Riddle’s GF..) I don’t know if she was running agains Carolyn or thinking about it..

            Oh Carolyn said that Mary wasn’t fit to hold her bra strap !!!! ( Doesn’t that sound like her)

            Well during the recall Protest ( A bunch of us were on the Freep forum together ( Like this forum on of course smaller scale) but still Asshole involved.

            And I wore a Huge Victoria Secret’s Bra on the outside of my shirt.. in honor of Ms Carolyn..

            I still read the Freep today.. I see where Carlita K lost her job and the lease on her home in Texas .. and Monica and Riddle out of jail.. What a mess, huh?

  • Vistaril

    This latest move by Scientology is certainly predictable but hardly stunning. It is, after all, the application of KSW Standard L Ron Hubbard Scientology tech as described in the 1955 “Manual on the Dissemination of Material”:

    . . . The purpose of the suit is to harass and discourage rather than to win. The law can be used very easily to harrass and enough harrassment on somebody who is simply on the thin edge anyway, well knowing that he is not authorized, will generally be sufficient to cause his professional decease. If possible, of course, ruin him utterly . . .

    The underlying tactic in this L Ron Hubbard teaching is to exhaust the financial and emotional resources of litigants and simultaneously provide an example to anyone else tempted to take legal action against Scientology. This tactic has already been highlighted in court judgements. In 1995, for example, U.S. District Court Judge Leonie Brinkema, in a scathing finding against Scientology, cited the above passage and said:

    . . . On the first issue, the Court finds that the motivation of
    plaintiff in filing this lawsuit against the [Washington] Post is reprehensible.
    Although the RTC brought the complaint under traditional secular
    concepts of copyright and trade secret law, it has become clear
    that a much broader motivation prevailed–the stifling of crticism
    and dissent of the religious practices of Scientology and the
    destruction of its opponents . . .

    Basically, Scientology deems wog justice to be another device in its Fair Game Toolkit and doesn’t care greatly whether it wins or loses a legal case, nor even if Scientology itself appears idiotic. Here, with the motion to dismiss Mosey’s lawyers, it doesn’t matter that the argument is flimsy, only that it complicates matters and provides an opporunity to draw the case out for as long as possible by opening another avenue for a series of appeals and largely irrelevant distractions from the core issue. Rather than “stunning”, it is another example of Scientology’s typical cynicism and overt mendacity which has been a feature of its legal representations for the last fifty years. Despite a few losses after years and years of litigation in some eceptional cases, this aspect of Scientology’s tech can actually be described as “workable”. Just ask people like Gerry Armstrong and David Mayo.

    • Eclipse-girl

      Not being well schooled in the legal arena, don’t tactics like these anger judges? and juries?
      Don’t tactics like these risk causing a larger settlement?

      Granted it takes staying power to fight Co$. I would think the Ray Jeffrey is very much aware that this lawsuit could drag out for 15 – 20 yrs. He appears to be very much aware of what the Co$ is going to do before the Co$ actually does it.

      • RMycroft

        Standard Scientology Legal Playbook:
        [ ] Make the judge angry enough that you can ask them to step down because they’re biased.

        • richelieu jr

          Judge Swapping just makes me sick. Perverts.

      • Vistaril

        Annoying judges is part of the process. Annoyed judges are more likely to make mistakes or utter intemperate comments to provide more opportunity for appeal. Even if the judges don’t actually make a legal mistake, there’s also the behind-the-scenes full-on investigation and Fair Gaming of judges, lawyers, and court staff which Scientology, as per its {scripture}, runs parallel to the actual process. Any indiscretions will be uncovered and/or, as L Ron Hubbard teaches, actually manufactured and used against any judge who might not be “on side”. Then there’s the witness tampering, perjury, destruction of evidence, mysterious deaths of family pets . . . when it comes to Scientology, nothing is as it at first appears and it is always worse than you think.

        • Eclipse-girl

          Isn’t it likely that such tactics get talked about by judges? I would expect that any new judge would be aware of the shit-storm. I understand the idea of fair game, etc. I just think that that may be some judges are intelligent enough, and clean enough to stick it to the Co$.

          • Vistaril

            Again, that’s part of the process. The sorts of actions Scientology takes causes fear amongst the judiciary, especially for anyone who has any sort of dodgy background or even innocent incidents which can be twisted. In Scientology’s “PR Series 18″ of 21 November 1972, L Ron Hubbard teaches that statements to the media . . .

            . . . can be curved. ‘She had a birthday party’ becomes ‘The delinquents in her circle gathered yesterday for a sex orgy and pretended to the police it was a birthday party. No one was jailed’ . . .

            . . . its not just a matter of intelligence and being “clean”. Just consider how difficult it is to even get a lawyer to go up against Scientology.

            Another factor to bear in mind is that Scientology’s actions are very often beond belief. In my inoculation of wogs process I stick to the “LOL Xenu” strategy and other such simple, easily proven facts because once you start getting into the nitty-gritty of actual Scientology it becomes less and less credible and requires more and more actual research. Its not for no reason that L Ron Hubbard pointed out:

            Incredulity of our data . . . is our finest asset and gives us more protection than any other single thing. If certain parties thought we were real we would have infinitely more trouble . . . and without a public incredulity we never would have gotten as far as we have. And now it’s too late to be stopped. This protection was accidental but it serves us very well indeed. Remember that the next time the ignorant scoff . . .

            He was talking about the “powers” Scientology gives to those who learn to duplicate Xenu but it applies in actuality to the real power a billion dollar war chest, a battalion of lawyers, a posse of PIs, and a crew of OSA goons provides. Just ask the IRS.

            • Poison Ivy

              “incredulity of our data . . . is our finest asset and gives us more protection than any other single thing. If certain parties thought we were real we would have infinitely more trouble . . . and without a public incredulity we never would have gotten as far as we have. And now it’s too late to be stopped. . . .” – LRH

              “The bigger the lie, the more it will be believed.” – Joseph Goebbels

            • Interested

              Thanks PI? I knew that phrase was said by a high ranking nazi, but did not know who.

            • Poison Ivy

              It is sometimes mistakenly attributed to Hitler and his statement about the “Big Lie” in Mein Kampf:

              “All this was inspired by the principle – which is quite true in itself – that in the big lie there is always a certain force of credibility; because the broad masses of a nation are always more easily corrupted in the deeper strata of their emotional nature than consciously or voluntarily; and thus in the primitive simplicity of their minds they more readily fall victims to the big lie than the small lie, since they themselves often tell small lies in little matters but would be ashamed to resort to large-scale falsehoods. It would never come into their heads to fabricate colossal untruths, and they would not believe that others could have the impudence to distort the truth so infamously. Even though the facts which prove this to be so may be brought clearly to their minds, they will still doubt and waver and will continue to think that there may be some other explanation. For the grossly impudent lie always leaves traces behind it, even after it has been nailed down, a fact which is known to all expert liars in this world and to all who conspire together in the art of lying. These people know only too well how to use falsehood for the basest purposes.”

              Hitler here, of course, is referring to the Jews. But it’s yet another LRH-ian classic example of projection, because Hitler’s “Big Lie” cost 6 million Jews their lives.

            • Interested

              One day we might know how many lives were destroyed by l r h’s lie.

            • Missionary Kid

              Here’s the answer: anyone who came in contact with him.

            • WildaBeast

              I’m kind of gagging writing this but…Joseph fucking Goebbels has just proved himself to have a greater facility with language, and a far greater talent for brevity and succinctness, than Elron Hubtard. I am gagging because I think I just (even relatively) complimented a Nazi.
              Oh dear God…L. Ron Hubbard: making Nazis look smart…

            • Poison Ivy

              If it could be said it a phrase, LRH would say it in three paragraphs. Hence his voluminous output of works. Another classic conman trick – bamboozle ‘em with verbiage and jargon to make yourself sound brilliant and to obscure the actual meaning of the words.

            • stateofcircle

              Unfortunately, just because a person is incredibly evil doesn’t mean they are stupid. In fact, and again, unfortunately, horrible, evil bastards such as Goebbels and Hubbard were quite brilliant when it came to manipulating people and processes. And yes, I am aware that I used the words “Hubbard” and “brilliant” in a sentence together, and believe me, it pains me to my core that I did, but as horrible as the things they’ve done are, and as much as they are the very definition of bad people, the scope of what they accomplished through their careful and intricate manipulations was, well, pretty genius. Again, yes, I hate myself for saying it, but just because I hate myself for saying it doesn’t mean it’s not true.

              Ok, you can all down vote me now :(

            • ze moo

              One can admire the self-reinforcing and mind control aspects of the con and despise them at the same time. As long as you apply the critical thinking that brought you that realization to other areas, you are far ahead of the clams. You can evolve, they can’t. Poor clams, always in fear of boiling water and melted butter….yum, yum….

            • Captain Howdy

              History is chock a block full of intelligent “evil” people. That shouldn’t come as a shock or revelation to anyone who has been paying attention.

            • WildaBeast

              Ugh, I know you’re right, state. And I’m usually all about giving credit where it’s due. I just hate, loathe and despise saying anything positive about people who, yes, dammit, had brains, but used them to destroy the lives of others. Without some sort of moral compass, I figure any intelligence a person has actually goes into the minus column, rather than the plus.
              On the bright side, look how well the Nazis came out in the end. Nuremberg, anyone?

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              Let’s just say Hubbard had a grab bag of accomplices and enablers who tugged at his robes. And before scientology, he had plenty of characters in his life to draw maneuver techniques from in all kinds of circles. Hubbard stole ideas as well as wallets. I would say he used brilliant people and took credit for it.

            • villagedianne

              Yes, and then both Hubbard and Miscavige pulled down anyone who became too powerful or too popular.

            • coonellie

              I’d never down vote your statement, especially as I know it’s true. History is replete with such cases…sigh. My evil parent is also a genius, not just in manipulating people, but in solving problems that go far beyond the norm. It never ceased to amaze me. It also made me incredibly sad as I could see such potential for good that always ended up in harm. Okay, back to the cave. Great to “see” you :).

            • Observer

              That’s the quote I was looking for, the “incredulity of data” one! Do you have the reference for it?

            • Vistaril

              HCOB 29 July 1963 “Scientology Review”

            • Observer

              Thanks!

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              “it takes staying power”. More precisely, it takes having a pillaged war chest of Billions of $.

              And where does this dictator of tiny town get it? Who is funding this personal war of his? Tom Cruise, John Travolta, Kirstie Alley, Priscilla Presley, Nancy Cartwright, Bog Duggan, Craig Jensen, etcetera, etcetera.

              Imagine you promoted a brand an international campaign for a toothpaste brand for 30 or 40 years. You kept hearing here and there that people’s teeth were falling out and eventually high rates of cancer. Would you a) Find out for yourself if it was true or b) Refuse to find out for yourself because it might upset you?

              These legal cases throughout the decades that to me have been won Only because scientology has this blood money to wear a litigant out financially has been the worst part of the cruel and deadly history of this scam. It succeeded in its purpose for far too long: to terrify or discourage anyone else to even try to stop the incessant and constant crimes and human rights abuses.

              And that’s why I sometimes call out these Shillebrities and the Whales as Accomplices. They’ve been around for 3 or 4 decades “Just Following Orders”. They are funding the crimes and human rights abuses. Period.

              Okay, needs more coffee, end of rant.

            • Poison Ivy

              Ditto. And Leah Remini proves, you CAN stand up to the abuses, leave and maybe they WILL harrass you, but you will survive and thrive! Jason Beghe, Paul Haggis, Michael Fairman and others have done so successfully. These whales have no excuse except either a) complete blind indoctrination b) total narcissistic refusal to admit a colossal life mistake and/or c) terror of the potential blackmail material and/or disconnection.

            • ThetaBara

              I really wonder what they’ve got on ol’ Bob Duggan.

            • richelieu jr

              And Tom Cruise proves Scilontoology doesn’t make your teeth fall out:

              He’s even got an extra one right in the middle in front!

            • coonellie

              You keep ranting! It gives me strength!

            • Cat Daddy

              The IRS should grow some balls

            • richelieu jr

              Yes, this is the ‘When did you stop beating your wife?” school of ethics.

            • villagedianne

              I once told a co-worker that I could tell her one bad Scientology story each day for a whole month. I pretty much did it too, although towards the end I ran out of stories off the top of my head, and had to research them. She looked forward to the daily story. To use a Scientology term, I educated her along a gradient.

            • Casabeca

              Now she can share those stories too. Awesome job.

          • RMycroft

            They’ve been doing stuff like this for decades.

            Scientology’s War Against Judges December 1, 1980, James B. Stewart Jr., American Lawyer
            http://www.gerryarmstrong.org/50grand/media/am-lawyer-1980.html

        • Zana

          Woah. Thank you for the insight. !

    • chukicita

      You’re right that they are just applying standard tech here. But, just like there is a hint of the coolness of the coming of fall in late summer air, there is a hint of attorneys seeing handwriting on the wall and expediting a soft landing with this one.

  • Real Shellback

    Damn! Store is out of popcorn again!

    • Krew13

      But Tom Cruise has complete control over MEST and can easily summon a big tub of popcorn any time he wants, just like he can levitate and do other neat stuff, except, it seems, find a woman who can tolerate being with him.

      • Real Shellback

        Well I’m not Tom Cruise; I have to manipulate MEST the old fashioned way. (edit) Store is out of popcorn because I bough tit out.

        • EnthralledObserver

          Have to switch to other snacks then… it’s going to be a long haul, I reckon, though exciting as hell.

          • WildaBeast

            I’ve found peanuts to be an acceptable substitute. I finished the popcorn two days ago, myself.

    • MO Mom

      Boy Scouts are selling it. I’ve stocked up with about $40 bucks worth.

      • ThetaBara

        I guess they got jelly of the Girl Scout cookie franchise!

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      Tony really should market Bunker Popcorn to subsidize this place. Anyone here who Wouldn’t buy it?

      • Real Shellback

        Now there ‘s an idea! Bunker-Bucket popcorn.

      • Mrs Libnish

        Yes! Butter flavor please. And white cheddar.

        • TheHoleDoesNotExist

          To keep expenses down and profits up, I’d say Plain and each person can add what they want. All he needs then is some kernels and the UB logo on the cover.

          • Mrs Libnish

            Ok. As long as it has “SP” on it somewhere too.

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              Savory Popcorn + SP

          • WildaBeast

            If the popcorn does well, he can start selling flavour packets as a sideline. Best of both worlds!

      • Michael Leonard Tilse

        Tony’s Bunker SPecial Popcorn, Now with Bunker Butter and kosher salt!
        Every Kernel has a story!

        • Casabeca

          Kernel could be one of the ranks in the SP Org

          • Michael Leonard Tilse

            A Bunker Kernel with popcorn balls rampant and SP clusters!

            • Casabeca

              Even better! Like what you did with that :).

      • Kitz

        Sour cream and onion!

    • DamOTclese2

      ROFL! That’s damn amusing seeing as how I *literally* got popcorn going on the stove this morning after seeing another installment of The Bunker. :) I purchased 25 pounds of yellow kernels over a year ago, and The Bunker has been helping me work my way through it. :)

      • ThetaBara

        I have one of these. Sounds like I ought to fire it up!

        • ThetaBara

          Also, a couple of these:

        • DamOTclese2

          That looks awesome. :)

  • sugarplumfairy

    “– Miscavige’s every utterance was considered so important, Sea Org employees constantly followed him everywhere he went, recording his words and transcribing them 24 hours a day.”

    That just absolutely fascinates me.. Since they exist, can those transcripts be subpoenaed? Would be awesome to see what miscavige was saying in 1993 before the IRS cave-in..

    • Bury_The_Nuts

      What a way to die…………….bored.to.death.

      • Krew13

        This lady would happily pay $10m to read them all.

        http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=96ap6r&s=5

        • sugarplumfairy

          More likely, she’d pay $10 million NOT to read them..

        • Bury_The_Nuts

          GAH! Need eyewash!!!

          • TheHoleDoesNotExist

            Thanks for the warning.

    • Pepsicat

      I’m sure that they would have been shredded at the end of the day. But what I’ve read and heard from witnesses to his insanity is that he mutters some indecipherable Alice in Wonderland sentences to bait you into saying, “Excuse me?” Then he sends you to the hole because you can’t understand him.

      • sugarplumfairy

        I stole this from OTGrVIII’s blog after he borrowed it from Kingpin’s site..

        Start of COB meeting:
        DM: “She didn’t what’s the say on it.”
        You: “Excuse me, Sir.”
        DM: [glares sliently, then to the rest of the room] “He’s going to backflash me?”
        Bystander: “That’s bad… It’s blackflash, Sir.”
        DM: “I know it’s backflash, that’s what I said, Parrot! You want it?”
        Bystander: “Excuse me?”
        DM: “The fucking cracker… fucking…!
        Bystander: “Right, no, sorry sir. Yes, the cracker.”
        DM: “I know what I said DO you?”
        Bystander: “Yes Sir, you…”
        DM: “Shut up! (points to you) You!”
        You: “I apologize for back flashing Sir, and pretending I couldn’t hear you.”
        DM: (glares silently for a while, decides to go on) “She didn’t have the braided so he’ll tell for so inch.”
        You: (can’t think of anything to say)
        DM: “Answer the fucking question, pie face!”
        You: “I’m sorry I didn’t get that last.” …and now it starts over. Welcome to life at the top of Scientology.

        • TheHoleDoesNotExist

          hahahaha. And This, ladies and gentlemen, is the guy that Tom Cruise worships.

      • Poison Ivy

        Marc Headley writes of this. It’s insane, terrifying and also hilarious.

    • WhereIsSHE

      If he and/or RTC are actual “parties” (which he and RTC are typically fighting tooth and nail), you could include a demand for them via the discovery process as part of a Request for Production of Documents. It would have to be tailored properly. You can’t go on “a fishing expedition”.
      But would Miscavige and RTC ADMIT to having any such transcripts? Who inside the cult would testify TRUTHFULLY as to their existence??

      If they are not parties, you could subpoena them, but again, you would have a fight on your hands, and then, I feel comfortable in alleging that you would be met with outright lies, denying their very existence.
      Remember, too, that Miscavige requires the documents containing the “fair game” evidence to be shredded. Those are the ones you really want, and –according to Marty’s affidavit– Miscavige makes certain to destroy the evidence.

      • Poison Ivy

        That’s what that giant “Shredding Room” in the Sooper Powerz building is for!

        (However, given Davey’s ego, I’d bet he’d keep a personal copy of his Words of Wisdom on a drive somewhere, for himself alone. Better to relive his glory days once he escapes to South America or wherever he’s planning on running to…)

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        and currently there are far more witnesses Out than In. I’m hoping the real numbers will be important in this and other cases. This is Why Miscavige orders hunting expeditions every few years to find former Sea Org members, what they are doing, if they might know something, are they planning something, etc. Paranoia is his middle name.

        • WildaBeast

          I thought his middle name was “I am not insane”!
          Ooops, my bad…

      • Real Shellback

        I guess the real question is – who defecting from the cult is willing to leak this material? I’m reminded that Hubbard too had people following him around, recording every utterance.

      • Robert Eckert

        I believe Marc Headley has already spoken of how tightly controlled these binders full of transcripts are and how they get destroyed promptly.

    • Once_Born

      I recall a man called Richard Nixon, who thought his every word was so important he arranged to have them recorded and archived – a practice which rebounded on him in court and helped remove him from power.

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        That’s what I’m talkin’ about! He did it his way and recorded it too. Don’t want to miss out on a single sentence which might be So brilliant that the world will fall down on their knees and worship in massive gratitude.

      • heuristically_inclined

        Hitler and Himmler did too.

    • 1subgenius

      I have previously said that I can’t wait for when (not if) Ray requests those records.
      If it’s ordered, there’s little likelihood that it will go back that far.

    • Douglas D. Douglas

      Of course, the trail blazer in this particular form of megalomania is the ever-popular former Chancellor of Germany (1933-45). Among his gems of know-it-all wisdom are the Table Talk volumes:
      http://www.archive.org/stream/HitlersTableTalk/HitlersTableTalk_djvu.txt

    • DamOTclese2

      Highly doubtful that they could be subpoenaed. They would probably be judged to be “trade secrets” — which would be ironic since the crime syndicate often demands that evidence of their crimes are inadmissible due to being “trade secrets.”

      • Robert Eckert

        No, they wouldn’t fall into the category of “trade secrets” in any way. “Trade secrets” are things like the ingredients for KFC’s breading, or such-like manufacturing processes. The {church} can argue that various auditing techniques and the training materials for them are trade secrets, but not COB’s directives to staff.

        • stateofcircle

          Couldn’t they argue that the things he says are in reference to said auditing and training techniques and materials and as such still be considered trade secrets? For instance, if a cook at KFC was discussing with another cook possibly changing the amount of paprika in the recipe and how that will affect the color, while it is not specifically about the trade secret it does contain relevant privileged information about said trade secret. Using that (probably flawed) logic, if Miscavige was discussing with Marty how to go about hiring a PI to stalk the McPherson family using the “Fair Game” policy as a guideline, could it be argued that since it is being discussed within the context of a confidential, established church policy that, even though it is not specifically about the trade secret, it contains relevant privileged information about the trade secret?

          • Robert Eckert

            I wouldn’t be surprised to see them make such arguments. I would be thoroughly surprised to see any judge find the arguments remotely convincing.

        • Public Buggering

          I see that the idiots already do try to claims trade secrets to avoid having their crimes widely exposed in public court documents.

  • MO Mom

    Fan, meet shit. Have fun together.

  • Krew13

    Next time Top Gun appears in public with a “girlfriend” and jumps up and down, protesting a little bit too much about how much he loves her and how much he loves women (!), remember this uber-babe and goddess that the prick sent away to clean toilets with a toothbrush just because she said “Excuse me?” to Miscmidget. She luckily escaped the Sciloons in 2010 and has never looked back.

    http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20121127191252/marvelcinematicuniverse/images/5/54/Nazanin_Boniadi.jpg

    • Douglas D. Douglas

      Who couldn’t upvote this???

      • Captain Howdy

        People who didn’t like boob jobs?

        No offense to Ms. Boniadi.

        • Sherbet

          She’s very pretty, except for those ^&%$# incisors. TC was right to kick her to the curb.

          • Captain Howdy

            She has a gorgeous face, I just happen to have a real dislike for plastic surgery and tattoo’s, etc. on a woman. To me it’s like disfiguring a work of art.

            • ThetaBara

              You had me until you said you dislike tattoos. WTF? I thought you were a punker?

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              Every time you think you have the Cap’n figured out….

            • Captain Howdy
            • Captain Howdy

              The O.P (original punk) chicks 1976-83 generally speaking didn’t have tattoos – and they were much cuter than the faux punk chicks that followed.

              Me & Nick Cave prefer the all natural “secretary type”.

  • chuckbeattyexseaorg75to03

    Photo of Rathbun sitting to the right of the standing Miscavige, that’s great photo journalist evidence of the “right hand man” label for Rathbun. Can’t get any better than that, and this photo was in church promotional material, which seals the label for Rathbun for all time!

    Compared to even 5 years ago, no journalist has so delved into Scientology, and nailed so many aspects correctly, and stayed on top of so many ongoing history points as you Tony!

    We forget how little the average media got the story right, and how dribbled out the story was, in the past.

    Hopefully this will all still come to something.

    I hope the attorney for Monique isn’t bought off, behind the scenes, somehow.

    The great attorneys who over the years defended people like Lerma, Erlich and Gerry Armstrong, ought to have an article on them, and include Dandar and Lirot and Jeffrey.

    The law firms that do basically pro bono defense, out of principle, should be recognized, that firm in California that helped Erlich comes to mind.

    Good lawyers ought be reported about as a public service, in the decades long battle against Scientology’s abuses.

    Joe Yanny and Graham Berry!

    The good lawyers is a chapter in some book, or history, and their successful legal wins ought be summarized, I’d think.

    • noseinabk

      ” Monique’s attorney Ray Jeffrey”

      Think Monique picked a fine attn. :-)

    • RMycroft
      • Eclipse-girl

        Very Nice. Its tragic that is reality.

        • Mark

          Naah – Tiny Fists wouldn’t have wanted blood-spots all over his shiny conference-table and pristine blotters. That’s why he only beats people up in the open air – or in the Hole…

          • Eclipse-girl

            But then he can have those in the Hole or elsewhere clean it up by licking.

            • Mark

              Xenu preserve us! SP-spit all over Shortarse’s expensive furniture – yeuk!

          • Captain Howdy

            Actually, most of the assaults by D.M I’ve read about took place indoors and in his inner office sanctum. He supposedly leapt across the conference table like some kind of mini-werewolf to attack Jeff Hawkins on one occasion.

            • Mark

              True – acts like he’s master of all he surveys, but the little shit’s so scared of being seen that he hides his violence behind closed doors. A bully and a coward.

            • WildaBeast

              I’ve known a lot of bullies. Every single one of them was a physical coward, and the vast preponderance were social cowards as well. As in, you don’t even have to threaten them with violence to make them back off. You just start laughing, and they shut right up. When I get really close to losing my temper, I flame off adrenaline by laughing, so I discovered this very effective tactic completely by mistake.

            • Sherbet

              I’m laughing at your description, although it probably wasn’t funny to Jeff at the time.

            • Bury_The_Nuts

              “Mini-werewolf”…snorts!

            • Captain Howdy

            • richelieu jr

              I believe the technical term is ‘Teeny Wolf’…

            • L. Wrong Hubturd

              Michael J. Fox approves this comment.

            • Public Buggering

              LOL! Like in the Austin Powers movie? Ha! Put that dwarf on a leash, would ya?!

            • villagedianne

              It was in an area visible to other people working in that office on Int Base. Amy Scobee (I think it was) saw the assault.

          • richelieu jr

            And if you’ve ever been hit in the hole, you now how much that hurts!

        • richelieu jr

          I believe the technical term is ‘Teeny Wolf’.

      • 1subgenius

        Have I told you lately that you are awesome?

        • RMycroft

          It’s not mine. Finding stuff in the Internet, that I’m good at.

          • ThetaBara

            Dude. You have been bringing the dox lately! m/ m/

      • aquaclara

        This is a 5 doggie-cookie laugh. (My dog and I have a new game. I laugh at the computer; dog wants to know what’s so funny. I reward him with a cookie).

        • ze moo

          I don’t mean to be mean here but how fat is your dog?? The lutz continues forever…..This a new measurement, much like ‘a three dog night’ or ‘one toke over the line’…..

          • aquaclara

            Yup, I have given you a brand new measure of fun. Especially helpful in this season of tents and legal mind-f*ckery.
            Luckily, my baby is a very trim half Lab/half greyhound who luuuuvvvs to chase Frisbees, squirrels, rabbits and his friends of the canine persuasion. He is happy with this new game!

            • Mooser

              Keep a sharp eye on his anterior cruciate ligament! And keeping his weight down is the best thing you can do. We didn’t, and now my dog has a titanium knee. I don’t have all my teeth, and very little of my hair, but the dog has a goddam titanium knee. It wasn’t cheap, neither. It cost more than the entire L Ron Hubbard box set!

            • aquaclara

              Aaw, you have a bunker dog, too! Titanium knee — I am NOT laughing. Nope.

            • WildaBeast

              Hmmm, I think I might be jealous. I have a cat, and when he wants to know what’s so great about the screen, he just walks right across the keyboard and has a good look for himself…

            • Mrs Libnish

              I’m with you there. And my fatty weighs 25lbs…he covers the entire monitor.

            • WildaBeast

              My boy is only 16lbs, but he’s figured out this trick where he can walk across the keyboard, block my view of the screen, and simultaneously run his tail right under my nose and shed while he does it.
              And yet I keep petting him, feeding him, cleaning the litter, replenishing his water, playing with him…he has me so trained lol.

            • ze moo

              Labs are hyper on their own, add in greyhound and you get a carbon based life form that can hit warp speed. I pity and envy you.

            • aquaclara

              That would be it! He is a very good dog, even though sometimes I can’t find his “off” button.
              He is very proud of his warp speed record! Luckily, the yard is fenced and there are many dog parks nearby.

            • stateofcircle

              Ahh yes, to have an “off” button for the pooch. My beautiful and lively dog, a papillon, is naturally energetic and very playful, which is one of the reasons I wanted a pap. But she is “on” 24/7 (I’m not 100% sure she actually sleeps…), and by “on” I mean always looking for a toy with which to play fetch, signaling me that she wants to go outside to play and run around, excitedly running around the house, or practicing her vertical jump, which has reached upwards of 4 feet. My vet told me she would calm down at a year and a half…then 3…then 5…. Well, she’s 9 now, and as “on” as ever. Whenever we bring her around our friend’s dogs, she runs circles around them (literally and figuratively) and is still going after they’ve all pooped out, and she is always the oldest one. Thankfully she is a very intelligent dog, kind and a great listener, so I don’t have a lot to complain about, and since she is getting up there in years, I suppose I am grateful for her energy and hope it means that she has a lot of years ahead of her…

              Also, she has taken up swimming in her advanced years…

            • aquaclara

              Soo cute! She looks like she’s ready to go! You have to love that. She looks like she’s still a puppy. What a lovely breed.
              Mine swims, too, only there are not a ton of places right here where I can take him…he will settle for puddles, ponds, fountains, streams…..

            • Casabeca

              She looks so happy and ready for fun. My mostly Vizsla is gonna be jealous of the the cookie game!
              LOVE dog and cat photos…wish I could see all the Bunker pets.

      • stateofcircle

        I am not really sure what they are trying to convey with this picture (the original, not Mycroft’s wonderful edited version). When I look at it, I think about a Situation Room, with government leaders discussing whether they should bomb a country. In all seriousness, as a promotional picture targeted at parishioners of which only about what, 10%, even know about the galactic confederacy h-bomb scheme, what is the message of a picture like this supposed to be in the context of Scientology’s stated purpose of making people feel better by talking about their problems while holding magical soup cans?

        • aquaclara

          ….and do they/did they really go around in the Donald Duck suits all the time?

          • Sherbet

            Donald Duck didn’t wear pants. Don’t tell me DM is, ugh, you-know-what, below table level.

            • aquaclara

              aaargh!

            • Sherbet

              I know, aqua, I know…

            • WildaBeast

              /rolls into fetal position and rocks back and forth

            • Public Buggering

              ROFL!

            • Douglas D. Douglas

              Well thank you for that! Off to scrub the frontal lobe of my brain now…

            • Sherbet

              OK, I lied! I lied! COB has pants on!

            • ThetaBara

              It’s called “shirtcocking.”
              You’re welcome.

            • WildaBeast

              Snickersnort! I love that there’s a word for that…

        • Mooser

          Scientology’s stated purpose of making people feel better by talking about their problems while holding magical soup cans?”

          They’re not beer cans? I always thought they had to be beer cans. And of course, beer cans don’t empty themselves, you know. So every session had to start with two 16 ouncers! Group sessions are even better!
          Nothing good ever starts “Take two cans condensed cream-of-mushroom soup…” What’s next, potato chips and weenies?

          • Douglas D. Douglas

            However, the addition of Durkee Fried Onions makes it a gor-may treat!

          • Missionary Kid

            That’s not the bridge to total freedom, it’s the path to alcoholism. ;-)

            • WildaBeast

              Path to alcoholism > Bridge to Total Freedom.

              No, I don’t really mean that. They’re probably about equally awful. But the booze might cost you less over time.

            • ThetaBara

              The booze is a LOT more fun!

            • WildaBeast

              Detoxing from booze is probably more fun than Scientology. At least when you’re detoxing, they give you Valium!

            • richelieu jr

              “Oh Beer, the solution and the cause to all of lifes problems!”

            • WildaBeast

              It’s like beer goggles…they get you laid, which is great! But then you wake up sober, and it’s…not.

            • Missionary Kid

              Yeah, they’re both pretty destructive to health and wealth.

          • richelieu jr

            I got a big WIN! My blood didn’t turn to total sludge!

        • RMycroft
        • Douglas D. Douglas

          I pointed this out elsewhere already, but speaking as an art director I am pretty certain that the photographer at this shoot either handed Missy Miscavige those papers, or asked him to pick them up. Holding something in the hands gives even the most befuddled dope the appearance of gravitas.

          Just crop the papers out of his hands and you will see what I mean…

          • Poison Ivy

            Are you an art director for still or film (or both)? I love art directors. Sometimes I wish I’d gone in that direction.

            • Douglas D. Douglas

              It is among the skills in my portfolio.

          • richelieu jr

            I thoght basicallyt he same thing, 3D! I was, “OK who gave DM some ‘business’?”

        • ThetaBara

          I think the Cabbage looks like he’s about to smack someone, and the other three all look like they’re hoping it won’t be their turn.

      • 1subgenius

        I hope Marty gets to see this. And I hope that he actually gets a chuckle.

        • Spackle Motion

          Oh please…..he is really good at head in the sand tech and stick fingers in ears while singing off key tech. Marty still stays away from entheta although his definition of entheta now only involves people being critical of him. He has a very thin skin, gauging on how immature he reacted to Tony’s review of his last piece of trash.

          • 1subgenius

            I am nothing if not overly-optimistic.
            Thus the use of “hope” not once, but twice.
            We are all works in progress.

          • richelieu jr

            Strangely that was Hubbard’s definition of entheta as well… Hmmm…

        • Public Buggering

          I really, really wish that Robert Minton had lived to see what is happening to the Scientology bastards these days.

          • villagedianne

            Somewhere, Robert Minton is happy.

      • WildaBeast

        Having just hit the snooze button for my wife (she doesn’t work until 1pm today), I am watching this while plugging my nose and covering my mouth to keep the guffaws silent…

        • Douglas D. Douglas

          You’re a good man.

          • WildaBeast

            Errr, woman, but thanks!

            • Douglas D. Douglas

              You’re a good person. And a good woman.

            • WildaBeast

              Thank you! :-)

            • phronsie

              Gender bias ‘ll get ya every time! I thought you were a woman and then you talked about your wife and I was confused, and here I am having attended 2 separate commitment ceremonies for some of my lesbian friends in the past year! Well, the world is changing and here’s hoping one day there won’t be so much ready assumption.

            • WildaBeast

              It’s happened before, and I’m sure it’ll happen again! It doesn’t really bother me – my gender dysphoria was fairly severe for some years there :p I passed for a while in my mid-to-late teens, but the Tenser bandages really hurt my ribs and the short hair cut wasn’t flattering anyway. It’s just, you know, in the interests of accuracy…don’t want to confuse folks down the road :-D

            • Sherbet

              Well, it’s kinda hard to tell from your avatar, Wilda!

            • WildaBeast

              I know, right? This was honest to God the stock “female” avatar when I set up my FB account a year and a half ago. I gotta do something about it, but I’m kind of a Luddite and also kind of lazy…still, it keeps nagging at me, so I’ll probably fix it up eventually.

            • Sherbet

              It either looks to me like a British bobby who was squished in the elevator doors, or the rubber bulb on a bottle of nose drops. Have you considered using a pic of an actual wildebeest, m’dear?

            • richelieu jr

              Perhaps the bandages wouldn’t have been so tense had they not been wrapped around your boobs…

            • WildaBeast

              This is true.

            • Sherbet

              Groan…

            • GlibWog

              I knew Wilda.. OUCH.. with the damn bandages..

              So sad about you suffering from the gender dysphoria.. It must have been So painful to know that you were stuck in a body that didn’t fit who you were.. / are..

              I celebrate you.. your decision and your life.. Your wife is very lucky.. xoxox Glibby..

              oops AND your bravery!

            • Missionary Kid

              I can’t wait for Der Dwarfenfuher’s commitment ceremony to Bubba while thery’re in prison.

        • Sherbet

          Your wife called. She said, “Nice try, but you’re shakin’ the bed!”

          • WildaBeast

            Baaahahahaha!

          • richelieu jr

            She says that a lot actually…

            • Sherbet

              Oooh, naughty richelieu!

      • Public Buggering

        Sweet shoop! Now do one where DM is being publicly buggered!

        • GlibWog

          Ewwwwwwwwwww I’ll pass Public..

      • GlibWog

        OMG NO……….. RM Brilliant..

    • Vistaril

      EDIT: Ooops . . . RMycroft beat me to it.

      • RMycroft

        And by only a minute too!

    • 1subgenius

      “I hope the attorney for Monique isn’t bought off, behind the scenes, somehow.”

      Not gonna happen..

      • villagedianne

        Ray Jeffrey has already been tested by litigating against the COS before.

    • Mooser

      “The good lawyers is a chapter in some book, or history, and their successful legal wins ought be summarized, I’d think.”

      Who are the bad lawyers? What kind of legal or financial professional would work for COS? Wouldn’t it play havoc with your professional standing? No it’s not at all the same as the defense every accused person is entitled to. In this case, everything you do legally will show you are, to some extent aware of the basic frauds being perpetrated. Sure, sure attorney-client privilege, but still.

      • Douglas D. Douglas

        There’s a reason there are so many lawyers. It’s like baby ducks. There needs to be enough for the crows to carry off.

        • Public Buggering

          I love the idea of DM being carted off by a crow.

          • WildaBeast

            Crows are big. Tiny Tyrant is tiny. It could happen!

          • Douglas D. Douglas

            Mighty slim pickin’s, even for a crow.

      • DamOTclese2

        “What kind of legal or financial professional would work for COS?”

        Any lawyer would love to take Tom Cruise’s money from David. It’s not a crusade, lawyers aren’t concerned about justice or truth or falsehoods, it’s every lawyer’s dream to have a dimwitted, fucking insane client with $billions$ of bucks ready and willing to be thrown at said lawyer.

        • villagedianne

          Very true, for the most part. But now that COS is being tried in the court of public opinion, perhaps there are some lawyers who would shy away from the bad publicity that would result from defending the cult.

          • Interested

            Would the mafia hire them after?

    • DamOTclese2

      And the fact that both of them are wearing matching Toy Sailor Outfits should add to the fact that the two were, like, twins or something. :)

      • WildaBeast

        Brothas from a different motha!
        Until that whole family trouble started, back about 10 years ago…

    • richelieu jr

      ‘Right Hand Man’ or ‘Mini Mini Me’?

  • Mighty Korgo of Teegeeack

    Let me bring up a psychological term– GESTALT meaning shape.

    Let me bring up a Scientology term– MEST meaning matter, energy, space and time.

    In some ways they mean the same things but nobody outside Scientology talks about MEST. Each day, I suspect, fewer and fewer people use the term. Gestalt is a commonly used term. In this situation, we are not just looking at Monique Rathbun’s case, we are looking at the Gestalt of the Church of Scientology. It is fun to make book on what will happen here and it really matters to Monique and Marty Rathbun as it should. It also matters to the cult and their lawyers. But it is only part of the gestalt which now includes several legal cases, execs abandoning them, execs fighting them, anonymous, websites like this, a rash of journalists and authors, the governments of the world finally getting on board, the movie stars abandoning them, movies out and movies in progress and, of course, me with my picket sign.

    As for the MEST, things don’t look good. The matter (money) is not flowing their way. The troops are out of energy. Time is working against them. The only thing on their side is space as they build more and bigger cult offices.

    • Poison Ivy

      …offices which, left to their own devices, can’t pay their electricity bills….

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        All those 4,200,244 bricks and 303,099 square feet of crown moulding and 353,553, 988 marble tiles … they don’t need to see in the dark.

  • Nevermore

    OT, but what happened with Devon Campbell yesterday? Google hasn’t found anything…

    • Eivol Ekdal
      • Nevermore

        Merci!

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        “The charges of conspiracy to commit murder and first-degree kidnapping have been dropped.” Now, just attempted kidnapping charges? What? Why?

        • Sherbet

          Yeah, what happened there??

          • Poison Ivy

            Wimps.

            • Sherbet

              I assume they go after only those charges they’ll be more likely to prove. Still…

            • Robert Eckert

              Yeah. What Howdy said. They may also be trying to persuade these knuckleheads to just plead guilty to the reduced charges, although they may be crazy enough to fight it all the way through trial so they can inflict their rants on a judge and jury and get sentenced to decades.

            • WildaBeast

              This whole thing is just…argh. Come the fuck ON! Why must the police be damn near as incompetent as the people they set up!

          • Captain Howdy

            The D.A after getting the evaluation from the shrink which determined they were both mildly retarded and mentally ill decided s/he didn’t have a chance in hell of convincing a judge or jury that these two defectives were remotely capable of pulling off their fantasy.

            The cops tried to score “terrorist” points and goofed the floof. It’s like the FBI setting up these kids on the internet asking them if they wanna join Al-Qaeda then they provide them with cash, arms, explosives and a fantasy bomb button to push and it’s BAM we foiled a terrorist attack..that we set-up..YAY!

            • Sherbet

              We can assume scn won’t be rallying around Devon with their ample legal resources. Crazy? Caught in a crime? Nope, we don’t know her.

            • WildaBeast

              They can dodge all they want, but apparently Devon’s lawyers have moved for separate trials because she “isn’t really a sovereign citizen”. Which begs the question, “What is she then?” Answer: a longtime Scilon.
              Even if they try to repudiate her, this is going to be an epic PR footbullet for them.

            • Sherbet

              “Devon who? We don’t know her. And she wasn’t important, anyway.”

      • 1subgenius

        Outrage.

  • tetloj

    Judge it’s not fair. Plaintiff’s husband knows every time we tell lies. That’s an unfair advantage. And religious bigotry. And against the constitution. And it just……sucks. So there.

    • sugarplumfairy

      Lol.. the motion in a nutshell..

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        Exactamundo! I’m sure that wog judge won’t catch on to it though.

        • RMycroft

          Evil Overlord #12. One of my advisers will be an average five-year-old child. Any flaws in my plan that he is able to spot will be corrected before implementation.

          • ze moo

            I see you are aware of the ‘rules of evil overlords’. I always lose it when I get to ‘make all air ducts too small to climb through’…

    • 1subgenius

      You’re forgetting their ultimate tactic, as per the French fraud case.
      Storming out of the courtroom, and later appealing because they proceeded in your absence.
      What could possibly go wrong with that?

      • aquaclara

        Giggles and snickers from today’s docs:
        “In his efforts to convince this Court of that claim, Mark Rathbun betrays the fiduciary duties he owes to his former employer and EAGERLY and deliberately broadcasts his corrupted and false version of its confidential and privileged information.” (OK, the all caps are mine.) EAGERLY.

        Since when is being happy a crime?

        “Fiduciary’ is a fun word, too. I thought the word was “volunteer” where, in which case, how can he owe Tiny Fists anything?

        “The conduct of Plaintiff’s counsel is unprofessional, unethical and immoral…” Bahahahah
        hahahahahahahahahah.

        • ThetaBara

          Oh, Marty got paid while he was in. The muckteys get paid real money and eat decent food, it’s just the schmoes who are trampled on.

          • aquaclara

            aah, I did not know that. So there are actual employees in the cult, not just volunteers?
            I wonder if that would allow whistle-blower protection to kick in….
            thanks.

      • Eclipse-girl

        We need to name this tactic. Richelieu Jr. was justifiably upset when I called it “the French Defense.”
        Calling it the “The $cientology Defense” doesn’t work because the Co$ tries everything.

        I am now thinking of “The Ostrich Defense” but I don’t want to malign those creatures.

        • Douglas D. Douglas

          The Chutzpah Walk?

          • WildaBeast

            The Ostrich Defense actually isn’t bad. And, um, ostriches totally have their place in the great ecological circle of life and all that, but have you ever gotten up close and personal with one? They smell *horrible*, and if you’re not separated from them by a big ol’ fence, they have to have their beaks wrapped shut (the one I saw had a sweat sock with the toe cut off – very fashionable!) because otherwise they’ll bite you just because they can.

            • ThetaBara

              They’ll kick the shit out of you, too. Ostriches are not to be trifled with!

            • WildaBeast

              Nuh-uh. They’re six feet tall and they weigh like 600 pounds and they’re hugely bad-tempered. Maybe 15 years ago some people thought they could start ostrich and emu farms and turn them into steaks and burgers and such…I thought it was a rather good use for them, but apparently it wasn’t a successful business model.

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              You furinners have the weirdest pets.

            • WildaBeast

              LOL Oddly enough, this was the one year I lived in the States. My dad was on sabbatical and had a research grant in Chapel Hill, NC, so I spent my sixth grade year there…and met the big smelly angry bird with gutting claws on its feet.

            • Interested

              I’d DM read how good emus are at guarding somewhere he might decide to swop the guard dogs hat are in place. I’d love to see that. They are large enough to put into sO uniform. Chuckle

            • Captain Howdy

              Ostriches, Emus, Cassowarys can eviscerate & disembowel you with one kick.

            • Eclipse-girl

              They have a really wicked claw on their feet.

            • Captain Howdy

              I almost lost my family jewels to an Emu.

            • WildaBeast

              Eeeep! Did you piss it off, or were you just near the thing when it was in a bad mood?

            • Captain Howdy

              I grew up across the street from the Frisco Zoo and my friends and I were trying to sneak in at the usual spot and soon as we hopped the fence this Emu came out of the brush and headed for me and I immediately turned and jumped as high as I could back onto the fence and the Emu kicked at me and barely missed. Sneaky bastards were using guard Emus

            • WildaBeast

              Jesus! That’s the kind of moment that fully justifies crapping your pants…and the thought of guard emus is horrifying!

          • N. Graham

            The Courtroom Storm Defense?
            Missing Miscavige Defense?

            • WildaBeast

              The Empty Courtroom Defense?

        • 1subgenius

          Something like the “Murderous Orphan” defense, after the guy who killed his parents, and plead for mercy because he was an orphan.
          But even that isn’t catchy enough.

        • Robert Eckert

          La Défense Scientologique reminds those in the know that they uncorked this one in the French courts.

          • WildaBeast

            Hmmm, I could go with that. Sounds nice, has an inside joke flavour, and those not in the know will probably ask why it’s in French, and then they’ll learn aaallll about it.

          • richelieu jr

            Quite elegant, I think.

        • DamOTclese2

          The Surrender Monkey Defense might work. It’s a fine defense it is,too, since surrendering is the way to win in Scientology loon circles.

        • TheHoleDoesNotExist

          “The Miscavige Defense”

          …because I want this fucker’s name and all it represents to be violently slammed into the history books, just like LRH wanted. Oh wait…

        • richelieu jr

          The thing is, people say ‘To take French leave’ which means to sneak out, you see (we actually say ‘filer à l’anglaise’ which means ‘to sneak out in the English manner’ so… Don’t you Yanks blame it onthe Greeks or something?

          And anyway, it vibrates too closely to me and makes it sound like Scilons are acting like the French (Prosecuting themselves and denying themselves the statute of ‘religion’? Now THAT I’d like to see!)

          • WildaBeast

            Errr..what we associate with the Greeks is what David Miscavige seems to be unusually concerned about having happen to him, should he ever be imprisoned.

      • Cat Daddy

        GTFO defense

      • DamOTclese2

        Oh I would love to see Scientology employ the French Procedure in Texas. “Bailiff! Stop those assholes from leaving this court room!” — The Judge.

    • ze moo

      And ‘stamps tiny feet and cries’…….

      • WildaBeast

        Don’t forget ‘turns red and yells and goes to the Hole to punch someone because he can’!
        Ugh…

    • DamOTclese2

      I’m surprised the lawyers have not been told to play the “religious bigotry” card yet. David must be holding that in reserve.

    • Missionary Kid

      Scientology legal strategy: reductio ad absurbum.

  • California

    RE: Narconon and the insurance companies

    Interesting. IANAL and so I do not wish to comment on this. However, I would suggest that the plaintiffs suing Narconon talk with the their attorneys about this development. I would not like to see the plaintiffs lose out because of this reasoning.

    Furthermore, if anyone has knowledge of the insurers of the various Narconons and the WLC-affiliated substance abuse facilities, it might be nice to post that information here.

    • ze moo

      If the insurance companies did not do their ‘due diligence’, they will still be on the hook. If they just accepted the word of NarCONon in the insurance applications, hey may be off the hook. I suspect that the rehab property will be seized and auctioned off to pay any judgement. I wonder if the apartment complex can be seized too??

      • Public Buggering

        And also if it is determined that the insurance carriers really did employ “due diligence” and insured Scientology anyway, that would be an admission.

  • Interested

    I know this is off subject, but if you have not read mike Rinders blog ” not the friendliest place in the world” early sep. please try to do so. It is moving and sad and eye opening.

    • Poison Ivy

      I read it – it is heartbreaking. Scientology uses people, takes their money and their souls, chews ‘em up and spits ‘em out, at the very time in their lives they most need a community to help them.

    • 1subgenius

      Good article about massive blatant fraud on the org in Budapest by Sea Org & Co.

      • Interested

        Yes, I like his blog…. Mostly. He has a fantastic sense of humour.

      • aquaclara

        Thanks. it’s an excellent post on Budapest Ideal Org crush. In the comments, someone notes that the building that had been slated for Ideal initially (before a second option had to be purchased) just sold at less than the initial purchase price. It is further noted that four other Scilon buildings are up for sale there.
        A trend?

        • Robert Eckert

          Same thing happened in Portland.

    • Eclipse-girl

      Once you are broke, old or sick, you are useless to Co$

  • Nick Overmyer

    So guys—bit off topic but I just found out that GTA 5 will contain a full-on parody of scientology. Looks to be hilarious. Did anyone else know about this!? http://www.gtav.net/news/4578/have-you-seen-these-los-santos-residents

  • Mark

    Looking at the expressions on the faces in that “back in the day” picture, I suspect Marty Rathbun started “enturbulating” DM (a COB Of Very Little Brain, after all) rather earlier than everybody thought:

    • Mooser

      Looking at that picture, I can only recall the words of Thoreau: “Beware of any enterprise which requires new clothes”.

      • Sherbet

        And in the words of Hans Christian Andersen: “REALLY beware of any enterprise which requires belief in the emperor’s new clothes.”

      • Poison Ivy

        Just finished re-reading the “LRH’s navy career” section in “A Piece of Blue Sky.” For him to adopt faux-Naval uniforms for his minions (and the “Commodore” title!) given his service record is just pathetic.

        • Sherbet

          And insulting to Navy war veterans.

          • Poison Ivy

            Of which PaterPI was a real one!

            • Sherbet

              And has my gratitude, as do all veterans, wartime or otherwise.

            • Eclipse-girl

              Mine was an Army veteran. I thought false claims as LRH’s could send you to jail. If not, It should be illegal

            • Robert Eckert

              The “Stolen Valor Act” now makes it an offense to falsely claim to have been awarded decorations. It is fairly recent legislation I think, after some egregious cases; I don’t think there was anything like it in force when LRH was still alive.

            • ze moo

              Those laws were found to be unconstitutional. Seems we have a ‘right’ to lie. Lying to get tangible benefits is still illegal, but wearing an unearned Purple Heart or any other decoration (except Medal of Honor) is protected ‘free speech’.

            • Douglas D. Douglas

              Yep. That’s the peril of living in a free and open society. Even creeps have rights.

            • Robert Eckert
            • Eclipse-girl

              That is sad. For all that the Vets have given, I think we should be able to protect their legacies.

            • Deeana

              I can attest that Vietnam Vets keep a close eye on this issue and quite proactively question and “out” imposters. And they have been doing so for quite some time now. There have been some very public outings over the years.

              Also this:

              Stolen Valor Act Becomes Law

              Week of June 10, 2013

              On June 3, President Barack Obama signed into law The American Legion-backed Stolen Valor Act of 2013, which now makes it a “federal crime for an individual to fraudulently hold oneself out to be a recipient of any of several specified military decorations or medals with the intent to obtain money, property, or other tangible benefit.” Violators could face up to a year in prison. The U.S. Supreme Court had overturned the original Stolen Valor Act of 2005, deeming it unconstitutional because it was, in the justices’ opinion, too broad in scope and violated the right of free speech. A summary and the text of the Act are available on the Congress.gov website at http://beta.congress.gov/bill/113th-congress/house-bill/258.

            • Poison Ivy

              LRH would’ve been busted many times over. In fact CO$ should be busted for the claims they still make.

            • WildaBeast

              Pity it can’t be retroactively applied. Imagine if LRH was posthumously convicted!

            • richelieu jr

              Here in France he WAS convicted and sentenced to four years while he was still alive.

        • 3feetback-of-COS

          I call them the Make Believe Navy, the MBN.

          I wonder if anyone who served in the real navy takes the SO as an insult.

      • Mark

        I’ll hazard a guess that at least some of that gold braid on Shortarse’s “uniform” is disguised wires from his thinking-aid.

        • WildaBeast

          If he has a thinking-aid, it’s fifty years out of date and malfunctioning badly…

          • Mark

            Well, if he’d only stop wetting himself, the batteries wouldn’t keep on getting ruined.

            • WildaBeast

              Hmmm, that Depends shoop is starting to seem awfully relevant to this conversation…

      • Free Minds, Free Hearts

        I know, what on earth are they wearing? They look like little kids playing dress up.

        • WildaBeast

          Put it this way: I’d rather walk down a major downtown street starkers at 2pm on a Saturday in July than wear those outfits in the privacy of my own home.

      • DamOTclese2

        I wonder if these clowns think they’re cute. It’s amazing, adults playing dress-up.

    • Douglas D. Douglas

      Speaking as an art director, I am certain that at some point in this shoot the photographer either handed Missy Miscavige those papers, or asked him to pick them up. Holding papers gives even the most befuddled dope the appearance of gravitas.

      (Just crop the papers out of his hands and you will see what I mean.)

      • WildaBeast

        Oh…oh MY, 3D. I covered the papers with my hand and just looked at his face and…bol…

        • Douglas D. Douglas

          And, of course, just a soupçon of annoyed cruelty in those eyes. As in, “Get the photo and get out.”

      • Mark

        Good grief, I see it, Douglas – a sort of “Duh – my brain hoits!” look. I wish I’d shooped a toilet-roll into his hands now!

        • Douglas D. Douglas

          Poor little Miss. It sucks to be so very much in charge.

          • WildaBeast

            The pressures of command…the loneliness at the top…it’s enough to kill anyone’s brain cells. It’s just that Damage Mismanage had so many fewer than most folks to begin with…so it makes his face look…well, like that.

    • Suppressive Tomato

      Some joker and degrader commented on this photo a few days back how it looks like Marty is kneeling so as to make COB appear taller and now I can’t unsee it.

  • Krew13
  • Moonshot

    There is one thing you can bank on. If things legally start to look very dicey for DM. As in, his ASS might end up in prison, at that point there will be unearthed some appropriatly relavant secret heretofor undiscovered LRH Advices and DM will find a pressing need to base his Ministry and his ASS in some foreign country with strict NO EXTRADITION TO THE USA laws on the books.

    Don’t be suprised if you start hereing about a new SCN facility being built in Venzuala or Belgium or someplace of the sort. Probably suitable properties have already been purchased out of the funds generated by DM’s various Ideal Org land and building scams.

    We can fantasize about Bubba getting in some well deserved ASS nookie with DM in their prison love nest, but more than likely the scenerio oultlined above will take place preventing such poetic justice.

    • 1subgenius

      I know that if I had that amount of money, there is no way in hell I’d wait around to get locked up.

      That’s a fact Jack.

      Pro-tip: And he better skate before being arrested and his passport taken away.

      • Eclipse-girl

        If he did run away, how would the $ci – lebrities rationalize it?

        KA would just be herself and yell at everyone
        TC would just visit Dm where ever he was holed up

        And the hollywood allure of $cientology would be gone.

        And you have made the assumption the Dm is smart enough to realize the game is up. As a narcissist, wouldn’t that be admitting defeat? Something that more narcissists are incapable of.

        • 1subgenius

          And nothing of value would be lost.

          And not a fuck would be given.

          http://i43.tinypic.com/axmjdc.gif

          • ze moo

            Another unit of measurement has been found. Finally, another measurement to place between foot-pounds and electron volts.

          • Michael Leonard Tilse

            Is that a dirty needle, or are you just happy to see me?

    • Mooser

      “We can fantasize about Bubba getting in some well deserved ASS nookie with DM in their prison love nest,”

      You know what the song says: “Love, thy magic spell is everywhere!”

    • Poison Ivy

      JohnP, our resident Capitalist, was watching for this a while ago, following the money trail, I presume.

    • Phil McKraken

      Wait, Belgium doesn’t have an extradition treaty with the US? Because… dame blanche!

      • ze moo

        Belgium, like all of western Europe (old and new nato) have extrdition treaties with the US. Moonshot was joking and degrading…..There are several South American counties that could deny extradition for ‘political reasons’. Wave 2 million dollars in cash under any ones nose and you’ll get their undivided attention.

        • WildaBeast

          He could always go to North Korea *smiles sweetly*. I know they don’t have an extradition treaty with the U.S., I know they’re broke as hell and thus easily bribable, I know Kim Jong Un has a fascination with all things American…and just think how well Davey would fit in there!

          • Douglas D. Douglas

            He’d feel…

            …tall.

            • Sherbet

              Not if Dennis Rodman is visiting! Wouldn’t that be a sight to behold — DM ordering Rodman to SIT DOWN, and Rodman refusing.

            • ze moo

              The Rodman jokes just write themselves, don’t they?

            • Sherbet

              They sure do.

            • Captain Howdy

              Rodman telling the world that Kim is just a regular guy looking for friends would be funny if wasn’t deflecting attention away from horror stories like this:

              “Bizarre report claims Kim Jong Un’s ex-girlfriend executed”
              http://worldnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/08/29/20247358-bizarre-report-claims-kim-jong-uns-ex-girlfriend-executed?lite

            • Robert Eckert

              Her hit song “Excellent Horse-Like Lady”:

              http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v5tkXgw2OMY&feature=player_embedded

            • Captain Howdy

              So he shoots the ex-girlfriend and her entire performing ensemble and makes the families watch, and then sends them to labor camps.

              I bet COB pleasures himself fantasizing he had that kind of power.

            • heuristically_inclined

              It is believed that his current wife may have had influence in her execution. Apparently, they were band mates at one time and there were lingering jealousy issues.

            • junojones

              Hell, I bet Tom wishes he had that power.

            • Captain Howdy

              Who’d thunk Wurlitzer polka music was big in North Korea? On it’s own that video is surreally disturbing without knowing the end result.

            • Robert Eckert

              The title puzzles many people as well. Apparently “horse-like” is a compliment in Korea?

            • junojones

              OK, I watched five seconds of this.
              L Ron and his mighty hammond organ would feel right at home playing ‘Space Jazz’ with this bunch.

              With both hands, even.

            • Robert Eckert

              You are not the first to notice the curious overlaps between Hubbard and the Kims in matters of style.

            • Sherbet

              You said it, Howdy.

          • ze moo

            The only problem with bribing a dictator is what do you do when the dictator wants more?? Saying no is not an option and you can’t run away. While NK would be poetic justice, it would be stupid. Then again, maybe Dennis Rodman could visit him….

            • WildaBeast

              It would end up being a terrible mistake in the end…but that’s the beauty of it!
              Besides, given how incredibly bad DM is at being polite to anyone, there’s always the chance he’d piss off Kim III and end up in a prison camp…

    • John P.

      On the one hand, Miscavige could certainly consider flight to a jurisdiction with no extradition treaty for financial crimes. There are a few of those left, but it is much harder to find a safe haven than it used to be, particularly in the wake of 9/11 and numerous international agreements to stop money laundering and international transport of ill-gotten gains. Bank secrecy is not what it used to be, either.

      The big problem with Miscavige fleeing is that many of the places where he could evade prosecution are ones where a racist xenophobe would not be comfortable. In other words, it seems likely that Miscavige would want to be surrounded by English-speaking white people. That rules out many of the usual places in the world.

      The other problem Miscavige would face is that it is difficult on going to a corrupt country to know who to bribe and how to keep them bribed. If you only bribed eight of the ten people you needed to pay off, the other two would happily turn you in for a big enough reward. And bribery is like blackmail: it’s never a one-time payment. So Miscavige’s potential haven in a corrupt land would not be all that secure.

      Finally, a goodly percentage of countries with no extradition treaty for financial crime will happily hand back many sorts of violent or semi-violent criminals. Cuba, which has no love for the US, recently returned a Florida couple accused of abducting their kids to circumvent a custody order, without significant pressure from the US government.

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        So you’re saying Las Vegas then?

        • DamOTclese2

          Law Vegas is the money laundering capitol of the world, yeah.

        • Captain Howdy

          The U.S doesn’t have a extradition treaty with…”drumroll”..the Vatican!

          • Sherbet

            That’s enough to make DM pretend to renounce the cos to return to his boyhood Catholicism.

      • DamOTclese2

        INTERPOL has been stepping up its financial crimes activities, yeah, and even previously “neutral” Swiss banking institutions are opening up their books to some of the more significant organized crime syndicate’s accounts. David really should flee with as much paper money and gold he can cart off.

        • Robert Eckert

          “Well I don’t know, but I’ve been told, it’s hard to run with a weight of gold. On the other hand, I’ve heard it said, it’s just as hard with a weight of lead.”

          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_nOpJMQ3-VE

      • MissCandle

        My two theories:
        1. The California vaults are cover for digging Shortie’s escape route to China a la Shawshank Redemption; or
        2. Shortie relocates to Somalia to become king of the pirates a la Charles Manson.
        (No offense meant to individual Chinese and non-pirate Somalian people.)
        On a serious note, there are a handful of countries (including island countries) that would be good places for Shortie for consider because, even though they may have anti-money-laundering and know-your-customer laws in place, their governments and banking systems are still developing and are therefore unsophisticated and easily manipulated (if not corrupt).

    • DamOTclese2

      We can also see what David thinks about Public Buggering in his amazing outburst during the Grady Ward / Keith Henson hearing. :) Got to be amused by what runs through that dwarf’s head all the time, apparently.

    • junojones

      Years ago in Granta, they printed a story (sorry, can no longer remember the title or author) about a a very rich man who decides to trade in his American passport for a tax exile’s life somewhere else. He has to rule out Europe for legal reasons, and rule out S.A. and Africa for certain other cultural and technological reasons. He winds up in Macau or some other small asian city/island/state, which ultimately proves to be his undoing. The story was a good one and it stuck with me…

      DM is sorta fucked there. Bulgravia is out of the question because even eastern europe is a part of EU now and subject to US treaties. His options are rapidly retreating and whatever choice he makes is probably going to bite him on the ass hard.

  • aquaclara

    Davey’s next move: “Marty can’t admit this stuff. Para. 31-36 are protected by priest-penitent confidentiality. Strike it from the record.”

    • Eclipse-girl

      I am sure they will try to use that one, too.

    • Minion Gayle

      That’s right, only Dave, Marty and the 472 reviewers of the files are allowed to know this {holey} information.

  • Still_On_Your_Side

    Is Narconon an alter ego of the Church of Scientology and /or the Religious Technology Center? Was there a co-mingling of funds between the entities? Did Miscavige use Narconon as the church’s piggy bank? These are questions that will be asked in order to try to reach past Narconon into the billion dollar plus assets of the church, i.e., pierce the Narconon corporate veil and discover who really is behind the curtain. These are questions that, undoubtedly, will be asked even if the insurers are still paying for the defense. If the insurance companies are allowed to bail (and I think that is a good possibility), Narconon does not get to just walk away. If they truly cannot afford attorneys, and, therefore, stage no defense, the plaintiffs get a default judgment. If there is a judgment, the judgment creditors can force Narconon into bankruptcy. The bankruptcy court, and bankruptcy attorneys, are experts at finding assets, piercing corporate veils and digging out fraud. At the end of the day, Miscavige will be foolish if he lets Narconon lose the class action lawsuit due to a lack of lawyers. He has so much at stake, it would make more sense to pay for the lawyers or to try to settle, no matter where the money comes from.

    • Eclipse-girl

      It is hoped by some of us, that lawyers looking for money for settlements will be able to unravel the corporates structure and then use RICO to seize assets of Co$, RTS, IAS etc.

    • aquaclara

      Brilliant. thanks.

    • Mooser

      Gosh, to my mind (what’s left of it) the appellation “Religious Technology” is oxymoronicly redolent of fraudulence. On the other hand, it might be a good name for a company that installs Audio-Visual systems in chapels.

      • ThetaBara

        LOL! Actually, if you look at Tibet, they have genuine religious technology: prayer flags and prayer wheels. Whenever the flags move, or the wheels are rotated, all the prayers within them are sent out. So if you have 100 prayers in a prayer wheel and you revolve it once, you’ve just sent out 100 prayers in a very short time. The flags are moved by the wind – automated prayer!

        • Robert Eckert

          The Tibetans in the US have pioneered computers that automatically repeat mantras.

        • Casabeca

          I love seeing those in films about Mt. Everest.

  • Sherbet

    Regarding the possibility of plaintiffs in narconon suits ending up with nothing: Didn’t I suggest that might happen when Western World first balked? Didn’t I? Yes, I did!

    • Bury_The_Nuts

      I attest!

    • Eclipse-girl

      I still hope that lawyers, and forensic accountants will go after he corporate structure and then be able to use RICO and go after assets of the Co$

      • Poison Ivy

        Yes, as Still On Your Side suggested, an “alter ego” assault? I am not a lawyer but it seems like there could be grounds, if the right evidence for Narconon’s chain of command could be obtained.

        • Eclipse-girl

          What it would also do is EXPOSE the fraudulent corporate structure and hopefully make the Co$, IAS, RTC etc liable for a whole lot more lawsuits. Wishful thinking.

        • Robert Eckert

          Yes, yes, but this makes it all so much more complicated and expensive, and will deter all but the most dedicated lawyers.

          • Eclipse-girl

            As someone said a few days ago, you don’t mess with Insurance Co.s I would assume they do have dedicated lawyers, and aren’t legal fees paid by the losers in cases like this?

            • Robert Eckert

              The insurance companies aren’t the ones we’re worried about. They don’t need to pierce any corporate veils or whatnot to demonstrate that Narconon has made misrepresentations and shouldn’t have liability coverage. It’s the people trying to sue for what was done to them or their family members who have a tough row to hoe if there is no insurer paying the judgments and they have to pry the money loose from Miscavige’s fingers because Narconon “has no” money.

          • 1subgenius

            The current lawyers have a resource of >9000 interwebbites with relevant info. Hopefully some will forward useful info/dox.

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      Yessirreee bob! I used to be on of those class action cheerleaders until that one time when Tony, in one of his rare frustrated comments, mentioned for the last time Why class action was not the way to go. doh!

      • WildaBeast

        Class action lawsuits: the lawyers get it all. :-(
        And yes, Sherbet, you called it. If the plaintiffs end up screwed on this, I won’t even consider it a Pyrrhic victory. It’ll just be sad.

  • Bury_The_Nuts

    This is off topic but I have an important update about the Freewinds.
    It is NOT docked in Cartagena as has been stated.

    But It has indeed been found!

    • Sherbet

      Laughing, laughing, laughing, Bury. But it can’t be — “free beer”? Nothing is free on the Freewinds.

      • Bury_The_Nuts

        That is how they get you to take the personality test.

        • Sherbet

          Hahaha! You’ve figured out their M.O., all right.

          • Poison Ivy

            You know, I wonder why Scientology hasn’t gotten into the offshore casino biz? Did LRH have some sort of edict against gambling? (Other than gambling one’s life savings and free will for some sort of poorly sketched out eternity and laughable sooper powerz?)

            • Bury_The_Nuts

              lol, I hope he did have an edict against it.
              That would make Davey and teams gambling trip to Reno while LRH was croaking all the more ironic, eh?

            • Poison Ivy

              Ironic indeed. If they really were on that gambling trip to Reno…

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              Don’t hear any new stories, but used to hear them about Miscavige’s gambling casino habits and noticed how many of them were in the Caribbean ports that the Freewinds visited. Also have heard undetailed reports about his risky investment losses over the years. This is why it was no surprise to hear he was getting other people to buy him real estate during That whole scam.

            • Sherbet

              Yes, no gambling allowed! We know lrh had real moral scruples against vices….No, I can’t type that with a straight face.

              But, you’re right, PI. If there’s money in it, DM should be able to combine “religion” and gambling and come up with a new offshoot. Church of the Rolling Dice, maybe.

            • heuristically_inclined

              Didn’t Jesse Prince catch Little Boots and Pat Broeker skimming off thousands of dollars of Lroon’s money and gambling it away in Vegas?

            • Eclipse-girl

              Could it be that gambling revenue is taxable?

            • Poison Ivy

              Aha! No such thing as non-profit gambling!

            • Suppressive Tomato

              You’re treading dangerous water. Next thing you know, they take over a Native American tribe with e-Meters and suddenly they’re a sovereign nation.

            • Poison Ivy

              I would not be surprised if they tried that. In fact isn’t the Arrowhead Narconon facility on tribal land? (Or wasn’t there some big push to get a Narconon facility built on tribal land, to get around some laws or property taxes or both?)

            • Suppressive Tomato

              Gold Base adjoins a large amount of tribal land.

            • Michael Leonard Tilse

              It used to be at the former Chilocco Indian Agricultural School. They lied to the tribe, IIRC, and the tribe eventually ‘invited’ them to leave.

              I remember when it was announced. The private briefing was that since the new international headquarters was on indian land, it was out of federal jurisdiction and thus could never be shut down.

            • WildaBeast

              Err, when ‘invited’ to depart, did they go?

            • Michael Leonard Tilse

              It looks like it was a bit more complex than that. I don’t know the whole story, but it was being covered by a local paper:

              http://www.xenutv.com/print/newkirk/narconon-71.htm

            • Eclipse-girl

              I just don’t think that any Native Americans / First Nations would tolerate the Co$.
              They would scare the small one.

              I thought you had to have some % of blood ties to the nations to qualify

            • Suppressive Tomato

              Does being a fabled Native American warrior somewhere back on my time-track count?

            • Eclipse-girl

              I lie that tactic

            • Douglas D. Douglas

              Lie? Lie=like? Or is there a cry for help in this…?

            • Eclipse-girl

              You caught it before my edit. Perhaps it was a slip

            • WildaBeast

              At least in Canada, it’s 1/8th for reservation status. My mother missed by a generation, that’s the only way I know.

            • monkeyknickers

              Well, my sister is in, so she wasn’t too frightened. I’m actually surprised that Sci HASN’T focused on natives. We’re all of us kinda fucked up, given the circumstances. The last little ripples in the genocide pond. Grist for the mill.

              I think it’s an equal opportunity scam.

            • Douglas D. Douglas

              The Orgs have Casino Nights. I understand the odds are heavily in favor of the house, however…

            • Eclipse-girl

              I have started to understand that anyone who gambled (their life) with this cult, and was able to escape actually beat the house

            • ze moo

              Clams may be discouraged from gambling, can’t make those ‘donations’ to the IAS if you spent them in Vegas. Fleecing the wogs would seem to be a requirement.

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              It’s all about the IRS glare.

            • 0tessa

              Miscavige and his pals could be found in the casino regularly.

        • dagobarbz

          My results said ‘go home, you’re drunk on free beer.’ And then my wallet disappeared…

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        You’ve got to come to the next SP Society convention. We SO do it right. And there’s much more to come…

        • Sherbet

          You’re very sweet! (And I’m very shy…)

    • Douglas D. Douglas

      I do hope everything is OK…!

      • Sherbet

        No, you don’t, 3D!

    • Suppressive Tomato

      The Co$ used to be able to get new bodies with a free personality test; now it appears they’ve had to resort to free sunset cruises with dolphin watching.

      • ThetaBara

        Over on celebitchy there was a commenter who said they’d seen the freewinds somewhere while on vacation and that people were swimming laps near or around the boat. Sounds like they have a “swimming program.”

        • Suppressive Tomato

          LOL swimming with the sharks, literally.

        • Douglas D. Douglas

          Hard to swim when you’ve been tied up and are wearing gray rags. Or so I’ve been told…

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        Free Beer and Gambling. The Dolphin watching is just a spiritual cloaking ruse. This boat is likely registered as Fleewinds II.

        Also, this pic doesn’t show the teeny bikini beer servers and casino babes.

    • dagobarbz

      They had me at ‘free beer…’

    • DamOTclese2

      The irony is that their new boat can hold every one of their remaining customers.

      Also notice the chain locker in the back? :)

      • Sherbet

        I notice “Sunset Cruise” — Must be TC’s nickname.

  • DamOTclese2

    They look so cute in their little toy sailor outfits! Well, they *would* look cute if they were 8 years old. In adults, it’s not so cute. Good grief, how amusing.

    • Nevermore

      Is it not against some law or other to dress up as like a Navy officer?

      • phronsie

        It’s definitely against any sense of decency or honor, hmphh!

      • DamOTclese2

        Funny you should mention that. In 1998 when a.r.s people attended the Lisa McPherson Memorial Protest in December 5th, we talked with local residents about Scientology, and one crew of citizens working on electrical systems under a sidewalk paused to talk with us about Scientology assloons wearing pretend military clothes.

        One guy working under the sidewalk came out and expressed great anger at the Scientology assclowns wearing military-style uniforms and at Hubbard claiming all kinds of military accomplishments, complaining bitterly about how Scientology defames the tradition and the honor of actual military people who actually served.

        I wrote about it At This Link somewhat. People of Clearwater hate these fuckers walking around in little sailor outfits.

      • DamOTclese2

        Apparently it is not against the law, though some law-makers have tried to pass laws which would make it a crime. It’s illegal if it’s done in the commission of other crimes, it looks like, but something tells me that the coming felony indictments will some how lack mention of this bit of Scientology lunacy.

        • Nevermore

          Maybe the pic of Wavey Davey in his uniform at the top of this page could be included in the curt papers!

          • WildaBeast

            Court papers are seldom if ever ‘curt’. They’re usually verbose beyond the comprehension of any layperson…

            • Nevermore

              I did think of editing that to ‘court papers’ but I like your reply so much I’m not going to!

    • 3feetback-of-COS

      You mean the MBN? Make-Believe-Navy

      • DamOTclese2

        Yeah, that’s the one. :) Still, one has to wonder who they think they’re fooling with their little outfits.

  • DamOTclese2

    “…because… Monique’s attorney Ray Jeffrey and his team
    improperly used “confidential and attorney client privileged
    information…”

    Well, at least the crime syndicate did not trot out the other claim they often use: That telling the truth about Scientology’s crimes and abuses are “trade secrets” and “trademark violations.” Helena Kobrin tried those a number of times, amusingly, and got slapped by various Judges.

    I find it remarkable that the syndicate is trying to get knowledgeable, highly informed attorneys removed from cases based solely upon the fact that said attorneys hold the upper hand in terms of detailed knowledge of Scientology’s core crimes and core human rights / civil rights abuses. It is an admission that the crime syndicate *is* a criminal enterprise and that it *does* commit the endless human rights abuses detailed in the affidavit, among other documents down through the decades of criminal and civil trials.

    I wonder if any Judge would consider witness testimony of people’s crimes to be “protected information.” I wonder if *any* criminal could play that game. “I’m sorry, your Honor, my client murdered two women and evaded police driving a white Bronco for hours, but that information — despite widespread coverage in the world’s news — is client privelage, you can’t use any of that to prosecute O. J.”

    Yeah. That’ll work.

    • 1subgenius

      “I’m sorry, your Honor, my client murdered two women and evaded police driving a white Bronco for hours, but that information — despite widespread coverage in the world’s news — is client privelage, you can’t use any of that to prosecute O. J.”

      And pathetic Judge Ito bought it all. And the shit head prosecutors declined to even offer much of the conclusive incriminating evidence.

      The best analysis of the subject was by Vincent Bugliosi :Outrage: The Five Reasons Why O.J. Simpson Got Away with Murder (1996)

      The prosecutors, including Scientology dabbling Marcia Clarke, were completely incompetent.
      Bugliosi would have convicted OJ in a heartbeat. His logic is impeccable. I wish I had a brain a fraction as sharp as his.

      And his book about Bush v. Gore is a thing of beauty.

      The Betrayal of America: How the Supreme Court Undermined the Constitution and Chose Our President (2001)

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Betrayal_of_America

      • ThetaBara

        Marcia is/was a scilon?! Damn.

        • Sherbet

          I’m sorry to hear that, too.

        • 1subgenius

          I used the term “dabbling” because its one of those unverified things. She was married to one, so……
          Regardless of that, she’s an idiot.

  • M Diggs

    With everything swirling around COS and all the damage control to be done, i always have and certainly now more than ever wonder how in the world its even physically possible for DM to micromanage every single issue the church is involved in?

    The PR and legal stuff alone must distract from his awareness of people blowing and the normal day to day internal problems. I mean, I realize that you hardly sleep as a sea org member, but if you’re him – you basically have to be doing piles of blow to deal with everything that’s going on. Don’t get me wrong I’m not insinuating the stories about him aren’t true, to the contrary, I believe he’s a psycho. What is DOES make me wonder is what is truly the mixture of disorders he has going on the fuel him? Clearly there has been talk about narcissism, bipolar disorder, hyperactivity, and displaying sociopath behavior… but has anyone tried to distill all the information we have about him and come up with a scientific hypothesis? By virtue of having a PR department he is aware of the concept of perception so we can be sure that this is accepted as part of his “reality”. But then explore the mire of contradictions he has committed PR vs legal action. His actions seem equivalent to putting band aids on a broken arm. In an age as transparent as this one, why ignore the professional advise of your legal aid? I know LRH was terribly prone to contradicting himself, and might well be his example – but he had the anonymity of no internet to hide behind. What kind of personality disorder can cause someone to be hopelessly aware of the own mire they are creating?

    Larry Wright wrote about some disturbing and aggressive behavior DM exhibited as a boy at Saint Hill. Then you try to reconcile this with Jenna Hill’s perception of him when she was a child – to be kind and patient (tangent: which i always thought to be interesting he interacted with her as a child when there are no children just adult thetans in child bodies) This confirms that he is aware of perception. Combine that with what little we have seen of him in “public” – robotically rambling speeches or tap dancing around ted koppel’s questions. (poorly, i might add).

    Thoughts on the mixture of DM’s nuerosis?

    • Douglas D. Douglas

      Miscavige is in an exquisite trap of his own devising.

      (And welcome back, MD. Don’t be such a stranger!)

      • 1subgenius

        I like the phrase “Hoist with your own petard”

        .http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/hoist%20by%20your%20own%20petard.html

        • TheHoleDoesNotExist

          Me too.

          • Mooser

            I like “Miscarriage” . My Disqus spel-chek tells me that is his name, and I believe it

        • Nevermore

          I especially like it where Miss Cabbage is concerned!

          • phronsie

            I think Miss Cabbage is my favorite moniker for the midge.

            • ThetaBara

              Mine, too. Or just “the Cabbage.” Because he is a cabbage head!

          • 1subgenius

            BTW, here’s one I haven’t seen before:
            McSavage.

    • Eclipse-girl

      I am waiting with baited breath to hear the responses.

      I want to know what makes a person a psychopath when their sibling is not.
      I want to know what makes a person a narcissist when their sibling is not.

      How much is nature? How much is nurture?

      • Robert Eckert

        Maybe there really is such a thing as a “soul” (or “thetan” or whatever you want to call it) that does not derive from the physical history either genetic or environmental.

      • ThetaBara

        Brain chemistry.

        • Eclipse-girl

          So its nature, bad genetics?

          • Robert Eckert

            If it is indeed “nature” that does not necessarily imply “genetics”. Other things can go wrong in early development that were not encoded for in the DNA.

            • Eclipse-girl

              I know better. I was writing without thinking.

          • ThetaBara

            According to the well-researched book “The Sociopath Next Door” there have been brain studies on sociopathic people which have shown that, when asked to empathize with a person in a photograph (or understand what that person is feeling) the areas of their brain light up that would light up for you or me if we were attempting to do an algebra problem. The book was incredibly enlightening overall, for me.

            Also, if children are raised together and treated the same, it really points to genetic factors. I used to believe nurture was all, but, it isn’t. You can only play the hand you’re dealt.

            • Eclipse-girl

              TY. I will get that book.

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist
            • Eclipse-girl

              I realize neglect and worse can cause horrific problems.

              But is there any evidence that either El Ron, or Miscmidget were neglected, or worse by their families?

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              No evidence. And I was just adding to the conversation of biology. I believe from my own connecting dots of others’ research that Hubbard suffered from hydrocephalus as an effect of extreme preemie birth. He had 90% of the symptoms of those babies who survive, and at exactly the right time of development (teens to early 20’s). These included both physical and mental problems. It even includes many oddities, such as difficulty with math, excelling in English but on the verbal and essay parts. There are many many detailed symptoms. His onset of trying to cure himself with drugs and alcohol magnified these of course. He then tried to invent his own cures (a/k/a Dianetics and Scientology) while simultaneously imbibing. Well, we all know how That worked out for him. but again, this is just my opinion.

              Don’t know about Miscavige. His dad’s book didn’t really talk that much about him. There Might be physical background causes, such as too long without oxygen to the brain during an asthma attack while having the flu or some other ailment. And IF Miscavige has also been imbibing heavily with alcohol and perhaps steroids, it would explain a lot. He grew up in the rougher attitudes and behaviors of Philly bullies and so could have learned his way to his personality. Or he could have just been born predestined to a prick.

            • Eclipse-girl

              TY for sharing your opinions.

        • D.Y.G.

          Brain wiring. A psychopaths brain is literally wired wrong. The neural pathways don’t fire the same compared to normal, empathic folks. The amygdala is impaired, or even sometimes deformed.

          • Michael Leonard Tilse

            Dainty Miss lost his amygdala long ago
            To a man with fava beans and a nice merlot.

    • WildaBeast

      Is it possible that he essentially maintains a PR department as a status symbol? Like, “Oh, all real organizations and important people have one, so I better have one too, plus Elron was concerned about spin and I have to follow in his footsteps”? That would explain both why he has one, and why he seems to be constantly undermining all their efforts on his behalf.

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        The PR dept is part of the scientology intelligence wing. That pretty much tells you what you need to know about it.

        • WildaBeast

          Didn’t know that. And yep, you’re right, it does!

    • M Diggs

      I guess i am just really interested in exactly how aware his is of what he is doing? Several scholars of Scientology’s history have said that LRH knew exactly what he was doing – including Jon Atack. But DM didn’t invent this world. Is he some weird and lethal mix of being indoctrinated, combined with being mentally ill? Or is he acutely aware of the fact that he is overseeing a cult and trying to outrun everything that is chasing him? Is he living in some half tech / half wog world. I am just totally fascinated by what created this monster.

      • Michael Leonard Tilse

        In answer to your questions: Yes.

    • D.Y.G.

      I vote that he is pure psychopath. Psychopaths are almost manic in their younger years – they’re full of energy, and they need it to keep all of their various schemes going. The good news is that most of them burn out by late middle age.

    • kemist

      I think that like all gurus (or drug empire kingpins), he’s been made crazy with power.

      He’s definitely cynical about it all, or he wouldn’t have lasted that long. Gurus who believe their own schtick, like drug lords who also use, tend to end up dead or deposed quite rapidly. However, being used to having all his whims obeyed in his little abode of power, adaptation to the real world must be difficult.

  • pronoia

    Aargh! No time to read today :-(.

    I never knew it was possible to disqualify a person’s attorney until I strated to read about scientology, and it does seem to be a big part of their go-to playbook. I mean, when haven’t they tried it?

    • Eclipse-girl

      Attorneys have to go through something like a “due diligence” before they can represent you. My husband needed advice on a contract and couldn’t use one firm because they had dealings with the DH’s partner.

      Attorneys are supposed to represent their clients interests. However if they are being paid by a 3rd party, they could be representing the interests of the 3rd party rather than their clients.

      • WhereIsSHE

        This is not accurate.
        It’s off topic, so I dont want to belabor the issue.
        In certain transactional matters (non-litigation matters), yes, due diligence is the appropriate term for a non-interested law firm (or accounting firm) who is hired to evaluate the risks and advantages of engaging in the proposed business transaction.

        We are dealing here with a litigation matter. Before an attorney can take on representation of a client in a litigation matter, the attorney must ensure that he/she (and his/her lawfirm) do not have a conflict of interest.

        You are confusing these two concepts, unless you are just using a lay version of “due dilligence” to describe the thoroughness with which a conflict of interest search is performed.
        This is an oversimplification (but just to give an idea):
        You/the firm cannot take on representation of a client whose interests are adverse to current clients (and former clients under certain circumstances) unless the client waives the conflict.

        There are Rules of Professional Responsibility which guide the analysis, and there are far too detailed/lengthy and off topic for purposes of this post.
        Here is the ABA Model Rule on current clients: http://www.americanbar.org/groups/professional_responsibility/publications/model_rules_of_professional_conduct/rule_1_7_conflict_of_interest_current_clients/comment_on_rule_1_7.html

        • Eclipse-girl

          I apologize for my ignorance. I am a lay person.

          • Robert Eckert

            Everybody is ignorant, just about different subjects. The Bunker is a great cross-pollination of education.

          • Jgg2012

            If Jeffrey had a conflict of interest, such as representing Shelly Miscavige or being a friend of Davey, and certainly if he was representing Scientology. Also, if he knew Scientology’s attorneys or witnesses.

            • Eclipse-girl

              But there is no evidence of that.

              There also must be something for Monique’s filing and retaining Ray Jeffrey first, that would ?force Co$ not to hire attorneys who are friends of Ray Jeffrey. It would be too easy to retain a new attorney who has dealings with Jeffrey and then complain and say Jeffrey must be removed.

            • Robert Eckert

              There would be nothing wrong with the other side hiring an attorney who was “friends” of your attorney (in a small town, for example, they all know each other), but hiring an attorney who works in the same firm as your attorney would be a conflict.

            • Eclipse-girl

              But what I am trying to ask is wouldn’t the second attorney be the one disqualified / removed? There is no conflict unless Co$ etc hire someone who is in conflict with RJ, and then they would lose that lawyer because Ray was there first.

            • Robert Eckert

              In the Garcia case they were saying they hired an affiliated lawyer first, long ago to handle an unrelated matter. Here, their argument is way too incoherent for me to try to make sense of it. If Marty Rathbun were an attorney, now working for Ray although he used to work for the {church}, then they would have the case for disqualification that they are somehow trying to articulate.

            • Eclipse-girl

              Marty was with $cientology for ? 27 yrs. When did he have time to pursue a legal education?

              I don’t know about the Garcia case, but I do know my husband was able to use the same law firm as his partner as long as the business was not related to the task of what the partner had hired them for.

            • Robert Eckert

              Yeah, well the argument for disqualification in the Garcia case is very feeble for the same sort of reason– but in this case, where Marty is not an attorney of any kind, there seem to be several severe holes in the argument they are trying to spin.

  • DamOTclese2

    Fascinating. I had thought that the days of incompetent, stupid, dimwitted Scientology lawyers were over; Helena Kobrin, Ava Parquette, Kendrick Moxon, Samuel Rosen are long gone however it looks like David Miscaviage has gone back to hiring new stupids.


    “But the far larger, more structural problem with CSI’s motion to disqualify is that Marty isn’t an employee of Ray Jeffrey, he’s a witness.”

    Also Marty is not a party to the civil complaint, he’s neither defendant nor plaintiff. He is solely a witness to the crimes and abuses committed prior to the facts of the extant civil case as well as a witness during the facts of the extant case.

    Amusing that the crime syndicate would complain that a witness’ factual testimony should disqualify the attorneys that file and utilize said testimony only because said witness is highly knowledgeable about the facts detailed in said testimony. Got to wonder if *any* criminal enterprise is allowed to make that argument or whether Scientology is the only one.

  • DamOTclese2


    “… quit whining about Marty and sue him…”

    Oh he will, he will. David Miscaviage has almost certainly already been screaming and slapping people demanding that they sue him already, and no doubt the people telling him there are no legitimate grounds to do so are already sore from the endless resulting slaps.

    Bet you $1 the psychopath already has another suit of lawyers drawing up the complaint papers against Marty, going through his “Pre Clear” folders looking for ways to “handle” him and “shutter him in to silence.”

    • t1kk

      It’d have happened already if they were going to. They have plenty of avenues at their disposal, if they were so disposed. At a macro level, to sue Marty would be to elevate his stature while they’re simultaneously busy trying to pretend he doesn’t exist. Also, Marty can control the media narrative (and its size) and they know that. More importantly, Marty had too much one-to-one contact with Miscavige and they’d be effectively forcing that into the open if they sued him. Granted, it’s coming out in drips and drabs anyway. Scientology often makes poor decisions regarding legal strategy but they’ve been gun-shy with regard to the biggest possible players, I’d speculate for the reasons I give above.

      • WildaBeast

        So, in summary: not even Scientology is stupid enough to sue Marty Rathbun.
        That says something about how stupid suing him would be.

        • Jgg2012

          It also says what a high position he did, in fact, hold. If he was a nobody going to the tabloids with a bogus story, he would be easy to discredit. Knowing what he knows, however, even they won’t go after him. How many previously unrevealed Lisa McPherson details would you like?

      • Eclipse-girl

        Did Marty ever sign any NDAs?

        • Robert Eckert

          He blew, so no.

          • Spackle Motion

            It is highly likely that he signed many NDAs while in the SO. When you route out, they make you sign more but I would bet money that he’s tight lipped for legal reasons as well as selfish ones.

            • TonyOrtega

              Yes, Rinder told me that he and Marty did sign many NDAs as part of standard SO contracts that they were required to sign each year or something. They said they never worried about them, and the church has never brought them up.

            • Robert Eckert

              Ah. We may get to see them shortly, if the judge demands evidence that Marty had any “fiduciary duty” not to talk about what Miscavige ordered him to do.

            • Jgg2012

              NDAs normally apply to what someone tells you, not torts you independently witness. Trade secrets, for example, would be protected. If Marty saw Davey slap a 3d person, that would normally not be covered (but an admission from Davey would be).

            • WildaBeast

              If the {church} has never brought them up, that implies that there’s no legal ground for the NDAs to stand on…doesn’t it?

            • t1kk

              It’s impossible to speculate without actually reading the document.

            • WildaBeast

              Okay. I won’t, then. /shuts off particular line of speculation

            • Spackle Motion

              Thanks, Tony. I’m not so sure that I find those two credible when it comes to their own actions while in the Cult (even when they say that they are not worried about them). Rinder and Rathbun are holding back on what they really did while in the Cult, which may be to prevent criminal sanctions and/or not getting sued by Scientology. I think it is a mix of both.

      • Jgg2012

        Right, it would be another Debbie Cook–he would testify to threats and blackmail that forced him to sign anything or promise anything. It would mean more bad publicity. It would mean taking somewhat contradictory positions (“it’s not true, but he learned it from a confidential discussion”). Worst of all, it would be another reason to depose Davey.

    • Michael Leonard Tilse

      Hehe. “A suit of lawyers”. Is that like a “murder of crows” or a “pride of lions”?

      • aquaclara

        or a Chinese school of scientologists
        or a miscavige of lawsuits
        or a dodginess of clams
        or….

  • DamOTclese2


    “But Pete and WSB-TV’s Jodie Fleischer smartly advance the story by interviewing Georgia state insurance commissioner Ralph Hudgens, who has some dire words for the people suing Scientology’s drug rehab system in a class-action lawsuit. If the insurance companies are allowed to bail on Narconon, those plaintiffs might be left out in the cold”

    How is that possible? People can continue to advance their civil lawsuits for Scientology’s frauds, I don’t see how the syndicate’s insurance carriers successfully dropping out would have any impact in other people’s civil lawsuits against the criminal enterprise.

    The chance of getting their money back, the chance of having the syndicate pay for their crimes in real dollars should not hinge upon the fact that the syndicate’s insurance carrier was allowed to be dropped based upon the fraudulent crimes Scientology commits, it just means that David Miscaviage must fork over the money.

    Obviously Scientology would declare bankruptcy and every victim would merely sign on to the bankruptcy case as creditors, right?

    • Robert Eckert

      “it just means that David Miscaviage must fork over the money” They have to prove that David Miscavige has Narconon’s money. No doubt it would then turn out that Miscavige does not have any money to speak of in his personal bank accounts: they will have to figure out which corporate shell the money has actually been siphoned off to, and prove that that money came from Narconon etc.

      • Missionary Kid

        I started to post, then you put it much better.

      • Jgg2012

        Marty and Mike know that. Oh wait, any knowledge they have is confidential…no, wait, they never held high positions in the Church. Or did they?

        • Robert Eckert

          They know about money shufflings a decade ago, but who knows where the money has been shuffled to lately?

    • Deeana

      Okay, but insurance company or no insurance company funds, would this (these) lawsuits not allow investigation into the Scientology maze that DOES have money?

      • Robert Eckert

        Of course, and that will be long and complex and very expensive.

  • Artoo45

    Christmas is coming. What to get the despot who has everything?

    http://www.adishom.com/men-enter-here/get-tall-1000

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      and Almost Tents.

  • Jgg2012

    The problem with the motion is that Jeffrey is not responsible for Rathbun’s breach of confidentiality (if that occurred) unless he somehow told him to breach confidentiality. If anything, it is Miscavige who opened the door by saying he had no contacts with Texas.

  • Jgg2012

    As to the insurance companies dropping Narconon–no, the plaintiffs can sue Narconon directly, and the parent organization which told the IRS in 1993 that Narconon and ABLE were subsidiaries.

    • WildaBeast

      Wait…the {church} told the IRS (even 20 years ago) that Narconon and ABLE were subsidiaries?
      Hope springs eternal!

    • DamOTclese2

      That’s what I was thinking. The deaths civil lawsuits should still continue regardless of whether Scientology’s insurance covers them or not. I do not see how the plaintiffs would be “out of luck” just because Scientology’s insurance carriers bail out.

  • dwayners13 .

    Davey, Davey, Davey you have got to keep your stories straight if you expect people to believe them (& when I say ‘believe’, I mean really think something is true, as opposed to pretending to believe out of absolute fear). Either Marty was your right hand man, had a shitload of authority & your trust & therefore was privy to confidential information or he was some inconsequential peon on who had delusions of grandeur. I realize that in Scientology (especially the Sea. Org) truth is rather fluid & situational, but in the real (wog) world, what is true/factual isn’t dependant on what is best for you & your current needs or the greatest number of dynamics. Furthermore people aren’t afraid to call out your bullshit & frankly my dear leader, this is bullshit.

    • Jgg2012

      “What’s true is what’s true for you.” — LRH

      • WildaBeast

        Gravity is bullshit. I don’t need to breathe air. Nor do I need water. Food? It’s for the weak, like sleep!
        I like this game!

        • Robert Eckert

          That’s approximately how LRH got to Target Two.

          • WildaBeast

            Man I love this place. Just lol’d twice at two totally separate things in less than a minute. Honestly now, where else but at a really good house party does THAT happen?

      • kemist

        “Well, for me scientology’s a bullshit money-grubbing cult headed by an insane, sociopathic dwarf*. That’s true for me, so that must be true.” — Me

        Next !

        *With my sincere apologies to nice dwarves.

      • dwayners13 .

        If only that were true.

  • aquaclara

    Just have to say that Pete Combs at WSB-Atlanta is doing a phenomenal job of covering Narconon’s fraudulent behavior with solid reporting and a good knowledge of all the moving parts. And the insurance commish is my hero. Every time I hear an update on NN of Georgia, I hope that this will be the death knell for NN.

    For everyone in Georgia and at the Bunker, and at Reaching for the Tipping Point, thank you for keeping this all on your mind, front and center.
    Cheers, boatloads of good luck, and a loud whoop-whoop roar of support for our fine Southern friends in Georgia today!

  • Jgg2012

    Even if Rathbun’s affidavit is inadmissible against the Church, it should be admissible vs. Miscavige, who is also named as a party and is the one challenging jurisdiction. The Church has 2 orgs in Texas and cannot realistically challenge jurisdiction.

  • Krew13

    It’s been a good few days, folks. The Ellen interview, the lawsuit proceeding, various NarCONons around the world beset with legal problems. The one downer is that charges against Reverend Devon Campbell Newman of conspiracy to commit murder and first-degree kidnapping have been dropped, but the OT is still charged with conspiracy to attempt kidnapping.

    In all, plenty of good stuff to keep Miscmidget busy throwing tantrums like the punk bitch he is. Don’t cwy, Davey! Your BFF is always at the other end of the line. Just don’t ask him about his recent grosses. For some strange reason, audiences have gone off him. Can’t for the life of me figure out why.

    Talking of the Angry Munchkin and Top Gun, this photo is what caused the invention of the word “eeeew”.

    http://blogs.villagevoice.com/runninscared/TomCruiseDavidMiscavige.jpg

    • Veritas

      COB has rarely looked so ecclesiastical! He practically glows with a saint-like aura.

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        I can only handle so many ewwww’s and already past the quota today. So I’ll take your word for it.

        • Observer

          Don’t you just want to reach into that pic and knock their heads together repeatedly?

          • TheHoleDoesNotExist

            I didn’t peek.

            • Observer

              It’s the one of TC and DM posing douchily on their bikes.

            • Bury_The_Nuts

              “douchily”.

              Into my personal lexicon it goes!

            • Michael Leonard Tilse

              “douchily” is how you are doing something when you are in firm contact with your inner douchness.

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              Oh…then my crystal ball sez “Decidedly So”.

          • Bury_The_Nuts

            Why yes. Yes, I do.

          • WildaBeast

            Okay, is it the lighting in that pic, or does the Tiny Tyrant have two days’ worth of stubble going on there? It’s like he was planning that shot for a week, and thought, “Oh, I know what’ll make me look like a dangerous biker! I won’t shave for 48 hours!” Also, for two really homophobic men, they both look like they’re trying to look like middle-aged gay porn stars.

            • Nevermore

              Have you noted his tousled hair, quite different from his usual well styled locks? Definitely a well-planned photo!

            • WildaBeast

              I missed the hair entirely! Thanks for pointing it out!

    • DamOTclese2

      Not gay. NOT gay!

      • Eclipse-girl

        It would explain his fear of “buggering.”

    • TonyOrtega

      So, if Devon Campbell gets like five years in prison instead of 50, it’s actually going to ruin your day?

      • Jgg2012

        Well, it won’t affect the Thursday afternoon stats

      • Krew13

        Hi Tony! Big fan of this site. Regarding Campbell, I get your point. Mine was just that the cops had evidence she and the guy were planning to commit murder but for whatever reason the charge has been dropped.

        • TonyOrtega

          Yes, I understood the situation. I just thought it was funny that you sounded like it was disappointing that her charges had been changed.
          I’m sure the evidence hasn’t changed. The prosecutors are probably just settling on what’s going to be easiest to prove to a jury or something.

          • Robert Eckert

            And what it would be easiest to persuade them (or at least one of them) to plead to.

          • Krew13

            Well, it’s kinda disappointing in that a Sciloon being convicted of conspiring to commit murder is a headline that would make Miscmidget throw the mother of all hissy fits. I’m just waiting for Karen Krapouw to say Campbell was an SP plant whose mission is to discredit the COS.

            • dbloch7986

              They are probably yelling LV Org employees that, but I doubt they’d issue a public statement like that. Though you never know with Scientology.

      • DamOTclese2

        It may be that for a successful kidnapping within the State of Nevada without rape, murder, or the abduction of a minor The Penalty Is 15 Years though one law firm states that at the Federal level for an attempted kidnapping,

        “Similarly, a federal conviction of conspiracy to kidnap carries a possible penalty of up to a life sentence. And a federal conviction of attempted kidnapping carries up to twenty years in prison.”

        I see many web sites with different information, some of them talking about attempted kidnapping while armed with a gun being different sentencing than attempted kidnapping without a gun. It’s kind of difficult to pick through every web page to see what might be handed down against Devon. Tony, did you ever find out what the minimum sentencing would be if Devon is convicted? I see everything pretty much goes about 15 years minimum using Google as my Source For All Knowledge Evah.

  • Truthiwant

    I think with all these court cases going on, we could all do with a few words of wisdom from Source.

    D’oh!

    • Observer

      So are the misspellings “dependant” in the first line and “alititude” in the next-to-last from Source, or is it the dastardly work of another suppressive typist?

      • Truthiwant

        Obsi, you missed the spelling of altitude. Not to mention the bookstore store officer!

        • Observer

          I caught it eventually, apparently while you were typing your reply. I got so spelling Nazi-ishly excited over the J&D opportunities with “dependant” that I didn’t finish reading the whole thing until after I posted my reply. You know how we Internet fringe-dwellers are.

          • Truthiwant

            You know, Obsi, I get the feeling Ron had been popping pills just a bit too much when he wrote those words. What do they mean?

            However, they are interesting because he talks about landing on a planet as a total stranger. Could that be a future vision of the great man going to Target Two?
            Maybe we’ll never know, unless we buy the “Wash Your Hands”, I mean “Clean Hands Congress”.

            • Observer

              I interpret the meaning as, “I’m an enormous blowhard and I must say things that sound profound and wisely esoteric so that people will think I’m a genius instead of realizing I’m a mentally ill, pathologically lying fantasist and grifter.”

            • Mooser

              Well, if I wake one day one a different planet, I’ll remember those words. Or I could read Kipling’s “The Man who would be King” again, too.

            • Truthiwant

              And to think that there are people at this very moment, in the various Org course rooms around the world, that are studying this nonsense and are telling their fellow Scientologists the enormous ‘wins’ they have had from the words of wisdom of LRH.

              From personal experience, if somebody tried to ‘word clear’ those sentences written by LRH, the student would be in the Org all evening, trying to make sense of them.

              Because the words don’t make sense, there is a possibility that the student would start to show symptoms of ‘misunderstoods’. This would be immediately picked up by the Course Supervisor (by seeing the student start fidgeting or yawning) and the student might be sent to the Word Clearer. If that didn’t work then the student could well be sent to ‘Cramming’. This is an action taken to remedy an “outpoint”, which means something that the student hasn’t understood.

              Actually, I’m writing this so that you can understand what it really means to ‘study’ Scientology. Sometimes it is just unreal what the students have to endure to get through a course. I think many people here on this blog don’t understand what ‘Study Tech’ really means and how time consuming it is. Much of the brain washing starts in the Course Room.

            • WildaBeast

              That kind of brought it home to me, Truthiwant. You could very easily spend 3-5 hours just trying to make {sense} of just ONE of Elron’s more egregious crimes against the English language, couldn’t you? That would brainwash anyone…

            • Truthiwant

              I remember once spending a whole evening in Padova Org trying to decipher ONE sentence written by LRH.

            • WildaBeast

              And it’s a game you can’t win. I mean, the words don’t make sense! The only way you can get away from the dictionary, the Course Supervisor, ‘Cramming’, &c., is to somehow convince yourself that you’ve made sense of the nonsensical, so they’ll leave you alone…but then there’s the next sentence, and the next…
              Scientology: the biggest win you’ll ever have is the moment you walk away.
              So glad you’re here, Truthiwant.

            • Truthiwant

              “…is to somehow convince yourself that you’ve made sense of the nonsensical…”

              Well said! You obviously have a good understanding of how Scientology works.

            • WildaBeast

              If I do, it’s because people like you go out of their way to explain it for the benefit of wogs like me, and the doubters (your doubts are valid, btw!) who are lurking here.

            • Truthiwant

              If I could go back in time, there is only ONE thing that I would never have done and that is Scientology.

              All I can do now is write down my experiences, maybe in the knowledge that they might be useful to someone like yourself.

            • shasha40

              They will be to many , as every persons positions , ( SO, staff , public etc. ) and views, and how they were able to leave , or Escape are so unique to that person specifically . Thank you .

            • shasha40

              Besides you know how Hungry we are here at the Bunker for ” data ” ..

            • ThetaBara

              Scientology: the biggest win you’ll ever have is the moment you walk away.

              LOVE this. Very true.

            • Sherbet

              It’s so bizarre. If I were taking an adult ed course that caused me such consternation and confusion, I’d drop it. But the way you and other describe it, the student has already settled into an attitude of “If I don’t get it, it must be me,” and “This is important for the sake of the planet.” The trap has been set, and the prey is caught.

            • Truthiwant

              Yep. You’re right. That’s what LRH wanted. And I fell for it.

            • Sherbet

              But you fell out of it, and that’s what’s important.

            • Truthiwant

              Thank goodness.

              Liberating myself from Scientology is a bit like a prisoner having his shackles cut off.

            • WildaBeast

              Hmmm, yeah. A horrible, uncomfortable weight is removed, but there are painful sores from the time you spent shackled, which need time and care to heal properly. Good analogy.

            • kemist

              And I thought reading french sociology was the worse form of mental torture through hazy, puzzled, sensory-deprived boredom one could ever be subjected to.

              ‘Study Tech’ tops it all.

            • WildaBeast

              I thought reading 1950s anthropology took the cake. I was wrong.

            • shasha40

              WOW , that must be it ! I got the same meaning , especially the adjectives to describe him towards the end !

        • SandiCorrena

          Ali-tit-ude – maybe it means they all have tits for brains so the subject would fit right in with all the other boobs, such as the bookstore store officer?

          • ThetaBara

            Hey, lay off boobs. Or lay on them, but don’t be defaming them!

            • SandiCorrena

              lol….my right one tried to kill me in 2004 with breast cancer so I don’t think of them as “smart” but I have noticed babies, kittens, and puppies love the cuddle cushions so I suppose they’re not without value. ;)

            • Eclipse-girl

              Best Friend had breast cancer with a double mastectomy about 10 yrs ago. She waited a long time (9 yrs) and finally had her breast remade with her own body tissue. She went thru her own gender identity / body dysmorphia issues not having her breasts. Sounds weird, but it is her experience.

            • SandiCorrena

              Good point Eclipse-girl – I always ask my oncologist why he didn’t just remove them and he always says because they’re perfectly nice. So long as the left one doesn’t decide to come after me we’ll all be good! Blessings and hugs to your friend from a fellow survivor and to you too!

            • Eclipse-girl

              She was young ( in her 40s) when this occurred. Because of the familial factor she had them both removed. She has been cancer free since all the treatment, but she will always be vigilant. She was surprised at how much she felt not like herself without her breasts.

          • Robert Eckert

            Ali-titude, the attitude that you are The Greatest. Typically lasts until the real Muhammad Ali punches the crap out of you.

      • Sherbet

        Spelling tech: Scientology — making the Able more Blea…

        • shasha40

          ” … making the Able more blea.. ” Roflmao !

          • Sherbet

            They just plain ask for the J&D.

    • Veritas

      What an elegant piece of advice. Four sentences, and the word “reach” repeated 4 times. It’s factually totally worked out that way, basically.

      • Nevermore

        Factually, even. I loathe the way they butcher the language.

    • Mark

      “Ability to retch” more like.

      • Truthiwant

        It actually makes more sense with the word ‘retch’. What about ‘fart’?

    • shasha40

      WTF ??? Every time I read LRH’s , non-sense ? Gibberrish .. I keep trying to understand it , what the fuck is wrong with me ? Bol , I’m Dizzy now.

      • Robert Eckert

        “Spinny” is the technical term for how you feel in the grip of M/U’s (seriously, LRH said so!)

        • shasha40

          Stop it , my family will begin to think I’m some kind of alien, or Scientologist, saying things like , ” I’m feeling alittle spinny. ” And my husband replying , ” you wanna dance ? “

      • Truthiwant

        Be careful or you will be sent to the word clearer!

        • shasha40

          Nooooo ! lmao

    • tetloj

      He says factually so it must be true [insert Tommy Lee Jones implied facepalm meme here]

  • Jgg2012

    You know, if someone testifies in David Miscavige’s defense, Jeffrey should argue that they are barred from doing so because they are testifying to confidential matters. Just kidding. Seriously, this came up in the Debbie Cook case and Garcia’s case, but you can always testify when required to do so by law. Jeffrey could subpoena Marty to testify as to RTC activities in Texas if he had refused to do so.

  • DamOTclese2

    Two things bear repeating. :)

    David Miscaviage’s Bizarre Outburst About Public Buggering and commentary by Clearwater citizens about Little Toy Sailor Outfits that these insane loons wear in public.

    In 1998, people in Clearwater talked about the idiot quasi-military outfits these loons were wearing, expressing anger that they would sully the honor of actual military veterans, such as the guy working under the sidewalk that came out to talk to us about the sailor outfits. In extract:

    That’s part of the fear that many residents expressed to us, by the way. The cultists parade around in their little toy sailor suits and, I’m told, during the summer, swap their sailor suits for little toy air force suits. Always the cult likes to have cultists ride their bicycles around dressed-up like the Clearwater police and, I’m told, only get away with it because the city has taken measures to keep these cultists from strapping on firearms and putting “POLICE” on their uniforms anywhere.

    The cult wants to pretend they’re part of the community when in fact they’re considered a deadly organism invading the otherwise healthy body of Clearwater. Even as the cult holds “public” events from time to time, only cultists ever attend them. All attempts to get the citizens to join in any event results in absolute failure. The people of Clearwater absolutely hate and fear this deadly cult! And the response from the public, hour after hour, proved the fact.”

    So this photograph offered here reminds me of the Lisa McPherson Memorial Protest of 1998. It’s such a freakish, silly behavior that it always invokes both laughter and the “WTF” reflex.

    • NeverIn

      OMG, that deposition transcript is just precious! (Re-posting: http://personal.linkline.com/frice/bugger.htm)

      A) He’s complaining about online descriptions of him getting it in the ass. He must love today!
      B) He’s being laughed at to his face. Presumably doesn’t happen often.
      C) Who knew it was so easy to push his buttons? Remember this when he takes the stand :)

      • Public Buggering

        Yeah, and it also shows what runs through the little head of his. :)

        • ThetaBara

          Both of them! Badump-um.

  • http://www.tingleff.org/jensting/muslinger/ Jens TINGLEFF

    This on the face of it useless motion is completely consistent with the strategy employed to such devastatingly bad effect in Paris where the legal strategy was to complain about procedural issues then walk out (of the appeal that the criminal organisation known as the “church” of $cientology asked for). Good news for team Monique. Like I keep saying, there are recent and not so recent examples of winning hands down against the Co$, taking the money and not having to sign any kind of gag order.

    If the Co$ were following the play book used against Bonnie Woods, we should expect a counter suit and finally a settlement entirely in Monique’s favour citing concerns about Monique’s ability to pay the award to the Co$ if they had won. Maybe David “he is NOT insane!” Miscavige has changed his style since the Bonnie Woods case, tho’

  • Public Buggering

    Did somebody here mention my name?

    • Michael Leonard Tilse

      It was passing reference.

      • Public Buggering

        I knew it! I thought I felt a disturbance in The Force!

  • Richie

    Davy boy keeps stepping in it here. Way to go, Rathbuns. Rooting for you, big time.

    Separate note, I was having dinner in Los Feliz last night and walked right past the brand new cult mission of Los Feliz. It’s housed in a gorgeous, newly renovated building on Hillhurst, and I must say, for 9pm at night, the place was jumping.

    There were between 6 and 8 very attractive, twenty-something women conveniently hanging out right in front of the window, facing the sidewalk; laughing, talking, having the best time! Hillhurst is a very active area for young people, more specifically, young actors.

    Coincidence?

    • Tory Christman

      “Dave” knows one of the KEY things now talked about is how utterly empty his “Ideal Orgs” have been. So I’m sure with this one, he’s ‘stocking up’ with peeps to “prove” it’s working. LOL. Shall we bet on how many days they’ll keep up this charade? I’ll be swinging by to check…and hey, now we have a new place to picket! Head’s up~! LOL….why is it I can hear the gnashing of teeth when I say that? Davey boy, remember what I’ve told you for years now: you can RUN but you CANNOT HIDE. Tick tock—this is a good one! Tory/Magoo~Your local, friendly SP!! PS: Thanks to Tony O, Monique and Marty and all posting facts here that help fill in the blanks on this one.

      • WildaBeast

        Even if he posted every SO member to the Ideal mOrgs, I don’t think he could fill ‘em all up. He is seriously going to have to go out and rent random public bodies…
        DM: I want the Ideal Orgs to be busy…bustling! I don’t fucking CARE how you do it! Make it happen or heads will roll!!!
        SO Member: Sir, yes sir! I can make it happen for you, sir! All I need is $5,000 released to every Ideal Org, SIR!
        DM: Fine, fine, if that’s what it takes. But I want RESULTS, you little puke!

        —Later that same evening, on the streets of, let’s say, Portland—

        Ideal Org Staff Member: (approaches Drunken Street Person) Say, man, how’d you like to make fifty bucks tomorrow? All you have to do is sit around a building all day. It’s climate controlled and we’ll (chokes slightly) even pay you half in advance, so you won’t get the shakes while you’re working…
        Drunken Street Person: Hey, buddy, sounds all right to me! What’s the address?
        Ideal Org Staff Member: (scribbles on paper) Here you go…9am sharp, okay?
        Drunken Street Person: You got it!
        Ideal Org Staff Member: (walking away) One down, 99 to go…

  • Collin

    This just in- Assad trades chemical weapons for copies of the basics for all the Syrian people, now Davy can really clear the planet….

  • dbloch7986

    Let’s say that Scientology sues Marty in California and references a lawsuit in Texas, what would that entail? Or would it end up being a federal lawsuit since it crosses state lines? Would it potentially elevate all Scientology-related lawsuits so that they are more visible, instead of compartmentalized into various jurisdictions as they are now?

  • Public Buggering

    Maybe I shouldn’t be giving The Slapping Dwarf any bright ideas, but is anyone else extremely happy that the Scientology assholes don’t have nuclear weapons yet?

    • Collin

      I actually wish that scientology would piss off a group of terrorists that were more brutal than that are.

      • Public Buggering

        Instead Scientology is ass buddies with the Nation of Islam terrorist cult.

        • ThetaBara

          How long do you think that is going to last, though?
          FarraCon isn’t going to give up power any more willingly than Miss Cabbage. And the NOI has a reputation for violence way worse than the scilons, and going back years. No wonder the Cabbage wears a bulletproof vest!

          • WildaBeast

            Oh man, someone needs to do a shoop of a large (sorry, tiny) green cabbage in a Kevlar vest now.

        • Lemont

          Funny things about the NOI alliance:

          (1) Hubbard was a notorious racist
          (2) Hubbard’s favorite book called Mohammed a lunatic

          • shasha40

            Scientology and NOI . The Blind leading the deaf and dumb ! bol

      • ThetaBara

        Um, like the NOI?
        Just you wait.

        • Bury_The_Nuts

          No shit. I am stocked up on popcorn waiting for the day that shoe drops!

          • heuristically_inclined

            Oh what a pissing contest that will be. I’m absolutely giddy just contemplating it.

    • ze moo

      Nuk u lar weapons require an actual working knowledge of physics.

      • kemist

        Nuclear weapons would be far more dangerous to the sciloons themselves than for anyone around them.

        According to L. Ron “I failed intro nuclear physics” Hubbard, his niacin-laced vitamin cocktail was supposed to “run out” radiations.

        Let them manipulate weapons-grade nuclear fuel and they’d all be flushed, toothless, hairless and very dead within approximately three weeks. Touch assists are a very poor substitute for a bone marrow graft when you’ve absorbed a lethal dose of radiations.

        That’d be a bit funny in a pathetic way, except that’s a very nasty way to die, and His Ecclesiastical Dwarfiness and chief minions would probably delegate the task to the poorest of their deluded slaves.

        • dbloch7986

          Don’t forget that he also said smoking cleared out radiation in the human body and prevented cancer.

          • shasha40

            L Loon Is so smart …When are you coming back to Teegak, L Roon? , we need new tech ! this repackaging shits starting to get old and I don’t even get regged !

        • Lemont

          LRH said radiation passes through walls, but not our bodies- because our bodies RESIST!

          • Eclipse-girl

            LRH also failed or received a D in the one course in Nuclear Physics that he took.

            • Robert Eckert

              How he managed to get a D we will never understand.

            • kemist

              It’s the tech, man.

              Powerful stuff.

      • shasha40

        Scientology = Just say No to knowledge {{ especially Sciences ! }}

      • Public Buggering

        No problem! Eller H was a nyuck-lar Scientist! Hey Moe!

    • media_lush

      if they did you can guarantee they would have accidentally blown up their titanium plate holding vaults by now

      [and probably blamed Marty]

      • Public Buggering

        The clowns blowing up their own underground bunker would probably get somebody slapped, yeah.

  • Still_On_Your_Side

    I have to say that the Motion to Disqualify is not going to rate any points with the judge. The opening paragraph says it all. The church filed a motion to disqualify Jeffrey before in another lawsuit, and rather than let a jury or a judge decide whether it had merit, the church chose to settle (twice, apparently). Now the church takes the incredibly childish stand (so childish, I have to wonder who wrote it) that if an argument is presented in a case, it must be true and if Jeffrey isn’t terrified and in hiding over those allegations, he must be unethical. Hello? Suppose Pluto sues Miscavige, and Miscavige writes in his response that Pluto’s lawyer, Bluto, is from the planet Uranus and therefore is an illegal alien. Miscavige’s argument is that Bluto, as an illegal alien who lives on Uranus and not in the US, has no right to practice law. Bluto, however, is from New Jresey, and has never even been to Uranus, so Miscavige, knowing he will lose that argument, settles with Pluto. Case over, no verdict, nothing on the record. However, then Bluto sues Miscavige on behalf of another client. Miscavige freaks out. Bluto is from Uranus! Miscavige already said that in court! Why is Bluto so unethically continuing to practice law and how dare he, a citizen of Uranus, sue Miscavige!

    What is wrong here? Just because something is said in court, it isn’t proven until it is either admitted or a judge or jury says it’s it is proven.

    I also agree with Scott, if Marty Rathbun has an obligation to keep secrets and he is breaching that obligation, Miscavige could sue Marty. It is likely, however, that since Marty has been telling Miscavige’s secrets for almost five years, the doctrine of waiver or laches now applies (if you sit on your hands, you sit on your rights). It also is likely that Miscavige has no right to tell Marty to keep quiet — which is why he has spent $$$$ harassing Marty rather than suing him.

    • Leslie Stipe

      “Bluto, however, is from New Jresey, and has never even been to Uranus”

      Bluto is from New Jersey…then oh yeah, he’s definitely been to Uranus!

    • WildaBeast

      The Pluto, Bluto and Uranus analogy had me rolling in the aisles!

    • t1kk

      I agree that they may be moving into laches territory (laches is an affirmative defense whereby the plaintiff loses its right to sue if it delayed unreasonably bringing a claim; sort of like an informal statute of limitations), if the SOL hasn’t run on particular claims. Still, we don’t know, to my knowledge anyway, the precise content of whatever Marty may have signed, which may have a clause that renders moot SOL concerns. There’s also the possibility of claims Scientology could bring against Marty over his present conduct, though I can’t think of anything offhand and I don’t think it’s worthwhile to imagine out loud.

      • Robert Eckert

        We don’t know what Marty has signed because the {church} has not entered any confidentiality agreements into evidence, by their own choice.

        • Espiando

          Except for these facts:

          Marty blew. He didn’t route out. He didn’t have a chance to sign confidentiality agreements unless he did it while he was in. In that case, he could plead coercion. Also, he’s never been involved in legal moves against the cult as either plaintiff or defendant.(well, since he’s been out), so there hasn’t been a chance there to make him sign an NDA.

          I don’t think he’s signed one. The Dark Lord Chuckles The Silly Piggy has quickly settled any suit that Marty would have been called in as a witness (especially the PIs suit). Chuckles is absolutely terrified at what Marty would reveal on the stand, and therefore irrevocably into the public record. If OTIII and Debbie Cook’s testimony made him shit the silk, Marty would cause rectal prolapse.

          • Robert Eckert

            This was discussed below. Of course he did not sign NDA’s on the way out, but Tony’s opinion is that he is likely to have signed a bunch of them when he took on high-level jobs (which would not be unusual in any more normal kind of organization either). But no such agreements have been introduced, which to me makes it seem like their content is probably so weird that the lawyers did not want to use them.

            • Eclipse-girl

              That makes me laugh. You have signed NDAs that are so weird we won’t produce them or hold you to them because it will make Co$ look weird.

            • ThetaBara

              Not all NDAs are legal. Just like “freeloader debt” isn’t legally enforceable. Or a contract to kill someone. Even if they do sign it, it’s still UNENFORCEABLE.

              Who knows, he probably had to sign blank pieces of paper!

      • Still_On_Your_Side

        Scott, I agree, and, since Ray Jeffrey has been up against the church at least three prior times (including the Garcia case), I doubt he was surprised by the motion to disqualify. He’s in his home turf, the church is not, and the court knows Jeffrey. I doubt the church’s tired disqualification effort will go far.

      • Sherbet

        Does anyone have an updated calendar of all the sci-related court dates we’re following? I turned left at Garcia, right at DeCrescenzo, was sidetracked by Campbell Newman, and now I’m hopelessly lost. I’d really like to set up an accurate timetable once and for all.

        • ThetaBara

          We need a shared calendar!

          • Sherbet

            Great idea! Alas, I’m not savvy enough to develop one. I hope someone is.

        • George Layton

          Mark your calendars, folks; lots of important dates in September & October 2013 for court cases within the US related to Scientology/Co$ & Narconon. (Bolded dates for calendar; red date for general irony/lulz.)

          September 5 — Florida judge will consider the scope of subpoenas previously issued in the Florida-based Garcia Fraud lawsuit.
          September 9 — Las Vegas preliminary hearing for Devon Campbell Newman — multiple criminal charges.
          September 18 — Oklahoma judge to hear motion to compel production of documents in the Landmeier v. Narconon suit. (Documents sought relate to the incidents of drug/alcohol use by residents/employees. Note: this suit was filed in March 2010 and it’s still in the pre-trial phase.)
          September 12 & 13 — Texas hearing dates for Monique Rathbun’s case re: temporary injunction issue.
          September 30 — The US Supreme Court conference to grant/deny certification to Co$/scientology’s petition re: “priest-penitent confidentiality”.
          September 30 — Georgia judge to hear appeal the license revocation of Narconon Georgia. (pp’d 2x already!)
          October 3 — Brian Culkin expected to testify as part of an evidentiary hearing in the Florida-based Garcia Fraud lawsuit.
          October 6 — ‘Super Power’ building opening in Clearwater, Florida.

          In the class action suit filed in Georgia against Narconon & related entities, 2 rulings are expected in the near future: will ALL of the originally-named defendants remain as such; and, will the evidence gathered by Georgia state investigators be preserved…and be made available for use in current/future civil Narconon-related cases.

          Per Wickstrom’s lawsuit against a town’s refusal to grant permission for him to expand his ‘drug rehab facility’, filed in Michigan state court but currently removed to federal jurisdiction, should also produce a few rulings shortly. A dismissal of the suit by a federal magistrate/judge would not be a surprise.

          Will September 2013 be the month we finally see evidence of ANY action undertaken by the Oklahoma investigating authorities related to the Narconon facility there and the 3 people who died?

          More dates? Please add ‘em. Thanks!

          Link to The Underground Bunker for more info on each case/date: http://tonyortega.org/2013/08/28/sci…hine-and-more/

          JBWriter over at ESMB

          • Sherbet

            George, you’re a peach!

          • shasha40

            You Totally Rock !

          • tetloj

            Hey JB Writer

  • Suppressive Tomato

    In honor of recent whispers that the Tom Cruise Dating Service (aka Golden Age of Viagra II) is back underway, here’s a fun infographic that points to a talentless young “country” singer who also has persistent 2D troubles as a prime candidate:

    • Bury_The_Nuts

      Oh please make it so!

    • dbloch7986

      Aw, did you really have to call the poor girl “talentless” lol

      • Suppressive Tomato

        Derek have you heard her “music”? Also, she is so insufferable, I can’t resist. If I see that Diet Coke commercial one more time, I might explode.

        • Nevermore

          I agree. They deserve each other. They’re both supposedly mega-clingy, so they should be happy! ;-)

        • media_lush

          she actually does a huge amount of charity work as well as giving huge amounts to charity…. much more than most of her peers and doesn’t publicise the fact….

          • Suppressive Tomato

            She also has public beach access next to her Rhode Island mansion shut down by her security guards. Welcome to the neighborhood, entitled princess! Any charity work is great publicity, tax write-off, etc.

            • dbloch7986

              I don’t think that there is anything wrong with living in opulence. If I had the money, I would too. If you have enough money to give some to charity and still live in opulence, why not?

            • Suppressive Tomato

              Totally, but maybe don’t buy a mansion next to public beach access if you want privacy.

            • Guest

              Well, she probably does have Scilons snooping around, and has reason to fear for her daughter’s safety… Maybe she’ll loosen up as time goes on…

            • Captain Howdy

              “Behind every great fortune there is a great crime”
              – Honoré de Balzac

            • dbloch7986

              I think that what he is trying to say is, “having a great fortune is itself a crime.” An opinion which varies greatly from person to person.

              ETA: And I think he was referring particularly to easily procured fortunes. However that still neglects people who are wealthy by birthright.

            • media_lush

              …. this was never the case, it was a story that hugely exaggerated by those gossip sites who never bother to check up on what the real story was

            • Suppressive Tomato

              Why are you invalidating my hate pleasures? Please tell me it’s still OK to loathe Gwyneth Paltrow!

            • media_lush

              truly the über teen douche to focus your “hate pleasures” is Justin Bieber and his entourage…. what kind of douche actually spits on his fans….

            • Suppressive Tomato

              Oh, every day Lush, every day. Someone needs to get him to Celebrity Centre as soon as possible!

            • ThetaBara

              Bieber and Miley are both much worse; I will give you that.

            • Mooser

              Excuse me, but can you tell me the meaning of “douche” in that sentence? And why “douche” was the onliest mott juice to use there?

            • media_lush

              as I said, she never wanted the publicity from the work and very few people know about it…. also she gives way, way more than a tax break right-off [unlike the Cock brothers]…. other stars who write huge cheques well above their tax break credits are Brangelina, Sandra Bullock…. and, surprisingly Mariah Carey

          • Captain Howdy

            The Koch Brothers donate lots of money to charity also. It’s a competition/status thing amongst the wealthy.

            • media_lush

              amongst her peers it’s pretty much unheard of, especially at such a young age…. given how wealthy the Cock brothers are what they give is pitiful when compared to true philanthropists.

          • ThetaBara

            Having mega-rich parents sure doesn’t hurt, hmm?

            • media_lush

              I don’t get it…. you still diss on her even though she does all this uncredited charity work and donates literally millions to charity [also without any PR], well above her tax allowances and you go on about her having rich parents? …. sheesh

            • ThetaBara

              Sorry, I just find her annoying. At least I don’t shame her for being female by calling her a cunt!

            • media_lush

              I’ve never done that [keep up] …. I think you’re under some allusion that ‘Jeb’ is a woman’s name…. and I would never behave like that and take offense at your accusation; if you bother to look at my posts you’ll notice that the only times I tend to swear is in response to aggressive and obnoxious posters/trolls who pretty much deserve it.

            • ThetaBara

              Oh, please. I’m not stupid, nor new here. You call all sorts of people cunts.
              Swear all you want, but (and you don’t get a pass for being a Brit, sorry) I fucking OBJECT to CUNT being such a terrible insult. It means ladyparts, as you know perfectly well. Calling a man a cunt suggests that he is actually female and therefor, lesser. And fuck that noise.
              But thanks for the downvote. I eat them like candy!

            • media_lush

              there’s a difference to swearing at trolls/aggressive douche posters and a deliberate misogenous insult – you’re blatantly accusing me of the latter and I categorically deny it…. in fact all of my comments are freely available for you or anyone to search if you want.

              Also I think by saying:

              “Calling a man a cunt suggests that he is actually female” shows you’ve really lost the plot here…. [it’s actually quite lulzy, if it wasn’t so tragic]

            • ThetaBara

              LOL (or whinge) all you want, but using “cunt” as an insult is inherently misogynistic.
              Sorry if you don’t like it. Doesn’t make it any less true.

            • Sherbet

              I’ll jump in here and support the women. ‘lush, you’re the Bunker’s invaluable gossip guru, but, sheesh, if the “c word” is offensive to other people, quit using it. Is that so hard to do? Smooch, and hugs, and all that stuff that means I like you.

            • media_lush

              She’s actually used it way more than I have and claimed I used it in it’s misogenous context which is a lie and total bollocks and pretty offensive to me….

            • Sherbet

              OK, I can see this has more history than I thought. Never mind my trying to keep the peace. //tiptoeing away//

            • Captain Howdy

              Ah, the Battle for PC Hill rages on I see. I’m an uncontentious objectionable, so that leaves me out.

            • Bury_The_Nuts

              I object….oh yeah, nevermind. I will just go take a nap, till like, morning!

            • ThetaBara

              No, I haven’t. I never use it because, as I have said, it is inherently offensive.
              What do you think it means, if it doesn’t mean pussy? I mean, really. I said it hurts my feelings and your response was to say I’m one. Thanks a fucking pantload.

            • media_lush

              refresh the page and look at the yellow highlights…. you started this whole thing by bringing it up out the blue and now have the gall to say you never use it…. it’s up there in black and white…. the fact you only choose to use one interpretation also speaks volumes that you’re starting to turn into a troll.

            • Robert Eckert

              The “one” interpretation is the original sense, which is the only sense of the word known to most of the English-speaking population.

            • media_lush

              sorry, but that’s bollocks; go to UK, Australia, NZ. South Africa… or do you only regard the US as “most of the English-speaking population”?

              [sorry if I sound hostile but I’ve been dealing with a someone who’s turning into a troll]

            • Robert Eckert

              YOU are being a troll. Most people, including those from the countries you name, don’t use the word at all and only know it in the original sense of female genitalia. You are precisely like those people who use “faggot” all the name and claim they aren’t accusing anyone of being gay or of meaning that being gay is bad, and then try to blame the people they offend for feeling offended.

            • media_lush

              where do you base this “most people”…. I have friends in Oz, NZ and live in the UK and it is primarily interpreted as the yellow highlights…. where do you live?

              I have employed literally hundreds of gay people and don’t have a homophobic bone in my body so take offence that you compare me to people who use the ‘faggot’ word. You are making sweeping generalisations that are fucking ridiculous.

            • Robert Eckert

              Well I was going to compare you to Theo earnestly telling us that “wog” is not offensive, but then it occurred to me that since Theo is not a native English speaker he has some excuse. Now you may hang around circles that use the c-word a lot, but you know perfectly well that there are people, including from your home country, who find it more offensive than either “wog” or “faggot”, more on the level of “nigger”, so stop with the faux outrage when people tell you that you are being highly offensive.

            • media_lush

              so you’re basing your “most people” on Theo?…. and that outrage wasn’t faux it was genuine; when you say:

              “You are precisely like those people who use “faggot” all the name and claim they aren’t accusing anyone of being gay” you’re using fighting words as far as I’m concerned – it’s a dick thing to say and given your past posts I’m surprised you use a derogative assumption like that.

              I am disappoint

            • Robert Eckert

              “so you’re basing your “most people” on Theo?” No, I was saying that Theo is precisely an example of someone who is NOT typical of most English-speaking people, which is why I changed the example from “wog”

              You are indeed behaving exactly like the people I often run into on the boards who have grown up among a bunch of thugs (“thug” in American approx. equivalent to the “bogans” that according to Enthralled use “cunt” all the time in Oz, or approx. to “chavs” in UK) who use “faggot” unself-consciously as their generic insult, and think that therefore it is fine to sling it about in any company. When you realize that you are giving much profounder offense than you intended to, then apologize and stop doing it; don’t blame the people who have been hurt by the word so often in the past and try to make it their fault that they have been hurt.

            • media_lush

              If you look at all the posts in order you will see that I didn’t bring it up at all – someone else was looking for a troll argument and brought that word into the discussion in a totally inappropriate manner also making a totally unwarranted and offensive assumption. You seem to be doing the same thing IMO. To me, and most others here it seems, there are two distinct interpretations of the c word, by choosing to understand one, and one only [even after been shown the alternative] then you’re a dick as far as I’m concerned.

            • Robert Eckert

              I understand that you weren’t the one bringing it up to start with, but I still find your position indefensible. The “one” interpretation of the word is the original one, the one that is universal in the language. Some derogatories, like “nigger” and “faggot”, become a “nuclear” level of offensiveness because they are used to attack oppressed groups commonly with violence: women typically hear “you cunt!” from someone who is beating them. “Wog” used to be nuclear-offensive but I hear that in the UK it has been replaced in that role by “Paki”. Now you say you are terribly offended to be compared to someone who would throw around “faggot” as a casual insult; but it is really just a matter of chance that the particular lowlives who taught you to swear happened to pick up the one word rather than the other as their generic nastiness.

            • media_lush

              it’s this condescending twattish assumptions you insist on putting into your replies that bug me:

              “but it is really just a matter of chance that the particular lowlives who taught you to swear happened to pick up the one word rather than the other as their generic nastiness.”

              yet again you’re really being a prick about this argument… rather than a proper discourse you’re putting in these deliberate insults.

              man, I really thought you were better than that….. so you say that ‘cunt’ has ” “one” interpretation of the word is the original one, the one that is universal in the language”

              …. but sorry, a big fuck you on that one I’m afraid…. I posted this before but it seems doubly relevant now!

              http://youtu.be/SZxTb01OgNE

            • Robert Eckert

              I am not making any “assumptions”. I am stating facts, which you don’t seem to want to hear. Espiando came here slinging “fag” around, not because he is homophobic but because he came out of the b-chan culture where they use that generically, just like the circles you happen to come out of happen to use “cunt” generically. Of course when he was told, yeah I understand you use that word where you come from without meaning to offend but just cool it here, he was all “I’ll fucking talk any goddamn way I please” — but, in fact, he has stopped. And he never played the game “you’re a fucking fag if you mind being called a fag, you fag” like what you are doing.

              “you say that ‘cunt’ has ” “one” interpretation of the word is the original one” Yes, that’s perfectly true. In fact it not only traces back to Proto-Indo-European, it is even older and cognates of the *KUNA root are found in non-Indo-European languages as well. I don’t know why you are trying to deny the anciency of the primary usage. You come from some circles which have detached their word from its original sense? I don’t care. Don’t try to pretend that the majority of people from the UK or Australia use that kind of language because it just isn’t true, anymore than b-chan is typical of the US.

            • media_lush

              “just like the circles you happen to come out of happen to use “cunt” generically”

              …. sorry, but you’re really behaving like a cunt yourself now [look it up]

            • Robert Eckert

              It IS the same. I don’t care if your chums at school used “cunt” in a non-misogynistic way, anymore than I cared that Espiando’s buddies used “fag” non-homophobically. You’re not talking to them here. You are talking to hundreds of lurkers you don’t know,

            • Candygram

              Dan Savage prefaced all letters to himself with “Hey Faggot” for years… Until he felt it suitably reclaimed.

            • Robert Eckert

              Yeah, yeah, and rappers call each other “nigger” a lot. It is still unwise for outsiders to the group targeted by a nuclear-level insult to use such words. And to play the game of “Too bad you’re such a prick as to get offended” is inexcusable.

            • EnthralledObserver

              Not true – Aussies use it to mean ‘arsehole’, ‘dick’, ‘prick’, ‘bastard’, etc. It has particular nasty emphasis, but it still is used like this if you are insulting someone.
              Some even use it as a term of endearment… the bogans, that is. But hey, they’re Aussies too, and some might even say they are the typical Aussie.

            • Candygram

              Yeah I’ve heard its usage is different in the uk. Maybe not the precise definition but the context and spirit.

            • richelieu jr

              Let’s not forget the biggest one: India.

            • ThetaBara

              Now you’re just being disingenuous (and/or butthurt). Maybe I have said it more than you have IN THIS THREAD, but YOU regularly use it as an insult. I’m talking ABOUT it. I never use it an an insult. You do.
              If there’s nothing wrong with that then why are you being so defensive about it?
              Also, you never said what you think it means, if it doesn’t mean what I say it means.
              AND you directly called me one, in this very thread. So who’s the troll?

            • media_lush

              I was commentating on Taylor Swift and her undisclosed charity work and you replied with the comment below… you were obviously trolling for an argument

            • ThetaBara

              Well I’m really fucking sorry I offended you because I dislike Taylor Swift. Jeez.

            • media_lush

              If you just said that then that would have been fine but you didn’t; it’s pretty plain to see that you were looking for a troll argument.

            • ThetaBara

              No, I’m trying to make a point about a particular word. I’ve been told all my life that I was lesser because of being born female. Now I have the ability to speak out against that, so that is what I’m doing.
              And thanks again for the downvote! Om nom nom!

            • Mooser

              Theta, you go ahead and dump on Taylor Swift. She’s never answered a single one of my letters, or acknowledged any of the gifts I sent. There’s a name for girls like that, but nobody will tell me what it is!

            • Missionary Kid

              Theta, realize (and we’ve had this discussion before) that cunt is not as offensive to Brits, and fanny isn’t as offensive to us. It’s a cultural thing.

              In Victorian times, a street that had houses of prostitution was named “Cunt Lane.” The name was eventually changed.

            • Eclipse-girl

              Fanny is offensive to the Brits? I learn something new every day. I understand that the Brits equate “bloody” with swearing.

            • media_lush

              and “faggot” is a meatball….. and “fag” is a cigarette

            • Candygram

              Faggot is a meatball?

            • media_lush

              Faggots are a traditional dish in the UK,[1][2] especially South and Mid Wales and the Midlands of England.[3][4][5] It is made from meat off-cuts and offal, especially pork.[3] A faggot is traditionally made from pig’s heart, liver and fatty belly meat or bacon minced together, with herbs added for flavouring and sometimes bread crumbs.

              Faggots are also known as “ducks” in the Midlands, Yorkshire, Lincolnshire and Lancashire, often as “savoury ducks”.

            • Candygram

              Wow. I had no idea. I wanna watch bedknobs and broomsticks with you, Media Lush. Those kids list all of their fave foods, and none of them sound edible.

            • Robert Eckert
            • richelieu jr

              I used to have a can that said ‘Faggots and Peas in their own sauce’ that won me my second ‘Best Weird Product label in a row (I won four times)

              The last was the best though: ‘Potted Meat Food Product”

            • EnthralledObserver

              We had these cool lollies as kids, in the shape of a cigarette with the end reddened like a lighted cigarette. Now they removed the red end and call them FADS… bloody political correctness, poohey!

            • EnthralledObserver

              The lollies were called FAGS, forgot to put that bit in… duh!

            • EnthralledObserver

              We had these cool lollies as kids, in the shape of a cigarette with the end reddened like a lighted cigarette. Now they removed the red end and call them FADS… bloody political correctness, poohey!

            • Missionary Kid

              Fanny, in British colloquial speech, means the same as cunt. Can you imagine the sniggers that accompanied the musical film?

              Likewise, “Free Willy” means pulling out one’s penis. There were loud guffaws at that film in the U.K.

              The reason “bloody” is considered swearing is that one is swearing by the blood on Jesus’ cross. I believe, and media lush, will correct me, it’s considered a mild swear word.

            • EnthralledObserver

              In Aussie land… bloody is also a mild swear word, typically used ‘bloody hell’… it’s the same as ‘Jesus Christ’, ‘For Christ’s sake’ or ‘for fuck’s sake’. It’s left over religious hurt. a parent might chastise a child for using them, but probably couldn’t explain why any more.

            • Missionary Kid

              I was raised so strictly that after I graduated from high school, I got a half-hour lecture for using the word “darn” in front of my preacher father. (It’s a contraction of “damn”), so I’m fairly aware of swearing in English. (Here, in the Bunker, I swear like the former Marine I am, but not all out).

            • EnthralledObserver

              After chastising my kids when they swear, I explain to my kids that it is the intent behind the word that is the biggest problem, but it also doesn’t sound very nice, and you want to be seen as a nice, decent person. I don’t necessarily practice what I preach… :p

            • Missionary Kid

              One of the things that happens with kids is that once they discover the power that swear words have, they want to utilize them.

              Story. My oldest, at the age of nearly two was at his grandparent’s house, (not my parents), went to bed at Christmas Eve. After he went to bed, a large tree was brought in, decorated with lights and all sorts of decorations, and a large number of gifts were put under it.

              Early the next morning, he got up, when he walked into the living room, he was obviously overwhelmed, because all he could say was, “Ohhh, shit!” All everyone could do was laugh.

            • EnthralledObserver

              Oh, I hear you on that discovery of power.
              The order of my kids are Girl, girl, boy, girl, girl. Never had any trouble with the first two, until the boy learned a number of swear words from the feral kids down tIthe street one day… and it just infected the other two like a virus… which they then passed on to the younger two girls as they were born and got older.
              It’s an unstoppable virus… the best hope you have is to contain and control it as best you can. *grimace*

            • q-bird

              oh yes Kid, you gave me a fine-ass military joke, “The fucking fuckers fucked!”
              oh I laughed and so did Mr. Q; he understood perfectly well.

            • Missionary Kid

              I didn’t remember using that phrase. I can’t find it on any of my lists, either.

              I can remember someone else using it, but I didn’t copy it.

            • q-bird

              my mistake MK, may have been semper fi or quite possibly 1Sub, damn my memory — There was a first-time poster who responded to Monkeyknickers & was upset with all the foul language…. a regular commenter posted this joke:

              A soldier is by the side of the road looking under the hood of his jeep.

              Another soldier drives by and asks what’s the problem.

              The first soldier says “The fucking fucker’s fucked!”

              I have used this line since reading it then & it never fails to make me laugh, rather than get mad.

            • Missionary Kid
            • Robert Eckert

              That was a joke I relayed from my dad. A jeep is broken down by the side of the road, a soldier staring under the hood, and when another soldier comes by and asks what’s the problem, he says…

            • q-bird

              ah twas you Robert my dear paddle dipper! It was YOU!!! Yay!!! I love this joke —
              I do – and thanks for jogging my mushy brain.

            • Eclipse-girl

              I understandd “willy” means penis.

              Is it just me, but in the US doesn’t the fanny means your butt cheeks, what you sit on? EVERYONE has a fanny in the US.

              Thanks for the help on “bloody” I was using that as a way to help me from using other words in the US. Totally freaked out some british friends

            • EnthralledObserver

              What you call ‘fanny’, we call ‘bum’. And isn’t there a clothing brand with those initials in the US?

            • media_lush

              fanny is one of those delightful words that can actually mean front bottom AND arse cheeks…. the context and grin on the person using it would give the clue as to which one…. I’ve often wondered why we have the R in arse and Americans use ass…. arse is just such a more enjoyable word to say.

            • EnthralledObserver

              I know, right? I hear you!

            • EnthralledObserver

              Whenever I hear an American say ‘ass’, I think of a donkey…

            • media_lush

              I had a Norwegian friend of mine at uni called Lars; I used to love shouting for him across a crowded bar…. he never did understand.

            • EnthralledObserver

              Oh, dear… despite trying to educate myself with google, I have to dip my head in shame and ask – huh? I no underkerstumble, either…
              Please explain…

            • Mark

              ‘Lars’ rhymes with ‘arse’ in British speech.

            • Michael Leonard Tilse

              L’arse in french……

            • EnthralledObserver

              Thank you, I see…

            • media_lush

              L’arsé, surely

            • Michael Leonard Tilse

              Don’t call me Surely!

            • media_lush

              surement, surement?

            • EnthralledObserver

              Oh… is that all. Okay, I would never have thought of that… I guess it is one you have to ‘try out’ for full impact. ;)

            • EnthralledObserver

              Oh, dear… despite trying to educate myself with google, I have to dip my head in shame and ask – huh? I no underkerstumble, either…
              Please explain…

            • Bury_The_Nuts

              When I say Ass…………I am usually meaning a Donkey!

            • EnthralledObserver

              Oh, well then… it is interesting, then, that when we say ‘arse’, we mean bum… er butt.
              Hmm… while I have you here, Bury, I understand the general term ass-hat, but what does it literally mean when you guys use it?

            • Bury_The_Nuts

              Grant Cardone.

            • EnthralledObserver

              lol… indeed, touché

            • Bury_The_Nuts

              When I say Ass…………I am usually meaning a Donkey!

            • media_lush

              a simple lulzy org protest video to make:

              you’ll need two of you, one with a camera and one with a hidden mic close to your face… the one with the mic should approach one of the org robots posted outside trying to intimate the protestors and motion for the Orgbot to come closer as he needs to ask a question…. when he gets close enough he should whisper:

              “Have you seen David Miscavige’s arse?” …. and just before he backs off all the way he should continue “I have” and then make any exaggerated face he feels like.

              I think it would make for a far more impacting video then the normal stuff and would probably get loads more hits, too.

              This could be done at orgs all over and a nice compilation of the reactions would make for a great christmas video for Tiny Fists.

            • N. Graham

              Maybe it could become a new drill! Part of the Diamond Age of Tech II or something.

            • Robert Eckert

              “arse” is the original (compare German Arsch) while “ass” started out as a euphemism.

            • Missionary Kid

              Bloody isn’t usually used in polite or religious company in the U.K.

            • Mark

              Ma’s out, Pa’s out, Let’s talk rude!
              Pee Po Belly Bum Drawers.
              Dance round the garden in the nude,
              Pee Po Belly Bum Drawers.
              Let’s write rude words all down our street,
              Stick out our tongues at the people we meet,
              Let’s have an intellectual treat for
              Pee Po Belly Bum Drawers!

            • Missionary Kid

              At about the of 4, as I remember it, little kids discover that there are words that, while they are not considered swearing, still annoy.

              I call it the “Pee, pee, poo, poo,” stage. They’ll use those words, then giggle and do it again, and giggle.

              That poem sounds like it’s a remembrance of that stage.

            • Mark

              It’s by the late 50’s musical comedy act Flanders and Swann: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSrXqOI9988

            • Missionary Kid

              They sound like they come out of the classic English music hall tradition, updated. I can see how you’d remember them well.

            • richelieu jr

              Here kids say ‘caca boudin, caca boudin!” until they fall about laughing;…

            • richelieu jr

              Go to your room! And there’ll be no pudding at tea, either!

            • Mark

              Ma’s out, Pa’s out, Let’s talk rude!
              Pee Po Belly Bum Drawers.
              Dance round the garden in the nude,
              Pee Po Belly Bum Drawers.
              Let’s write rude words all down our street,
              Stick out our tongues at the people we meet,
              Let’s have an intellectual treat for
              Pee Po Belly Bum Drawers!

            • media_lush

              mentioned bloody above. “Fanny” is pretty much used by little kids, if at all and is somewhere between front bottom and pussy…. it is also a girl’s name which really throws a spanner in the works…. the expression “sweet Fanny Adams’ evolved into sweet F.A. which means Fuck All… as in I won sweet F.A. in the casino tonight.

            • EnthralledObserver

              Really… ‘sweet fuck all’ evolved from ‘sweet Fanny Adams’… well I’ll be a monkey’s uncle!

            • Mark

              It’s the other way round, ML – ‘Fanny Adams’ is a euphemism for ‘fuck-all’, which itself is a stronger version of ‘bugger-all’ and that in turn of ‘damn-all’.

            • media_lush

              ah yes “bugger” …. considering it’s meaning I’m surprised this one slips through as pretty much harmless.

              Shit, the TV’s buggered!

            • EnthralledObserver

              Ouch… you just opened up a whole new can of worms, lush.

            • media_lush

              in the opening scene of ‘Four Weddings and a Funeral’ the original version has Hugh Grant being late and going fuck…. fuck…. fuck…. fuck…. whilst attempting to get ready as quickly as possible…. I happened to watch it again on an airplane and they replaced “fuck” with “bugger” [still his real voice as they knew to make different version in advance]… I’m sure there’s a strict PG version and am curious what epithet they used for that version.

            • EnthralledObserver

              ‘gosh’ ???
              :p

            • richelieu jr

              My current fave is: ‘I’m going to have a Brad…”

              Cockny rhyming slang is almost as good as our Verlain…

            • Lark Smith

              In America a bugger is snot- as kids a good insult was calling someone a bugger eater. George Carlin never understood why the the word bugger was censored. I was shocked when I learned that bugger used as a verb had a TOTALLY different meaning.

            • N. Graham

              I always thought the one meaning Snot is spelled “booger.”

            • Robert Eckert

              That’s correct. They are totally separate words.

            • Lark Smith

              you are right !

            • EnthralledObserver

              Well, that does make a little more sense… how easily we can be led astray here at the Bunker… ;)

            • Mark

              ‘Fanny’ may mean the same, but is far less rude than the ‘C’ word in the UK. It’s falling out of use, largely due to the US influence via TV. Equivalents would be ‘front-bottom’, ‘tuppence’ &c. ‘Willy’ is child-speak; equivalents would be ‘todger’, John-Thomas, &c. ‘Bloody’ was thought to have religious connotations as an abbreviation of “by Our Lady”, but that’s a myth invented by Victorian prudes who wanted to stop people swearing.

            • richelieu jr

              ‘Fanny’ is more ‘pussy’, really…

            • media_lush

              it’s kind of old school…. it’s most famous usage is probably by Michael Caine in The Italian Job…. “I only told you to blow the bloody doors off!”…. it’s almost a polite swear word nowadays

            • Mark

              What about Eliza Doolittle’s “bloody” in Shaw’s Pygmalion, then?

            • media_lush

              haven’t seen that in ages…. and who the hell was Nora?

            • Mark

              Most say from Cockney “flamin’ horror!” distorted into “bloody Nora”; or a ‘famously’ murderous 17th century maidservant called Norah. You looks it up & takes your pick…

            • media_lush

              you’re not a QI elve by any chance?

            • Mark

              No – I just enjoy reading reference-books – in this case Eric Partridge’s marvellously filthy Dictionary of Slang & Unconventional English.

            • Michael Leonard Tilse

              Ohhhh. I have his “A dictionary of the Underworld”

            • Mark

              You lucky devil! I’ve been after the Wordsworth p/b reprint for ages, but it’s escaped me so far. My other favourites are Brewer’s Dictionary of Phrase & Fable, & Yule’s Hobson-Jobson which I did get in the Wordsworth version before they let it drop out of print, the bastards…

            • Michael Leonard Tilse

              Mine’s a 1961 hardback with dust jacket.

            • Mark

              I’ll probably find one eventually at a church jumble-sale or the like; I can be patient (and I refuse to pay the extortionate s/h prices on Ebay or Abebooks).

            • media_lush

              okay…. I’ll be impressed if you can find the answer to this [only if you want to] …. open to everyone

            • Mark

              Whether it’s east or west of the Mississippi, supposedly – but really because the government said so. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Call_signs_in_North_America

            • media_lush

              Wiki is not your friend in this case:

              “All broadcast call signs in the United States begin with either “K” or “W”, with “K” usually west of the Mississippi River and “W” usually east of it (except in Louisiana andMinnesota, which don’t strictly follow the dividing line between the two groups). Initial letters “AA” through “AL”, as well as “N”, are internationally allocated to the United States but are not used for broadcast stations.”

              …. I say again what does the ‘W’ and ‘K’ actually stand for…… it’s an absolute stinker to try and research…. you’ll go crazy [should you try to find the answer]

            • Mark

              I give up. The most informative website looks to be ‘The Straight Dope’ http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/2303/why-do-u-s-radio-call-letters-start-with-w-in-the-east-and-k-in-the-west-revisited
              but they are stumped.

            • media_lush

              I’ll post the answer in a couple of days…. I posted it to the QI twitter account but haven’t got a reply either…. might tweet them again

            • Mark

              Someone certainly needs to wipe the smug grin off Stephen Fry’s face. ;)

            • media_lush

              when I lived in New York I asked this question at a party that had a lot of people from NBC and none of them could answer it….. fast forward a few years I asked it again in one of my lectures at uni [University of Westminster – top Media uni in Europe… or so they said]… the lecturer couldn’t answer it and suggested I ask the Dean of uni who knew everything [He’s Dean of Princeton now, I think] and he didn’t know either but it really bugged him. it took him 2 days to track down the answer and involved numerous calls to his colleagues in the US

            • Robert Eckert

              And then the first commercial station was KDKA (in Pittsburgh, not west of the Mississippi). The idea that the first letter should indicate the country of origin came later, and W and K got assigned to the US because stations whose call signs started with those letters already existed here.

            • media_lush

              nope

            • Robert Eckert

              Yep.

            • richelieu jr

              HEre’s what I get from ‘early radio history’
              It goes back to 1912-14.

              Here is info taken from “Mystique of the Three-Letter Callsigns” by
              Thomas H. White — January 1, 2007 referenced in the source below.

              With the adoption by the United States, in 1912, of an act to regulate
              radio stations, call letter assignments became formalized under federal
              authority. Under international agreement unique initial letters were
              allotted among the various nations. The 1914 edition of Radio Stations
              of the United States records the contemporary practices for allocating
              calls for sea and commercial land stations, which at this time were few
              enough so that all could be given three-letter calls: International
              agreements started to make some sense out of all the wireless broadcasts
              being made all over the world. The call letters assigned to the United
              States are all combinations (676) beginning with the letter N and all
              (676) beginning with the letter W, and all combinations (598) from KDA
              to KZZ, inclusive. [NOTE: KAA-KCZ was allocated to Germany at this time,
              and was not assigned to the United States until 1929.] The total number
              of international calls is thus 1,950, and these are reserved for
              Government stations and stations open to public and limited commercial
              service. All combinations beginning with the letter N are reserved for
              Government stations and in addition the combinations from WUA to WVZ and
              WXA to WZZ are reserved for the stations of the Army of the United
              States.

              The combinations KDA to KZZ, with a few exceptions, are reserved
              for ship stations on the Atlantic and the Gulf of Mexico and for land
              stations on the Pacific coast. The combinations beginning with W (except
              WUA to WVZ and WXA to WZZ as already indicated) are reserved, with a
              few exceptions, for ship stations on the Pacific and Great Lakes and for
              land stations on the Atlantic and Gulf coasts and in the Great Lakes
              region.

              Notice the policy was that calls for ocean-going ship stations started
              with a different letter than the land stations they communicated with:
              in the West ships received W– calls and land stations were assigned
              K–, while the reverse was true in the East, with K– ship calls and W–
              land calls. (NOTE: The assignment of W and K to the United States
              appears to have been completely arbitrary–the letters have no
              particular significance. N, however, had been commonly used by the U.S.
              Navy since November, 1909).

              In the early teens most non-amateur land stations engaged in
              ship-to-shore communication, and were found clustered along the coasts.
              As other services were developed stations crept inland, and a dividing
              line between the western K’s and eastern W’s was needed. As noted
              earlier, coastal land stations in states along the Atlantic and Gulf
              coasts, including Texas, received W calls. Thus, using the Texas-New
              Mexico border as a starting point and heading north, the original
              boundary ran along the eastern borders of New Mexico, Colorado, Wyoming,
              and Montana.

              The flood of broadcasting service authorizations that began in earnest
              in December of 1921 served to overload the recycling three-letter land
              station calls. Before the crunch the Bureau was able to assign
              three-letter callsigns to about 200 broadcasters.

              For more details see the source below.

              Source(s):
              http://earlyradiohistory.us/3myst.htm#or…

            • media_lush

              I don’t have access to my uni notes [they’re in my garage somewhere] and my history of American radio is fuzzy at the moment [been following this site ALL day] but the answer is actually pretty simple.

              When US radio really started to take off and the whole concept of affiliates and proper commercial broadcasting was introduced it had to be regulated and licenses applied for and given out. The government department responsible for this had a bunch of guys in an office putting it all together and a big map of America… according to my professor the guy in charge put a line down the middle and said “Walter” you’re in charge of the East Coast and “Karl” you’re in charge of the West… he then wrote a big circled “W’ and “K” on the map. Please note that I am using Walter and Karl as examples as I can’t remember the exact names [could actually be those names]. So when any new station applied for a license it was given a W or K prefix depending which side of the line it was.

              I cannot vouch for this 100% as I don’t have the documentation [and it’s unlikely that this type of documentation would exist based on this explanation] but he was the Dean of my uni – head of all media departments and is now the Dean of Princeton and told me he made numerous call to America to find out the answer… he went on to say that it bugged his colleagues as well and they managed to track down someone who was part of the original process or something.

              When you look it it does make really simple sense and is a rather elegant explanation.

            • richelieu jr

              It’s a good story if nothing else!

            • media_lush

              indeed

              BTW his name is Brian Winston…. he’s won an Emmy [which he never told us about] and recently got an OBE

            • richelieu jr

              OMG! I can’t believe it: I actually just bought that book on a whim about an hour ago!

            • N. Graham

              The Who used “bloody” in a lot of their songs.

            • richelieu jr

              ‘Fanny’ means ‘pussy”… and it’ snot some stange argot for it, either It is THE word…

              I’ll never forget the first time I saw the sitcom ‘The Nanny’ for the first time with a bunch of English types.. The song goes like ‘The Nanny.. She fell on her fanny…” and the place EXPLODED!

            • Eclipse-girl

              fanny in US speech means the butt cheeks.

            • media_lush

              It’s not a question of me not liking it it’s a question of you deciding on a single interpretation of it and accusing me of using it in that manner. I’m sorry but I’ve explained numerous times that that was not the case and I am fucked off that you can’t see it or that there might be a possible different interpretation of the word.

              The fact you don’t see, or more likely choose NOT to see this explanation makes you a bit of a cunt really…. just so you know what my intention of that word is I have highlighted it in yellow for you.

            • shasha40

              In defnse of you Lush , I too can have a potty mouth, and from your postings I see who you are and think your a gas and am not offend by that word but hey , I’m a New Yorker , but I also don’t believe we want to have any type of censorship around here either . So , let’s let it go for now. : D

            • media_lush

              I never brought it up in the first place….. look at who was looking for that particular argument here

            • EnthralledObserver

              It’s alright, lush… not ALL of us ladies act so hysterically over mere words.
              If you call me a ‘cunt’, then I’ll probably just lash back with ‘dick’, so we’d be even.
              Continue to do your thing… you entertain me.

            • Mooser

              And “douche”, too. Another inherently misogynistic epithet. A woman should be able to come here and not have her escutcheon tarnished, if you get my drift.

            • q-bird

              Rock and Roll, Hoochie Koo! looking up escutcheon & other words…
              Also, a new word cleared today because Mr. Q asked what this was… tweaking.

              hanging on by a thread.

            • Bury_The_Nuts

              Tweaking? Or Twerking?

            • q-bird

              crap – twerking – yes BTN’s – that dance hall move!

              edit: hiya – oh I wish oh wish I could attend the southern sp party coming up. Sad to report, I have November & December off from work – NOT OCT. drat!!!

            • EnthralledObserver

              Call it the prude in me – yes, I have a small amount of prude – but that’s vile, and Miley is VILE for doing it on stage.

            • q-bird

              get this Enthralled – where I work we have kids from all over the world who come here for summer seasonal work (being immersed in English helps them in their studies and those dollars earned help pay for their educations, a wonderful deal all ’round). Anyway, 6 years ago, we had Jamaicans working with us – they put on a Jamaica Nite for us, all sorts of very different food, drink & dance. And let me tell you, those women can dance! And twerking was a part of it all; they did not use that word for it tho, to them, it was just dancehall dancing – it’s how they have danced all of their lives. I was simultaneously embarrassed and in awe of their skill. Now. Imagine these young girly-girls trying to teach us old ladies how to dance like that! Oh much laughter and joy in it I tell you for true, under the stars around a campfire!
              That encounter with the beautiful & sweet Jamaican women, for me, it takes the edge of vile EO.

            • EnthralledObserver

              I see your point… and had Miley done it in the Jamaican setting where it is considered normal, or regular, that’s one thing, but Miley did it for shock value… nothing regular about it. My kids still see her as Hannah Montana… and it’s awkward to have to censor her from them now.
              I know she’s breaking out of that good girl shell she was held in for many years, and I’m all for individuality, but her lack of class is appalling to me.
              You know, my five year old’s dancing teacher said to me the other day that it was getting harder and harder to find music appropriate for her dance students (under 18’s) to use – and most often she has to go find the old stuff of the 80’s and 90’s… if that isn’t saying something about an industry out of control, trying to one up one another on shock value, then what does?

            • richelieu jr

              They said the same ting about Elvis. And they were right, and kids will always do it… and if the parents aren’t pissed off, then they’re doing it wrong…

            • richelieu jr

              Hey, that just means ‘shower’, BTW!

              Some folks around here need to take a quick douche écossaise!

            • Jimmy Threetimes

              I agree. People who get all worked up over “cunt” are usually dicks.
              Edit: sorry I wasn’t trying to offend you theta, I actually agree that the word shouldn’t be considered as offensive as it is. That’s all

            • sugarplumfairy

              It’s just a word.. Yes, a word designed to dehumanize and offend.. But still just a word.. Flunk uses it more than media does and he uses it on women.. Media is correct.. He only uses it on assholes.. And he never uses it on women.. Even if they’re assholes..

            • ThetaBara

              That’s incorrect. He called me a cunt just today.
              And I am just as offended when Flunk says it. The difference is that I guess I thought ML would be more reasonable about it. Ha.
              The thing is, you cannot divorce the word from its actual meaning. I’m sorry, but it means what it means, so using it as an insult IS saying women = bad. You don’t have to be a goddamn postmodern theorist to understand that.

            • EnthralledObserver

              Well… apparently you do… because it doesn’t mean that for me.

            • Jimmy Threetimes

              What you have to consider is that an insult to a man by any derogatory term that implies femininity is a challenge to their masculinity. There is no underlying implication that femininity is bad as a whole, after all, men love women, but most men don’t want to be a woman. The insulting aspect is that femininity is not seen an appropriate trait for men to have. Not that femininity is bad in general.

            • sugarplumfairy

              My mistake.. Sorry.. My go-to insult is prick.. Guess I should rethink that.. Don’t want to offend the gentlemen..

            • EnthralledObserver

              lol… but isn’t that the point of an insult… hahaha

            • richelieu jr

              I sounds a bit like you’re citing the Mad Hatter there, TB:

              Then you should say what you mean,” the March Hare went on.

              “I do,” Alice hastily replied; “at least–at least I mean what I say–that’s the same thing, you know.”

              “Not the same thing a bit!” said the Hatter. “You might just as well
              say that ‘I see what I eat’ is the same thing as ‘I eat what I see’!”

              “You might just as well say,” added the March Hare, “that ‘I like what I get’ is the same thing as ‘I get what I like’!”

              “You might just as well say,” added the Dormouse, who seemed to be
              talking in his sleep, “that ‘I breathe when I sleep’ is the same thing
              as ‘I sleep when I breathe’!”

              (Alice’s Adventures in Wonderland, Chapter 7)

            • ThetaBara

              No, it sounds like YOU are citing the Mad Hatter.
              You know perfectly well what it means, and if you want to go on saying that, regardless, go ahead.
              I don’t appreciate it. But, say what you think. You didn’t like it when yo thought someone was defaming the French. I don’t like it when men are defaming women. Neither one of us can do anything about it except point it out. If it falls on deaf ears, well, too bad.

            • richelieu jr

              Hey, how often have you heard me use that word?

              I mean seriously, find one example.

            • ThetaBara

              In that case, why are you continuing this line of argument?
              No, really, why?
              I’ve never had anything but good interactions with you here. I don’t perceive you as generally misogynistic. And I have asked (and we have all BEEN asked) to let it die.
              So, WTF, dude?
              Friends? Can we let it go?

            • richelieu jr

              I’m not arguing at all, I promise.

            • media_lush

              I did use it I’m afraid but only as emphasis to the context I was trying to get across…. [seen here in yellow highlights]

            • richelieu jr

              You know, in French ‘con/conne’ means exactly the same ting from exactly the same origins, but we use it to mean ‘stupid’ or ‘asshole’.. .

              Culture and context DO matter. There’s no reason the U.S. interpretation MUST be the right one.

            • ThetaBara

              Yeah well, it is used as “asshole” and “stupid’ here too – but – why not just SAY “asshole” or “stupid” if that is what you mean? Unless calling someone a name that means “pussy” somehow makes it worse?

              Anyway, you boys go ahead and insult folks however you like. I’m through with this bullshitness.

            • Mooser

              Okay, hold up. As I remember it was Tony O who said Jeb Burton was acting like a “douche” about something. A few comments later, Burton accused Media Lush of calling him a “cunt”. Which I don’t think Media Lush did, unless I missed it. I thought Tony’s use of “douche” was in dubious taste, but I should talk? I don’t even have any taste in my mouth.

              At any rate, I don’t think it was Media Lush who did any cunt-calling.

            • media_lush

              no, I did a couple of weeks ago when he was really going off on one of his aggressive and vile rants that was really annoying everybody…. I think my comment was something like

              “if you stop posting like a c*nt then something something….

            • Candygram

              Meh. I still like you Media Lush… Not that that and a coupon will get you a cuppa coffee.

            • EnthralledObserver

              Heh, heh… I like both Media_lush AND Jeb… I think I must be stuck in a paradox…

            • q-bird

              Jeb is just so seriously super dooper pissed off at what CO$ has done to ‘his town’ that he tends to direct that deep & monumental anger at any & all scientologists that have ever existed, here, there, famous or not, doesn’t matter to him. No room for any compassion when anger (and fear) is so strongly held.

            • Sandy

              Luv ya ML. Just sayin’ …

      • Suppressive Tomato

        My new motto:

        • Missionary Kid

          Credit Alice Roosevelt Longworth daughter of Teddy for that.

    • Captain Howdy

      Swiftiness already put the nix on the Tom mix.

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xZzczBTa8rI

    • ThetaBara

      I wouldn’t wish Tom on Swifty, and I really can’t stand Swifty.

      • richelieu jr

        Super Agent Irving “Swifty” Lazare?

    • Robert Eckert
    • SandiCorrena

      OMG RUN TAYLOR RUN! She seems like just the right kind of vulnerable to fall for that crap; to me anyway.

      • Eclipse-girl

        I do not think TS is vulnerable. I think she is high maintenance and demanding. She runs through her BFs extremely fast.

        • Sandy

          I disagree. I am 6′ tall and was SO vulnerable at that age

          • Eclipse-girl

            I think TS is protected by many people. Yes, most people are vulnerable at that age. I do not thinkTS is like most people

            • Sandy

              Maybe you are right. But – it is SO hard to be 6′ tall and in your 20’s. Seriously.

            • Eclipse-girl

              I have a friend who is 5′ 8″ or 5′ 10. It is hard to be a tall women in high school, too.

    • Missionary Kid

      It will never happen for one reason Taylor is 6′ tall.

      • Bury_The_Nuts

        Two words.

        Kidman, Holmes.

        • Missionary Kid

          You’re right, all of his wives have been taller.

          Rogers is 5’9″, Kidman is 5’11” Holmes is 5’9″, and Cruse is listed is 5’7″, but I’m willing to bet he’s shorter.

          Good points. I hadn’t realized that Nichole was that tall. There are some short guys who are only attracted to tall women. I understand that Nichole said after leaving TC that she could finally wear heels again.

          I’m 5’9″ and I remember as a freshman in college that a beautiful, intelligent, girl who was several inches taller than I was attracted to me, but I cooled any approaches from her because she was taller. I was an immature idiot.

          If Cruise exclusively goes for taller women, that’s fine with me. The need to wear lifts, though, is something else. I understand the whole Hollywood image thing.

          On the other hand, I didn’t know they made dildos that tall.

    • Jimmy Threetimes

      I just think the song she would write after that divorce would be amazing. I know she was included in that great parody video of the TC wife auditions, but imagine how it would play out in real life.

  • NeverIn

    STOP IT! Stop with the funnies! I can’t stop reading! You people have been making me laugh my ass off all day. DON’T YOU KNOW I HAVE WORK TO DO?

    Also, I am seriously tempted to ditch said work and zip down to New Braunfels for the hearing Thursday.

    • Suppressive Tomato

      Haha, just for that…

      • ThetaBara

        Um, wow. Somehow this actually makes me feel sorry for her!

        • Suppressive Tomato

          That’ll pass next time she tweets something utterly moronic.

          • ThetaBara

            Yeah, right?

      • NeverIn

        Ouch!

      • junojones

        She didn’t use to look like LRH….

    • Lemont

      Even back in the Village Voice days, on so many occasions I have arrived at work in the morning, pulled up the internet news, silently muttering…. please, Tony, don’t have an awesome story TODAY, I need to get some WORK done!!!

  • Robin Hairs

    im not a ex cos/cob but have been reading any and all ex cos sites i can find. i must say you all have me crying im laughing so hard at the comments.. my kids think ive finally lost what was left of my mind.. with that said i would also like to congratulate and praise all of you who were inside and made it out in one piece. and for all the help you all do to help others to wake up. to the truth of what is going on with cos. Mr Headley im almost sure i used to have a link to a blog you were writing. my computer crashed and i lost all links. so im in the process of finding them again. but you had some awesome information on your site too. i just last week found martys site thru operation clambake. anyway just wanted to let you all know that it isnt only ex members your saving but those who might have had a thought of joining. without learning the truth.

    • ThetaBara

      Marc has a book, Blown for Good, but I don’t think I’ve ever seen a blog. Although I bet it would be awesome if he did!

      • Eclipse-girl

        Marc has 3 young boys that he is parenting with (the beautiful) Claire. It probably take some time. I am glad when he posts. It is always insightful.

      • Bury_The_Nuts

        http://blownforgood.com/

        It is there, but he hasn’t been updating it in a long, long time.

      • Bury_The_Nuts

        http://blownforgood.com/

        It is there, but he hasn’t been updating it in a long, long time.

    • Eclipse-girl

      Welcome. There are a bunch of ver funny people here. We all have one thing in common. We would like to see the destruction / dissolution of Co$ and (hopefully) DM put in prison for years.

      • Suppressive Tomato

        More specifically, an electronic prison somewhere in a mountaintop volcano.

        • shasha40

          Where H-bombs get dropped in them … Tick, Tock Tiny Dick, won’t be too much longer now …but keep the foot bullets a coming ! Straight up and vertical !

        • Robert Eckert

          And we’ll make sure to keep those eternal batteries recharged!

    • Suppressive Tomato

      Yes, Tony is performing an incredibly important community service. This site continues to be hugely helpful for people leaving the organization and for educating the general public about what goes on inside.

      • ThetaBara

        This is the first place I send folks who ask me what’s up with all this Scientology bullshitness. Then, Wright. Then, if they want to get involved themselves, WWP.

        • shasha40

          Man, I was never in but the anger and disdain for COS was and is Very strong . The crimes they have committed against humanity, children, financial ruin, disconnection, and on and on down that hole. I still read with Amazement with the things this group has gotten away with in the US using their thuggery on people and spies .They can’t go down Fast enough for any of us here ! Welcome .

          • Mooser

            Don’t worry. I’m going over to the COS located in my burgh on Thurs., and I will demand a complete explanation. I’ll get to the bottom of this. However, I do plan to leave my wallet in the car. I’ll let you know what happens. I have a feeling what I will find is an elaborate, but pretty much empty building. But I have some pretty probing questions for whoever happens to be there.

            • Candygram

              It’s actually pretty unassuming. Good call leaving the wallet in the car. Better yet, don’t drive. And make sure a few of your friends/family know you’re going.

            • Robert Eckert
    • Lemont

      Great post! Nice to have you here!!

    • Douglas D. Douglas

      Welcome! Glad to have you here!

    • aquaclara

      Nice post! Welcome. I laugh a lot, too. And cry. Today is a happy day….I have discovered a joy in reading legal briefs here at the Bunker! So glad you’re here, and posting. Chime in often.

  • Jeb Burton

    Look at Marty in his little sailor outfit. What are these people thinking? Hard to believe this simpleton is still a follower of LRH after all he has been through. Hope his beautiful wife gets the million bucks and leave this weirdo.

    • Missionary Kid

      I don’t hope she leaves him or stays. I just hope she stays happy. Who knows what goes on in a marriage?

      • Mooser

        Who knows what goes on in a marriage?”

        My Mother-in-law. I swear, she peeks in our windows.

        • Missionary Kid

          What does your wife say about it?

  • mook

    a little preview of what the Supah Powah Building opening might look like. this is from an event a few years ago, I believe. From left to right: Marisol Nichols (?), Kelly Preston, Jenna Elfman (?) [in between Kelly and Anne], Anne Archer, Misscavige, Nancy Cartwright, Kirstie Alley, ?, Geoffrey Lewis (?).
    since these celebs were also the biggest donors to the Supah Powah Building, I’m guessing they’ll be attending the event in Clearwater

    • Artoo45

      Is there supposed to be an image?

      • Nevermore

        Refresh the page.

      • Artoo45

        There it is!

    • Suppressive Tomato

      I simply cannot wait to go exterior as I rub myself all over that oiliness table! My perceptics are twitching just postulating it! It is going to be the most upstat theta beingness anywhere on my wholetrack!

      • Mooser

        Me, I’m prone to hyperbole. I’ll come back when I get up.

    • George Layton

      Not only does Kirstie have two left feet, she has two left hands!

    • Artoo45

      Whoah! Ah said whoah mule! Whose hand is that around Bart Simpson’s waist?

    • Captain Howdy

      You got 4 right.

    • Michael Leonard Tilse

      Nah. That’s Craig Jensen, the tall guy in the beige suit.

      • mook

        Who’s the lady between Kirstie and Mr. Jensen? She looks familiar

  • ze moo

    At 950 comments, I bet it maxs out at about 1200. Rather nice for a Tuesday.

    • Bury_The_Nuts

      Straight up and verticle!
      By the way,….does it bug anyone else that they had to say it twice???

      • EnthralledObserver

        lol… well, yes, now that you mention it.

  • Artoo45

    Okay kids, it’s Slightly Off-Topic, Paranoid, Blown-Celebrity Gossip Time!

    My business partners attended the Sausalito Arts Fair this weekend and Lisa Marie Presley was headlining. My band had a gig on Saturday night, so I was unable to attend but I was eager to hear how she was and was she cool and all. They looked at each other and then at me with a look of pity and said “uh, well, she kind of cleared the tent.” I said that “didn’t sound too good.” “Yeah, the entire tend left over the course of her set. There were people cleaning up . . . she was still singing.” WTF?

    So here’s where the paranoia part comes into play. The woman can sing. She has a fantastic band. Why would the tent clear? Could she have been that awful or did the cult pack the tent with instructions for everyone to leave en masse. My partners are not prone to hyperbole. Anyone else there last weekend? I couldn’t find anything online about it.

    • media_lush

      in the UK our public transport [mainly the tube/subway] closes relatively early – about midnight – so if an act comes on late [Rhianna and Bieber in the huge O2 forum in London recently] many people had to leave early to get the last train home…. there was quite a brouhaha about this in the press at the time. unlikely, but a possible explanation for LMP, maybe.

      • Artoo45

        No public transit of any significance in Marin county. Just Rangies and Teslas . . .

    • N. Graham

      I see that she followed Creedance Clearwater Revisited. Maybe the place was filled with CCR fans who couldn’t get into Lisa’s music, which is, music structure wise, a lot less basic than CCR. I’ve seen it before where the crowd is there for band 2 and they take all the available space and then all leave when band 2 is done.
      Here is a “review” and interview. No $cientology mention though.
      http://www.elvispresleyfansofnashville.com/lisa-marie-presley.html

      She is touring the whole month, maybe someone will get some info from her, although probably not as long as Priscilla is in.
      http://lisamariepresley.com/tour

      • Artoo45

        Well, I have to say as a member of a band that plays all original music, when you follow a tribute band, sometimes the audience goes out with ‘em. Like I said, it was probably just an odd coincidence. I’m sorry I didn’t get to meet her, though.

  • Suppressive Tomato

    Sometimes, LRH just couldn’t help himself.

    • N. Graham

      1970s Clip Art!

  • Douglas D. Douglas

    Closing in on a thousand comments already? I pity the Bunkerite who didn’t check the comments this morning…

    Happy reading!

    • Sandy

      Triple D. I am here all day (I am retired) and even I can’t keep up!

    • Lark Smith

      Jeesh, That would be me :-O. I did check this morning but you folks have been very busy Bunkerites!

    • Davka

      I saw the number and just went, “Gaah!” No way to keep up…..

      • Jimmy Threetimes

        A good way to quickly scan thru the comment section is to just read every other word of each post, and only read threads that start with a vowel.

        • Davka

          Ha! When I’m methodical, I start with “best”, read through those, and then shift to “newest” to read the 50 gajillion that appeared after I started. But now I’m just too tired – I give up!

    • Aslansown

      Aaaand that would be me. Just got home from work. Won’t be getting much sleep tonight!

  • LemonLemon

    Great article! Things are getting good! It doesn’t sound like Scientology has much of a case. My only fear is that a settlement will be reached just to make it go away and so Miscavige won’t have to testify or be deposed. Scientology would rather pay a tidy sum than the story being blown wide open and light being shed. Of course scientology will always contend that they are telling the truth because as we all know– say it with me– if it’s true for you, it’s true. DM doesn’t have to say what’s actually true, he just has to believe it’s true.

    • q-bird

      WOW – you’re the 1000th comment right on the button LemonLemon – you WIN!!!

    • Mooser

      “DM doesn’t have to say what’s actually true, he just has to believe it’s true.”

      In high-falutin’ philosophistical jargon, this is also known as “The Costanza Dictum”

    • Douglas D. Douglas

      The consensus here is that Monique and Marty are not interested in settling. They want to see the COB in court.

      • Suppressive Tomato

        I pray to the 8th Dynamic that this is true!

      • LemonLemon

        As do we all. If he is compelled by the court to sit for a depo or to testify, how much squirming will he be doing when the lawyer calls him on all his bullshit? Ahhhhh can’t wait for the backpeddling to begin!

        • N. Graham

          Wait until he tries to have the lawyer call him “sir.”

          • LemonLemon

            Ohhhhh yes! Imagine his reaction when the lawyer DARES to point out his contradictions. After years of being surrounded by “yes-men”, he will finally have to “lower” himself to obeying wog-laws. Will Tommy Davis be there to object and tell the lawyer he “doesn’t have the f’ing rank to ask those questions”

      • LemonLemon

        As do we all. If he is compelled by the court to sit for a depo or to testify, how much squirming will he be doing when the lawyer calls him on all his bullshit? Ahhhhh can’t wait for the backpeddling to begin!

  • Suppressive Tomato

    Going through my vast archives of LRH Technology, another delightful piece. What good sales pitch doesn’t start out with the mark in a cage with a lion?

    • Douglas D. Douglas

      What would I do if I found myself in a 20 foot cage with a lion? Based on the recent videos I have seen of the mighty, mighty OTs handling protesters, I would look that lion right in the eye and in a quavering voice keep repeating, “You need to leave. You need to leave right now… You need to leave.”

      That is the standard Tech, is it not?

      • Suppressive Tomato

        DDD, your confront is strong, but I’m worried you’re not granting enough beingness. Maybe you need to repair your havingness, or maybe you have a M/U on lion, or cage?

        • Douglas D. Douglas

          Then again, I could call on this guy to do a REAL confront:
          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQr1XOaW794

          • heuristically_inclined

            Now that is some real super powers! Someone needs to get the Pope a cape.

          • Suppressive Tomato

            LOL “Are you dauntless and defiant?” LOL

      • N. Graham

        I think you have to take its picture a dozen times or so also. And try to sell it a book.

    • kemist

      “What would you think if you woke up and found yourself in a 20 foot cage with a lion ?”

      I hope it’s been fed recently ?

      Where’s the key ?

      Needs moar antelopes ?

      • sugarplumfairy

        I’d go the f*ck back to sleep..

      • Nevermore

        Rather that than a room full of reggers lusting after my credit card number!

  • media_lush

    I anticipate future lulz with this story….. we now have one of the most eagerly waited book adaptations since Lord Of The Rings associated with scientology already

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-2416837/Dakota-Johnson-dating-Scientologist-Jordan-Masterson.html

    • Eclipse-girl

      I read that and wanted to post RUN AWAY. But he is from one of the multi generational, wealthy families where some of the rules do not apply. Do you think they are chaste?

      • media_lush

        if she’s anything like her parents….. no waaaaay

        • Eclipse-girl

          I wasn’t either. I find it humorous.

      • Artoo45

        No, but they should be chased . . . out of Hollywood.

    • Anonymookme

      Ugh! A Sciloon sporting a Notre Dame t-shirt. My father and my grandfather are spinning in their graves.

  • Candygram

    Does anyone else think it would be a riot to see Bill Murray play Marty in the movie version of this mess?

    • Candygram

      Expanding on that, I imagine Bill in his fake navy uniform tossing chairs and pens everywhere, barking orders and leveling side eyes during “the coup.”

      • Bury_The_Nuts

        Bravo. My brain played the scene as written.
        It was great!

      • Bury_The_Nuts

        Bravo. My brain played the scene as written.
        It was great!

    • SandiCorrena

      he’s too tall though……gilbert godfrey?

      • Candygram

        Is Marty short? I still think the demeanors match somewhat. Just gazing from the outside in.

        • Lunatic Posse

          Marty Short! Perfect! Good one CG!

  • Steven

    Sorry but…they have gotten away with so many things the past 50 years that I wouldn’t be surprised if they win this one…still waiting for the checkmate…been waiting for 20 years since I’ve been following them. Don’t feel very positive at this point.

    • Steven

      but I thank Tony for bringing so much to light and working so hard to bring them to justice. It just seems impossible in this country that after Lisa McPherson, Flo Barnett (shelly miscavige’s mother’s murder), Operation Snow White, The Hole, the RPF, Shelly Miscavige, Alexader Jentzsch’s death, numerous stalking/harassment cases, numerous suicide cases, CHILD LABOR, the Headleys, Debbie Cook and so so so so so so many more that we are STILL here waiting for something to happen…sorry but I am very very angry today.

      • stateofcircle

        I’m with you, Steven. Earlier in the comments a few Bunkerites brought up a very good point, which is that the general public can get behind ridiculing, dismissing and condemning Scientology for all the space opera xenu body thetans e-meter ridiculousness, but when it comes to the terrorism, stalking, child labor, forced abortions, physical and mental abuse, etc, etc., it is just too much to wrap one’s head around and even believe, and all that stuff involves digging a little deeper. So it’s easier for the general public to just write them off as weirdos and be done with it. And it’s so very, very sad.

        • Steven

          Hello,

          Yes, you said it better than I could. It’s great that the mainstream media has ridiculed, made fun of, etc….but yes…the TRUE crimes have not been discussed enough because they would not seem believable. I wish there was ONE website that ONLY highlighted the horrors of the cult (murders, abortions, child labor, stalking, physical/mental abuse, suicides) in a very clear/concise manner. There are too many different sites all over (not very well put together and confusing) that most people cannot find and would not find so it is difficult to get the information and the big picture of what has happened with this very very dangerous cult. Also, again, I LOVE Tony but I don’t think the “Sunday Funnies” are appropriate when you know the story of all of these horrific things. The bad things should be the focus. Again, with all of the sick things that have happened throughout the years with murders and suicides…WHERE IS THE CHECKMATE???!!!

          • Jimmy Threetimes

            There are plenty of sites documenting the horror show that LRH/DM have run. Tony could either spend his time compiling it into a giant archive of depression, or he could focus it on tracking down and reporting new information on a daily basis. Which do you think is more constructive (or in this case destructive) in covering Scientology? And as for the Sunday Funnies, a little levity is always good for our sanity, no?

      • Eclipse-girl

        No one is trying to say that our should not be angry.

        What some of us who are optimistic about think is could be The case. With Monique, Marty, Ray Jeffrey (possible Mike Rinder) and the bad decisions DM always seems to make it could be the clusterfuck to damage Co$

        As to the “regular public” ignoring the abuses –> I am not sure that they do. I think they are uninformed and believe that that nothing like that could happen in the US in this day and age. We need people like Tony, And Larry White, and Marc, Marty and MIke and Jenna, Karen and Tory and MANY MANY others to keep exposing the lies and the crimes of $cientology.

  • monkeyknickers

    And god those outfits look stupid. Everyday is Halloween in the SO.
    Poor kids .. . . . ugh.

    • Anonymookme

      Oh god, I agree. I cannot even imagine the embarrasment and humiliation for having gone to {work} in that silly costume FOR 27 YEARS!

      • junojones

        I know. And Mc Donald’s is somehow degrading compared to that?

        • Anonymookme

          Wha? Are folks wearing McDonalds uniforms pretending to be in a fake Navy?

        • ThetaBara

          No. McDonald’s is degrading all on its own.

    • Anonymookme

      Pretend Naval Officer Mark “Marty” Rathbun reporting for duty, Sir.
      27 freaking years. Teh stupid. It burns.

    • Michael Leonard Tilse

      Well, as I remember it, being in the Sea Org, it was kind of powerful. It made me feel like a part of a group that was doing something, that had a future. I was proud of it.

      Back then it didn’t register that it looked gooney and loony-tunes. That it trampled upon the good memories of those who HAD sacrificed their lives to save the world or their country.

      I bought my stuff from the racks at L.A. Uniform Supply, because the S.O. Uniform was a U.S. Navy uniform without all the rank and service insignia. They also sold sew-on sea org symbol patches, the lanyards and other gee-gaws that went with it. Epaulet shirts and web belts. They had stocks of the sea org specific stuff.

      I don’t discount the powerful psychological impact of dressing yourself for the role you have been given our adopted for yourself. If it didn’t seem so real before, it does when you wear the uniform.

      Making fun of it is not going to get you anywhere with most s.o. members.

      After the advanced org was raided for the upper level materials by some former scientologists who dressed in navy uniforms, and mimicked sea org officers, most of the uniforms were changed to be not like the standard U.S. Navy uniform so much it could easily be copied.

      • Spackle Motion

        Chances are good that any SO that adores that phony uniform isn’t reading the posts making fun of it. There are more wogs than Scientologists by….um….a few billion, and to most of us it looks cultish, ridiculous, and just plain stupid. They are denigrating those that actually sacrifice for this nation so it is open season to denigrate them.

        • Michael Leonard Tilse

          I understand the J&D here. I was thinking of situations where anons or family or people who are trying to reach someone who is in the s.o. might make fun of the uniform and just shut down any chance of connecting.

          • Eclipse-girl

            as in the discussion of a week or two ago, there is a strategy for families with loved ones in this cult. RIDICULE is not a part of of it. Love, compassion, empathy are going to be the tools that help (along with food and sleep.)

            Many of us “never ins” do use ridicule / mockery to show our disdain for the cult. I don’t think it is wrong.

            TY MLT for keeping us honest and making sure we respect others.

            • Michael Leonard Tilse

              Ridicule / mockery is wonderful. It creates a great environment which helps to defang and reduce the power of an inimical cult. It is not wrong. After all, within the cult, the only ridicule and mockery that is allowed is the degradation that comes from COB or is about Pharma or Psychs or SPs. But one-on-one when we are trying to engage the minds and logic of of those who have bought into the fantasy we have to appreciate how it appears to those still high on the flav-r-aide.

            • Eclipse-girl

              I very much enjoy your perspective. I am glad you escaped, survived and are able to share

            • ThetaBara

              This is an excellent point, and one that I try to keep in mind when dealing with culties through chalk tech, or even here. It’s SO easy to ridicule… but, is it EFFECTIVE?

            • Jimmy Threetimes

              Chalk tech is somewhat effective, but it is easily countered by eraser tech.

            • ThetaBara

              Actually, they sometimes try to counter with Hose Tech. But, WE COME BACK.

      • aurora50

        what you say:

        ‘the S.O. Uniform was a U.S. Navy uniform without all the rank and
        service insignia.’

        That seems so shockingly disrespectful…how is it even legal?

        • Eclipse-girl

          It is shameful to veterans and their families. Apparently it is not illegal. Otherwise it would impinge on free speech. What may be illegal is to claim honors (medals).

        • Jimmy Threetimes

          There are laws preventing one from impersonating a military officer or law enforcement officer in the U.S. The one thing is that it has to be a willful or intentional act of portraying oneself as such. They may strive to look similar to Naval officers, but they do not actively portray themselves as being Naval officers. So it is legal.