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‘Going Clear’: Jason Beghe, the actor who left Scientology and made a stink about it

Jason_Beghe3

Here’s a screenshot of Jason Beghe from Alex Gibney’s film Going Clear, which airs on HBO in nine more days, on March 29.

Beghe is one of eight former members of the Church of Scientology who make up the main subjects of Gibney’s film. Our longtime readers know that we’ve been writing about Jason for a long time, since he made his very visible protest against Scientology in 2008, having left the organization a few months earlier.

In the movie, there’s a reference to the full two-hour 2008 video of Jason Beghe that Mark Bunker filmed and put on YouTube. But actually, what happened was that Bunker first posted a three or four minute teaser that, on its own, went viral. The next day, we got a call from Tory Christman.

We hadn’t heard from Tory in years, but we both still remembered fondly the time we spent putting together a story about her defection from Scientology which came out in 2001. She asked if we had seen the Beghe video, and explained that she had had a hand in it, and that a longer version was coming. And then she asked the question: “How would you like the first press interview with Jason?”

Oh, you bet. And even better: After talking to Beghe and getting to know him for that initial story, he told us he’d be coming to New York to tape a segment for 20/20 about Scientology, and we made plans to get together.

Like yesterday, we remember meeting him at the Blue Water Grill at Union Square while he told us what it was like to be quizzed for a couple of hours on camera by Elizabeth Vargas. He said it was comprehensive and explosive. He was amped.

And none of it aired.

It wouldn’t be the last time 20/20 got great material on Scientology that it then canned rather than air. But ABC’s indecision wasn’t going to slow Beghe down. After we talked for hours, he said he was heading down to DC the next day to see his parents, and he asked if we wanted to come along and talk more. We sure did. We spent the next day on the train, talking even more about what he’d been through as a celebrity in Scientology. And now, he wanted to find out what had happened to other people who had left. After visiting his parents, he then went on a cross-country trip, checking in with some legendary names in Scientology, people who had defected or been expelled, and learning what had happened to them. He knew that Marty Rathbun had left several years earlier, and no one seemed to know where he was. And we had just heard at that time that Mike Rinder, the former church spokesman, had also “blown.”

Beghe became determined to track them all down to find out what seemed to be driving away former high-ranking members. And, as Going Clear indicates, Beghe was one of the first people to track down Marty Rathbun, along with Amy Scobee and Mat Pesch, and started talking to Rathbun about re-emerging and doing something about Scientology’s internal turmoil.

We think it’s no accident that the epic St. Petersburg Times series came out just a year later, after Beghe had crossed the country to get former Scientologists motivated to talk publicly about what was going on. We don’t know that Beghe has ever received proper credit for how much things have changed in the last six years because he made that effort.

And he paid a steep price. Beghe was subjected to a harsh “Fair Game” campaign by Scientology, one that threatened his livelihood, and worse. Eventually, he managed to extricate himself from the legal part of that nightmare, and gradually, his career began to pick up steam. He became a recurring character on Californication, the series that starred his great childhood friend, David Duchovny. And then Dick Wolf made Beghe a key part of his major NBC series, Chicago Fire, which led to a spinoff centered around Beghe’s character, Chicago PD.

Now, he’s a major part of Going Clear, and certainly one of the most memorable. His descriptions of what it’s like to suffer through Scientology processing that he didn’t want is hilarious and troubling at the same time.

Let us know what you think about Jason’s parts in the movie, and how it fit into the narrative that Alex Gibney constructs in his film.

 
——————–

Hollywood Arclight getting some late enturbulation

A tipster passed on to us a couple of communications from someone who works in the massive call center that handles calls for the Hollywood Arclight theater.

Alex Gibney’s documentary ‘Going Clear’ opened at the theater a week ago, but it’s apparently only in the last few days that an onslaught of calls have come in from locals who claim that they’re outraged about the theater showing the movie, and threaten to boycott the Arclight because of it.

This is classic Scientology behavior. Too late for it to have any real effect, someone at the church noticed what was going on and an “all hands on deck” order was put out to get people making calls. It’s so Scientology.

Then, yesterday, our tipster received this text message from their friend at the call center:

Ohhh My God. I’m in call center at Arclight and on the caller ID “Church of Scientology” shows up. And I answer and the woman is asking to speak with one of our administrators who helps decide which movies we show at arclight. And I was like no one is in right now, can I help you with something? And she said “it’s… About… An… Issue… We have. With arclight. I’m not going to say anything else.” Super mean. And eventually I just told her to email our management team. It’s scary because she’s clearly trying to get us to stop showing that movie Just like the movie says.. If someone speaks out against their religion they attack that person or group and that’s what they r trying to do to this guy at arclight! Scary as fuck!!!

Classic.

Going Clear begins its second weekend at the Arclight tonight, extending past the time required for Oscar consideration. You still have time to see it on the big screen before it airs on HBO on March 29.

 
——————–

Posted by Tony Ortega on March 20, 2015 at 07:00

E-mail your tips and story ideas to tonyo94@gmail.com or follow us on Twitter. We post behind-the-scenes updates at our Facebook author page. Here at the Bunker we try to have a post up every morning at 7 AM Eastern (Noon GMT), and on some days we post an afternoon story at around 2 PM. After every new story we send out an alert to our e-mail list and our FB page.

Learn about Scientology with our numerous series with experts…

BLOGGING DIANETICS: We read Scientology’s founding text cover to cover with the help of LA attorney and former church member Vance Woodward

UP THE BRIDGE: Claire Headley and Bruce Hines train us as Scientologists

GETTING OUR ETHICS IN: Jefferson Hawkins explains Scientology’s system of justice

SCIENTOLOGY MYTHBUSTING: Historian Jon Atack discusses key Scientology concepts

PZ Myers reads L. Ron Hubbard’s “A History of Man” | Scientology’s Master Spies | Scientology’s Private Dancer
The mystery of the richest Scientologist and his wayward sons | Scientology’s shocking mistreatment of the mentally ill
The Underground Bunker’s Official Theme Song | The Underground Bunker FAQ

 

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  • Miss Tia

    Happy First Day of Spring y’all! Also the anniversary day of Panacea and Poliahu arriving here (one year apart). They’ll get extra doggie treats today! πŸ™‚ Just haiku with the theme of niblet escaping/leaving…..

    Tail between his legs
    Cash placed in safe hiding spots
    niblet plots escape
    #haiku #scientology #DavidMiscavige #GoingIndictmentFree

    Must buy Lou’s silence
    Ensure Shelly doesn’t talk
    Then ride like the wind
    #haiku #scientology #DavidMiscavige #GoingLikeATumbleWeedThruAnOrg

    Abandoning ship
    Good captains don’t do that; but
    Sea Org run by rat
    #haiku #scientology #DavidMiscavige #GoingEverymanForHimself

    Family to turn to?
    Disconnected or escaped
    Nope, he’s on his own
    #haiku #scientology #DavidMiscavige #GoingToLearnHeHasNoFriendsEither

    Who’d risk hiding him?
    Would Tom Cruise still need him then?
    Without church-friendless!
    #haiku #scientology #DavidMiscavige #GoingToKnowThis

    Slip out back, new plan,
    Don’t be coy, get a new key,
    50 ways to leave….
    #haiku #scientology #DavidMiscavige #GoingTo

    • The spring is going clear!

      • Miss Tia

        I can tell it’s rained here and we are to get more today, BUT they have said it might also be snow! The winter that wouldn’t die!!!

    • seriouslyWTF

      Love your haikus Miss Tia.. I did the following yesterday.. the last one is kind of in the same theme..

      On the twenty ninth
      Going Clear on HBO
      Alex Gibney Rocks

      On the twenty ninth
      SP’s will finally see
      A very blue sky

      Petty Little Bitch
      There will be no place to hide
      After Going Clear

      • Miss Tia

        oh those are really good!!

        • seriouslyWTF

          Thank you! I really don’t know how you come up with so many of them.. and they are all so good.

          • Miss Tia

            i gotta say i don’t know how i come up with so many of them either!!

    • joan nieman

      Yes. Yes. Yes. Every one of them descriptive to the tee…..T for Tia that is!

      • Miss Tia

        thanks joan! πŸ™‚

    • Miss Tia

      Morning Dodo!

      • Morning, Tia

      • Synthia Fagen

        Man, you all get up early! The only reason I am here is because I haven’t gone to bed yet. LOL…Btw, Good Morning Y’all. I love the smell of burning cult early in the morning.

        • Morning, Syn πŸ™‚

        • NOLAGirl

          Synthia…get some sleep girl. πŸ™‚ We’ll save your seat until you get back.

        • Miss Tia

          Morning Synthia!!

  • Ella Raitch

    Now surely Christian Stolte has to by and say something about his mate Jason

    • NOLAGirl

      I think Christian will do what he has continued to do. Speak out, but respect his friends privacy. As much as I’d love to know details, I respect that Christian is such a good friend.

  • 1subgenius

    Of course I haven’t seen “the movie”, but, despite being on a rather strict comedy-only regime, I have seen bits of “Chicago PD”.
    The son of a bitch is riveting.

    • NOLAGirl

      Seconded. I LOVE him (and the rest of the cast) in that show.

    • Ella Raitch

      Haven’t seen the movie either. I do remember about 3 1/2 years ago watching the Jason Beghe video in full length till the wee hours of the morning. Then found the Running Sacred blog at the Village Voice and have been here ever since. I’d previously stumbled across Lisa McPherson stuff and found it too far fetched to believe (no, really). Jason was compelling and credible. Might go and watch that vid again tonight.

      • NOLAGirl

        See the show Ella. Seriously. I’ll even lay a bet on it. If you watch it the first few episodes and don’t like it….well, it’s early, and I’m still on coffee one..you work out the bet. LOL

        • 1subgenius

          You can always offer a double-your-money-back guarantee.

          • NOLAGirl

            Happy to. πŸ™‚

      • bromo

        Ella, I just recently rewatched Bunker’s Jason video. My takeaway this time was much more than the first time I watched it a couple of years ago. I credit that with all the knowledge I have now that I didn’t have then of the cult due to reading, reading, reading here and other places everyday. With knowledge comes understanding, and, besides, I didn’t have as many MUs as the first time. πŸ˜‰

      • LeeAnneClark

        Interesting! That’s exactly how I ended up here too!

        I’d had a passing interest in Scientology for years, ever since a college boyfriend had gotten mixed up in the COS for about a millisecond, decided it was all bunkum, then was subjected to an intense campaign to get him back. This culminating in an all-out war at school one day when he decided to send the message to them once and for all by doing a speech in his communications class about the bizarre antics of the cult, and the lengths they will go to get people to stay (they’d been calling all his family members, including his grandparents, telling them he was seriously troubled and if he didn’t come back in he was headed for disaster). The COS sent several members to his classroom, where they stood outside the door and bullbaited him while he was up front speaking!

        Anyway…that was long ago. So I’d been occasionally reading stuff at Clambake, and just kinda generally following whatever was happening in the news about them, when I came across Jason Beghe’s video. WOWZA! I was riveted! I watched the entire thing. Right after that I too stumbled across Tony at VV. And I’ve been hooked ever since.

        I used to comment a lot more, but given that I’m on the West Coast by the time I see his stories these days they have upwards of 500 to 1000 comments, and I don’t have time to read them all. But I read the Bunker every single day.

        Can’t wait to see the movie!

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      And I like to think of him as “our” son of a bitch.

  • HTC

    Just about every day now there is a story about the cult on my yahoo homepage.

    http://www.bostonglobe.com/ideas/2015/03/19/scientology-enturbulating-lingo/TvBESMQkV4RcxGnyrNSH1K/story.html

    • NOLAGirl

      Did you notice our rockstar i-Betty in that article? πŸ™‚

      • HTC

        No Nola!!! Where is she in the article?

        • generic sock account

          A comment she posted on OCMB is quoted in the last paragraph. Also, she’s a mermaid.

          • HTC

            Duh, ok saw it. Go girl!

          • NOLAGirl

            What should I call you now? The initials of your name mean something else in my life and I don’t like calling you ‘generic’, because you certainly aren’t. Help me out here. πŸ™‚ Sock? G?

            • generic sock account

              Jimmy is fine. I’m still the same person.

            • NOLAGirl

              Thank you, I prefer that but wasn’t sure. πŸ™‚

            • Juicer77

              Shhhhhh, you’ll hear you.

            • generic sock account

              Your mental ninjutsu will not work on me, sailor.

          • Mermaid and a fairy.

            • NOLAGirl

              …and an angel.

            • i-Betty

              Oh, God, stop it! *furiously blushing* The author probably put “scientology + lingo” into the search box at OCMB and came up with that comment or the thread it was in. That aside, it’s good to know journalists are still using the Bake as a resource because it will always be such an important repository for old dox n’ stuff.

              One of the mods, I’mglib, made a post about her upcoming 10 year anniversary at OCMB which led to some lovely reminiscences about old names and faces, the changing times, and the role of OCMB in today’s scene.

              Another mod, Don Carlo, replied:

              Tony’s blog is the greatest, for news and comments. But OCMB is split up into topics and not so crowded here as Tony’s blog, which is one long string of comments every day – one day Tony was answered with over 2,000 comments. I link to Tony every day, read most of the comments and post new or witty remarks by his readers, and lead newbies to that site. OCMB still ranks high in Google, due to 18 years, over four hundred thousand posts, and tons of links, so I’m happy we can boost Tony’s great site.

              400,000 posts!

              http://ocmb.xenu.net/ocmb/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=301064

            • generic sock account

              Yes, one day there was OVER 2000 comments here. That one day.

            • i-Betty

              That made me chuckle, too. 3000 is uncommon these days. We left 2000 back in the Dark Ages.

              But Don wrote that last summer and perhaps there really has been that steep a climb in the comments here since then.

            • You can’t stop us from loving you, i-Betty. I am sorry, on behalf of The Bunker.

            • i-Betty

              Big fat kiss πŸ™‚

            • <3 πŸ™‚

            • One Human

              I always felt Don Carlo resembled another great SP…The Wrong Guy too….

      • i-Betty

        How funny! Noseinabk sent me the link. I can’t wait to show my mum πŸ˜›

        • Sejanus

          Hey nice work in the Globe piece!

          • i-Betty

            I’m just upvoting everything out of sheer ebullience and hilarity this morning, but I have to say that the author of the article only copy-pasted one of my forum comments; I didn’t get to wear my journalists costume made out of newspapers or do anything important, but thank you πŸ™‚ And I’m glad she did because it has given me my best laugh in ages! All my friends and family are going to get copies with the word: “SEE?!” written across it. I’m not sure what they are supposed to see, but it will be something profound πŸ˜›

            • generic sock account

              Now I want to know why you have a costume made of newspaper. But that discussion can be shelved for another time, I suppose.

        • NOLAGirl

          I was already gone but I hope you saw my request for your autograph. πŸ™‚ Congrats love!

        • generic sock account

          Pan posted a beautiful shoop of you as a mermaid, and I’m forever going to think of you as a mermaid, in a good, non-creepy way.

    • Sejanus

      Excellent article with good background.
      A good primer for someone peering down the rabbit hole.
      I-Betty was well quoted in it

  • generic sock account

    If my house was on fire, I’d call Beghe and Stolte before I would call 911. That’s just personal preference.

    • NOLAGirl

      Stolte for the rescue. Beghe to find the motherfucker who started the fire. πŸ™‚

      • generic sock account

        What fire?

        Ohhh

        • NOLAGirl

          I told you just “spritzing the fire” with hairspray wouldn’t be funny. πŸ˜€

      • bromo

        Glad I had a paper towel nearby for the keyboard coffee spew.

        • i-Betty

          They’re so funny πŸ˜›

      • joan nieman

        Ha ha!

  • The only Mofo Clear I ever saw is Jason Beghe. Period.

    • joan nieman

      Good one Dodo!

  • ComeToPresentTime

    Jason Beghe’s parts in Going Clear definitely elicited the most laughs from the audience I was with. He was so good in it. It made me want to go back and revisit his ’08 Mark Bunker interview after I got back home. I remember when the Wise Beard Man dropped the little teaser thing prior to the whole video being released, that was quite the PR flap for the COS at the time.

    Watching the video now, I understood so much more of it than when I watched it back then, even though I was quite familiar with most of the Scieno-speak back in those days. There really is a lot to unpack in his musings, and to the uninitiated I can definitely see why the general consensus was that “here’s this crazy guy spouting a bunch of nonsense.”

    I seriously wish he would’ve broken his thoughts down into “wog-speak” for lack of a better term in that interview.. Actual english is what It would be, I guess, lol.. He drops some very insightful knowledge in there, I especially liked how he compared the whole Scientology experience to the Theta Trap LRH refers to in one of his books. It’s an absolutely perfect analogy. That’s one amazing part of LRH’s hubris, that he actually tells Scientologists what he is doing to them on more than one occasion. And thanks to KSW and such, it keeps on trucking more or less. I just wish more Scientologists could objectively view KSW for what it is and why it in and of itself shows why Scientology is a sham.

    • stanrogers

      I seriously wish he would’ve broken his thoughts down into “wog-speak” for lack of a better term in that interview.

      I’m not sure how close to a possibility that would have been. It seems to take a bit of time for English (or some other natural human language) to pave over the potholes that Scientology creates in the brain. I have to admit to harbouring a bit of anger when I first stepped into this weird world; I understood and agreed with the fight against the “church”, having had good people in my life sucked into it many years ago, but I found it somewhat upsetting that the people leading the fight seemed to be exploiting poor exes who were obviously suffering from mental or developmental challenges. Hearing them talk about their experiences and feelings in the simplest terms they had available was like watching somebody trying to add two and two, and somehow coming to the conclusion that the Pythagorian theorem needed to be invoked somehow, and surely something needs to be divided by pi at some point, and then deciding that six is probably close enough for government work because there’s got to be something wrong with this calculator. Then, as the Scino-speak slowly faded, I could see that these were bright, committed and sane people who had quite literally been temporarily robbed of the ability to express themselves in a language that was mutually intelligible with the English the rest of the Anglophone world speaks. Some are faster getting back to straightforward language than others, but I don’t think anybody can just flip a switch.

      • ComeToPresentTime

        I’d actually disagree with some of what you said, and that practically every Scientologist, current and ex, public and SO that I’ve known throughout my life has actually had an above-average vocabulary of wog-speak, it just that when they’re actually discussing Scientology with anyone it’s incredibly difficult to navigate through the immense obfuscation created by all of the lingo, and it can lead to someone going off on way too many tangents just to explain the terms they’re using.

        This is one area where I feel Going Clear excels, more so than any other video work I’ve watched about Scientology.

        • stanrogers

          That’s precisely what I meant. It’s only where it counts, in relating the experience, that the language completely falls apart. That is by design.

          • Richard Grant

            Stan and PresentTime, this is a fascinating discussion — thanks for digging into this issue.

            My introduction to Scientology came by way of an old dear friend who was extremely articulate and well-read (she’d turned me on to Lawrence Durrell’s “Alexandria Quartet”), which made it so disconcerting to sit across a dinner table and listen to her talk about L. Ron Hubbard and all these exciting new experiences she was having. It was really like meeting a quite different person who looked exactly the same as the person I’d known very well for many years.

            • Draco

              That’s an interesting point, Richard. It’s sort of uncomfortable to think that people I had known for years would think of me that way. Must have been very disconcerting for them. Meanwhile, I the enlightened one, carried on oblivious to the fact that people probably thought I was really weird! Heh.

          • Gerard Plourde

            “That is by design.”

            Absolutely. It appears to form an integral part of the cult’s program of mind control. To control people you have to deny them the ability to think and analyze.

            • Bavarian Rage

              It seems mind control and manipulation are the only areas that Hubbard ever really buckled down and gave diligent, all out study to. Curious how his impressive list of intellectual accomplishments overlooks the only real study he ever applied himself to.

            • rom661

              And, as horrific as the results are, he was exceedingly good at it.

            • Bavarian Rage

              True dat! As though he were taking lessons from the “Father of Lies” – the devil himself. I’m not one quickly dismiss his involvement in the occult. I think it shaped and directed his evil. Quite a witches brew when coupled which a heaping helping of paranoid schizophrenia and sociopathy (??) or whatever personality disorders he was cursed with.

            • Gerard Plourde

              I agree that his fascination with occult practices for the purpose of self-aggrandizement is key to understanding Hubbard. He is a prime example of evil being concealed behind a smiling face.

      • Graham

        George Orwell, 1984:
        β€œDon’t you see that the whole aim of Newspeak is to narrow the range of thought?… Has it ever
        occurred to you, Winston, that by the year 2050, at the very latest, not a single human being will be alive who could understand such a conversation as we are having now?… The whole climate of thought will be different. In fact, there will be no thought, as we understand it now. Orthodoxy means not thinking-not needing to think. Orthodoxy is unconsciousness.”

      • Bavarian Rage

        Ironically their initiation course of choice is Communication.

        • It’s all about control. Specifically, for the victim to accept being controlled.

          • villagedianne

            Precisely. To accept being controlled and monitored as a good thing. Not just to internally control and monitor themselves, but to control and monitor others. KSW.

            • BirdsFlying

              That was one thing that really frosted my gourd about Scientology – the need to control. The first time I was on staff and got a call from someone in the Sea Org asking who was “running so-and-so” I nearly freaked. This sounded like some sort of CIA spook operation.

              I did not know how close that assessment might have been.

        • One Human

          Yes, LRH’s irony, “It’s not cyanide, it’s a cure-all!”.

      • Bavarian Rage

        I spent 2 years in Japan 20 years ago and while I’ve retained only scant basics of the language – hello, thank you, sorry and most importantly, how to order my fav vegetable tempura combo ;D, there are a few Japanese words that I much prefer to English as there are no English equivalents. Such words are just superior at articulating my thoughts.

        Could it be that for newly emerging ex-scions, when trying express a piece of their cray-cray experience which has no comparison to the real world, the scion-speak lingo is the most “accurate” word they can latch onto, to “best” convey the mental picture they’re trying to translate into words.

        In that sense they could be considered quite articulate, though in an unfortunate language that should never have come into existence at all.

        • splog

          That’s how I see it, there’s some things in scieno-speak I still don’t have adequate English words for. So when DM goes all bat-shit crazy on FreeDum, I think “missed withhold”. It’s probably one of the few cases where a scientology word correctly communicates something.

          I run into a similar problem in my regular job too – I’m an IT sysadmin. Now there’s a field with it’s own huge lingo – how would you describe “bootstrap” to someone trying to figure out how computers work?

          The difference of course is that Japanese and IT words usually describe something real, and they have real definitions. But your point is correct – new exes do have a hard time describing what they are thinking in regular English

          • Bavarian Rage

            Bingo! You IT dudes and photocopier repairmen seriously speak a foreign language. And when you make the mistake of trying to break the problem down for us average mortals, we just nod vacantly, hoping it will end soon! Cheers and best to you!

            • splog

              Here’s what we *really* do when we show up to fix your stuff:

              http://xkcd.com/627/

              Mrs. Splog was so impressed she had that printed on a tee for my 50th (true fact!)

            • Scream Nevermore

              Ah, that takes me back!

        • IMHO, it’s not that the vocabulary is somehow strange, but that meaning is radically different. “Ethics” is my favoured example, not least because I just finished “Closing Minds: How Scientology’s “Ethics Technology” is Used to Control Their Members” by Jefferson Hawkins.

          In a way it’s fortunate that the victims have been taken over by LRH (including his inability to make an articulate response to simple questions, see the video below at teh beginning) in that they lose the ability to actually communicate.

          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_w-YWwC1lI

        • Dale A.

          Hello Bavarian,

          …” the scion-speak lingo is the most “accurate” word they can latch onto, to
          “best” convey the mental picture”…

          It is quite true that there are certain words in any language that are priceless,
          and not interchangeable; see French, Yiddish… etc….

          But as a reader, I have yet to find anything in Scientology that wasn’t copped from
          another more beautiful, older, and more profound source. So I feel that the
          phenomenon of esoteric vocabulary in Scientology has more to do with the
          conversion phenomenon. That is to say, when westerners convert to Islam, they
          start sprinkling their language with Arabic. When westerners convert to Hindu,
          they do the same with Sanskrit.

          I do not believe that this new vocabulary exalts the religious experience any
          higher than the vernacular, or expresses it with any greater precision. What it
          does is help the convert escape the boredom of their humdrum experience (what
          Freud calls life’s everyday miseries) by offering tantalizing words, suggestive of a magic and secret future.

          So much for Scientology. That silly dangerous corrupt pursuit

        • ComeToPresentTime

          That’s a bingo.

    • PickAnotherID

      I don’t think the made up internal lingo is the major problem.

      What really throws people off is, the Orwellian way El Rum redefined everyday words to mean something totally different within $cientology. A prime example being “ethics”. What people believe when they here a $cientologist mention ethics, and what the $cientologist actually means, are in fact polar opposites.

      • Ben Franklin

        True. Even “Morality” is defined differently

        • Victoria Pandora

          Yeah, I just finished Jeff Hawkins “Closing Minds”. He really lays it all out as to what $cns. really mean when they say they are “the most ethical people on the planet”.

    • i-Betty

      I believe he had only recently left at the time WBM interviewed him? The Scinospeak would have been strong in him, still.

      • Juicer77

        Yes, you can see him mentally processing things as he’s speaking. It’s fascinating.

      • Draco

        I agree – you tend to forget that people won’t understand what you are saying. It takes a while to replace scinospeak with normal language.

      • Dale A.

        I like the way you said that Betty.
        Cometo Present, I understand this sentiment, ” wish he would’ve broken his thoughts down into “wog-speak”. But IMO, if someone (us) wants to understand something, it is really our responsibility to do the work. In that effort lies the obligation to listen to others speak, in exactly the words they wish to use.

        • i-Betty

          “In that effort lies the obligation to listen to others speak, in exactly the words they wish to use.”

          How beautifully put.

    • villagedianne

      “That’s one amazing part of LRH’s hubris, that he actually tells Scientologists what he is doing to them on more than one occasion.”

      One thing I’ve read about Satanism is the belief that you have to in some way tell people what is really going on. That way, they reason, the victim is acting out of his own free will and the Satanist does not incur the Karma.

      Personally I think Karma is a smarter bitch than that.

    • Mighty Korgo of Teegeeack

      Look out MIscavige. I found copies of OT9-16 in my basement. It looks like L.Ron’s handwriting and that’s good enough for me. I am not going to disclose them in full because there is big money to be made and I am no fool. Here’s a teaser.

      OT9– Looking good, knowingly and at will while wearing an ascot. $25,000
      OT10– Convince a hundred thousand adherents that you have 15,000,000 adherents. $30,000
      OT11– Pick up beautiful women even if you are ugly,fat , broke, and have rotting teeth. $40,000.
      OT12– Never go to jail no matter what you do. $50,000, slightly more in California
      OT13– Become Howard Hughes– Kit includes engineering degree, long nails and hair, bottled urine at slight additional cost. $60,000
      OT14– Write your own dictionary as prep for OT 15. $70,000
      OT15– Start a fake religion. $100,000
      OT16– Create a reign of terror and maintain it long after you croak. $1,000,000

    • Mockingbird

      Well , you may be interested to know Hubbard studied rhetoric under Dean Wilbur and it at the heart of Scientology and KSW – KSW has tons of rhetorical methods intertwined to control , confuse and enthrall you . I have a series of very brief posts on this at my blog .First a post giving credit to a poster at ESMB who refers me and others to evidence Hubbard studied rhetoric with a very concise description of the form he saw the subject in and its most basic ideas :http://mbnest.blogspot.com/2015/03/gibs-great-find-rhetoric.html

      Then a few simple examples how Hubbard used the simplest broadest ideas from rhetoric in Scientology

      http://mbnest.blogspot.com/2015/03/rhetoric-in-scientology-few-brief.html

      Then a brief analysis of some of the complex intentionally confusing rhetorical methods Hubbard used in Scientology’s most harmful and pervasive doctrine -KSW http://mbnest.blogspot.com/2015/01/a-brief-rhetorical-analysis-of-keeping.html

    • valshifter

      Now I have to listen to his tapes again, I just watched one clip where he states something I never understood, and that is; the progression from clear to OT, when you “clear” you have only worked with your reactive mind, and your spirit is still plagued with BT’s, then you go OT you start exorcising from your spirit other peoples spirits, to leave your spirit sparking clean. wow what a sell.

      • ComeToPresentTime

        yep, it’s an endless bait-and-switch. And of course, OT 9 and 10 won’t be released until there are x amount of Idle Orgs and the Super Power building is up and running or something (ProTip: They either don’t exist or will be made up). Maybe OT10 tells parishioners to drink more Ovaltine? I bet sales of the powdered beverage would be through the roof.

  • 1subgenius

    I wonder if Daniel Montalvo has lost any more fingers.

  • Narapoid

    Jason’s recollection of going exterior was a great deal like mine. That experience was the strongest hook for me in lending credibility to the “tech”. My thought at the time was “holy shit, my soul is actually coming out of my body” and removed all doubt for me. Thank heavens a sea org press gang disabused me of my cozy happy spot within my “church”; that probably saved me from decades of misery.

    Thanks Jason for sharing your experience, it has helped me make sense of mine. All the very best to you!

    • It happened to me prior to $cientology. Exteriorization was the big carrot on a stick for thousands of $cientologists for decades, and very rarely every happened, though promised in “rundown” after rundown, level after level. Guess Elwrong couldn’t figure out how to do it without the drugs that did it for him.

      • rom661

        Same here. I had serious head injuries in a car accident. Was “out” and couldn’t get back in. Trying to figure out that sensation and impression paved the way for my being open to Scientology.

        • Thanks for the reminder. It also happened to me when in the cult. I had an OT3, Class 4 auditor pressuring me to move in with her and it was bugging the heck out of me to the point that I drove through a red light, got sideswiped, hit my head on the windshield (wasn’t wearing a seat belt) and was out of my boy for a time. Scientology didn’t do it; Scientology craziness lead to it.

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      I fell off my chair the first time I learned that this is a symptom of one of the disassciative disorders. That’s when I realized scientology makes you pay for mental disorders that others pay psychiatrists to get rid of.

      • i-Betty

        Christ.

    • Kim O’Brien

      happened to me while i was in labor ..also happened on an outward bound trip in Mexico ( after not eating food for 3 days )

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        BAM!

  • Maury Dowd

    What part did Jason Beghe play in Going Clear?

    Jason Beghe was KEY. He was was the pivot point between fantasy and reality, the man who got in and got out, and boy did he he tell the story well.

    He spoke eloquently of his early wins in Scientology. Interestingly, after his ‘wins,’ he was very happy, and he felt like he no longer needed Scientology. Of course, the church didn’t see it that way…

    Beghe was animated, engaging, and at the same time down to Earth. And Beghe got the most laughs!

    Thank you JB.

    BTW, I think Elizabeth Vargas is very sharp, intelligent and very talented.. too bad her interview with Beghe never aired.

  • NOLAGirl

    Tony, does anyone know at what level the decision to not air his interview with E. Vargas came from? She doesn’t seem like a shrinking violet to me, was it her bosses?

    • what’suppressive

      Hey Nola, what’sup! You definitely answered your own question.

      • NOLAGirl

        LOL I guess I did huh? I know nothing about how TV works behind the scenes on a news program so I was just curious.

    • They probably pulled the legal action card out with ABC. Remember, Miss Cabbage’s last TV interview was with Ted Coppell on ABC’s Nightline and that didn’t go well.

  • Sunny

    I remember back when Jason was tracking people down. He found me through a friend of a friend of a friend (one of whom is still pretending to be in Scn, but is really fully out and helps where he can). This would have been before the videos that he made. He had just decided he was out and talked and talked and talked on the phone, a lot of which are in the videos with Mark Bunker.
    I warned (not sure if that is really the right word for a tough guy like Jason) him about the backlash directed at him for speaking out. He is not one to keep silent! I told him about how Scientology will pull all of his pc and ethics folders and go through everything to try to find things to push his buttons and use things against him. Of course, like Jason he said “bring it on!”.
    ——
    I remember when he was at CCI, that same energy you see him with against Scn, he used to have FOR Scn. He did a lot for the church in bringing in new people, and always helping others. I think it was quite a huge shock to Scn when he walked out so loudly.
    Kudos to you, Jason.

    • MaxSpaceman

      Thank you for the facts from A to C.

      Your story certainly must be amazing. Hope to see it someday. πŸ™‚

    • NOLAGirl

      Thank you Sunny. You only confirm what I already assumed about him. He is not to be toyed with, but has a huge heart. πŸ™‚

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      Definitely would like to hear more on this Sunny. I am so glad so are still here hanging on with the rest of us. You bring a light to the cave.

      • Draco

        Yes – more details please Sunny. We love stories.

      • Sunny

        Ok, a little more. It’s all so vague and so long ago and I am old and can’t remember like I used to. LOL.
        Good information for anyone coming out is what I told him above: be ready for the lash-back that is straight out of your own pc and ethics folders. They get gone through very thoroughly for anything they can use to a) save you b) shut you up c) make you look like a criminal.(I apologize to anyone I may have done this to… as a Case Supervisor sometimes we had to go through folders for people who had turned and determine course of action with the help of the ethics officer).
        Another good thing, which can backfire on you, but is best to do before walking out is determining who is your friend and has your back. I mentioned to Jason to make sure his wife was with him 100% on him leaving or they would try to put a wedge between them. I think he had told me she was backing him 100% and was relieved that he was getting out finally (I think both of them made it to OT V and found it to be crap).
        Soon after this, I found weird things going on around me, which I don’t know if they were related or not. I never had an ‘in your face” PI, but I know I was being watched and followed back then. And some strange phone calls from people pretending to be government officials trying to get information from me. They could have gone through my trash, I don’t know. They were definitely watching my house.

        • TheHoleDoesNotExist

          Oh my, Sunny. Of Course they were fair gaming you! Are you kidding – with a celeb and more importantly, a strong and vocal one like Jason – there is no doubt at all.

          Yes, OTV is IT for many. After OT3, a lot leave, but still hoping for Something – OTV is so ridiculous. If it wasn’t for the fact that Jill was my OTV auditor, I wouldn’t have stayed after the first session. But we were actually laughing so much so hard throughout the whole thing, she made it seem like an adventure. Well, you know how she was – could make anything seem like one you were tagging along on one of her Jewish Princess adventures.

          You bring up a good point about finding out who your real friends are – but it’s nearly impossible to find one that is still In and will back you 100% – especially now. Thanks for filling in more details. I hope that Under the Radars are reading the Bunker these days as part of a How To diary – how to leave, how to escape, how to plan, how to deal with it all.

          For anyone on the fence lurking out there, know this: No, it is Not just you. Yes, there really are no more than 25,000, maybe 12,000 active, members in the entire world. No, you are not an SP. Yes, it’s OK to have doubts. Yes, your doubts are valid. No, ALL the stats are False.

          • Sunny

            Jill could make anyone laugh. She was a funny lady.
            I made it to Step 16 of OT V. I know what you mean… pretty weird stuff.
            Yes, for those lurking, you would be surprised how many of your friends are lurking too…

          • Pepper

            Yes THDNE, OTV is ridiculous and is definitely not for everyone! I still remember the indoctrination step at the beginning when LRH writes that prayer stirs up BT’s. I recall thinking: He has to take that away from us too? Put it on the list of “not okay” things to do along with those listed out on KSW, like yoga, going to a chiropractor or taking an advil for Gods sake.

            I know that prayer is not for everyone but prayer and meditation is something I did pretty much my whole life, from the time I was very young and taught this by my Mom. I’ve come to the understanding that prayer is a form of meditation (for me) and it has always helped me to come to a place of peace and calm. Sorry I went off on a tangent here, we are talking about OTV!
            Thanks for the nice words of encouragement for us UTR lurkers.

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              Welcome and sorry late seeing this. Yes, it’s really nutso stuff. And yes, the longer you stay in, the more Hubbard will take away. In the end, he was afraid of his own shadow. So not a tangent. I forgot about the prayer pox, but remembered meditation and yoga. We all had to secretly “disagree” about a lot of stuff, didn’t we? No wonder we weren’t allowed to talk to each other.

              Anything or anyone that would help us, or be a comfort, or strengthen our basic survival instincts were especially pounced on and weeded out. What’s so ironic on your point is that relaxing, meditating in a way, and talking to another human being who cared is where most of us stumbled upon our “wins”. And then that very quality and benefit is slowly but surely stripped away, item by item.

            • Pepper

              Thank you THDNE. I appreciate your response.

          • Mymy88

            Yes, yes yes! Trust what ‘TheHoleDoesNotExist’ is saying. Doubt is not a crime. It is a survival mechanism. Use it simply by allowing it.

        • Pepper

          Wow Sunny, thanks so much for this story. Yes, there are plenty of us lurking…

          • aquaclara

            Good for you! When you’re ready, come tell us your story. In the meantime, lurk and comment away.

            And life outside is good. Very, very good.

            Good luck.

        • Lesa

          How difficult is it once you break free to acclimate yourself to normal daily life? All of the ex- members seem to show so much clarity and appear to realize the unhealthy hold that the COS had over them once they broke loose. I would think years and years of the treatment you received would cause, at the very least, PTSD or depression, but the few people I have observed in Going Clear seemed to be adjusting quite well.

      • joan nieman

        Yes indeed,THDNE, and that light could just be the one at the end of the tunnel.

    • El Con Blubbard

      Jason Beghe was OT long before Scientology. He, like the rest of us, just did not know it and was convinced “OUR POWER” was something Scientology gave us.

      Thank you Jason Beghe – your videos were among the first videos I watched as I made my escape.

      They were awesome!!

  • Walter Mitty

    This one always makes me laugh:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwMGFteBQcc

    • KNMF

      now that’s acting.

    • Draco

      Love it. Come on JT, TC & KA – look how free this man is! He can make a joke about dear leader and he doesn’t have to pay for a sec check!

      • Ben Franklin

        If DM farted, JT, TC & KA would all tell him how great it smelled.

        • rom661

          Yeah, that’s probably true. The really pathetic thing is that they might actually believe it.

        • Bavarian Rage

          Ewww! Crude, but still worthy of a “slow cap”! πŸ˜‰

    • Scream Nevermore

      He’s a baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaad man! I like him!

    • valshifter

      He jokes about it but there might be some truth to it. people do crazy things for money all the more so for millions. (Dave) up to the hand in the pocket might be true, not so much the octopus hand in the movies.

    • joan nieman

      Priceless!

    • I forgot all about that one!! Too funny!

    • ComeToPresentTime

      I saw that this was a tease for a much longer video, but can’t seem to find the longer video that this was teasing.. Does it not exist?

  • Eivol Ekdal

    His Town
    “WHEN MARTY RATHBUN BECAME AN OUTSPOKEN DEFECTOR FROM THE CHURCH OF SCIENTOLOGY, A GROUP OF FILMMAKERS BEGAN TO DISRUPT LIFE IN HIS ADOPTED HOMETOWN. BUT THEY WEREN’T COUNTING ON THE RESPONSE OF HIS NEIGHBORS.”
    http://www.texasmonthly.com/story/his-town

  • 1subgenius

    I continue to wonder if Jason ever got his files back.

  • Gerard Plourde

    Marty was just on the Today Show talking about the “Hole” and OSA’s role in the Cruise/Kidman divorce.

  • kemist

    Perhaps that interview will be aired now, along with others.

    Come on 20/20, let’s swarm over this motherfucking cult until it can’t even keep up with its ridiculous threatening letters.

  • PickAnotherID

    Now that “Going Clear” has cleared the decks, so to speak, maybe 20/20 will grow a pair and air the original interview.

  • valshifter

    DJ Mom Jeans is very angry, about Going Clear. Sorry if you seen it I just came across.
    http://uproxx.com/filmdrunk/2015/02/famous-scientologist-danny-masterson-is-very-angry-about-going-clear/

    • bromo

      Thanks for the link. The writer says what is important. It is not the belief it is the practices (although I tend to us the word behavior.)

    • Scream Nevermore

      Does anyone really care what that tit thinks??

      • One Human

        He THINKS? Oh, you mean like Jaden?

        • Scream Nevermore

          OK, does anyone really care about the nonsense that tit spews out every time he opens his trap?? πŸ˜‰

          • One Human

            The role of Hyde was my favorite on “That 70’s Show”, damn the clams!

            • Scream Nevermore

              I’ve never watched it!

  • Jason was the most entertaining speaker in the movie. He did what few celebrities involved in $cientology have done. He was a movie star (in “G.I. Jane” with Demi Moore) who dived whole-heartedly into the cult, becoming a top auditor and ignoring his career, then realized it was crap and got out and resurrected his career bigger than ever. He’s a force of nature and always tremendous onscreen. I knew so many stars over the years whose careers dived downhill the more they got into the cult, and they never recovered like Jason did. A whole lot of $cientology celebrities could learn from him, if they only would.

    • One Human

      Skip, was Demi still visibly involved at that point?

      • I never knew she was involved. I have never been interested in Demi Moore beyond her performance in Ghost.

        • One Human

          From what I understand, she wasn’t highly visible but did a number of courses. It has been suggested that Bruce Willis was very displeased with her involvement, especially after they became parents.

          • Ella Raitch

            Didn’t she go kabbalah too?

            • One Human

              A lifelong dabbler perhaps.

            • villagedianne

              Oh Yes very much so. According to the book by Madonna’s brother, Ashton and Demi were part of an exclusive weekly Kaballah study group taught by one of it’s most prominent Rabbis.

          • Sounds about right. The hypnotist that counseled those two used to write Scientology processes that Hubbard used, which makes it particularly ironic.

            • villagedianne

              Please tell us more. I’m very interested in finding out which Scientology processes were appropriated by Hubbard but were really the work of others.

            • Some “creative processing” stuff, but I doubt you or I or anyone will ever nail down specific steals of each new set of $cientology bullshit. David Mayo invented NOTS from all accounts I’ve heard, after Elwrong wrecked his motorcycle riding on rain-soaked streets very late at night after people warned him against it. Maybe someone should (or has?) compiled a list of “where it really came from” but I haven’t seen it.

            • villagedianne

              Thanks Skip. Even if you can’t nail it down your recollections are valuable in themselves, and may stimulate others to remember similar instances. This is the kind of thing that more recent defectors need to hear about so they don’t go on believing in the supposed greatness of the “Old man”.

            • It’s one of the things I’m going to write about in the future so I don’t want to be more specific about the hypnotist, but I found it astonishing at the time then remembered all the other things I’d found out over decades about Hubbard’s larceny, so it wasn’t hard to believe.

            • villagedianne

              I’m looking forward to reading your book. I’ll bet it will have something for both the serious Scientology-watcher and the more general reader.

            • Thanks. I regret to mention it any more because I feel like I should just shut up since it’s not complete. But you’re correct about content, and it’s not really about $cientology, just encompasses a lot of those years.

            • Orglodyte

              Ava and Charles Berner: Study tech. Jack Horner: repetitive processes. Gordon Bell: By-passed charge, and he put together the Grades. Jan and Richard Halpern: TRs. All from ESMB, especially Alan Walter’s thread “Pandora’s Box.” I’ve read that the Berners presented Study Tech to LRH with pride, and the next day he claimed it as a discovery of his own in a lecture they were attending! Putting’ the “hub” in hubris indeed.

            • villagedianne

              Thanks Orglodyte. And those are just the examples we know about.

        • Ben Franklin

          Kind of makes me wonder if a several actors and actresses who have appeared in movies with Tom Cruise have had a brush with Scientology at one point or another. Was Penelope Cruiz ever involved with Scientology?

          • splog

            Briefly. Only fact I know is she was in the front row at Tom’s OT V graduation

            • valshifter

              I so would like to know what she knows. they probably make her sing papers to kip it hush.

          • Scream Nevermore
          • I’ve read reports of Lil Tommy having Volunteer Ministers on the set. Don’t know about Cruz, don’t care.

            • Scream Nevermore
            • Thanks for that. Tommy the know-it-all turd. —

              Cruise: I’m a helper. For instance, I myself have helped hundreds
              of people get off drugs. In Scientology, we have the only successful
              drug rehabilitation program in the world. It’s called Narconon.

              SPIEGEL: That’s not correct. Yours is never mentioned among the
              recognized detox programs. Independent experts warn against it because
              it is rooted in pseudo science.

              Cruise: You don’t understand what I am saying. It’s a
              statistically proven fact that there is only one successful drug
              rehabilitation program in the world. Period.

            • Scream Nevermore

              He’s such an irritating shithead!

            • I heard at one point that people were instructed on a set to not look at him unless he looked at them. I also heard from a producer of a Katie movie that Cruise was “very nice” to cast and crew. But then, he’s an ACTOR, isn’t he? Unlike some, I don’t think Cruise would be just fine if he got de-hypnotized from $cientology. He’s so far into the evil he’s a clone of Miscavige, an arrogant Napoleon, a louse on lifts. I can’t stand watching him in any film, he’s such a fake personality.

            • Scream Nevermore

              He’s made such big, sweeping public statements about how wonderful Scientology is, that I don’t think he will ever be forgiven, no matter how many oceans of crocodile tears he may cry in future. His ‘big beings’ speech to Nazanin Bondiani was a glimpse at the ‘real’ him, and it’s not nice.

            • Semper Phi

              I volunteered at a couple of benefit dinners for the 9/11 rescue workers detox center that TC started in NYC. We weren’t allowed to speak his name, only refer to him as “The Co-Founder.” And then we were told to stay away from him and not talk to him at all. We weren’t even allowed into the room to hear the speeches. Any really compassionate human being, however famous, who knew there were a couple dozen people working all day for free to make his dinner a success, would have made it a point to give us some sort of personal acknowledgment. I don’t even remember that he thanked us during his speech.
              Now, Dennis Leary was at the first dinner I worked at, in 2004. After I nearly collided with him going through a door, he couldn’t have been more gracious and friendly. Totally opposite to The Co-Founder.

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              It’s almost like Tom Cruise is just ACTING the role of a nice guy.

            • Wow, what a story. There’s the real Tom Cruise, may his career end swiftly.

            • Anonymous

              Big Beings cannot be dragged down by little beings…that is the history of this universe, don’t you know?

              Tom just wants to help…can’t we all just get along?

            • CobGatYour$$

              My sister has been in for 40 years. By our humble and conservative estimations she has sunk 2-3 million, YES MILLION, in ABD IS NOT OT7. Furthermore she is being disfigured by a very curable type of cancer. What writings tell them not to get treatment? Can anyone tell me? How much does it take to go OT7? Oh, now she has to redo it all?!

            • Anonymous

              I’m sorry to hear about your sister.

              Unfortunately, much of the Scientology rantings of L. Ron Hubbard are anti-medicine and anti-psychiatry. It is part of the culture of the organization and is infused in his books, taped lectures and other written materials.

              At the same time (like much of Scientology teaching) there are also small pieces of contradictory material also by Hubbard which recommend such things as “if you are ill, see a doctor.”

              Such contradictory maundering are tiny in proportion to the other material and appear to exist simply so that Scientology can point to them and say “see…we are not really anti-medicine”

              Also…the answer to “how much does it take to go OT7?”…is frequently as much money as a person has or can borrow.

              That is the insidious and evil nature of Scientology…by design the organization is structured to exploit virtually everyone that becomes involved of most of their money and / or time…and frequently both.

              Those that figure this out before they are destroyed financially or become to old to make a change frequently flee the church and seek to warn warn others.

            • Well, NOTS34, “The Sequence for Handling a Physical Condition” is one of the more explicit documents. Dunno which OT level this is run at.

              https://www.cs.cmu.edu/~dst/NOTs/commentary/nots34-oconnor.txt
              http://www.holysmoke.org/cos/nots34-criminals.htm

            • This apes the classic Hubbard approach – truth by assertion.

            • Captain MustSavage

              Yeah, he’s a nincompoop alright. I feel angriest at the media though when I see things like this because they never seem to press for details. Eg Tell us more about those statistics, mr cruise. where were the studies conducted? We’re randomised control trials use? Have they been published in peer reviewed journals?

              Asking scientologists for details and keeping on asking for specific details is like dousing a vampire in sunlight. It will kill a scientologist’s wacky claims stone dead. Hopefully after GC, more journalists will do their homework thoroughly before interviews. The ones that do are amazing to watch… Anderson Cooper, Nathan Baca (what a legend), and Bryan Seymour come to mind.

            • Anderson Cooper interviewing those idiot ex-wives was a joy to behold, particularly his reactions, and in dealing with that little viper Jenny Linson. Fact is, no one is scared of $cientology and their soulless lawyers any more. And since Farrakhan turned on his old buddy Obama and has now steered the Nation of Islam toward the cult, he won’t get any help from the administration. Scientology has its back up against a wall, and there are angry people with diamond drills on the other side.

            • arcinva

              If only American interviewers pushed as much as that Der Spiegel writer did.

            • villagedianne

              I guess the reporter just had a misunderstood word.

          • arcinva

            I think the tabloids said part of the reason they didn’t last was because she wouldn’t join and was a devout Catholic.

            • Sherbet

              I thought she was a practicing Buddhist.

            • arcinva

              Oops… you are right.

  • Panopea Abrupta

    Hey Davey,
    You may be dressed to the nines but Dante’s nine circles of hell await you.
    The cat-o-nine tails speaks of perfect punishment.

    No cloud nine for you, DM, nor nine lives.
    Possession is nine tenths of the law and possessed you are – by vindictiveness, by violence, by nastiness, by arrogance, by viciousness and meanness of spirit, by stupidness, by Loch Ness where Crowley had his house and, worst of all, $cientologyness
    Nine is strongly associated with the Chinese dragon, a symbol of magic and power. There are nine forms of the dragon, it is described in terms of nine attributes, and it has nine children. It has 117 scales – 81 yang and 36 yin. All three numbers are multiples of 9 (9Γ—13=117, 9Γ—9=81, 9Γ—4=36.)
    May nine times nine times nine dragons follow you and hound you and track you, fire-breath upon you, evil eyes above you, sharp claws behind you, great hunger upon you. May all the wealth you gather be greater than Croesus, than Gates and Buffett together, and may it not be enough to pay the physics you need to heal you, the guards you need to protect you or the lawyers you need to plead for you. May the poverty of your spirit weigh down upon you like unto mountains crushing you. May the desolation and waste you cast surround you in the long sorrows and deep shadows of your days.

    Nine days, Davey.
    A mere nine days.

    The Countdown con-tinues, TICK TOCK
    Quake in your very perfect John Lobbs.

    • Draco

      Standing O, Pan. You have outdone yourself!

      • Draco

        And PS…I would fucking fly to the US to watch you debate with David Miscavige. All the Shermanspeak in the world would not help him and it would be delightful to see you annihilate him with your words.
        (Y’all might have noticed I have a little thing about Pan and her words…)

        • i-Betty

          Yes, yes, YES! Pan would own Davey with a mere flick of the wrist. I’m going to dream about this tonight.

    • flexible

      So good..

  • KNMF

    One of Beghe’s greatest hits was when he and Tony went to the door of the NY Org during a protest. Sinatra track. Epic.

    • Juicer77

      Do tell, for us newbies πŸ™‚

      • KNMF
        • Pepsicat

          Oh hell, that was awesome!

        • TheHoleDoesNotExist

          A thing of beauty.

        • 1subgenius

          Everyone needs to see this to see how to deal with Scientology bullshit and bullying.
          Beghe for the win.

        • Juicer77

          Superlative song choice. Very meaningful. Mr. Beghe knew exactly what to say. I had no idea he was so active when he first left the Co$, what a smart and big-hearted guy.

        • NOLAGirl

          …….

        • chukicita

          Love how Vinnie Bag-O-Donuts couldn’t even LOOK at Jason!

          The “I smell…” comment I’m thinking referenced the ecclesiastical frothing of the president of the church of scientology new york, john carmichael in the faces of some anons just 3 days earlier:

          http://blogs.villagevoice.com/runninscared/2008/05/ny_scientology.php

          • KNMF

            glad you pointed out the “smell pussy” reference, and that It was originated by scilon clergy.

          • TheHoleDoesNotExist

            Bag O Donuts, lawl.

        • Mrs. V.

          Loved it!

      • Draco

        Thanks I was going to ask too πŸ™‚

    • 1subgenius

      I miss those filthy foul-mouthed glorious bastards.
      Gotta find their “12 Days of Christmas” protest chant.

      • i-Betty
        • 1subgenius

          Thanks, but not the one.

          • i-Betty

            Found it πŸ™‚

            https://youtu.be/DG3O8dO6XpQ

            • 1subgenius
            • WildaBeast

              I got to the seventh day of Christmas before I lost it completely. This is worth being late for class for, especially because I’m still sick and now I have an ear infection and I still have to go and I’m PISSED. So I needed that.

            • Sherbet

              Aw, poor Beastie.

            • i-Betty

              Poor thing! Get better very soon.

            • rom661

              I agree with the idea but I suspect passers by found this offensive in the extreme and it may have generated sympathy for the cult. Wonder what the wise bearded man would think of it….

            • God

              most nerds get it

            • rom661

              I really don’t know what the hell that meant.

            • God

              They nailed it

            • God

              Command intention every one of them πŸ™‚

            • i-Betty

              Yup πŸ™‚

      • KNMF

        “come out and represent your butt church”

        • 1subgenius

          iB found it, see below.

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        A holiday classic at our house! Glorious, indeed.

  • I hadn’t known that Jason had such a huge impact, as I hadn’t started following Scientology until 2010.

    Great work Jason!

  • Draco

    Just what the doctor ordered after a lousy week – a little Jason Beghe. I am not surprised that he stirred the pot when he left. “Bring it on” indeed.

  • Jack99

    Well, well… Looking through an old issue of Freedom, from 2007, and finding the film review of No Country for Old Men.

    “Somewhere in Texas a man stumbles upon the remnants of a drug deal gone wrong and a case containing two million dollars. He takes the money. He shouldn’t have. That man is for some strange reason played by Josh Brolin. Really, if they wanted lean and rugged, they should have asked Jason Beghe, the modern equivalent of Gary Cooper. As the bad guy they hired some Spanish guy. This is the sort of role that John Travolta can do in his sleep. The directors, the Coen brothers, clearly have no clue. The job should have been given to Paul Haggis. His amazing film, Crash, just won the Oscar for best film, and he even wrote a James Bond. Haggis can do it all!
    The story itself is not that interesting, just some nihilistic nonsense. It’s based on a novel by Cormac McCarthy. What is wrong with LRH?, I must ask. He has written more novels than Battlefield Earth, you know. Audiences are dying to see more of his work. But no, bigoted Hollywood doesn’t care about that. Big Pharma wouldn’t let them. And people are wondering why box office revenue is in decline… Grade: F”

    • Draco

      Heh heh. Thanks Jack99 πŸ™‚

    • Juicer77

      LOLOLOL!

    • sugarplumfairy

      What.. No role for kirstie?

      • Jack99

        The film reviewer screwed up. Krusty could have played the 20something girlfriend.

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        Oh hi. Do you have a film review I missed? Really looking forward to your deep thoughts on this one.

        • sugarplumfairy

          No.. Didn’t want to spoil it for anyone else.. I just noted that the show I went to was standing room only and that the movie itself was definitely worth waiting for..

          My sister came away from the the movie wanting to know more.. She’s been on her iPad since last night, reading me stories, reviews, comments.. She’s hooked..

          • i-Betty

            Nat took her sister and was worried beforehand that she wouldn’t ‘get it’, but she really, really ‘got it’ πŸ™‚

      • Draco

        No Country for Old Men

        Even at her worst, she has never been mistaken for an old man πŸ˜€

        • Ella Raitch

          I would rather she got the end that Kelly McDonald got in the film.

    • generic sock account

      Priceless, friendo.

    • Tsk. Besides the Battlemission Earth stuff, Hubbard didn’t write that many novels. For example, Fear is only a novella in length. Galaxy Press has quite a padding job to fill a whole book with Hubbard’s shorter works. Even critics rarely examine the myth that Hubbard was a prolific writer, but compared to contemporaries, it was nothing to write home about. (From the Robert M. Ford interview, he was a very lazy writer.)

      • Jack99

        His other novels were never published, because it would create a lot of jealousy.

      • scottmercer

        Exacy. Most of his “works” were short stories. Most of his Sci writings qere transcribed from lectures. He never published 1000 books. Does anyone have a true account of his published writings?

      • “Nothing to write home about!” What?

        Hubbard’s short story titles speak for themselves – titles like, “They Killed Him Dead!”, “Killer Ape”and “Man for Breakfast”. http://www.wiseoldgoat.com/papers-scientology/hubbard_fiction_of_lrh_chrono-list.html

        No… really… Hubbard wrote a short story entitled, “They Killed Him Dead!”
        (Detective Fiction Weekly, Vol. 101, No. 6, May 2, 1936: pp. 116-126)

        Some more padding is now being done by having Hubbard’s limp screenplays novelised, and short stories expanded by jobbing writers like Kevin J Anderson (who collaborated with Brian Herbert on the less-than-brilliant ‘new Dune series’) and Dave Wolverton, but you have to go to Bridge Publications sites to keep up with this.

        • ze moo

          I rather liked the ‘new dune series’. The trilogy about the Butlerian ‘jihad’ was quite good.

          Lroon kept telling people what a great author he was, when in reality, he was a hack. He just smoozed some editors and got his penny a word crap published. I have never been impressed with his characters or his inability to be creative. While the clampire touts his sci-fi stuff, he besmirched all the genres he tried to inhabit. Hubbtard never got past his 9th grade education and vocabulary. ‘They Killed Him Dead’……at least they didn’t half kill him dead twice.

    • i-Betty

      Jack’s Rotten Cabbage Reviews!

      • Jack99

        What? No, the Freedom film reviewer wrote this. Not me.

        • i-Betty

          I apologise πŸ˜›

    • rom661

      Didn’t see the movie. The book was more than enough for me.

      • Jack99

        It’s a great novel. There’s no need to see the film, really. But, as film adaptations go, it’s one of the best.

    • rom661

      I think the key sentence is “What is wrong with LRH?”

  • Fred G. Haseney

    Jason Beghe and Alex Gibney’s film Going Clear

    As I’ve written before, I got into Scientology in 1977 and got out in 2014. My first auditing session (spiritual counseling) occurred in 1977 with the Hubbard Qualified Scientologist (“HQS”) course in which a student teams up with another student and co-audits (without an e-meter). Later, I didn’t make it very far on their “Bridge to Total Freedom” because I couldn’t afford it, financially. The prices for auditing kept going up and up and up.

    All of this may have worked out in my favor, because without auditing, Scientology Inc. (“SI”) didn’t have a chance to f*ck me up. Don’t get me wrong: back in the old days with L. Ron Hubbard still around, auditing went well and I had spiritual benefits. With David Miscavige, leader of SI, came an alteration of auditing technology that endangers the person being audited. One such alteration that comes to mind is the definition of the “floating needle,” something an e-meter does to indicate that the person receiving auditing is doing well; its also indicates when an auditing session should be ended (finished or completed, at least for that day).

    By messing with the technology, Scientology Inc. puts at risk people receiving spiritual counseling. Alex Gibney’s film Going Clear tells me that Scientology Inc. messed Jason Beghe up spiritually and they didn’t fix what they broke. They threw “the poster boy for Scientology” (as declared by Miscavige) to the birds; they left his carcass (spiritually-speaking) lying by the side of the road. All this for a great guy who spent around $1 million in support of SI.

    • Draco

      That was no “carcass” running around rallying the troops and encouraging people to speak out. They could never fix what they broke because scientology is not set up that way, before or after DM. You need to do a bit more research on “the good old days”.
      Jason Beghe fixed himself up just fine – no auditing required.

      • Fred G. Haseney

        I hear you, Draco. I’m not referring to Scientology’s “good old days”; I only know from my experience, although I’ve read plenty to now believe that I may have benefited from something that Hubbard may have formulated from Black Magic.

        Going Clear shows a strong Jason Beghe who has bounced back, but it also shows a spirit that Scientology Inc. trampled on.

    • flyonthewall

      Auditing and sci processes have damaged people and driven them insane from the very beginning

      • Fred G. Haseney

        Okay, flyonthewall. I didn’t write this to advocate Scientology; please understand that.

        • flyonthewall

          Not looking to start my morning with an argument Fred. Hope you have a good one

          • Fred G. Haseney

            You, too, flyonthewall.

            • generic sock account

              Worst fight ever.

            • what’suppressive

              I know right. What the fuck am I gonna do with all this popcorn?

            • generic sock account

              Give me some of it? You had popcorn this whole time? Wtf man?

            • i-Betty

              *mouth open*

            • Fred G. Haseney

              Hello, i-Betty. After a day at work, I read again this great section of comments.

              “Worst. Fight. Ever.”

              I never had this much fun in Scientology; thanks Bunkerites!

            • i-Betty

              They’re a funny lot, Fred πŸ˜€

            • Fred G. Haseney

              Generic sock account and what’s suppressive… thanks so much for the early morning cheering!

    • i-Betty

      Thanks for posting that, Fred. It can be slightly harder here for those who speak of the good old days and talk about Corporate Scientology being the bad guy, the twister of the tech, if only they hadn’t messed with purity of Ron’s finely tuned machine, etc. I think the Bunker is one of the only places where people of all bents can congregate and exchange views, but there will always be a slight tensing of the shoulders when the ‘old days’ are spoken of with any positive inflection.

      But I don’t think that’s what you’re saying here, at least it’s not the point of your comment.

      • Fred G. Haseney

        You got that, i-Betty. At one point, Alex Gibney’s film Going Clear focuses for a lingering moment on Jason Beghe’s fractured spirit; it’s enough to fracture mine.

        • i-Betty

          Oh, bless you πŸ™

  • A picture of Beghe and Rathbun that surfaced on the forums is what first motivated a group of us to reach out to Marty.

    • Juicer77

      Us being who? (that could be read a couple ways here πŸ˜‰

  • Pepsicat

    I’m just wondering after reading this post and seeing the video that KNMF just posted, has anyone ever walked with Jason Beghe down the street? And when you did, did you hear a clang, clang,clang?

    • i-Betty

      As a Brit I’m not sure I get the reference but I’m really hoping we’re talking about steel balls.

      • bromo

        Betty, my state of reference would be brass balls, but I think you are on target with his being made of steel!

        • Pepsicat

          Steel, brass…just not made of the usual stuff.

          • One Human

            Titanium.

        • i-Betty

          Whoop!

        • chukicita

          I think they must be solid gold.

          • shasha40

            Platinum ?…Titanium ?

            • i-Betty

              Do we need to build underground vaults (upside-down cathedrals – thank you, John Sweeney) for Jason Beghe’s balls?

            • shasha40

              YES!!! πŸ˜€

          • TheHoleDoesNotExist

            Jason doesn’t strike me as that kind of guy. I’m going with Rock. Balls of Rock. Because, well you know.

            • NOLAGirl

              Science Doc needs to come school us on the strongest form of rock. πŸ™‚

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              School of Rock? Science Doc is Jack Black? I knew it!

            • Scream Nevermore

              Granite?

            • NOLAGirl

              Granite balls. I like it. πŸ™‚

            • chukicita

              Yes. I think you’re right. Rock on!

    • bromo

      Real life LOL. And I give up drinking coffee here this morning as I cannot afford a new computer right now.

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      If so, I’d like to record that please.

      • i-Betty

        Ringtone. Oh, and alarm clock. I could probably reconfigure my front doorbell, too.

    • Chee Chalker

      How sad is it that the first thing I thought of “……went the trolley….ding ding ding went the bell……”

      • Sherbet

        Don’t feel bad, Chee. I thought it was a reference to the Chicago Fire show. Let me insert a great big DUH! here.

        • Chee Chalker

          Steel balls.never entered my mind…….what is wrong with me!!!
          I had a professor in school who used to say “get your mind out of the gutter…..so mine can float on by”

          • Sherbet

            LOL. Whatever’s wrong with you is also wrong with me. Of course, now that I know what Pepsicat was talking about, I’m howling with laughter.

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        Well, it sure made me laugh!

      • Miss Tia

        i thought that too!

  • And there was the incident where YouTube just happened to nuke Mark Bunker’s video channel before the full three hour Jason Beghe interview was added.

    Anti-Scientology crusader vaporized from YouTube April 24, 2008, Cade Metz, The Register

  • shasha40

    Unfortunately , I have yet to see the movie , but Jason Beghe’s video was mind blowing ( and he is easy on the eyes , am I right Ladies ? ;). ) ,and I loved his colorful exclamation words ! ” Show me a M*ther F*cking Clear !!! ” . I’ve been down the rabbit hole ever since .

    • Draco

      Very easy on the eyes and ears. Love that gravel in the voice…(swoons)

      • shasha40

        Oh , yeah ! πŸ™‚

      • i-Betty

        That voice. *Toe curl*

        • shasha40

          Now I need a fan ! Lol

        • Rita Gregory

          Yes, that voice. Sigh.

      • rom661

        Owen Meany (from the John Irving novel)

    • what’suppressive

      Monkey shines is good. A George A Romero film from the 80’s

      • shasha40

        That is one of my all time Favorites ! I am a horror fan , actual suspense , not gore .

  • Draco
  • Soggydog

    I’m looking to join others in the Kailua Kona (I’m in the South Kona District) area to watch Going Clear on March 29. If you’re hosting a viewing party, please respond here. Or, if you’re interested in getting a hotel room to watch, I’m game to share the cost.

  • Toner Ed

    Notoriously, I miss very important answers in this blog.

    A) Why isn’t Diana Hubbard or her siblings in charge of Scientology?
    B) Why is she and her siblings no part of the HBO documentary or Wright’s book? Why were they not interviewed? Suzette and Arthur are not at the Int Base, it should be easy to contact them.
    C) Why did Suzette and Arthur leave the Sea Org? Why did nobody ask them?
    D) Besides Beghe, who else was interviewed by ABC?
    E) WHY was that ABC interview by Ms. Vagas not aired and when did it actually take place? Did the ABC conclude that the interviewed persons didn’t speak the truth? HBO isn’t afraid of lawsuits, and I conclude the same applies to ABC. They have 160 lawyers too.

    • Ben Franklin

      In answer to your first question as to why Diana Hubbard or her siblings are not in charge? It is because David Miscavige is in charge. For more details, see:

      http://www.scientology-cult.com/marty-rathbun/374-how-david-miscavige-crushed-l-ron-hubbards-family.html

      • Toner Ed

        That makes no sense to me. One guy airs his opinion and everyone is satisfied with it?

        • splog

          Yes. That’s exactly how it is. Looks to me like you’re missing the vital piece of the puzzle.

          If that one guy is Josef Satlin, or Pol Pot, or Jim Il Yung, or Bob Mugabe, or Putin – who’s gonna argue with him? You?

          • Toner Ed

            I find it sad that you are so easily satisfied. I find campaigning against the Scientology very silly but without wanting to know about Scientology not silly. I haven’t seen the HBO documentary but if Alex Gibney didn’t try to interview at least one of the Hubbard kids, it is not a good documentary.

            • Scream Nevermore

              You do know that Thursday is stats day, don’t you?

            • i-Betty

              Snap!

            • Scream Nevermore

              We pulled that in, by wondering where they all were yesterday! πŸ˜‰

            • Sure, but that’s just your opinion, and I – for one – am not going to be particularly satisfied by it, rather I will find out for myself and go see the documentary.

              Please stick around πŸ™‚

            • Douglas D. Douglas

              Silly is as silly does, TE. Are the gloves coming off, or do you not possess the mad skills you imagine?

            • i-Betty

              You realise it’s Friday today, right? You’re late πŸ™‚

            • Douglas D. Douglas

              Hee hee.

            • Dr. Hunky Jimpjorps

              Why would they be relevant? None of them have been involved in the operations of the church for decades, if at all. They’ve been marginalized for over thirty years.

            • If they had any significance I would have expected them to be featured in the videos taken by events run by Captain David “he is NOT insane!” Miscavige. Yet, if they are I haven’t heard of them. Any counter examples more than welcome.

              Happily, one of the things I’m looking forward to in “Going Clear” is excerpts from DM’s videos. I hope they’re half as good as this one advocating violence (what a great way to spend tax payers’ money, eh?)

              http://www.xenu-directory.net/topics/miscavige-vs-psychiatry.html

              “Accordingly, if not poetically, where better to begin a year-end review than with our 2006 campaign to break the dark spell cast across Earth by psychiatry. By way of a recap, that campaign was expressly-maybe even diabolically-engineered to ignite both government action and media blizzard. It’s also got an internal kicker: our Mental Health Budget Adjustment Kit which essentially works like a smart bomb in that it sniffs out psych fuel lines and blows the funding mechanism. And in that way, to put it bluntly, we booby trap the whole psychiatric ecosystem. “

            • Sherbet

              Oh, brother! What a bunch of horse-puckey.

            • One Human

              Ah, the troll mask is slipping;

            • dungeon master

              How do you know he didn’t?

            • Douglas D. Douglas

              None of the Hubbard kids were interviewed for those vile “documentaries” that Freedom Magazine has been posting. Doesn’t mean a thing one way or another.

            • Toner Ed

              Maybe not for the regular posters on this blog but regular people find it odd that HBO reports on Hubbard but not about his children who are still alive and who might have a lot to say.

            • Douglas D. Douglas

              “Regular people?” Consumers of All Bran?

              As far as it goes, you received a very cogent answer from the owner of this site. Stop beating the dead horse.

            • Toner Ed

              I spent 2 hours watching the videos on the Freedom Magazine because you mentioned it. I had overlooked these videos. If these data are true, HBO has bad sources. If they are not true, why don’t the sources sue?

            • Douglas D. Douglas

              And then there is the third possibility– no one cares about the lunatic ravings of the “official sources” of the Church of Scientology.

            • And yet, here you are.

              Here’s an ex-victim of the criminal organisation known as the “church” of $cientology, speaking up in public. Remind me, how is Captain David “he is NOT insane!” Miscavige doing on the speaking up in public bit?

              http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEIvoKT7bVw

              Mr Rathbun says : “I realised that I only became free when I took all that, and they got everything that I did out there – OK – and I realised that blacmail is no longer powerful when the truth is told”

            • Curiously, critics typically know more about Scientology than Scientologists

              I understand that Scientologists have to avoid talking about their experience to each other (“Verbal Tech”) or finding out anything at all about higher levels (learning the OT3 !Xenu” story will apparently give you pneumonia).

              What kind of Church expects members to accept all of its doctrine sight unseen? The only comparable situation I have come across was the ancient Cult of Mithras.

              Also, if you haven’t seem the film, you can’t really comment on its quality, can you?

            • Toner Ed

              That is hard to believe. Nobody of you knows why just one Hubbard kid is still left in the SO. You assume you know it but nobody interviewed the adult children.

            • I said more about Scientology – about doctrines such as OT3 (the Xenu story). I didn’t mention Hubbard’s children.

              Most people assume Scientologists know about their own beliefs, but almost nobody in the Church is aware of its ‘advanced’ teachings, and are not allowed to even try to find out.

              I admit this is hard to believe, but there it is. Scientologists are typically only aware of a small fraction of the teachings of their own religion.

            • splog

              Why is that? Hubbard’s kids are not the subject of Alex’s film. The current actions of the cult *is* the subject of the film.

            • Toner Ed

              But HBO also reported about Hubbard, right?

            • splog

              Of course they reported about Hubbard, it was Hubbard that started the scam, and scientology is all.about.hubbard. The current CoS is all.about.miscavige.Hubbard’s kids are not important – scientology isn’t and never was a monarchy with father -> son succession built in. So please, let it go already.

              You are just a troll, and not a very good one.

        • Juicer77

          It was a carefully planned and micro-managed takeover by a very crafty individual. He gambled on it working, and it did.

        • dungeon master

          Lurk moar places.. U r sadly under read.

        • Ben Franklin

          Toner Ed, Just for analogy sake, if two people went to rob a bank, and one of the people involved recounted what happened during the robbery, why would I doubt what the person is saying unless it sounded totally ridiculous and untrue?

          • Toner Ed

            If you would be able to pull more strings concerning that bank robbery, I would, but you are saying you would not.

            • Ben Franklin

              Toner Ed, What is your reason for doubt?

            • Ben Franklin

              Toner, How would you know if the person was lying about what happened if you were not there in person to begin with? So far the story seems to be corroborated by facts which makes it believable

        • Angry Elf

          It seems you need to do some research. There is more to this story than meets the eye and the one thing to remember is that Scientology is always worse than you think. And the members of this blog know more about this organization than anyone. Me excluded.

          • Toner Ed

            Yes, I have to do more research but it appears that you are not as knowledgeable than you think you are. You are angry and that might cloud your judgement.

            • Douglas D. Douglas

              (Angry is just part of his name. Like “Tone” is part of yours. It’s just, you know, a name.)

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      If any of the Hubbard family Wanted an interview, you can be certain they would be interviewed. That’s a clue.

      • Toner Ed

        A good journalist would try to find answers not wait if somebody comes to him on their own.

        • Scream Nevermore

          How do you know they’ve not been approached, and declined to speak? Being related to El Source would not save them if Mean Missy didn’t like what they said.

          • Sherbet

            Ix-nay on the oster-pay, Scream.

        • i-Betty

          Don’t be silly πŸ™‚

        • dungeon master

          Lurk moar..

        • generic sock account

          A good troll would be more effective at upsetting people. You have as much of a right to comment here as anyone else, but don’t think for a minute that the people here are stupid. No one is buying your weak game. You need to try harder.

          • Sherbet

            Oh, he said a GOOD journalist, Jimmy, like the ones at Freedom mag. Yes, Freedom is synonymous with the truth, as is every bit of media released from the church’s maw.

            • generic sock account

              Downthread, Jack99 pasted an excerpt of a 2007 Freedom Mag review of No Country For Old Men. Basically, the entire movie should’ve been Scientologists. It should’ve starred Jorm Tramolta and Jason Beghe, with Paul Haggis directing. It’s the funniest thing I’ve read in a long time.

            • Sherbet

              It was a hoot, sock. I’m wondering how many people read it and thought it was for real.

            • generic sock account

              If it’s on this fine journalismistic blog, it’s real.

            • Sherbet

              ‘zackly.

        • TheHoleDoesNotExist

          I hope that you find a soft place to land and someone caring waiting for you when you get there. It’s a damn tough earthquake to survive when you learn that what you were seeking and what you found was all a sham. Whatever benefits you got, cherish them, remember them, but never forget those “wins” came at the price of tens of thousands of shattered lives.

          It’s OVER. And there are many here waiting to help those who’ll be struggling with a terrible, dark wave of stark and raw facts. There’s going to be a lot of fear in being swept away and engulfed in this tsunami about to hit.

          How about we all just lay the pitchforks down and meet at some common ground. Most of us wanted help, and wanted to help others. In the end, that’s what really counts, isn’t it? So let’s all remember why we got sucked in in the first place – let’s all help each other now emerge from this mindf*ck and get on with it.

          If we can’t help each other now, in a time of real crisis, then what benefit is any of it in the end?

          http://i.imgur.com/wIx6B57.jpg

      • splog

        I have a teeny snippet of insider dope on interviewing Hubbard’s kids; yes, it’s hearsay but I have no reason to doubt the teller. I was told the story in 2001 or so.

        A friend of many years (still drinking Kool-Aid I’m afraid) worked at Int as an LRH PPRO (PR for Hubbard’s image) and was working on one of those awful Ron mags. It was one of the art-aligned issues and my friend got the idea that since Arthur was into the arts and ex-SO, interview him for the mag. He found Arthur and interviewed him, there was nothing particularly special in the result, just that Arthur was a nice guy and had some nice things to say.

        And then the shit-storm erupted. Excrement from way on high poured down, the shore story being that Hubbard’s family was off-limits for *anything* related to Scientology as Ron is the founder and his kids are just his kids. But in true Scientology style all way over the top. Followed up with a long stay in Ethics, of course.

    • Juicer77

      If you enter some of those names into the handy search box (right of this page, by the magnifying glass) you’ll find articles about these people mentioned in your question.
      As to why certain people were not in the documentary, it is POSSIBLE that Mr. Gibney attempted to contact them and was rebuffed. You are right to question everyone’s “facts.” That also applies to the Church of Scientology’s information. Fact-check theirs too. I hope you find the answers you really need, not only the ones you are looking for.

    • Douglas D. Douglas

      TE, in all sincerity, it is painfully obvious that, “notoriously” or not, you have not come to this blog seeking answers, but rather, to attempt to spread doubt and confusion. The problem for you is that most of us here have been witnesses to the puppet show for a very long time, and tactics you are employing are rather… old hat.

      You seem like a nice person. I hope you will stick around and continue to play nice. Really.

      • Sherbet

        That was wonderful, D3.

        • Douglas D. Douglas

          Aw shucks. I was really marking time until Tony (a real journalist) provided answers. And there it is (above)!

    • Tony Ortega

      Miscavige systematically marginalized Diana and the rest of the family. At Scientology’s website, you won’t find any references to L. Ron Hubbard even having any children. Diana spends most of her time at Int Base and has been relegated to a minor role. Suzette and Arthur refuse press requests. The three of them have been more focused on this of late…

      http://tonyortega.org/2014/08/16/after-a-years-delay-mary-sue-hubbards-house-is-on-the-market-for-2-5-million/

      (The house sold for $2.2 million.)

      As for Beghe’s interview in 2008, he was the only one interviewed at that time. But in 2012, 20/20 interviewed many of us for a special after the TomKat split, and that too was not aired. And you are very wrong. ABC is very afraid of lawsuits, and it’s the lawyers that have repeatedly torpedoed stories about Scientology there. I feel for Dan Harris, who is a good reporter but rarely gets a chance to dig into these stories.

      • generic sock account

        Disney goes out of its way to avoid offending people. Walt was famous for *cgghff* respecting people of all walks of life.

  • TheHoleDoesNotExist

    When Mr. Hole accompanied me to Pook’s stellar SP Party, the one where all the stars came out to shine, Kate Bornstein, Lawrence Wright, Professor Kent, our own JohnP, Mr Ortega, Paulette Cooper, Denise Brennan, Nancy Many, oh my the list went on – Mr. Hole had his geek on,

    He work this t-shirt that had a speaker, yes a speaker in the shirt and he carried around a tiny remote control that came with it. You could record a few short messages and then play them to a quite unexpecting crowd. In between the lobster cracking sounds up and down the tented tables in the backyard, Mr. Hole kept hitting one particular button that played “Show Me A M*Fuckin’ Clear!” It still cracks me up to this day when I think of it. Wow, now I find out more evidence of Jason’s awesomeness. How cool is that?!

    http://i.imgur.com/YbVfUQj.png?2

    • i-Betty

      That’s SO funny. Mr Hole rocks πŸ™‚

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        Did you see your mermaid picture?!!! You have to make a poster of it. I would! It’s awesome.

        • i-Betty

          I did, and I loved it πŸ™‚ Everyone should have their own Pan shoop. Especially those, like you, who do far more than simply have an old comment lifted from a forum.

          • TheHoleDoesNotExist

            Thanks you, and now you have given Pan a new business model! Honestly, can you imagine the line?

    • shasha40

      We need to get that on some t-shirts .

  • flyonthewall

    Ok, this is a new one. From Rinder’s blog today this guy says he experienced ” extreme butt-pain ” when doing TR-0 for the first time. Scientology is always worse than you think. http://www.mikerindersblog.org/david-braverman-a-too-familiar-story/

    • i-Betty

      I…what? Better head over there and read before I made further comment.

      So, David Braverman suffered real physiological pain as a response to his Scientology studies? I wonder how much of it – if anything – was just co-incidence. I mean, presumably the poor guy was sitting still for hours as he did TR-0?

      “I remember… grief, loneliness, foreboding” – poor man πŸ™

      • NOLAGirl

        Whatever his thoughts on the subject, I am just glad he’s out. That’s one less pocket for the Mini Furher to pick.

      • shasha40

        Where was tiny dick in all this ? Never mind , the butt hurt couldn’t be caused by that …

      • Sarcasmo

        Good morning,

        If you weren’t already aware, you’ve been quoted in the Boston Globe.

        http://www.bostonglobe.com/ideas/2015/03/19/scientology-enturbulating-lingo/TvBESMQkV4RcxGnyrNSH1K/story.html

        • Angry Elf

          When I read i-Betty’s quote in the Boston Globe, I immediately thought of the man who is featured on Mike Blinder’s blog and how he still uses the term “2D” to describe his relationship.

          • i-Betty

            Yes, that’s a perfect example.

      • It’s a well written article but for some reason, it smells of good roads and fair weather to me, like there’s still a gloss of culty dissonance over what is a very disturbing story of total betrayal.

        • i-Betty

          It was also tl:dr for many people, but let’s hope these are just the first baby steps for David and that he’ll be coming on a glamping trip this time next year with us SPs πŸ™‚

          • L. Wrong Hubturd

            Oh, glamping! I’ll bring the yurt.

            • i-Betty

              Darling, we would get on fabulously! *clink*

            • L. Wrong Hubturd

              I think we shall meet one day…*clink*

    • generic sock account

      That’s nothing new. Scientology has always been a pain in the ass.

      Thank you, thank you. I’ll be dodging tomatoes all week.

      • Bavarian Rage

        Best.Possible.Response. (Rises to feet with slow clap and cheesy grin) πŸ˜€

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        But, but … okay, I got nuthin’.

    • Bavarian Rage

      Whaaaa?! On my way over there now.

      • Ella Raitch

        tl,dr – the tech was fine….yawn

        • Sherbet

          Very interesting post, but, you’re right, there should be a flag in the text where non-tech people could stop reading before the Ron fawning began.

          • splog

            Odds are that 18 months from now David Braverman will be here at the bunker saying “WTF was I thinking???!!!???”, just like almost every other ex….

            • Sherbet

              Plenty of room in the Bunker. He can bring artisan bread and play the piano.

            • splog

              Artisan bread? With a nice ripe cheese and a good strong Belgian Ale?

              Dammit, now I have to the fridge

            • Douglas D. Douglas

              You bet. A little jazz, some good sourdough, and if he wants to ramble on about the Tech, we’ll be nice. Really.

            • Sherbet

              Speak for yourself. I’ll be off watering the plants.

            • NOLAGirl

              We probably should spruce this place up a bit. In 9 days we could have a lot of company. At the very least we know there will be a party. πŸ™‚

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              Double duty – you And Bury are going to be needed in the barkeeper lounge.

            • NOLAGirl

              I’ll have some frozen stuff pre-made in the freezer for the two hours I’m not here on the 29th. Once I pass out, someone else will have to take over. πŸ™‚

            • Sherbet

              I’d crochet some doilies, but, well, my carpal tunnel syndrome, you know…

            • NOLAGirl

              No crocheting for you Sherb. Just come party with us. ; )

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              Mr Hole just came in from battling the attack of the killer baby grasshoppers. There back this year,damnnit.

            • Sherbet

              Ew! It’s a plague unleashed by the god of scientology! We should have listened. lrh reigns. We are nothing. Quick; upload me a copy of Dianetics, and I’ll repent.

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              Oooh, throw in some brie and I’m there!

            • Ella Raitch

              Yep…I was thinking the same thing. He got out in 2014…early days yet, Pus he’s well off public, not slave-driven staff/sea org. This seems to make a huge difference.

        • what’suppressive

          He made the fatal mistake of thinking he was “going exterior” when really he was “bored out of his mind”

    • kemist

      Was it in the wallet region ?

      Dude, that was a warning of things to come.

    • rickiraccoon

      Did he ever consider his chair?

      • One Human

        That’s it, it was in a Scientology room.

    • Douglas D. Douglas

      Hmmmm. Most Scientologists experience butt-pain when they react to any form of criticism.

      Oh wait! That’s butt-hurt.

      Never mind.

    • Suzy

      That was a very long, detailed and good read. A good example of “frog in the boiling water” experience

    • The guy is out, but my hit from his long, well written letter is that he hasn’t really let the horror of what Hubbard did to him sink in. That’s gonna take more time. He’s trying to be all positive and cavalier about it. That, and they haven’t really gone after him yet. I’m sure they’re working on a smear page now that he’s spoken out, albeit in a very mild way.

      • Pepsicat

        It’s a process…give him time. He has learned and will keep learning how much the cherch has lied to him. Then he, like the rest of us, will realize that the founder was lying too.

    • Bury_The_Nuts

      Jesus, this guy wrote ‘war and peace’!

    • Probably good old anal cramp, caused by sitting still and tense for long periods of time.

      This can be agonising. There is more than most people want to know here: http://www.patient.co.uk/doctor/proctalgia-fugax-and-anal-pain

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        Some auditors would thankfully provide cushions for their auditing room chairs.

        I had “disappeared” this painful truth and fact – something every scientologist experiences –
        Scientology is a pain in the butt. A Real pain in the butt. Funny the things you Do forget:)

        • One Human

          So is a fart during drill an instant fail?

    • L. Wrong Hubturd

      Nobody asked me….

  • Sherbet

    Here’s a Jason Beghe quote on IMDB: “Scientology delivers what it promises under the guise of tearing away
    falsity, neuroses, psychoses. It creates a brainwashed, robotic version of you. It’s a ‘Matrix’ of you, so you’re communicating with people all the time using Scientology.”

    • generic sock account

      Freaky timing. I’m watching The Matrix on TBS, and the Oracle just told Neo about fate. Now I’m gonna sit and shiver under a blanket and contemplate life. Get out of my brane.

      • Sherbet

        Heavy, man.

        • generic sock account

          They cut the hard line. It’s a trap. Goodbye.

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        awww. Here ‘ya go. Just don’t squeeze too hard.

        http://i.imgur.com/k5Re5Ou.jpg?2

        • generic sock account

          I love that thing, whatever it is.

          • Sherbet

            A lemur. //not really//

  • villagedianne

    In Going Clear Jason said that in the beginning of his involvement he became super absorbed in Scientology. His agent would set up auditions, but he preferred to be at the Org discovering everything he could through the teachings and processes. Scientology managed to alienate someone so dedicated, even obsessed. They turned him from Scientology’s biggest enthusiast, into one of it’s biggest critics. Good job, Scientology.

    As a New Yorker by transplant, I am proud that the two most fearless and outspoken ex-Scienologist actors, Jason Beghe and Leah Remini, are native New Yorkers.

    • i-Betty

      As you should be πŸ™‚ And add another transplant to NY, Tony Ortega, as the go-to guy to get an ex’s voice heard and I’m keeping everything crossed that Leah will one day talk to Tony. Or ask him to co-author her book! That would be superb.

      Of course, we don’t know what has already gone on behind the scenes, and Tony won’t let on, because he is conscientious and principled. Either way, I can’t believe Leah has simply gone away.

      • Eileen

        Saw you quoted in the Boston Globe, nice!

        • i-Betty

          So funny πŸ™‚

  • geomeo

    I am an unitiated that reads this blog from time to time. I am a visual artist. Whilst attending art school, too many years ago to count, there was a fellow art student who we (small college) found was sending frequent checks to Scientology. He was highly intelligent, talented, an interesting person but a bit remote. I found it interesting that years later he became a very successful art designer in California. I and others always wondered how much his contributions aided his career. The location of the college would be considered a far cry geographically from L.A.
    My comment really refers to the 2 hour video that Mr. Beghe was the subject of. I was so touched whilst watching that I watched it again. I marveled at his apparent honesty/ the mastery of words and expression and the truly heartfelt explanation of his experience. I do understand that he is an actor and he has a natural talent to express but the honest telling of his story was striking.
    Reporting as an unitiated; I got it!

    • Ella Raitch

      Howdy Geomeo and welcome. Good to hear from you. I was also struck by Beghe in that video. I knew him vaguely as an actor, but his raw emotional honesty was evident in that interview.

    • i-Betty

      Hello, Geomeo. It’s lovely to meet you. Hope you’ll stick around πŸ™‚

    • Phil McKraken

      Being an actor helps to explain why Jason B is charismatic and engaging to listen to (note that the cause/effect equation probably runs both ways). But the content of his presentation has more to do with how he’s a smart guy who can string together paragraphs on the fly and passionate about this topic. Tom Cruise is also charismatic and engaging, but the content of his Sci-related utterances evinces something other than smarts.

      • i-Betty

        So true.

    • NOLAGirl

      πŸ™‚

    • Juicer77

      Welcome, GM!

  • HeatherGraceful

    BBB. Brass Balls Beghe. That was a moniker given to Jason by Anonymous in 2008.

    I loved watching that interview with WBM (Wise Beard Man) so very much. It was enlightening for me, a never-in, to hear such an intelligent and reflective person explain what drew him in and what led him out. The interview showed an incredibly authentic person, who even had “a moment” on screen. I immediately had a lot of respect for Jason.

    I didn’t know that Jason was stirring up people behind the scenes. Brilliant. BBB in action.

    • Sherbet

      I miss seeing Mark Bunker. We need some Bunker in the Bunker.

      • NOLAGirl

        ^^^^This!

      • nukethevolcano

        Hope he’s in an edit suite with a coffee.

        • Sherbet

          Yes!

      • joan nieman

        I think he must be very busy right now. He’ll show up one of these days.

        • Sherbet

          We have a good number of shrewd Clearwater-watchers in the Bunker, but it would be interesting to get Mark’s view of things there.

      • ccyankee

        What ever happened to the scientology documentary Mark Bunker was working on a few years ago? I remember seeing some clips of various interviews. Did he put it aside because of the Gibney and BBC films?

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      Brass! That’s it. Thank you.

  • i-Betty

    Ugh. I’ve just taken one for the team and visited Scientology’s website (I couldn’t remember whether NY org was ideal and it was the first link that came up when I googled).

    The atmosphere in here is great today, so please only alot this comment a nano-second of your time or our happiness bubble might burst. At the top of their article about the NY org it says this:

    The Church of Scientology in New York City, located just off Times Square, was a gift from the International Association of Scientologists to the people of New York in recognition of their courage and spirit in the face of the 2001 World Trade Center disaster.

    Oh, do please fuck off you heinous bandwagon-jumping liars.

    • Sherbet

      Urp! And what did the People of New York say to that gift? I’ll bet it had a few 4-letter words in it.

      Too bad IAS didn’t contribute toward charities to aid the survivors of the tragedy. And we know they didn’t do that, because they would have brayed about it loudly. The best charity is done under the radar.

      • joan nieman

        You are right Sherb.

      • Dr. Hunky Jimpjorps

        In 2003, Tom Cruise swept in and set up the “New York Rescue Workers Detoxification Project” two blocks away from Ground Zero, a fancy front for the niacin-and-saunas Purification Rundown, and essentially bribed a bunch of city politicians into agreeing to send firefighters there.

        So, Scientology’s sum total contributions to NYC’s recovery effort are an overpriced sauna, some “touch assist” poking, and the Times Square Free Stress Test Palace.

        • Sherbet

          Sadly, he got some boosters in the fire department, people who said the detox helped them. I don’t know if anyone joined the cos because of their experiences, but I hope not.

          • Sherbet

            This is interesting, from something called ShortNews.com:

            07/21/2008 06:00 AM
            ID: 72152
            Scientology Boasts Fraudulent FDNY “Medal of Valor”

            A scandal has arisen at Scientology’s NYC offices. When the local “org” dedicated a new building in 2004, a Scientologist named Stephan Hittman presented Scientology management with the Fire Department of New York’s (FDNY) “Medal of Valor.”

            Hittman, who falsely claimed to be an “Honorary Commissioner” of FDNY, had briefly held an administrative position at FDNY. Prior to that, he had spent more than 15 years as a “special education” administrator for the New York public school system.

            FDNY’s “Medal of Valor” is only ever presented posthumously to firemen who have died in the line of duty. Numerous Scientology websites boast of receiving this “Medal of Valor” in recognition of the activities of Scientologists on 9/11.

            • And I’m Cute, Too

              Another Scientologist, speaking his native language, all to advance the Cult.

            • i-Betty

              Sickening.

            • scottmercer

              Pricks.

            • Ella Raitch

              I’m horrified that this individual worked in special education. I’m hoping that was before Scientology.

          • Dr. Hunky Jimpjorps

            A couple firefighters apparently did; I found a couple sources saying that at least two FDNY members left their families and moved to California to work for the church after their time in the Detox Project. It’s sad, but at least the FDNY is now prepared to tell the CoS where to stick it if they offer their “help” again.

            • Sherbet

              Amen to that. Read my next post, below.

            • Semper Phi

              I met a couple of firefighters who had gone through the detox center’s program and swore it saved them. They spoke at the first benefit dinner thrown for the center, held at the Natural History Museum in 2004 (it’s the benefit shown in the TC Medal of Valor video). I volunteered at that dinner and they were there as guests and speakers. They were very convincing, I must say, but then I was pretty new to the whole Scientology scene and so believed the miracle stories.

            • One of the point of any clam processing is that you’re not done until you’ve convinced yourself that it’s the greatest thing since, well, since the first time one thing was compared to an unknown alternative.

            • villagedianne

              From the testimonials of the firefighters in the program that I heard on media, they were healthy and their colleagues who had been exposed to the same conditions were very very sick, requiring frequent hospitalizations and myriad medications. I don’t think that’s something you can just convince yourself of. It’s not like gushing about being at cause, or in present time, but much more concrete.
              Even if the Purification helped every firefighter who went through it, that doesn’t make Scientology a good place to be. It doesn’t make the Purification safe for everyone. It doesn’t make Hubbard a good man.
              Life doesn’t usually present us with purely black and white situations. There may be things in the COS package that help people. But the package taken as a whole is negative, evil, and destructive.

            • dagobarbz

              Medical science has debunked the Purif as quackery. You can’t argue with science.
              My anti-drugs program has a 100% rate of success. It’s amazing how effective one dose of cyanide can be to stop drug addiction.

            • “Even if the Purification helped every”

              The key word there is “every” – that could be one missing piece of information.

              We know from David Love (who worked as “Qual” type person at a narCONon) that the success percentage for narCONon (which is, after all, purif plus going cold turkey plus TRs) that the criminal organisation known as teh “church” of $cientology is not only aware that they do not collect the information to support their claims of success rate, but that what little inf9rmation they do collect does not, in fact, allow them to claim the success rate they do.

              So, I’m not saying no firefighter who went on the purif never got better, I’m saying that not only is anything to do with the Co$ is heavily tainted with lying about success, but the gushing about improvement is built in (regardless of whether its gushing about health or beingness).

          • villagedianne

            Yes reportedly some firefighters who had been exposed to the toxic dust on 9/11 were greatly helped by it. There was no way to tell from the name alone that it was Scientology-based. Supposedly there was no proselytizing for COS done there. I hope that’s true, but if so, it would have been a purely PR-driven change from normal Church policy.

            IMHO sweating out toxins has merit, or at least it can’t hurt you if done under medical supervision. IMO it’s the lack of medical supervision, overly prolonged duration, and mega doses of vitamins and niacin that harms.
            In the mid-twentieth century, cigarettes were deemed safe, and milk, butter and red meat were always healthy. Vitamins were seen as a sort of magical medical safe-guard, which I think added to the mystique of the Purification Rundown.
            But a sensible no-frills sweat and exercise program couldn’t be proclaimed by Hubbard as a great health discovery. Worse still, it might be something you could do on your own, quite outside the church.

            • dagobarbz

              Medical science has proven that our sweat system is for cooling, not detoxing. You simply don’t “sweat out” anything but fats, salts, water and trace elements. It’s like when they claim your brain is just a shock absorber. They don’t know diddly about human anatomy or medicine. At least, not in this life.

            • ComeToPresentTime

              You don’t sweat out “toxins”. It just doesn’t happen.

          • dagobarbz

            One of those fire dept boosters was a desk jockey who claimed to have a medal only given to firefighters killed in the line of duty.

        • And I’m Cute, Too

          And don’t forget: Hijacking the hotline broadcast on the footage “ticker”, tricking people desperate for emotional and mental help into calling Scientology instead.

        • dagobarbz

          It wasn’t as benign as an overpriced sauna. Toxic levels of vitamins and extremely long, overly hot sauna sessions can cause permanent health problems. I did hear of a couple low profile mentions of firefighters having a bad reaction, but they kind of sank without a trace and now I can’t find them.

    • Douglas D. Douglas

      Makes sense. A disaster to commemorate a disaster.

    • Scream Nevermore

      I hope they left the receipt in the bag, so the people of NY can exchange it for something they really want!

      • Pepper

        Really. Scientology is good at giving you things or shall I say experiences that you don’t want.

    • Observer

      The Church of Scientology in New York City, located just off Times Square, was a giftTrojan Horse from the International Association of Scientologists to the people of New York in recognition of their courage and spirit in the face of hope that the IAS could exploit their state of vulnerability after the 2001 World Trade Center disaster and sucker them into the con.

      fixt.

      • i-Betty

        As only you could!

      • ze moo

        The only real thing that Clamatology did for NYC was open a ‘purif’ center for 9/11 responders. One very publicly funded and advertised by Tom Cruise. And by ‘real’, I mean the hours and vitamins you get with the sauna until you melt package.

      • Pepper

        good one Observer! As usual.

      • Lurkness

        Obs, you MUST be with us tonight. I can send you my HBO GO login information to use tonight if you need it. Let me know if you need it; happy to share with you and Mr Obs.

    • joan nieman

      Well, that was nauseating but certainly not a surprise. They are so deceitful. Lying liars that lie.

    • Bury_The_Nuts

      Their delusion knows know bounds.

    • Robert Eckert

      Didn’t they think New York had suffered enough?

    • Semper Phi

      I was on my “leaving staff” sec check in NYC on Sept. 11, 2011, when the 10th anniversary ceremonies were being held. Imagine my disgust when I dropped into the org’s commemoration event and it turned out to be Vulture Ministers crowing about how fabulous they had been handling the disaster. I could only stand about a minute of it before I got the hell out. Heinous is the right word for it.

      • i-Betty

        Good grief! How sickening. I’m so happy for you that you’re out and free, SP πŸ™‚

      • On July the 7th 2005, London suffered a terrorist attack. Four fanatics detonated backpack bombs on underground trains and a bus, killing 52 people and injuring 700.

        Subsequently, BBC radio infiltrated a Scientology Org and recorded ‘Volunteer Ministers’ boasting about their supposed involvement in the emergency response. They explicitly state that their only objective was to keep traumatised people away from councillors and psychiatrists and bring them to Scientology instead. https://scicrit.wordpress.com/2014/11/11/mind-games-scientology-verses-psychiatry-from-bbc-radio-five-live/

        A Scientology spokesperson was interviewed near the end. Unable to defend the indefensible, she went ape instead, launching personal attacks on the other participants.

        Be assured, VMs look just as creepy to never-ins.

        • Anonymous Confused Person

          I went to your link and found a link to the transcript. I found this quote:

          “BRIAN DANIELS [ACP adds: Deputy Executive Director, CCHR]: No. No. No, I’m not. I’m saying that that’s what a doctor said – that psychosis can be as a result of a vitamin B-12 deficiency.

          DR. MAX PEMBERTON [ACP adds: psychiactric doctor & journalist who went undercover to some Scientology meetings]: Yes. Korsakoff’s psychosis —

          BRIAN DANIELS: Right.

          DR. MAX PEMBERTON: – That’s a recognized diagnosis for – um — for people who are alcoholics and haven’t had enough B-12.”

          And my first thought was, “oh, my god. THIS WAS HUBBARD’S PROBLEM.”

          When people say that he created Dianetics/Scientology as a means to heal himself, IT IS TRUE

          • Anonymous Confused Person

            What I find particularly interesting about this interview is the part where the Cherch rep gets asked “yes, but what do Volunteer Ministers actually /do/?” and “Why should be believe anything [the Cherch] has to say?” and immediately turns the conversation into an attack on the questioner until time runs out — conveniently and effectively avoiding answering the question. I have run into that fairly frequently: it is a tactic for people to try to avoid taking criticism by turning the conversation onto the critic.

            • dagobarbz

              And hogging all the air time so nobody else has a chance to speak.

            • Anonymous Confused Person

              Classic.

            • Dead right!

              This is standard Scientology practice – distract, and divert the discussion. It that doesn’t work, they provoke an argument. It is occasionally demonstrated here by Scientology Trolls, bless ’em.

              The aim is to stop you talking about Scientology by any means necessary, not address any issues raised (after all, a Scientologist already knows, with certainty that they are right, so why argue?).

          • Straight Diet of Kerbango

            Sorry, I can’t bear to let this go uncorrected.

            Thiamine deficiency (B1) is the cause of Wernicke–Korsakoff syndrome. Most common cause is chronic alcohol dependence leading to malnutrition and malabsorption.

            B12 deficiency is usually caused by inadequate intake (tea and toast diet, vegans, malnutrition of chronic alcohol) and/or an autoimmune malabsorption syndrome.

            Both can lead to dementia and delirium with psychotic symptoms.

            That is all.

            • Anonymous Confused Person

              Well, darn it, SDoK, there you go spoiling my epiphany and all. ; )

          • Well spotted!

            That’s one of many possible diagnoses for Hubbard… the problem is, of course, that his undoubted mental illness was masked by the heavy use of all kinds of drugs and aggravated by the strange social situation he created for himself (Sportsmen and Popular entertainers frequently demonstrate that being worshipped can go to your head).

            Thinking about it, one thing he never lacked was a good meal. At Saint Hill Manor he retained Chefs, who prepared a selection of dishes for every meal, in case he changed his mind, so perhaps a really serious vitamin deficiency is unlikely.

            If you look at Narconon nonsense, one of the their claims is that an overdose of various vitamins as part of the ‘Purif’ can cure anything (because Hubbard said so). The B12 claim is just an attempt to make this daft idea more respectable by associating it with a real medical phenomenon.

            Personally, I find this diagnosis more likely (and interesting) https://scicrit.wordpress.com/2014/06/18/malignant-narcissim-l-ron-hubbard-and-scientologys-policies-of-narcisstic-rage/

        • i-Betty

          Ha, Janet Laveau rears her beige head above the transitory St. Hill parapets to defend Scientology’s position here. The same Janet Laveau who gave John McGhee a cracking slap across the face when I met her.

          Thanks a million for the work you do on your blog, O_B. I really enjoyed this one.

          • When I first heard this I could not understand what she thought she was doing – her crazy an irrelevant personal attacks were so obviously a PR calamity.

            Since then, I have been persuaded that this kind of display is not aimed at the general public, but at Scientologists who (if they stumble across the programme) are supposedly assured that the CofS is on the job ‘defending their rights’ in the manner to which they (as Scientologists) have become accustomed.

            Thing is, this was going on in the UK in 200.. Perhaps the kind of inflexibility that requires all member behave in the same deluded way regardless of time, nationality or culture keeps the troops under control. However, it is a great weakness when dealing with the wider world .

    • Betsy

      You have a better digestive constitution than I, i-B. Just a glimpse of Fearless Leader and I have to go lie down with a cold compress on my forehead.

      Thanks for the post!

    • Lynn Fountain Campbell

      “Oh, do please fuck off…” LOL! Love it. My sentiments exactly. Cannot stop laughing. Not only did my happiness bubble not burst, but it was considerably enhanced.

    • Guest

      A Trojan horse, a gift that nobody needs, a gift that is not gift at all but a bad omen to the people of NY City, the NY people not only have suffered a great loss and aggravation but now they get a gift to betray them, slave them, destroy their family and leave them bankrupt, scientology is not better than the people that attacked NY City in 2001.

    • Simi Valley

      The Cherch of $ickentology New York was bought and moved into before the fucking IA$ existed – they were already there in that same location by 1980. The IA$ wasn’t even created until 1984. Kiss my big white Noo Yawk ass.

      • i-Betty

        You are a walking library of cool facts, Simi!

        • Simi Valley

          I lived it. The NY Org is where I got started in the cult.

    • Mighty Korgo of Teegeeack

      Gaaagh, huck, huck, huck-a, huck-a, huck-a…………RRRolffffffff.

    • dagobarbz

      Here’s Scientology’s REAL gift to New York City. A Friday night, these things were everywhere. Lots of cig butts too. And a condom I cropped out of the picture.

      • i-Betty

        “Bring your friends!” Good grief.

  • Basketballjane

    Jason was always my favorite student at Celebrity Centre. He was real and raw and swore like a sailor and made us all feel like actual people. Years after I left I reached out to him to apologize for any part I played in his Scientological torture. He assured me that I was one of if not the only highlight of going to Celebrity Centre. He is a class act 100% and I am so happy for him and his success and for his unabashed bravery for so long!

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      That is some compliment!

  • rickiraccoon

    9 more days….can’t wait!
    Has ABC or 20/20 ever given a reason for not airing Jason’s interview?

    • Douglas D. Douglas

      Because ABC is a pack of pussies, I suppose.

      • rickiraccoon

        I love how Alex G. calls out all 3 networks for not sharing their footage…..chickenshits.

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        In my dream, ABC’s chief producer personally calls Jason Beghe begging, on his/her knees, grovelling for an interview, anywhere he wants, any conditions, on March 30 – but Jason tells him/her he’s too busy giving interviews on every other media outlet in the world – so NO. heh

        • Douglas D. Douglas

          ABC could simply repackage the hours and hours of material they have been sitting on all these years…

          • Sherbet

            Riding on the coattails of HBO. Hmmm, I guess we could dust off this old material and pretend we were on the cutting edge of reporting.

            • “Excluded Exclusive interview!”

          • Juicer77

            They’ll pull out the old release forms and pretend it’s new, as Sherb says.

            • Sherbet

              I don’t know Elizabeth Vargas’s status right now. She was in alcohol rehab a couple of times recently. Not sure if she’s reporting at the moment.

            • Juicer77

              I’m sorry to hear that. She seems like a sharp cookie. Hope she gets her act together.

            • Sherbet

              I agree. She has a good demeanor about her.

      • BeezleBobby

        I wonder if they’re kicking themselves now.

  • Hana Eltringham Whitfield

    Thanks, T. And thanks Jason for all you did back then to find our ‘blown’ companions and extend a welcome hand.

    • NOLAGirl

      Hana!! *swoon*

      Hope you know you are adored Bunker-wide and I am sending lots of hugs your way. πŸ™‚

    • Douglas D. Douglas

      Doing my best not to stare, here.

    • One Human

      Hana, thank you for being one of the groundbreakers in exposing the horror show!
      Your book was one of the first I read when I became curious about C of S.
      Can you share any more details of the chain locker incident? This is the item that fueled my passion for seeing the monster defeated.

      • Hana Eltringham Whitfield

        Hi there, and thanks. There were three chain locker incidents that stand out. I’m not sure which you refer to. The first, and worst, was in early ’68, on board the then Royal Scotman, when Hubbard ordered a five-year old child, Derek Greene, into the chain locker for throwing David Ziff’s jewelry including a very expensive Rolex watch overboard. In retrospect, I guess we can’t blame Derek. Kids should never have been permitted on board to begin with; they ran unchecked all over the vessel. I shudder now, as I did then, at the thought of what could have happened had Derek managed to get down into the engine room and messed with the online generators and other engines, machines and pumps, or even fallen overboard when the Scotman was at sea. At the time, however, standing there in front of Hubbard and his ‘Lord of the Galaxy’ persona, and hearing what one small inquisitive and very energetic child had done – finding the jewelry in the first place and then tossing it into the harbor – I was both shocked and amused at the same time, and the last so much so that I had to stifle my mirth with coughs. Right there, in front of an audience of crew, and the boy’s mother, Felice Greene, Hubbard swelled in size and boomed in his loudest voice that even though children are thetans in small bodies, they know what they’re doing and Derek had to be punished; he had to be taught right from wrong. The chain locker was in the bow of the ship, a small dark, rank metal container, very cold, large enough to hold the anchor chain. And in went Derek. He sat on top of the coils of chains. After the hatch closed, the only light Derek had to see with came from the hawser pipe through which the chain was pulled in and let out. He ate and slept – did he sleep? – down there for several days. To this day, I do not know if he had blankets, never mind TP, and how he managed to go to the bathroom in that steel chamber in the first place. Much to my shame, I did not speak out, not to Hubbard or anyone. After the Old Man left, I comforted Derek’s mom, Felice, a friend of mind. Though the incident shocked me to my core, I rationalized it, as I did with everything that did not fit socially at the time, and continued believing in the Old Man. Of course, he had to be right!
        The other two chain locker incidents occurred on the Avon River, later called the Athena, when I captained the ship. On one of our trips to train new recruits, Hubbard, who was on board the Royal Scotman at another location, spoke with me over the radio and ordered me to put Nikki Freedman into the chain locker. He gave no reason. I did as he ordered. However, within twenty-four hours, I was so ashamed of myself for complying without asking Hubbard why, that I took her out without informing him. I expected him to chew my head off afterwards, as he was bound to find out at some point, and demote me. Surprisingly, nothing happened. The second incident also occurred on the Avon River; I assigned young Peter Gillham to the chain locker. I think I also took him out within twenty-four hours.
        These actions by Hubbard and myself were reprehensible. Hubbard always ordered them with ease, and most often accompanied them with a smile. I and the majority of crew complied because, when we committed to him, we unknowingly took on his personal culture of ‘no conscience.’ Therefore, we automatically did as he did. But most of us were not OF his culture, and we finally left when we realized there was something very wrong with the man we had once revered.

        • One Human

          Wow, wow, wow!
          Thank you Hana!
          Yes, the incident with the 5 year old is the one I was thinking of most, for it truly peeled the most substantial layer of the onion for me; Hubbard’s willingness to invoke such sinister cruelty, especially with a small child.
          We are truly blessed to have the good fortune of you being strong enough to break through, and the courage to speak out, not just once, but continually.
          I am deeply honored by your response.

        • Pepper

          Thank you Hana. Thinking about a child in a chain locker sends chills down my spine. I only wish it did Hubbard’s too.

          Was Derek okay when he got out of the chain locker? Has he ever spoken publicly about this incident? I wonder what he remembers about it and what he thinks of Scientology today.

      • villagedianne

        Hana Whitfield has a book? What’s it called and where can I get it? I can’t find any listing for the book from the usual online sources.

        • One Human

          I misspoke, her lengthy story is or was available on Operation Clambake.
          Absolutely astounding stuff.

    • Panopea Abrupta

      Thank you, Hana, for your honesty and courage.
      Your unflinching look into the heart of darkness and the raw emotion of the recollection of it
      has always moved me profoundly.
      I am frequently close to tears when you speak of the horrors on the Apollo.
      May your journey be as filled with light as those memories are with darkness.

    • i-Betty

      It’s lovely to have you here with us, Hana!

    • Newiga

      Hana, thank you for being the strong, intelligent, eloquent, courageous, classy lady your are! You are admired by many Bunkerites!

  • 27 years ago today:

    In Short: Nonfiction March 20, 1988, Marcia Chambers, New York Times

    Mr. Corydon does little to explain why he remained attached to a group that fed its members scraps and hurt him beyond measure.

    If only there was some book or documentary that explained this “prison of belief”…

    • One Human

      Well played Mycroft!

  • MaxSpaceman

    Jason Beghe- The
    Man of the hour. And you’re
    The man of the day.

  • Frank Lee

    I have been using the attached HBO ad to send to my local mayors, city councils, police chiefs, etc. via email entitled “A Clear & Present Danger”, urging them to view this very important documentary. The end of the email message states “What people DON’T know CAN hurt them!” The more the word is spread to those in authority, the more protection is afforded to those who have been subject to Fair Game. Scientology secrets protect them. Exposure is the only justice the “never ins” have!

  • Missionary Kid

    Holy shit. Had the Today show turned on while reading the Bunker. Marty Rathbun is doing an interview in a promo for Going Clear on the Today show, starting at about 42 minutes after the beginning of the first hour.

    Marty says that he had a part in setting up the “monster” of (he doesn’t name it specifically) OSA that is now used against the people Scientology considers its enemies, and that it is now used against him.

    He said that once he realized that everything that he had confessed to (in auditing and sec checking) would be used against him, and he was open about it, that $cientology no longer had control over him.

    He handles the question about the Tom Cruise phone tapping incident in saying that he ordered it, after being ordered to do it by David Miscavige.

    All in all, it was a great promo for Going Clear.

    I’m sure that the video will be available soon, if it isn’t all ready, on the NBC website.

    • Basketballjane
      • Missionary Kid

        Thanks to you and DDD, more people will see the NBC piece. $cientology sure shoots itself in the foot again by the way that they don’t provide a face in reply. Many of their attacks on the movie are quoted at the start of the piece, but they ring hollow after seeing Marty.

      • valshifter

        thanks for the link, holly wacamole!!! the word is out a lot of tv shows, websites, radio shows talking about it.

    • Douglas D. Douglas

      It’s Up!

      • Missionary Kid

        Thanks for posting the link a little later. BBJane did it in reply.

        • Douglas D. Douglas

          Didn’t see it. Good to get the word out in any case…!

        • joan nieman

          Darn. I have to go out somewhere for a bit but will watch this clip as soon as I return.

      • i-Betty

        Every time I hear a presenter or journalist saying “the church says the hole does not exist” I have a little chuckle and think “yes she bloody well does!”.

        • Spackle Motion

          Me too.

      • Toner Ed

        He looks like smirking not like crying.

        • Douglas D. Douglas

          Exactly. Thank you for your contribution.

      • L. Wrong Hubturd

        “The controversial church takes on documentary”

        There, I fixt the lower third title.

      • God

        Buddy Marty ! go go go

  • Douglas D. Douglas
    • Missionary Kid

      Thanks. I caught it and commented a little earlier. To provide “balance,” it has the usual $cientology bullshit about Going Clear, but, of course, nobody appears on camera for them. All that does is make more people want to see the film, and after Marty Rathbun finished, even more will want to see it. The Streisand Effect is becoming the $cientology Effect.

      Thank you for the publicity, David Miscavige, the biggest SP of all.

    • Basketballjane

      Here’s the clip of Marty this morning. http://www.today.com/video/today/57144679#57144679

      • One Human

        I truly did enjoy, and would have welcomed an entire hour.
        Has Marty ever participated in a panel discussion, outside of the one(s) for ‘Going Clear’?

        • Basketballjane

          Not that I know of but I would love for him too. HELL I would love to be on a panel with him discussing Scientology.

          • One Human

            Jane, I would hope you and Hana would also be on that panel, Tory and Sunny too, and Marc & Claire,…aahh crap, I could go on and on.

            • Basketballjane

              I think it would be great. Someday. I would love to get all of us together to talk about that. It would be therapy!! And educational at the same time. Bonus!

  • Vinay Agarwala

    I have not seen the movie ‘Going Clear’ yet. But what I read about Jason is quite revealing about his role in encouraging Marty Rathbun to come out with his story. That got the whole ball rolling.

    I greatly respect Jason Beghe for it.

    • Bury_The_Nuts

      Cute Avi, Vinay.

      • L. Wrong Hubturd

        I can’t do it……I already upvoted Theo, but Vinay is just too much for me. I’m a failed human being.

    • i-Betty

      Hi, Vinay πŸ™‚ You have a lovely dog.

      • Vinay Agarwala

        That was a puppy I met at a Hacienda in Equador during a trip to Amazon in January.

        • generic sock account

          No wonder packages from Amazon take forever to get here. WTF

          • L. Wrong Hubturd

            Wait until Vinay gets a drone.

  • joan nieman

    Yes. I think we would all agree that Jason is a hero. I am glad he was able to rise above that creepy presence that fouls up the earth. Good on you Jason!

  • Rasha

    Ticking of the clock
    Chiming with that omen sound
    Jason Beghe’s brass balls

    • SkyBill40

      Nice haiku. How about this one?

      $cientology
      An utter sham of a cult
      How can they exist?

  • beef

    What a great guy. I think I have watched that 2 hour interview about 50 times. I love to hear him speak on the subject.

  • Matt in Atlanta

    Just watched Marty Rathbun on the Today show. Holy shit!

    • nukethevolcano

      Dave isn’t jealous — he has his own tv studio:)

  • Roger Larsson

    13,798
    billion years ago Ron Hubbard’s ass produced a big bang. There are those
    finding the smell in this universe as lovely but most people detect the smell
    of stinking shit.

    • SkyBill40

      So THAT’s what that is?

      • And after that, billions of candles were lit to cut the stink. We call them stars.

        • Roger Larsson

          Out of Hubbards gaseous cloud galaxies, stars and planets with noses connected to thinking brains occured.

  • Hamtaro

    There once was a fellow named Jason
    Made a public cult recantation
    Davey wanted him stopped
    But his efforts all flopped
    And Jason got our veneration

  • Matt in Atlanta

    Several years ago I had some serious doubts about Marty Rathbun. This revolved around a picture of he and Jason Beghe. I was sort of livid that Jason was seeing Marty at the time.

    I asked Jason via Operation Clambake if it was possible to talk. Jason and I had a nice telephone conversation and that interaction quilled some of my concerns. Still took some time to come to terms with my thoughts in regard to Marty though.

    • Chee Chalker

      If I may ask…….were you upset that Jason was speaking to Marty because Marty was involved in the Indie movement and that Jason may be.involved in that?

      • Matt in Atlanta

        Yes. I was concerned at the time that Marty was still peddling the kool aid and JB whom many of us held in high esteem at that moment in time was not what he appeared.

        That line of thought on my end has changed.

        • Chee Chalker

          OK thank you for responding. That makes sense now.

  • Simi Valley

    In early 2012, OSA-bots ran around madly investigating to find out the names of all scilons who had read Debbie Cook’s mass email (sent out on New Years Day 2012 to about 12,000 Scientologists) and then interrogating and “handling” them. For some reason, their dumb asses MISSED yours truly, who was living right under their noses in that scilon rooming house half a mile from PAC.

    So we’d love to hear from any UTR person who is brave enough to speak out (or who can let someone else know) what the reaction is so far in the cherch, as there have already been a number of showing in several cities. It will be even more fun to learn what happens after the BIG SHOW on HBO.

    • NOLAGirl

      From what I’ve seen from various people who post their Facebook blather, it’s pretty much like this: “There is an entheta documentary out. CoS says its all lies. I’m not watching it. Here’s a link to Freedom.”

      It’s the “See No Evil, Hear No Evil, Speak No Evil” response. πŸ™‚

    • From BlackRob… Summary, on March 16 there was still a mix of “I’m not hearing anything – hooray!” and “Any criticism will increase the number of people who are interested – hooray!”

      https://whyweprotest.net/attachments/ebu7kmc-png.245866/

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        There are going to be the mentally void or blackmailed ethics bait OSA Volunteers spewing that kind of crap till kingdom come. I can’t imagine that any honest opinions will be seen on those sites or forums. More likely Rinder’s place or ESMB, but if they come here first, hope all will put on their company best manners. There Will be leaks from the flood. No doubt at all.

      • valshifter

        “Didn’t heard anything nope nothing”. Just because you didn’t hear it doesn’t mean is not happening.(scilions)

    • I don’t know if you read Mike Rinder’s blog, but on Thursday he runs a comic strip called ‘Regraded Being’, and yesterday’s Regraded Being covered what happens when someone in the Church goes to see Going Clear.

  • Room 101

    The best line from Beghe is something like, “If Scientology is real, then something’s fucked up..” – aint it the truth.

  • Douglas D. Douglas

    Real world intrudes on the fun (as always). I’ve gotta run to work.

    See you all in a thousand comments or so!

    • i-Betty

      Have a great day, Doug! Make lots of money and buy that island where we can send Marty and Mosey and Baby Rathbun to give them some peace.

      • NOLAGirl

        As long as they promise to host BBQ’s so we can go visit. πŸ™‚

        • i-Betty

          And be their friends πŸ™‚

          (Which sounds pukey if you didn’t watch the devastating video of Marty yesterday, which most of us have.)

          • NOLAGirl

            I did watch it, and that’s exactly what I meant. πŸ™‚

            I’d be their friends and FUCK CO$!! Come at me bro!

            • i-Betty

              They’d be like: seriously? More friends? First it was the Squirrel Busters, now all these friends? We just can’t catch some peace and quiet! πŸ˜€

            • NOLAGirl

              Right? Do these people ever stop partying?? LOL

            • i-Betty

              Bastards πŸ˜›

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              Why on earth would anyone stop partying?

            • NOLAGirl

              Pfffftt! No idea? I’m putting together a shaker of martini’s right now. LOL

            • TheMirrorThetan

              I would be any exes friend If I liked them and COS can suck a big one.
              No group of arseholes are going to dictate who Iam friends with.
              Plus as a shit stirrer I would have fun tormenting them.

            • NOLAGirl

              Exactly. They aren’t the only ones with a bunch of lawyers. *sticks out tongue at OSA*

  • NOLAGirl

    Looks like Co$ Portland will be looking for fresh meat this weekend. Just putting this here for anyone who might want to stroll by in a “Scientology Kills” t-shirt, or something. πŸ™‚

    https://twitter.com/ScientologyPDX/status/578254902771736576

    • Newiga

      Body, Mind, Spirit Expo, eh? Got any BT’s in formaldehyde?

      • Robert Eckert

        Alcohol and glycol is guaranteed to freeze a thetan.

        • Newiga

          πŸ˜€ Oh yeah! I could I forget. πŸ˜‰

    • generic sock account

      So just look for the emptiest booth? Or maybe ask for a table instead.

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      If Truth in Advertising applied to scientology:

      “Visit us at the Break your Body, Blow your Mind, Crush your Spirit Expo from Mar 21 to Eternity Booth”

  • ..

    • kemist

      OMG !

      A sign of extraterrestrial stupidity !! We Are Not Alone.

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      love it

  • Panopea Abrupta

    Today Show NBC
    “They say you were a low-level employee”

    Then THEY shouldn’t have published this photo πŸ™‚
    Lyman Spurlock, Marty Rathbun, some little guy and Greg Wilhere
    keeping $cientology wasting.

    • Steve Bazemore

      is that video available anywhere? doesn’t look like anything ive seen before and im always hungry for new anti sci videos

      • generic sock account

        It’s posted downthread. You shouldn’t have to scroll too far.

        • Steve Bazemore

          so far alli see is one that says “its up” with another picture, maube i am not going far enough. ill try searching on youtube

    • Eileen

      Great job by Marty, he deserves karma credit points.

    • Chee Chalker

      I love how DM tries to make himself be the physically biggest man. Even when he is standing you can tell he is teeny. Marty is sitting and is almost as tall as DM.
      To give more perspective of DM’s lack of height, last night I watched a documentary on Paul Williams. Paul Williams is taller than David Miscavige!
      (BTW, I know height is not a true measure of a person. I just bring it up because I know OSA reads this blog and I think the OSA bots believe Dave is 6’0.)
      How pissed will Miscavige be when he sees this clip of the Today show? I say ‘will see’ because wee Dave is still snug in his bed as its not quite 10 am in California.

    • Free Minds, Free Hearts

      Okay Pan, great photo – and did you call the trolls by showing that Marty Rathbun was a higher up, seated next to captain David Miscavige? The trolls are so cute when they act all innocent and confused!

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      There’s only one “Nobody” sitting at the Adult table that does not belong there:

      http://i.imgur.com/2zg2MhA.jpg?2

      • valshifter

        OMG, he is tiny.

    • L. C. Spencer

      Pan, I can’t remember who’s sitting with his back to the camera, do you know?

      (I love this picture.)

    • God

      he my bro he is

    • valshifter

      Employee? so scientology is a business not a church. “lower rank” how demeaning, is that how scientology talks about their former cleric?

  • sumertin

    It’s been a week since I saw Going Clear, but I don’t remember Jason’s “story” really being told. He has some good one-liners at the start of the film and he’s used intermittently as a talking head, but I don’t remember him as being one of the film’s “main subjects.”

    I think Jason’s story is better told in John Sweeney’s Panorama program. In fact I think both of John Sweeney’s programs were more engaging than Going Clear.

    I did enjoy Going Clear, but that may be because I’m obsessed with the subject matter. I was at the 7:10pm showing at Lincoln Center last Friday night and I’ve gotta tell you, I heard plenty of yawns all around me. In fact the man sitting next to me (who I was 100% convinced was Alex Gibney during the film) slept through half of it. Some sections of the film definitely dragged. And some of it was excellent. I just hope the casual HBO viewer can stick with it.

    • Lucille Austero

      You are fuh-nee.

      • sumertin

        Am I? I’m just trying to be hon-nest.

        • Lucille Austero

          Um. So you say. We are not believe you.

          • sumertin

            What don’t you believe? That I saw it and I was a little disappointed? Forgive me for having an opinion.

            • Lucille Austero

              Sumertin, what did you think of the part where Sean Bean calls Ewan Mcgregor into his office and tries to convince him that he had his best interests at heart? And when do you thing Ewan Mcgregor first starts to suspect that something is very wrong on the island? Is it before or after he talks to Steve Buscemi?

            • Anonymous Confused Person

              Does Sean Bean die in this movie? If not, then I think I definitely need to see it.

            • Lucille Austero

              I heart Sean Bean.

            • Ella Raitch

              *tears*

            • i-Betty

              44 minutes ago you told us: “It’s been a week since I saw Going Clear, but I don’t remember Jason’s “story” really being told”.

              Then 29 mins ago you told Derek: “Jason was definitely great. He got the most laughs for sure.”

              Now you say you were little disappointed with the entire film?

              I’m confused.

            • sumertin

              There are talking heads and then there are people whose personal story/journey are told. Of course Jason is in the film. I just don’t remember his personal story being told in depth.
              And my memory is usually very good, but if there is indeed a lengthy Jason Beghe section I just don’t remember it. Sorry.

      • Robert Eckert

        He killed the previous account with this name (used to make similar bogus “reviews” of the movie) to start a new Sumertin with only this one comment in the profile.

        • Lucille Austero

          And we would NEVER know, would we?

        • sumertin

          You’ve got the wrong guy. I’ve been using this Sumertin account for a while now. And I’ve only written one other review about this film. I said I had mixed feelings. Same account.

          • Robert Eckert

            That previous “mixed feelings” review has been mysteriously scrubbed from your profile. I would chalk it up to Disqus being glitchy except that this kind of thing happens only to certain kinds of accounts.

            • sumertin

              I don’t know enough about Disqus to know why or how anything would be “scrubbed,” but I can tell you that you’re dead wrong.
              I’ve never engaged in any Disqus shenanigans. I’ve never deleted anything and I’ve never “killed” an account. I just occasionally start a new one if I get locked out of an old one. It’s never intentional.

            • generic sock account

              Then why do you have this entirely separate account with the same name? https://disqus.com/by/sumertin/

              Obvious lies are obvious.

            • generic sock account

              I do see what you mean. The name is the same, I probably just misunderstood what you meant.

            • sumertin

              Yes, that’s my account. What’s the problem? I see everything perfectly. You don’t?

              (Sometimes I use Safari and sometimes I use FireFox, does that make a difference?)

            • generic sock account

              Yeah, it seems more and more like a misunderstanding. I’m sorry.

            • sumertin

              No prob, it’s gotta be a Firefox/Safari issue. I’m using Firefox today because Tony’s blog wouldn’t load on Safari. If that somehow screws up my disqus account then idk… Bad timing for a controversial post.

            • generic sock account

              You’re logging into different accounts. If it’s a browser issue, it’s because your browsers are logged into or are logging into different accounts by default.

            • sumertin

              No, it’s definitely the same account. I only ever log in once and use a junk password that I don’t bother remembering. It’s got to be a browser issue.
              But I’m not great with computers so I don’t know for sure…

            • generic sock account

              It’s not the same account. I’ve demonstrated that. The account of yours I linked is not the one you’re posting under right now. You’re either lying or too dumb to understand what you’re doing. Sorry.

            • sumertin

              I guess I’m too dumb.

              Although I can tell you – as a matter of FACT – that I’ve only ever created and logged into this account once.

            • generic sock account

              That sounds like a different story than you told just a bit ago.

            • sumertin

              No, everything I’ve said is consistent. But I think I figured out why there are two accounts called sumertin. It’s not a browser issue. It’s my fault. I do take responsibility for some of this madness.

            • Jack99

              You’re on a safari, all right.

          • generic sock account

            You replied to a comment I posted last night under the same name, and your comment isn’t visible on this account. You’re blatantly lying. I don’t know why, and I don’t care. But c’mon. Try harder.

          • Ben Franklin

            nice try sumertin. you will have a much happier life outside the church

        • Observer

          IIRC it was a “Magic Jesus” who spouted nearly identical criticism about The Master, and reacted the same way as this guy to the criticism of his criticism.

          • Robert Eckert

            Thank you. I haven’t reach a state of Perfect Recall on all the dubious accounts we have interacted with over the years.

          • sumertin

            It’s not criticism to my criticism. I’m being accused of trolling. That’s not debating the substance of my film criticism, that’s getting personal.

            My comments about The Master didn’t turn into a dust up like this. Just a few lemmings calling me a troll.

            • Observer

              You come in here as an infrequent poster and call the regulars names because they voice their disagreement with you. This site is trolled by the professionals in the Church of Scientology, and many of the regulars here are exes who have been fair gamed; of course we’re a suspicious bunch. When I started posting here I had quite a few shots taken at me until I proved myself.

              I don’t know whether you’re a troll or not, but your posts are similar to the derailment tactics used by Scientology trolls to disrupt and derail the discussion.

              If you’re not a troll, grow a thick skin, be patient, learn the community etiquette and show us you’re not one. If you are a troll, get used to being called out.

            • sumertin

              For the record, I didn’t call anyone any names, nor did I take umbrage at any disagreement that was substantive.

              I’m very sensitive to the experience of ex’s and I’m sympathetic to those who may be easily unnerved, but if this is truly a forum for open and honest debate, one shouldn’t automatically be disparaged for posting a less-than-glowing review of Alex Gibney’s film.
              I understand that the age of my account added to the confusion, but that really shouldn’t matter. I kept the discussion on-topic, it was others who got personal.

            • Observer

              Actually, you called them “lemmings”, which is a sly way of saying they’re mindless followers who aren’t capable of independent thought. If everyone agreed with you, would they still be lemmings?

              I’ve explained why you got the responses you did (though they were downright friendly compared to what you’d get other places on the internet from people who disagree with you). You are free to post your opinion. Everyone else is free to post their opinions of your opinion. Just ignore the responses you don’t like. If you can’t do that, then you have to make a decision about whether posting here is worth it.

            • Fred G. Haseney

              JennyAtLAX and I truly love the Observer.

    • generic sock account

      Was it a theater, or a special showing at the home you live in? Be honest. I know many nurses. Probably one of them works at your home.

      • sumertin

        Tony was there. Ask him.

        • Lucille Austero

          Did you like Lincoln Six Echo’s wardrobe? I did.

        • Robert Eckert

          When you talked to Tony your claim was that you were at the late late show.

          • sumertin

            Robert I can’t keep this up forever but I was at the 7:10pm screening, this is not a new account, and I don’t know what else to tell you. The facts have not changed.

            *I think you’re confusing me with someone who posted the other day who was at the 9:30pm show and also thought it was a little boring. That’s a completely different person.

            • God

              you cute, may I mess you up ?

    • I did actually see the film. The theater was packed. Everyone was engaged in it, including my friend who was never a Scientologist that went with me. I think it would be doubly interesting to someone who hadn’t heard or been following the Scientology saga like I have since I already knew a lot of the information in the film.

      Jason Beghe was the highlight of the film for me. When he started talking about how Scientologists are full of shit. It was the funniest moment in the film. In fact, he went over his involvement in Scientology from beginning to end. So you are completely full of shit when you say his story wasn’t told. I don’t know what you were doing in the theater but you certainly weren’t watching the movie.

      • sumertin

        Jason was definitely great. He got the most laughs for sure. I just don’t remember that his personal journey was told the way other subjects were. Although I admit, it’s been a week and I may have forgotten.

        • Lucille Austero

          You don’t remember it because you were not there. Do you even have the $$ to purchase a ticket?

          • sumertin

            Jeeesus Lucille…

            R2-45 suddenly seems like an attractive option…

            • Lucille Austero

              Are you advocating violence? This is a no-no.

            • i-Betty

              Ouch. If you’ve been mischaracterised as a troll I can understand your frustration but you cannot, CANNOT say things like that, Sumertin!

            • Fred G. Haseney

              I’m reading through the sumertin-related comments and I can’t believe how much of a buffoon that poster is! I just had to leave you a little note to say that and, wow, you defended the Bunker quite nicely, i-Betty.

        • Dude, come on. As soon as the film’s timeline came to the point where Jason joined Scientology he was on the screen constantly. Telling his entire story. From start to finish. I saw it last Saturday and I remember. You’re ridiculous. Why bother to critique the movie if your memory is that bad.

          • sumertin

            Really? Wow then I must have legitimately forgotten. The basic format I remember was:
            -Intro
            -LRH Bio
            -Miscavage BIO
            -IRS background
            -Tom Cruise section
            -Brief Outro

            And the stories of Spanky, Sara Goldberg, Travolta, etc, littered throughout. I really don’t remember a solid Beghe section. Hmm… I’ve gotta see it again.

            • Lucille Austero

              Yeah. You should def see it “again.” And get some food while you’re there. You probably need it.

            • Science Doc

              I like how it was all shot in Dutch Angles with Lou Reed’s Metal Machine Music playing throughout.

            • sumertin

              Ha, I’ve got that record. I paid way too much for it.

            • Lucille Austero

              Did you notice that Neelix was in the movie? I was surprised too! I like that little guy.

            • Science Doc

              What’s your favorite Lou Reed Album? Do you like John Cale? What about Laurie Anderson?

            • sumertin

              eh, either Transformer or New York but none of his solo stuff is that great. No, never cared much for John Cale.

            • Ben Franklin

              You must have watched an OSA bootleg version, probably with Beghe part blacked out.

            • sumertin

              Ben, you’re a newbie and you’re annoying. ‘Blog off.

            • Lucille Austero

              Speaking of blog off, what about the part where Lincoln Six Echo shows up at Tom Lincolns house? What a mind blower.

            • Eileen

              Getting cranky? I think it is your true colors that are showing.

            • Robert Eckert

              YOU are in no position to be calling anyone a newbie, or annoying. And nobody except Tony can make someone stop posting.

            • Lucille Austero

              I liked the part where Ewan Mcgregor and Scarlett Johansson escape from the Island! That’s my favorite part!

            • flyonthewall

              I like the part where he says “outro”. Is that special GoldenEra productions scientology film lingo?

            • Ella Raitch

              *smooches*

            • You should definitely watch it again. Beghe is on there as much as the rest of them.

    • Semper Phi

      You must have been in a different part of the theater then, because I sure didn’t hear any yawns near me at that show.

      • sumertin

        I was in one of the 3 upper rows. You weren’t near me Semper, I saw you afterwards.

        • Scream Nevermore

          OK, this is confusing – you have claimed to know a few people in here, but they don’t appear to know you. What’s going on??

          • sumertin

            Yeah I know, it’s weird.

        • Semper Phi

          Do I know you in real life? I haven’t shared my pseudonym very widely, so I’m wondering how you knew who I was when you “saw me afterwards.” And BTW, I was at the back of the theater as well, and I saw no one yawning or nodding off.

    • Science Doc

      This film is an absolute disaster for Scientology. Maybe rather than the usual nonsense which stopped working entirely in 2008, you might consider fixing some of your problems. Walk up to COB and make some helpful suggestions.

      • And I’m Cute, Too

        Then duck and cover.

    • “And some of it was excellent.”

      Which part(s) did you find excellent?

      • consigli3r3

        Don’t feed the troll!

      • sumertin

        The LRH Bio was great – a lot of stuff I didn’t previously know. And the visuals for the creation myth (Xenu section) was better than I’ve ever seen it done before. Better than South Park, BBC, etc.

        The section on the IRS battle dragged on a bit but the clips of Miscavage during “the war is over” event were extremely effective – it came off as terrifying.

        And the Tom Cruise sequence really stole the show. The audience gasped during the Nazanin Boniadi story and laughed hysterically at the Medal of Valor/Black Turtleneck mini-film.

        Look, it was good, it just wasn’t as good as I hoped it would be. And believe me, it will not hold the interest of a lot of the more casual HBO viewers. I’m sorry for that inconvenient truth. But the bottom line is, I’m thrilled the film was made and hopefully this will be what really turns the tide.

        • generic sock account

          You really can’t cast broad judgements on how millions of people will receive this film. People have already packed theaters to see it in its limited releases. So many more will see it on HBO. People I know that don’t even care about Scientology are excited and amped up to see it. It will be shocking to more people than you can imagine.

          Your opinions are your own. Let’s see how the broad public reacts to it, and then we’ll compare that to your simple review.

          • sumertin

            That’s true. It will definitely have an impact regardless. But I’m telling you, parts of it are slow. There were definitely some bored viewers at 7:10pm Friday night Lincoln Center showing.
            And yes, of course my opinions are my own.

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              Okay then. I hate when something riveting suddenly slows down, but I’ve figured out that for the most part, those parts go too fast for some, too slow for others. Depends on what grabs your interests. There’s so many moving parts to this saga – it will be interesting to see which parts (which dragged for you) grabbed Alex Gibney’s attention. It says a lot to me which parts of the saga appeal to others. I know for myself, my interests have changed all the time, but then, I was involved in that whole onion peeling process.

              Well, we shall soon see a ton of reviews and I look forward to hearing them all.

            • Lucille Austero

              What about the part where they find out that the lottery is really used to pull someone out of the “island” and harvest their organs? That was really surprising.

            • i-Betty

              Snort!

            • generic sock account

              I’m expecting it to be slow for those of us who read this blog every day. Tony said that from the start. That people who’ve read the book and follow Scientology regularly won’t hear anything new. But we don’t know how many people will see this film as their first exposure to Scientology. But please, take a guess at how many.

          • i-Betty

            Nat and SuperPlumFairy’s sisters loved it!

            • And my sis is a tough sell. You know what she actually said after it? “They should have made it a miniseries so they could go into more detail.”
              !!!

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              Well that’s music to my ears.

            • It is a good film. A couple parts did seem disjointed and tedious to me but that is just because I know too much too precisely. When I checked with my sister she said the storyline made perfect sense to her and kept her attention throughout.
              But there is plenty of new stuff that we haven’t heard/seen before: New OTO footage, Sara Northrup’s story in her own words, Spanky Taylor on camera (that part made my sister cry) and Tony saying some stuff about himself.
              No Shelly or Lisa McPhereson but it was too packed as is. That is why my sister said it should be a series.

        • TheHoleDoesNotExist

          It’s good to hear All reviews. It’s just that when you try to insert the opinion of “other” viewers, you turn people off. I’m very interested in all the opinions when it comes out on HBO. I don’t expect every single person to like it. I understand that some will watch it purely because it’s Alex Gibney. Another segment will watch it purely because it’s Lawrence Wright. Another segment will watch it because there’s nothing else to watch on TV that night.

          I also get it that those who saw it in the type of theatres it was played are more likely to be true documentary and film buffs, or deeply interested in the subject. Maybe the subject being cults or any manipulative, coercive groups.

          We are talking about millions of viewers. Millions. Of course there will be some who don’t like parts, or none at all, and a thousand different views in between. So I welcome your critiques and pointing out what you did and didn’t like. If you had stopped there, you would be fine. When you throw a lot of garbage in the can, don’t expect anyone to do anything but hold their nose when they pass by.

          • One Human

            Hey, I only recently became aware of ‘Paradise Lost:The Child Murders at Robin Hood Hills’ which came out in 1996, has now spawned 2 sequels (can you imagine Going Clear 2 & 3? πŸ™‚ ), and at least one separate documentary. Even now it is a hard hitting story.

            So if the initial reception is lukewarm, don’t worry; most of the prior doc’s like ‘Scientology and The World of L Ron Hubbard’ or fictional tellings like ‘The Bridge’ were virtually unknown before youtube and the ever increasing SP brigade.

        • I actually agree with most of what you say. I do think it is too early to judge how HBO audiences will respond to it.

      • God

        all of you

    • i-Betty

      “This is exactly what happened a few years ago after admitting disappointment with The Master. I was widely attacked for being a “troll,””

      But presumably under a different sock as this account has only existed for mere moments? πŸ™‚

      • Lucille Austero

        I KNEW you were summertin!

        • i-Betty

          πŸ˜›

      • sumertin

        Yes, we figured it out Betty, I’m using Firefox today, so for whatever reason you all can’t access the rest of my profile. I have no idea why.

        • i-Betty

          I do recognise your name going back some time, actually. I will feel awful if you’re not a troll!

          • sumertin

            I’m not a troll but don’t feel awful, I think there was some legitimate computer issue today. i-Still Love-u Betty.

    • Not attacking you for your opinion. I was parsing your inaccuracies.There’s a stark difference between the two. You can’t give an “honest” review of something, but also not have your facts about the film straight.

      Also, you can’t compare ‘Scientology and me’ to ‘Going Clear’. Apples to oranges. They are both about Scientology but they take a very different approach.

      Anyway, I don’t know how you could possibly be disappointed in this film. It was comprehensive, orderly, and engaging. Since you didn’t like ‘The Master’ either, I think you might just be a Negative Nancy, i.e. you are just contrarian.

      • Lucille Austero

        I vote for Negative Nancy!

        • TheHoleDoesNotExist

          Is she related to Debbie Downer?

          • One Human

            They twinned.

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        Just to nit pick, The Master received many thoughtful but negative reviews for a variety of reasons.

        • Good point. Still. I stand by my assessment. This is just a contrarian review. It’s got nothing to do with the actual movie, but rather he didn’t like it just because everyone else did.

          • sumertin

            That’s a bunch of horseshit. I’m not afraid to say what I like or dislike. I didn’t realize it was mandatory to love Gibney’s film. Nor did I realize the Bunker was a place where honest evaluations are frowned upon.

            • Lucille Austero

              I’m not afraid to say that now I really do think you might be Negative Nancy.

            • I thought you were disappointed in the bunker already back when you posted a less than glowing review of “the master?”

              Now I’m no longer confused – bye

            • sumertin

              I do have a unique perspective of the bunker. And at this point, the group is so solidified that it has more in common with “the church” than many of you would care to admit.

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              Well you make statements like this, you announce to all that you don’t know what you’re talking about. It makes not a splat of difference to me what your motives are, or your intentions. You just nuke your own opinions into neutralized little puddles.

              I hope at this point everyone will just ignore. Jason’s brass, the BBC’s review of Going Clear, mermaids, Obs shoops, Pan’s brilliant classic de jeur, so much more interesting and fun toys to play with here. Collapsing … Now.

            • It’s alright. This person is just realizing they have a character flaw. Just like we all have at some point. It’s uncomfortable, and it causes nasty reactions. Eventually we all come around and accept it and move on.

            • sumertin

              Ha, I have plenty of character flaws, although I’m not sure I’ve exposed them on this thread. Considering it’s me against “everyone” I actually think I’m doing pretty well…

            • Not really. You degenerated into hurling insults like “you guys are basically scientologists!” Uber fail.

            • sumertin

              You’re absolutely right. When it comes to bullying well-meaning people, you guys are very good, but nothing like the pro’s over in Hemet.

            • Lucille Austero

              “Everyone” had a vote and we don’t want you to expose yourself here. Please.

            • sumertin

              Hey THDNE, do an experiment. Try posting on this blog from a brand new account. And write something that you believe but may be mildly controversial. Sit back and watch the shit-storm unfold. Watch the people you’ve been friendly with for years ripping you a new asshole.

              Trust me, you’ll be amazed. You’ll be saying to yourself, “Hey wait a minute, I’m THNDE!, I’ve been around for a long time, I’m supposed to be respected…”

              Go ahead, try it.

            • Lucille Austero

              Psst. She said she was already gone.

            • Woe is you. You has so many sads.

              I have gotten into it with so many people on here I’ve lost count, including THDNE. I frequently say things that are controversial. The difference is that I understand this is an internet commenting community, and that there are hundreds of people here. All of whom might virulently disagree with my opinion at any moment. I don’t get the sads about it. I might argue for a bit, or for a long time about it. Then it is over.

              Frankly your OP, which is the thesis for this entire conversation, was insubstantial, very negative, and contradictory. It was bullshit. It sounded like a troll comment.Then everyone went, what the fuck, sumertin makes no sense. Then they had a hard time believing it was you because you keep saying things that make no sense and then your conversational skills degenerated into immature insults.

              Don’t sweat it. I’ve done the same thing and tomorrow it will be like nothing happened. Assuming you have people at home who love you and who you love and you don’t brood over this comments section. It seems like you do and you won’t, so all good in the neighborhood.

            • sumertin

              I agree, my original comment could have been better articulated. It was just a quick reaction to today’s post.
              But don’t worry, I’m not sweating it at all. Having a bit of fun actually. I’m off work and it’s snowing. Just passing the time.

            • Good stuff. That’s exactly how to do It.

            • Yes, you are special. No one is as special as you. *pat pat* Collapsing thread.

            • LMFAO. The comments section of Tony’s website is exactly like Scientology. That’s not childish at all, and no one has ever tried that one before. If you want to be insulting there are certainly better ways to do it than childish, bullshit comments like that.

              http://stream1.gifsoup.com/webroot/animatedgifs2/1125344_o.gif

            • sumertin

              Us against them attitude. Suspicion of all outsiders. Obsessed that you’re always under attack. No tolerance for dissent. Fawning all over the leader.

              And of course I never wrote “exactly like Scientology.” Stop distorting my words.

            • Lucille Austero

              Well, I will admit, I am mildly suspicious. Of robots. Specifically robots that wear pants.

            • Those things don’t make something similar to Scientology. You are the one with a “me against everyone” attitude, and you are obsessed with being under attack, and you are not tolerating dissent. You are fawning over yourself. So….look in the mirror maybe?

            • Lucille Austero

              Oh, this argument. Like, we have totally never heard this before. Mmm-hmm.

            • There you go. Fak me for getting sucked into this contrarian crap. You haven’t given a substantial opinion. Every opinion you’ve given is just the opposite of what other people say. Then you apologize for your opinion. Then you cry foul. You probably don’t even realize it, and that’s okay. But fak me for humoring it.

            • sumertin

              You’re right, I don’t realize it. I’m responding to this onslaught as best I can. And since these comments are not ordered chronologically, the sequence is now totally screwed up. Fak us both.

            • Robert Eckert

              The Bunker is a place where someone creating a brand-new account to make negative posts are looked on with suspicion, for excellent historical reasons.

            • sumertin

              I’ll say this one last time. This is not a brand new account. My only explanation for why it may appear that way today is because I had to use Firefox. Normally I use Safari but Tony’s blog wouldn’t load using Safari today. I’m not a Disqus expert and I have no idea why the browser would matter.

              *Just tried again (1:54pm), Safari still not loading this site.

            • Robert Eckert

              You make reference to when you reviewed The Master years ago, and to when I told you to add music to your life– but neither “sumertin” account existed then.
              New accounts which say “Marty and Mike have a lot to answer for” or “Other religions are just as bad as Scientology” or as here “This is kind of boring” are far more suspicious than similar opinions expressed from accounts with a long track record. New accounts which get threatening and order people not to talk to them are of course highly suspicious.

            • sumertin

              Other than saying parts of the film were boring, when did I say any of those things?
              And when did I make a threat or order anyone to do anything?

            • Lucille Austero

              You did make the threat of exposing yourself. You did.

            • cdub

              browser doesn’t matter guy–you’re spinning your wheels

            • sumertin

              Yeah I know I figured it out. It’s very weird what happened. My fault.

          • TheHoleDoesNotExist

            I’m bored with this stuff actually. I hope that HBO comes out with a DVD of this very very soon. I have a number of people I want to make sure see it – starting with the Clearwater Mayor!

        • Phil McKraken

          The problem with “The Master” was that the main character (Freddie Quell) was extremely annoying and totally uninteresting. The rest only superficially referenced Hubbard and Scientology. Lost opportunity.

      • sumertin

        Not to belabor the point, but nothing in my original post is inaccurate. I clearly wrote that “I don’t remember Jason’s ‘story’ really being told.”
        Yes, i remember his good one liners and his profanity and how they convinced him to return after OTIII and it made him think he was going crazy, but as I recall, these bits were sort of scattered about.
        In fact, you may have nailed what bothered me about the film. I thought, if anything, it was disorderly. I thought it could have been strung together better. But now maybe I’m knit-picking.

        • Lucille Austero

          Do you remember the part where Lincoln Six Echo steals Tom Lincoln’s boat? Just asking.

        • You said Jason Beghe wasn’t a main subject. That’s inaccurate. In fact he’s a significant part of the movie that you can’t remember. The fact that you say you can’t remember and continue to comment on the film is ridiculous.

          Then you talk about yawns in the theater and people sleeping. There’s nothing there about the movie itself. You don’t say what parts dragged or why, you just popped in and relayed a negative, insubstantial comment based on yawns and Alex Gibney’s doppelganger sleeping next to you.

          The only reason you could have posted this is so you could cry foul when other people said, “what the fuck?” If you need attention that badly, you’re welcome because you got a ton of it.

          • sumertin

            Derek you’re so silly. You’re basically telling me that if I don’t have something complimentary to say about the film, I shouldn’t say it – or else I’m a contrarian looking for attention. No, I simply and quickly posted my thoughts. It was not meant to be a comprehensive review. I posted a much more detailed reaction to the film last Saturday.

            I honestly don’t remember Jason Beghe’s personal journey being a focal point but it’s true there may be parts I’m forgetting. The film is quite dense.

            And my observation of the audience’s reaction is perfectly relevant to a discussion of the film. I’m sorry if it doesn’t jibe with your personal feelings.

        • HanniballtheFirst

          You are nitpicking.

          Sometimes one is fooled by ones own expectations and not able to see what is in front of one.

          We watched with a group of 5 and the first spontaneous reaction at the end was: “What the 2 hours have already passed?”
          IMO it was well written and excellent put together to show a coherent picture using very different people as witnesses.
          I do not think it was about anybodies individual story. I think this was about the story of LRH, DM, TC and JT and everybody who was interviewed contributed to that story.
          Saying Jason’s or somebody others story was not really being told is kind of insequitur.
          To tell the story of any of those witnesses it would take 10 hours each and would not even come close.
          This is not about any of the people in the docu. It is about a charismatic psychopath who founded a church and handed it over to a sociopath who went ballistic and megalomaniac when he was able to whip the IRS. Now all US taxpayers funding the PI and other abusive tactics and TC and JT know about and do nothing and have ‘blood’ on their hands for that reason.

          That story was told entertaining, convincingly and speedily in 2 hours.

  • splog

    Is it just my imagination, or is today’s story drawing the trolls in? I see more than a few posts trying to derail the subject, or minimize Jason’s part in Alex’s film

    • flyonthewall

      I like your name. It makes me chuckle. I just thought you should know that

      • splog

        Thanks πŸ™‚

        It even means something: Snarky Pedantic Lazy Old Git

    • Robert Eckert

      And just yesterday Observer observed how troll-free it had been. Sigh.

      • NOLAGirl

        That’s why I love the little “collapse thread” feature Disqus offers. Cleans up all their clutter. πŸ™‚

      • sumertin

        Hey Rob, as you once told me: “Add Some Music” to your day.

        • Lucille Austero

          Speaking of “add some music,” what about Jordan Two Delta? What a spunky character! As an aside, I also really loved the film Lucy. But I digress.

        • Robert Eckert

          I thought you had only posted here once before.

          • sumertin

            No I never said that. I’ve been around since the early VV days. And I remember exactly when you came on the scene, Rob.

            • Lucille Austero

              Wow. Rob should be all scairt and everything.

            • Robert Eckert

              He’ll go full Norman soon enough. Yawn.

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        It’ all her fault.

        • Observer

          *cries* I didn’t mean it!

          • Anonymous Confused Person

            Wait, is that photo of you? If that’s the case, well, it’s okay. You’re too adorable to scold.
            : )

            • Observer

              I wish I were that adorable. The world would be my oyster!

      • Observer

        I jinxed us. *hangs head*

      • ScnMonkeyNuts

        It was the same last week–all quiet on the Western Front for the Thursday, then Friday… and there were a few about. Think they’re getting their up–stat in early now πŸ™‚

    • If Tony’s articles from today and until the 29th are about a different contributor every day, and we get “I’m not a scientologist but … Person XYZ was not very good .. blah blah .. film .. boring” posts each day, then I’m going to have to Laugh Out Loud.

      • sumertin

        Reread my post. I never said Jason wasn’t good. I happen to love Jason. I expressed some mild disappointment with the film and some of you went apeshit. If my account appears as “brand new,” well sorry, I don’t know why that is.

        Jens, have you seen the film yourself?

  • Panopea Abrupta

    Red-X Red-X Red-X

    A troll shows up to derail right after I post a photo of Marty in one of $cientology’s seats of power?
    I guess I’ll just post it again.
    Heh, things are getting desperate in the Clampire.
    No person, just Karin Puow’s drivel.
    Where is David Miscavige?

    RED-X here:
    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1-Kvg78kCcvo5gL7UfPcmhmbsagTNtdj0y2LAiHVFrCU/pubhtml

    TICK TOCK, LilFiveOne

    http://i.imgur.com/ylsc1.gif

  • Here was my review of ‘Going Clear’ that I posted a few days back. Just to combat the trollolols that are showing up.

    ‘Going Clear’ was awesome. I never thought that a 2 hour film could so completely and accurately capture the monstrosity that is Scientology. It made me laugh and it made my cry. My two favorite parts of the film were:

    -When Jason Beghe says, “Scientologists are full of shit.” Then he goes on to do a mocking facial expression that resembles what Scientologists actually look like. I was laughing so hard.

    -When Marty Rathbun describes what it is like to have to continually see himself and be reminded of his actions when he was in the Sea Org. I have never seen someone look so sad and defeated. He was talking about Karma, and I wanted to grab him and say, “Fuck Karma. Stop beating yourself up. You don’t deserve this.” It was so hard to watch and it really brought me to tears.

    Alex Gibney did a wonderful job taking everyone through the history of Scientology all the way to present day and covering all the scandals along the way.

    It was especially satisfying to hear John Travolta and Tom Cruise exposed for the assholes that they truly are. Spanky, Rathbun, Rinder, Gibney, and even David Miscavige (through the recordings of him interspersed throughout the film) all had a hand in demonstrating how these movie stars callously ignore the abuse happening right under their nose, and to people that they have the nerve to call friends.

    Almost equally satisfying was watching the words, music, and recordings of the Scientologists turned against the Scientologists and used to demonstrate just how insane the cult really is.

    I took a friend with me that has had no exposure to Scientology. She walked out shaking her head. She had no idea what to think. She cried at several parts, laughed at others, and just shook her head at things like the field of flowers that was planted for Tom Cruise.

    The film is riveting and emotionally taxing. I think that everyone, besides the Scientologists, will enjoy watching this documentary.

    I might add that the way Gibney set the film up was incredible. He started from the beginning of the Scientology saga and took it all the way to the end. Along the way he picked up the various stars of the film as their timelines matched up with the timeline of Scientology. The story is told through their anecdotes and through Gibney’s narration.

    It was absolutely flawlessly executed. It even takes time to dive into the internal conflict that most Scientologists experience when they are doing horrific things in the name of Scientology. It really captures the humanity of it all, which was even more fascinating to me. Since that is probably the least touched upon part of the story of the cult. It doesn’t leave you wondering why these people joined; which is the most frequently asked question I encounter and unfortunately one that I cannot answer since I was brought up in it. It also correctly portrays Scientologists as victims of a fraud of nearly unmatched proportions.

    There were quite a few moments that were cringe-worthy because they stood as a stark and embarrassing reminder to me of the ridiculous things that I did and believed when I was in the cult. Watching the people at those Scientology events after being completely separated from the cult for nearly 3 years was an experience, man. I realized how crazy the cult looks from the outside. Singing the birthday song to Hubbard and talking about “discarding bodies” and aliens.

    It really is a great film and I can’t wait for all of you to see it in 9 days.

    • i-Betty

      I love that you’re still thinking about it days after posting your first review. It clearly has a huge impact.

      • I know, right? I mean I couldn’t praise it anymore without sounding superfluous.

    • .. and you’ve actually seen it, unlike the victims of the criminal organisation known as the “church” of $cientology who really, REALLY, don’t want to see it…

      Excellent review, I was going to see “Going Clear” anyway, but this made me want to even more πŸ™‚

    • And I’m Cute, Too

      Your generosity to Marty is inspiring, Derek. Especially in light of how much you’ve suffered, and how much Marty has been involved in the sufferings of others.

      May you continue to have much hope and courage.

      • As the film so accurately shows, everyone involved in Scientology is a victim. Even Miscavige.

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      “It really captures the humanity of it all”. For those who say there’s nothing new here, move along, This is definitely new, like you say, Derek. I fully expected Alex Gibney to be fair and balanced. It sounds like I will not be disappointed. It’s good to hear reviews of those like yourself more freshly out and 2nd gens. I hope it was another healing moment. I’ve already bought my tissues to go along with the popcorn.

    • ScnMonkeyNuts

      Thanks for the comprehensive review Derek, makes me all the more pissed off that I’m stuck on the European side of the pond! I’ll just have to vicariously experience it via The Bunker πŸ™‚

      • In a few more weeks it will be available on Vimeo. I am sure when it is released on Vimeo, Tony will post a link.

        • ScnMonkeyNuts

          Cool–thanks πŸ™‚

    • Allie

      Powerful perceptions and comments, Derek. The film brings up strong emotions, esp. from people who were in. Now that you’ve been out for 3 years, your critical skills and rational thinking continue to blossom.
      What joys are available for you to experience. Carry on!

    • Did you see ‘Regraded Being’ on Mike Rinnder’s blog yesterday? It’s about a Scientologists who goes to see Going Clear, and it is really well done.

  • flyonthewall

    and Rathbun on the Today show aired this morning. The Hole is mentioned first and talked about at length – http://www.today.com/news/ex-scientologist-tells-today-i-ordered-nicole-kidman-phone-tap-2D80561700

  • And I’m Cute, Too

    (Off topic)

    Twenty years ago today, the Aum Shinrikyo doomsday cult carried out its chemical attack on the Tokyo subway system. Casualty count: 13 dead, over 6000 blinded, sickened or otherwise affected by sarin gas.

    This is just one example of how a group with harmful, heartless ideology can cause widespread death and suffering, no matter how small that group is. I don’t think Scientology has done anything that could be called terrorist (yet), but it’s definitely criminal, and shows no signs of changing its ways.

    May Gibney’s film wake up many, many more people to the evil of this sick, sick cult.

  • Ya know, I had a problem with Jason Beghe’s part in the film too — I wished it was longer! XD
    He was one of the best parts of the film and totally charmed my sister silly. Loved him!

  • Beth

    Would like to re-share my film review from last week too, with a couple of minor edits (it was late).
    ——————————————

    Just home from the first show at Lincoln Center. This film is staggering. My favorite bits:

    “So I’m thinking…. maybe this is a sanity test! Maybe if you believe it they kick you out!”
    Paul Haggis on his first reaction to reading OT III materials

    “I learned from it. That I would never again do the bidding of a tyrant.”
    Hana Whitfield on years of depression after leaving the org

    “Why is Tom Cruise paying a thousand bucks to have aliens pulled out of his body?”
    Tony Ortega

    “I’m fighting back by communicating.”
    Sara Goldberg

    These are not just soundbites. It will be very interesting to see what the ripple effect of the film might bring about. For the giant black hole that was L Ron Hubbard this film makes crystal clear….. whatever the opposite of L Ron Hubbard is. Alex. Larry, Tony you are class A human beings. Mike Rinder, Paul Haggis, Hana Whitfield, Sara Goldberg, Marty Rathbun, Spanky Taylor, Tom de Vocht, Jason Beghe, and all the other ex-scientologist in the film, you are heroes and you have won. You are walking us out of the darkness. I hope we make it all the way to the finish line.

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      Thanks for the review – and you got to see it at the Lincoln Center no less.

      • Beth

        I live out in the suburbs now but I made a special trip in to see it. I couldn’t wait.
        And what a pleasure to share the HBO countdown here in the bunker with all of you. You’re awesome.

    • Ella Raitch

      Thanks for sharing Beth – and welcome

  • Panopea Abrupta

    Breaking News Reuters Burbank, CA
    3/20/15
    with our special correspondents Doc Grumpy, Happy Slappy, and B.R. Ashful Sleazy-Dopey

    Disney Announces Remakes of Classics

    In a move that has taken the movie world by surprise,
    Roger Iger, president of Disney, has announced that he has contracted
    the newly renovated Ideal KCET Studios
    to do a $47 million remake of the children’s classic, Clambi.
    If that is a success, the following titles should follow:

    Sleeping Brutey
    The Sourcerer’s Apprentice
    Brutey is a Beast
    101 Clam Nations
    Clamnesia
    The Lying King
    The Hunchback of Notre Clam
    Dumbo
    Monsters Inc.

    Kirstie Alley has been hired as technical advisor.
    “No lemurs will be hurt in the making of these films” she announced.

    Karin Puow, spokesliar for $cientology, was unavailable for comment
    as she is currently occupied with moving sandbags around in an attempt to stop a deluge.
    David Miscavige is said to be building an ARC.

    Jason Beghe will NOT lend his voice to the characters.
    Tom Cruise will voice Thumper – he is said to be intimately familiar with the character.

    • Ouch! That hit me right in the childhood.

    • ScnMonkeyNuts

      lolol Thanks Pan, my day improved already πŸ™‚

    • Allie

      In addition to your fabulous writing skills and creativity, your snark and humor is outstanding.
      Thank you for all you contribute.

    • Ardent

      At first, I was seriously taken aback by your post. Then, about one second into my horror I realised…
      Well done!

    • daytoncapri

      The Operation Snow White movie includes the RPF song – https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mIwa9sPFT5I

    • One Human

      I can’t wait for ‘Finding Shelley’ πŸ™‚

  • BeezleBobby

    How out of touch is David Miscavige? Apparently, enough to believe that he can fend off the shit tornado hitting his organization with a bunch of strongly-worded press releases. I suppose the deny-and-wait-until-it-blows-over approach has worked in the past. But surely he must see that what is happening now is 47x times worse than ever before. And HBO hasn’t even shown the movie yet!

  • nottrue
    • Betsy

      Yow. That stupid threat note she got: “We’re going to look into you…” In the past it would have been leave-town-at-midnight time. Now it’s just-another-footbullet for the Chorch with its head concreted permanently in the sand.

  • Hamtaro

    An update about the Tampa Jump Start voting:

    Around 9:00am EST today the voting went offline due to “technical difficulties.” It came back up about noon. However, once it came back up the page displayed the following notice “Please note that due to the technical difficulties we experienced earlier with a third-party vendor, we are unable to display the results of the voting until Monday, March 22, 2015. During this time, all votes will continue to be counted without issue. Thank you for your continued understanding.”

    At the time the voting went down, the stats were approximately:

    Wounded Warriors in Action 1500 votes
    MLK Center 600 votes

    Humane Society 2000 votes
    Berkley Middle School 1000 votes

    While this is a great start, it’s important that folks continue to vote each and every day until the cumulative vote totals become public again. We wouldn’t want to get a nasty surprise now, would we? Thanks to everyone who is making the effort to support these two great charities.

    • Scream Nevermore

      Except that the 22nd is Sunday…

      • Robert Eckert

        That might be one of their technical difficulties?

    • Betsy

      Oh, Ham…could you give us the link again? (Sorry, I’m lazy, but I want to vote.) I didn’t realize that one could vote every day. If you give it to us again I will bookmark it.

    • Sibs

      I’m glad you mentioned this because I was just about to post the link again. Go vote! http://www.milner.com/jumpstart/jumpstart-tampa/vote2

    • Ardent

      Voted: Warriors, Humane.

  • Betsy

    Very great thanks for the link to Tory’s story from 2001. Her experience with Andreas Heidel-Lund should be an example to never-ins who happen to connect with people still in the Chorch. He was NICE. He corresponded with her in a respectful way. Tory identifies him as one of the most important people in helping her resolve to leave.

    If Tory is reading, boy, I had no idea what the earlier part of your story, pre-Youtube, was. Your experience trying to get to Clearwater to meet with ex-members sounds scary and surely tested your growing sense of who you could be, outside of the Chorch.

    I have mentioned it before but I’ll say again that Tory’s interview on TheLiptv was one of the primary reasons I got involved. As a never-in I was bowled over by her clear, concise story.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ihGTwPQE54

    • i-Betty

      Tory was superb when Allison Hope Weiner interviewed her for Media Mayhem. Was that really what brought you in, Betsy? See? The message is being spread in so many ways, and to so many different people that it’s an unstoppable flood of biblical proportions.

      I’m so glad you are here, Betsy. You’re a great Bunkerite πŸ™‚

      • Betsy

        Thanks, i-B! That means a lot to me.

        Allison’s interview wasn’t ALL that brought me in. It started when a friend gave me Lawrence Wright’s book for Christmas. (Several Christmases ago.) I got hooked. I was searching the net for things about it and I hit on Tory’s interview. It really shocked me. And I found the Bunker and began to hear some of the stories.

        You’re right, it’s spreading like mad. I’ve managed to create at least 5 addicts amongst my also-never-in friends. We’re having a party on March 29. And Tory’s interview with Allison is one of the URLS I send to people who seem to be interested.

        I know several of my never-in friends have begun to spread the books and the URLS to THEIR friends. It’s like the way rabbits reproduce…you can’t keep track of the increase.

        And instead of hearing “how could anyone do that?” I’ve heard from several friends “I would have joined at many points in my life if it had crossed my path.”

        • i-Betty

          “It’s like the way rabbits reproduce…you can’t keep track of the increase.”

          Heehee, that’s a great analogy!

  • RBE

    Apologies if already posted. BBC review of Going Clear

    http://www.bbc.com/culture/story/20150320-a-scary-must-see-scientology-doc

    • Scream Nevermore

      Let’s start asking them to broadcast it – there’s a link to their FB page in there!

      • HBO has an exclusive deal with Sky Atlantic in the UK…. I tweet them on a regular basis and they don’t have an answer yet

        • Scream Nevermore

          Perhaps pushing the BBC will encourage Sky to get their finger out.

        • i-Betty

          Arseholes. Literally. And bugger, too.

          I did actually know that and it’s going to be the sole reason I regret cancelling my SKY subs.

    • i-Betty

      First time I’ve seen it, thank you! Like Scream Nevermore suggests, we ought to contact the BBC and remind them we pay their wages!

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      This is an outstanding review. Just outstanding. Thank you, RBE, for the link.

      “Owen Gleiberman awards five stars to a film that β€˜has the scary intensity of a thriller’. “

    • Sherbet

      “In Scientology, he (Hubbard) wrapped these ideas around a theological core of interplanetary gibberish that could have come straight out of one his pulp novels.” Ya think?

      • Observer

        And it wasn’t dven good interplanetary gibberish.

        • Robert Eckert

          Neither were his pulp novels.

          • ScnMonkeyNuts

            Amen to that.

    • Allie

      Excellent review by Gleiberman. He seems to have knowledge of Gibney’s documentaries and his style of film-making and how well this works in untangling the complexity of Scientology. The docu demystifies the power of the organization and is a “must-see”.
      “He alleges that Miscavige, in actions worthy of the Khmer Rouge, subjected his loyal officials to rituals of abuse, making them confess to imagined crimes and assaulting them if they didn’t comply”. Tick tock, Davey, the world is now going to know what an insane evil dictator you are. Exactly what all those bitter apostates have said for years.

    • Deadpool

      “especially in one astounding clip Gibney has uncovered of the actor’s birthday celebration aboard a Scientology ship – as a clueless β€˜true believer’, blind to much of what goes on within the Church, his loyalty to Scientology stoked and manipulated by his friendship with Miscavige”

      I don’t know why I’m confused by this. I thought the Doc shows that Tom knows about the abuses not a blind true believer.

  • A bird in the chimney

    As I think of him: Jason “show me a motherfucking clear” Beghe. He always makes me so happy, and I’ve been so enamored and proud of his outspoken efforts. I was glad when I learned he was featured in the documentary.

    • Allie

      Agree with you. I think many people like Jason as an actor and that his part in the documentary lends credence to the film and will get many more people to take this evil cult seriously.

  • JackTheGiantKiller

    I’ve always been a fan of Jason Beghe, but now I am bigger one! He is one of those down to earth people that you just have to love on screen and off. He’s genuine and consistent wherever he goes and whatever he does. I am amazed at how open and willing he is to talk about having been brainwashed by the Cult of $cientology. He all but face palms himself during that original two-hour Bunker interview when talking about Xenu and such. And after all that he remains outspoken and does not bow down to their Fair Game tactics. Instead he rises above it all to gain even more integrity than he had before. Yeah, I like this guy. Ballsy – real – stuff.

    I don’t dog the guy for his involvement with $cientology, but I do applaud his uprightness in speaking out against its abuses!!! If only Cruise, Travolta, Kirstie, etc. could pay attention to Beghe and walk through the door he has opened, they would see how much better is to be an honest person. Then the world they pretend to be improving as Miscavige fleeces their bank accounts would REALLY would be a little better!!! It is time for them all to take some behavioral acting lessons from Mr. Beghe before it is too late.

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      Tom Cruise could take some big pants humanity lessons from Mr. Beghe

      Tom Cruise doesn’t know the history of brass balls. Mr. Beghe Does!

      • JackTheGiantKiller

        Hell ya!

      • Missionary Kid

        I echo JackTheGiantKiller. HELL YA!

  • Betsy

    I just noticed Allison Hope-Weiner’s tweet up on the right, posted by Tony. Allison is a true friend of the cause. I admire her courage and I like her interviews.

    • Zana

      Where is the tweet? Yes, I like her!

      • Betsy

        Oh, I don’t tweet so I can’t tell you its origins, but Tony listed it up on the top left of the Bunker page. (sorry! Old age! Can’t tell right from left!)

        • Zana

          We don’t grow older…we grow BETTER.

          • Betsy

            Yes, that’s right! I’ve learned so many new things that it pushed a lot of the old things (like the difference between left and right) out of my head! Thanks, Zana!

            • i-Betty

            • Betsy

              Thx, i-B–I really appreciate your doing this. What a treat! (Don’t forget about sending me a new laptop. I like Apples.)

      • Robert Eckert

        In case it scrolls away:

        Allison Hope Weiner @ahopeweiner

        Just saw @HBO film on #Scientology #goingclear doc with @TonyOrtega94 It is so informative and scary. Tony is amazing in it. Must see!

        • Zana

          Thank you!

    • Newiga

      She is a kick-ass lady!

    • Dale A.

      I like her interviews because she is willing to challenge and engage the guest.

    • Juicer77

      She actually attended court one day with Tony O. during the Laura DeCrescenzo case. The case is ongoing, will be active again in early December 2015. They talk about it here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lthXXnGjEIQ

      • Betsy

        Oh, wow! Thanks for this link, Juicer. I didn’t know about it. Another great listen.

        • Juicer77

          Tony’s been on a couple times. All worth watching. Enjoy! πŸ™‚

  • Betsy

    For anyone who hasn’t seen it, Jason Beghe’s speech at a conference in Hamburg, Germany is worth watching. Marc Headley was there too. Jason’s speech is long, but absolutely on target.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dFDl6GA1DI0

    • Zana

      This is brilliant. Down-to-earth. Smart. I have a whole different sense of who Jason Beghe is. Now I’m a fan. I love his clarity. Thank you, Jason. Thank you, Betsy, for putting this up. !

    • Allie

      Jason is an articulate and powerful speaker (plus being so darn cute!) While he hadn’t written a speech, he smoothly describes how dangerous Scientology really is and in simple terms so everyone can understand.
      This is very important esp since he was speaking to people in government. Every point he made–from why people are attracted to Scn, the control and brainwashing, the expenses of the courses and materials, the numbers of Scns. I esp. liked his description of the “events” and the minions’ attitudes and behaviors.
      Kudos to Jason and his integrity and outspokenness.

    • Ardent

      That has to be the most riveting and cogent argument against the cult I can recall seeing. Extraordinary.
      (pity the camera operator got into the schnapps a little early!)

    • Spectacular. There should be a link to this on the film’s homepage over at HBO.

    • MaxSpaceman

      “Scientology is quite dangerous … It’s our own little slice of hell.”

      @ 1 min. 50 secs. Now *that* is speaking in public !

    • Dee Findlay-DeElizabethan

      This was one of the best speech’s and sure helped me to wake up as an ex and resign for ever. Everything he said, I saw to be true, since I had gone back in for a year after being out for very long time and not on the internet. I cannot thank Jason enough, and anyone who was in would understand this.

  • Zana

    I had no idea that Jason was the one who got Marty and all those speaking out. I had no idea that he was such an instigator in this whole movement. Right on, Jason. I have always like him…I now realized what a powerful force he is and have great respect for him. Fearless. Fearless – in the face of insurmountable obstacles. Love it! He deserves all the good karma he has been receiving. !! Thank you, Jason. You are a hero.

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      I hope that all the Under the Radars see this movie on March 29. From everything I’ve heard so far, it seems like it just might remind them that the only power holding them back is their own. I so understand that they are watching guard over the prison, but scientology causes you to forget that You hold all the keys, all the cards. The mirage is getting so faint, so dark now, all they have to is put their lips together and blow.

      • Ardent

        I recall the first time I saw that bit of film. Yowza!

        • One Human

          I love all four of the movies they did together.

      • One Human

        Terrific THDNE!
        Also, one of my favorite movies too.

    • generic sock account

      He literally saves peoples’ lives on television. Literally.

      • Zana

        He’s saving peoples’ lives in real life as well. πŸ™‚

        • generic sock account

          He would help more people if he’d tell us Stolte’s Bunker handle. Where are you, Stolte?

          • Sherbet

            I have someone in mind, but I’m not telling in case I’m wrong.

            • generic sock account

              He’s Howdy, isn’t he? Dammit.

            • Sherbet

              You guessed. Dammit.

          • Juicer77

            It’s you, you big dummy. Now get back to work!

  • Observer

    Huh. Turns out Alanna Masterson, Scientologist and half-sister of DJ Douchebag, is going to be at the Horrorhound convention in Cincinnati this weekend. Mr. Observer and his brother will be there … I wish there were some way I could convince them to stand outside her autograph booth with Going Clear posters, but that ain’t gonna happen.

    http://www.horrorhoundweekend.com/shows/201503/default.shtml

    • Sherbet

      Aw, no guts, huh?

      • Observer

        It’s a little more complicated than that

        • Sherbet

          I was joking, though. I admire anyone with the courage to poke the cult with a stick right out in the open.

          • Observer

            Oh, I wasn’t offended. πŸ™‚

    • Ignoring her existence is just as good XD

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      Vistaprint. Tshirts. Cheap, very fast. Oh wait, This weekend. Iron on inkjet printer paper to iron on tshirts.

    • Scream Nevermore

      That’s quite the line up!

    • Juicer77

      I’m hoping for a big death scene on the 3/29 episode πŸ™‚

      • Ella Raitch

        I was screaming at the TV last week – ‘you let another black guy die, but the Scientologist survives??!!’

        • Juicer77

          I know, right? I loved Noah. That was a really rough one, too.

    • Why not tell the ConCom via letter why they shouldn’t have someone like Alanna as guest? It won’t effect this year, but could have an impact in the future.

  • Mark

    Message to Miscavige (refresh):

    • Ben Franklin

      You really want to see a clear?

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GdBCSP3KKtw

      • Mark

        Well, that’s the perfect recall sorted: not so sure about the being at cause over matter, energy, space and time…

        • Ben Franklin

          True. There are no clears anywhere in the sense LRH described. LRH’s idea of true clear state is fictional

  • We think Jason Beghe is FABULOUS, are there nudes of Jason?

    • Ew dude. Gtfoh

    • generic sock account

      By nude, I assume you mean without his mask?
      I got you hooked up, bro.

      • generic sock account

        shit that’s a different Jason. I’m sorry.

        • Chee Chalker

          I didnt realize they unmasked Jason from Halloween…. I gave up on those movies after the first one

    • Free Minds, Free Hearts

      flagged this comment

      • I lol’ed a little bit though. This comment is so ridiculous. I read through these people’s other comments and that seems to be their shtick.

        • generic sock account

          He’s actually hilarious, imo. Poking shit with your dick is ok again.

        • Chee Chalker

          Do you read this as an implied ‘we read your file and we know the pics are out there’. ?

          • No just someone trying to be outrageous. Look at their comment history. That’s just how they are

        • God

          You will sit on my right side Derek

          • would truly be an honor.

      • Ardent

        me too.

      • Matt in Atlanta

        Same here.

  • nottrue

    I hope Monique gets some kind of win in her case right before the HBO doc shows

    • Drat

      Is a decision scheduled?

  • Today, the BBC website featured an article about an upcoming programme by Louis Theroux,. It’s about people in an Ohio mental institution who have been found ‘not guilty by reason of insanity’. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-31962182 It will be broadcast on the 22nd of March.

    With luck, this indicates that the release of his programme “Stairway to Heaven” (on page 20 of this BBC brochure http://downloads.bbc.co.uk/bbcfilms/live/bbcfilms_brochure.pdf ) will not be long delayed.

    • Tony Ortega

      The two really have nothing to do with each other.

      The documentary on Scientology, produced by Simon Chinn and directed by John Gower, is intended for theater release. Not sure when that might be, but it could be a while.

      • Doh!

        • Tony Ortega

          Hey, but who knows. They seem to be wrapping things up pretty quickly now. Maybe the BBC has other ideas because of the popularity of Going Clear. But Simon and John were talking theater release, and my sense would be more like late summer or fall.

          • That sounds about right – the BBC may prefer to capitalise on the interest generated by “Going Clear”, not compete with it.

  • MaxSpaceman

    More snow in New York! Unreal winter this year. But, am telling it straight:

    Not snow, rain, gloom of
    night will keep us from Tony’s
    HBO Party!

    • MissBlueGown

      Moi aussi!

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      Clean up that winter crap, New York. No, really!

  • Jason da Bomb! Especially dangerous to the PLB!

  • Drat

    I’m not a troll, but I have to say I wish Jason would cross my Bridge!

  • ShoopZ

    HBO-pocalypse! (refresh)

    • romanesco

      Nice one! Very Monty Python. I can hear the sound effect.

      • ShoopZ

        It IS Monty Python! Except for the bits I added.

    • Splendid!

    • i-Betty

      Fantastic!

    • Illinoisian

      Beautiful! Love the feeling it conveys!! These are exciting times.

    • Juicer77

      That’s gorgeous *sniff* (wipes eyes)

    • funnybroad

      I’M BEING SUPPRESSED!

  • Suzy

    Something for Seniors: AARP has “Going Clear” as number 8 on their list of TV “must see”

    http://www.salina.com/life/aarp-our-spring-tv-preview-highlights-new-and-old-must/article_33aedda7-854f-50af-924b-753d86b248a8.html

    • Suzy

      Going Clear is also playing at the Martha’s vineyard film festival (who knew?) next weekend if you’d like to plan a weekend trip

      http://vineyardgazette.com/news/2015/03/12/marthas-vineyard-film-festival-gets-ready-its-close?k=vg550b5a66ca114

    • Free Minds, Free Hearts

      I love that AARP is doing this! LOL!

    • Juicer77

      Nice! The Co$ will target the elderly for bequests somehow. I bet someone on top of their game at AARP knows this.

    • Allie

      It’s great that AARP is highlighting this film. In addition to the general viewership, it may be important
      for some parents, grand-parents, aunts, uncles, etc. who may have some association (or disconnection) with
      Co$

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      Holy Crap – for the second time today!

  • i-Betty

    Neill Bradley has got his hands on an old e-meter and he’s taking it apart to build something new: a working computer! So far, among other fun things, he has managed to squeeze a quad core into a 17cm by 17cm space πŸ˜€

    He told me – “I am toying with censoring all anti scientology stuff on it by default also. Imagine a North Korean computer.”

    Superb!

    Refresh for pics:

    • Suzy

      I’d like to have one as a laser hair remover. After doing a Brazilian you could tell everyone you are “clear”

      • i-Betty

        I love it! πŸ˜›

        He’s going to do something different with a second e-meter: “We want to turn one into a synthersizer with the cans working like a theramin.”

        I literally have no clue what that means! Neill is an evil technical and engineering genius, so whatever it is it will be amazing.

        • Captain MustSavage

          A theremin? Awesome!

        • Observer
          • i-Betty

            Whoa. How eerily gorgeous.

        • beauty for ashes

          I’m still trying to figure out if it can be made into something you give a facial with!

          • Seems unlikely…

            Oh, that kind of facial. Never mind.

        • Missionary Kid

          A theramin is a musical instrument that was often used as “weird” music for science fiction movies. It is operated by bringing your hand(s) close to a wire or tube that has a charge on it. The charge, by sensing a body part close to it, and having a feedback loop, changes its tone, so it makes sounds like ooo eeee oooh.

          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theremin

          • i-Betty

            Thanks, Mish!

            • Missionary Kid

              What the article doesn’t say is that Theramin was a Soviet spy in his time in the U.S., gathering intelligence about U.S. technology for the USSR.

    • MaxSpaceman

      Finally, a clear look at the thing. Now, now I can see why they’re clocking in at $5,000.00 per unit.

    • Mark

      He should have a look inside one of Dr. Strabismus’s machines, too: https://www.flickr.com/photos/marksshoops/13568778625/

      • i-Betty

        You’re just so funny πŸ˜€

  • Panopea Abrupta

    I made a new poster specially for Tommy Boy.
    Come on in from the cold, TC – it’s warm in here in the Bunker.
    We even have hedgehogs πŸ™‚

    • i-Betty

      Baby hedgehogs melt my heart. Tom Cruise hardens it. Superb, Pan πŸ™‚

    • Juicer77

      Cruise… bleh.
      Hedgehogs….. squeeeeee!

  • Chee Chalker

    I wonder if COB misses Shelley………..from Mike and Marty’s reports, Shelley seemed to keep him a little more balanced, in check. Unlike Lou, who I am sure agrees with everything COB says.
    Shelley might have been able to handle the PR disaster of Tommy Davis. And we all know ‘Going Clear’ may never have happened if not for our little blue suede shoes boy!

    • Suzy

      Anyone have a link to a recent picture of Lou? She can’t be aging gracefully in such close proximity to COB.

      • Todd Tomorrow

        She went through a rough breakup with Ava Paquette, a lawyer with Moxon. Known for her dehydration and lack of sun they were perfect together. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9swehgmSiNg
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LQ2Y09dPrzs

        • Suzy

          Wow

      • Todd Tomorrow

        She slumps over like an abused child, It is so sad.

      • Missionary Kid

        If she has aged gracefully, I’d start looking for a Dorian Gray type portrait of her. DM gives such wonderful headaches and has a reputation for amping up the tension of those around him, neither of which would help a person age gracefully.

  • Hey, you under the radars out there. Anonymous needs you, LOL!

    The list of ex-COS members speaking out is approaching 2,500 entries. http://whyweprotest.wikia.com/wiki/Former_Church_of_Scientology_members_who_have_spoken_out

    Would be nice if we could have actually 2,500 entries when the Going Clear documentary is broadcasted on HBO at the 29th of March.

    Please consider coming out of the woordwork. :p

    Of course it will have to be your choice, and yours only.

    To qualify for the list we need proof of speaking out against the COS using your full name AND proof of having been in, such as Scientology completions ( http://www.truthaboutscientology.com/ ) or a well known ex to vouch for your.

    Of course you may also consider sending your story to Tony so he can publish.

    Let’s break RCS down under an avalanche of truth! πŸ™‚

    • Captain MustSavage

      There used to be a number count at the top, which I found very helpful. What happened to that?

      • There is a count in the first paragraph. Last line.

        • Captain MustSavage

          Thanks.

  • Tony Ortega

    Age of Answers ad playing at halftime of Indiana game on CBS here in NYC.

  • Heidi

    Anyone else getting Disqus replies re: Scientology from year-old or older posts? That’s started for me…

    • Free Minds, Free Hearts

      Is it Millie Rae about Little Acorns?

    • Millie Somebody was making a stink about my old posts about Little Acorns Grow but then they deleted their name from the comments.

      • Free Minds, Free Hearts

        I got that from Millie also – I told her to complain to Community Care Licensing, not to me, since CCL licenses preschools… and I gave her the info for the local CCL office…

      • Heidi

        Naw, I’m talking Radar of all places. They’re so…. desperate.

  • J. Swift

    I met Jason Beghe at a party held by Marc and Claire Headley when they lived in Burbank. Jason’s video with Mark Bunker was the proverbial “shot heard round the world” in these circles. Jason is very much “what you see is what you get.” No pretense.

    Jason’s video was extremely important because he was fearless and said what he thought. He could care less about OSA or David Miscavige or any of the Church’s nonsense. I admire Jason. He is a force of nature.

    There were a two parties hosted by Jason Beghe and Marc and Claire Headley, One was at Pyramid Lake and the other was at the beach at Santa Monica. John Peeler, Tory, Mark Bunker, all the SP’s were there. This is when the internet morphs into real life and you meet the real people behind the screen names.

    I remember the Pyramid Lake party because actor Larry Anderson, who stars in the Orientation video, had literally just left Scientology the day before. I was blown away. If Larry had left — and Tommy Davis had failed to handle him — then the Cult was falling apart at the seams.

    In this time period, OSA enforcers Kirsten Caetano and Mike Sutter were out breaking laws in an attempt to terrorize BFG, BTs2Free, and others who had left and were speaking out. If they did that stuff now they would probably get themselves arrested. Everyone in OSA belongs in prison. They really are criminals.

    On a related note, I just put up a post at the Money Project re: IRS Form 13909. This one page form allows anyone to make a complaint about the Church to the IRS – you can even complain about bogus fundraising claims and acts of terror.

    Let’s create a 13909 snowstorm at the IRS: http://scientologymoneyproject.com/2014/04/18/time-to-13909-the-church-of-scientology/

    http://i1284.photobucket.com/albums/a563/OTVIIIisGrrr8/13909.B_zpsi2kioicd.png

    • NOLAGirl

      Thank you Jeff. An IRS form that I am actually looking forward to filling out. πŸ™‚

      • J. Swift

        NOLAGirl, like I wrote at the SMP:

        SOMETHING CAN BE DONE ABOUT IT!

        * Deceptive fundraising practices by the Church of Scientology can be reported using the 13909

        * Each and every instance of Scientology misbehavior, lies in its PR or fundraising, and any other form of misbehavior needs to be reported. Use Form 13909.

        * Tweet this post and help educate the public and those with family and friends still in the Church.

        * It is high time to step up pressure on the Church of Scientology using the exact IRS technology to confront and shatter Scientology suppression and the SP’s in OSA!

        • NOLAGirl

          Tweeted. Also hashtagged Scientology and Going Clear. The more eyes the better.

          • J. Swift

            Thank you NOLAgirl.

            Because Scientology has 501(c)(3) status, it is up to the public to police Scientology and write up every single violation and lie.

            See fake PR with a lie? Report it.

            See misleading Craigslist ads? Print a copy and send it off with a 13909.

            The 13909 is the IRS’ version of Scientology’s Knowledge Report or “KR.”

            13909 the Church for everything and hold its feet to the fire.

            • NOLAGirl

              Also, if someone could repost a link to Jeff’s post later for the night-shift that would be great. Jeff, can people from outside the US file a report or no?

            • J. Swift

              The Church of Scientology International is US-based, Therefore, non-residents can complain by stating that a non-US licensee of CSI has engaged in a violation. The idea here is to show a pattern of national and international misconduct and violations.

            • NOLAGirl

              Thank you. Sorry for all the blathering questions but I’m ready to do something. I’ve been getting in touch with my local representatives to encourage them to watch Going Clear, but I want to do more.

            • J. Swift

              As the self-proclaimed “Scientology Answer Man” I work tirelessly to answer your questions about Scientology.

            • Keep asking those questions NOLAGirl. I needed those answers too!

        • Pepper

          Thank you for this information Jeff. I wonder what would happen if thousands of people started sending these in on the CoS? I’m downloading mine today.

          • J. Swift

            Pepper, if thousands of people send the IRS 13909 on documented violations then we will find out what happens.

    • Mary Smith

      what is the EIN number?

      • ze moo

        Employer Identification Number. A sort of social security number for businesses. Each clam ‘entity’ {not body thetan} will have a unique one. You should be able to find one for each clam entity on the property tax rolls or IRS 990 disclosure site. Some of them may be very hard to find.

    • Elle

      Thanks Jeff! I JUST finished a week of working on taxes but I will actually find delight in using the 990.

    • Juicer77

      For those of us never-ins who have no personal experience with the fundraising practices, what do you recommend we use as evidence? Just want to make sure the complaints have some weight to them.

    • Free Minds, Free Hearts

      Thanks Jeff. I can’t see the post over there yet. What entity should we complain about – CSI, CST, RCS? (I still get them all confused, so sorry). Seems like the complaints would pertain to the first two categories, personal gain and for-profit activities, also the improper fundraising. Maybe we should also send a copy to Congressman Raul Ruiz (he represents Hemet) and Congressman Alan Grayson (he represents Clearwater) and ask them to hold a hearing. Also to Oregon Senator Ron Wyden…

      • chukicita

        Excessive lobbying activities might be an interesting tack as well. And income used to support illegal or terrorist activities.

    • TheHoleDoesNotExist

      What are the requirements for evidence or documentation? That’s an important piece of the puzzle. Do you have all the information so we can figure out what is needed to be attached? The IRS keeps saying they are understaffed and underbudgeted, that they don’t check up on 501C’s unless someone complains so this is a good first step, but also said they don’t have time and resources to check for documentation – so any available would be that much more effective.

      If this is done along with writing, snail mail, to our Senators and Congresmen to amend the laws so that ALL religious institutions and entities benefiting from any tax exemptions are required to submit full disclosure of all their financials to the IRS and to public view.

      Scientology will try and play the religious card as long as the IRS stays silent about their secret agreement. They are already being investigated about favoritism for 501C’s, although that is only because of the right wing concerns. But showing favoritism on any one group might be a problem Unless there is a simultaneous letter writing campaign to the Senate and Congress to change the requirements for All religious entities. The timing is right as far as the American public will. We just need to thread the players who are on board with this to gather enough clout to solidify the political will

      http://i.imgur.com/lqVtdXv.jpg

    • ccyankee

      I’m looking at the line “Income/assts are being used to support illegal or terrorist activities”. Would a partial transcript in the Rathbun case in Texas (where the church admitted to harassing Monique Rathbun at her place of employment/home,etc.) be sufficient evidence to support “terrorist” activities? Sending her sex toys, claiming she was a man, harassing her family… Couldn’t that be considered terrorism, or am I over reaching?

      • This puzzles me too. State law seems to clearly characterise such behaviour as ‘stalking’. However, the Rathburn case is a civil, not a criminal action. If the offender has to be have been convicted of a criminal offence before you can make a valid complaint to the IRS about criminal activity (which seems fair) this case is not relevant.

        I suspect that the only reason the ‘squirrel busters’ were not arrested for stalking is that the police were too afraid of the likely consequences (having all of their budget for the rest of time used up in defending themselves against endless litigation from the CofS). I do remember Marty being arrested by police at one point, for objecting to the criminal offence clearly being committed against him.

        You are not over-reacting. It’s stalking, at the very least. The problem seems to be getting it successfully prosecuted. Like the IRS deal itself, this is a matter of practical politics, not law.

  • Todd Tomorrow

    Jason Beghe (born March 12, 1960) is an American film and television actor and critic of Scientology. As a young man he attended the Collegiate School in New York City, where he became best friends with John F. Kennedy, Jr. and David Duchovny.