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	Comments on: Sunday Special: Remembering Some People Who Mattered	</title>
	<atom:link href="https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/</link>
	<description>TONY ORTEGA on SCIENTOLOGY</description>
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		<title>
		By: Toni m		</title>
		<link>https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-2/#comment-492314</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Toni m]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 18 Mar 2014 20:58:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tonyortega.org/?p=10883#comment-492314</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[This was a great article.  I knew only about Lisa&#039;s story at that time but with the links I learn about other wonderful people.   This was a good learning experience for someone&#039;s poor knowledge in scientology&#039;s evil ways to treat others.

Mr Milton amazed  me in his fight for denounce scientology, he dedicated time, money, his security.  Is sad he did not live to see what is happening now,  he will be very happy.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This was a great article.  I knew only about Lisa&#8217;s story at that time but with the links I learn about other wonderful people.   This was a good learning experience for someone&#8217;s poor knowledge in scientology&#8217;s evil ways to treat others.</p>
<p>Mr Milton amazed  me in his fight for denounce scientology, he dedicated time, money, his security.  Is sad he did not live to see what is happening now,  he will be very happy.</p>
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		<title>
		By: theoracle		</title>
		<link>https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-1/#comment-314591</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[theoracle]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Oct 2013 22:17:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tonyortega.org/?p=10883#comment-314591</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-1/#comment-295845&quot;&gt;Tony Ortega&lt;/a&gt;.

Well see there, Hubbard was not the only opinion leader to get miffed upon meeting with disagreement.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-1/#comment-295845">Tony Ortega</a>.</p>
<p>Well see there, Hubbard was not the only opinion leader to get miffed upon meeting with disagreement.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Tony Ortega		</title>
		<link>https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-1/#comment-295845</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tony Ortega]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Oct 2013 01:22:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tonyortega.org/?p=10883#comment-295845</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-1/#comment-295739&quot;&gt;theoracle&lt;/a&gt;.

No one is fooled when you talk about being &quot;Fair Gamed&quot; when it comes to making comments in blogs like this. In fact, every time you pull out that nonsense, you dishonor those people who went through Scientology&#039;s actual Fair Game retaliation. You do them a disservice. Not that it would ever stop you from your complete bullshit.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-1/#comment-295739">theoracle</a>.</p>
<p>No one is fooled when you talk about being &#8220;Fair Gamed&#8221; when it comes to making comments in blogs like this. In fact, every time you pull out that nonsense, you dishonor those people who went through Scientology&#8217;s actual Fair Game retaliation. You do them a disservice. Not that it would ever stop you from your complete bullshit.</p>
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		<title>
		By: theoracle		</title>
		<link>https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-1/#comment-295739</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[theoracle]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Oct 2013 23:35:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tonyortega.org/?p=10883#comment-295739</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-1/#comment-289200&quot;&gt;Bury_The_Nuts&lt;/a&gt;.

See Bury  The Nuts? You publish a complete false report, a blatant lie, (&quot;You always get shit here&quot; ) and look at the fabulous applause! I can count the times I was fair gamed here on one hand. I have posted here for years. I DO NOT &quot;Always get shit here&quot;.  Yet you publish it is as truth , and the support rushed forward to applaud you for publishing a false report. 


Not to suggest I do not find this kind of social course happening here, along with the fair gaming, amusing and enlightening.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-1/#comment-289200">Bury_The_Nuts</a>.</p>
<p>See Bury  The Nuts? You publish a complete false report, a blatant lie, (&#8220;You always get shit here&#8221; ) and look at the fabulous applause! I can count the times I was fair gamed here on one hand. I have posted here for years. I DO NOT &#8220;Always get shit here&#8221;.  Yet you publish it is as truth , and the support rushed forward to applaud you for publishing a false report. </p>
<p>Not to suggest I do not find this kind of social course happening here, along with the fair gaming, amusing and enlightening.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Peter		</title>
		<link>https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-1/#comment-293273</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Peter]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Oct 2013 10:16:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tonyortega.org/?p=10883#comment-293273</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-1/#comment-289034&quot;&gt;ThetaBara&lt;/a&gt;.

When one looks at the entire world and all the misery therein, almost all of which one can do absolutely nothing about, you could go very bonkers attempting to rationalize the harm done.  And rationalize is a very tricky word.  My dictionary says this:

&quot;attempt to explain or justify (one&#039;s own or another&#039;s behavior or attitude) with logical, plausible reasons, even if these are not true or appropriate&quot;.  That last phrase is the most important one.  It&#039;s extremely difficult to explain anyone else&#039;s actions and/or motivations without actual data/information.  Yet, in our need to understand the believe we KNOW, we do it anyway.  Then, worse, we add our own emotions into the mix, emotions which may actually be harmful to ourselves and inappropriate to the *actual* situation.



Can you truly say that you fully understand what anyone, especially someone you do not personally know, is feeling, thinking?  I&#039;ve heard countless comments on the list as to what DM&#039;s motivations are/were for his actions.  Many of them are dramatically different in tone and nature.  Which one is right?  Who on this blog can truly look into the thoughts and emotions of another?  Especially someone one doesn&#039;t know?


i&#039;ve seen all kinds of speculation as to why Leah did what she did, is doing what she&#039;s doing.  And each person thinks s/he KNOWS her motivations though they&#039;ve never once spoken to her.  Makes for good drama now and then, but hardly qualifies as &quot;Truth&quot;.  She&#039;s been publicly called a &quot;hero&quot; on this list, repeatedly.  For all any of us knows, that might well make her cringe.  Assigning someone that kind of role without knowing their *actual* motivations, and doing it very publicly, could be very harmful to them emotionally.


To quote you, &quot;some people lack empathy and just go on to victimize someone else.&quot;  The world has many people who, for one reason or another, lack empathy.  At least according to your belief.  It might be true, might not.  Yet you deliberately take on the personal burden of hating or disparaging that person.  By doing so, you burden yourself without having the slightest effect on that other person.  How does that help the situation?  What have you changed?  Many here, for instance, have repeatedly stated they &quot;hate&quot; DM or &quot;hate&quot; what some other person is doing or has done.  Hate is an extremely corrosive emotion.  It can do very nasty physical things as well as emotional ones to the hater.  And just what does all that hatred due to change DM?  Or effect him in any way?  What have you changed by doing so?  Just what is the point?



Human beings seem to have an inner demand to &quot;understand&quot; everything that puzzles them.  Being able to say &quot;I don&#039;t know&quot; appears to be almost impossible.  Yet that is the actual truth of the matter.  None of us knows the heart of a stranger no matter what we think.


As for the length of time it took you to forgive yourself, how does that even come into the equation?  You did what you did when you did it.  You can&#039;t go back in time and change it.  You had your reasons then, acted on the information you had or understood.  We all do that all our lives.  It&#039;s called &quot;learning&quot;.  Our greatest life lessons are learned by making mistakes.  Seems to be the way of the world.  (I have certainly made some monster mistakes in my life and often paid a dreadful price.  I can go on beating myself up and being neither of my value to myself nor to others OR I can acknowledge the mistake, take responsibiity for it, make amends where possible, do my best to understand the &quot;why&quot; of my error....and get on with my life, a better person to myself and others.  Wringing my hands and hating the person who &quot;did that to me&quot;, caused me to veer off into an incorrect road, does absolutely nothing for myself, the world, anyone else I know.)



So to answer your question of &quot;why should I forgive them&quot;, I say simply letting go is a very healthy thing to do for yourself and those you love.  To continue holding corrosive thoughts and feelings is an UNhealthy thing to do for yourself and those you love.


The above written with as much love and compassion as I can gather at this time in my life.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-1/#comment-289034">ThetaBara</a>.</p>
<p>When one looks at the entire world and all the misery therein, almost all of which one can do absolutely nothing about, you could go very bonkers attempting to rationalize the harm done.  And rationalize is a very tricky word.  My dictionary says this:</p>
<p>&#8220;attempt to explain or justify (one&#8217;s own or another&#8217;s behavior or attitude) with logical, plausible reasons, even if these are not true or appropriate&#8221;.  That last phrase is the most important one.  It&#8217;s extremely difficult to explain anyone else&#8217;s actions and/or motivations without actual data/information.  Yet, in our need to understand the believe we KNOW, we do it anyway.  Then, worse, we add our own emotions into the mix, emotions which may actually be harmful to ourselves and inappropriate to the *actual* situation.</p>
<p>Can you truly say that you fully understand what anyone, especially someone you do not personally know, is feeling, thinking?  I&#8217;ve heard countless comments on the list as to what DM&#8217;s motivations are/were for his actions.  Many of them are dramatically different in tone and nature.  Which one is right?  Who on this blog can truly look into the thoughts and emotions of another?  Especially someone one doesn&#8217;t know?</p>
<p>i&#8217;ve seen all kinds of speculation as to why Leah did what she did, is doing what she&#8217;s doing.  And each person thinks s/he KNOWS her motivations though they&#8217;ve never once spoken to her.  Makes for good drama now and then, but hardly qualifies as &#8220;Truth&#8221;.  She&#8217;s been publicly called a &#8220;hero&#8221; on this list, repeatedly.  For all any of us knows, that might well make her cringe.  Assigning someone that kind of role without knowing their *actual* motivations, and doing it very publicly, could be very harmful to them emotionally.</p>
<p>To quote you, &#8220;some people lack empathy and just go on to victimize someone else.&#8221;  The world has many people who, for one reason or another, lack empathy.  At least according to your belief.  It might be true, might not.  Yet you deliberately take on the personal burden of hating or disparaging that person.  By doing so, you burden yourself without having the slightest effect on that other person.  How does that help the situation?  What have you changed?  Many here, for instance, have repeatedly stated they &#8220;hate&#8221; DM or &#8220;hate&#8221; what some other person is doing or has done.  Hate is an extremely corrosive emotion.  It can do very nasty physical things as well as emotional ones to the hater.  And just what does all that hatred due to change DM?  Or effect him in any way?  What have you changed by doing so?  Just what is the point?</p>
<p>Human beings seem to have an inner demand to &#8220;understand&#8221; everything that puzzles them.  Being able to say &#8220;I don&#8217;t know&#8221; appears to be almost impossible.  Yet that is the actual truth of the matter.  None of us knows the heart of a stranger no matter what we think.</p>
<p>As for the length of time it took you to forgive yourself, how does that even come into the equation?  You did what you did when you did it.  You can&#8217;t go back in time and change it.  You had your reasons then, acted on the information you had or understood.  We all do that all our lives.  It&#8217;s called &#8220;learning&#8221;.  Our greatest life lessons are learned by making mistakes.  Seems to be the way of the world.  (I have certainly made some monster mistakes in my life and often paid a dreadful price.  I can go on beating myself up and being neither of my value to myself nor to others OR I can acknowledge the mistake, take responsibiity for it, make amends where possible, do my best to understand the &#8220;why&#8221; of my error&#8230;.and get on with my life, a better person to myself and others.  Wringing my hands and hating the person who &#8220;did that to me&#8221;, caused me to veer off into an incorrect road, does absolutely nothing for myself, the world, anyone else I know.)</p>
<p>So to answer your question of &#8220;why should I forgive them&#8221;, I say simply letting go is a very healthy thing to do for yourself and those you love.  To continue holding corrosive thoughts and feelings is an UNhealthy thing to do for yourself and those you love.</p>
<p>The above written with as much love and compassion as I can gather at this time in my life.</p>
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		<title>
		By: aNon Scilon		</title>
		<link>https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-1/#comment-292802</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[aNon Scilon]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Oct 2013 23:49:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tonyortega.org/?p=10883#comment-292802</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-1/#comment-292602&quot;&gt;An Theta&lt;/a&gt;.

I just changed it! :-0]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-1/#comment-292602">An Theta</a>.</p>
<p>I just changed it! :-0</p>
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		<title>
		By: An Theta		</title>
		<link>https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-1/#comment-292602</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[An Theta]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Oct 2013 22:38:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tonyortega.org/?p=10883#comment-292602</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-1/#comment-290578&quot;&gt;N. Th8ta&lt;/a&gt;.

A fantastic name, too!]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-1/#comment-290578">N. Th8ta</a>.</p>
<p>A fantastic name, too!</p>
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		<title>
		By: EnthralledObserver		</title>
		<link>https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-2/#comment-291196</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[EnthralledObserver]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Oct 2013 01:51:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tonyortega.org/?p=10883#comment-291196</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-2/#comment-291064&quot;&gt;marti&lt;/a&gt;.

:)  Thank you.  Yeah, I know... I just made a mistake, I know. *hugs to you for being so sweet to remind me*]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-2/#comment-291064">marti</a>.</p>
<p>🙂  Thank you.  Yeah, I know&#8230; I just made a mistake, I know. *hugs to you for being so sweet to remind me*</p>
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		<title>
		By: marti		</title>
		<link>https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-1/#comment-291087</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[marti]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Oct 2013 01:11:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tonyortega.org/?p=10883#comment-291087</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-1/#comment-289934&quot;&gt;Jeb Burton&lt;/a&gt;.

@Jeb Burton, I will wade thru Theta&#039;s comments. 
She has more guts in her little pinkie then you do in your whole body, Thank you very much.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-1/#comment-289934">Jeb Burton</a>.</p>
<p>@Jeb Burton, I will wade thru Theta&#8217;s comments.<br />
She has more guts in her little pinkie then you do in your whole body, Thank you very much.</p>
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		By: marti		</title>
		<link>https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-2/#comment-291064</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[marti]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Oct 2013 01:03:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tonyortega.org/?p=10883#comment-291064</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-2/#comment-289931&quot;&gt;EnthralledObserver&lt;/a&gt;.

EO, You are not a twit.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://tonyortega.org/2013/10/13/sunday-special-remembering-some-people-who-mattered/comment-page-2/#comment-289931">EnthralledObserver</a>.</p>
<p>EO, You are not a twit.</p>
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