I disagree, I’m sure a lot of corporations envy the slave labor system Hubbard set up, and the way he made not meeting quotas sacrilegious.

I was just talking number of members.. You prob have a point if all facilities and all the business fronts are considered.. Sorry.. =)

I am becoming increasingly afraid of Dentists and Chiropractors.
Really….I am now going through the trash of my last Chiropractor in case I get a crick in my neck again. I want to be completely comfortable that he is not a closet Scion.
Nope, nothin to see here except fear that the wackadoodles can exploit my Blue Cross Blue Shield benefits!
Bastards.

Hey Chuck.

Thanks for relating that. And thanks for addressing me at all in spite of my rejection of steelydan logic.

I had a really similar experience with a different book, Winter’s “Dianetics: A Doctors’s report.” Although he believed there was someting of value in Dianetics, he also includes summaries of actual sessions. When you look at his conclusions in view of the way things went down, the whole argument to falls apart.

@deselby88 It’s the sucker born every day syndrome condition that so many of us have/had, which keeps Scientology afloat. I hear from some of the newbies, who get lured in, and it’s the same old lure story.

Hubbard even noted that the negative coverage of Scientology lured some in to see what the truth was.

I myself, was an Arizona State Univ student at the time I foolishly joined, and even after my first week in, I then spent 2 weeks in my spare time in the ASU library, reading all the past magazine and newspaper articles critical of Scientology. I was disappointed not to have a good layman’s language dissection that was really well written, to get to the point, and provide me with the arguments that might have deflated my gullibility syndrome.

The highly critical generalities by the media (even more biting and accurate than today’s tamer criticism) were not satisfying.

I grew up in the late 1960s and early 70s when wide searching of alternative spiritual stuff went on.

If anything, one of my long term writing goals, has been to write the book I wish I had found in the ASU library, that would have really wised me up on all the other gullibility factors I suffered from.

For me, it would have taken knocking out all of the various legs that Scientology stands on, not just knocking out the known obvious bad legs of Scientology, the totalitarian abuses vindictive stuff that Scientology heaps on its followers and ex followers.

I had to finally knock out the philosophical legs, the soul’s existence even, the fact that in human history ALL the groups that claimed to offer supersoul powers are all bogus,and that the spiritual ESP past/future lives stuff are bogus.

Just the mob gullibility of eastern religion traditions, of astral walking and even past and future lives, Karma over long spans of lives, all seemed to wide open the door to Hubbard’s science fiction narrative version of past and future lives.

With Sea Org members, with their “We Come Back” motto, and “Have You Lived Before This Life”, and I got in when the now out of print “Dianetics Today” 1975 edition, came out.

In Dianetics Today, 1975, are actual Dianetics therapy session work paper summaries of the sesisons, with past life discoveries of the patients, and the Hubbard 1975 version of Dianetics procedure was very exacting in how the therapist guided the patient to earlier and earlier past lives, and into further back science fiction adventures.

So, past and future lives, just is a huge leg, that is widely, or was widely believed, in eastern religions, and had a HUGE bearing on me even giving credence to Hubbard’s Dianetics procedures.

I urge people give a look to the “Dianetics Today” 1975 edition. It in a single book, gives the biggest leg, that I had to knock out, philosophically, which I did, to really begin to lose Hubbard and Scientology out of my life.

I’m atheist again, and lost the past and future lives belief.

Oh, yeah. 1970. Thats when scientology had 9 ships the size of the Freewinds. And 9 bases the size of Hemet. And they had sprawled over 9 towns the size of Clearwater. And there were thousands of Narconons. And when they threw a party, it wasn’t a tent with 5,000 people in St Hill, they rented a stadium for the 45,000 who showed up. Right.

Well, I just don’t think making up bs is the way to get rid of the blight of scientology. Its absolutely as bad now as it ever was, except that they have more revenue streams and more ways of recruiting.

Yea, it’s a hard sell, for so many reasons.

I’m an atheist, to answer your question,above. I only think mathematics and physics and science is worthy of explaining what is really real.

I like lots of wise eastern religion wisdom is great to think about. ( I read and listened to Zen Buddhist Alan Watts and other hippy eastern speakers, like Baba Ram Dass, but I think alot of their passed along ideas are BS waste of time advice and not that great though.)

I’m currently listening and reading the pre-Socratic philosophers, I like Parimeniides and Anaxminader, the Greek philosophers before Socrates, free online great simple lectures:

https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/history-of-philosophy/id396903391

Much better to get a college wide liberal education, is my advice to ex Scientologists, to dislodge the Hubbard indoctrination out of one’s head.

Hubbard’s Freudian slips and Freudian slip metaphors, are a whole article by themselves. Bank, Clear, Release, Auditing, Keep the Show on the Road, Meet you on the other side of the Bridge, the Bridge,

His pulp era training in imaginative adventure writing, with pulp story plots, if you could read all he wrote, you would see the style.

I’d say the hopeful gullible minds that enjoy pulp adventure, and the sci fi adventure mindset, it fits in.

The fantastic cosmic theater platform, is all through Scientology teachings, and past/future lives adventures, are in our pasts, and in our futures, like Hugh Urban says in his book, the Sea Org staffers are like Hubbard’s Old Doc Methuselah series, Soldiers of Light.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ole_Doc_Methuselah

Hubbard’s Sea Org absolutely has roots in Hubbard’s pulp ficiton author’s mind, and if you were a believer in the super soul powers regaining story line of Hubbard’s Bridge to Total Freedom, gradient layout of re attaining your lost soul powers, then it fits.

The totalitarian barbs and control methods, all through the setup, all by Hubbard, to keep those caught in his fantastic science fiction religion, are just part of the bargain, for regaining one’s supersoul powers, and helping others, like the tight juggernaut of staff followers (Sea Org members) who carry the burden of pushing forward Hubbarfd’s show. Keeping the show on the road, per Keeping Scientology Working!

Hugh’s book and Janet’s book, they get this. Hugh by showing the Hubbard sci fi swashbuckling side of Hubbard, you see that part, which is displayed by Hubbard in his staff writings, and particularly the LRH Executive Directives, LRH EDs, which I think are important, to see Hubbard’s most frank inspirational talk straight to the membership. “From Clear to Eternity” deserves detailed inspection.

The “Birthday Game” deserves detailed inspection. There’s much in his writings, that the gullible hopeful supersoul powers seekers who believe in a sci fi past and future lives narrative, this whole sci fi world mindset is reality, to the Hubbardites.

Sorry Rene,

I don’t. I’ve wished to go tour the stashes of material in the various universities, like Univ of Alberta, UC Berkeley, UC Santa Barbara and the other places Hugh Urban utilized for his book, and see who has what.

The way that study of the Hubbard output stands, a lot of material is out there, sitting in boxes unrealized for what it is.

Likely the University collections, and Ursula Caberta’s massive collection, and some of the private collections, need someone, a wooden headed nerd (bert) like me to go through the piles of crap, and index it, and do a paper on what is where, for the pro writers to then decide which pile of crap to sift through, for their own purposes.

At the Flag course rooms I ran in my heyday, at Clearwater, our setup had several filing cabinets of the rare goodies, and we had access to the filing cabinets down the street of the OODs and every other of the oddball sub issue types by Hubbard,and one of the ex Sea Org speaker outers, Dan Garvin, he was the Mimeo Files In Charge, and saw untold amounts of the limited distribution writings.

Sadly, the best we have is what is sitting in boxes unknown, at the various universities, and one of us who knows the issue types, needs do a tour of the university stashes, and write up what it where.

So, sorry, I don’t know. Since Scientology has legalistic claims to their limited distribution materials, and the OODs are in that category, in their own minds that is, then some universities might not wish even an expert like me to go do an index of what they have, for fear Scientology will hassle them (not sure this is true, but might be my paranoia).

Point well taken.

I was so indoctrinated, if you knew more details, you’d see even more proof of what you say is so true.

Which has various ironic effects, in that this wooden headedness I display, is emblamatic of the mindset of the trained (conditioned, indoctrinated) Scienotologists, and rings bells in their heads.

Very annoying, to say the least.

I try to walk the people I interact with, out of the wooden-headed-ness Hubbard mindset, but displaying it to those reaching to get out, helps them identify with a sympathetic ear, mine, and I try to walk the callers who call the 866-XSEAORG out the other side, back to normal thinking.

It’s covered in the “Snapping” book, by the two psyches, who say coming down out of the Hubbardism mindset (Scientology) takes longer than coming down out of any other NRM cult.

Point well taken.