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When Scientology makes you a villain, you understand that it rules its members by fear

Jon_AtackJon Atack is the author of A Piece of Blue Sky, one of the very best books on L. Ron Hubbard and Scientology. He has a new edition of the book for sale, and for more than a year on Saturdays he helped us sift through the legends, myths, and contested facts about Scientology that tend to get hashed and rehashed in books, articles, and especially on the Internet. He was kind enough to send us a new post.

It was great to see you again in London, Jon. And thanks again for sending along a new piece. We talked a little about this subject at the Old Mitre Pub the other day, but we’re glad to see you go into it at length…

JON: Former members often tell me that when they were in the cult, I was considered extraordinarily dangerous: a bête noir, indeed. Thirty years on, I should be used to this thought, but when I look in the mirror I don’t see a fiend with horns and a tail. Instead, I see a usually smiling and generally genial man who has always been puzzled by the fear and loathing of Scientologists.

At Toronto, my friend Gerry Armstrong took me to task from the stage for averring that I am not at war with Scientologists and never have been. I am not out to destroy anyone. My aim has always been to help those who have been taken over by Scientology, if I possibly can. I accept Gerry’s point of view – that Miscavige and co. are at war with me – but if I felt hostile towards Scientologists, I would find some other outlet. I do not and I never have.

I may sound off occasionally about those who harassed my family, but whoever asks my forgiveness will very probably receive it. This has nothing to do with sanctity on my part (sadly, far from it). It is a practical decision. I really have understood that we are all connected and that hatred always breeds more hatred and eats the person who feels it alive. I probably wouldn’t be very forgiving if you hurt my kids, but that is a different matter. I was deceived by Ron Hubbard and I have empathy for anyone else who fell for his silly ideas. I simply don’t have the constitution for those hateful “down tone” behaviours that characterise the Guardian’s Office of Special Affairs and so many believers.

When I interviewed the “World’s First Real Clear,” John McMaster, three decades ago, he told me he had vehemently disagreed with the progressively aggressive policies that Hubbard issued about so-called “Suppressive People” back in the 60s. John detested “Disconnection” and “Fair Game.” He remonstrated with Hubbard to no effect. In Scientology terms, his argument was that disconnection is no more nor less than “non-confront;” and, as Hubbard said, “The first step of handling anything is gaining an ability to face it.” (Scientology: a New Slant on Life).

Of course, it can be helpful to take time out when tempers flare, but relationships are not helped by long-term or frequent silence. John believed that the only way to deal with “suppression” (or “disagreement” as we non-Scientologists sometimes call it) is to face it and heal it. As we know, Hubbard was more interested in “shattering” suppression, but offered no “technology” beyond harassment, which quite evidently has not worked (thirty years on and I still haven’t shattered). McMaster felt that Scientology would fail until methods to heal “Suppressives” were developed. Hubbard seems to have believed that Suppressives are permanently so, and he had no idea what to do about it. So, it wouldn’t matter how clear the universe became, there would always be a war between good and evil.

Some of the Gnostic sects were keen on this, and Hubbard even had members of the Sea Org surveyed to find out whether they had been “Soldiers of Light” or “Soldiers of Darkness” while his little flotilla was still at sea. It is worthy of note that he promoted the Dark ones and demoted those who clung to the Light.

A few weeks after I left, I was in the supermarket. I turned to see my former landlady, who had turned toward me at the very same moment. I smiled and was about to say, “Hi, Cedar” when she leapt from the ground – like a character in an animation – and scarpered just as fast as she could. Now, I was one OT level higher than she, but this was the first time I realized my newfound power: Scientologists were scared of me! Maybe leaving Scientology had finally conferred supernatural powers on me? Or maybe phobia induction is a bad idea if you truly want to “confront” the world.

A couple of weeks before, I was just a chap who had rented an apartment from her, with whom she had been on friendly terms. With the rumour of my defection, I had transformed into a very devil.

“Phobia induction” is a great way to bind a group together, but it is not a way to make a great group. Moonies are told that if they leave True Father’s service, not only will they burn in Hell, but so will their parents, and, indeed, all of their ancestors; quite a risk to take!

Lapsed Krishnas become “deadly demons” and will have to restart their incarnations all over again; and it takes 84,000 lives from bug to human. When I was leaving Scientology, the threat was newly bruited that we would “lose” our “immortality.”

As Hubbard said – in 8.8008 – “all logic is based upon the somewhat idiotic circumstance that a being that is immortal is trying to survive.” It is a ridiculous notion that an eternal soul can lose its immortality (I know I put it down here, somewhere…). But I spoke to people who did not share my and Hubbard’s amusement at this idea; indeed, they were terrified.

Hubbard derided “Heaven” as an implant station much like Busch Gardens in Pasadena once was (some years after reading the Heaven Bulletin, I visited Pasadena and found that they had indeed paved paradise and put up a parking lot). Hubbard derided Heaven, which meant that he couldn’t keep us down with Hell. The best he could offer was the loss of our immortality (which is, by the way, the whole purpose of Hinduism and Buddhism, who regard reincarnation with the “fear of eternal return”); go figure.

Early on, I realized that experienced Scientologists find it ever harder to communicate with unbelievers. Indeed, a couple of weeks after joining, I moved into a flat with a very enthusiastic Scientologist. Asked if he had any aversions, he grinned and said “Wogs!” I had never heard Hubbard’s perverse use of this racist term (forget “worthy oriental gentlemen”; growing up in England, at exactly the time that Hubbard adopted the term, I know that it was a synonym for the n-word). I quietly responded that I had close friends who were charming and intelligent Indians. He laughed, but it was a statement of phobia, or repulsion.

Although I was not a staff member, I was shoved out among the streetwalkers of Moseley with a clipboard to lure strangers into the Franchise (I was too naïve to realize that many of the women on those streets were also recruiting). The staff pulled the door closed quickly, once I was outside. I did not see even one of them out “body routing” during the eight months I was at the Franchise (and yes, the term “Mission” was still interchangeable, which other “religion” runs on the McDonalds model?). This was before the franchises were devastated into submission by “senior management” (a/k/a Ron Hubbard, who really did organize that conference in October 1982 – unless of course he had lost his OT powers by then).

I have seen the same pattern throughout the world, which is why my little leaflet was so successful at closing down both the East Grinstead centre and the Chichester Mission – the new recruit would scurry back inside and ask if the description of OT III was true, be lied to but then told that he or she must now have a Class VIII auditor at double the cost. By this time, I knew that no OT III would ever deign to talk to “wogs.” They simply don’t have the “confront” even though the purported “end phenomenon” of OT III is “freedom from overwhelm.” Believe me, I’ve overwhelmed some OT IIIs in my time!

Hubbard called Scientology the science of communication. He insisted that communication is the basis of Scientology. He even said, “More communication not less is the answer.” But he didn’t really mean it. Not only are Scientologists inveigled into “disconnecting,” they also must not talk about their problems (their “case”), their criticisms (“missed withholds”) or Scientology’s teaching (“verbal technology”). I know that I keep saying it, but a guaranteed outcome of the lowly Release Grade 0 is the “ability to communicate with anyone freely on any subject.” Any subject except Scientology, your problems, your doubts and fears and as long as it is not with the 17,500,000 Suppressives out there (if Hubbard’s 2.5 percent of the population is to be believed).

In the counter-cult world you will often hear about phobia induction and even guilt induction, but I wonder about the induction of repulsion. Disgust is one of six basic human emotions recognised by social scientists (though it failed to make it to the “Tone Scale”). The manipulation of disgust, or repulsion, unifies people without the need to consult their intelligence.

In every genocide, the perpetrators regard the victims as vermin. Nazi propaganda portrayed Jews as rats and they were commonly called “fleas.” One allied commander told his troops that they need not worry about killing the Japanese, because they were “monkeys.” Hubbard called those who refused to toe his line, or pay tithes, “squirrels.” If you want your followers to tear someone to shreds, first dehumanise them.

Even in Scientology, I had no difficulty reading hostile texts – except for Kaufman, in case I was ‘exposed’ to OT III. So it came as a surprise that repulsion and phobia usually make it impossible for believers to even glance at my writings. My friend Jesse Prince said that it took him years before he could read Let’s sell these people A Piece of Blue Sky. Now, he recommends three readings (and please do buy a new copy, each time).

It gladdens my heart whenever someone tells me that my work has helped them to break the conditioning of the Scientology mind-set. But it breaks my heart to know that many people do not even dare to touch my work for fear of contagion. Every now and then, some “independent” Scientologist rails against me, with embarrassing fervour, even when they haven’t actually read my work. I suppose that they are simply expressing the dreadful fear that their beliefs may be wrong, and that their immortality is about to dissipate.

Hubbard said “A man is as dead as he can’t communicate. He is as alive as he can communicate.” How little “self-determinism” is left to someone who dare not even hear criticism, let alone consider it. If we are to be self-determined, we must be brave enough to consider opinions – and evidence – that diametrically opposes our own beliefs without fear or repulsion.

John Stuart Mill, that beacon of good sense, should have the last word, from his vital essay, On Liberty: “…if opponents of all important truths do not exist, it is indispensible to imagine them and supply them with the strongest arguments which the most skillful devil’s advocate can conjure up.” And so say all of us.

 
——————–

EyeSauronThe Eye of Sauron is upon us

More than once, we’ve heard Scientology’s private investigator shenanigans described in a certain way. For the folks who were in Going Clear, for example, Scientology’s familiar “noisy” investigations and harassment tends to come and go, and it really stepped up early this year as the film was coming out. When that happens, we’ve heard people say that it’s because David Miscavige has suddenly turned his attention on you, “like the Eye of Sauron.”

It’s an apt analogy. You might go months or years with no attention, and then suddenly people you know are calling, saying that they’ve been contacted by private eyes asking about you. When that happens, you know that Miscavige has suddenly turned his gaze in your direction, yelling at his underlings and demanding to know why you haven’t yet been “handled.” You know that you’re in for weeks or months of sliming by his minions as they spread slander about you and put everyone who knows you on edge.

We’re telling you this because it appears the Eye of Sauron has turned our way again. Last night we got a call about someone pretty remotely connected to us getting hit up by Scientology’s private investigators for information.

Here we go again.

As we weather the storm yet again, we thought we’d put the word out in a more public way to our friends and family — get ready for a call or a visit — and we thought we’d ask our readers: What is it, do you think, that made Miscavige look our way? Was it…

1. ‘Going Clear’ winning three Emmys?

2. Reminding the public that Shelly Miscavige has been banished for a full ten years?

3. This picture?

4. Our Cat White coverage?

5. Or something else?

Tell us what you think.

 
——————–

Freedom, where are you?

We just noticed that the September issue of Scientology’s propaganda magazine Freedom is still up, and we’re more than half way into October. What gives?

In July 2014, Freedom was relaunched after having gone dark for about a year. Before that, Freedom had been coming out about once a year and was super funny. It took wild shots at targets like Lawrence Wright and The New Yorker, Marty Rathbun and his “Posse of Lunatics,” Anderson Cooper, and the St. Pete Times.

But then, with the July 2014 issue, Freedom re-emerged with a serious (and boring) outlook, and with a whole new staff that had been hired in Los Angeles. With editor Jennifer Lankheim in Los Angeles and John Sugg in Florida, the magazine took earnest looks at issues like the country’s crumbling infrastructure and poorly performing schools.

Lately, however, Freedom‘s Denver-based reporter, Dan Luzadder, has been tailing Lawrence Wright around the country, and when he showed up at our talk in Denver, he told us he was going to prove that Wright “did no research” for his book Going Clear. (That’s funny, because we’ve personally spoken to something like a hundred people who were interviewed by Wright for his book, which was in fact one of the most heavily researched we’ve ever read.)

Is Freedom going to revert to its attack-dog days, and is that why it’s late for October? Well, we suppose we’ll find out sooner or later.

 
——————–

Moviepilot gets punked with Jennifer Lawrence hoax

We saw a number of people yesterday sharing an article at Moviepilot titled “These 8 Xenuphobic Celebrities Boldly Spoke Out Against Scientology.”

It was the usual predictable stuff about Leah Remini and others who have left the church. But the final item claimed that Jennifer Lawrence had turned down an opportunity to audition as Tom Cruise’s new girlfriend. It linked to a hoax article at the fake news site World News Daily Report, which claimed that Lawrence had been approached at a charity event by David Miscavige and Kendrick Moxon.

The thought of Miscavige and Moxon cruising actresses at a Hollywood event was pretty hilarious, we have to admit, but it’s not something Moviepilot should have been peddling as an actual story. (Moviepilot even used a photo of Lawrence in its graphic for the story.)

Let’s keep vigilant for the fake stuff, folks.

 
——————–

Jenna and Bodhi are at it again

We just can’t bear to watch these two. We’ll let our readers tell us what this one is all about…

 

 
——————–

BOOK NOTES
3D-Unbreakable

We didn’t get a chance to include photos in our book, so we’ve posted them at a dedicated page. Reader Sookie put together a complete index and we’re hosting it here on the website. Copies of the paperback version of ‘The Unbreakable Miss Lovely’ are on sale at Amazon. The Kindle edition is also available, and shipping instantly.

Tony Ortega’s upcoming appearances (and check out the interactive map to our ongoing tour)…

 
Oct 23: Sydney, Giant Dwarf Theatre (with Steve Cannane and Bryan Seymour)

Oct 25: Melbourne, The Wheeler Centre, 3 pm, free but reservations recommended (with Steve Cannane)

Oct 28: Adelaide, Wheatsheaf Hotel, (with Sen. Nick Xenophon)

Oct 30: Perth, Collins Street Centre, Collins St and Shaftesbury St, South Perth, 7 pm

Past dates: Santa Barbara (5/16), Hollywood (5/17), Orange County (5/17), San Diego (5/20), San Francisco (5/22), New York (6/11), Chicago (6/20), Toronto (6/22), Clearwater (6/28), Washington DC (7/12), Hartford (7/14), Denver (7/17), Dallas (7/20), Houston (7/22), San Antonio (7/24), Austin (7/25), Paris (7/29), London (8/4), Boston (8/24), Phoenix (9/15), Cleveland (9/23), Minneapolis (9/24), Portland (9/27), Seattle (9/28), Vancouver BC (9/29)

 
——————–

Posted by Tony Ortega on October 17, 2015 at 07:00

E-mail your tips and story ideas to tonyo94 AT gmail DOT com or follow us on Twitter. We post behind-the-scenes updates at our Facebook author page. Here at the Bunker we try to have a post up every morning at 7 AM Eastern (Noon GMT), and on some days we post an afternoon story at around 2 PM. After every new story we send out an alert to our e-mail list and our FB page.

Learn about Scientology with our numerous series with experts…

BLOGGING DIANETICS: We read Scientology’s founding text cover to cover with the help of LA attorney and former church member Vance Woodward

UP THE BRIDGE: Claire Headley and Bruce Hines train us as Scientologists

GETTING OUR ETHICS IN: Jefferson Hawkins explains Scientology’s system of justice

SCIENTOLOGY MYTHBUSTING: Historian Jon Atack discusses key Scientology concepts

PZ Myers reads L. Ron Hubbard’s “A History of Man” | Scientology’s Master Spies | Scientology’s Private Dancer
The mystery of the richest Scientologist and his wayward sons | Scientology’s shocking mistreatment of the mentally ill
The Underground Bunker’s Official Theme Song | The Underground Bunker FAQ

Our Guide to Alex Gibney’s film ‘Going Clear,’ and our pages about its principal figures…
Jason Beghe | Tom DeVocht | Sara Goldberg | Paul Haggis | Mark “Marty” Rathbun | Mike Rinder | Spanky Taylor | Hana Whitfield

 

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  • jazzlover

    O/T: Mets and Cubbies in 30 minutes. It’s cold here in NY. They need to reduce regular season by a few games.

    • salin

      baseball, the near year round sport.

      • jazzlover

        LOL. At least the snow would cleverly hide the sight of grass growing 😉

        Gimme more hockey, dammit 🙂

        • salin

          Only hockey around here is minor minor league (if it still exists.). Old team had more visitors come to watch the mascots known as The Three Elvi. 3 Elvis impersonators trolling the arena!

    • Miss Tia

      GO CUBS!!!!!! (Sorry Tony, come on, the Cubs need this!!)

      • jazzlover

        Hey!

        • Glen

          Danial Murphy is out of his mind.

          • jazzlover

            3 of his 4 homers against lefties.

    • MaxSpaceman

      back to the 154 game season. a no brainer.

      if MN Twins ever win it, there will be: “World Series Game tonight- Snowed out.”

      • jazzlover

        All sports too greedy.

        • Mockingbird

          Don’t you enjoy subsidizing billionaires via taxes while education, infrastructure, the environment and social programs are annihilated through austerity measures ?

          And it has been reported that American colleges spend more money on athletics than education, while cutting programs.

          • jazzlover

            Not to mention the whole continuing to push the myth of the “American dream”. There was a documentary that came out a couple of years ago and then mysteriously disappeared quickly. It was about how much revenue the fed makes on student loans. Would be nice if the fed guaranteed jobs to go with all the debt incurred. Also, I’ve been reading that state subsidized colleges have been quietly reducing the ratio of in-state students to out-of- state students they accept, all in the name of increasing revenue.

            With regard to your comment…….ahem……Penn State Penn State Penn State. What?

            • Mockingbird

              Well in many countries college is considered a human right. Guaranteeing jobs is tough. Does that include low paying jobs ? Unpaid internships ?

              Just having corporations and the millionaires and billionaires actually pay taxes without loopholes would cover it. Reportedly two point one trillion dollars is hidden in tax havens, which shields over four hundred billion dollars in tax revenue from collection. That money could cover health care, education, good jobs to rebuild infrastructure and convert to cleaner renewable energy which would limit pollution and greatly improve our energy independence which would increase our national security through non-violent means.

              But corporations and the wealthiest people block that.

            • jazzlover

              FDR tried to get ‘right to work’ into the Bill of Rights. I know that guaranteeing jobs is tough, but with all the sending of jobs overseas and such, simple economics should dictate that the cost of an education should be dropping, not rising. Hopefully, people will realize that college education makes no guarantees other than huge debt, and will act appropriately. There are no such things as professional students anymore.

              And yes, M-Bird, I share your frustrations on all your “money talks” points. It’s becoming clearer to me that we need some sort of social revolution for things to change. The wheels turn much too slowly because of our an oddly strict adherence to the basic “principles” on which our country was founded. The system of checks and balances in place makes it virtually impossible to enact significant change for the better quickly.

            • Mockingbird

              I have to agree quite strongly. As an interesting position for me as an ex cult member I recognize tremendous danger in mass movements and have read Eric Hoffer’s great book True Believer while also having seen people like historian Howard Zinn and Noam Chomsky and Chris Hedges make the point that social progress requires mass movements. They discuss the abolitionists, civil rights, Vietnam war protesters, suffragettes , labor movements and throughout history other examples.

              So I am conflicted. We appear tobe in desperate need of improvement regarding issues that I feel all come down to human rights like income inequality, institutional racism, neoslavery, police brutality, corporate greed and influence in the political system, and even war crimes and atrocities by our country and our allies. All come down to violating human rights. Even our grossly polluting the environment violates human rights: those of the people that will have to live in a toxic wasteland. No amount of money will fix that.

            • jazzlover

              I think most reasonable people such as myself (a never-in any cult, btw) share your conflict, Mockingbird. I am seeing disillusionment, disenfranchisement and alienation all around rising at record paces. The result is that we’re seeing the creation of the new “ME” generation. Gosh, if Kurt Cobain had the sense to wait another 25 years, he really would have been on to something 🙂

        • Mockingbird

          Don’t you like subsidizing billionaires with tax dollars ? While cutting education ?

          • jazzlover

            Is this “deja vu” or something? 😉

  • sizzle8

    Re Eye of Sauron: Probably ‘all of the above’ plus more.
    I’m sure Tony is under constant surveillance. In fact, I’d be suspicious of any neighbors that have recently moved into his building, particularly if they are close neighbors.
    If Broeker and Ron Sr. and Marty and Karen and a dozen other ‘threats’ merit their own PI’s, and if Tony is currently the most visible and effective, then …

    • Ruby

      I agree.

    • Joe

      That’s so heartbreaking to me. I would hate running into someone or starting up a conversation and in the back of my mind having to go, “Wait, is this person a spy?”

      It’s what makes the story of Paulette and Paul so amazing is that she finally found someone who she knew had no connection to Scientology because she met him before she started investigating.

    • Ella Raitch

      If Paulette was Miss Lovely, what is Tony’s OSA operation code name

      • Robert Eckert

        “Most Interesting Man”?

        • Ella Raitch

          Mr Urbane

          • Robert Eckert

            I keep forgetting that not everybody sees American commercials. There has been a series of these:

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-4zfsy6rsM

            • Ella Raitch

              Ha – I’ve seen the memes but never the ad before.

            • Andrea ‘i-Betty’ Garner

              That’s bloody hilarious, Robert.

            • Robert Eckert

              There’s a bunch of them. “When he’s watching a movie and shouts at the teenage girl ‘Don’t go in there!’ — she doesn’t” etc. Eventually it was beaten into the ground, but as commercials go they were quite clever.

      • TonyOrtega

        ‘Refried,’ probably.

        • Kestrel

          Ouch.

  • MaxSpaceman

    On Louis Theroux’s documentary.

    “I cannot give away all the priceless moments. I can state that from
    beginning to end you feel how the cult is continuing by the day to
    become more and more mentally unhinged.

    “You do not feel for one second
    that it is a *Church* or *Religion*.

    “You continue to connect the dots
    for yourself and Louis cleverly lets you deduce from his footage how a
    cult can descend into its own brand of Cuckoo’s nest.”

    — by Karen de la C. @ https://www.scientologybollocks.com/scientology-facing-alien-cult-threat-from-another-wacky-space-religion-the-the-galactic-federation-of-light-and-the-ashtars/

  • OOkpik

    Tony, if you want not to incur the wrath of COS, you are doing EVERYTHING wrong, bless you.

    Besides the above, how about…

    Damning daily disclosures on your blog.
    Numerous highly “suppressive” interviews.
    Wide-spread admiration and respect.
    Impeccable investigative and communication skills.
    A wealth of knowledgeable and reliable sources.
    The world-wide distribution of The Unbreakable Miss Lovely.

    And more… all terrifying to Miscavige.

    Bad Dawg!
    <3

  • mon elle

    For the Tolkienites … if Miscavige is Sauron, that makes Hubbard Melkor.

    For the non-Tolkienites, Melkor is the original dark lord and boss of Sauron (who is a pale but still evil, malevolent copy).

    The thought of Miscavige as Sauron is quite appealing and appropriate.

    Appropriate in that there is very little DM won’t do to bind others to do his will, even if doing results in unwittingly setting the foundation of his destruction.

    Appealing in that the tower of Baradur will fall.

    http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/lotr/images/8/82/Melkor_by_formenost.jpg

    • beauty for ashes

      So too Hubbard, like Melkor, left a trail of dark gas behind him. 😉

      • mon elle

        Undoubtedly just as putrid, noxious and flammable.

        The only thing more lethal being my dog’s farts when under the duvet.

        And Miscavige singing.

        But I digress.

  • TonyOrtega

    M U R P H Y

    • Glen

      He is out of his mind right now.

      • MaxSpaceman

        He’s exteriorized, three feet ‘in front’ of his head, he’s seeing the ball so well.

        • Glen

          It seems like a big statement game for Matt Harvey.

        • outraged

          I can still hear my neighbors screaming while running out onto Amsterdam Avenue when the Amazin’s won the Championship in 1986. I had never seen such an outpouring of solidarity and wondered if there was a way to channel that energy…..

          Here’s Murphy!:….

        • TonyOrtega

          Weird story, completely true. After my event in Clearwater with Paulette, I was in the Tampa airport waiting for my flight. I turned towards the convenience shop in the terminal near my gate, and a little guy was walking toward me, leaving the same shop. “I know this guy,” I immediately registered. But his name didn’t come to me right away, and I didn’t say anything as he walked right by me to the gate. Later, as I was picking up an item in the shop, it finally hit me. That was Daniel Murphy.

          Sure enough, he was in first class as I went back to my seat in coach. I couldn’t help noticing what a young little kid he looked like to me in his street clothes. It turns out he’d rehabbed in Tampa for a shoulder injury, and he was flying back to NY to rejoin the team.

          Well, it didn’t mean anything in the scheme of things, but I’ve enjoyed watching him since that day as he’s really torn things up. I just wish my brain had worked quicker that day and I might have had a chance to have a little conversation with him away from anyone else.

          • Glen

            very cool

          • MaxSpaceman

            “… a little guy was walking … He looks formidable on television. But, then, you and I are both bigger than Daniel. I woudna guessed that.

  • Re: “The Eye of Sauron is upon us” – RTC/OSA, before you guys do anything even more stupid, realize that even if a bird takes a shit on Tony or any critic – you will be first to suspect. The Internet investigates your every step.
    So yeah.

  • aegerprimo

    Miss Lovely on the coast of Maine. F5

    • Sherbet

      I recognize that place. Cape Neddick, Nubble Light.

      • MaxSpaceman

        Ah. How I love the west coast of Maine.

        • TonyOrtega

          West coast?

          • MaxSpaceman

            😉

          • Sherbet

            AKA New Hampshire.

  • MostEthicalPimp

    http://www.instructables.com/id/How-to-make-a-David-Miscavige-or-any-one-paper-m/
    +
    Scientology Mission of the Foothills:
    We will be participating in the Montrose “Halloween Spooktacular” held every year! Stop by to trick-or-treat…and check out our kid-friendly haunted house!

    =
    good time!

  • Sena Rainey

    This may be off-topic, but have any of you guys heard about David Jolly running for Senator? He has ties with $cientology. http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2015/10/16/scientology-could-get-its-own-senator.html

    • TonyOrtega

      Made a note of it in yesterday’s post.

      • Sena Rainey

        Thanks. I’ll check it out.

        It’s been a long time since I’ve been on here.

        • Andrea ‘i-Betty’ Garner

          Welcome back!

  • TonyOrtega

    H A R V E Y

    • Susan black

      Who harvey?

    • Xique

      Let’s Go Mets!

    • Susan black

      This more baseball? Ok, enjoy the game. I’ll check in later…:)

    • Ella Raitch

      Just got into the living room to find Mr Raitch is watching this game too

      • Ella Raitch

        We’re seeing bottom of the fifth here – is that live?

        • jazzlover

          Yes. Mets just went up 2-1.

          • Ella Raitch

            Magic…I can watch with you guise

            • jazzlover

              In New York it’s “youse guys” 🙂

            • Ella Raitch

              That expression would be well understood in Australia

            • jazzlover

              LOL. It’s usually associated with that “element” in Brooklyn which employs cement shoes.

        • TonyOrtega

          You mean, I can watch my Mets in Australia?

          • Ella Raitch

            We have ESPN on Foxtel – many hotels have Foxtel but ESPN is premium – I’m sure you’ll find someone with it if it is not in your accommodation!

          • Robert Eckert

            You are taking it for granted the Mets will still be playing in a week– from anybody except the Most Interesting Man in the World, that might act as a jinx.

  • L U L Z

  • MaxSpaceman

    Granderson! The Grandy man can 🙂

    • jazzlover

      Almost makes me feel benevolent enough to forgive his 4 years in the Evil Empire 🙂

  • TonyOrtega

    46 years of watching baseball. I have never seen that.

    • TonyOrtega

      (Meaning, went to my first Dodger game at 6, so that’s how I measure it. And I’ve never seen the ball tap the pitcher on the back — here I am! And he still makes the play.)

      • jazzlover

        If I may ask, why did you stop being a Dodgers fan? My dad grew up a Dodgers fan when they were in Brooklyn.

        • TonyOrtega

          When I moved to NY in 2007, I planned to be here for a while, so I wanted to adopt at least one local team. I had no affinity for the local football or basketball franchises, and I soon discovered that the Mets’ announcing team — Gary Cohen, Keith Hernandez, and Ron Darling — was the best I’d found after growing up on Vince Scully and Chick Hearn. And I’m a National League guy and could never root for the Yankees. So I became a Mets fan. And, like you do, I suffered. So this year has been a real treat.

          • jazzlover

            At least you were lucky enough to miss 2006 😉 As I’ve made clear here, I’m a lifer, so I’ve done a lot of suffering (with all the teams I root for). The Mets, as you probably know, were MLB’s “gift” to NYC for losing both the Dodgers and Giants in the same year. I grew up in Queens, so it was a natural to be a Mets fan, especially since my dad was a Dodgers fan. Some of my favorite memories of my teenage years (70s when the Mets were dreadful) occurred when me and my friends would take a subway out to Shea on a hot summer afternoon, buy nosebleeds, and end up sitting like kings in the box seats behind the dugout by the 5th inning because there were usually fewer than 5,000 people there 🙂

            • TonyOrtega

              For me, it was seeing Manny Mota winning a game with a pinch hit in the bottom of the ninth at beautiful Dodger Stadium after a great game of pitching by Charlie Hough or Don Sutton. But as much as I grew up a Dodger fan, I had been away from LA for so long, I wanted to root for a home team.

            • jazzlover

              LOL. I remember Manny Mota like it was yesterday……and Hough and Sutton 🙂 Weren’t you torn during the NLDS?

            • TonyOrtega

              Only a little. I lived for the Dodgers when I was 11. After the last out in the 1974 series, when I was weeping over the A’s win, I’ll never forget my mother saying, Oh, Tony, it’s just a game.

              Now THAT hurt.

            • jazzlover

              I know how ya feel. The A’s broke my heart the year before. They beat Seaver and Matlack in games 6 and 7. I was stunned.

            • Rasha
            • jazzlover

              LOL

          • MaxSpaceman

            Kids were captivated by Vin Scully and Chick Hearn making games come to life. I loved them both.

            • Glen

              If you were a kid growing up in LA it was the transistor radio under the pillow listening to Vin Scully late on a school night.

            • jazzlover

              I grew up with Bob Murphy, Ralph Kiner and Lindsey Nelsen as the Mets TV announcers.

            • Doc M

              They did the the radio also. 3 innings TV, than 3 innings radio. Channel 9 was the TV but can’t remember the radio station, do you?

            • jazzlover

              WOR 710 AM (2014–present)
              WFAN-FM 101.9 FM (2013)
              WFAN 1050 AM (1987–Oct. 7, 1988); 660 AM (Oct. 7, 1988–2013)
              WHN 1050 AM (1983–1987)
              WMCA 570 AM (1978–1982)
              WNEW 1130 AM (1975–1977)
              WHN 1050 AM (1972–1974)

            • Doc M

              don’t you sleep?

            • jazzlover

              So, I go out of my way to any your question, and that’s what you come back with? LOL. You may be out west, Doc, but you still wear that “New York snark” well 😉

            • Doc M

              In the genes,

              Was talking to a NY friend a couple of weeks ago, reminiscing about growing up in NY.

              The topic of “Rank Out” fights came up and we realized that nobody outside of the city would have a clue as to what it was, much less be good at it.

              The other thing was a certain word that’s a part of the NY lexicon, and you hear it all the time. I mean constantly from everybody, yet in California, I’ve rarely heard it. Care to take a guess?

            • jazzlover

              Ha ha. I couldn’t even venture a guess — there are just too many examples. Besides, I’m currently listening to the Larks box and Fripp has my brain cells all a-skittered 🙂

            • Doc M

              Hint: Jewish derivation.

            • jazzlover

              Yiddish? schmuck?

            • Doc M

              yup
              later on in life I found out that it is actually Hebrew for erect penis.
              You really never hear it in California, but as you know, every other word in NY is schmuck. One of those quirky things.

            • jazzlover

              Given that it’s relatively common in sitcoms, you’d think that the Hollywood “cult” would have some knowledge of it. Or don’t Californians watch TV? LOL

            • Doc M

              Californians, by law, are only allowed to watch “Californication” or “Streets of SF”. Censorship is pretty tight here.
              Another thing in SF and Northern Ca. is that nobody and I really mean nobody uses their car horns. It might sound like an exaggeration, but it’s really true. If you ever get to SF, you’ll notice it immediately. I sure did.

            • jazzlover

              I’ve been. It’s a great city, but I was too caught up in my fascination for trolleys to notice any cars 😉

            • Doc M

              Not trolleys….cable cars….damn NY’er

            • jazzlover

              Yo meh, we had ’em here at one time too 🙂

            • Doc M

              The cable cars actually have large underground continually moving cables which pull them when the driver attaches to it. Really interesting. The city is down to 3 routes, but apparently in the day there were 20 or more covering large parts of the city.

              It really is a beautiful city but you really can’t get good Italian food to save your life.

            • jazzlover

              Is that awesome place that people used to line up for pancakes and other breakfast treats still there? How ’bout Le Petit Boulangerie (which used to be owned by Pepsi)?

            • MaxSpaceman

              Harvey Haddix, Pirates, threw 15 no-hit innings, then lost 1 to 0 in the 16th.

            • TonyOrtega

              Also, Dad letting me watch the 11 pm broadcast of the UCLA road games on the black and white TV. Johnny Wooden was the closest we came to worshipping a god.

            • Glen

              Ah, the Wooden years.

            • jazzlover

              I had to think about that for a second 😉

            • Jimmy3

              Mondays in the fall were the one school night I was allowed to stay up past my bedtime, to watch Monday Night Football with my pops. There was always something special about that.

          • Bob

            Wow, that makes sense. I guess I will shift for this series. Since the Dodgers blew it.
            I went into a store today that had bobble head replicas of the whole dodger team and they were all facing the wall except Vince Scully. I almost took a picture of it, it was so funny.
            Go Mets!

        • Doc M

          Jazz, does Bob Murphy, Lindsey Nelson and Ralph Kiner mean anything to you? Or Kiner’s Korner?

          But Rizzuto was the most entertaining, at least to me. Yea, different borough.

          • jazzlover

            My friends and I used to laugh hysterically at Rizzuto’s broadcasting inadequacies, so yeah, he was the most entertaining. Both NY teams had “cheesy” broadcast teams, but the Yankees’ team went above and beyond. They were horrible. Since they were bought by Steinbrenner, they haven’t appeared anything like the “flagship” baseball franchise they should be. They may as well be owned by that other dimwit, Donald Trump. Even Jim Dolan puts on a better show.

      • It reminds me that one time when Reds beat Bengals!
        (Disclaimer: I have no idea what I’m talking about.)

        • Andrew Robertson

          As far as I’m concerned there was only one sporting event today, New Zealand versus France at Cardiff in the World Rugby Cup.

          The All Blacks scraped by, 63 – 13. (Good) Next South Africa then (probably) Australia.

          Andrew

      • MaxSpaceman

        My first game was via television, the Yankees in a World Series; was 6, too. There were no Dodgers in town to go to at the time.

  • Ella Raitch

    He hit the apple!

    • TonyOrtega

      Yes he did.

  • NOLAGirl (Stephanie)

    I’m enjoying a perfectly good Florida – LSU game and who does the camera pan to?

    Tom Cruise
    In Tiger Stadium
    I’ll need time to heal from this.

    • Ella Raitch

      No crowd booing?

      • NOLAGirl (Stephanie)

        Not sure if they showed it on the stadium screen but I didn’t hear any.

        A shame really. 🙂

        • Miss Tia

          From the bunker, for NOLA:

          BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!
          BOOOOOOOOOOOOO TOM CRUISE BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!

          • Glen

            They booed the heck out of him at Dodger stadium.

            • Miss Tia

              I know! They probably were all like ‘wtf is he doing here?!’ They should have yelled “show us your tits!” and then threw beads at him!!

            • Glen

              ha

            • NOLAGirl (Stephanie)

              *snort*

        • Supper Powers

          The new Scientology building opened there recently. Related to that or a movie?

          • NOLAGirl (Stephanie)

            More likely a movie or was just invited by friends. I don’t think Tom does “mission openings” they’re below his station (at least in his mind).

            • Miss Tia

              well his friends would have to be scienos, right??

            • NOLAGirl (Stephanie)

              *shrugs* We’re playing Florida, anything is possible.

            • ReallyMGM

              Someone told me he is there filming new Jack Reacher movie. Don’t know the reliability if it. I do trust her on LSU stuff though. And she is very anti Scion.

    • Supper Powers

      Nooooooooo!

    • jazzlover

      You poor girl. I think someone should poor YOU a drink this time 🙂

    • Miss Tia

      dafuq he doing there? oh wait, he’s trying to pretend he’s a florida resident or something? o_O

      • NOLAGirl (Stephanie)

        Thought I saw him with LSU fans but that doesn’t mean anything, we party with all fans. 😀

        NO IDEA why he’s here girl!! From the above tweet it appears it’s his first college football game. Even though I want to shower because he’s that close, he did pick a good venue for his first game. *gag*

        • Miss Tia

          dafuq?! he needs to get off your lawn turf!!!

    • Supper Powers

      At least he’s drinking Community.

      • NOLAGirl (Stephanie)

        I hope his jet is warming on the runway to take him back to….wherever….as soon as this game is over.

        • Supper Powers

          Louisiana now feels dirty in a different way.

  • NOLAGirl (Stephanie)

    I can’t…. (thanks Louisiana resident for mentioning that you were urinating when this happened. smh)

    https://twitter.com/DellengerAdv/status/655556524916342785

  • Andrea ‘i-Betty’ Garner

    What is a METS? What is a Dodgers? 😛

    • TonyOrtega

      Mets is short for Metropolitans.

      Dodgers were originally from Brooklyn, and it referred to dodging streetcars.

      • Andrea ‘i-Betty’ Garner

        Thank you very much for that sensible answer. I was rather expecting to be invited to leave the Bunker on a permanent basis 😀

        • TonyOrtega

          Now, who can tell us why the Los Angeles basketball franchises are named the Lakers and the Clippers?

          • Kestrel

            At one time the Lakers were based in Minnesota, a state known for its lakes. The Clippers were based at one time in San Diego, which was once a base for sailing ships.

            • Glen

              And Utah Jazz. Really?

            • NOLAGirl (Stephanie)

              They got that from New Orleans. 🙂

            • Glen

              Yea, but jazz is so non-Mormon.

            • Kim O’Brien

              i think it’s like ” Jazz Hands ” …Mormon punk rock

              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xuPSIbABYVU

            • Glen

              So wholesome

            • Kim O’Brien

              pretty sure he has a butt plug in. But that is just a guess

            • Glen

              ha

            • Ella Raitch

              I watched this with the sound turned down and singing ‘My Little Buttercup’ from ‘Three Amigos’ in my head

            • Chee Chalker

              What….was…..that…

            • TonyOrtega

              Actually, it’s because Salt Lake City is secretly a hive of soul duds and slow jams.

            • NOLAGirl (Stephanie)

              Hehehehe!!!

            • jazzlover

              LOL.

            • Sebastian L. Jackson

              Now Tony, can you tell me where the Richmond Flying Squirrels got their name from?

            • Tony Ortega

              Out-tech apostates in gliders.

            • Ella Raitch

              Hubbard flew a glider once….

            • Sebastian L. Jackson

              A contest choosing a new name was held after Richmond gained the Giants’ AA team. Someone submitted “Flying Squirrels” and ended up winning.

            • Robert Eckert

              UC Santa Cruz similarly made the mistake of submitting the question to their student body. That is how they got to be the Banana Slugs.

            • Glen

              Ah, Giants AA farm team. I never knew the story of their name.

            • TonyOrtega

              Correct

            • Doc M

              Interesting!!!

          • NOLAGirl (Stephanie)

            Don’t know about the Clippers, but the Lakers were originally a Minnesota team and it comes from their lakes right?

            • TonyOrtega

              Yes

          • Doc M

            Lakers came from the “The land of 10,000 Lakes” Minnesota, but Clippers I don’t know

      • EmmaDaoust

        Let’s go Blue Jays!

      • Doc M

        “Trolley Dodgers” to be exact

    • Miss Tia

      mets is what tom cruise thinks mest is cuz they didn’t cure his dyslexia that he probably didn’t have anyway….a dodger is what some men do in massage parlors when travolta walks in…..

      • noseinabk

        Thank you for staying on topic. (lmao)

        • Miss Tia

          well the topic today is easy to stay on, it’s like an everything bagel and oh gee wait, that’s like every day! 😀

      • Kim O’Brien

        i just spit out my cocktail ….you owe me a drink LOL

        • Miss Tia

          check with NOLA, she’s the usual bartender! 🙂

          • NOLAGirl (Stephanie)

            I’m on the chaise with a cold washcloth on my forehead. 😀

    • MEST, METS, who cares?

  • Jonathan Cummings

    I am shocked Bodhi or Jenna even speak to Bodhi’s mom since she is 1.1 (Covet Hostility) on the Tone Scale. L Ron Hubbard makes no secret in his writings and on tape how he feels about homosexuals. How these two can basically talk as if gay is OK makes me sick, but I guess it is an acceptable lie in this case. My take on Jenna and Bodhi ? Big Fucking Liars, who love the sound of their own voices. I hope Leah Remini has some juicy dirt on these two liars in her book!

  • Kim O’Brien

    Yankeeeeesss….suuuuuck

    just wanted to get that in there .

  • Bunkerados just scored!!

    • Jimmy3

      Awesome! I have the Bunkerados at -4700. But I also owe this other guy. I may be changing my discus name soon. Just a heads up.

      • Miss Tia

        gonna change it to flyonthewall4?

        • Jimmy3

          Flyonthewall4 is still in development. Might need to use the flyonthewall3 prototype. We try to build these things on a schedule, but we always get sidetracked just playing with Legos.

  • Utterly OT, but kitteh shirt! Dobots and Ronuts! Robot pillow! Butch Pansy, Momtoo 45 and I ended up at an open studio of one of my art heroes, Eric Joyner. Many things were purchased. Much delight ensued. Edit. All the pictures were upright when I took them. Why are they sideways?

    • Jimmy3

      This is great, and it reminds me of a movie I watched last night. Frank is available on Netflix and it’s definitely worth a watch. It’s a lot of subtle, absurdist humor, and I was grinning and giggling like an idiot the entire time. But there are some dark turns and twists you wouldn’t expect. It’s really good. Pleasantly smiling face.

      • Sherbet

        Ah, I’ve finally found someone else who has seen that movie. I liked it, too.

        • Frodis73

          Same here! I swear, I thought I was the only one that had seen it. I loved it, it was so good. Very sad, but it felt so real and honest regarding Frank. I don’t want to say too much…I’m sure you both know what I mean.

          • madame duran

            That last scene where Michael Fassbender’s character reunites with his band in the bar…it had me in tears.

            • Frodis73

              Me too. I also think that song is quite catchy.

          • Sherbet

            It was a nice surprise. I had no idea what it would be like when I chose it from Netflix.

      • Isn’t Frank amazing? I treasure any cinema that can surprise me, no matter how flawed.

    • Juicer77

      Ronuts!!! XD

  • TonyOrtega

    M U R P H Y

    • Jimmy3

      Clutch play.

    • MaxSpaceman

      With the bat & the glove.

      First run, last out.

    • jazzlover

      Not sure why Collins let Harvey go out for the 8th, given that he wants him to pitch 2 games in this series (if necessary). Has he lost complete confidence in Clippard and Reed? Does he expect 2 innings saves from Familia every night?

  • Michael David

    Jodhi… Their careers are… wait for it…

  • Metaleros are going strong..

  • Asillem4

    Ugh. Babbling idiots. I got to the pile of shit with a drop of art in it….. CAN’T.LISTEN.ANY.MORE

    • There was also a droplet of God we all are, but full of shit, something something. Deep OT stuff.

  • Over and out. Have fun Sunday Bunker family.

  • Douglas D. Douglas

    Mrs. Douglas and I are waiting to see Tracy Morgan host SNL tonight. Just a reminder for the rest of the Bunker.

    • Jimmy3

      Dammit. With the baseballs and the footballs, I forgot all about that. I’ll catch it tomorrow.

      Btw, on the West Coast, don’t you guys just call it SN?

      • Douglas D. Douglas

        SNLRFALEB.

        • Jimmy3

          Saturday Night Late Repeat For a Lettuce Egg Bacon?

          Damn I’m hungry

    • sugarplumfairy

      He did great.. He is one funny guy.. So happy to see him looking so well.. Tina Fey was great too..

  • Spike Robinson

    Good Morning, early-rising British Bunkeroos – this is for you, and in honor of Tony’s recent visit to Jollie Olde, where my heart, if not my body, resideth:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9xMBhCPhS4s

    Please accept my most humble apologies; Xenu made me do it. To my fellow Yanks, imagine that I’ve just taken that one anthem that makes you wobble a bit inside, and then imagine I’ve done the following (it’s their unofficial national anthem over there, I’m told. And it’s just a damn beautiful melody. And now I’ve gone and done what I’ve done):

    Did Liver Lips in ‘59
    Pucker at St. Hill Manor green?
    And was the red head of L. Ron
    ‘Mid Dublin’s pleasant cobbles seen?
    And did he take it on the lam
    With teenage girls, his ship did crew?
    And was Clearwater built by a man
    Who never told the truth?

    Bring me my Body Thetans old!
    Bring me my 2-D of desire!
    Bring me that TV that I sold!
    Bring me out of finances dire!
    They will not cease to reg me dry,
    Unless I bravely turn away,
    And stay away from Clearwater’s lies
    And no more hard-earned money pay.

    (yeah, sorry I screwed up the last line. I would’ve fixed it, but when you’ve sunk this low…)

    • EmmaDaoust

      Love it, Spike!

      • Spike Robinson

        Thanks! I’m so evil…

        • EmmaDaoust

          In the best possible way! Good to see you! I just popped in to the Bunker, and here you are!

          • Spike Robinson

            yeah, I’m goofing off when I should be writing, as usual!

            • EmmaDaoust

              Need any name tags? 😉

            • Spike Robinson

              Oh! it’s you! hay there ! no, thanks, but thanks for everything ya did! 😀

              (I was wondering why the name rang a bell)

            • EmmaDaoust

              ’tis I! Oh hey, tweren’t nuthin! Glad to help.

            • Spike Robinson

              Still gonna write up my account of the Toronto conference – it’s just the Cranberry Quaffing Quixote is a slavedriver! 😉 And I’m having the time of my life!

            • EmmaDaoust

              I look forward to it! Oh, yes, he is quite the taskmaster, ain’t he. Yay, good on ya!

    • Kay

      That’s great !!

      • Spike Robinson

        Thanks!

  • Mary Smith

    Tom Cruise at the LSU game tonight–see Yahoo pics

  • man, I think this story takes the biscuit for scientology bollocks!….. CCHR didn’t get away with it’s bullshit this time!

    “Rising Corbyn star and group who say Bin Laden hypnotised into launching 9/11 attack”….

    A rising Labour Party star was the guest of honour at the launch of an exhibition by a Church of Scientology offshoot that blames the 9/11 World Trade Centre terror attack on psychiatrists.

    http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/midlands-news/rising-corbyn-star-group-who-10274219

    • Intergalactic Walrus

      What did she get from the clams for showing up, I wonder…

      • the current right wing UK press are going hammer & tongs at discrediting Corbyn, so much so that I’m starting to like the guy, that I dread to imagine how they’ll spin this

        • Intergalactic Walrus

          I think that any politician stupid enough to show up at a CO$ event, (especially the CCHR who’s website screams that they are an insane hate group) deserves to be spun into oblivion.

          • Frodis73

            I agree. There is NO excuse today, esp when we all can spend a couple minutes to google something like that. Unless it’s a group well known, like maybe the Red Cross, these people should take a minute to research it before committing.

            • Intergalactic Walrus

              I know right? There are no valid excuses for this. I think they figure they’ll just wait and see if there is any blow back and if there is, then they’ll use the old excuse that they didn’t know anything about it. Those CCHR exhibits are straight up BS and even a quick peek at it after she showed up would have been enough for any intelligent person (politician or not) to bolt the hell out of there and then apologize to her constituents for screwing up enough to have ever been there in the first place. She’d never get my support! No way.

            • Frodis73

              I agree. If you didn’t figure it out before the event, the minute you realize they are crack pots, you should call them on it and leave ASAP.

        • Edward Clarke

          So far, he has sympathised with every terrorist group that has attacked the UK, and taken the side of the one country who was in openly declared war with the U.K. in his lifetime.

          His opponents in Parliament are playing it all down at the moment. They can’t believe their luck.

        • Andrew Robertson

          I developed a dislike for Jeremy Corbyn back in his ‘loony left’ days in the’ 90’s thinking that he was destroying Labour’s chances of ever being elected. But wiser heads prevailed in the party and under Tony Blair’s leadership, Labour became electable again.

          I still remember that night in May ’97, I think it was, watching the election with a virtuous young lady I’d just met, who suddenly became unexpectedly amourous when the results
          came in. ‘New Labour’ may have become a bit tarnished as the years went by but I’ll always be grateful to it for personal reasons.

          Andrew

          • Sid (Phil)

            Too funny. Election results aphrodisiac.

          • Robert Eckert

            “Back” in his loony-left days? I am handicapped by being on the other side of the ocean, but my impression of him is that he combines the smarmy “fellow-traveller” attitudes of the Old Left (sure, Stalin wasn’t nice, but you can’t make an omelet without breaking some eggs) with the “gentlemanly anti-Semitism” of the Old Right (all in nods and winks, or what in America we call “dog whistles”) into a particularly toxic attitude. An alliance with the Scientologists makes perfect sense.

            • scottishinlondon

              Siding with the critics of Israel’s racist and genocidal policies isn’t antisemitism. And one young Muslim councillor being present at a CCHR meeting doesn’t mean that the Labour party or Corbyn are pro Scientology. It just means she didn’t do her homework.

            • Robert Eckert

              Siding with people who want to exterminate all Jews everywhere is antisemitism. He also sided with the IRA, although he would like to forget that now.

              “It just means she didn’t do her homework.” I doubt that very much. She is as natural a fit for a Scientology alliance as Louis Farrakhan.

            • scottishinlondon

              The IRA, like the armed groups in Palestine, were a necessary evil. When your country is invaded by an armed force you may need to take arms against it. A letter writing campaign won’t cut it. not going to go to bat for this clueless Labour councillor I am on a phone and can’t research her. I would ask you though what does she have in common with Farrakhan apart from being a Muslim?

            • Robert Eckert

              “The IRA, like the armed groups in Palestine, were a necessary evil” They were evil. That I will agree with. Nothing that either of them did has ever been “necessary” or done any good whatsoever for anyone.

              ” I would ask you though what does she have in common with Farrakhan apart from being a Muslim?” Like you (who apparently are not Muslim), she has in common an instinctive alliance with evil.

            • scottishinlondon

              “She has an instinctive alliance with evil” because she is a Muslim? Robert this is the sort of shit LRH might have come up with. After leaving him behind you might want to wipe your shoes. Antisemitism is not the only sort of objectionable racism.

            • Robert Eckert

              “”She has an instinctive alliance with evil” because she is a Muslim?” AS I JUST POINTED OUT TO YOU, being Muslim is not necessary to that: you appear to be non-Muslim and yet have the same instincts.

              Neither the Protestants in Northern Ireland, nor the Jews in Israel, are going to be exterminated or expelled, but campaigns of random murder against them make no sense except with that end. Certainly such actions do not “defend” Catholics or Muslims, as they do nothing to lessen the ability of British/Israeli soldiers to do harm, and certainly nothing to lessen the willingness to do harm (quite the opposite). The sorts of actions you, Corbyn, Khan etc. applaud are all about putting yourself into a “virtuous” group defined by opposition to dehumanized others, to whom any kind of evil can be done for its own sake, not for the sake of any rational purpose.

              “Antisemitism is not the only sort of objectionable racism.” It is, however, one of the more prominent sorts.

            • scottishinlondon

              The IRA were the military wing of a political group which succeeded partly in its aims due almost entirely to the pressure applied by the IRA. The IRA included people who were basically gangsters. Hamas and Hezbollah are likewise very iffy groups made up of some very unpleasant people but so is the IDF and Mossad. The naivety and the pretension to holding virtuous views is all yours in this argument. The idea that antisemitism is a special form of racism is a vulgar and pernicious one which has allowed the Israeli state to repeatedly get away with murder and ethnic cleansing.

            • Robert Eckert

              “The IRA were the military wing of a political group which succeeded partly in its aims” Oh? There is no prospect whatsoever of Northern Ireland being united to the Republic. The IRA caused numerous deaths and maimings and retarded the economic growth of the area, for nothing.

              “The IRA included people who were basically gangsters.” The IRA consisted entirely of people who were entirely gangsters. Stop trying to pretend there was something else.

              “Hamas and Hezbollah are likewise very iffy groups” There are no “ifs” about it.

              “The naivety and the pretension to holding virtuous views is all yours in this argument.” Bullshit. I am not going to be polite with you. You are on the side of people who commit murders for the sake of murder, not for any rational objective but because they believe that doing evil to people who deserve it is itself a form of good.

              “The idea that antisemitism is a special form of racism is a vulgar and pernicious one” There is nothing “special” about it, but it is particularly widespread and accounts for the willingness of Corbynites to side with terrorism in this particular case.

              “one which has allowed the Israeli state to repeatedly get away with murder and ethnic cleansing” When the Zionist immigration back to the old homeland started, it was Ottoman territory and there was no prospect that it was ever going to be otherwise. The decision by the Muslim leadership to treat immigrants as “invaders” to be burned out or murdered was exactly the same as Klansmen burning out black families who move into white neighborhoods, or German skinheads burning out Turks: that is the side that you are on. The further escalation in the 20’s to seeking the extermination of all Jews, whether recent immigrants or members of centuries-old communities, was religious prejudice at its most medieval ugliness: that too is the side that you are on. The decision to partition the area into two states could have been the basis of a peaceful settlement except for the insistence on the Arab side that they would accept nothing less than expelling or exterminating all Jews. The modern accusations that it is the Arabs who are being “cleansed” is just projection: Palestinians are in fact among the most rapidly growing ethnic groups in the world.

            • scottishinlondon

              The IRA did not begin after the creation of the Republic of Ireland; the only reason the Republic of Ireland exists now is because of the IRA. To this extent Sinn FeInn was successful, and it was achieved by armed conflict. Whether this was worth the loss of human life is another question but that’s what happened and how it happened.
              As for the situation in Israel there will always be a difficulty when a state is created and the rhetoric of an empty land is used to justify it. Cleansing is exactly what has taken place; whatever the rights and wrongs of the creation of the state of Israel, the palestinians haves gradually become foreigners in their own land. I have no interest in your good opinion, but don’t tell me whose side I am on, you know nothing about me.

            • Robert Eckert

              “The IRA did not begin after the creation of the Republic of Ireland; the only reason the Republic of Ireland exists now is because of the IRA” You understand perfectly well that I was talking about the Provisionals and the events of recent decades, not a century ago. Corbyn of course was not involved in the Home Rule controversies of the 19th century; that is not what we are talking about.

              “As for the situation in Israel there will always be a difficulty when a state is created and the rhetoric of an empty land is used to justify it.” You have some propagandized fantasy of the history in your head. The state of Israel was created along with a state of Palestine as part of a partition plan, not because there was any failure to understand that there were both Arabs and Jews in the country, but because it was understood perfectly well that they were in the country and had been fighting for decades. The Arabs launched a war of extermination, and lost it. International recognition was then offered to both sides on condition of accepting the cease-fire: Israel accepted and became a member of the UN; Mufti Husseini’s “Government of All Palestine” refused and was recognized only by Egypt, and then suppressed after the Mufti’s agents murdered the king of Jordan.

              “Cleansing is exactly what has taken place” It happened in both directions. The Jews expelled from the Arab countries were only slightly lesser in number than the Arabs expelled from Israel; there were many larger ethnic displacements during the 40’s which was a very violent decade: the Germans displaced from their eastern provinces, the Muslims expelled by India, the Hindus expelled by Pakistan, and the Chinese fleeing the mainland after they took the anti-Communist side were all larger refugee streams. We don’t hear about the others because they were resettled long ago. The Arabs are the only people on the planet who refuse to take care of their own.

              “the palestinians haves gradually become foreigners in their own land” They dug the hole that they are in by themselves, and continue to dig. They can stop it at any time, and you do them no favors by telling them to continue.

              “don’t tell me whose side I am on, you know nothing about me.” I know only what you choose to reveal about yourself.

            • Robert Eckert

              Suppose, for example, that I told you this version of the Irish story: in 1970, Catholics moved into Northern Ireland and demanded that all of it be declared theirs, and started killing Protestants for no reason. Anybody with even slight familiarity with the history would retort that Catholics had never been absent from the North, and were the descendants of the only people who lived there before some violent expulsions of centuries earlier, and that the violence of the 1970’s and onward was an escalation of tit-for-tat violence in both directions that had a long and tangled back-story.

              And, anybody who didn’t even have any familiarity with the history would take it for granted that some prior history did exist, that it didn’t just erupt out of nothing. But this is the Palestinian narrative the trendy left buys into: in 1948 the Palestinians were just sitting there minding their own business when suddenly these Jews whom they’d never heard of before erupted into their country and started killing them and kicking them out of their homes for no reason. The Palestinians want to erase the preceding decades of conflict and the centuries of back story that precede it, because their part in that story is not very honorable– but what is your motivation for blithely believing that there is nothing more to the story? It basically comes down to the premise that Jews are more like demons than people, who do wicked things for no reason just because they’re Jews. It is one thing to say “Criticizing Netanyahu’s government is not the same as anti-Semitism” (I do, in fact, despise Netanyahu and think it most unfortunate someone like him is in power at this time), but it is quite another to claim that it is not anti-Semitic to believe Israel arose out of motiveless malignancy.

            • scottishinlondon

              I am curious. what action do you think is appropriate when your country is invaded, your land is seized and your country folk attacked and imprisoned?

            • Robert Eckert

              When Israel was invaded, they fought back and won. Palestinians lost territory, as nations usually do when they start wars of aggression and lose them: Germany and Japan similarly lost territory and ended up under occupation, because they lost, because they deserved to lose. The difference is that the Germans and Japanese do not hang on to delusions that they are going to time-trip back to the 1940’s, re-fight the war, and win this time.

        • 9001

          I like Jeremy Corbyn. I met him yesterday. I’m joining the party and I’ll be volunteering to work for him. I’ll ask him about this CCHR story.

          • Robert Eckert

            Jeremy Corbyn is the kindest, bravest, warmest, most wonderful human being I’ve ever known in my life.

            • Kim O’Brien

              i have been watching BBC and i watched their debates . I love that Corbyn won . He seems like an actual good person. Kind of like our own Bernie Sanders . I hope he does really well and gets support ….that story about the PM with his dick in a pig ‘s mouth …was just ..um …( what is the word i am looking for ?? LOL ..)

            • Robert Eckert

              The pigfucker is, in fact, a disgusting example of a right-winger born to privilege and unconcerned with anyone else. Corbyn, however, is far from a nice person: he actively allies with the most murderous factions active around the world.

            • scottishinlondon

              yes I am pretty impressed by Corbyn so far. He seems to be a man with real integrity. The trouble is that he has never had to compromise. Time will tell whether he can make a difference.

            • Juan Negro

              Well played.

    • scottishinlondon

      oopsy daisy

  • Lady Squash

    Jenna and Bodhi are so precious, just gotta say.

  • Newiga

    Sorry if this has been posted previously but Chris Shelton has posted a new Q&A video.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Od7TBSkpM84

  • you Americans and your baseball!!

    pic

    • Frodis73

      That is fantastically funny…and sad.

    • anoni81b4u

      I understand, I would not take it in the ass for royals tickets either … LMAO
      nice find lush!

  • Ella Raitch

    Tony, I’ve checked the gig guide for the night of your stop in Perth. Some band from the ’70’s called Fleetwood Mac? Supported by the excellent Angus and Julia Stone. Apart from that it sounds like a quiet time in the ol’ town.

    • seriouslyWTF

      Some band from the 70’s, Fleetwood Mac? You’re killing me. Loved their music. Am I really that old?

      • Ella Raitch

        Just kidding…I know a song or two!

  • Frodis73

    Getting ready to head to bed and I notice the movie ‘Old Dogs’ (with JT and Robin Williams) is on. I also note that Kelly Preston and JT’s daughter are also in it with him. Too lazy to google it, but I wonder if Kelly can get a job w/out a clam connection. I know she was on Krustie’s show, was in Jerry Maguire with TC…and I’m sure there are more. I have the movie on and am only half paying attention but it is pretty awful. Sad that Robin took this job.

  • valshifter

    Bodhi acts like a silly little boy trying to get rapport from her mom, doesn’t act like a husband, both of them are weird.

  • Pierrot

    *** RED X +–+ Reminder +–+ RED X *** Sunday, 18 October 2015.

    Good morning Night Owls and Early Birds,

    Wednesday 14th: NO SCORE
    Thursday 15th: San Antonio scraped in and saved the day
    Friday 16th: a silver lining with New York achieving a good score.
    Saturday 18th: SFBay scraped in and saved the day.

    RedX tips & Complaints procedure are included in the google doc under the RedXTips tab.
    Flag the lies, whack a few bait & switch ads : https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1-Kvg78kCcvo5gL7UfPcmhmbsagTNtdj0y2LAiHVFrCU/pubhtml

    F5… Hunger Games Mocking Jay enhanced by DodoTheLaser for RedX, flickred by Aeger Primo https://www.flickr.com/photos/120371503@N05/17035021672/in/set-72157642802079293

  • madame duran

    Re: Elfman video
    I only made it as far as 57 seconds in–not even a full minute–and I had to stop. I tried to watch but just couldn’t do it. They are too annoying . I guess these podcasts serve to entertain themselves while waiting for a steady job to come along?

    • Edward Clarke

      I don’t know much about them, so had no preconceptions. But yeah, I lasted about as long as you. God, they’re unbearable.

    • OOkpik

      You did better than I. Couldn’t stand it, especially after the great article by Jon Atack. Talk about night and day!

  • Bleuler

    I find myself wishing for another high-level defection, who’ll talk. Would love to know what the pint-sized pontiff with a proclivity for profanity is getting up to inbetween chugging copius ammounts of scotch and demanding to see our proprietor getting a “wall to wall ass-ripping”! Can’t be very happy in the Dwarvenführer’s bunker right now (not that it ever was).

    • OOkpik

      “pint-sized pontiff with a proclivity for profanity”. Great alliterative description.

  • valshifter

    The Eye of Sauron

    • OOkpik

      Report to Ethics…NOW!!!

    • richelieu jr

      The Sigh of Moron

  • Intergalactic Walrus

    Clam Eduardo Galan was always given me the creeps but this is just too much. Ugh!
    PHOTO CAPTION – “Viva la vida!!!”
    https://instagram.com/p/88nxOdg6yG/?taken-by=eduardogalan

  • valshifter

    The 2006 video leeks pissed him off.

  • Juicer77

    Just finished watching The Truman Show (again). Such a great movie. Bravo, Mr. Carrey.

    • Graham

      My all-time favourite movie. And not typical of Carrey’s work, which is usually more ‘zany’ than suits my taste.

      • Juicer77

        You may like The Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind also.

  • donald king

    The Elfmans prove one thing – that Scientologists can sit down and talk drivel non-stop just like ‘wogs.’ Are these people REALLY Scientologists? What will Ron think of them when he comes back to Earth?

  • Susie Serve

    Even though it’s the next day , and a new article is up to peruse, this one by Jon Atack has given me much to contemplate, like a new, fresh feedback for an old, seasoned horse. The quality and quantity of what he packs into every sentence give me a need to let it sit for quite awhile before response here will give what I want to give.

    I could not be less interested in B. and J.’s podcast but want to return and to explore the valuable contribution of Mr. Atack and will continue reading whatever I can find, written from his research, knowledge and wisdom.

  • FOTF2012

    Maybe Cat White was the last straw on top of the book tours.

    Atack’s article was awesome. He reminded me of being indoctrinated into believing that immortal beings (thetans, we ourselves) could indeed degrade down a dwindling spiral into eternal unconsciousness, lost forever — a sort of spiritual death. And Scientology was the one and only chance in the history of the universe to for sure escape such a fate. What intense phobia inducement. Phobia inducement is a control factor in major religions too — Atack points out some examples. Others are Islam (leave the faith and be killed by true believers, and suffer hellfire forever), e.g, Christianity (be punished in hell infinitely for finite crimes).

    Also re Atack, that 2.5% SPs: one Scientology publication apparently expanded that to 20% (the writer may have misunderstood or decided that PTS persons now also counted as SPs to get to the 20% figure).

    Jenna and Bodhi — how silly. And Jenna is way too full of herself. I got bored after a few minutes and stopped watching.

  • HCO Chief

    The Jenna and Bodhi video is proof positive why Scientology will always exist. It always will. There will be forums like this in 1000 years denouncing it and it will still exist because there will always be crazies. Miscavige will die and be replaced by someone more moderate and it may even grow. There are a lot of crazies and Scientology is there for them. Congratulations Lafayette, you have achieved your life goal.

  • I enjoyed Jon Atack comments. I’ll need to get his book. The very idea that someone is in fear to hear someone else with a contrary opinion should set off an alarm that someones beliefs are hanging by a thread. Truth is always true regardless of words or beliefs. Living in truth means you abide in a deep place of peace and certainty as to who you are and gently smile on the world with all its insane beliefs and don’t take them seriously. As a great sage from my childhood once told me, sticks and stones can break my bones but names can never harm me!

    • EmmaDaoust

      His book is a must read.

      • daisy

        I hope you had a nice Christmas. Tomorrow is New Years Eve hope you are celebrating with loved ones.

      • daisy

        Thank you for getting back to me. I am sorry you have not been well. I will miss you on the blog but certainly understand it can be a bit much. I will not stalk you but please know that you can call me or write me anytime you need a ear. Good luck and good wishes for the New Year.

  • NOLAGirl (Stephanie)