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How Scientology responds to adversity: A classic example from its golden era

FDAAgentWith just days to go until the beginning of what may turn out to be the biggest challenge the Church of Scientology has ever faced, we’re watching in awe as the organization fires back on several different fronts.

With Alex Gibney’s documentary “Going Clear” opening Sunday at the Sundance Film Festival and then airing March 16 on HBO, we’re seeing church leader David Miscavige respond with a full page ad in the New York Times, an advertising blitz on network television, and other major pushes to get Scientology’s message out on its own terms.

It turns out, there’s plenty of precedence for this. As former Scientology spokesman Mike Rinder pointed out to us, this is exactly the way Miscavige responded to a previous threat — the devastating 1991 TIME magazine cover story about Scientology by journalist Richard Behar. Scientology ran full page ads in USA Today, pursued a major legal onslaught with multiple lawsuits that lasted for years, and denuded whole forests so it could counter the bad publicity with its own publications to ‘set the record straight.’

And Miscavige was just following earlier examples by the organization’s founder, L. Ron Hubbard, and we have a great example to prove that today.

Our thanks to the tipster who, noticing that we’ve been having some fun over the last few days digging into the Food and Drug Administration’s January 4, 1963 raid of the Church of Scientology, sent us a real gem.

It’s a 1968 pamphlet put out by L. Ron Hubbard blasting the FDA for the raid, and it’s just chock full of fascinating material — and it proves to be a great model for the tactics that Miscavige is following today as he deals with the nightmare of the HBO documentary.

We still have quite a few interesting items coming from the records request that yielded raw research from the FDA’s files and that have never been put online before. but in the meantime, this pamphlet from Scientology is a gold mine.

In fact, it has so much fun stuff, we haven’t really been able to get to all of its best nuggets. But rather than make you wait for us to get around to it, we thought we’d just post it online and have our great Scientology researchers in the Bunker pore through the thing for its hidden treasure!

One example, we love the suggestion by Hubbard that President Kennedy was interested in Scientology’s applications for the space program, but it was his meddling brother, Attorney General Robert Kennedy, who was out to ruin things for Hubbard and his organization. Now that’s comedy gold.

Another classic is the way the pamphlet begins, by trashing the very idea of the FDA as a meddlesome and unnecessary agency.

Please pull out your favorite items and tell us about them in the comments….

The Findings

 
——————–

We’re big in France, apparently

Some time back, we helped out a reporter who was asking really interesting questions about Vivian Kubrick after seeing our coverage of the famous director’s daughter here at the Underground Bunker.

And here’s the result — a spread from the most recent edition of the French version of Vanity Fair. (We’ve taken down the article for now and will repost it at a later date after VF France has had a chance to sell some issues.)

 
VFFrance

 

 
——————–

Bonus photos from our tipsters

Caption: “Another happy Dianetics customer. #melbournestreets #melbourne #winning”

 
SciMelbourne2

 
Miss New York, in your schools, spreading the L. Ron Hubbard gospel! (Caption: “Jillian and I had so much fun speaking at #StVincentFerrerHS #AllGirlsSchool yesterday @missnewyorkmao We gave the seniors some #CollegeTips #DontTrustBoys #Freshman15Happens #StayTrueToYourself #StayFocused #BeALeader #LeavingAPartyIsCool #DrugFreeCampus #DrugFreeWorld)

 
SciNYSchool

 
Scientologists are using social media more than ever. Drop us a line if you spot them posting images to Instagram or Facebook!

 
——————–

Kim Masters on Alex Gibney and ‘Going Clear’

The Hollywood Reporter has a great piece about Alex Gibney and his documentary about Scientology, and the profile is written by Kim Masters, who we had the pleasure of meeting about a year ago.

Your proprietor is waiting until Sunday to see the film, but Kim got an advance look and spills some details about it. She also explains what makes Gibney tick, and gives us some sense of how he’s able to put out so many projects at the same time. Give it a read!

 
OUR COUNTDOWN

 
4 days until Alex Gibney’s film Going Clear: Scientology & the Prison of Belief opens at the Sundance Film Festival at 2:30 pm on Sunday, January 25 in Park City, Utah

 
——————–

 
Posted by Tony Ortega on January 21, 2015 at 07:30

E-mail your tips and story ideas to tonyo94@gmail.com or follow us on Twitter. We post behind-the-scenes updates at our Facebook author page. Here at the Bunker we try to have a post up every morning at 7 AM Eastern (Noon GMT), and on some days we post an afternoon story at around 2 PM. After every new story we send out an alert to our e-mail list and our FB page.

Learn about Scientology with our numerous series with experts…

BLOGGING DIANETICS: We read Scientology’s founding text cover to cover with the help of LA attorney and former church member Vance Woodward

UP THE BRIDGE: Claire Headley and Bruce Hines train us as Scientologists

GETTING OUR ETHICS IN: Jefferson Hawkins explains Scientology’s system of justice

SCIENTOLOGY MYTHBUSTING: Historian Jon Atack discusses key Scientology concepts

PZ Myers reads L. Ron Hubbard’s “A History of Man” | Scientology’s Master Spies | Scientology’s Private Dancer
The Underground Bunker’s Official Theme Song | The Underground Bunker FAQ

 

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  • “THE FINDINGS” — ROFL! The dumbfuck insane criminal really thought highly of himself, huh? 🙂

    • Eivol Ekdal

      His instructions for the cover, “Make it look like god himself is handing down this judgement.”
      (probably)

  • Chocolate Velvet

    Well, Tony, I am not going to translate “In the Shadow of Kubrick” for you. Good translation is hard work, and I’m not into that today. 😉 But I read it, and it is an interesting look at the Kubrick family through the lense of Vivian’s life.

    I skipped ahead to the part about Scientology, and how Kubrick wanted Vivian to work on the soundtrack for Eyes Wide Shut, and it was after that that she renounced her career as a film composer in H-wood and had a huge falling out with her dad over it. The part that interested me was where they talk about the orgy scene in EWS, and the supposed resemblance to a “black mass” and the “satanic” practices of Aleister Crowley. First of all, that scene does not resemble a black mass at all and Crowley was not a “satanist” — but the author raises an interesting connection there, that Kubrick was likely not oblivious to the connection between a young LRH and Crowley, and his choice of Tom and Nicole may have been influenced by that. It is just suggested. Apparently Kubrick never talked about the occult symbolism in his films with those who worked with him, but it was obvious to them that it was intentional.

    Myself, I always thought the orgy scene in EWS was heavily influenced by the accounts of Alma Hirsig (sister of Leah Hirsig, Crowley’s “scarlet woman”) about her time with “The Omnipotent Oom”, AKA Dr Pierre Bernard, one of Crowley’s competitors in the free-love guru marketplace. The description of an ogastic ritual in the book My Life in a Love Cult, strongly matches that scene in Kubrick’s movie.
    I highly recommend reading the book, if you are interested in that sort of thing. Some of the idle rich apparently did a lot of weird shit back in the early 20th century. I think this kind of thing helps shed light on Ron’s particular brand of BS, and why people went along with it back in the day. It is easily available as a PDF

    http://omnipotentoom.com/lovecult.pdf

    • 0tessa

      There is already a complete translation, made by Robert Eckert, at about 7 hrs ago.

      • Chocolate Velvet

        Ooh. Good.
        But I was actually just being a smart ass about it. Hence, the winky face…

        I’m sure there are plenty of folks who were willing to do it, and many thanks to Robert for getting it done!

  • First Last
  • Truthiwant

    What if…history had gone differently?

    • They’d have suit-blowouts while hip-hip-hooraying a picture of LRH. (The suits were assembled by Sea Org RPFers who’d been up for three days straight. Someone was supposed to double-check, but .. Thursday Was Coming!)

      • Stacy

        Please. Hubbard would’ve told his astronauts that they didn’t need suits in space after going Clear. You know how extravagant his false claims were.

  • After the FDA decision, Hubbard issued this CYA lip service order. It would be a rare day when they enforce this one, except to try and block private sales to Scientologists no longer in good standing:

    • Mrs. V.

      Thank you for posting this! Very interesting.

  • The Dude

    New Chris Shelton video. Not about $cios but definitely worth the watch. This guy rocks! http://mncriticalthinking.com/2015/01/21/video-why-conspiracy-theories-suck/

    • eldritch cuckoo

      Thank you so very much for the link to this. Chris rocks!!!

  • Stacy

    I wonder why NY scientologist-extraordinaire Meghan Fialkoff is missing from the Miss New York photo op.

    http://tonyortega.org/2014/11/20/did-a-fashion-website-give-a-big-boost-to-a-scientology-infiltrator-of-nyc-schools/

  • TheHoleDoesNotExist

    Hey, Dave. Three days. Tick. Tock. There’s only one way out now and time is running out. Here’s a little preemptive strike To Do List, just for starters – that USA ad doesn’t seem to be doing the trick, does it?

    1 – Cancel Disconnection. Distribute airfare vouchers for all families to reunite, starting with an all expenses paid trip to Disney.

    2 – Close down all Cadet Orgs, Delphi Orgs. Distribute educational vouchers for accredotred college education, full scholarship.

    3 – Dismiss all staff and public under the age of 25 – Distribute vouchers for career counseling and coaching, and throw in a free iPad and iPod.

    4 – Report all child abusers and molesters to the authorities and full detailed reports including current whereabouts. Purchase top rated, full coverage medical health insurance for each family, premiums paid in full for ten years.

    5 – Sell off all empty, idle orgs. Distribute proceeds to all families who have lost their homes for down payment, closing costs, moving expenses, and basic furnishings, including swing sets in the backyard.

    That’s a lot to accomplish over the weekend, but you’re the COB – and you’re the only who can. Tick. Tock.

    http://youtu.be/le1f8vxQbWM

    • LHS

      6. Get rid of the RPF. And the RPF’s RPF. And apologize for EVER having had an RPF.

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        I’m trying to get the kids out first. This is just a To Do List before Sunday. Monday’s list: RPF #1.

    • Stacy

      #7 Report all spouse abusers to the authorities as well.

  • SciWatcher

    “Never defend, always attack.” Such a great mantra. Just fire away, you’re bound to hit something. Even if it’s imaginary Japanese submarines or Islands belonging to an ally like, say, Mexico. Somewhere, someday, it’ll work, even if it seems to always backfire. I mean, it has to work eventually, right?. Why else would you keep doing it?

  • A Guest

    Robert Eckerit has just finished his epic translation of the Vanity Fair article. He really has done a fabulous job! He’s been at it for the past 6 hours, at least. I’m not sure if he’s going to post it himself up here, in one full post, or if he’s going to send it to Tony to post above.

    But if you would like to read it now, set the Disqus comments to Oldest, collapse 25 threads to get to Robert’s tranlations (below “RBE” comment). He really deserves a round of applause for his heroic effort – for our benefit, no less. Bravo!

    P.S. Should we ask him to translate Kim Masters’ piece about Alex Gibneu into French now?

  • Truthiwant

    Great quote from Kim Masters piece about Alex Gibney’s documentary:

    “Spanky Taylor… fell out of favor with Scientology officials and was forced into a prison-like setting that wouldn’t meet Geneva Convention standards.”

  • TheHoleDoesNotExist

    Can’t wait till Tom Cruise, the Astronaut and NASA spokesman, conducts the thousands of interviews on the lineup I can only imagine are heating up on the burner. Oh wait. Tom can’t come to the phone now. He’s busy saving the world in outer space. Gee, I wonder where he got the idea he’s a Spaceman. Ron was quite the space operator.

    http://youtu.be/Gtqft95DMK4
    (starts at 6:22)

    • Observer

      Ground Control to Major Tom …

      https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=D67kmFzSh_o

    • ze moo

      The NY ‘Purification’ scam lead to the best PR the clampire ever had. Too bad it is all based on bullshit and if the clam vitamin regime is used, dangerous. A good audit of those programs would be very enlightening. How much was siphoned off for DM?

    • Stacy

      While I hate to use a cool song while discussing TC, it fits.
      http://youtu.be/N1Hs2AQwDgA

  • SciWatcher

    There were some typos in the first paragraphs of that FDA booklet. I’ve fixed them:

    “The Church of
    Scientology is a relatively minor religion that originated as a self-help scam
    within the demented imagination of L Ron Hubbard. The organization has in fact
    done little to fulfill the promises outlined by Hubbard, but has grown to
    outsized physical and financial proportions. The COS has become, progressively
    since the 1950s, a source of disturbance to Americans, the presidency, the
    courts and Congress. It is today regrettably described as an organization
    behaving as a sort of cult, with an almost fanatical urge—to save the
    world. What the COS seems to feel it must “save the world” from is simply the
    ordinary freedoms and pursuits of the society, and from the protection and authority
    of the Constitution of the United States.“

    • Stacy

      Thanks. You not only fixed the typos, you corrected Hubbard’s horrendously convoluted and incorrect way of writing. This is much more fluid and organized. Not to mention honest and correct!

  • Juicer77

    Totally O/T, this song has been in my head all day! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qORYO0atB6g

    • The Dude

      Nice

  • valshifter

    This is what I got from the French magazine, is gonna take a long time to translate the whole thing.

    A cold rain fell since early morning. In Dallas, November 22, 2013 at the intersection of Dealey Plaza and Elm Street, the ceremonies of the fiftieth anniversary of the assassination of President Kennedy coming to an end . The police are on the alert. Set away from the stands, a crowd of protesters maintains his disagreement with the official version of JFK’s death.

    The banners are agitated: “The CIA killed Kennedy,” “Stop the disguise of the truth,” “Protect freedom of expression.” As head of the procession, megaphone in hand, Texan Alex Jones, a staunch defender of conspiracy theories is overheated:

    “If you, the American people, let them impose their lies without protest, the country will become a new North Korea. And the New World Order will triumph! “After a final lunge against the police, he gave the microphone to a protester of about fifty years old, auburn hair and tired eyes. It comes looking relaxed into the camera, a shy smile: “Hello, I live here in Dallas, my name is Vivian Kubrick, and my father was Stanley Kubrick. I learned early on thru him that I had to fight for ideas in which we believe”.

    She explains why the defense of the First Amendment of the Constitution (the freedom of expression) is paramount to her.

    The political activism can be seen, through, the work of her father, from Dr. Strangelove (1964) in Clockwork Orange (1971), has never stopped to denounce the manipulation of humanity by malefic elite. After a speech more than twenty minutes, Vivian, 54, encouraged her countrymen to weigh against all forms of tyranny in order that the history is not repeated . Her idol, she proclaims , is Edward Snowden

    1. clockwork orange (1971) , has never stopped denounce manipulation of humanity by malefic elite.

    • Tony Ortega

      It’s already been translated several times.

      • valshifter

        deng now I feel like an idiot sorry

        • Richard Grant

          But thank you, valshifter! I haven’t seen the other versions and I read yours with enjoyment.

          • Nat-lificent

            I love reading multiple translations of things. You catch a lot more nuance that way. We’ve been very spoiled by ALL our translators today 🙂

          • Eclipse-girl

            Robert Eckert did one in the first few hours of todays comments

        • Vaquera

          I just got here and haven’t seen the other translations. Glad I found yours at the top of the the new comments.

        • flyonthewall

          dont feel bad, I feel like that all the time

  • Mark

    I can’t help feeling Tubbo went about it all wrong with that expensively-printed booklet (the Garden City Press in Letchworth didn’t come cheap, you know) aimed at politicians and the broadsheet media; he should have gone a bit more downmarket if he really wanted to get his point across (refresh; my apologies to the late great Harvey Kurtzman and Bill Elder for pinching their idea):

    • Mark

      And a few hours earlier… (refresh):

  • Nat-lificent

    Thank you Robert Eckert! I really enjoyed the read 😀
    http://media1.giphy.com/media/etmqZvzyywRRS/giphy.gif

    • Robert Eckert

      It was a good article, worth slogging through in a foreign language.

      • Nat-lificent

        You’re awesome.

      • A Guest

        Thank you, Robert. Fabulous job! It was a pleasure watching you work today. You are so kind to donate most of your day to translating this for us. You are a good man.

        Did you see Tony’s message about wanting you to translate Kim Masters’ piece about Alex Gibney into French for that ‘sector’ of his readership?

        Just kidding.

  • TheHoleDoesNotExist

    The LAist

    “What We Can Expect From HBO’s Damning Scientology Documentary” January 21, 2015

    http://laist.com/2015/01/21/going_clear_scientology_documentary.php

    • Destructor of Worlds

      Old but funny

      “HBO to make film of Scientology book, hires 160 lawyers”

      http://edition.cnn.com/2014/11/25/showbiz/movies/going-clear-hbo-movie-lawyers/

    • A Guest

      I believe I’ve read there will be 8 former members in the doc, IIRC.

      This piece mentions:
      Paul Haggis
      Marty
      Rathbun
      Michael Rinder
      Jason Beghe
      Spanky Taylor

      That’s 5 people. (However, if I used Scientolomathics, that would add up to 88. But I digress…) I guess the other 3 are the “big reveal” that’s being kept out of any stories about the doc.

      For some reason, I keep thinking of the two Presley’s. As to the third, I’m even more unsure about who that might be. But I would not be too terribly surprised if it wasn’t someone who has been posting in the Bunker anonymously. If so, I have my bet on either one of two.

      Any speculation as to who the other 3 might be, THDNE?

      • Observer

        I’m not TDHNE, but I’d bet money on Marc and Claire Headley and Karen de la Carriere.

        • A Guest

          Ok, duly noted. Your list makes perfect sense, more so than mine. Although I wonder why these interviewees, already well-known critics, would be kept under a mysterious wrap or news blackout.

          But then again, this so-called “reveal” and “mystery” might just be something I imagined. Sigh… I do get carried away sometimes… If so, don’t mind me. Simply carry on with your good works and shoops, Observer.

      • Douglas D. Douglas

        How about Tory? I realize she is not a celebrity, but you could hardly ask for a more entertaining and articulate interview subject.

    • Graham

      “It’ll focus on Scientology’s star following, especially taking a close look at Cruise and John Travolta’s involvement—and this won’t be painting a pretty picture of them. The documentary discusses how they’re still members despite all the complaints from people about the abuse and forced labor the church imposes on its members. One former member of the church even talks about how Miscavige secretly would make fun of Cruise’s personal life.”

      Where will this leave Cruise? Basically this is a public shaming for him. How can he not react to this? The next few weeks are going to be VERY interesting.

      • ze moo

        TC has ignored all ‘evidence’ of Miscavage’s crimes and his use of TC’s pc folders. ‘The ignore is strong in this one, move along this is not the droid you are looking for’.

        • TheHoleDoesNotExist

          His people are going to be in crisis mode by now. How many interviews can he flat out turn down until his refusal or silence will write the story for him. I can imagine the usual, curt and canned short response and retort cominf from his camp.

          But this isn’t usual anything and again, it will backfire. None of these celebs will have an appropriate response.

          This is a new era, and it will be golden – just not for them. How do you explain you have supported child slave labor, child abuse, human rights abuse for decade after decade. The answer is: you don’t.

  • AutOmatic

    “As all of my books have been seized for burning…”

    Too bad they didn’t burn them all.

  • Observer

    Okay, Grasshopper—assuming you’re still here—here’s a list of references of things Ron said Scientology cures. Physical cures fall under the category of medical treatment, and medical treatment is under the purview of the FDA.

    In the interests of clarity and preventing any semantic sleight of hand no, none of these references explicitly market the e-meter as a cure for anything. What they do promise, however, is that auditing/Scientology can and does cure these things, I know as well as you that without the e-meter there is no auditing, and without auditing there’s no Scientology. If Scientology auditing cures these physical ailments, and auditing cannot be done without the e-meter, then the e-meter is as much a medical diagnostic device as the MRI. Unless, of course, the person happens to be suffering a case of psychosomatic broken ankle, in which case it’s merely a religious counseling tool.

    Cure skin cancer
    ALL ABOUT RADIATION (1979 ED.) p. 114

    Cure radiation sickness
    ALL ABOUT RADIATION p. 109
    also PAB no. 82 “Scientology is the only specific (cure) for
    radiation (atomic bomb) burns.”

    Improve eyesight
    PAB no. 111 “Eyesight and glasses”
    also Dianetic Auditor’s Bulletin vol. 2 no. 7 January 1952 “An
    afternoon with Ron” “You are only three or four hours from taking
    your glasses off for keeps.”

    Cure a broken ankle
    HCOB 30 July 1973 “Scientology, Current State of the Subject and Materials.”

    Cure bronchitis
    HCOB 14 Dec. ’63 “Case analysis Health Research”
    “12 days after this auditing the coughing was still in abeyance.”

    Cure brainwashing HCOB No. 19 Dec. ’55 “The turn of the Tide”
    “… in Dianetics in particular, we have the total antidote for the eradication of brainwashing.” Hahahahaha!

    HISTORY OF MAN P.13
    “The GE has the record of past deaths. Auditing it alters physical structure, eradicates physical malformations.”

    HISTORY OF MAN P.14
    “Paralysis, anxiety stomachs, arthritis and many ills and aberrations have been relieved by auditing them.”

    Why would Hubbard forbid medical treatment for Scientologists on course for all but extreme emergencies? The clear implication is that the e-meter would uncover the dastardly suppressives or “bad auditing” behind the illness or injury. From Illness in Scientology HCO PL 26 July 1965 “Release Declaration Restrictions Healing Amendments”

    “HEALING AMENDED “All students of any course are debarred from visiting any medical or healing practitioner unless they are given an Ethics clearance first and all possibility of ‘roller-coaster’ (sudden case decline) has been looked into and any suppressives or bad auditing precisely isolated. The exception is an emergency involving severe injury or *infectious* disease, but in this case the student must be cleared by Ethics to be permitted back on course or even in the org. This includes all accidents.

    “Course Supervisors are subject to Comm Ev in not so routing students requesting to see a doctor. … All students *must* have permission to see a medical doctor except in cases of severe emergency.”

    • Lucille Austero

      What a great example of pure evil. Thanks, Obs!

    • flyonthewall

      Grasshopper say “Thank you Master”

    • Mrs. V.

      Observer: thank you thank you thank you! LRH was a liar, pure and simple.

    • A Guest

      Thank you for this research. It’ll be very handy to have these references listed in this concise format. Brava!

    • Man are you a piker. You missed the most obvious one, in the Creed itself, no less: “And we of the Church believe that the spirit can be saved and that the spirit alone may save or heal the body.”

      • Observer

        The spirit isn’t an e-meter.

        • Good thing, or the FDA would have revoked the church’s thetans.

          • Lucille Austero

            Grasshopper, where are your thetans today? Hmm? Exactly what are they up to, anyway? Are they trolling the internetz bothering people? Are they shopping at Walmart? What is up with them?

            • Probably having a better time than yours.

            • Lucille Austero

              Oh. Well. That really got to me there, Grasshopper. My thetans are home cleaning the house and taking care of the goddam animals, like they always are on weekdays! They do get Sunday nights off, but that is after they leave me a nice caek to eat.

            • Stacy

              Could I possibly hire your thetans Lucille? I could use a few extra to help out around the house.

            • Nice to know you have a good use for yours!

            • Lucille Austero

              Well, Grasshopper, that is just it. I *think* I have a good use for them, and then I get to wondering. Lucille, I wonder to myself. Where are those goddam thetans right now and are they making me the lovely spice caek that I like to eat so much? Are they, because sometimes I feel like they are maybe just LOITERING on the back porch. Strumming their banjos with each other and making up new dittys like those ones in Deliverance.

          • Observer

            How about a response to the point I made, namely that the e-meter is in Scientology a de facto medical diagnostic device?

            • The E-Meter has nothing to do with medical diagnostics.

            • Lucille Austero

              You are almost there! The E-Meter has nothing to do with medical diagnostics AND now add this: The E-Meter has nothing to do with anything. Now we are all on the same page, right Grasshopper?

            • Observer

              According to the founder of Scientology the e-meter locates the sources of physical illness and injury, so for a Scientologist it has everything to do with medical diagnostics.

            • Graham

              Oh yes it has.

      • IASREG

        It didn’t work for Ron. He never healed himself from war wounds that never happened. He wasn’t able to heal his injuries from a motorcycle accident. He was never able to heal himself from his numerous maladies and he died from a stroke and never made it to Target Two. The dreck doesn’t work.

      • Lucille Austero

        Careful who you are calling a piker there, Grasshopper! You do not want the butthurt to come out!

      • Observer

        I have taken your questions seriously and answered them without name calling and with only a little bit of snark about a psychosomatic broken ankle. All I’m getting in return are deflection, glib flippancy, and no answers that have any bearing on the subject YOU brought up: that the FDA was fully within its rights to confiscate e-meters be cause they were in fact being touted as medical devices by Scientology, however indirectly, and I have supplied references to support my opinion.

        • I appreciate your effort. I am well aware of your references. They are out of context, but how are you to know since you don’t have the full materials to pull from. For example, regarding the ankle from the ’73 HCOB. In that very bulletin he states in the same paragraph that Scientology is not interested in healing, that the broken ankle in question was not healing and in fact getting worse despite medical help, and that by addressing the engram the healing was able to happen unencumbered. But, this is an example of Scientology claims to heal the body.

          Here’s the deal: Scientology has only ever addressed the mental or spiritual side of helping people out. It never addressed the medical. You can say that Hubbard over-promised – but he never said it was physical, i.e. medical, healing, only spiritual. And there are cases where very physical ailments are abated by spiritual betterment, both inside and outside Scientology. I know of several people who have had “cures” in this manner, from Scientology, and from other activities. So, you may not agree that healing can occur by aiding the spiritual side – maybe you do, I don’t know. But I do know it does and can occur.

          But, none of this is medical, and no medical diagnosis is done by use of the e-meter ever. It just isn’t.

          • Eclipse-girl

            Why would scientology insist that epileptics do not need their anti seizure medication?

            If you deny that scientology does exactly, Tory Christman will be able to prove you wrong?

            Why did scientology send a SO man, diagnosed with HIV, to a chiropractor rather than a doctor who would provide actual anti viral medications?

            • Yes, I know about that. More proof that you should see doctors if you need to. Would you ask your pastor if you should see a doctor?

            • Lucille Austero

              Would you ask your thetans to give you a colonoscopy? I am not going to share with you what my answer would be.

            • Eclipse-girl

              My pastor would not tell me my eternal salvation would be jeopardized for seeing a doctor, or taking any medication prescribed by a doctor.

            • Todd Tomorrow

              Cheaper and they think HIV, even in infants is all in their mind. A little neck adjustment some pills and he’s good to go!

          • Lucille Austero

            I know Obs is going to give a very measured and logical response to all of this horse-hooey, Grasshopper, so I will just say that my engram is VERY interested in healing in an unencumbered fashion, and would you be able to further discuss how my thetans might be able to help in this healing when they are not in fact making my bed and doing my vacuuming? I have them around all the time and I just want to put them to good use. I kind of feel like they might be malingering or at least perhaps dilly-dallying. Behind my back, of course.

            • Frankly, you may want to set them free. Then, they may hang out on their own accord, and you can have coffee klatches and all that – a nice afternoon tea. Or maybe go bowling.

            • Lucille Austero

              Oh REALLY?? I strongly suspect that you are trying to capture and/or possess my thetans! Step off, bad Grasshopper!

            • No, but I might trade them for thetans to be named later.

            • Observer

              Okay, this is funny!

          • Observer

            Sophistry. Hubbard claimed over and over that auditing using the e-meter would heal the body. Since you overlooked this reference, I’ll give it again:

            HISTORY OF MAN P.13
            “The GE has the record of past deaths. Auditing it alters physical structure, eradicates physical malformations.”

            Please explain to me any context in which a claim of “alter[ing] physical structures” and “eradicat[ing] physical malformations”–in other words, healing–can be construed as anything other than medical.

            And there’s still the issue of Hubbard forbidding his students to go get medical attention without going through Ethics and auditing first-including in the case of accidents–except in dire emergencies. I wonder how many dire emergencies developed because Ron decreed that the e-meter would locate the cause of the physical problem? What other context would put that in a different light?

            • Read the Theta/MEST theory. The answer is there. The being has an effect on the body.

              Have you ever been on course? The fact is that if you are sick, and you need to see a doctor, you see a doctor. This is policy, actually. Also, you are to see the ethics officer to see if there may be some undue stress, i.e., suppression around. You are aware that stress can precipitate illness, no? But, it is (or should be) never only PTS interviews. If you are sick you are sick. I was on course for years. I never had an issue with seeing doctors when I had to. Admittedly, I was rarely sick, but when I was there was no issue.

            • Lucille Austero

              Grasshopper, please have your thetans contact the ethics officer immediately.

            • Observer

              Please show me where that HCOPL was revoked. If it was never revoked, both you and your course supervisor were out-ethics which, in my wog view, is a good thing. I am sincerely glad you were able to get the treatment you needed.

              EDIT: And again, this is getting off-topic. Hubbard made promises that auditing would cure physical medical conditions. Because of those promises, Scientology became subject to laws regarding medical treatments.

            • Lucille Austero

              Him, his course supervisor and ALL of his thetans. Imagine!

            • I can show you HCOPL 27 October 64R (revised in 1987, still in force) called “Policies on Physical Healing, Insanity, and Sources of Trouble” in which Hubbard addresses this very thing. If someone is complaining of a physical disability or illness, the first two actions are 1. to have them see a doctor, and 2. clearly establish whether this is a physical illness or not – that the disability does or does not step from physical causes. Then, 3., they should get it addressed medically if it is a medical issue.

              This is policy that is extant, and should be followed by the church.

            • Observer

              Thanks for the reference.

            • Juicer77

              Thanks for the reference (I’m a never-in, so many of these documents are new to me). If I may ask, when do you believe this policy stopped being followed? Or in your experience is it still being followed? What was the rationale behind stopping if that is what happened. Just wondering what your experience has been.

            • My experience is all over the map. One of the reasons I am not in the church is because there are people who take things very literally and without judgement.

              There is no doubt that the fundamentalist view of sickness is that you are sick because you are “PTS” and for no other reason. And, fundamentalists can point to tech and policy that supports this view because Hubbard was not precise about it. But, Scientology requires study, and by understanding the basic underlying theory and structure, and understanding the the purpose of Scientology is to make people better, then you can see that people can be sick because they are sick. Their “PTS” situation is that they are in a meat body on this planet. You are in danger of dying from the moment you are born. So it’s a matter of degree.

              The policy, as far as I know, is in place. It is mostly followed. In fact, this particular policy is almost followed too much, in that it also prevents people with former psychiatric treatments from getting auditing. I think it is ludicrous – but on the other hand, no one seems to think twice when someone seeing a psychiatrist shoots up a neighborhood, but if a person getting auditing hurts someone, it’s proof that Scientology is a fraud. So, Hubbard cut them off, which to me is a mistake.

              My specific experience is that I grew up avoiding doctors. I’d see them if very sick – but my sicknesses were colds, mostly. I never took cold medicine. I did go to the local deli for the best chicken soup in Los Angeles.

              The colds I had rarely took me off course. When they did, I was off course, and saw the “MO” (medical officer) and Ethics Officer when I came back. They’d look for some PTS condition or another. But, there was no issue.

              So, they follow the policy sometimes. But the rules are different for SO members – as the IJC is a good example. They are expected to tough it out, and the culture is such that if you claim to be sick, you’d better be lifeless. The SO and I never got along.

            • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

              Just curious, Mr. Grasshopper, have you spent much time on Chris Shelton’s website?

            • I know and respect Chris, of course.

            • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

              Thank you for your response, Grasshopper. I am glad to hear that you know and respect Chris. That is a good sign. I do not know him, but I sure respect his journey out of the cult and how he recovered his critical thinking skills, which are excellent and plainly evident to those who take time to actually read his blog or watch his videos.
              Grasshopper, I hope that you have similar success in clearing the still-evident defensive and unbalanced manner in which you apply logic and reason. By way of example, did you even noticed how subtly you dodged or otherwise did not directly answer my question? Let me ask you again, but more directly, what specifically have you read? Your response will be demonstrative.

            • I saw his videos, read a few of his posts.

            • Techie

              Grasshopper, glad to see you still here and engaging in dialog. I am not going to try to change your mind, though I personally disagree. Just consider this – there is a difference between “gets some results” and “contains truth.” In “Keeping Scientology Working” Ron tried to conflate the two concepts by calling Scientology a “workable system”. When the criterion for success or “workability” is defined so broadly, and the tendency to fall into self-delusion is so easy, when it is in fact encouraged, when confirmation bias is rampant it is not possible to discern where truth ends and corruption of the truth begins. There are many activities that can cause a release of brain chemicals that make you smile and think you have found some new truth about yourself. Meditation, exercise, controlled breathing, self-hypnosis, repeated questions, bio-feedback techniques, the list is endless. And of course many drugs give the same feeling. If your only criterion of the workability of Scientology is “I and others had wins” then you would have to agree that sky-diving and bungee-jumping are just as valid as therapies. Of course that is ridiculous. But what elevates Scientology above pot-smoking, intense prayer and directed meditation? What makes it special, so special that some dedicate their lives to it and cast aside human dignity, love, family, even life itself? For Scientology to be that special, you have to buy into the concept of “The Bridge.” You have to believe that people can be permanently changed in incredibly glorious ways, you have to buy into the 30s notion that “we are only using 30% of our brains.” The little wins of every day sessions have to somehow add up into a big win that changes your life in an externally visible way, like curing your near-sightedness or giving you eidetic memory. That is the dream, the reality is pretty harshly different. Certainly some few have had incredible successes, but there is no consistent pattern to them. Just as there is no consistent pattern to the miraculous recoveries from placebos or faith in Jesus. Aside from random miracles the Bridge is 100% broken. The state of Clear cannot be demonstrated in anyone in the form it was originally explained (Book One). The “higher states” are for the most part just excuses for the failure of the State of Clear. And the highest state actually released by Ron (OT VIII) was actually stated by him to only be the start of the real OT levels. If there ever were any such “real OT levels” that actually worked they are lost. Certainly they did not work on Ron himself, who died in a pitiable state still trying to deal with physical conditions of his body. Nobody really wants to follow Ron down that road.I have no beef with people who want to make themselves feel better by controlled breathing or repetitive questions. Just realize that it cannot do any more than that. The harm is in the use of such parlor games to suck people into a dangerous cult. The human wreckage caused by the cult, the broken families and broken lives, the insidious mind-numbing and bank account draining effects of the standard application of Scientology are what I object to. Just for reference, I was in 35 years, made at least 3 “Clears” as an auditor, experienced and delivered 100s of hours of auditing, spent 25 years in the Sea Org at the Gold base. I am not speaking from ignorance. Scientology Kills.

            • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

              Exceptional post, Techie. So well reasoned that I doubt that Grasshopper will muster a response. But I so enjoy his sophistry, I hope he makes an attempt.

            • Thanks for that. 25 years in the SO is an ordeal.

            • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

              Hope you are able to learn to reason like Techie, Grasshopper, I really do.

            • Douglas D. Douglas

              “…no one seems to think twice when someone seeing a psychiatrist shoots up a neighborhood, but if a person getting auditing hurts someone, it’s proof that Scientology is a fraud.”

              Do you really believe this? That no one thinks twice when a psychiatric patient “shoots up a neighborhood?”

              Can you understand how lunatic this sounds?

            • Ok – so, let me be clear. If someone who is a Scientologist does something like shoot someone, this, to some, is proof (or at least an contributing factor) to Scientology being evil. However, while people are truly horrified at someone under psychiatric care shooting someone, they rarely look at their psychiatric treatment as a contributing factor. Rather, it is the availability of guns, or ever, oddly enough, the _lack_ of mental health funding, that is seen as a contributing factor.

              I am glad that certain drugs are labeled showing that “suicidal thoughts” can be a side effect of the drug.

            • Douglas D. Douglas

              There is good reason for what seems to you like a double standard. Literally millions of people around the world are being treated with psychiatric methods and drugs. On the rare occasion that one of them snaps to the extent of causing harm to others, it does not pass unnoticed, especially if the method of treatment is unusual or abusive. And in many cases it happens when someone leaves an otherwise successful treatment program.

              Scientology, on the other hand, treats a comparatively small sampling of the public. When a Scientologist, or one of their charges snaps, it is totally valid to point out that connection. To many here, it is a source of frustration that this is not consistently done in news accounts.

              Recognize, also, that most of the people out there (and here) have either been treated, or know someone who has been treated by conventional psychiatry/pharmacy/therapy. They know that psychiatry is not an industry of death, despite the best efforts of LRH and his descendent minions to prove otherwise.

              Do you understand that Scientology, and Scientology practices, are a tiny, tiny minority in the world today? And yet, per capita, they are the cause of so much grief and tragedy.

            • Yes I do, and I see your point.

            • daytoncapri

              “psychiatrist shoots up a neighborhood”

              Do you refer to an actual event?

            • Someone seeing a psychiatrist shooting up a neighborhood. in other words a patient of a psychiatrist. And the answer to that is, pretty much every mass shooting we have seen in this country.

            • daytoncapri

              A generalization, and the logic is reversed: “Sickness is caused by doctors” sort of thinking.

            • Seriously? I am not saying that. What I am saying is that they are not effective. Despite the professional care of these doctors, these people still seem to go out on shooting sprees. I am also saying that there are documented cases where the treatment has driven people to suicide (hell, the warnings are on the labels). And your use of Generalization is interesting. Let’s see – the most recent that comes to mind is the kid who shot up Santa Barbara a few months ago.

            • daytoncapri

              If that’s not what you are saying, them I apologize for misunderstanding you.

              I’ll say this: there are limits to what treatments of any kind can do for illness, including mental illness. There are no guarantees from treatment, we humans do the best that we can, we often fail, which can be disastrous.

              Add to that sad fact, that in this modern society, there has been a growing culture of violence and death, and increasingly easy access to guns.

              Sadly, just my opinion.

            • Agreed.

            • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

              Multifactorial reasoning is not your strength, is it young Grasshopper?

            • LHS

              Elliot Rodger? He had stopped all mental health treatment, and although he had been prescribed psychiatric meds, he refused to take them. Sorry, I think your blame is misplaced here.
              http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/2014_Isla_Vista_killings

            • Juicer77

              Thank you, that is helpful perspective.

            • Observer

              I don’t need to read the theta/MEST theory, simply because it is irrelevant to this issue. Again, Hubbard claimed spectacular physical cures for people who went under the e-meter. Physical cures = medical.

            • “Under the e-meter.” It is relevant because it is the spirit which can affect the body, which is what the GE is referring to here. You are quoting from snippets without context. Like I said – that’s all you have, and that’s fine. Let us just say that you believe it was the correct thing for the FDA to raid the church in ’63 and leave it at that.

            • George Layton

              How many of all the people audited had their will subdued so that the auditor’s will could dominate over the subdued will?

            • Observer

              You can be as condescending as you like, but that still doesn’t make Scientology beliefs relevant to this issue.

              What we’re dealing with here is the law of the land, and that law does not allow unlicensed, medically untrained people to make unsubstantiated claims for physical cures without coming under the scrutiny of the FDA. Hubbard’s big mouth got him in trouble, as many others making health benefit claims have gotten in trouble over the years, and are still getting in trouble. E-meters aren’t the only thing the FDA has ever confiscated.

            • I guess we’ll find out more when some of this information comes to light. The interesting thing is that A. the meters were returned, and B. that Scientologists still use them. So, what changed between 1963 and now? Could it be the FDA had it wrong? Or could it be that Scientology bought off the US government?

            • Observer

              As I understand it, the e-meters were returned on the condition that they have those stickers put on them. And it wouldn’t surprise me if some money changed hands as well.

            • All meters received the label, and still have the label. And, all books – pretty much all materials – have the label regarding the e-meter attached.

          • IASREG

            Of course Ron’s forked tongue would say Scientology heals but then qualify it in many different ways. Sounds like more Hubbard fraud to me.

          • Stacy

            “You can say that Hubbard over-promised – but he never said it was physical…”

            Isn’t promising an increased IQ a physical outcome? Since IQ can be measured, and it’s attached to the brain and learning, it’s not “spiritual.” And LRH did promise an increased IQ in Dianetics. And there is no scientific record of ANYONE increasing their IQ through the practice of Dianetics or scientology.

          • MaxSpaceman

            Indiemania. A serious malady.

            You become Lying Liars Who Mostly Lie (about their spiritual practices). Mary Sue wrote, “…to Ron goes my everlasting gratitude for having provided for all of us the Road to Clear.”

            There are no clears. You are not “Clear.” You are not OT. There are no OTs. You sound like a pontificating blowhard, full of yourself. When your religion does not produced any single person who is clear. And does not produce any single person who is an operating thetan.

            Not one. Indie scientology. Worse than Hubbard’s quack fakery. Now, you may continue to boringly pontificate.

          • Douglas D. Douglas

            Grasshopper, dude, really. Go back, read what you wrote, and understand that you are coming off like a patronizing, condescending ass. Side-snide like, “…how are you to know since you don’t have the full materials to pull from” does nothing to enhance a conversation.

            And it’s just plain wrong. The Bunker is not some protest rally filled with jokers who read a screed on the internet and decided to cause trouble. There are people here who have taken advantage of full access to every bit of the material that is being discussed. (It’s all out there on the internet, you should know.) Further. there are members of this community who used to teach this stuff to credulous individuals like yourself.

            So cut the crap, please. Thank you.

            • I have pretty much read it all. And there is more information available than is available on the internet, and it is dangerous to read a couple of lines out of context and then claim that this is the real deal about what is happening.

              By the way, do you believe the ’63 FDA raid was justified?

            • Douglas D. Douglas

              Anything that is being discussed here is readily available. It is not necessary to quote an entire document, as long as what is being presented represents its intention. You continue to dwell on the idea that anyone who disagrees with or criticizes you simply does not understand what you claim is true.

              This is the whole idea behind writing up “wins.” Until a “win” has been achieved, the Tech has not been properly applied. Therefore, the Tech is always correct, since no “win” means the Tech has not been applied properly.

              In a closed system of thought, it all makes sense. But it tends to fall apart when critical thinking is allowed.

              I have not read enough background on the 1963 raid to have definite opinion. I tend to trust the FDA, so that weighs in favor of their action. And I do know that (despite your vociferous protests) that Hubbard made specific claims about Dianetics/Scientology that would fall within their oversight. So there’s that.

            • Thanks for the answer.

              The bunker is an interesting collection of earnest truth-seekers, no? I am being criticized as being “devoid of humor, self awareness, and critical thinking skills” by Sir Hemet above, pitied by others, and called part of a group of “Lying Liars Who Mostly Lie” by another august member of this august forum. You yourself say I come across as a “condescending ass.” This is a hoot considering the comments I have been seeing today.

              So, we have this situation. On the one hand, Hubbard was a fraud, and Scientology itself is a fraud. Its only purpose is to extract money from people, and Ron set up up that way from day one. On the other hand, there are people who have been trained in its use, learned how to use an e-emeter, audited people and have been audited, and they have received value from the use of Scientology.

              The value is there. I myself have gained value from Scientology, and I know many others who have as well. So, when someone tells me, there is no value, I have to disagree. And when someone tells me it is a _fact_ that there is no value, it is especially interesting. As you said, you have a right to your opinions, but not to your own facts. And in my case it is a fact that people, including myself, have received value from using Scientology.

            • Douglas D. Douglas

              Sigh.

              I have no idea how earnestly truth seeking anyone is anywhere, let alone in this forum. Mostly, we are interested in reading daily reports on the inevitable decline of the Scientology religion.

              You have decided there are two sides (or hands, if you please) to this proposition. This is not a good example of critical thinking. There are more than two choices when it comes to describing Dianetics/Scientology and its founder, L. Ron Hubbard.

              I don’t know if others have stated that it is a _fact_ that there is no value in Scientology. I will say, without any hesitation, that it is a fact that L. Ron Hubbard was a fraud. This is, of course, my opinion, but it is backed up with ample, irrefutable evidence. Only someone who is willfully deluded can excuse it.

              Now, have I made that logical jump from Source is a fraud to Scientology is a fraud? No. But I do believe that any good that has come to you, or anyone else, through Scientology practices is not due to Source.

              Where, ultimately, is the value in life? If I knew that, I could start my own religion. But since I don’t (and I am not a fraud), I won’t.

            • Good answer. Thanks.

            • George Layton

              But is it a necessity? You gained value from it but does everyone need it to gain more from life than they would having lived a life never hearing of scientology? When the church experiences the incarceration or disappearance of dave, and all the assets disappear or become frozen in court battles where are all the sea org going to live? Who will step in and help them come to terms with the “wog” world? Will the freezone and indies be up front withthem that everything they have come to believe about scientology auditing is only a matter of personal value gain and they don’t require it at all, or will they be taken in with the loving care of all the indie auditors out there to continue with auditing under the guise that it is beneficial to them and not be told that there is more to life than taking part in the mind mending hubbard created? These are the questions that bother me when I see someone that has had gains from the tech and will voice their opinion without specific examples of the gains and the step by step methods used to experience those gains.

            • There is a pretty good network of people who will help people out. Some still consider Scientology to have some value, and some do not, but they all shared the journey in some manner, and are there for them if they need it. If the church collapses completely and suddenly, there will be a lot of people out of work. But – do you know any ex Sea Org people? One thing I will say for them is that any job they get outside the church will be a piece of cake compared to what they dealt with on staff. But in any event, any person “coming out” will be welcomed with open arms – and they are usually surprised, but happy about it.

              You ask if it’s a necessity? No, it’s not. I have friends who are all over the map when it comes to religion or the lack of it. I see cases where they could get some benefit from Scientology. Sometimes I mention it, sometimes not. It is not my purpose to get anyone “in.” Frankly, I think it would be worthwhile to set up a course room where people can learn the TRs and study tech, and maybe co-audit Self Analysis. But, it is not a necessity.

              I myself know that Scientology is incomplete. But, all subjects are incomplete, no? That is a downside to the fundamental view of Scientology – that somehow there is nothing else to know outside of what Hubbard wrote in the 37 years of his “tenure” so to speak. And I know and found a lot of wisdom that has nothing to do with Scientology the subject, but usually complements the basic tenets. But, then i have found value in philosophies that don’t complement the basic tenets. For example, I love Allen Watts, but I don’t agree with his world view completely, but it has helped me. For that matter, I don’t agree with Scientology/Hubbard’s world view completely, but have found value in it.

            • daytoncapri

              I think that the work-ethic of Scientologist would serve them well on the outside.

            • daytoncapri

              Well. your parents were Scientologists. You were raised in it. And, at some point, you / they made a decision to leave the organization. Yet you hold onto many of the beliefs, or tech even as you are free to explore alternatives. Fascinating. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFods1KSWsQ

            • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

              Oh, that’s going to stick.

            • Well, yes. I look at fundamentals. I am not an atheist. I am not a materialist. I am well aware that I could be wrong, but i do believe we are beings independent from the body. It could be we are material, so I could be wrong. I know this. I also know that I could be an essence of life or of God, and could melt back into overall Godhood when I die, losing my individual identity. This, too could be true. It could be that we are each created in the image of God, and that Jesus is our savior, and that through Him we can reach the Kingdom of God and that Jesus died for our sins. It could be that. There’s all kinds of things it could be. And, at the end of the day, all this is moot because we are perhaps truly material and when we die, we die. Also, we could just be brain patterns that can eventually be moved to silicon media, promising eternal life. Or, we could all be a computer simulation in someone else’s universe. Someone once said that model is the probably model. We really don’t know. Not really. So I choose what makes the most sense to me.

            • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

              Well said, Grasshopper. Hopefully, you base what makes sense to you on the best available evidence, with some awareness of the cognitive biases that are built into all of our human minds.

            • Thank you.

            • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

              You are quite welcome, Grasshopper. BTW, wise of you to make your comment history private.

            • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

              Hi Grasshopper, please note that I edited my response to reflect that it was incorrect for me to infer that you have no sense of humor. There is clear evidence in your responses that you indeed have a sense of humor, and a fine one at that. But the vast majority of your comments continue to provide clear evidence of defensive and unbalanced critical thinking. For those of us who have engaged with recent exes or indies, your response style fits a known pattern and is plainly obvious. Many here are interested to see whether you show evidence of improvement, hence the criticism.
              BTW, please tell me which of Chris Shelton’s blog post you read. That would at least suggest that you have started reversing your scientology-ingrained thought-stopping training.
              TTFN

            • I have a question for you, SH – What exactly is “Thought Stopping” and where did this concept come from?

            • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

              Good question. But I find it fascinating that you would ask me. I wonder, Grasshopper, is there any place or easy way that you could look that up yourself? Gee, why did you not think of that?

            • I did look it up. It is a psychological technique psychologists tell people to use who are suffering from thoughts they cannot control. They are given techniques to stop these thoughts. It is used on people with panic disorder. I don’t have panic disorder, so… why are you asking me to do some “thought stopping?” This term is ONLY used, I have found, in the world of ex-Scientologists, or the world of people who want people to become ex-Scientologists. It’s a little term that floats around and everyone nods their heads as if it actually means something.

              You know what is interesting? The term as it is used by this small world means about the same as “service facsimile.” That, I find hilarious.

            • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

              Wow. You’re fun, Grasshopper, because you just keep on putting that Scientology-style thinking out there! It’s really quite remarkable. Please tell me that you have that Scientology-style laugh of hilarity down pat. Do you know the one I’m talking about? Someone here can send several YouTube links I’m sure, because it’s fairly distinctive. You know, where you abruptly throw your head back and emit a forced and inappropriately loud laugh?

              But what you’re saying is that the first page of your quick google search brought up panic disorder, and hey, that doesn’t fit you, and then you noticed that many of the links referenced Scientology. And BOOM. FULL THOUGHT STOP. Immediate dismissal of any of the information, with lightening-quick assertion that it is ONLY [your caps, not mine] in reference to Scientology, not to cults in general, but ONLY to Scientology. Hilarious indeed! And then you perfectly describe a thought-stopping device, whereby you flip the narrative with this gem: “It’s a little term that floats around and everyone nods their heads as if it actually means something.” Wow. You just provided a perfect descriptor of a thought-stopping device, and without awareness, you demonstrate it in action! You’re the best, Grasshopper! I’m laughing with you, but mostly I’m laughing at how well you illustrate the horrible effect that Scientology has had on your thinking. And you really can’t see it!! Fascinating.

            • Took you a while to look it up didn’t it? I know all about it.

            • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

              Longer than it took you earlier, grasshopper, when you googled “thought stopping,” glanced at a few hits, engaged your expensive scientology-trained thought-stopping mechanism and narcissistic know-it-all assumptions, and then quickly came back to post your shallow gotcha-question. Like I said, Grasshopper, you’re fun, and a great example of scientology reasoning in action. I especially enjoy how you even claim to be a know-it-all, but with out providing a shred of written evidence!

            • But, to answer your question, I read some of his posts. Listen, Chris was in as a staff member for a number of years, and he has his experiences. Reading his blog is interesting, as are his videos, but all respect to Chris, but Chris doesn’t say anything I didn’t already know.

            • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

              Gosh I find that difficult to believe, EO…er, I mean Grasshopper. I’ll say it again, in virtually every post, you provide further evidence of how deeply distorted and unbalanced your critical reasoning skills are, especially when it comes to Scientology. What amazes me is how poorly aware you seem to be about the manner and frequency in which you display it.

              I don’t see any evidence that you have read or considered any of Chris Shelton’s website, and I doubt seriously you have attempted to read or listen in full to any of his video posts. Of course, only you know the truth of that, and all I can do is ask you if you are being honest with yourself about it, and if you are not, consider ALL the reasons why not.

              Chris has several links that will take you to other very good critical thinking websites, and I would encourage you to explore them, you know, like a good Grasshopper would.

              Try this one for thought-stopping. I dare you: http://mindcontrolwiki.com/thought-stopping/

            • You really have a problem with me. don’t you? Do you seriously think I am unaware of what thought stopping is as you use it? You are projecting an awful lot on me. Of course I read this and other sources on your use of “thought stopping.” Years ago. Years ago. The phrase is used often in sites like this and others. So, anyway, thanks for your concern.

            • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

              Considering the overall exchange and context of this conversation, it appears that you are the one with the problem, grasshopper. And the problem, that you continue to demonstrate, is that you do not know how to think critically about scientology.

              Of course I seriously thought you were unaware of the meaning of thought-stopping. Did you not ask what it meant? Should I not assume that you are an honest communicator? Perhaps not, since you have made it clear that your reasoning skills are still mired in the muck of LRH.

              Sorry Grasshopper, like LRH, you can claim that you know and understand everything all you want, but until you actually demonstrate your understanding, you are still very much a rube. As I keep saying, your written record here is an excellent demonstration of how scientology infects the mind of someone who is otherwise quite intelligent. Also, I do appreciate that you are thankful for my concern, which is real.
              TTFN

            • daytoncapri

              Aw Grasshopper, I do not support many of your positions, but I am enjoying the funny
              back-and-forth – It’s been funny on both sides.

              You are scouting opinions? Well, to answer your question, I think the ’63 FDA raid was perfectly OK, and “justified” in response to the larger context of many transgressions by LRH et al. Let’s look at Al Capone, he should have been put away for multiple murders, but the Feds couldn’t pin it on him; instead, he was put away for Tax Evasion. Different tool; same desired result (incarceration). In the case of the FDA raid, my disappointment is that it did not impair Scientology for the long term.

              Just another opinion.

            • Thanks

          • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

            Hello there, Mr. Grasshopper. I just wanted express my appreciation for you being here. You add a lot to the bunker. I find you illuminative and especially entertaining.

            And to all new-comers to the Bunker, please read all Grasshopper’s posts, including those he has left in previous days. His responses represent a perfect example of how Scientology training renders someone of apparent high verbal intelligence into an defensive interlocutor, devoid of humor, self-awareness, and critical thinking skills.

        • Grasshopper is not here for a discussion.
          He is just a sad little bit of trollery.
          That keeps coming back to the bunker because his butthurtness won’t let him get on with his life.
          After all if his beloved tech really worked he would have handled the bunker already and gone back to saving the rest of the planet. I suggest he gets the extra large tube of Preparation H and applies it liberally.
          Then perhaps a nice cruise and fresh air would do him the world of good. I hear the Asbestoswinds is really cheap at the moment.

          • Observer

            Grasshopper is an indie.

            • Hopefully not the limp one that tried to start shite between Tony and Mike the other day on Mike’s blog. They got slapped down so quickly it was funny.

          • Dr_Orpheus

            If the tech really created Super Beings, a greedy incompetent, asshole like his Oiliness would never have taken over Scientology. Of course if Hubbardtech is designed only to create a bunch of drones who mindlessly obey authority, then Miscavige’s takeover makes a lot more sense.

        • Sherbet

          You get an A for effort, but the day Grasshopper says, “Oh! Well, that changes everything. Thanks, Observer!” I’ll eat my foot.

        • I believe I saw the likes of Grasshopper lurking around here yesterday, stirring up things with Skip Press, much like he appers to be doing with you, Observer. I certainty can’t smell a stinker in the “comments” section here, but I’m always sidestepping their stinkin’ little droppings.

          • Todd Tomorrow

            What are his crimes, Jenny?

            • The Underground Bunker/Grasshopper Security Check (“Sec Check”):

              1. Has Grasshopper ever enslaved a blogger to undermine the Underground Bunker?
              2. Has Grasshopper ever sacked a city the Underground Bunker was in?
              3. Has Grasshopper ever destroyed a non-combatant blogger in the Underground Bunker?
              4. Has Grasshopper ever annihilated bloggers in the Underground Bunker?
              5. Has Grasshopper ever poisoned food or drinking supplies in the Underground Bunker?
              6. Has Grasshopper ever strangled a blogger in the Underground Bunker?
              7. Has Grasshopper ever deliberately spread disease in the Underground Bunker?
              8. Has Grasshopper ever deprived bloggers of traveling in the Underground Bunker?
              9. Has Grasshopper ever committed a murder in the Underground Bunker?
              10. Has Grasshopper ever destroyed a blogger in the Underground Bunker?
              11. Has Grasshopper ever kidnapped or otherwise made of with a blogger in the Underground Bunker?
              12. Is anybody seeking to discover Grasshopper’s whereabouts besides the Underground Bunker?
              13. Has Grasshopper ever broken a treaty to make the Underground Bunker look bad?
              14. Has Grasshopper ever upset an ecology the Underground Bunker was a part of?
              15. Has Grasshopper ever been a crook in the Underground Bunker?
              16. Has Grasshopper ever obliterated a language the Underground Bunker spoke?
              17. Has Grasshopper ever deliberately trained bloggers in the Underground Bunker in untruths for power or profit?
              18. Has Grasshopper ever defiled religious places, persons, or objects in the Underground Bunker?
              19. Has Grasshopper ever practiced terrorism in the Underground Bunker?

      • Douglas D. Douglas

        A sincere question: Which “spirit” specifically can be saved, and alone may save or heal the body?

        • The individual him or herself.

          • Douglas D. Douglas

            Ah. You mean the Thetan. Got it.

            Is there some reason that Scientology won’t use consistent terminology, especially when it comes to something as basic as their Creed? I mean, besides the obvious observation…

            • I can’t say exactly, but knowing Hubbard, it was because he wanted to avoid jargon in the creed.

            • Douglas D. Douglas

              Now I laugh.

              Hubbard wanted to… avoid… JARGON… in ANY context?

              Please, I beg of you, go back, read what you wrote. Or edit before you post.

            • Of course, it could have been because he wanted to fool people into thinking Scientology was a bonafide religion. It could be that. And maybe it was.

              But here is where, again, you lose context. Are you familiar with the concept of Scientology 0? Or the avoidance of misunderstood words in public texts? You may or may not agree with the need to avoid words that are not defined, but it is a part of Scientology to minimize exposure to new words without defining them. Can you see a creed riddled with asterisks as a valid creed? So, yes, I can see how creating a public-facing creed should be lacking in jargon.

            • Douglas D. Douglas

              Word Clearing and M/Us are just another tool to keep people who are enthralled with Scientology safely in the fold. I am familiar with the concepts you cite, and am capable of checking into any I am not (I learned how to “look words up” in the third grade, and with a real dictionary, not a book of jargon and terminology).

              A “public-facing” creed? Try that one on any legitimate religion. A Creed is intended for the faithful, to explicitly define what makes them unique and binds them together. It is not simple PR.

      • Hingle McCringleberry

        It takes it the orders from the OSA man and posts on the Bunker. It does this whenever it’s told.

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ReqpC2yE9ts

        • This is the Scientology version of Godwin’s Law: Eventually, someone is going to invoke OSA. All my buddies know I am certainly not OSA.

    • And, for the record, auditing does and can occur without the aid of an E-Meter. The entirety of Routes 1 and 2 are sans E-meter. And, of course, R2-45 is sans E-Meter.

      • Lucille Austero

        Oh, Grasshopper, of course it can occur without the “aid” of an E-Meter. Why? Because it is all made-up stuff. See? You make it up, you can add anything you want to it. Or take anything away! It is all-purpose!

        • Douglas D. Douglas

          You really are rude and bigoted to keep bringing up that pesky logic.

          Stop it!

      • Observer

        Again with the deflection. Are overts run without the e-meter? Are sec checks done without the e-meter? How about PTS rundowns? Those are the Big Bads for illnesses and accidents.

      • Artoo45

        I always have my e-meter . . .

        • aquaclara

          Hah, hah. You found the very best spot for your treasure.
          Ironic in so many ways….
          It makes me smile.

      • IASREG

        Convincing people with treatable conditions,such as cancer, to undergo auditing instead of seeking actual medical treatment is very much like R2-45 and the cult gets to defraud them of money at the same time. The OT8 with cancer chooses worthless auditing instead of valid medical treatment, coughs up as much money as the cult can defraud them out of, and then they die. Of course they will be quickly forgotten by Scientology.

      • Stacy

        Wait, was that murder humor again? Am I supposed to chuckle over the fact that people can shoot themselves or others without making use of the e-meter?

        Maybe it’s all the statistical knowledge I have about murders and suicides committed each year with guns that makes this seem so humorless to me.

        ETA: If you think my comment is somewhat offensive, that’s because I find your humor over potential murder and suicide offensive.

        • Douglas D. Douglas

          The mind boggles, does it not?

          “Go shoot yourself! Ha ha ha, that’s a joke. But really, go shoot yourself.”

        • Well, since guns are not mentioned in the actual definition of R2-45, just think of R2-45 as sharing a can of Colt 45 Malt Liquor. This, too, is a sure-fire way to exteriorize. It’s pretty potent stuff.

          • Todd Tomorrow

            I heard OSA is looking to spray you with some, Roundup.

            • daytoncapri

              Nasty stuff, it kills off toads. I like toads.

            • Todd Tomorrow

              Sadly it kills almost everything.

            • beauty for ashes

              Please do not use or buy roundup. It’s made by Monsanto. (the scientology of agriculture)
              http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2013/06/09/monsanto-roundup-herbicide.aspx

            • Todd Tomorrow

              It is the most evil thing on the market. Our townhouse groundskeeper keeps it on his utility belt.

            • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

              Not sure which is source of information is more duplicitous and unreliable: spin from a monstrous agribusiness or pseudoscience claptrap from an online hucksterbusiness.

            • beauty for ashes

              Sir Hemet, truly you have a dizzying intellect.
              Please enlighten me to the business of your post, I cannot make heads or tails of your meaning. 🙂

            • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

              Hi Beauty. I can assure you, I am no more intelligent than most people here. But I am very much a skeptic and I like to think that I know a bit about what counts as good empirical evidence. While I am highly skeptical of the claims from such a powerful organization like Monsanto, I am even more skeptical of anything from Mercola, and I must say that the link that you provided is complete crap. And not merely crap, but harmful crap, to a degree that it nearly rivals the pseudoscientific claims of LRH and scientology. Mercola is a well known and egregious quack. Please read about him here: http://skepdic.com/mercola.html

              The skeptics dictionary is a great website to visit to checkout all types of claims.
              I am also a regular reader of sciencebasedmedicine.org and neurologica.org, both excellent resources for skeptical analysis of pseudoscientific medical claims. I hope that is helpful. Cheers!

            • beauty for ashes

              That is helpful! I will look into that. I need to find a better link for what I wanted to say, mostly about the litigious nature. I should have looked at the whole article instead of the headline. Since you say it is a harmful link i will edit it. I wasn’t sure initially if that was what you were saying. Thanks ! 🙂

            • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

              Pleased to have obliged, Ms. Beauty. Monsanto is scary powerful, and any corporate entity that large is able to use the legal system to overwhelm and bully those without such resources. The analogy fits. Take care!

          • Anonymous

            “…Well, since guns are not mentioned in the actual definition of R2-45…”

            Oh really?

            Listen to this clip in Hubbard’s own voice and tell us that guns are not mentioned in reference to R2-45:

            http://file.wikileaks.org/file/r2-45.mp3

            You really need to get your facts straight.

            • A little levity please. I prefer the Colt 45 version.

            • Anonymous

              I’m sure you do prefer the false version…because the true, unredacted, unedited version shows Scientology and its founder for what and who they really are / were…

          • Stacy

            I apologize to you for taking offense at your (as I perceive it) insensitive sense of humor. Taking offense makes no sense. Good luck in the future. I hope your spiritual journey leads you to some true insight.

    • Observer

      Oops, I forgot to post the links where I got this info, and Disqus isn’t letting me edit the post, so here they are:

      http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~dst/NOTs/medical/jacobsen-medical.txt
      http://www.holysmoke.org/cos/illness.htm

    • George Layton

      The only thing it couldn’t cure was ron.

    • BFM

      Thanks Obs! This collection of Looneys preposterous claims is a gem. Someone ought to collect and publish it.

    • grundoon

      OH MY GAWD! The other day a well known figure in British Scientology was standing in my office being asked to undertake an activity and I said to him, more to make conversation than anything else, “Of course you know that if we were to take on a long series of cases suffering from some specific chronic somatic we would at least, even if we used group processing, alleviate the majority of those cases.” And this gentleman who has been in Scientology for a very long time and has done a very great deal of auditing said to me, “Oh really? Could you do that now?”

      WHERE HAS THIS GUY BEEN? Back in Wichita when Susie and I were combing the whole track trying to plow up the various incidents which eventually became What to Audit (in England, The History of Man) we took on a series of polio cases by means of newspaper advertisement. The newspaper advertisement said, “Polio sufferers. A research foundation is undertaking an investigation of polio. Any persons so inflicted who would like to participate in this investigation should phone —– .” The same ad was also run for arthritics. People with arthritis and polio started to call in and we took these people on, the polio sufferers up at my house, the arthritics down at the foundation, and using the oldest known form of overt acts and motivators, and using effort processing, we alleviated the majority of the cases which presented themselves. The first case that came up immediately, by the way, enrolled in the professional course and other cases took professional auditing afterwards. Don G. Purcell cut the program off without informing us because of course the foundation was supposed to fail. This program alone would have meant the making of Dianetics in that immediate area, and as a matter of fact, is still heard from, although it was only in progress ten days (it happens to be a good gag for any auditor to work). But remember this was 1951, and right there, auditing these people no more than three hours per preclear, we made the majority of these people feel so much better about life that they could get on with it. One girl threw away her crutches immediately. Another one, an old lady, got out of her wheel chair, and what we did in that short program just auditing these few hours using nothing but overt acts, motivators in the manner of effort processing, yet it did so much more for these people than had ever been done for them medically or ever could be done for them medically, that they were astonished beyond gratitude.

      And here is this British Scientologist who has been in practice for years standing there in front of my desk and asking me in a surprised tone of voice whether or not we could do anything for polio or other types of illnesses. This man is reputed to have more success with auditing than many others. But if he has not learned that we can alleviate the majority of any illness in any series (as distinct from curing all cases into a state of perfection), then what does this man think we are doing? Does he think that Scientology is a swindle. He must! Either that or he’s never applied it even vaguely to people who were ill.

      This matter was a considerable shock to me, as you might well suppose, for it told me at once why the progress of Scientology in Great Britain was relatively limited. A further check into this subject with another person, a much better Scientologist, discovered to me that the British Scientologist is not aware of the wild reactions and phenomena obtained from running engrams. The preclear rolling up in a ball on the bed as he goes into a pre- natal or wriggling his whole body like a fish as he hits a sperm sequence is unknown in Great Britain. Indeed at this late date I suppose that it is more or less unknown in America since it has been two or three years since anybody ran an engram on anybody. But here again was the tremendous drama associated with auditing.

      Now if we have forgotten in Great Britain, America, and if we have not established in South Africa or Australia, first that Dianetics or Scientology even in its crudest form could alleviate the majority of man’s illnesses, and that a majority of any series of cases of any specific illness would be alleviated, and if we have not established the various highly convincing phenomena obtained in running engrams, we of course are not making anywhere near the progress we should. Indeed if we have let this material lapse in America and are no longer beating the drum for it, no longer demonstrating it, we of course are going to make very slow progress. There is nothing quite as convincing as getting tipped over into a pre-natal and getting it run out. The phenomena of running birth, of operations, accidents, of the loud zip, pop that comes from electronic explosions hot enough to burn holes in the E-Meter electrodes, and particularly the fantastic efficiency of Dianetics and Scientology in alleviating a majority of illnesses, are any one of them capable of giving enough word of mouth to Dianetics and Scientology across a populace to alert the world to what we really have here. However, if we neglect these things utterly, if our auditors do not know they can happen, we are going to make very slow progress of it.

      We can as of this moment process a chronic somatic. I know that some months ago and earlier than that it seemed rather fatal to us to continue to fixate the preclear’s attention on a chronic somatic. But that is not a problem with us right now. It ceased to be a problem the moment I invented an auditing command exactly as follows: “Invent a problem that (leg, arm, nose, eye, body) could be to you.” Running this command which is in itself a sort of a remedy of havingness, and repairing and remedying the havingness of the preclear as we go, we will discover that practically any and all phenomena associated with the service facsimile will come away and clear up and the limb or nose or eye will get well. This can be used as a word of warning, only on actual terminals. Never use this command, and I mean never, on actual conditions. Never ask the individual to invent problems lameness could be to him. Never ask him what problem blindness could be to him. Lameness and blindness are conditions. We want to know what problems legs or eyes can be to him, since legs and eyes are terminals. In running this command we reduce havingness too rapidly whenever we are stressing conditions. Therefore we run it only on terminals and use only terminals in running it. Handled in this way we do have the answer, as of this moment, to chronic somatics. This is really not news. We have had the answer to chronic somatics for years, and we have actually been able to alleviate the majority of chronic somatics which presented themselves to us. – L. Ron Hubbard, OPERATIONAL BULLETIN NO. 13, 17 January 1956.

    • grundoon

      It is very interesting to note this girl’s trouble (polio, paralysis, one leg shortened up beyond the other): had completely passed medical notice that the polio had affected the right leg as well as the left leg by enlarging it slightly. And it was this factor as much as anything else which was making it difficult for her to walk. This is one of those cases that you find outside of Dianetics — just one of those dreamboat cases. You just sit there and you ask a few questions and the answers all come up, and no occlusions or anything like that. After a while the person sits there and says, “Well, I can wiggle my toes a little bit now,” and so on. I’m going to audit her again Thursday at two, just to check audit on this.

      You see, I do not know, by these new techniques, how long it takes for something like that to occur. That is the only thing in question. Theoretically, it could take place instantaneously — that is to say, in the process of the afternoon. There is no reason why this couldn’t happen this long, but the theory is that on a limb which has been reduced in size or made unusable, it takes it a while; the medical practice is that it takes it a while to rehabilitate itself, if it is ever going to at all. Now, one case worked by the earlier techniques required six or eight months to get back complete liveness of muscles and so on. And the only question in this case is whether or not this is going to take place completely in six or eight months or whether or not it is going to take place in two or three weeks or four or five weeks, or something like that. That is the factor involved.

      She is a very, very beautiful young lady, by the way — very, very pretty. That was, by the way, Case Number 1 on this series.

      I don’t know where they keep all the blind people in Wichita, but I think there must be some prize or something given to people who keep blind people out of sight, or keep them blind. Of course, a blind person cannot read an ad. Pray tell, who doesn’t read the ad to them? It’s an interesting question. I am reduced, on the point of blind people, to the point where I am going to have to go round and start working on the people that go up and down the street playing guitars and things.

      …Right now you could say to any industry, “We will speed up your efficiency, we will cut down your accidents to practically zero, we will make your personnel problems almost vanish, we will set up your management category so that they will last until they are at least eighty with no ulcers, and give you a nice, smooth-running personnel setup on your organization for a total cost of $250 per man in your organization. It will take twenty-five hours per man, and the results will be just exactly as stated.” Now, that’s quite remarkable to be able to do that.

      You could say to the United States Army, “If you want some soldiers for a change, we would be very happy to set up a program for you by which the reaction time of an American soldier could be speeded up to the point where he could not be beaten — the reaction time alone. Furthermore, the reason an army loses is because it does not have a spirit to win. You are worried about morale — you spend millions, billions, every year upon morale. It is very simple: You really don’t need all this money spent on morale; all you need is men who win — who want to win, not lose. Very simple.” You could actually offer out a project of that kind.

      … The caste of a person who has known about Dianetics for a long time will go up. “Let’s go around to Agnes’s house tonight. I understand that she’s been in Dianetics for over a year. Yes, maybe she can answer this question about little Benny’s wart.”

      – L. Ron Hubbard – THE IMPACT OF DIANETICS ON SOCIETY – A lecture given on 14 January 1952

    • But nothing that Hubbard said or wrote actually claims or promises anything!
      ..

    • grundoon

      There’s a young lady . . . You understand I can’t promise you one way or the other, with this new technique, that it will be very fast. In the majority of cases which I have worked, there has only been one: there’s an old lady with arthritis — she’s about seventy-two — and boy, she is so far out of present time! The calcium is practically in her mind, rather than her knees, and she is sure that nothing can possibly help her. As a matter of fact, the way she gets along with her family is to be lame, and so on. I mean, that’s her whole computation. And her case is just moving at a snail’s pace. I guess I’ve put in about eight hours on her, total, and all I’ve got to show for it is the relief of an anxiety in her stomach, and nothing showing up on the arthritis, yet, at all.

      But a young lady came in here, for instance, last Thursday — young lady who was hit by polio — and her left leg was shortened and muscularly incapacitated, paralyzed, much smaller than the right leg, on a crutch. And she was processed — I think it was two and a half hours — and at the end of two and a half hours she found out she could wiggle her toes. And at the end of the session, she went out of here on her crutch. I called up to check how she was the day after — the next day — and she wasn’t in the house. She had left her crutch home. Her crutch is sitting here, but she is downtown…. And I’ve got to do a checkover on her tomorrow, but that was only two and a half hours worth. Of course, she was only seventeen, eighteen. But God almighty!

      Now, her mother was in the lecture on Monday night — I give lectures Monday night down here at 211 West Douglas — and her mother was there. And she said they were trying awfully hard not to get too excited about it around her, and try to get her to take it more or less as a routine proposition.

      Now, that’s awfully fast. But that is by this new technique as compared to the old techniques, whereby a young lady who had been in braces for thirty-five years — she was processed for about three months, maybe five to ten hours a week, pretty heavy, for about three months. And her muscular paralysis did not begin to recede until another six months had gone by. She had been thirty-five years on crutches and braces, and the muscular tones came back in all muscles, and she is now walking without her crutches. But that’s about — took almost fourteen months as a total on a rehabilitation basis. So we have no idea how fast polio will rehabilitate. We know it may be very quick, a matter of a few weeks . . . there’s this possibility — on up to a point where it may rehabilitate — take months. We know it will rehabilitate.

      It’s a matter of time; it’s how much. Well, I’ve only worked — let’s be blunt about it — I’ve only worked this one case of polio since the first of the year with this new technique. There are — oh, there must be twenty-five cases that were worked as research cases in the old Foundation. All of these people have recovered on the older types of technique, which I consider a pretty good average.

      One girl down in Texas — I’ve never run into this, really, with polio — but a shortening of the right arm and muscular paralysis on it. And she was thirty-eight years of age and she grew two and a half inches on her arm. How is a human body able to do this? Nobody knows its ability to recover — nobody knows.

      – L. Ron Hubbard, telling the preclear what to expect, in an auditing session recorded on 16 January 1952.

    • grundoon

      For a very long time we have been working on optimum dissemination to find out if there was such a thing. Over the years we have found that in order of importance the following methods were workable.

      Personal Contact: …

      Books: …

      Casualty Contact: A fruitful source of HAS co-audit people is casualty contact. This is very old, is almost never tried and is always roaringly successful, providing the auditor goes about it in roughly the right way. Using his Minister’s card, an auditor need only barge into any nonsectarian hospital, get permission to visit the wards from the Superintendent, mentioning nothing about processing but only about taking care of people’s souls, to find himself wonderfully welcome. Ministers almost never make such rounds. Some hospitals are sticky about this sort of thing, but it’s only necessary to find another. It’s fabulous what one can get done in a hospital with a touch assist and locational processing. Don’t pick on the very bad off unconscious cases. Hit the fracture ward and the maternity ward. Go around and say hello to the people and ask if you can do anything for them. Now here’s how auditors have lost on this one. They omit the following steps: They fail to have a card with their Ministerial name on it with their phone number. They fail to have a telephone answering service. They fail to tell the people they snap away from death’s yawning door that they can have more of this stuff simply by calling in. They get so involved in the complexities of medical (ha) treatment and so outraged at some of the things they see going on that they get into rows with medicos and the hospital staff. And also they pick unconscious patients or people who are halfway exteriorised already. This is a pretty routine drill really. You get permission to visit. You go in and give patients a cheery smile. You want to know if you can do anything for them, you give them a card and tell them to come around to your group and really get well, and you give them a touch assist if they seem to need it but only if they’re willing. And you for sure make sure that somebody is on the other end when they ring up. Giving them a schedule of your HAS Co-Audit will avail much. I’ve got a book scheduled the “sick person” as a working title that will make good fodder for this. But your statement, “The modern scientific church can cure things like that. Come around and see,” will work. It’s straight recruiting….

      – L. Ron Hubbard – HCO BULLETIN OF 15 SEPTEMBER 1959 – DISSEMINATION TIPS

    • Free Minds, Free Hearts

      Whoa, I did not realize that auditing is supposed to cure brainwashing. Too bad it doesn’t work.

    • grundoon

      There is one clear who was in the Foundation, and a lot of the people worried about her…. This girl had had poliomyelitis when she was two and had been on crutches all of her life. Her auditor had run out all the engrams that he could possibly find in her, and a check of her demonstrated that her sonic, visio and other things were all right. They were a little bit off and sometimes she had a tendency to not pick up all the data, but that was all right. I have looked for engrams in her and I couldn’t find any. Nobody else could find any….

      Anyway, this girl demonstrated that she no longer had certain aberrations she had before. When I first saw her come into the Foundation, by the way, you could not talk to her or say three words to her without some tears leaking out of her eyes…. She had terrific nervous tension, and she had been working in the field of psychiatry as a psychiatric assistant. She was really something.

      All of her engrams were knocked out; all of those aspects went away and she became a pretty calm person and became a lot more able than before. But people said she couldn’t possibly be a clear because she was still on crutches. I often thought that, after all, this person from the age of two to the age of thirty, or something like that, had never walked a step by herself; she was on nothing but crutches. Yet people were saying, “She couldn’t possibly be a clear,” and “This couldn’t be a clear because she is still on those crutches.” I think this is being arbitrary.

      But she fooled everybody. A note came in here a couple of days ago; she is no longer on crutches. This is incredible. This has never happened before; a person who for twenty-eight years walks on crutches from poliomyelitis all of a sudden throws them away. She has grown about an inch and three quarters and she no longer walks on crutches. This person is adjusting, evidently, physiologically to these changes in her being—functional changes.

      – L. Ron Hubbard – ALL POSSIBLE ABERRATIONS – A lecture given on 4 June 1951

    • LHS

      “You are only three or four hours from taking your glasses off for keeps.”

      Of course, several people say that LRH wore glasses in private for his entire adult life. Funny that he couldn’t fix his own eyesight with Dianetics.

  • Destructor of Worlds

    The ultimate appropiate quote:

    “Illusion is needed to disguise the emptiness within.”

    – Arthur Erickson

  • Pierrot

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    44 ads so far pre-statsday, SF way ahead of the field with a sprinkling of LA, Sac & Nash, (see the Daily Wip). Keep checking the Daily Wip for more ads from California later this evening every 2nd hours.
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    Remember Tony Chen in Sacramento!

    This Way by Keep Walking, enhanced by DodoTheLaser for RedX & flickred by Aegerprimo:. https://www.flickr.com/photos/120371503@N05/15704434326/in/set-72157642802079293

  • Artoo45

    Has Hubbs ever written anything that didn’t veer into unintended hilarity? What a broth of bravado, bathos and butthurt.

    • Lucille Austero

      Agreed 47,000 percent!

    • Stacy

      Not to mention complete and utter falsehoods. Sorry, couldn’t keep up the alliteration.

    • Chee Chalker

      Yes, humility is not a Co$ trait….”we are the authorities on the human mind, we are the authorities on getting people off drugs….. “.

  • Stacy

    Has anyone been able to find the supposed quote from Senator Edward V. Long in the Senate Subcommittee Hearings from the 89th Congress? I’ve spent the past few hours wading through this illustrious document and I’m having absolutely no luck.

    I was thinking that Hubbard probably took a statement by Long out of context to use in his self-aggrandizing pamphlet, but I’m now starting to think Long never said anything remotely like this and Hubbard just made the whole thing up. Gee, Hubbard making up complete and utter falsehoods. What a surprise (not really, just being dramatic, like usual).

    If anyone finds this, let me know. Otherwise I’ll go back to wading through the Hearing document later. I want to actually read the Bunker comments now.

  • Douglas D. Douglas

    Earlier today Michael Leopold wrote: “The cover of “The Findings” features Arslycus, the R-6 God, who was a creation of Hubbard’s. Hubbard believed that by depicting him on the cover, readers would be ‘re-stimulated’ and the contents would ‘impinge.'”

    And, oddly enough, the sight of that solemn, shaggy figure did restimulate something buried deep in my psyche. And I was impinged to refrain from cheating at cards! Through a complicated and secret process (send me $10,000 and I will try and explain it to you) I was able to create a tangible, graphic image of that restimulation:

    (refresh)

    • Observer

      Very nicely done!

      • Douglas D. Douglas

        Didn’t it fit together nicely?

        • Observer

          Perfectly!

        • Chee Chalker

          It was great! Does it come in velvet?

          • Douglas D. Douglas

            I will postulate that for next time…!

        • Nat-lificent

          Like butter!

    • aegerprimo

      Talk about a poker face, jeeze!

    • Anonymous

      I’ll bet he cheats at cards too.

    • Missionary Kid

      *Good, wholesome laugh*
      Can I get that on black velvet?

      • Douglas D. Douglas

        That would be the Ideal medium, no?

        • Missionary Kid

          😉

    • Nat-lificent

      I need this as a T-shirt. Srsly.

      • Douglas D. Douglas

        Awfully arcane, though, don’t you think?

    • Ella Raitch

      I heart you for this Triple D

  • Panopea Abrupta

    One year ago today, I came out of long-time lurking here and at the Village Voice to post on the Bunker for the first time.
    Now, 3248 posts and one roller coaster ride around the sun later, my heartfelt thanks go to our generous proprietor for this amazing online community he hosts and, above all, for his unflinchingly honest and open look into a fascinating subject.
    Thank you all for your love, intelligence, snark and righteous indignation. This coming year will bring even more to cause joy, tears and laughter as we follow the continued decline of Co$.
    Thank you, Tony.
    Thank you all.

    • Eclipse-girl

      Happy anniversary.
      We are all grateful that you started writing.

    • Observer

      Happy Bunkerversary!

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        Bunkerversary ! Yessss!

    • Missionary Kid

      I’m happy you’re here, in spite of the fact that I’ve worn my fingers down to the bone catching all of your wonderful language for my lists – just kidding, because it’s been a pleasure, because your writing is so fun and incisive to read.

      • Richard Grant

        Yeah really she should file those things down.

        Oh wait, you said INCISIVE. nvm

    • FromPolandWithLove

      Best wishes Panopea :):):). Happy anniversary:)

      • Richard Grant

        Isn’t it tomorrow in Poland? What are you doing awake?

        • FromPolandWithLove

          Last minutes of today;) , Catching up with Bunker news:)

        • Pierrot

          Our problem is that much of the action and J&D start late for us in the gmt-

    • Pierrot

      Thanks for your help, thanks for your posts. Je ne trouve pas les mots justes pour exprimer mon appreciation de votre support.

    • Stacy

      Happy Anniversary, Pan. I can’t imagine the Bunker without you. This community is so very lucky to have you here providing intelligent, witty commentary on Hubbard’s Ship of Fools.

      Thank you so much.

    • I had my first bunker anniversary a week or so ago too 🙂

      • aquaclara

        Congratulations! You and Pan are both scelebrating today!

      • aegerprimo

        Happy Bunkerversary to you too! ♥

        • Thanks AP. But I think I have prematurely bunker aniversaryed.
          My earliest post I could find was the 17th February.
          I will just go and sit in the corner wearing the bunker dunce hat, having made a fool of myself 🙂

      • Davka

        I don’t remember the date when I first posted – how do you remember the date? I remember the why – the Headleys selling their swing set – and thus I posted for the first time ever on anything.

        • Bury_The_Nuts

          I think it was sheer luck…but i could be wrong….;-)

        • I was sure that my first post was 3 weeks after Xmas, but I followed my posts back and the earliest one I could find was 17th of February so unless some of my posts have gone missing, I may have prematurely bunker anniversaryed.
          Perhaps scientology could help with that.

          • Robert Eckert

            How can you run out that electronic incident if you can’t date locate it on the whole track?

            • It wasn’t the first time my memory was full of shite and it wont be the last.
              Getting kicked in the head by a racehorse has screwed up my memory sometimes.
              But funnily enough I never forget my old grudges 🙂

    • Richard Grant

      OLD COOT: Ah, you whippersnappers don’t remember the good old days, when you didn’t need a college degree to enjoy these Bunker posts. That was before that gal, what’s her name, Panoply Interruptus, something like that —

      [O.S. – SHOTS FIRED]

      OLD COOT: Dribble just a little brandy in that tea, if you don’t mind. But milk in first, milk in first!

      • beauty for ashes

        You must write delightful dialogue!

    • Richard Grant

      I think I remember you from the shadows at the Voice, where I lurked too. Seriously, it’s so great you’ve come out in all your splendor into the light of the comment thread. You’ve kicked this place to a new level.

    • aegerprimo

      Woo hoo Pan Ab! The Bunker is an even better place because of you and the amazing way you string words together. ♥

      • Pierrot

        hear, hear!

    • Sibs

      Man, I can’t remember or imagine the Bunker without you.

    • Jimmy3

      You will always be my favorite species of extinct clam.

      • Pierrot

        :-)}

    • Bury_The_Nuts

      But, did you bring Doritos?

      • Observer

        Now I want tacos. 🙁

        • Bury_The_Nuts

          My work here is done 😉

          And I have “specifically” not mentioned Tacos for Months.

          You have been indoctrinated.
          Please pay the fee to the reg at the door…BWAHHHHAHHHAHAAAHHH

          • Observer

            Pffffffffffffft!

        • L. Wrong Hubturd

          Welcome to Bury’s House of Pavlov Tacos. Would you like a meal deal? Free rice and beans as a side.

    • NOLAGirl

      We <3 you Pan! 🙂

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        Hey, wheres her cake? I just started back on new program, new doc, 850 friggin calories, no bread or cheese, or much of anything, and working it in gym. I am back in hell. At the moment back in bed, like a stiff board. Cant make cake, Pan, or I would. We have many excellent bakers though. Just pull up to the dessert cart. Im sure someome can whip something up.

        • NOLAGirl

          All the clam cakes I found were ugly, so I went with an oyster. 🙂 (F5)

    • Jimmy3

      I thought I remembered your very first post here, so I went back and found it. I was right

    • Cece

      Love the Love ~

    • beauty for ashes

      any chance of a sundance inspired hitler video?

    • Free Minds, Free Hearts

      Happy Anniversary Pan!!

    • Robert Eckert

      The recent Downfall recaptioning was truly superb, thanks for that and many other belly laughs. Happy anniversary!

    • Ella Raitch

      I remember the day you explained your name and avi – if that was the first day you posted, I was here reading. Happy anniversary, baby!

      BTW – someone didn’t get the memo to stop upvoting at 47

  • Douglas D. Douglas

    How toothless OSA has become. Over at the Hollywood Reporter a glowing story about Gibney and his documentary has been up for five hours, with nary a peep from the Usual Suspects. There aren’t that many comments at all, actually, though I did leave one. Might be a good idea to drop by there and offer a few more ‘attaboys to THR…

    http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/bombshell-scientology-film-revealed-alex-764849?utm_source=twitter

    • Observer

      I bet they’ll turn up tomorrow, being as it’s Staturday.

      • aegerprimo

        Aw, those silly $ciloons, so predictable.

      • Sneering Cyril

        It’s Wed today!

    • aegerprimo

      This article (though not the depth of Kim Master’s article) runs on Disqus comments as well…

      What We Can Expect From HBO’s Damning Scientology Documentary
      http://laist.com/2015/01/21/going_clear_scientology_documentary.php

  • Todd Tomorrow

    If bat shit crazy mary blew.You can, Too!
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ocw90W44Boc

    • MaxSpaceman

      really, she blew? Dox/links ?

      • Todd Tomorrow

        It’s all over Google and really hasn’t been seen since 2010. Even issuing a statement via her sister. Looks much better and healthier prior to her taking down her blog. God, I still hate her but love the music! Bunker even cried(no shit) over her departure!

        • Sneering Cyril

          Hope you don’t mind me asking who you’re talking about?

          • DMSTCC

            Mary DeMoss

            • Mary DeMoss – Mary Panton – Mary VonBreck…

            • Bury_The_Nuts

              At least she has found a new focus 😉

            • Political actions for Don’t-Drug-Kids causes side-by-side with CCHR? (That may have changed since the last time I looked, several years ago.)

            • Todd Tomorrow

              It’s now GMO food, which I’m all for. Still I’d love to bullbait Mary for old time sake.

            • Sneering Cyril

              Thanks : )

        • MaxSpaceman

          google what name …

          • Benfranklin

            Just go to this twitter link and you will find Mary: https://twitter.com/peopleslobbyist

            • Stacy

              She’s something of an activist. I have to admire this about her.

            • Free Minds, Free Hearts

              She sure looks better now! Much healthier and more relaxed.

    • Did she blow? As I recall, while she deleted some old blogs, there wasn’t much evidence that she had got out.

      • Todd Tomorrow

        Researched in for hours she is gone!! I didn’t believe it either.

    • Still_On_Your_Side

      Well at least she didn’t ask for the secret handshake or the password to get into the secret clubhouse.

    • Stacy

      Wow Todd. She is seriously batshit, delusional. I sit here thinking, “this woman can’t have any idea how literally crazy she looks and sounds. If she did, she would not act like this.” Then I realize, this very messed up woman is probably thinking the exact same things about Mark and Tory. This is just so wrong (Messed-up Mary, not Tory or Mark).

      ETA: Very difficult to believe she actually blew. I hope she’s getting some serious help now.

      • Todd Tomorrow

        She was worse than this. An expert at”bullbaiting” as the scions call it. Search, Mary De Moss on youtube. I was so amazed she left. Such a die hard clam but I love when she tries to take on Stacy Brooks and Tory who know what she’s trying to do.

    • Todd Tomorrow

      I still want my own,”Nigerian stealing guy.”
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nhMA6attV0Y

  • Bury_The_Nuts

    That Kim Masters piece was freaking awesome.

    Damn it to hell in a hand basket.
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    This.Used.To.Be.Work!!!!
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Now you can sleepwalk through being an Anti-Scientologist and still have time to make fun of the Kardashians.

    So Tony, is North Korea next?

    • Douglas D. Douglas

      Hey there.

      • Bury_The_Nuts

        Hey Back at Ya!

    • Bob

      Great article. I would have loved to comment.

      • Bury_The_Nuts

        The Lance Armstrong comment was PRICELESS!!!!

        • Bob

          That’s real credibility, when the film maker exposes a fraud and the fraudulent person then complements the filmmaker.
          Put that in your OT pipe and smoke little Davey Myth-Scabige.
          My new slogan:

          Scientology, INCREDIBLY DISCREDITABLE!

          • Bury_The_Nuts

            No kidding. That was just incredible. It also did a lot for me to have a better understanding of Lance Armstrong.

    • Ella Raitch

      So true – lately it feels laid on like an all-you-can-eat buffet

      • Stacy

        Nothing wrong with an all-you-can-eat buffet, unless somebody sneezes cold and flu germs all over the food you’re going to eat.

  • Still_On_Your_Side

    The good news about the reception so far of Gibney’s documentary, and Tony’s forthcoming book, has me thinking about Ida Camburn. I wish she could see how far down Scientology has fallen. She lost her only son to Scientology, and spent years trying to stop the cult from taking any more sons and daughters. She made a promise to the late Leo Ryan to expose Scientology as a destructive organization. Ryan lost his life trying to assist people wanting to escape Jonestown, and Ida died before her work was done. When the last light is turned off at the Church of Scientology, and families that have been torn apart by disconnection are reunited, there should be a sign posted on the door that states, ” Ida Camburn’s promise is now fulfilled.”

  • TheHoleDoesNotExist

    Three names I’d like to see in the Gibney documentary:
    Julia Schlessinger (sp?),
    Kate Bornstein,
    and Pat Broeker.

    Hey, I can dream, can’t I?

    • Bury_The_Nuts

      and Pat Broeker.

      and Pat Broeker.

      and Pat Broeker.

      and Pat Broeker.

      and Pat Broeker.

      and Pat Broeker.

      and Pat Broeker.

      OOOOh…as if!!!!

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        Oh, hi Dave! Sleep tight! ;

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        Any word on bearsharks?

        • Bury_The_Nuts

          ?
          I tried to post..went to DICKSUCKS land.
          Is he missing?
          I been in and out for the last several days,

          Edit: APB is happening.

          • A Guest

            Sunday, IIRC, he said he was finally going in for that “tune-up” on Monday or Tuesday (yesterday) and asked StillGrace to hold down the fort. I’ve been wondering/worrying myself. Any word?

            • Bury_The_Nuts

              Thank you. No…but i will see what i can find.

              Thanks again.

            • A Guest

              Thanks to you, too, for being a terminal.

            • Bury_The_Nuts

              On it. If he does not answer in a short time frame…I am sending the last and best terminal after him.
              Grrrr.

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              The Taco Terminal. Heh. Terminal… please do not say we asked, because nobody cares. Also he will be irritated, or conked out for days.

            • Bury_The_Nuts

              Oh, I dont care if I piss him off. I do that on a regular basis.
              (I think he is getting used to it)

            • TheHoleDoesNotExist

              Because you have all the tacos.

            • Bury_The_Nuts

              Well…I did…but then I ate em……………;-)

            • The Dude

              Been worried a bit. Posted a few things here for him to see. Never a click. Bury if you hear from him, I live within an hour of his town. I will drive over there and drag his ass out by his thumbs if I have to.
              Joking about the thumbs. Not about the drive over there. But I don’t have an address, just a town. I can’t drive all over asking for a “Bear-shark”!

            • The Dude

              Baby, Howdy and Dodo were my first friends here.

            • Sherbet

              I second Dude’s emotion. Somebody keep us informed, OK?

            • Sherbet

              If he’s doing what we all wanted him to do, then we can deal with his absence for a bit.

            • EnthralledObserver

              Are we talking about Howdy here?

            • Sherbet

              Our favorite bearshark, yes.

            • Stacy

              You have the patience of a saint and the stubbornness of a wolverine, Bury. Go get ’em!

            • Jimmy3

              He said he probably wouldn’t be around for a while, so I wouldn’t expect updates. The last tiem I asked how he was doing, he blocked me on his MySpace page.

            • A Guest

              Hmmmph… grrrrhhh… sigh… OK. I’ll just have to accept those are his wishes, I guess…

              Oh sorry, Jimmy3, I was talking to myself. Thanks for the info.

            • Jimmy3

              I’m not relaying his wishes, only what he said, and I’m kidding about MySpace. Because Captain Howdy having a MySpace profile would be hilarious. Anyway, Bury knows how to contact him. It’ll be alright

            • A Guest

              Yeah, got it re: MySpace, but thought he had blocked you somewhere else, which would have implied he wanted to be left alone and not bugged about his health. Thanks for the clarification.

            • Captain Howdy

              I don’t have a MySpace page…DOH!..I took the bait!
              Ian Hunter was right..Cleveland Sucks
              I’ll be back…and if it’s not soon wait until Halloween and try then.

              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tJzcS-mEfOg

            • Sherbet

              Why, you, you, you STALKER.

            • Captain Howdy

              If I wasn’t a procrastinating ne’er-do-well motherfucker I wouldn’t be in this freaking mess in the first place would i? I’m going, the wheels have been set in motion.

              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QGRb6btilMI

            • Sherbet

              What is that, the soundtrack to your life? I’m glad you’re getting your tires rotated. Stay out of Brigham & Women’s. Well, I guess it’s safe now anyway.

            • Ella Raitch

              Come here you curmudgeon, you.

            • Jimmy3

              I’ve already bookmarked this comment for Halloween 2015.

              Last Halloween I watched Funny Games for the first time, and the Cleveland native I was watching with said: “Oh. Are the subtitles supposed to make it scarier? Is that why they do it?”

              I was thinking, “No, shithead, it’s so we can understand what the fuck they’re saying.”

              But I said, “Yes. That’s why they do it. Just watch.”

            • Frodis73

              Rotflmao.

            • beauty for ashes

              Yeah Captain Howdy sighting! 🙂 (F5)

            • Frodis73

              Hey you! Them’s fighting words! Cleveland does NOT suck…Oh, wait, YES, it does. It sucks a lot. Carry on.

            • Nat-lificent

              Ha ha, very funny — but NO. If you are laid up somewhere for more than a week and a half, you are ordered to find a way to email Bury or check in somehow. I’m pulling rank as Evil Fairy Sorceress trumps lowly demon.

            • Nat-lificent

              I am evil.
              (refresh)

            • Jimmy3

              Hah. He’s gonna be so pissed about that. If we know anything about Howdy, it’s that he loves normal butterflies, but hates sparkly butterflies.

            • Nat-lificent

              I really just laughed.

            • Jimmy3

              How was it?

            • Nat-lificent

              Good. Very good. Kinda deep and gravelly (in a good way) because it was spontaneous.
              “loves normal butterflies, but hates sparkly butterflies”

            • Jimmy3
            • Nat-lificent

              Thank you, Jimmy3. I used to play this song to my classes as they walked in in the morning and after lunch. I miss some of those nice little moments :’)

          • TheHoleDoesNotExist

            Had that happen too. Sunday he said mon or tues going into the garage to get his tires fixed.

            • Stacy

              Yay! That’s great news! Tune-ups are important.

      • Todd Tomorrow

        Isn’t he a Dr.in the Czech Republic?

    • Jgg2012

      And Shelly.

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        But what would she wear? Her tailor is declared, and no woman wants to wear last decade’s frock.

    • RBE

      What about Leah Remini? That would get Das Midget’s blood boiling (and Krusty’s)

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        Yeppers, but I think career is in her way these days. Id like it!

    • Stacy

      Do you mean Jilian Schlesinger? I tried to look up Julia Schlessinger, and nothing came up. Google asked me if I meant Jilian S. I found a Tony O post about her. If you’re not talking about Jilian, do you have a link or something so I can further my CoS knowledge?

      Thanks THDNE. 🙂

      http://tonyortega.org/2014/03/26/jillian-schlesinger-how-i-got-into-scientology-and-how-i-got-out/

      • EnthralledObserver

        Not the original vid – Karen seems to have made these private for some reason – but here’s her interview with Jillian…

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xrhwADt1WFY

        • Nat-lificent

          I noticed that they were made private a few weeks back. I hope Jillian is okay.

          • Eclipse-girl

            I wonder if Jilian became a target for OSA

            • Nat-lificent

              I hope not.

      • TheHoleDoesNotExist

        Thanks. Yes.

  • Bob

    Although I think we are seeing the beginning of the end, the cherch will fight. And like Brare Rabbit the more he fought the more he got stuck in the tar. This is the time to really all of us make a concerted effort to support HBO, Alex, Tony, Marty, Mike and all the others who have put themselves on the line to bring the truth to light.
    My hope is that people come out of the woodwork and we see a groundswell of stories regarding the crimes, abuses and frauds perpetrated under the guise of total freedom. And the the timid journalists and reporters jump on the band wagon as well.
    Time to push harder not “count our chickens”.

    • Bury_The_Nuts

      Tell yer friends….as best you can!

    • ze moo

      Like the Bill Cosby scandal, if enough come out, some will be believed. Social disapproval is a great weapon.

      • outraged

        He should be in jail.
        He will be soon
        There is a very credible case coming to court from one of the MANY women he abused.
        And it is still within the right amnount of years.

      • Bob

        Yes. Cosby was the most powerful black actor in the world at one time. And charming and handsome. Seems he may have also been very weak.

    • Missionary Kid

      I think that $cientology has pushed so many reporters and news agencies around or tried to scare them that the dammed up antagonistic feelings will bring a fair amount of news coverage of the HBO movie.

      $cientology (we all know it’s DM) has helped the movie immensely with his full paged ads. What a Maroon, as Bugs Bunny would put it. Even if the movie isn’t very good (and, given the past efforts it will be superior) it will do well.

      I’m hoping for a $cientology demonstration in front of the theater at the film festival. That would give the reporters something more to write about.

  • MaxSpaceman

    O/T. On Tom Cruise and PR Titan, Ms. Pat Kingsley.

    From the most powerful PR person in the world, at one time, Pat Kingsley. For those who don’t want to slog through the multi-pages of the HR story, here’s the interview about Tom Cruise. (He’s a pilot, too, like J. Travolta.)

    No client became as closely linked to Kingsley as Cruise, whom she signed during the early ’90s.

    “I met with him on the set of [1992’s] A Few Good Men, and he grilled me in his trailer,” she says. “It was fabulous! ‘What do you think about this? How important do you think Japan is? And how important do you think TV is opposed to print?’ I was quite taken with him. And then he called me and said, ‘Let’s start tomorrow.’ ”

    Over the next few years, they became so close “we could almost finish each others sentence. We never really had a disagreement about direction or any particular interview. The trust became pretty complete on both sides.”

    They would talk every day, often at 11 p.m. “We talked constantly. He was an insomniac. I liked the fact that he was so much fun. And he was so thoughtful. He remembered birthdays, my daughter’s birthday. He came to her wedding; she was registered somewhere for the china, and he bought out everything. They’ve got things they haven’t even opened yet, and they’ve been together 15 years!”

    Once, she remembers, “He took me up in this little airplane he had in Santa Monica. It was a two-seater, one in front and one in back. You could pick it up with your hands, practically. I went to the airport, and they said, ‘Tom’s flying around, he’ll land soon.’ So he lands the plane, and out comes Barry Diller — ‘I’ve got to get me one of these.’ Then it was my turn. You had to put all these straps on. I said, ‘Which one’s the parachute?’ They said, ‘It doesn’t matter.’ We took off and started going to Malibu. I said, ‘Tom, I don’t want to wave at anybody, I just want to fly straight.’ He said, ‘Well, there’s Jeffrey Katzenberg.’ I said, ‘I don’t care!’ It was scary, I’m telling you. He said, ‘Next time, I’ll take you over to Catalina for lunch.’ But I never wanted to get in that plane again.”

    The end of their relationship in many ways meant the end of Kingsley’s run at the top. She realized it was coming: The late-night chats had dried up, and she wasn’t traveling with Cruise as much as before. “I’d had so much control over everything,” she observes. “I think he wanted to be more personally involved in all those decisions. He felt, ‘Look, it’s been 14 years. I think it’s time I tried something different.’ And I certainly had no quarrel with that. It was his life, his career. It was not working. I was not having the rapport. I felt a kind of pulling back, and I knew it was going to happen.”

    Cruise’s Scientology played a role, but only toward the end. Before that, there had been just one serious conflict with reps for the religious organization, “but it was taken care of very early in the game,” says Kingsley. “I felt that they were involved in a story that I was doing on Tom, and I said: ‘It’s not your story, it’s Tom’s. You have to step aside.’ And they did.”

    Later, however, Cruise wanted to be more vocal about his beliefs. “I did have that conversation with Tom, about cooling it,” notes Kingsley, saying she told him: ” ‘Scientology is fine. You want to do a tour for Scientology? Do a tour for Scientology. But Warner Bros. is sponsoring this tour.’ That was for [2003’s] The Last Samurai. He didn’t say yes or no, except he did not discuss Scientology on that European tour.”

    It was clear Cruise wanted to do things differently, and now it was just a question of whether he or Kingsley would end their work together. The rupture took place in March 2004; she has not seen him in private since. (Through a rep, Cruise declined comment.)

    Regardless, says Kingsley, “Tom Cruise was a prince.”

    • Jimmy3

      Maybe it went unnoticed because the 12th and 13th were courtroom dates in the Rathbun case. Someone linked it, but there were way too many comments.

    • Stacy

      Fascinating. Here’s the link.
      http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/pat-kingsley-finally-talks-tom-664535

      Ms. Kingsley says:

      “…she was registered somewhere for the china, and he bought out everything. They’ve got things they haven’t even opened yet, and they’ve been together 15 years!”

      Is this generosity, or is this an attempt to buy someone’s affection and esteem? And I’m genuinely asking for everyone’s opinions. There are so many stories of TC’s generosity. I’m really wondering about whether it’s true generosity or if he’s got an extreme fear of people disliking him and abandoning him, so he attempts to buy affection and regard from others.

      • shasha40

        Ask Jefferson Hawkins and SO members … He may be nice but he is also a slave owner , IMO

        • Stacy

          This is true.
          I’m just curious about what others think. People aren’t all one thing or another. TC isn’t necessarily all idiocy and arrogance and badness (my general opinion; not trying to say it’s anyone else’s). But that’s a very one-dimensional view. I’m trying to flesh out my perspective on him.
          I’m hoping he might have a few redeeming qualities. I don’t think that would make me like him any better if he does; it would help me keep in mind that he’s human.

          • Bob

            My take having been around him and knowing others close to him. Very sweet, insecure, drives himself to be the best he can be, huge kool aid drinker. Manipulated by Davey Mindf–ker.
            When your in all things are possible whether legal or illegal. It comes with the programming. I’ve been there.

            • Missionary Kid

              Bob, you added another nickname for DM: Davey Mindfucker. I’ll post it on the list next weekend.

              It’s really a measure of your progress since we first met here in the Bunker that now you’re regularly coming up with observations and nicknames. Quite a change, huh?

            • Bob

              Yes. Decompressing is a slow process and I’ve had a lot of help. Also I think I may be your biggest contributor the the Davey Name game.

            • Missionary Kid

              You’ve added a lot of them, that’s for sure. Thanks.
              I thought at first, we’d have maybe 1 or 2 hundred, then, maybe a thousand. We’re closing in on 1,500.

            • Bob

              You were never to hard on me. You made it easy to be there.

            • Bob

              Thanks. Over a period of time. It was slow. I had a lot of help though.

            • Missionary Kid

              You may have had a lot of help, but your own efforts to overcome a lot of the mind-numbing ideas that were pounded into you by Co$ are to be lauded.

              I hope I wasn’t too harsh on you, but you were open to looking at things in a different way, and found your own path.

          • shasha40

            I hear you . I think he is another victim of CoS , he too spews LRH’s teaching as though they’ re the only ones on the planet that can save drug addicts , criminals , etc . Many people go in to actually do good for mankind , but CoS warps that into something else. Which is why they need to go down .

      • Ardent

        I think it was over the top, and probably embarrassed other guests.

      • madame duran

        It is my opinion that Tom Cruise is very insecure as a person and tries to either buy affection or impress somebody with his money. He goes overboard with everything (that may also be in part due to his hyperactive, intense personality). Think of how he tries to woo his women. It’s not enough for him to get 12 long stem roses for his date/wife. He has to buy 100. Proposing marriage in a private location or simply saying, “I love you” must be seen as boring. He has to propose on top of the Eiffel Tower during his movie promo tour, notify the media about it right afterwards then jump on a couch on a nationally televised TV show to proclaim his love.

        The fact that Cruise can actually afford such lavish gifts may mitigate his show-off tendancies for some but I find his “generosity” to ring hollow (I’m thinking his generosity is, at times, quite genuine but on other occasions, I suspect it serves another purpose…like easing into cult recruitment or generating positive PR). The question that comes to my mind is how can someone who is so generous seem to lack any close, personal friendships? Generosity is the kind of quality that spills over into other areas of one’s life. The more generous you become with your wealth/time/talents, the kinder and more open you appear. You tend to be empathic, charitable and have an urge to bond/connect/share with others beyond your immediate social circle. The impression I get of Tom’s generosity is that it’s a series of “in the moment” acts, primarily based on him awarding someone money and/or an abundance of material goods. Generosity is not a long-term commitment or a lifestyle; it’s an ego booster. “LOOK AT ME! I CAN GIVE SO MUCH MONEY!! AREN’T I GREAT???” I think his spirit of generosity is compromised–even tainted–by his insecurity. He craves the accolades. I regard him with suspicion.

        • Stacy

          Very inciseful assessment. Thanks Madame Duran.

  • Free Minds, Free Hearts

    This new Facebook page just showed up on my google news feed for scientology – based on the Newser article “God Smites Scientologists with Unflattering Documentary” https://www.facebook.com/TheGoodLordAbove/posts/1389272621160437

    Also if you haven’t seen the Radar Online article that links to Marty Rathbun’s deposition, citing it as first reported on Tony’s blog, check it out at http://radaronline.com/exclusives/2015/01/scientology-secrets-marty-rathbun-deposition-video/

    • Cece

      Thx ~ fun stuff 🙂

    • BFM

      The ROL piece is a decent rehash of what Tony covered, and covered a lot better. Good they give Tony the credit he deserves.

      There is just one little thing that is slightly off:

      “Rathbun is currently embroiled in a lawsuit he and his wife Monique brought against the church”

      Being bunker inhabitant I have come to appreciate Tony’s level of precise journalism. And as far as I know, the lawsuit is Monique Rathbun vs the Church of Scientology. Marty isn’t the one suing. But I don’t want to be too much of a nitpicker, good rehash overall.

      • Free Minds, Free Hearts

        Good catch, BFM. It is Mosey’s suit, not Marty’s.

        • Ardent

          Yep. Nice catch!

        • BFM

          I understated this fact-checking error somewhat because I do appreciate the effort of ROL to spread the word to their audience.

          But this is actually a crucial part of the suit. It’s about harassment of a woman who was never in, had nothing to do with the Church and still was harmed because she happened to marry a man who once was.

          That keeps the whole religious dispute thing etc. out of the suit. It’s about criminal harassment. If ROL was on the ball with the story for real they wouldn’t have made that major error.

    • Free Minds, Free Hearts

      I just listened to the radio piece Blame It on Outer Space, they were reading from Scilon material and Going Clear – about the Sex Magick goings on, and doing a lot of joking around. My favorite was when they heard that Xenu made the thetans sit and watch a movie for the implant, they compared him to a bad substitute teacher, making the kids watch a movie.

      • beauty for ashes

        What a great comparison! Bad Mr. XENU!

  • Cece

    Did anyone besides me think it odd that the ‘Findings’ are published in 1968 yet the raid was Jan 4th, 1963 – 5 plus years earlier????
    FWIW: I hung around SO berthing buildings and storage areas 74-96 and never saw or heard of this booklet. I did have the ‘Brainwashing’ one for a while ~ never read it. Boooorrrring.

  • BFM

    So this post has been thoroughly chewed out, analyzed and boxed up for filing Any chance of a new post coming in the next hour or so?
    If not, I will wait it out and check out the many links provided here. just finished with the Kim Masters piece. It contained lots of phrases that made me smile. Loved the comment of Lance Armstrong on the Scientology thing. Reading what Lance said about Gibney raised my respect for Lance. To put on the sackcloth like that and give credit to Gibney for his documentary about him is admirable.
    I wish scientology could do that…. yeah I know, I believe in the tooth fairy too 😉 LOL, OK I don’t and it won’t happen (was just day dreaming)

  • The Dude

    I have found in my time in “The Bunker”, many people aligned against a common cause. We might be vulgar at times, but we always approach even the worst of trolls with logic and almost (pity) compassion.
    I have kept my $cio-watching and commenting strictly here. And I have found some great friends, if only faceless screen names…. Still friends. Just recently I searched facebook for $cientology and found lots. Made some friends and read a lot of comments.
    I am not coming down on ex-scientologists, but I have noticed that there are some out there that are not too civil(my friends excluded, you guys are great!). I think that some have to rethink the whole “Confront and Shatter” thing. It just makes you look like an ass or unstable.
    We here in The Bunker have a certain family atmosphere that I like.
    It is a little ugly out there in FB world…..

    • Stacy

      I’ve said this a lot, but it bears repeating. The Bunker is a pretty unique and wonderful place. There doesn’t seem to be anything else like it in all the wide Fringe zone 😉

      I love this place! 😀

      • The Dude

        Most of my ex-scio friends on facebook are from here anyway. That is why I didn’t want them to think I was referring to them.

        • BFM

          Ex scio’s isn’t a homogenous group. The one thing the nasty one’s have in common is that they were nasty to begin with, scientology couldn’t help them with that 😉 And then there are those that are Ron lovers…. ugh…. (I have a couple of longtime friends who are out but indies…, I don’t want to break contact with them because they are good friends… we just avoid Ron and the Tech etc…for now!) I am hoping one day they will just stop solo-auditing when they realize chasing away BT’s isn’t getting them anywhere.

          The bunker is diverse too, but we are united in our recognition that Ron Hubbard is the true source of all atrocities committed in the name of “Total Freedom”. The end justifying all means came from him directly. And even that projected “end” was a sham to start with. We all here feel the same way about that. There are a few exceptions who occasionally post here….. but I don’t count them as bunkerfamily.

          • The Dude

            I wish I could show them there are other way to express themselves than just to attack.

            When I first came here and asked questions I was inundated with replies, giving me links to read and whatnot.

            I have seen on F B, many hostile people attacking newbies who don’t understand. It is a little disturbing to me as a never-in with inside knowledge. I see behavior that is easily recognized as LRH Tech. But they are on a SP group.

            Some of these people should go back to Jefferson Hawkins’s excellent post about The way to happiness for ex-scios.

            Twelve lessons every ex-Scientologist needs to learn

            1. The world outside Scientology is not a dangerous or degraded or hostile place. You’ll find that on the whole, people are pretty nice, and you’re likely to encounter more kindness, empathy, and friendliness — and less judgment — than you did inside Scientology.

            2. You have your own ideas and opinions separate from those of L. Ron Hubbard and Scientology. Learn to differentiate. Ask yourself, “is this really what I personally think or believe, or is this just what I was taught in Scientology?” Stop putting everything through a Scientology filter to determine if it is good or bad, true or false. Make your own decisions. And it’s OK to disagree with Hubbard and Scientology.

            3. You have the right to privacy and to your own personal space. Your private life, your activities, your lifestyle are your own choice and no one has the right to pry or invade your space or pass judgment. You do not have to reveal or confess everything about your life to anyone. People in general do not care or judge you.

            4. Learn to relax and live your life. You don’t have to be “productive” every moment. Take the time to relax, go for long walks, daydream, read a book, hang out with friends and family. You are not on the clock and you don’t have to measure every minute of your life against some arbitrary standard of “production.”

            5. Make an effort to overcome any prejudices instilled by Scientology. Gays are not “covertly hostile.” Psychiatrists are not evil. Journalists are not “merchants of chaos.” “Wogs” are not degraded or out-ethics. And they are not “wogs.” Try to re-examine generalities like this and see people and institutions for who they actually are, not what Scientology told you they are.

            6. People who disagree with you are not “enemies.” People who challenge your opinions are not “attacking” you. Loosen up. Try to see other viewpoints. Re-examine your own opinions and conclusions. You will never learn anything if you only reactively defend your own position and demonize those who disagree.

            7. It’s important to take care of yourself. See a doctor regularly. Get a checkup. See the dentist. Take needed medication. Get over any preconception that doctors, dentists, or medicine are bad, scary, invalid, or unnecessary.

            8. Emotion is a good thing. It is not a sign of a weak person or a “lesser being.” Emotions are a part of life, and everyone feels them. It is not shameful to feel anger, grief, or depression, and it does not make you less of a person. If you try to suppress your so-called “lower” emotions, you may end up being unable to feel anything.

            9. Whatever wins you have had, remember that nothing in Scientology has made you superior to others. Get over any sense of superiority or entitlement. Realize that Scientologists have the same hang-ups, problems, foibles, and faults as anyone else. They make the same mistakes and commit the same sins. Scientologists have not reached a “higher state” where they have super powers or are morally or intellectually or spiritually superior to others. Try to see yourself objectively and with humility. Do not approach others with arrogance or condescension.

            10. Get over the idea that your life only has meaning if you are “serving a higher purpose.” Just living your life with love, tolerance, kindness, and charity is what gives it meaning. If the world is to be improved, it will be through individual acts of kindness, friendship, and generosity, not some organized international movement to “save the planet.”

            11. You don’t need to follow someone else on your life’s journey. You don’t need a leader or a guru or a “source.” You don’t need an “ism” or “ology.” Get over the idea that Scientology — or anyone for that matter — has all the answers. Broaden your horizons. If you are interested in learning more about the mind and spirit, read or study broadly. You don’t need someone else to define truth for you. You are fully capable of coming up with your own ideas, opinions, and conclusions. Blaze your own trail to your own truth.

            12. You don’t need to be constantly “fixed” or corrected. You don’t need constant auditing or interviews or therapy to survive. Scientology only exists by constantly “finding people’s ruins” and convincing them of their failings and imperfections all the way up the line. In all likelihood, there is not as much wrong with you as you might have been led to believe and you are pretty much fine just as you are.

            — Jefferson Hawkins

            • BFM

              Sometimes the mind altering is so profound it will stick on them for the rest of their lives…. some examples I saw of this was on Marty’s blog when he was still doing daily posts. And also on Mike’s blog when he had just started to blog and was decompressing himself. he made it out, IMHO. Some just won’t ever come out of the mindfuck Ron instilled.

            • MaxSpaceman

              Hubbardthink can capture a mind and divert it from things rational and commit to the nothing-their-everthing that is L. Ron’s spirituality and beliefs.

            • The Dude

              I am truly sorry for them. I am glad there are people like you, Dodo and THDNE. You guys have really made it out intact. I am happy for you.
              But, if you think about it Dianetics would not get a person if they did not believe there was something fundamentally wrong with them. With some it might be social. Some working success. But I am sure there are some that are very disturbed, and they buy into LRH’s tall tales of “cast down your phych meds and confront your engrams” bullshit!

            • BFM

              I am glad you are here with us in the bunker too Dude!

              Some people get entangled because of the hideous ruin-finding. There isn’t a person alive who doesn’t have some kind of trouble with AN aspect of their lives. But are overall happy people. And then they enter this organization that enlarges that little trouble to a monstrous size through mind manipulation. Scientology fishes with really wide nets.

              I just hope the abuses come to an end soon! I couldn’t care less if there will be people that will continue to exorcise dead alien space cooties. It’s their right to believe. The disbandment of the SO and a full stop on forced disconnection is all I ask for.

            • The Dude

              The mudslide took down the fence… No one left, that we know of.
              I don’t know who said this but,”The slave may be released from bondage, only to find a stronger set of chains”.

      • The Dude

        Hi Stacy! How have you been. I count you too on that list of my Faceless friends. You seem like a genuine person. You have been very kind to me. Thank you.

    • BFM

      “The Bunker have a certain family atmosphere that I like.”

      I second that whole heartedly!

      • Sherbet

        Yeah, we scream, we swear, we hug, we laugh, we eat, and we end up playing board games where everyone cheats. A real family.

        • BFM

          yeah…the whole array of family matters passes on here.. just like real life. Unique in all aspects!

          I bet the OSA trolls are turning green of jealousy when witnessing this tight-knit family group where diversity is valued and cherished.

          Hey, OSA, you don’t need to be jealous.. walk over and be part of this!

          • Sherbet

            They can be the nasty cousins nobody wants to talk to at the family reunion.

            • The Dude

              You always talk of nasty cousins. Your family must be a hoot!

            • Sherbet

              Nobody can carry a grudge like an Italian family, Dude. Boy, we’ve got some pips.

            • The Dude

              Irish myself. Forgive, never forget. Shame me once, never get the chance again. Boyo!

            • Sherbet

              That makes me Irish, too. 😀

            • BFM

              Lovely debate going on here! As you were, carry on 😉 lol

            • Ardent

              Dude, I’m Irish/English! Talk about inner conflict! 🙂

            • Sherbet

              You forgive, never forget, and then have scones and tea?

            • The Dude

              Maybe my grandmother. We have a beer and laugh it off. And then take the grudge to our grave.

            • The Dude

              It’s ok. I got a little English too. We don’t talk about it. lol

            • Missionary Kid

              I’m an American of 100% Swedish lineage. That makes me really, really stubborn.

              I gave my dad a coffee mug that said on it, “You can always tell a Swede, but you can’t tell him much.” He was not amused.

              When I told him that I was more stubborn than he was, he said, “I’m not stubborn. I’m just strong willed.” He was serious, but I still chuckle over that one.

            • The Dude

              That’s great! Thanks.

            • Ardent

              I have some seriously boring cousins you can borrow, Dude. You know, to slow things down a little…

            • L. Wrong Hubturd

              Maybe Sherb is the nasty cousin.

            • Sherbet

              Hey, ya think?

          • Missionary Kid

            The Bunker really is an extended family.

        • Ardent

          Hi Sherb. How’s tricks?

          • Sherbet

            Pretty good Ardent. How about in your neck o’ the woods? Everything good?

            • Ardent

              Job hunting. Pure hell. However, that’s what we get for not being inheritors of immense fortunes, or movie stars or, well, you know. I did have to go to Art College, didn’t I? That turned out fine, but earning a steady living, and with all the turmoil last year (which I will not inflict on The Bunker), I am feeling squooshed.

            • Sherbet

              We’ll always try to unsquoosh your squooshiness in the Bunker. I hope it gets better for you, and somebody is just itchin’ to hire an Art College grad at a whopping salary.

            • Vaquera

              I started out as a sculpture major and then switched to art history because I thought it would be a more profitable degree. BWA-HAHAHAHAHAHAHA !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    • Todd Tomorrow

      I don’t FB on purpose. I keep in touch with plenty of people I grew up with. I see now they are putting FB access into new cars,WTF? What’s funny is that my sister gets people looking for me on her FB. Since I only want to really hear from one person I lost contact with I told her to tell people he left the country ages ago.

      • The Dude

        To tell you the truth. I love FB. I lost a lot of friend’s numbers or they move. I was all over the east coast of USA for like 12 years! Working at resorts for 6 months till they close for the season and I moved to a different resort in a warmer city, “Snow Birds” is what they called us. Needless to say, after 12 years I had met a large group of peeps. I had thought they were gone just to my memory. Facebook got me in touch with 75% of them. I could not be happier with FB.

      • Prim

        I despise FB. I thought connecting with all my grown cousins would be warm and fuzzy but I found out that they all turned into batshit crazy right wing gun nuts who watch Fox News all day while they eat bacon and torture animals. That’s more than I ever wanted to know. Screw Facebook. I love the Bunker.

        • Todd Tomorrow

          I’ve heard that from so many people the same exact thing. Or that their relatives put up religious vomit all over. Come on people have murdered each other over being defriended. No thanks not for me!

          • The Dude

            My favorite band of all time. Dead Kennedys “Religious Vomit”. For you,My Friend! Or should I say Fiend.

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZBa6YMs-AbY

            • Todd Tomorrow

              Funny, I drink out of a huge DK mug at night full of Cammomile tea. I was in a band too but due to OSA I won’t print it here.

    • Ardent

      Dude, what you said is precisely why I keep visiting. This is an interesting, pleasantly populated forum. Thanks for saying it so well.

    • Vaquera

      Dude, I started lurking around Runnin’ Scared and then commenting in The Bunker when the love of my life suddenly passed away. My faceless Bunker friends, though unaware, became my social outlet when I couldn’t pull it together to put on a little makeup and go out for actual social interaction. A lot has changed since then, but I will be forever grateful for the unique family and cyber-home The Underground Bunker provided during that first year.

      Thanks Tony and all of you glorious Bunker guys and gals!

      • Sherbet

        Aw, you cowgirl, you’re a sweetie.

        • Vaquera

          Ha! After I posted the comment I realized that I was actually choked up. 🙂

          • Sherbet

            Kleenex, stat. People who never get choked up have cold hearts.

          • The Dude

            I do it all the time. Dudes cry too.
            For the right reasons.

            • Todd Tomorrow

              I broke my arm in half in a bike accident. At the same time I hit the boy bar in the middle. I cried like a baby until the ambulance shot me up with something.

          • Jimmy3

            I teared up a little after reading your incredibly sweet comment, but that is just a side effect of my allergy medications.

            • The Dude

              Ya big Softy!

            • Vaquera

              Suck it up! xo

            • Jimmy3

              It’s pine season, okay! Sometimes you cry a little after freebasing Allegra. It just happens.

            • Vaquera

              And here I thought it was because the end of football season is upon us.

            • Jimmy3

              This season was the worst. I’m actually glad it’ll be over soon.

            • Vaquera

              It would have been hard for the Texans not to improve on last year’s effort, so I’m a happy camper. I’ve just started to watch hockey over the past two years, so at least I have a sport to take the edge off of my football DTs.

            • Jimmy3

              Hockey is hella fun to watch, but I can’t get into the NHL because I have no vested interest in any of the teams. I could name only a handful of players, and in general I just don’t know what is going on. The only hockey I understand is NHL ’98 on the Sega Genesis. I’m the Colorado Avalanche, we’re good. Patrick Roy is a wall of a goalie and my center Peter Forsberg is amazing. Get Forsberg the puck and you win. That’s the extent of my hockey knowledge.

            • Vaquera

              A vested interest is exactly why I started watching hockey. My best friend’s son plays for USANTDP, USA National Team Development Program, on their U18 team (and U17 last year). He is predicted to go in the second round of the NHL draft this April. I want to be able to understand what I’m watching once he’s skating the big leagues, so I’m on a steep learning curve.

            • Jimmy3

              Hope he does well. Let me know what team picks him up, and I’ll root for them. But why do they draft during the playoffs? Strange

            • Vaquera

              You’re asking a question beyond my pay grade. I’ll keep you posted on where he lands. Whoever drafts him will probably have him play a year or more of college skate or in the OHL before bringing him up for NHL games. At least that’s the way it’s been explained to me. He’s committed to Miami of Ohio and was drafted by the OHL Plymouth Whalers when he was 16.

            • Jimmy3

              I know many Oxford grads. I was almost invited to a party there once. Great place.

            • Jenstnick

              I never thought to freebase it….

            • Todd Tomorrow

              Bolivian marching powder does a number on my sinuses. Had to give it up!

        • Ardent

          See you later, Sherb, Dude, Y’all. I’m plumb tuckered out. ‘Night!

          • Sherbet

            I’m right behind you. Gnite.

            • Ardent

              🙂

      • Ardent

        Very happy to have been of solace to you! Be well.

      • The Dude

        We love you!

        • Vaquera

          ^^^^^^ Right back atcha’!

      • Eclipse-girl

        (((HUGS)))

        I didn’t know.
        My deepest condolences.

        • Vaquera

          Thx. Time has passed and life is once again good.

        • Vaquera

          I’ve mentioned it a few times, but you must have been out clearing the world! 🙂

          • Eclipse-girl

            I am not tony O
            I do not read every comment.
            Then I would never leave.

            (((HUGS)))

      • einsteinonthebeach

        Love your posts, Vaquera, and I’m sorry for your loss.

      • BFM

        I can relate to this, all though your loss is incomparable to my troubles. But it’s good to see you picked up life again and have been doing better :)!

        I find this place a warm bath, where I am given to chance to talk, feel, get genuine responses and heal…

        Such a great platform here. And without ANY form of moderation (baring a couple of times when the ban hammer was used).

        Lovely bunch of people here.

      • L. Wrong Hubturd

        How’s the nest doing? Getting used to the kiddo being at college?

        • Vaquera

          She was gone for all of a week before I hopped in the car and drove over for a 24 hour visit (about 2 1/2 hours away). That little trip did a world of good. Thanks for remembering!

          • L. Wrong Hubturd

            Good for you. No sense wanting to do it and NOT.

      • Free Minds, Free Hearts

        Vaquera I am sorry about your love passing away, I am glad that you found us at the Bunker. I love your comments and insights.

        • Vaquera

          Thank you honey. I was up voting your patient comments on another site yesterday, but have forgotten which one it was.

          • Free Minds, Free Hearts

            Thanks Miss V – I was commenting on Radar and THR and actually got someone (who I assumed was a still-in, but maybe not) to agree to look at Tony’s blog to find out more!

            • Vaquera

              Look at you #ClearingTheCult !

      • aquaclara

        Oh, I’m so sorry, too. I hope you have some good memories, even though that doesn’t begin to make up for your loss.
        Glad you’re here. Hope your days are getting better.

        • Vaquera

          I am replete good with memories. Knowing the end, I would still do it all over again. True love is a wonderous thing.

          • aquaclara

            omg…They were very lucky to have you…

            • Vaquera

              Truly, I was the lucky one.

  • Donna Cline Sargent

    WOW on my yahoo news home page.the main news story,A big pic of miscavige on stage. Its headline is : Details emerge from bombshell Scientology film. Sorry I don’t know how to make links.

    • Donna Cline Sargent

      Its the story by Kim Masters.

      • Donna Cline Sargent

        and the pic. is actually Tom Cruise

        • BFM

          Check Tony’s update.. he has provided the link to that story already.

          • Donna Cline Sargent

            I read the story , but I am excited that its on yahoo.

            • outraged

              me too!!
              Headlines headlines

              Miscavige is boo hooed on Yahoo.

            • Donna Cline Sargent

              YES ! I check everyday for headlines after I started learning about all this abuse that I can not believe is going on ! And I can’t believe nothing, ever. So I think this is big. sorry if I seem stupid,but I am so excited !

            • outraged

              You Are Not Stupid.

              Miscavige is.

            • BFM

              Got it:)!

            • Frodis73

              Any and all exposure is welcome. Plus, it’s DM’s nightmare. I hope he’s crawled up in a ball rocking himself to sleep.

            • Donna Cline Sargent

              Me too. I can’t wait for a story to go viral on social media,that’s just in everyone’s face,to maybe get Washington’s attention. I just can’t believe all the articles that Tony does have not been picked up by the main stream. Its awful ! Thank God for Tony. He is awesome !

          • outraged
            • einsteinonthebeach

              This is great, thx

    • Dale A.

      Some of the comments over at the Yahoo news site are hilarious. They are basically divided into a) Scientology is a cult and cults are terrible b) I was once a member of Scientology and it’s terrible, c)Scientology is terrible. And stupid.
      Here’s one from Cecil: “I am a Scientologist and am often confronted by skeptics. One time three men tried to physically hurt me but since I’m an Operating Thetan and have knowing and willing cause over life, thought, matter, energy, space and time, I disassembled them at a molecular level and reanimated them as a 600lb common house fly.”

      • Donna Cline Sargent

        lol

      • AintMizBahavin

        nice dream hope she wakes up b4 she gets fly trapped!!!!

      • BFM

        Cecil j&d-ing? I take it that’s the case, as a die hard clam wouldn’t talk like that 🙂 It’s hilarious indeed! LOL. 600 LB house flly LMAO

    • BlondesAreDumb

      Gibney’s interviews are interesting, thoughtful, and coherent. His behavior and style I would describe as calm and inviting.

      Scientology is uninteresting to most (until this documentary is released), unthoughtful in every thing that it does, and incoherent in its communications and dogma, for a start. The recent actions of the “church” are frenetic and annoying.

      Hmm? Which of the above is working well in today’s well-informed and internet-savvy market?

  • einsteinonthebeach

    Wow, Hubbard was a terrible writer.

    His “judgements” on the people judging him are laughable.

  • Sherbet

    Off to continue binge watching “Justified.” Ciao, babies.

    • Frodis73

      How funny! I’m about to start watching that any day now.

      • Sherbet

        It’s awesome, if you don’t mind seeing blood spray in every episode.

        • Frodis73

          Nah, I’m good with that. I love Walton Goggins too.

          • Sherbet

            Creepy, and yet you want to wrap him up and hug him. But not while he’s carrying a gun.

            • Frodis73

              Lol! DId you see him on Sons of Anarchy? So good! He made me cry.

            • Sherbet

              No, never saw that show.

    • BFM

      Ciao bella, have fun:)

      • Sherbet

        Thanks, BFM.

    • einsteinonthebeach

      Great stuff!

    • Jenstnick

      My favorite show

  • Science Doc

    Been traveling, sick, and busy so not the usual level of participation. I usually am ambivalent about goldent age of Hubbard crap because it mostly annoys indies, and church members rarely see it. Miscavige is the problem today. But I liked the anti FDA booklet for a number of reasons. In one concise timeline it makes a number of disprovable or ridiculous assertions. We know that the course Hubbard actually took was on atomic and molecular physics. Not nuclear physics. Very differnt topics. He failed it. Yet he imagines that this course led him to develop Diametics and Scientology. I know a lot of physics. There is nothing in the physics of atoms, molecules or nuclei that connects to the human mind or spirituality and certainly not to engrams and Xenu. I call total bullshit on Hubbard based on this concise document.

    • Artoo45

      Annoying the indies is a feature, not a bug.

      • Science Doc

        Today Miscavige, tomorrow the indies.

    • Cosmo Pidgeon

      All this early stuff helps to paint a complete picture..I enjoy the history and takes the big man down to an every day guy building a questionable enterprise. I found it funny that this pamphlet used news articles critical of the FDA that are so similar to the complaints of some present day politicians of regulatory agencies…

      • Science Doc

        Let’s take him down now and write the history and analysis later.

  • Todd Tomorrow

    I have to go catch a plane myself. Just got off the phone with my mother and she still goes to a male Gynecologist. I told her that’s like going to an auto mechanic that doesn’t own a car. Caio!

    • Artoo45

      Bon voyage TT!

    • AintMizBahavin

      be safe Todd Praying for !!!!!

    • beauty for ashes

      Be careful of Jenny at LAX!

  • Cosmo Pidgeon

    Another news source covering the new documentary.http://laist.com/2015/01/21/going_clear_scientology_documentary.php.

  • Cosmo Pidgeon
  • L. Wrong Hubturd

    OT, but does anyone know if Howdy went in finally for medical care? Thank you all.

    • EnthralledObserver

      He showed up briefly downthread when the topic turned to him… it seems he’s working on it, I understood.

      • L. Wrong Hubturd

        Cool, thanks.

    • Jimmy3

      Scroll down.

      • L. Wrong Hubturd

        Thank you, sir. I see it now.

      • Ella Raitch

        Since your profile is pirvate (hmmph) and I can’t be bothered finding the comment again I will congratulate you here on the Scientology Monopoly post which had me in fits – so masterful I wondered why someone hadn’t done it before!

        • Jimmy3

          You are the kindest. I’d like to make a full Scientollogish Monipily board (my loyer told me to type it that way), so if you or anyone else have any ideas for it I’d love to hear them.

          • Ella Raitch

            So you start off on the first run with missions then work up to class v orgs with FLAG – the Superpower building where May Fair and Park Lane normally are; you would have to have some way of gaining different levels up to clear, OT etc. This would have to be a Chance thing (pick a card – you have gone Type III, pay $10000 for your babywatch etc). Opportuntiy chess could include FSM earnings plus shelling out for failwinds, Clearwater restaurants etc. Or you cold put things like sec checks on the utilities squares but only if you are on Solo NOTS. The possibilities are endless. Snakes and ladders (Wins and NCG?) would of course make for a great Scientology game, as would Hungry, Hungry Regges

            • aquaclara

              excellent upon excellent.

    • Science Doc

      I have a routine cold this week and feel like hell. I know a lot of us have partial or extensive disabilities. This is very on topic because those of us with illness and disabilities have sometimes been referred to scientology for a fix. I’d handle serpents at a tent revival if it would fix my broken body.

      • Nat-lificent

        They wouldn’t have us. They only want people who hide what is wrong with them. We flaunt 🙂

        • Science Doc

          Except that some of us could finish the Valley Org in which case they would drain us and then kick us to the curb.

          • beauty for ashes

            I have to admit i have always wanted my own doorknob named after me.

            • Nat-lificent

              “Valley!”

            • beauty for ashes

              LOL! I almost choked on my cookie!

          • Nat-lificent

            True dat.

      • beauty for ashes

        I have a very dark sense of humor about my “frailties” 🙂 Luckily I have friends who also have chronic illnesses and my friend with fibromyalgia laughed at this even though she knows nothing about scientology. (f5)

  • Narapoid

    I’ve been kinda busy, and I am sure someone has said something about this Yahoo post: http://www.yahoo.com/movies/bombshell-scientology-film-alex-gibney-on-cruise-108751189867.html

    ETA: It is just avalanches of entheta out there. It will take a special Scientologist with confront, and full-on ARC to deal with it. Oh yeah, a can of confront/shatter will make it all go ok. (Confront/Shatter: sounds like a badass laundry soap.)

    • Vaquera

      People were talking about it, but I couldn’t find a link. Thanks!

    • Graham

      Amazing. Over 800 comments, and on a quick skim read I couldn’t see one that was ‘positive’. Where are the OSA-bots? Looks like they are overwhelmed, with too few staff left to try to snow articles like this with positive or de-railing comments. Tick Tock Slappy!

  • edge

    I haven’t read the whole thing, only the introduction, opening paragraphs and final pages. But man, the hubris of this guy.
    “Ten months after the raid on the Church, carried out in distinctly Mafia style, Attorney General Kennedy Kennedy had not ceased attacking Mafia, and President Kennedy was assassinated.
    Whether in any way these events can be connected the fact remains that President Kennedy’s interest in actually solving problems of mental health endangered the declining psychiatric-drug therapist interests and influence. His Attorney General was endangering the other end of the combine, the “Mafia” interests. By attacking the Church under the supposed backing of the President, the FDA could and did, to thousands of people, place in question his integrity, as the first Roman Catholic President, as a supporter of religions freedom. That a Church was attacked and that it happened to possess a technology capable quite incidentally of detecting subversives and of aiding the space effort would ordinarily be credited only to coincidence and be left at just that. It is certainly not mere coincidence that Robert Kennedy is no longer Attorney General and that the government campaign against the Mafia is no longer even a gesture in comparison to the Kennedy program while the assassination of President Kennedy remains in dispute.”

    So to paraphrase the rambling: By attacking the Church (i.e Hubbard) the FDA caused the Kennedy assassination. And by the way, that assassination might not have happened had the government adopted Scientology because it has super powers that can sniff out would be assassins. And uh, the space program.

  • MaxSpaceman

    Answering the call for a translation of the French Vanity Fair article on Ms. Kubrick, Bunkeroo Robert E. delivered a most superb translation of the article. Down thread about 1/2 day ago. Thank you Robert. That is awesome! Wonderfully well done, sir. 🙂

    • Science Doc

      Multiple translations are always welcome. Beowulf gets better with successive translations. I don’t read French worth a darn, and it’s not a language to toy with,

    • Robert Eckert

      You’re welcome. I tried to translate every word of the French while still keeping the sentences idiomatic in English, a bit of a balance; I leaned on Google Translate only to check words I was doubtful about, and I retro-edited when subsequent usage clarified what I was messing up (Franglais “VOIX OFF” threw me for a loop, particularly since it was coupled with “DECAPITATION” and at first I put “Sound Off” but context below made it plain it must mean “Voice-over”). I hope native speakers will critique for little lapses I’m sure are in there.

      • beauty for ashes

        I’m jealous you’re so fluent. Languages did not come easy for me. I studied french for five years and a college course or two. Je m’appelle Virginie et je suis fatigue. 🙂
        Were you raised with both languages or pick it up?

        • Robert Eckert

          I didn’t really get it in school but I was over in Europe for almost all of 1976 usually having to speak French or German rather than English. I have had little occasion to use either language since and I am sure I could no longer carry on a conversation but I am still able to read well with only occasional look-ups.

          • Frodis73

            Wow! We are all very grateful that you did that for us.

          • The Dude

            I am the same with Spanish and Portuguese. I can read and understand more than have a conversation. One week in Brazil, and I can speak much better! Immersion is the key to a new language. Your mind has to make sense of it, to make you learn.

            • beauty for ashes

              i thought you had to make sense of it making a clay demo?

            • Frodis73

              Snort!

            • The Dude
            • beauty for ashes

              I’m scared of your clay demo, it looks creepy. forgive me for not watching it 🙂

      • Ella Raitch

        VWD! It was a fascinating piece.

  • Hingle McCringleberry

    So, I called out some clam troll that was posting earlier about being OSA, and they got upset and said that was like the Godwin’s Law of Co$ discussions. So, Scientologists are comparable to Nazis? Can’t complain with that logic. They also comply with Rule 34:

    • Douglas D. Douglas

      I appreciate your passion, but the Grasshopper is not a troll and not OSA. Try a little more nuance.

      • The Dude

        I think an indie? Still LRH lovin’?

      • I think he is an Indie troll in that he is just posting for the hell of it he doesn’t mean to genuinely add to the conversation or have a meaningful dialogue with anyone here.

        • Hingle McCringleberry

          Exactamundo.

        • Jimmy3

          That sounds about right. But at least he communicates. I’ve seen him hop from reply to reply, stopping his hopping only to share his grassy charm before hopping away to his next reply.

          • He probably only communicates here because he loves the sound of his own voice.
            My cat loves eating grasshoppers they must be a tasty snack.

            • Sir Hemet TC Burlwood, VIII

              I’ve found his quite typical scientology-style inability to reason highly entertaining. He has even directly claimed, more than once, that he is a know-it-all.

        • Douglas D. Douglas

          Hey, I just appreciate having someone who will answer basic questions. There are so few Scientologists out there that the opportunity seldom arises.

          • Well they are an endangered species. however unlike endangered animals. humanity will rejoice when they become extinct.

      • Hingle McCringleberry

        That’s all fine and good. Like most here, I’ve got zero axes to grind with the idea that some people get something helpful from some ideas put forth by Hubbard. That said, the persecution card, especially here, is oooooooooooooooooooooooooollllllldddd. And stale.

        • Douglas D. Douglas

          People can work only with the tools they have been given.

  • The Dude

    Repost from an earlier thread:
    The mudslide took down the fence… No one left, that we know of.
    I don’t know who said this but,”The slave may be released from bondage, only to find a stronger set of chains”.

  • Frodis73

    Interesting, yet very creepy, comment from the yahoo post of the Masters story:

    Kelly • 4 minutes ago
    Be careful if you park off Franklin near Gower, that is one of the
    Scientology’s freak centers the runaway teens disappear over in east
    Hollywood and ‘appear’ there all shined up as ‘soldiers’ there are
    cameras everywhere and weird guys patrolling the area on bicycles..Funny
    thing is the place is completely lit
    up… but you never see anyone inside the building but these weird
    people on bikes check every one out ..there is a big apartment across
    the street… man they have taken over Hollywood like some sort of Dark
    Army..

    • beauty for ashes

      oh teenage runaways for sea ogre because their desperate . They probably love bomb the shit out of them. another depth to their pulchritude .

      • Frodis73

        Yeah, the runaway thing is what really caught my eye. Think of how many young kids head to Hollywood to make it big and end up on the streets…easy targets for any cult, esp this one due to location.

        • beauty for ashes

          And they’re just bouncing from one abusive situation to another, and another. ughh. As Lucille would say, I has a sad. 🙁

    • giggler

      really creepy

  • The Dude

    I posted something on FB. I think I was censored. Fuck them if they don’t want to listen. Good night all. Hey Howdy! It is good to hear from you!!!
    Take care!
    I’m out.

    • beauty for ashes

      bye dude! don’t spill your drink on the way out! 🙂

  • 3 Days

    • outraged

      and counting….

      • Couch_Incident

        Reminds me of a note that a Bond villain wrote in one of the books: “Your days are numbered, and I have begun to count.”

        • outraged

          hahaha.

          The Spanish Count D’Davilla Montague.

    • First Last

      Dodo what if I take flight and fly east – do I get to 25th today.
      What does the world’s greatest scientist “fucktard hubbly bubbly” said in his sacred writing and recording about time travel?
      Do you think that he has already see it, standing at van allen belt?

      • Very good question, First Last.
        The answer awaits you on OT XV, my friend.

        Of course he sees it from Van Allen belt.
        You have a great theta perception.

  • outraged

    Some lady up there in the photos looks like a Scientology Reality Star.
    Is there even such a thing?

    More to the point.

    Bunker Haiku #2

    What Howard Stern
    Reveals alot More Of
    See former Scientology official Marty Rathburn

    • outraged

      $cientology Reality Star:

  • outraged

    $cientology is stuck in the TIcker Tape Age.

    http://youtu.be/yU6-bT8H-_A

  • 1subgenius

    There will be at least one Scientologist at Sundance:
    DJ Mom Jeans (Danny Masterson) and indie band Dorothy will also be performing throughout the night.

    Read more: http://www.usmagazine.com/celebrity-news/news/sundance-film-festival-2015-celebrity-hotspots–2015221#ixzz3PXR68TsY

    • Hopefully, Tony will say hi to Danny.

      • outraged

        how dare they show up at Sundance.
        This is a scandal.
        Two $cions.
        So brave those $cions.

        • May be they forgot to tell him about Going Clear documentary.

          • outraged

            lo. hahaha.

            I think they told these two,
            but, $cienor Dementia.

            • One thing for sure – this is going to be very interesting.

            • outraged

              Sundance or

              $cientology going down in the twenty teeens?

            • Not sure. Your spelling throws me off. Sorry.

            • I get it now. It’s both.

    • Graham

      ‘Nicole Kidman expected to attend.’

      • Mimi Rogers and Katie Holmes should join her.

    • Graham

      Just done me a mass flaggin’

      ETA: this was meant to be a response to Pierrot!

    • Miss Cabbage

      The devout and long term Sciloons may now question their so-called “faith.”
      After all, who thought Leah Remini would cut ‘n run? Good for her! She is not the only one, either.
      All the begging and for cash could be chipping away at the celebrities. After all, one can only be fooled for so long. The celebs DO speak to others, and they DO have to keep up their image.

      Now, time to Red-X those craigslist posts!

  • Pierrot

    *** RED X +–+** RED X ** +–+ RED X *** Thursday 22nd of January – statsday

    Good morning Night Owls and Early Birds,
    The score for yesterday, pre-statsday, 152 new/refreshed ads bringing the Last 4 Days UP from 343 to 419 and the 7 days Regional List UP from 585 to 609.
    RedX write up : https://whyweprotest.net/threads/taking-down-co-on-craigslist-co-ads-on-craigslist.113779/page-117#post-2494321
    RedX spreadsheet: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1-Kvg78kCcvo5gL7UfPcmhmbsagTNtdj0y2LAiHVFrCU/pubhtml
    For those who do not have much time but would like to send a message to Tony Chen do Sacramento in the Regional list TAB of the RedX spreadsheet. (see link above).

    FREELOADER Debt is ILLEGAL and CAN’T BE ENFORCED.
    DON’T route out, BLOW, Get HELP, get OUT. CALL 1-866-XSEAORG

    Fallout3 enhanced by Bob Kåre for RedX

    • NOLAGirl

      Morning Pierrot. Not sure when you’ll get this message but I just wanted you to know that Baton Rouge, Louisiana is back on the radar. They have some job listings and one free stress test listing at the moment. Looks like they are trying to staff up the place. Here’s the info:

      9716 Airline Hwy Baton Rouge, LA 70816 (225) 928-7804

      • Pierrot

        Thanks Nola, I will include the address & Tel# in the searches.

      • Pierrot

        I got the stress test which is 12 days hold and thus will not appear in our lists.
        I can not find the job listing, can you give me the links.
        Thanks

        • NOLAGirl

          The credit goes to https://seccheck.wordpress.com/

          They posted the job ad and that sent me on the hunt through all the categories. I’m just glad they were found. Can’t have them sneaking around in my states back yard. 😀

      • Pierrot

        OK got them, we never searched the category jobs before, good find!
        They are current and will be included in the trawl later on in 30 minutes

        • NOLAGirl

          Thanks so much Pierrot. 🙂

    • Dale A.

      The concept and practice of Scientology as a group is confounding enough. But just reflect on the fact that 1 single person came up with the idea that someone else, who had worked for years for almost no pay, now owed them money in the 5 figures because they left, taking with them a supposedly objective thing that could be weighed, measured, and valued monetarily. That person articulated the idea, and others around them agreed with it, and acted it out. Then at the end of course, an inexplicably vulnerable person decided it was true, and further excoriated herself or himself.

  • Guest
  • Just been watching the port Aruba webcam to waste time, as a huge cruise ship docked. It makes the Fleecewinds look like a tiny canoe.
    Just the thought of how desperate they are begging for customers/suckers makes me smile.

    • Snake Plissken

      The Freewinds suits the cult well, it’s the David Miscavige of cruse ships

      • The Dude

        Yeah. Stunted and depleted. With a overinflated sense of self worth.

  • Sarah Tonin

    What’s with the “#DontTrustBoys” hidden among the other feel-good hashtags in Miss New York’s caption?

    Don’t trust boys? Were they sewing the seeds for a future in the Sea Org where relationships are frowned upon and noone trusts anyone??

    • Douglas D. Douglas

      Boys are icky.

      But girls got cooties.